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Quest Means Business
Trump Signs Executive Orders After Midair Crash; No Survivors After Midair Collision Near Washington, DC; Israel Condemns Chaotic Scenes at Hostage Release Site; Trump Threatens Tariffs on Canada, Mexico on February 1; No Survivors After Midair Collision Near Washington, D.C.; The Complex Airspace Over Washington; Nigeria's Business Climate. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired January 30, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:00]
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In this case, but certainly over the years, it has been the case and it is the case with
respect to close calls, and it is the case with respect for circling for hours on end.
You know, planes circle a lot and they circle because the people bringing them down, these people that have to be very, very smart and it is not
based on anything other than the brain. We need the smartest people. We need both psychologically smart and just brilliant. Period. And we are
going to have them in our control towers.
We are going to have -- we are going to have the most competent people in the country in our control towers, not people that are there for any other
reason.
REPORTER: Mr. President, you said that you envisioned sending the 80 something thousand IRS agents hired under Biden to the border. What role do
you see them playing?
TRUMP: We will see. I mean, I may do that or I may use different people, but we are going to send more. We are going to give the Border Patrol some
help.
Although now, if you look, they've taken in the lowest number since my administration. The numbers are very low. And that level, we don't need so
much help.
People know not to come because if they come, they're not going to make it in, and they're going to be shipped out.
REPORTER: Mr. President, Egypt's president and the King of Jordan have both said that they won't take in displaced people from Gaza, like you
suggested. Is there anything you can do to make them do that? I mean, tariffs against those countries, for example.
TRUMP: They will do it. They will do it.
REPORTER: What makes you say that?
TRUMP: They are going to do it, okay. We do a lot for them and they're going to do it.
REPORTER: Mr. President, you've offered over two million federal workers the option to resign immediately.
TRUMP: Right.
REPORTER: There are 50,000 FAA employees. Does this tragedy give you reason to reconsider that option of resignations because of concerns about
staffing issues?
TRUMP: No. No.
REPORTER: For airline safety.
TRUMP: If people aren't coming to work, if they're not going to come into the office and report as per the date that you know what it is, everybody
knows what the date is. It has been very well documented, then they're going to be terminated.
REPORTER: So you're not going to be -- you're not concerned though, that if many people take that offer, there could be shortages that could lead to
safety issues?
TRUMP: Then they will be replaced with very competent people. We have a lot of competent people in this country.
REPORTER: Have you spoken to any of the families of the victims of the plane crash?
TRUMP: I don't want to comment on that.
REPORTER: Do you have a plan to go visit the site or meet with any of the first responders?
TRUMP: I have -- I have a plan to visit, not the site, because what -- you tell me, what's the site? The water?
REPORTER: Or to meet with the first responders down there?
TRUMP: You want me to go swimming?
I don't have a plan to do that, but I will be meeting with some people that were very badly hurt with their family member, obviously, but I will be
meeting with some of the families. Yes.
REPORTER: On birthright citizenship, sir, do you believe that there are five votes on the Supreme Court that would uphold your position?
TRUMP: One what?
REPORTER: Five votes on the Supreme Court?
TRUMP: What position?
REPORTER: Birthright citizenship.
TRUMP: I think so, yes. Look, birthright citizenship was, if you look back when this was passed and made, that was meant for the children of slaves,
this was not meant for the whole world to come in and pile into the United States of America. Everybody coming in and totally unqualified people with
perhaps unqualified children. This wasn't meant for that.
This was meant, when it was originally done, for the children of slaves and that was a very good and noble thing to do. And I am in favor of that a
hundred percent, but it wasn't meant for the entire world to occupy the United States.
REPORTER: So you don't see it requiring a constitutional amendment that would be --
TRUMP: I just think that we will end up winning that court -- in the Supreme Court. I think we are going to win that case, and I look forward to
winning it.
This has been going on. At that level, we are the only country in the world that does this. There is no other country at this level, there is no other
country in the world that does it. It is crazy.
REPORTER: Mr. President, 64 people lost their lives last night, if you aren't confident that DEI had any role, why bring it up?
TRUMP: Well, all I am talking about is competence and we want in that particular position, we have to have the most competent people in our
country because we are talking about lives.
Now, it may or may not have had to do, but I don't like the fact that the helicopter was at the exact same level as the airplane. The helicopter
should have been thousand feet or 500 feet above it, or something below it. The plane was at three to four hundred feet or the plane should have been
stopped because -- the helicopter could have stopped. The plane can't be stopped, but the plane was on a schedule that was, you know, it was along a
track. They call it a track and it is the same track that every other planes used for many years.
It was going down and landing and the helicopter got in its way. And if the helicopter was higher or lower or stopped or turning left or turning right
at a quicker time, I mean, it turned, but it turned when it was too late. A tragic a tragic story.
So I don't know. Do you blame it on the air traffic controller too, in addition to the pilots? Maybe the pilot's fault. They should have seen it.
[16:05:08]
I would have thought they should have seen it, because it was a plane that was loaded up with lights. And everybody, you can see it from Kennedy
Center. You can see it very easily.
So all I want is the most competent people in our country to be air traffic controllers. It is a very important position and other positions too, by
the way. We are not only talking about that, we are talking but -- air traffic controllers may be in particular. They have to be brilliant with
computers, brilliant with graphics. They have to be psychologically really, really smart.
And, you know, there are a lot of people that wouldn't be able to do that.
REPORTER: Were there any signs of foul play?
REPORTER: Can you talk about tariffs on Canada and Mexico, 25 percent. That's coming on Saturday.
TRUMP: That's coming on the first, Saturday.
REPORTER: But no oil tariff. No oil tariffs.
TRUMP: No, I don't -- well I didn't say that, you said that. No. We may or may not. We are going to make that determination probably tonight on oil.
Yes, because they send us oil. We will see. It depends on what the price is.
If the oil is properly priced, if they treat us properly, which they don't. Look, Mexico and Canada have never been good to us on trade. They've
treated us very unfairly on trade. And we will be able to make that up very quickly because we don't need the products that they have. We have all the
oil you need, we have all the trees you need, meaning the lumber. We have more than almost anybody in those two categories.
In oil, we have more than anybody and we don't need anybody's trees. We have to free up some of the some of the tree areas that we have. We have
great lumber in this country. We have to free them up environmentally, which I can do very quickly, but we don't need what they have.
And for us to be subsidizing Canada to the tune of $175 billion a year and subsidizing Mexico to the tune of $250 billion, $300 billion a year and
Mexico is a method of China, sending in its product.
And with China, I am also thinking about something because they're sending fentanyl into our country. And because of that, they are causing us
hundreds of thousands of deaths. So China is going to end up paying a tariff also for that and we are in the process of doing that.
REPORTER: Mr. President --
TRUMP: We will make that determination what it is going to be. But China has to stop sending fentanyl into our country and killing our people.
REPORTER: Mr. President --
REPORTER: Israeli media has reported that conversations between Netanyahu's government and the White House have signaled that the US may be about to
pull its troops out of Syria. Have you made a decision to do so?
TRUMP: I don't know who said that. I mean, I don't know who said that, but we will make a determination on that. We are not going to -- we are not
involved in Syria. Syria is its own mess. They've got enough messes over there. They don't need us involved in everyone.
REPORTER: Mr. President, is there a shortage of staff at the control tower at DCA last night you're aware of?
TRUMP: Well, that's part of competence right there. They shouldn't have that happen. Right there is what I am talking about. Competence would be
you're not going to have a shortage. But if you had the right people you wouldn't need as many people either.
REPORTER: Do you know if there was a shortage last night or not?
TRUMP: I don't know. No, I don't know. You're telling me so.
REPORTER: Mr. President, you said earlier today that you had not spoken to Putin about this. When was the last time that you spoke with him and has
President Xi responded to your ask to help put pressure to end the war in Ukraine?
TRUMP: I won't comment on either of them, but we are doing very well with regard to both.
REPORTER: There are some reports that Xi might ask of you in order to give that help, pressure to disavow potential Taiwan independence. Is that
something that you would ever do?
TRUMP: No, we never discussed it.
REPORTER: You had said earlier that we would get more details about the victims on the plane. Can you give more on that now?
TRUMP: We have a -- I have a lot of details, but it is something that will be released to you also at the appropriate time. No, I have the full
details.
REPORTER: There were a lot of young people in the plane?
TRUMP: Young people, great people, great athletes, great skaters, very sad situation -- from numerous countries.
REPORTER: Mr. President --
TRUMP: Thank you very much, everybody. Thank you. Thank you, guys.
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Well, just keeping up with the president is a job in itself.
More comments from President Trump in the Oval Office. He signed one appointment, the acting director of the FAA and he then signed also a
presidential memorandum on DEI in aviation.
Good evening.
A warm welcome.
Our main story tonight, of course, US Aviation officials say that the investigation has begun and they will leave no stone unturned as they begin
to investigate the deadly air disaster over Washington, DC.
[16:10:02]
Air traffic control now telling people, one person was working two different tower positions at the time of the crash at Reagan National.
Officials have yet to retrieve the plane's black boxes, the flight data recorders will help them figure out what happened. The NTSB held its first
news conference.
The president with all members of the National Transportation Safety Board, and the chair says it is important not to rush to conclusions.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JENNIFER HOMENDY, NATIONAL TRANSPORTATION SAFETY BOARD CHAIR: What I am going to say is you need to give us time. You need to give NTSB -- it is
not that we don't have information. We do have information. We have data. We have substantial amounts of information.
We need to verify information. We need to take our time to make sure it is accurate. That is best for you, that's important for the families. It is
important for legislators who are seeking answers to try to figure out what they're going to do about this and so it will take time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now, if we are talking about disasters, this collision is the deadliest US air disaster since 2001. Although the last crash of a US
airline on domestic soil was in 2009, The Coughlin Buffalo air crash.
Air safety officials say though it is way too early now to speculate on what caused this one.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TOWER: PAT 2-5, do you have the CRJ in sight? PAT 2-5, pass behind the CRJ.
HELICOPTER PILOT: PAT 2-5 has aircraft in sight, request visual separation.
QUEST (voice over): This is the fateful moment when the air traffic control operator asked a US Army helicopter pilot to move away from a passenger
plane. The helicopter pilot confirmed that he did have an aircraft in sight, but was it the one air traffic control was referring to?
Because less than 13 seconds later, the helicopter and the commercial plane collided over the freezing Potomac River in Washington, DC. It was just
before 9:00 PM on Wednesday.
DISPATCHER: Crash, crash, crash. This is an alert three. Crash, crash, crash. This is alert three.
TOWER: Fire command. The accident happened in the river. I just saw a fireball, and then it was just gone.
QUEST (voice over): Later, the DC Mayor, Muriel Bowser, confirmed that both aircraft are in the water and that 64 people were aboard the jet operated
by American Airlines subsidiary PSA Airlines, and three people were on board the military helicopter.
JOHN DONNELLY, WASHINGTON, DC FIRE AND EMS CHIEF: We are now at a point where we are switching from a rescue operation to a recovery operation. At
this point, we don't believe there are any survivors from this accident.
QUEST (voice over): So what happened?
The investigation will sift through the multiple factors at play, and only then will come up with a final conclusion, but already we know certain
basic facts.
The passenger jet, a Canada Regional Jet 700 was flying from Wichita, Kansas, to Washington, DC's Reagan National Airport.
It was on final approach when air traffic control asked the pilot to switch runways.
TOWER: Can you take runway 33.
PILOT: Yes, we can do 33. Bluestreak 5342.
TOWER: Can you confirm runway 33. Runway 33 cleared to land.
QUEST: We don't yet know the reason why. We also know that the US Army Black Hawk helicopter, like the one here, was on a training flight at the
time. But that does not mean the pilots were inexperienced.
Air traffic control asked them to maintain visual separation from the commercial jet. It appears not to have done that. And that will be the key
question for investigators.
Then there is the sensitive location of the airport, Reagan National. It is close to both Dulles International and Joint Base Andrews, along with the
White House, The Pentagon, the US Capitol and other key civilian and military facilities.
It is an exceptionally busy air corridor.
DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: The fact that this is one of the busiest airports, not only is it the busiest, it is the most complex airport. There
are military and commercial together. There are flight restrictions on where you can fly, what kind of approaches you have to make, and there are
demands on how quickly those airplanes have to come in and out.
QUEST (voice over): President Trump took to social media to call the situation "a bad situation," and perhaps stating the obvious, said "it
looks like it should have been prevented."
For now, the shocked families are demanding answers. This is the deadliest commercial airplane disaster in the United States in more than 20 years, so
it is not surprising everybody is now demanding to know what happened and why.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[16:15:00]
QUEST: And so as we continue to find out more details, of course it is about the passengers aboard the planes. There are at least six on the
commercial jet that were returning from a figure skating event.
Vadim Naumov and Evgenia Shishkova were a championship couple who skated together at the Paris Olympics. The promising young skater, Jinna Han and
her mother also were on the aircraft, as did Spencer Lane and his mother.
One of the pilots on the aircraft was Samuel Lilley. His father reacted to the news of his son's death, saying, "It hurts so bad I can't even cry
myself to sleep."
In Wichita, at the Eisenhower Airport, it has activated a team to support families of the victims.
Jesse Romo is the director of that airport. He joins me now.
Director, obviously. Our thoughts, commiserations, I mean, the appallingness.
You know, whenever one of these things happen, I am always acutely aware that people like you know the inherent risks involved with aviation. You
prepare, you practice for all of these things, but nothing really prepares you for when it happens, does it?
JESSE ROMO, DIRECTOR OF AIRPORTS, CITY OF WICHITA: You're absolutely right. Nothing ever prepares you to actually experience this level of tragedy.
QUEST: From what we know, there was nothing wrong with the aircraft, it seems -- everything was fine. Is that your understanding?
ROMO: That is my understanding. We didn't see any abnormalities in operations that occurred when the aircraft was departing from Wichita.
QUEST: And to your knowledge, the way in which the flight performed, all seems to have been normal, too, isn't it?
ROMO: We have limited knowledge on the actual operation of the aircraft once it is in flight, but we haven't heard anything unusual.
QUEST: What's been the reaction? Well, I mean, obviously, you know, it is sadness, but how are people taking it? What is happening in Wichita?
Because this flight was -- it was an important one in a sense. It was your only daily flight to DC and it was a well-used flight, wasn't it? So tell
me about the reaction.
ROMO: Yes, Washington, DC, especially DC Airport is very difficult to get into, so we were extremely proud to start that service just a year ago,
January of last year.
And so it is very well-utilized and has helped us out tremendously across the community for business growth, for events, and it is extremely tragic
that it occurred on this route, especially after hosting one of those ice skating events, which you had just referenced.
So it is devastating to the community. We have already held a prayer vigil citywide, with a lot of leaders from different clergy coming together and
everybody just, you know, thoughts and prayers are to all the family and victims, everyone involved and the first responders that are out there.
QUEST: Do you know anything about the skaters? The event? Do you know anything? I mean, the skating association had chosen Wichita as a place to
hold this event.
ROMO: Yes, that was a significant win for us to from our visitors and convention bureau. And, you know, it was great to highlight Wichita, and it
is just very unfortunate that it happened to some of the participants.
QUEST: We are hearing all sorts of ideas and thoughts of what might have taken place, particularly concerning air traffic control. Now I am going to
follow, forgive me. I am not going to follow the president's view on terms of DEI, but I want to instead talk more about this idea from the chair of
the of the NTSB, which is air traffic control and the level of stress not only of the controllers, but of the system and the number of air traffic
controllers. Is this something of which you have experience at Wichita that there are simply just not enough controllers to go around?
ROMO: I think that we've all seen that in recent years, especially since COVID, that we've struggled with staffing and keeping it at the highest
level possible. We've definitely suffered through a pilot shortage in our industry, and there has been discussions of the shortage of air traffic
controllers.
I am not sure, and I can't speak to the level of staffing that occurred there last night in the Washington, DC area. But it has definitely been
something prevalent in our workforce across several industries as well.
QUEST: Have you seen any evidence of a lowering of quality of staff that people have been employed either on competency or on DEI grounds or
anything? And the reason I am asking, sir, and I know it is an uncomfortable question, is because the president himself put this firmly,
squarely right in the domain in a 45-minute news conference.
[16:20:07]
From what you have seen, have you seen anything that suggests that standards have changed?
ROMO: I can't state that I've seen any sort of standard change. So again, my comments would only be towards -- I know that we've had a shortage in
workforce and, you know, we've all struggled with retention and wanting to train and develop our staff. But, no, I won't engage in that level of
speculation on their quality of workforce there.
QUEST: Mr. Director, I am grateful, sir. Our thoughts, prayers, considerations. This is a very difficult time for everybody and yourselves
and your staff and your colleagues. And I am grateful that you've taken a moment or two out of your busy day to talk to me.
Thank you sir. It is appreciated. Thank you.
ROMO: Thank you. Appreciate it.
QUEST: It is CNN. In a moment, huge celebrations in the West Bank and Gaza. Israel has freed 110 Palestinian prisoners. It is all part of the ceasefire
agreement with Hamas.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: And more hostages have been released from Gaza. Three Israelis and five Thai citizens. And in return, Israel has set free more than a hundred
Palestinian prisoners, but only after a tense delay, as CNN's Jeremy Diamond reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): These are the chaotic final moments of Israeli hostage Arbel Yehud, 15 months in captivity. Flanked by
masked militants, the 29-year-old appears terrified as she is hustled through a raucous crowd in Gaza's southern city of Khan Younis.
Red Cross vehicles and her freedom are just steps away.
In Tel Aviv's Hostage Square, Israelis watch with dreaded anticipation as the scene unfolds live on television. Minutes later, Yehud is handed over
to Red Cross officials.
Gadi Moses is next, amid a sea of militants wearing the green and yellow bandanas of Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad, the 80-year-old hostage is
handed over to the Red Cross.
The Israeli prime minister, condemning the chaotic scene, calling it yet more proof of the unimaginable cruelty of the Hamas terrorist organization,
demanding that the mediators ensure that such horrific scenes do not recur.
In response, the prime minister delaying the release of 110 Palestinian prisoners driving Palestinian youths into the streets.
[16:25:07]
Amid clashes, at least three Palestinians are shot by Israeli Forces, according to the Palestine Red Crescent.
Hours later, the buses emerge from Ofer Prison. Of the 110 prisoners being released, 32 were serving life sentences, including several responsible for
deadly attacks on Israeli civilians. Thirty children were also released. They had all been arrested in the last two years, some held without charge,
none convicted of a crime.
In Israel, emotional reunions as three Israelis held hostage by Hamas, including the Israeli soldier, Agam Berger were reunited with their
families. Five Thai hostages were also released, freed in addition to the 33 Israeli hostages being released during the six-week ceasefire.
President Trump's Middle East envoy also making an appearance at Hostage Square.
STEVE WITKOFF, US SPECIAL ENVOY TO THE MIDDLE EAST: President Trump is committed to doing everything possible to help the families.
DIAMOND (voice over): Indicating one of two Americans set to be released in the coming weeks will be freed on Saturday.
Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Tel Aviv.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: On Capitol Hill, Donald Trump's nominee for US Director of National Intelligence, DNI, faced sharp questions about her past statements.
Tulsi Gabbard was grilled by senators over sympathetic comments she made about Russia and a controversial meeting in 2017 with the Syrian dictator
Bashar al-Assad.
The Senate, the Democratic Senator Mark Warner wondered whether US allies would work with Gabbard given her past remarks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MARK WARNER (D-VA): There is no legal requirement that our allies share intelligence with us. It is all predicated on trust. Trust that our
allies will protect each other's secrets, yet, it appears to me you have repeatedly excused our adversaries' worst actions and instead often blamed
them on the United States and those very allies.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Sir Simon Fraser was the head of the UK Diplomatic Service, now chair of Chatham House and a founding partner of Flint Global.
Sir Simon, thank you.
SIR SIMON FRASER FORMER HEAD OF THE UK DIPLOMATIC SERVICE: Thank you for inviting me.
QUEST: Do you -- I mean, is it likely that -- how will people regard Tulsi Gabbard knowing what she said and yet, at the same time, if she is
confirmed she has got the job.
FRASER: Well, I think if she is confirmed, she has got the job and therefore we have to be realistic about that, but they will be looking at
her. I don't know how well people know her background. She said some very interesting things about Syria, about Russia, about Edward Snowden, and she
is going to be occupying a very sensitive position that affects the UK and other allies of the United States.
QUEST: And when you look at something like AUKUS or the Four Eyes, then it becomes even more significant.
FRASER: Well, it is very significant and those relationships are based on trust in sharing intelligence and it works in both directions.
QUEST: These Five Eyes.
FRASER: It is the Five Eyes.
QUEST: The Five Eyes, I was mentioning -- every time I do that, I was mentally working out. Who have I forgotten? It is the Five Eyes. Apologies.
FRASER: But, I mean, it is an important relationship. And it depends on trust on all sides and it is mutually beneficial that intelligence is
shared, but equally, these are highly sensitive things. So, you know, there will be a lot of concern about the implications of this nomination.
On the other hand, final point, the relationship is deeply, institutionally embedded between the intelligence agencies, the military and others, so it
is not just one individual, it is a lot of people who are involved in this.
QUEST: But if it gets to a situation, as we are seemingly heading towards where you have a president who will speak off the top of his head on any
subject, you then have a DNI who is a bit suspect.
FRASER: Yes.
QUEST: You then have a CIA Director who is known for X, Y, or Z. Do the bonds of trust that really intelligence relies on, do they start to fray?
FRASER: So there is a risk of that and that is without doubt an issue. And people in London and elsewhere will be looking at this, and there will be a
degree of caution. On the other hand, I know that, for example, Peter Mandelson is very clear that when he goes as ambassador to Washington, one
of his big priorities is to make sure that those relationships are preserved and remain intact because they matter to the United Kingdom and
indeed, I would say they matter to the United States.
QUEST: Was Lord Mandelson's mea culpa -- I didn't mean to say that or I know I was wrong saying those things about President Trump the last time.
Was that toe-curlingly creepy?
FRASER: I think a lot of people have said things in the past that they've moved on from --
QUEST: But he had to do a sort of I was wrong, I was wrong.
FRASER: I don't know whether we should read too much into that. He wants to obviously create a playing field, which gives him the chance to have a
positive influence in Washington, and that's what he should be doing.
QUEST: The tariffs on Canada and Mexico on the grounds of immigration, fentanyl subsidies. I assume that the EU will have them as well. It is very
difficult to know how to respond.
FRASER: Well, I wouldn't put everybody in the same bucket. We knew that he had threatened -- Donald Trump had threatened tariffs on Mexico and Canada,
25 percent. It seems as if he is now signing an executive order, but we need to read the fine print because I think he is also linking that to
their actions to help secure America's borders.
So this brings us to the question to what extent is this political leverage in those relationships, and to what extent is he actually going to fully
follow through with the economic measures? We don't know yet.
But, you know, it is -- it's a known Trump playbook. You create leverage with your partners and then you --
QUEST: Right. But when he does sign --
FRASER: You pursue your goals.
QUEST: I mean, he announced it. But when he does sign it, probably on the 1st, and how do you as a government respond to that? Because you're being
hit with something that is against everything you normally do. No other -- can you remember a time where people have shot from the hip in quite such a
way?
FRASER: Well --
QUEST: So frequently.
FRASER: Not since Donald Trump was last president. No.
QUEST: Exactly.
FRASER: But -- and it may be even a bit more so this time. But we do have experience of this. So if you think back, you talked about the E.U., they
did -- he did impose selective tariffs on the E.U. in the past. And the E.U. took reciprocal measures. And then the E.U. negotiated a deal, for
example, over soy beans, I remember, in order to try and get those tariffs lifted. So it's about negotiating your way through it.
QUEST: The speed with which he's prepared to go tariff nuclear, if you will.
FRASER: Yes.
QUEST: It seemed to me last week at Davos that the E.U. really has a plan but doesn't really know how to deal with it. One person described them as
like chickens without heads.
Do you think the E.U. structures, council, commission, et cetera, are fit for purpose against Donald Trump?
FRASER: Well, they've dealt with him in the past, but I think it's important that E.U. at the moment is in a difficult position. Its economy
is not growing. It's got political difficulties in Germany and France, its main states. It's got a new commission in place. So you're right to say
there's a lot of change in Brussels, but the E.U. system is very adept and experienced at international trade negotiations, for example. So I wouldn't
write them off.
QUEST: Unless the other person wants a fight.
FRASER: Well, but -- yes, but does the United States really want a long, protracted economic fight with Europe? Let's hope not.
QUEST: Sir Simon, glad to see you.
FRASER: Thank you.
QUEST: Thank you very much indeed.
Now, as we continue tonight, we'll take a break. And when we come back, plenty more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:35:31]
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. A lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in just a moment but only after the headlines because these are the stories we're
following for you at the top of this hour. Top headlines.
Tonight 67 people perished when the passenger jet and a military helicopter collided near Washington, D.C. The wreckage plunged into the freezing
waters of the Potomac. The collision is the worst U.S. air disaster since November 2001.
There were celebrations -- now, returning to our breaking news. There are no survivors after a passenger jet and a military helicopter collided over
Washington. A total of 67 people died. The head of the National Air Transportation Board -- I beg your pardon. The head of the National Air
Traffic Controllers Union says it's too soon to speculate on the cause. But that didn't stop the president who baselessly placed the blame on DEI and
the Biden administration.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I do want to point out that various articles that appeared prior to my entering office, and here's one.
The FAA's diversity push includes focus on hiring people with severe intellectual and psychiatric disabilities. That is amazing.
Pete Buttigieg, a real winner. That's the guy who's a real winner. Do you know how badly everything was run since he's run the Department of
Transportation? He's a disaster.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Les Abend, Captain Abend is a retired American Airlines pilot, flown more 777s than most, contributing editor at "Flying Magazine."
Let's get that out of the way before we discuss what actually happened. What do you make of what the president said? Take it any way or which way?
LES ABEND, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, FLYING MAGAZINE: You know, this is an awful, awful, awful tragedy. I was there in 43 years ago when Air Florida
crashed in the river. And it's hard to take that memory of those airplane parts floating in the river. With that setting, what he said was a total
insult to air traffic controllers. Matter of fact, Washington, I found to be the most proficient, some of the best controllers in the country. And
it's one of the safest places to fly into because of that.
QUEST: It is one of the more complex and challenging. Now, that's not to say less safe, but the nature of -- you know, the geography, the
topography, the buildings, the flight paths. It is challenging for pilots.
ABEND: It is challenging, Richard. I mean, we're talking about a lot of concrete in a very small area. We're talking about short runways. We're
talking about very limited amount of approaches because of the airspace restrictions that are around there. You cannot fly in some of that military
airspace.
And of course, we know about the White House and the airspace over the capital. So in addition, we're talking about an arrival that starts 80
miles out with various what we call step down spots in the sky where we have to change altitude, and then you get to a point where you follow those
and you're intensely focused on that, and then you have to transition to a visual approach.
When you add the ingredient of nighttime, now you have multitudes of lights. We can sincerely identify runway lights and so on and so forth. But
identifying a helicopter in the cockpit of a regional jet is very difficult.
QUEST: Why --
ABEND: And apparently it was very difficult for the helicopter as well.
QUEST: Why wouldn't any of the collision avoidance systems? I mean, admittedly, there's a lot of traffic around there, so they're not as useful
as they are further out and more spaced out. Otherwise they'd be blurting all the time. But why do you think none on either craft did any of the
traffic avoidance systems come into play?
ABEND: I can't speak to the system on the Blackhawk, and I'm not quite sure about the system on the -- I know what the minimum systems have to be on
that regional jet, but we have a system that definitely was on board, that would have warned the pilots and they would have been able to take control
past whatever the controllers ordered.
[16:40:10]
But that would have been a muted audio alert below 1,000 feet. So the objective is to focus on your landing, and you don't want a lot of
distractions beyond that. So they may not have heard that. The visual may have been part of it, but it may have been too late, Richard, for that
visual warning that's part of the audio to occur.
QUEST: So we're also hearing, and it's not confirmed, I will make that clear, potentially one air traffic controller covering two spaces in the
tower. Not unusual because of a shortage of controllers. And -- but the complexity, I mean, it does seem, and I'm not ascribing yet, but it does
seem as if air traffic controls, procedures, will play a major part in this investigation. Would you agree?
ABEND: I absolutely would agree. And that they will be. A part of those controllers will be a party to the NTSB investigation as they should. But
the -- I've seen this circumstance where at certain times of the day, mostly, you know, toward the evening hours, a ground controller at a
smaller facility might take over for the tower controller and vice versa. As long as you've got experienced controllers involved with this process,
it's not a big deal.
But indeed, this seemed like this was a -- it was a busy time. And two controllers may have saved the day on this one. It's hard to say at this
point.
QUEST: The only thing I know is never, when you're landing at D.C. is that -- is that turn to that runway, which is always -- which is a very late
turn, and for passengers, it's always a stomach churning moment because there are some very, very late maneuvers, aren't there?
ABEND: There are. And most airlines require their captains to fly with a check airman before they ever fly into Washington for those reasons because
of the challenges that are involved.
QUEST: Right.
ABEND: But you've got to be on your A game. There's no doubt about it, Richard.
QUEST: Les, always good to see you. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much indeed.
Now, as I just discussed with Les, the airspace over D.C. is incredibly complex. And as a result, one U.S. senator said he's long worried something
like this could happen. We'll discuss that aspect in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:45:09]
QUEST: There were no survivors after a passenger jet and a military helicopter crashed midair near Washington on Wednesday. 67 people were
killed in the disaster. The American Airlines Eagle Flight took off from Kansas and was about to land at Reagan National Airport. The airspace over
Washington is always congested with both civilian and military aircraft. Senator Tim Kaine says he's long been worried something like this could
happen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): I have been very worried about this for a long time. And I continue to be worried about it. The National Transportation Safety
Board will do an investigation of this, and I have high confidence in them. And they'll look and see what was the cause of this devastating tragedy.
And I'm not going to speculate. They'll do the work. They're good at it. They'll give us answers. But yes, I've been very, very concerned about this
very complex airspace.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now, Tom Foreman is in Washington. We were talking to Les Abend, his words, well, you may have just heard him. He says, you have to be on your A
game when you're landing at National.
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: (INAUDIBLE) review of records has found that in the past three years, twice we've come very close to having a
commercial airline and a helicopter in this area collide. And another time, two helicopters nearly collided.
Part of the reason, Richard, is there's sort of a funneling effect here. This is a normal route that military helicopters follow all the time. And
this is a normal route for airplanes coming in, swinging out wide here to hit this runway instead of that one is a little more unusual. But still, it
happens all the time. And part of what's guiding this into sort of a funneling effect is that this is a class B airport.
Now, it may sound kind of technical, but what that really means is that there's so much traffic here that this is sort of an upside down wedding
cake plan. All the airspace up here, and this may be 60 miles across, up to 10,000 feet or so, this is where the planes are going to come in and work
their way down to land or as they take off. This is how they're managing it through this airspace.
The helicopters around here, and you see them all the time in this city, maybe 100 flights a day, they're flying down here with a ceiling of about
200 feet. So that's very close to the ground. If you saw it anywhere else, you'd say, why are they so low? Here they're that low to keep them out of
this wedding cake. But when they get to the final part where they all come together, that's where they have to occupy some of the same space, and they
have to simply look out for each other. They have to be able to see each other.
Now, I was talking to a commercial airline pilot who said just a short while ago that he came in one time and he was told on this approach,
there's a helicopter there. Their instrumentation told him there was a helicopter there. And he said, and we could still never see it, because at
night, with all the lights of the town, it doesn't jump out at you. It's very difficult to do. So the bottom line is when they get to this area,
they have to figure out where the other vessel is if it presents a threat.
And even the warning systems may not tell them specifically where it is. And even if they do, if you're in a plane traveling 150 miles an hour, you
may have to make a split second decision and get it exactly right to avoid a collision.
So on a busy place like this, Richard, yes, there's reason to worry.
QUEST: Tom, there's so many questions to ask. We'll save them for another moment, but that's fascinating. Thank you, sir. Thank you.
In a moment, Nigeria's trade minister, who is laser focused on making her country a better place to do business, in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:51:39]
QUEST: Nigeria's trade minister says her country is slowly but surely changing its business climate. Nigeria is saddled with a reputation for
poor business practice and corruption, scored at just 25 on 100 on the Transparency Internationals Corporation Index, and that number has not
really changed significantly over the past decade.
I spoke to Jumoke Oduwole last week at Davos, and she told me the country is becoming an easier place to start and grow a business.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JUMOKE ODUWOLE, NIGERIAN MINISTER OF INDUSTRY, TRADE AND INVESTMENT: For the last nine years, I've been working on business climate reforms. In
fact, that is why I got this job. Ease of doing business. Over 200 verifiable reforms implemented by or verified by the World Bank. Nigerian
businesses have learned to trust that gradually ease of people, processes and to a lesser extent, infrastructure.
The Purbeck has delivered on that mandate. So now it's time to take it further, move it to investment promotion, move it to exports of services
because it needs less infrastructure. So it's a quicker win for Nigeria.
QUEST: How can you essentially clean up the business environment? How can you change the culture within this?
ODUWOLE: There's no shortcut. It's the people issues, the processes and infrastructure. We need to start making sure there's more transparency and
efficiency. And we've been doing that work for nine years. There's just no shortcut. We continue to make it a progressively easier place to start and
grow a business.
QUEST: So one of the things I always find extraordinary about Africa, besides just the excitement of the place, but aviation is a good example of
how dreadful it can be. How you have to almost go via the Gulf or Europe to get from one side of Africa to the other, simply because the deregulation
hasn't happened within the continent.
ODUWOLE: So, for instance, our minister of aviation has put in impressive reforms. So part of why you have that lack of connectivity is, for
instance, Nigeria was a signatory to the Cape Town Convention, but we hadn't done the procedural rules at the federal high court. So that has
been done last year. And so now more aviation sector is paying attention, investment, cheaper planes for lease. And those are the things that bring
costs down. Those are the things that bring open up new routes and connectivity. So it's services, services, services. Nigeria's GDP,
Nigeria's GDP mix is skewed towards services and growing.
QUEST: You've been described as the next Ngozi. Of course who is standing where you were only last night and is a dear friend of this program. And
I've interviewed her when she was finance minister. So it's quite a compliment that people are regarding you as being somebody who can make
that much of a contribution.
ODUWOLE: Yes. Christine Lagarde just called me one of those girls and I take it as a huge compliment. I just told Madam Ngozi that as well. It's
about excellence, it's about impact. It's about being good at what you do and being committed to your role to deliver for over 200 million Nigerian
people.
QUEST: It's about choosing a color.
ODUWOLE: Red. Actually green.
QUEST: That was a quick change of mind.
ODUWOLE: Yes.
QUEST: All right. The next four years in one word. You can jump on somebody else's. You can choose your own. Digital.
ODUWOLE: I'm telling the world, Nigeria is open for business, we're digital. Five out of nine unicorns in Africa are Nigerian. Nigerian talent,
our youth. Incredible. Don't miss the wave. Working on it.
[16:55:12]
But we are resourceful. We are resilient. We are agile in spite of a deficiency in power. Look at our economy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: So many of whom I know were going to hear a great deal more in the years ahead. It was delightful to bring them to you today.
All the indices closed higher. On the Dow Jones, picked up 168 points. The S&P, well, you can see. And the Nasdaq eking out a smaller gain. But still
it was positive for the session despite a 6 percent loss of Microsoft. Gold futures rose 2 percent to a new record, the first since October. Gold is up
7 percent on the year.
We'll have a "Profitable Moment" after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Today we had two very different views and ways in which the aftermath of air disasters is handled. We had the NTSB, which, because this
crash was in Washington, the American Airlines crash was in Washington, came out in full force to show they are still the gold standard of
investigations, saying, making clear that they will hold an investigation. They would not speculate. They were setting at operationals and various
working groups, and they would keep us informed as to how they were going to proceed.
And then we had the president of the United States, the secretary of Transportation, and the Defense secretary, all of whom came out and
proceeded to speculate wildly. The president admitted, he said I have some thoughts and opinions, and then went off on a wild track about DEI and how
that might have played a role in the air traffic control. In other words, speculated shamelessly, wantonly, negligently about what might have
happened.
And why do I say that? Because people will listen and believe. People will not listen to the nuance of, well, I don't know, but. They won't listen to,
well, perhaps, maybe. They will merely here, competence, DEI, and all the things that President Trump talked about today.
You make your own minds up on which way forward was the best.
And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in London. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead.
END
