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Quest Means Business
Luigi Mangione Indicted In Murder Of UnitedHealthcare CEO; CEOs Flock To Mar-A-Lago Ahead Of Trump's Inauguration; TikTok Faces US Ban On Day Before Inauguration; Russia Calls Killing Of Kirillov In Moscow A Terrorist Act; New Syrian Leader Meets British Officials In Damascus. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired December 17, 2024 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:25]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Good evening. You've been watching a press conference in New York as a grand
jury in the city has indicted Luigi Mangione in the murder of the UnitedHealthcare chief executive. He is accused of killing Brian Thompson
on December the 4th. The Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg, was speaking just a moment or two ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALVIN BRAGG, MANHATTAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The defendant is charged with one count of murder in the first degree and two counts of murder in the second
degree, including one count of murder in the second degree as an act of terrorism for the brazen, targeted, and premeditated shooting of Brian
Thompson who, as you know, was the CEO of UnitedHealthcare.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Kara Scannell is with me. She is in New York, which route are they using to get it as murder in the first degree with the element of
terrorism? What's the logic of the argument?
KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So the District Attorney Alvin Bragg addressed this question directly. He said that based on the evidence that
they have obtained, they feel that it can support this charge of murder one in the first degree in the furtherance of terrorism.
And he pointed to, as he said, the writings that they discovered through this investigation, including on the bullet casings and the casing of one
live bullet that they found at the scene of the alleged shooting that they said "deny, delay, depose." Those are words that are used in the insurance
industry.
There were also, as CNN has reported, writings that were recovered with Mangione on his person when he was arrested in Pennsylvania that also
talked about the health insurance industry and focusing on that.
So Bragg connecting those dots here, saying as he said, that "... this was not an ordinary killing. This was a killing intended to invoke terror." He
also pointed to where this occurred, Midtown Manhattan, early morning, busy time of the day commuting in Manhattan and he is that that all is part of
the picture of why they think that they can bring this case as murder in the first degree, an unusual charge in New York, but a very serious one,
which carries with it a maximum sentence of life in prison without parole.
QUEST: Right, now, as I understand it, that is the significance here, because once you get in the first degree, there is no option of parole. It
is a mandatory sentence.
SCANNELL: That is exactly right. I mean, that is why this really raises it from what it would have been even as a murder in the second degree charge,
which there are two additional counts in this indictment, including that one also about a murder with the intent to intimidate and terrorism, and
another with murder, just regular murder with the intent to kill, those have sentences of 25 years up to life in prison.
But as you point out, the real distinction there with murder in the first degree is that there would be no parole if convicted. And so that is where
the district attorney is taking this. That is what really distinguishes this, even from the felony arrest warrant that we had already seen in this
case that had charged him with murder in the second degree.
QUEST: I want to just delve into the comments made by the police commissioner, where she chastised the public and I suppose the press or
warned, whatever word you want to use for some of the comments and some of the reporting, which, whilst not making Mangione a folk hero, certainly has
given rise to criticism over the healthcare industry in the United States.
SCANNELL: Yes, she spent some of her time at the press conference focusing in on that, saying that she thought it was shocking and an appalling
celebration of cold-blooded murder. She said there is no heroism in what Mangione did.
So saying that they are bringing this case to uphold the rule of law and to kind of set the stage that this is not something that should be condoned,
that he is an accused murderer in the first degree, and trying to call out people for celebrating it, even holding up the cover of "The New York
Post," which said that there was a group of people, she called them vigilantes who had created a deck of cards with possible CEO targets on
them.
So really trying to send a message to the public that the celebration of this is not okay, and it is something that the investigators are clearly
aware of as they pursue this investigation. And, you know, they have made warnings to large corporation CEOs to raise their awareness about the
fallout from this -- from the murder of the UnitedHealthcare CEO.
QUEST: Kara, this is all just happened. I am grateful you came quickly to talk to us about it. Thank you.
' [16:05:10]
Our business agenda now, and the head of Netflix is the latest chief executive paying visits to the president-elect at Mar-a-Lago. The visitor
log has been filled with tech and media executives since the election.
You had Amazon founder, Jeff Bezos, who also owns "The Washington Post." He is going on Wednesday, but so far, Tim Cook of Apple, Meta, Softbank, all
the others have come calling.
Kristen Holmes is in Washington.
A tricky one, this. I mean, who is asking to see whom here? Or is it a case of go to see the president-elect, you know, touch the forelock and bend at
the knee?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it certainly seems like a case of trying to bend at the knee. I mean, you have to keep in mind,
Richard, this is very different than what we saw in 2016-2017 when Donald Trump came into office.
First of all, a number of these tech leaders, including Jeff Bezos and Mark Zuckerberg, were at odds with the president-elect, so a lot of them coming
down to Mar-a-Lago we are told by these senior advisers, is them trying to save face, trying to mend fences, basically trying to erase the past with
the president-elect who could be very helpful or potentially very harmful in this administration.
Now, some of them have asks, we are told these CEOs, these tech titans, but some of them are just there to try and get into his good graces.
It has been interesting to see Donald Trump react to all of this. One, it seems as though the past eight years is water under the bridge for him. He
is allowing these conversations. He is looking forward to these conversations. In fact, one of the things he said in his press conference
yesterday, Richard, was that it seems like everyone likes him now. That's what he said when he was talking about the difference between now and back
in 2017 and not just 2017, but really throughout his entire tenure and when he left office.
QUEST: And they've got the checkbook out in many cases, a million dollars here, a million dollars there. Now, look, it is laudable that people wish
to contribute to a civic event of grandeur like inauguration, but they didn't do it last time and they haven't done it before and look, it is all
a bit weird.
HOLMES: Yes. I mean, look, I like your spin on this, that it is all just a donation in terms of a civic event, but obviously these people are seeking
something out and whether or not they are seeking something out policy-wise when it comes to the president-elect or if they're seeking something out
just in terms of having a relationship with him to try and mend fences, to make up for the past eight years, we just don't know yet.
When it comes to the head of TikTok, we know that there is a pressing issue that he is trying to get through to the president-elect on whether or not
they talked about it, unclear at this point in that meeting, but we do know that he is going to want help with that issue down the road, so a meeting
with the president-elect is something that he is going to want to set up.
QUEST: Kristen, very good to have that aspect, the political aspect. Now to the media aspect. Thank you, Kristen.
Brian is with me, Brian Stelter. It is -- look, everyone is entitled to, but they didn't do it before and also you have this business with Elon Musk
who is sort of already on the inside and in many cases is either a rival or a frenemy of many of these people.
BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA ANALYST: And I am looking down at Tesla's stock price closing today, up another 3.6 percent, Richard.
The tear that Tesla has been on, it is -- you know, it is eye watering and for investors, it is thrilling. But I think for some of these other CEOs,
for some of these media and tech titans, they might be looking at Tesla, they might be looking at Elon Musk with a little bit of jealousy.
And as Kristen said, there is also some face saving to do. Netflix co-CEO, Ted Sarandos at Mar-a-Lago today, he has donated to Democrats for years. He
has endorsed Democratic presidential candidates for years, so it is understandable that he might feel he needs to have a conversation with
Trump.
I think that the biggest difference here, though, is not that CEOs are trying to have strong relations with the government. The difference here is
that Trump blends the personal and the national in a way that past presidents never have in the United States.
QUEST: Now, let's talk about this exact point, because the media is on notice. Donald Trump has filed lawsuits accusing of all people, "The Des
Moines Register" because its top pollster of electoral interference, now, it is a very late poll that gave Kamala Harris a surprising lead and Trump
carried the state.
And now, they are admitting the poll missed the mark, but Donald Trump is basically saying I am going after you all. And he says, as I was reading in
"Reliable Sources," the excellent, excellent journal of which you are leader that he is not doing -- he is doing it because it is his duty. He
needs to do it.
[16:10:14]
STELTER: He is saying he has to do this in order to straighten out the free press. Look, in his first term, he decried real news as fake. In his second
term, he seems to want to match his words with actions. And that's, I think, what we need to be on the watch for. These lawsuits are an early
indication that he is being much more aggressive this time around.
When it comes to suing "The Des Moines Register" and this pollster, lawyers, and media experts are decrying this suit as both an attack on free
speech and as a total stretch from a legal perspective.
He is using an Iowa Consumer Fraud Act to claim that this pollster might have made up the poll and deceived consumers. But we spoke with Rebecca
Tushnet, a Harvard Law School professor, who says this is total junk from a consumer protection point of view, and it is deeply concerning to see the
law abused or misused in this way.
I think this is a stretch. It will probably be thrown out by the courts, but Trump is getting what he wants, right? He is getting the headline. He
is getting the scrutiny. He is getting a chilling effect.
QUEST: Right. But Brian, your colleague, Hadas Gold again from "Reliable Sources," she nailed it, in your words, "... it doesn't matter if it gets
tossed out."
"Even if a lawsuit is tossed out," she writes, "The punishment is in the process." And to that extent, we see that with the ABC decision where
people are talking about how Bob Iger surrendered.
STELTER: Yes, these cases sometimes cost millions of dollars to fight, whether you prevail or not. Media companies, especially big ones owned by
companies, let's take ABC owned by Disney, they decided that that fight was not worth having anymore.
I am interested in the Iowa case because "The Des Moines Register" is owned by a much smaller newspaper publisher. It is still a big company, Gannett,
but it is a smaller company. It is going to be interesting to see what choices they make.
And is Trump going to start to target smaller outlets? Smaller media brands? That is an open question, but we know his pick for FBI chief, Kash
Patel also wants to investigate media outlets and hosts and personalities in the future.
Right now, we are kind of in the preseason. We don't know what is going to happen, but all the signs so far point to a very chilled environment for
the press in the United States.
QUEST: As a former editor of mine once used to say to us all, get your tin helmets on, be ready for battle.
STELTER: Hey, there you go.
QUEST: Brian Stelter, thank you.
Now, Donald Trump is suggesting he may also try to save TikTok. At that news conference, he said he has a warm spot in his heart for the app.
You'll remember you and I have talked about many times, it is set to be banned in the United States on January the 19th, the very day before the
inauguration.
CNN's Clare Duffy, now on how Donald Trump could keep the popular social media app around if he wants to.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS WRITER: TikTok is running out of time, and President-elect Donald Trump may be its only hope.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So this is insane.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: January 19th. It's over.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm like shaking. I'm mad. I'm so anxious because TikTok changed my life.
DUFFY: Unless TikTok wins its lawsuit, the app is scheduled to be banned in the United States just one day before Trump takes office. Ironically, he
tried to ban the app during his first administration, but later pledged to save it.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: For all of those that want to save TikTok in America, vote for Trump.
CHARLIE KIRK, FOUNDER, TURNING POINT USA: And you'll never ban TikTok. That's for sure.
TRUMP: I will never ban TikTok.
KIRK: Thank you.
DUFFY: So can President Trump save TikTok? Here are four possibilities.
Number one, Trump could ask Congress to repeal the law.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is National Repeal Day.
DUFFY: But experts say that's probably not going to happen. After all, they just passed it in April, and many lawmakers want to look tough on China.
ALAN ROZENSHTEIN, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF LAW, UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA: There are a lot of China hawks in Congress. I mean, that's the main reason
this law was passed to begin with. They didn't magically become China doves overnight just because of the election.
DUFFY: Option number two, President Trump could direct his attorney general, who will run the Department of Justice, not to enforce the law.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is the DOJ? She was like Department of Justice? And I was like, how am I supposed to know?
DUFFY: Basically, the administration would signal to app stores like Apple that they won't face any fines for continuing to host TikTok, but that one
could be pretty risky for TikTok's partners.
ROZENSHTEIN: The problem there is that it would still put these companies in the position of violating the law. They would now just be hoping that
Trump goes through with his promise not to punish them for it.
DUFFY: Option three, Trump could do something he is famous for talking about, making a deal.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Trump, "The Art of the Deal" is a book written by Donald J. Trump and journalist, Tony Schwartz.
DUFFY: In this deal, TikTok's parent company, ByteDance would sell the app to an American company or individual. There are plenty of billionaires who
might be interested in grabbing an app used by 170 million Americans, although ByteDance has so far indicated it has no interest in selling
TikTok.
ROZENSHTEIN: I don't think Trump's role here is really the big one. I mean, unless he goes and flies to Beijing and convinces Xi Jinping to sell TikTok
as part of some Nixon goes to China diplomatic strategy.
[16:15:00]
DUFFY: The fourth option is a little wonky.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good morning. It's Wonky Wednesday at night.
DUFFY: In this scenario, the president could announce that TikTok is no longer subject to the law. I'll let the law professor explain this one.
ROZENSHTEIN: The law doesn't ban TikTok outright. It allows ByteDance, TikTok's Chinese owner to sell its share in TikTok. And under the law, it
is actually up to the president to determine what counts as this kind of sale. And so on one reading of the law, Trump could say, well, it is up to
me to determine whether or not TikTok is still owned by a Chinese company and I am just going to declare that TikTok is no longer owned by a Chinese
company, whether or not that's actually true.
And because of a bunch of sort of technical legal reasons, that kind of determination is really hard to challenge, even if its false. That might be
enough to give the Apples and Googles and Oracles of the world enough comfort to still do business with TikTok.
DUFFY: Wonky? Yes. But of all the possibilities for saving TikTok, that one might just be the easiest for President Trump to pull off.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: TikTok's troubles are expanding beyond the United States. The European Commission has opened formal proceedings today against the
platform. TikTok is accused of failing to limit election interference, most notably in Romania, where, of course, you'll be well familiar with how the
presidential elections were annulled and they will have to take place again.
Now, the latest proceedings will allow the commission to take more enforcement steps. Anna Stewart is with me.
This is a fascinating aspect because Donald Trump is also very much against the way the EU interferes with American companies, not that this is an
American company.
ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: Yes and this is actually the third investigation that they've implemented into TikTok. This one I think we saw
coming.
On the 6th of December, the EU said to TikTok, you need to keep and retain any data relating to this election. And so now, of course, they've opened
up proceedings and they could fine it up to six percent of global turnover, which presumably, it would be billions.
QUEST: But what's the accusation?
STEWART: In this specific case, there are three potential clauses --
QUEST: Right.
STEWART: -- TikTok has broken.
Now one is regarding political advertisements and paid political content. TikTok says it doesn't do any of that. The other one, the third one, is the
interesting one, which is more about algorithms. So what are the algorithms that sort of promote certain content, particularly with a political
context? And how can it be manipulated?
QUEST: But look --
STEWART: Which is believed to have happened in this case, that's what Romanian authorities think has happened.
QUEST: Is this a case of the European Commission doing the work that others won't do? We've seen it again and again and again. Digital Services Act or
and GDF or --
STEWART: GDPR.
QUEST: Thank you, GDPR.
STEWART: It wasn't that sexy bit of legislation.
QUEST: GDPR, we've seen that before, but the criticism of the tech is that Europe is too antsy-antsy. Europe says no, we've got it right.
STEWART: Europe goes first and this is the first time, of course, recently with misinformation on TikTok that it is happening to an EU member. We've
already had allegations in Moldova's election, in Georgia's elections. And of course, coming up, you've got Croatian elections, you've got German
elections.
QUEST: Can it be proven? Can it be proven? That's the problem with all these election ones, because you've got to prove that it was involved in
terms of --
STEWART: So Romania has disclosed certain information. They say, for instance, 25,000 TikTok accounts are related to this completely unknown
Calin Georgescu in the campaign and they are all activated two weeks before the first round of the election, 85,000 attempted cyberattacks on election
websites. They say this is the proof and the EU is going to run with it.
QUEST: And we are grateful that you're here to talk about it.
STEWART: Pleasure.
QUEST: Very much indeed, thank you.
It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tonight. We are in London and after the break, exclusive new reporting. It was the rape trial that shocked and fixated us
all in France and the world. Extraordinary.
But of course, as you know, the wife and the victim spoke out bravely and you'll hear more after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:21:44]
QUEST: A verdict is expected on Thursday in the Pelicot rape trial. It is the trial that shocked France, and indeed the world.
Dominique Pelicot is accused of organizing the abuse of his own wife, Gisele. She has decided to waive her right to anonymity. She spoke openly
in court, saying it is time to look at this macho, patriarchal society and change the way it looks at rape.
Fifteen men, including Pelicot have pleaded guilty to rape. Others said they thought that her husband's consent was enough.
Now, exclusive access to French Police reports reveals exactly how her husband found men to rape his wife. And please, I warn you, the content is
graphic and disturbing, but it must be seen.
Saskya Vandoorne reports from Paris.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TEXT: I am about to close her.
We have to wait at least one hour to abuse her.
Once asleep, I dress her as a (bleep) and offer her --
SASKYA VANDOORNE, CNN SENIOR PRODUCER: I've come here to retrace the steps of all those men who visited Dominique Pelicot's house in the middle of the
night.
TEXT: It won't be long until she goes to bed, our friends are leaving soon.
I will text you in 30 minutes.
VANDOORNE: This case really has captured the world's attention with so many people asking why. We're going to focus instead on how Pelicot led the men
right here.
DOMINIQUE PELICOT, HUSBAND: I will text you in 30 minutes.
NINOU: I am already at the sports pitch in Mazan.
VANDOORNE (voice over): The way he communicated, the tactics he used, how he came to be on trial for mass rape and drugging his wife. What was his
playbook?
CNN NEWS ANCHOR: Fifty men accused in the mass rape of Gisele Pelicot. She was drugged.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Drugged unconscious by her husband, Dominique Pelicot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dominique Pelicot admitted to recruiting --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Enlisting other men to join --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- rape his wife.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It sparked outrage across France.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Going global concern about violence against women.
VANDOORNE (voice over): CNN has gained exclusive access to police reports with thousands of messages that Dominique exchanged with the 50 men on
trial alongside him. He didn't have to search far for his alleged accomplices. They all live within a 30-mile radius of his house in Mazan.
The horror is still felt here by local women.
NEDELJKA MACAN, MAZAN RESIDENT: This area was so quiet, a nice area. And now, we don't know if somebody who is the next shop is one of these men. It
changed everything.
VANDOORNE (voice over): From a firefighter to a journalist to a nurse, from 27 years old to 74 years old, all the men were connected by one website,
Coco. Shut down this summer, Coco's chat rooms were easy to access.
VANDOORNE (on camera): It was not buried in the dark web, as one man accused of raping Gisele Pelicot said.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I got in touch through Coco in the evening when I was by myself. My wife had gone to bed and I was a little
bored.
VANDOORNE (voice over): But because the so-called dating site was entirely unmoderated and anonymous, it boasted chatrooms selling date rape drugs and
spaces to glorify sexual violence.
Under the pseudonym "Available All Night," Pelicot posted in a chatroom called "Without Her Knowledge." It was there that misogyny and sexual abuse
were completely normalized.
VANDOORNE (on camera): While Pelicot has pleaded guilty to rape, most of his codefendants say that they believe Dominique Pelicot's consent was
enough.
[16:20:10]
VANDOORNE (voice over): Coco was the door. Pelicot would then move the discussion to Skype.
VANDOORNE (on camera): He traded videos of his wife being raped for intimate images of the men's own partners, according to the police report.
DOMINIQUE: Your (bleep) makes me want to rape her in front of you.
MATHIAS DARMON, LAWYER, INNOCENCE EN DANGER: We saw Coco was a very dangerous website.
VANDOORNE (on camera): Innocence En Danger has been campaigning against the site for years.
DARMON: They went to this website to realize their worst fantasies, so it became a reality thanks to Dominique Pelicot.
VANDOORNE (on camera): He told police that over time he built a network of men.
DARMON: The place where they could meet, what time, what they could wear, they couldn't wear.
TEXT: You have to be clean without aftershave, no long dirty nails.
VANDOORNE (on camera): He allegedly told the men what drugs to buy and how to use them.
TEXT: Better not leave any trace at the pharmacy because they are recording you.
VANDOORNE (on camera): This all went undetected for 10 years.
Dominique Pelicot never thought his text messages or his alleged crimes would see the light of day and they probably wouldn't have if it weren't
for the events that took place right here on September 12th, when a security guard caught him red handed filming up the skirts of several
women.
DARMON: This is kind of websites, as long as there is demand, then there will be supply.
VANDOORNE (on camera): In the wake of Coco's shutdown, more websites have gained in popularity in France.
CNN extracted data from just one of those websites.
After going through almost 6,000 messages from a 24-hour period, we found a strikingly similar pattern of men sharing explicit photos of their wives
and girlfriends. And asking to move the discussions to private messaging platforms.
Some men went as far as offering up their wives to other users in a manner like Pelicot, but it's unclear if any of them set up real-life encounters.
There are some websites that could be the new Coco. How does that make you feel?
MACAN: For these websites, it's a kind of marvelous thing what happened with Gisele Pelicot. It brings them advertising.
ANNETTE DUMONT, MAZAN RESIDENT (through translator): It could very well happen again tomorrow in another place.
MACAN: We expect that some laws will change, but of course, I'm not sure that it will be enough. So, I don't feel at ease here in the streets.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: Extraordinary reporting from Saskya Vandoorne.
A top Russian general has been killed on the streets of Moscow, and we are learning that Ukrainian Security Services were behind the assassination.
From Moscow, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:31:02]
QUEST: Russian officials are vowing to avenge the death of a top general who was killed in Moscow. According to our sources telling us that the
Ukrainian security services were behind the assassination. It was General Igor Kirillov who died when a bomb went off. He'd been sanctioned by the
U.K. for allegedly helping deploy chemical weapons in Ukraine.
Fred Pleitgen is in Moscow.
Two aspects here really, aren't there? I mean, there is the blow to the Russians in terms of losing a top commander but also there's the audacity
of the attack to be done in such a way right in the heart of the capital.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And I think both of it was really on display here in the southeast of Moscow today
after that attack took place. One of the things that we saw when we arrived on the scene, we were there pretty shortly after all of it happened. And
you could tell that someone very important had been killed.
There were a lot of security forces on the ground, Richard. The entire area was cordoned off. The police and other security services very careful.
Investigators there from the police, investigators there from the military, and of course, the Russians outraged by the audacity of all of this
happening in the early morning hours, as this general and an aide were leaving that house.
Here's what we found out.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PLEITGEN (voice-over): One of Russia's top generals and an aide just seconds before the fatal blast. We're not showing the moment of the
explosion in this video obtained by CNN.
Russian investigators say the bomb with about 300 grams of TNT was hidden in an electric scooter parked just outside the entrance of that building.
As the general and an aide walked out, it blew up, killing them both.
(Voice-over): Russian investigators say the device was detonated remotely. The blast so powerful it shattered windows several floors up in buildings
across the street.
At first, we thought that cement might have been unloaded or something similar, this resident says, but the blast was so loud it did not seem like
construction work. It was very scary.
Lieutenant General Igor Kirillov was the head of Russia's nuclear, chemical and biological defense forces, often accusing Kyiv of planning to use
chemicals on the battlefield. The Ukrainians, for their part, accused Kirillov of overseeing the use of chemical substances against their forces
and have claimed responsibility for assassinating him, calling the general, quote, "an absolutely legitimate target," and saying, "Such an inglorious
end awaits all those who kill Ukrainians."
The general is not the first, but the highest ranking Russian military official the Ukrainians claimed to have assassinated. Moscow furious,
launching both a terrorism and a criminal investigation.
Investigative actions and operational search activities are being carried out aimed at establishing all the circumstances of the crime committed, the
spokesperson said.
Asymmetric warfare like this brazen drone attack inside Russia two days ago is how the Ukrainian forces are trying to level the battlefield, as
Vladimir Putin's army has been making significant gains on nearly all frontlines.
The lieutenant general's assassination comes just hours after Putin met with his top military brass ripping into the Biden administration for its
support of Ukraine.
In an effort to weaken our country and impose a strategic defeat on us, the United States continues to pump the virtually illegitimate ruling regime in
Kyiv, full of weapons and money, sends mercenaries and military advisers and thereby encourages further escalation of the conflict, Putin said.
And Russian politicians have vowed revenge for the general's killing while acknowledging his death is a major loss.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PLEITGEN (on-camera): And even more indications, Richard, that the Russians are trying to sort of place the blame on the West in all of this, as well
as senior Russian lawmaker came out today and said that he believed that the Ukrainians were, as he put it, taking orders from their Western
masters.
[16:35:06]
And there was a senior Russian senator who came out and said he believed that all of this could actually hurt the prospects of any talks between
Moscow and Washington once the Trump administration takes over, Richard.
QUEST: And let's just delve on to that aspect. We're getting ever closer, Fred. Is there -- are you getting any feeling, any inkling as to how Moscow
would view a deal or any -- you know, this idea of settling it within a week? Or, I mean, even if we forget the timeline, what would Moscow go for?
PLEITGEN: I believe, Richard, and the signals that we're getting here from the Russians is that they're feeling increasingly positive about the
incoming Trump administration. They believe that right now they're winning on the battlefield. They're hearing some of the things that the incoming
president, the President-elect Donald Trump, has said, for instance, about saying that it was a mistake by the Biden administration to allow the
Ukrainians to use longer distance U.S. supplied weapons to strike deep into Russian territory.
So the Russians themselves are saying they believe that for them these are all the right signals. They think right now with the momentum they have on
the battlefield, with the shortage of soldiers that the Ukrainians have, and with the Trump administration coming in, they think that in a -- I
wouldn't say a fairly short amount of time, but they think that potentially there could be a deal to end the war in Ukraine in the not-too-distant
future and to end it on terms positive for Russia -- Richard.
QUEST: Fred Pleitgen in Moscow. It's late for you, sir. I'm grateful. Thank you.
More than a week after the fall of Bashar al-Assad's dictatorship, we're now getting a sense of the magnitude of atrocities. Now, the video is just
downright disturbing. But again, we need to see it. Across Syria, people are starting to uncover mass graves. Digging up remains, using everything
from heavy machinery to bare hands. And for good reason. Families have no answers about what happened to the loved ones who disappeared, detained by
Assad's secret police.
The new rulers are pushing for international legitimacy. Remember they are sanctioned as terrorists. The rebel leader, Abu Mohammed al-Jolani, met the
British in Damascus on Monday. He's hoping to convince them the group no longer deserves to be labeled terrorists. The former jihadist has been
meeting foreign dignitaries since the ousting.
Kirsten Fontenrose is the senior -- was the senior director for Persian Gulf Region in Donald Trump's National Security Council, with me now.
Good to see you. Grateful for you. And I guess at this point it's best case, worst case. How does either the E.U., the U.S. navigate towards best
case? And do they even have a vision of what best case looks like?
KIRSTEN FONTENROSE, FORMER SENIOR DIRECTOR FOR GULF AFFAIRS, U.S. NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL: That's such a good question. There is no best case yet,
especially since many of our partner countries are taking these divergent approaches to what's happening on the ground so far. You have countries,
including even Israel and Turkey, kind of doing land grabs, very likely hoping that they can use these potential land grabs and exchange in
negotiations about border peace deals later on.
And then you have some European countries rushing and kind of this very hopeful attempt at removing designations, removing sanctions. And the U.S.
sitting back, a lame-duck president, an incoming president who's making ultimatums, and the world trying to navigate this. So if you're the Syrians
on the ground, it's really confusing. And we don't see -- we see one vision coming out of statements the countries are making about what they expect
from HTS and partners in a new Syrian government, but we're not seeing one approach by the international community towards Syria at this point.
QUEST: Right. But I guess, you know, when I heard that interview from HTS before they had succeeded. I understand that a sort of a bicameral,
Wilsonian, democratic parliament is highly unlikely. But at the same time, the West doesn't want Iraq or worse, Afghanistan and Taliban. And is it
possible to have a strong Islamic country without the excesses of the others?
FONTENROSE: It is possible. I don't know if we've seen it in modern history in the same way, not including some of the tenets that we've seen HTS used
in places where they've been in power, issues like women's rights and minorities. But it's not entirely impossible. And I think most of the
international community is really optimistic about it. But we have too many lessons learned in places where groups were given this kind of leverage and
they blew it.
Look at the Houthis, look at Hezbollah, organizations you mentioned, militias that are running part of Iraqis' parliament. They're just
Afghanistan. There are just too many examples to point to. So one of the important points that folks are making is that this is slightly different
because now any reconstruction in Syria will be so dependent on foreign aid that donors will get a vote they haven't necessarily had in these other
contexts.
[16:40:06]
QUEST: Gosh, we must talk more on this as things progress. I'm grateful for your time and attention tonight. Thank you.
And so finally, from you and me tonight, the Dow was throwing it back to the 1970s for all the wrong reasons because the Dow is down. Its nine-day
losing streak. You've got to go back to 1978 to when it last happened. In 1978, nine losing days, eight days. Moviegoers goes we're watching
"Grease."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STOCKARD CHANNING, ACTRESS: Hey, Zuko, I got a surprise for you.
JOHN TRAVOLTA, ACTOR: Oh, yes?
CHANNING: Yes.
TRAVOLTA: Sandy.
OLIVIA NEWTON-JOHN, ACTRESS: Danny?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Dow is down. President Jimmy Carter was grappling with surprise Middle East politics and an oil crisis. More surprise. And the bigger
surprise of all today, my hair. Can you see the similarities? My mother never forgave me for not cutting my hair. But you can see maybe a little
bit the same? And most notably the Dow slid nine days in a row, from 777 to 749. The Dow was just (INAUDIBLE) -- nine straight (INAUDIBLE).
That's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. I'll see you tomorrow.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(CONNECTING AFRICA)
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Murder in the death of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson. First-degree murder. Prosecutors announced an 11-count indictment
this afternoon that includes one count of murder in the first degree, as well as two counts of second-degree murder, including one as a crime of
terrorism.
Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg called the shooting a, quote, "frightening, well-planned, targeted murder that was intended to cause
shock and attention and intimidation," unquote. The district attorney's office says Mangione faces a sentence of life in prison without the
possibility of parole if convicted.
END
