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Quest Means Business

Santorini in State of Emergency After Strong Quake, Tremors; Elon Musk Shines Spotlight on U.K. Child Abuse Scandal; Inside Eleven Madison Park. USAID Workers Have Their Lives Upended by Trump Orders; Trump Expected to Sign Executive Order Targeting ICC; Rubio Walks Back State Department Claim that US Government Ships Can Use Panama Canal for Free. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired February 06, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: I wonder if it could have been my uncle's backyard. I think I would have heard about that, right? I would have heard

of -- it's not -- it is very, I feel like this is commonplace in Australia.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Australia --

KEILAR: It's just no big deal.

SANCHEZ: It's just like the weirdest animals, everything can kill you over there.

KEILAR: Everything can kill you.

SANCHEZ: It's intense.

KEILAR: But chill will be right as they say.

SANCHEZ: Not the least -- not the least --

KEILAR: Chill be right.

SANCHEZ: -- of which the break dancer's --

KEILAR: And so will Jake Tapper.

SANCHEZ: Shoutout to Ray Gun. We always have room for Ray Gun.

KEILAR: "The Lead" starts now.

[16:00:25]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": The closing bell has rung on Wall Street. The market and trading is over for the day.

It was a down day on the markets overall, as you can see, it was pretty much in the red for most of the session. Largely political reasons that we

will get to over the course of the program.

Those are the main events and these are the events of the day that we are talking about: A judge has paused the Trump administrations planned

deadline for accepting a buyout offer for federal workers, 40,000 is believed to have accepted it.

There is outrage from the president of Panama, who says the United States is spreading lies and falsehoods about the Panama Canal and US transit.

And behind-the-scenes at one of New York's most sought after restaurants. Now, the one thing you won't find on this menu, meat. It is so, so popular,

the restaurant that is.

Live tonight from Paris. It is Thursday. It is February the 6th. I am Richard Quest, and in Paris, as elsewhere, I mean business.

Good evening.

We begin tonight with the Trump administrations plans to quickly shrink the US federal government and the blow it has been dealt by a court.

A judge has paused the deadline for federal workers to accept resignation offers. Employees originally had until midnight to make their decision. Now

that's on hold while the court battles over the program's legality and how that plays out.

Elon musk was dealt a separate blow in the crusade to cut spending. The US Treasury Department is limiting his team's access to its payment system.

His Department of Government Efficiency or DOGE wants the data for its crackdown on government spending.

Now access to it is being challenged in court. CNN's Jeff Zeleny reports on the day's events from the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: The White House, bit of a -- perhaps sarcastic response, this is what we are getting from White

House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt, who said a few minutes ago this: "We are grateful to the judge for extending the deadline so more federal

workers who refuse to show up to the office can take the administration up on this very generous, once in a lifetime offer."

So expressing gratitude to that Massachusetts federal judge who put this on hold, saying that there needed to be oral arguments on this on Monday.

The bottom line to all of this is there is so much confusion and skepticism throughout the federal government about this buyout program because it

happened in a very nontraditional way. It started, of course, with those e- mails that sounded very Elon Musk like, which of course, they were devised to sound like that. He has been playing a huge role in this, in his

Department of Government Efficiency.

But there have been questions from labor unions for the federal workforce if these actually were valid agreements.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Jeff Zeleny reporting there. My apologies. I was just getting a bit congested. Cold weather, flu, and all of that.

Now, the US Secretary of State Marco Rubio, says USAID workers with exceptional circumstances can stay in their station despite the order to

stay at home. Employees have been otherwise told to return to the United States, and are set to be placed on administrative leave as of tomorrow,

which is Friday.

Their lives have been completely upended. One official in the Middle East says their team has no clue how or if they are going to even get home, even

though the government has said it will pay all the costs.

Diplomats often have years long posts. They've built their lives where they are working, and the funding freeze is making things even more complicated.

Contractors don't know if and how they will get reimbursed.

Joining me now, Steve Schmida, the co-founder and the chief innovation officer of Resonance, a consulting firm for the USAID -- a USAID contractor

for many years.

[16:05:03]

And Steve, I've been reading about the issues and the problems that you are facing. Essentially, you're having to lay off your staff and essentially,

you're almost shut down.

STEVE SCHMIDA, CO-FOUNDER AND CHIEF INNOVATION OFFICER, RESONANCE GLOBAL: That's correct, Richard.

So when the executive order came out on Inauguration Day to pause foreign assistance, that's not that unusual, right? That's something that occurs.

Administrations certainly have the right to do, you know, the right and its very understandable.

When Marco Rubio issued the stop work order, stop work orders are usually only used on a single contract or a single program. They've never been

applied in a blanket way across the federal government.

And as a result, the regulations with it are quite onerous and it takes time to shut things down and make sure that you're accounting for the

taxpayer dollars properly.

But things got much worse when administration officials and DOGE shut down the USAID payment system. We had millions of dollars of invoices that had

been approved for payment for work going as far back as November, even before the election to be frank that are not being paid.

And we are not unique in this regard. There are millions or excuse me, there are hundreds of organizations owed hundreds of millions of dollars

for work that the government hired us to do.

QUEST: Now, do you believe that you will eventually get paid? I understand that doesn't help you with any cash flow issues or wages or liabilities

that you have, but is there a confusion about whether you will get paid for work done?

SCHMIDA: We have received no direction from the administration, from USAID whatsoever, that it contravenes the stop work order rules themselves,

right? So they're already breaking the rules.

So we have no idea, and as a result, you know, there has been all of these layoffs. I mean, we are talking probably well over 10,000 in the US already

and probably maybe double that in the next week or two as organizations either go bankrupt or have to cut back drastically.

QUEST: What does this mean for your business overall? Does this imperil -- and forgive me, but does this imperil the very existence of your business?

SCHMIDA: Yes. I mean, this is -- you know, just to put this in perspective, about 70, maybe 75 percent of our work was -- our largest client was USAID

until January 24th. The impact on our workforce has been devastating.

Yesterday, we had a call with our teams and had to let go so many of our personnel. We have an amazing team, Richard. These are folks who have

dedicated their lives to advancing American interests, to working and to support our values in places like Afghanistan, you know, Venezuela, all

over the world.

QUEST: If we look at the effect on the programs involved, you know, in all of this, what I am trying to do is basically understand as a result of the

DOGE and well, as a result of the executive order and then the DOGE, we are talking about antiretrovirals not being bought, food or formula not being

bought for babies.

We are talking real life and death matters downstream, which of course is in the developed world -- the developing world, correct?

SCHMIDA: Absolutely. And it covers even more than that. For example, you know, there are organizations monitoring ISIS, right, in Syria, trying to

keep an eye on extremist groups to make sure they don't attack us again.

You know, these are -- they've gone dark, right? We have no idea, you know, on the open source basis that we've gone dark there.

And so, you know, it affects our National Security, it affects our health security and frankly, it is going to increase migration to the border. A

big part of the work that USAID does is to increase prosperity in Latin America, so that folks don't want to migrate in the first place.

We could save the taxpayer a ton of money if they never show up at the border, because they have great lives at home.

QUEST: Now, let me just put bluntly to you what those in the administration would say. The president himself, a nest of vipers, I think, is what was

described in one way.

[16:10:08]

It needed to be shut down before it could be reopened. And in fact, on the question of not a bad word -- a bad apple in the barrel, but the entire

barrel was bad. Is that your understanding?

SCHMIDA: No, quite the contrary, Richard.

I mean, many, many of us, myself included, have served alongside our Armed Forces in places like Afghanistan and Iraq, right?

We have -- you know, my company, for example, one of our projects was promoting the president's program in Greenland. We are promoting -- until

January 24th, until DOGE, we were working to promote US trade and investment in Greenland, right? That is a key presidential priority.

In my experience, I've worked across Republican and Democratic administrations for 30 years. The vast, vast majority of folks in foreign

assistance are professionals. We serve the interests of and values of the administration that is elected by the American people.

We are not policymakers. We don't decide that. We are the ones who help make it happen.

And so, you know, I think the president is a little misguided in his rhetoric.

QUEST: Steve, I am grateful for you for joining us this evening. We have something on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS voices of the crisis, which we now will

be talking to you about, and we look forward to -- well, we will keep in touch and follow on.

Thank you, sir. I am grateful. Thank you.

Now, President Trump is expected to sign an executive order shortly, which will be targeting the International Criminal Court. It is a wide ranging

executive order, we believe, and its apparent response to the courts arrest warrant for Israeli leaders. According to a fact sheet obtained by CNN, the

order sanctions people who helped the court investigate US citizens and US allies, that would include Israel.

So Kim Dozier is with me.

How wide, how deep, and what do you believe is going to be the actual effect of this?

KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: It could make it very difficult for members of the court to travel to do their jobs. That's one

of the main effects whenever the US slaps sanctions on someone and depending on the level, depending on the details, it could make it hard for

them to travel to any country that has an extradition treaty with the United States.

But more importantly for this administration is this is about symbolism. This is about sending the message to Trump administration supporters, MAGA

world and Israel, that they are doing whatever they can to support the state of Israel, including going after their legal detractors who have been

investigating everything that has happened inside Gaza, the West Bank and beyond.

QUEST: Right. So I think it is important to understand here that even though the US may not be with the ICC, by taking this action, they will be

hindering the ICC's work, even if they are not involved directly themselves as the United States not being a member.

DOZIER: Again, the devil is in the details. We need to see, are they going to name specific investigative judges? Are they going to do like the Biden

administration did with Israeli settlers who the administration held responsible for violence in the West Bank. It named and shamed individual

ones, tried to seize their funds that were overseas and also made it difficult for them to move around. It could be the same way with the Trump

administration and the criminal court when they issue, say, Red Notices for particular people.

But we don't know exactly what they're going to do. At least I haven't read the executive order yet. Now, can it be challenged, as so many of the Trump

administration executive orders are being challenged right now? Absolutely. But it becomes more background noise with everything else that is going on

and therefore more symbolic.

Yes, the Trump DOJ will fight to make it stick, but it definitely means that it may be harder for those who need to travel across various different

countries and various different airspaces to collect the physical evidence they need to build the case to do their job.

QUEST: So in the end, the ICC becomes more hobbled as a result.

DOZIER: Yes.

[16:15:07]

Which won't upset the administration, whose very goal, in a sense, is to do that.

But what I wonder is whether -- pardon the bluntness of the question, and it is not meant to be flippant, but I wonder if anyone cares? Because you

see, in the great scheme of the fire hose of EOs and changes taking place coming out of the White House and the administration, there will be those

who say this is quite low down in terms of priorities and fire alarms.

DOZIER: If your center of gravity is here in Washington, DC, I absolutely agree with you. There is a small subset of Americans who care about this --

Human Rights lawyers, Civil Rights lawyers et cetera. But the rest of the world is watching this, including European allies who are thinking long and

hard about how much they can count on the Trump administration going forward and how much their own values align.

You know, EU values do not align with a lot that's coming out of the White House right now and I've spoken to diplomats, both European and others, who

are, for instance, big China watchers. And they say, you know, if you're watching all of this unspool out of the White House and the norms of

democracy and human rights are being trashed, at least rhetorically, you're going to start looking for other allies who can be counted on, at least in

terms of --

A lot of European countries have moved away from doing business with China, with the pressure and cooperation of the Biden administration, which

facilitated, gave them other avenues and opportunities, other investments.

I have spoken to diplomats who believe that this will make Europe reconsider that maybe China is the ally, or at least the investment partner

that they can count on. Yes, Beijing is very transactional, but you don't have the fickle nature that many of them feel is coming out of Washington

right now.

QUEST: Kim, I am grateful to you. Another one that we will follow very closely. Thank you so much.

As QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tonight continues, Panama's president says the US State Department is lying after the department claimed there was an

agreement to let US ships pass free through the Panama Canal, US government ships, that is.

Next, we will talk about who said what, where, when and why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:20:20]

QUEST: The US Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, is walking back claims about a new agreement with the government of Panama. The State Department posted

on its website that the US government ships could use the Panama Canal for free. Apparently, that was part of an agreement that he and others had

reached.

However, now, the Secretary of State is clarifying and saying the US expects to have free use of the canal. But it is not yet been sorted out.

Panama's president, Jose Raul Mulino rebuked the United States over the original post, claiming free transit.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSE RAUL MULINO, PANAMANIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): I am very surprised by the statement from the State Department yesterday because they

are making an important and institutional statement from the entity that governs the foreign policy of the United States under the president of the

United States, based on a falsehood and that is intolerable, simply and plainly intolerable.

And today, Panama expresses through you and to the world my absolute rejection of continuing to explore the path of managing the bilateral

relationship on the basis of lies and falsehoods.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: So what is it about? Well, President Trump has been trying to take back the Panama Canal, which he says is a US asset and should never have

been given away. Let's remind ourselves about the Canal.

It was the United States that built it in the early 20th Century. Thousands of workers, tens of thousands in some cases died, including many people

from Panama.

Once it was opened, it was controlled by the United States and used by the US Navy. The former President Jimmy Carter, agreed in 1977 to transfer

control to Panama with a handover completed in the year 2000.

Alex Marquardt is with me now.

This is a rather ugly dispute because here we have the president of Panama basically saying, I can't do bilateral negotiations or bilateral relations

with the United States when you're lying.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Richard, it is really quite remarkable. The top US diplomat getting into some pretty

undiplomatic spats in his first few weeks on the job, not just Panama, but South Africa as well.

It seemed like the meeting, the trip had gone quite well and then you had this statement by the State Department last night saying there has been

this agreement that the US vessels can go through without any fees, which, of course, President Mulino rejected wholeheartedly today.

We have heard from Rubio essentially trying to clarify this, saying that this is where he expects Panama to end up. But he says that he understands

that Panama is a sovereign country, has a process that they need to go through. He says he thinks that they will go through this process and this

is where they will end up.

But if you read between the lines of what the Panamanians have been saying, it doesn't appear that way and you would think that the statement would

have been issued once the discussions had been had and an agreement had been reached.

But it looks like here the State Department was jumping the gun. So then I think the question becomes, is this part of the broader pressure campaign

that we are seeing from the Trump administration, not just on Panama, but on several other countries as well -- Richard.

QUEST: Yes. You see that -- you're very diplomatic and elegant, Alex, as I would expect. I will put it bluntly, is this more up cock up than

conspiracy?

MARQUARDT: It is hard to say. And I am trying to be diplomatic as well. No, we could see -- the strategy has worked in a couple of other cases when it

comes to Colombia, for example, threatening to impose tariffs, same thing with Canada and Mexico, those countries essentially backing down or

acquiescing to the demands of Donald Trump.

Whether the Panamanians will do the same thing, we don't know. You and I have talked about the spat between the Trump administration and the South

Africans. Will that be resolved? We are not sure.

We are talking about the same kind of thing when it comes to displaced Palestinians, whether they will end up in Jordan and Egypt.

Certainly, the Trump administration feels at this point that it can throw its weight around, and it has been proven right in a number of occasions.

Whether that will happen here in Panama, we will just have to wait and see.

[16:25:10]

But the sounds that we are hearing from the Panamanians is that they have no intention of letting these American vessels through without paying what

they are supposed to for going through the Canal.

QUEST: Grateful that you're with us, as always, Alex. Thank you for helping us understand.

MARQUARDT: Thank you.

QUEST: The chief executive of the Maersk Shipping Lines says everyone should want the Panama Canal to function smoothly.

Now, Maersk is one of the world's largest shipping firms. I think it might be the largest shipping firm. It shares jumped after the company predicted

four percent growth in container traffic, which is interesting bearing in mind the potential for tariffs and trade wars.

Now, Maersk did caution that trouble in the Red Sea and the new tariffs could cut into that growth. So I guess that share price rise was more rear

view mirror.

Anna Stewart is with me. She has been speaking to the Maersk CEO Vincent Clerc, who must be extremely concerned on all these issues.

ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: Well, you'd think he would be, but I have to say, the man was fairly bullish. He does think there will be global trade

growth of four percent this year. That is actually less than he was saying just in December or the company was. They gave a range, I think between

five and seven percent, and clearly, there are huge headwinds.

And Richard, it is quite hard to know where to begin if you're talking about global trade and shipping in terms of headwinds, you've got tariffs

on the one hand between China and the US, possibly also with Canada and Mexico, possibly tariffs with Europe.

You have the ongoing issue with the Red Sea, which this shipping giant is still not using due to security risks. And then, of course, you've got all

the back and forth in the last 24 hours about the Panama Canal. That is where we started our conversation, just how concerned is he?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VINCENT CLERC, MAERSK CEO: The Panamanian government has a strong interest in keeping operations running in the Panama Canal and everything I am

hearing from the US administration is they also want the Panama Canal to function. They want it to function smoother and they would like it to be

cheaper to use.

In any case, the thing that both of them agree on is that transit needs to be fluid, because this is such a crucial piece of infrastructure for the

world.

STEWART: How significant is it in terms of global trade?

CLERC: It is, of course, quite important. There is not as much traffic going through Panama as there is going through Suez and we have seen the

amount of disruption that this -- that not being able to sail through Suez has caused.

But this is obviously very, very important for the United States because about 60 to 70 percent of the cargo who transit through the Panama Canal is

actually cargo that is or goes to or from the United States.

STEWART: A lot of the sort of concern, I suppose, from the US side is the influence of China on the Panama Canal. Is that something you have ever

been concerned about as someone who operates through it?

CLERC: I think from our perspective, the concerns that we have when it comes to the Panama Canal is twofold. First of all, it is the quality of

the service and the infrastructure that we have along the Canal. And on that front, I think that we have seen good levels of service.

The second is actually the intense pressure that there is on operations in general in Latin America with narcotrafficking and security concerns in

general. And this is a problem that has for us an increasing surface and is more and more important to address.

So on that, we have some concerns with what is in place today, and we think that one of the things that needs to come out of the current conversation

is a much more stringent approach to how we keep this infrastructure insulated from the interest of the narcotraffickers.

But other than that, I think for us, this is an infrastructure that we use that has been going well and that has been more impacted by lack of

rainfalls a few years ago than it has been impacted by the Chinese in different parts of the operation.

STEWART: You're still not sailing through the Red Sea. What needs to happen in terms of the security situation, for you to feel comfortable to resume

that route?

CLERC: We are looking at the security and the safety situation on the ground, but the second one is, we need to see durability of the situation.

The worst that we can do for the world and for our customers is actually to flip-flop back and forth, because this is causing huge disruptions in our

customers' supply chain.

So while all of them would like to see us resume sailing through the Red Sea, they have all been very, very clear on the fact that we get one shot

to make that change, and it needs to be a permanent change. And as long as were not sure this can be permanent, it is important for us to continue to

take the safe approach and keep the integrity and the resilience of their supply chain together.

STEWART: I feel like given our conversation, there are so many geopolitical concerns here. What worries you the most for 2025?

CLERC: There is actually a big difference today between the different declarations and intentions that are being preferred, and actually what

we're seeing on the ground. I talked about, you know, whether we see deglobalization or we see a reduction of the share of China? None of that

is happening despite the much you read about it. And for a lot of what is happening today, it's really about getting focused on what are the true

signals that we need to act on to continue to support our customers through these difficult times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART: And he essentially said that it's all quite a lot of noise and that actually you need to dampen down some of the noise and just focus on

what's actually happening on the ground. So much noise coming from the U.S. administration of course. The Red Sea may reopen for Maersk later this

year. There's a hope that maybe in the second half of the year, but they don't want to resume that too early, given if they had to then close it.

That is so much disruption for customers, but it is costing customers a small fortune to sail around the Cape of Good Hope, Richard. I think it's

an extra two weeks on the sail.

RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: And then I just imagine, Anna, put all that together with trade tariffs and the extra cost of inflation, we

can't -- we haven't time, unfortunately, to get into that at the moment. But I'm looking forward to delving deep in the days ahead.

Thank you, Anna Stewart.

A state of emergency has been declared on the Greek island of Santorini. In just a moment, we'll talk about the residents and the tourists that are

fleeing en masse. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. There's a lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in just a moment. So much to talk about. We'll be live in Greece, where a

surge in earthquakes is forcing holidaymakers to flee the island of Santorini. And also we'll tell you about inside the world famous Eleven

Madison Park. It's a superb restaurant, very expensive, vegetarian, three Michelin Stars. It banked its future and risked it on a plant based menu.

[16:35:06]

I'll get to all of that only after the news headlines because, as you know very well, this is CNN and on this network, the news always comes first.

Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is meeting with U.S. lawmakers today on Capitol Hill amid the controversy over President Trump's plans to

take over Gaza. Mr. Netanyahu is now publicly supporting the displacement of Gaza's entire population, calling it a remarkable idea.

There are new details about last week's deadly jailbreak in the Democratic Republic of Congo. It's believed that the male inmates who were escaping

set the prison in Goma on fire, and before they escaped, according to the United Nations anyway, they raped most of the 165 female prisoners. Only a

few of the women survived the fire. It all comes as Rwandan backed rebels have been fighting government forces to take control of Goma.

The man, accused of killing two people and wounding four others at an Ohio warehouse, is being held on a $20 million bond. The police say Bruce

Reginald Foster opened fire on co-workers on Tuesday and then resisted arrest following a daylong manhunt. A hearing is set for next week.

A state of emergency has been declared on the Greek island of Santorini. It follows a strong earthquake last night. It was a magnitude 5.2 quake and it

followed days of near constant tremors on the famous tourist island. According to residents and visitors alike, they've been fleeing en masse

since the shaking began last week. Around 20,000 people live on the island, and it sees more than three million visitors each year.

So for the current situation, Elinda Labropoulou joins me now from there.

Are people still scared and leaving?

ELINDA LABROPOULOU, JOURNALIST: People are still scared and leaving. We understand that at least 11,000 people have fled the island since the

tremors began. Obviously this is not the high season, so it's not so much tourists as more locals and workers who are on the island right now. But

emergency boats and flights have been put in place in order for people to be able to leave.

Now, this is an unprecedented situation on the island. This is what the experts have been telling us. And today the island has been put on state of

emergency for over a month, just simply to make sure that all scenarios can be taken care of. There are two scenarios here. There's a good scenario

that these tremors will continue, and they may continue for a long time. It could be weeks. It could even be months.

But that finally the activity is going to subside. And there is a bad scenario that these are just foreshocks that were seeing so far. And there

is a big earthquake coming. So authorities are preparing for all scenarios. There are -- the army is on the island. Special rescue teams have arrived.

And from what we understand now, Santorini is really looking like a ghost town as most people have already left -- Richard.

QUEST: So the feeling must be that if the worst in terms of a quake were to happen, that most are out of harm's way, whatever the physical damage would

be, at least for people there out of harm's way.

Yes, that would be the feeling. However, of course, you're also looking at an island that sees such a great number of visitors and at this time of

year, everybody is preparing for the summer, is preparing for the season. So it's extremely difficult to know how things are going to go in the long

run. Richard.

LABROPOULOU: Yes, that would be the feeling. However, of course, you're also looking at an island that sees such a great number of visitors and at

this time of year everybody is preparing for the summers, preparing for the season, so it's extremely difficult to know how things are going to go in

the long run -- Richard.

QUEST: Yes, of course. And you'll be there to watch events as they unfold over the next few days. I'm grateful. Thank you, Elinda.

Elon Musk has shone a spotlight on the grooming gang scandal that shook the United Kingdom a decade ago.

CNN's Nic Robertson has been speaking to one of the victims about Musk's involvement in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:42:41]

QUEST: Elon Musk recently whipped up an online storm about a child sexual abuse scandal that shook Britain. More than a thousand children were abused

by gangs in northern England over the years 1997 to 2013. Mr. Musk accuses the prime minister, Sir Keir Starmer, of failing to stop when he was a

prosecutor. Sir Keir says that Musk is spreading lies and disinformation.

CNN's Nic Robertson asked a victim of the grooming gangs to weigh in.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good morning. Demands for a national inquiry into grooming gangs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very close to the center of which is Elon Musk.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR (voice-over): In these Northern English streets, gangs of predominantly Pakistani heritage men,

groomed and gang raped vulnerable young girls, exploiting them under the noses of authorities.

It is this painful national scar that Elon Musk has helped reopen using his social media platform X to call for a national inquiry into these awful

events more than a decade ago.

(Voice-over): His intervention targeting the U.K. prime minister is winning Musk fans.

SAMANTHA WALKER-ROBERTS, CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE SURVIVOR: I honestly can't thank him enough for doing this because we need justice and we can't keep

going on year after year, decades on, and still getting nowhere.

ROBERTSON: What's different this time?

WALKER-ROBERTS: Everyone is finally listening.

ROBERTSON: Because of Elon Musk.

WALKER-ROBERTS: Yes.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): Sam, who was raped by a South Asian grooming gang, doesn't want to show her face, fearing a backlash.

WALKER-ROBERTS: I went to the police station to report a sexual assault that had just happened. There were two men behind me. They interrupted and

said, we can give you a lift, which the officer said, yes, go with them.

ROBERTSON: So the police handed you over to two abusers.

WALKER-ROBERTS: Yes.

ROBERTSON: You were how old then?

WALKER-ROBERTS: Twelve. Yes. As children, we're meant to trust officials. I was hurt from that.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): Musk appears to have picked Oldham and the abuse scandal to reignite attacks on U.K. PM Keir Starmer that began last summer,

picking up again early January when Musk began accusing Starmer, who was the chief prosecutor as the child abuse scandal surfaced of failing,

tweeting prison for Starmer, Starmer must go.

[16:45:14]

Starmer accused Musk of, quote, "lies and disinformation." The region's former chief prosecutor questions Musk's motivation.

NAZIR AFZAL, FORMER CHIEF PROSECUTOR FOR NORTH-WEST ENGLAND: He's just stirring up a racist pot.

ROBERTSON: Worse, he says, Musk's right-wing tweets amplifying posts focusing on crimes committed by, quote, "migrants." Pakistani Muslim and

Asian gangs are putting girls at risk.

AFZAL: When you just focus on the brown guy, you're telling girls beware of the brown guy. You're not telling them that they're 40 times more likely in

this country to be abused by a British white guy.

ROBERTSON: For years, rape was happening in plain sight. Institutional failings repeated.

According to an independent national inquiry, the child abuse scandal spanned dozens of British cities, affected thousands of children, threw

shame on national institutions, heightened racial tensions, particularly in cities like Oldham. Historically poorer with higher than national average

immigration.

(Voice-over): Oldham, a rustbelt type of town, is also pushing back against Musk.

ABDUL WAHID, OLDHAM COUNCILOR: Some of the rhetoric he's coming out with is probably not helpful.

ROBERTSON: Why is it unhelpful?

WAHID: It's unhelpful because everybody starts pitching against each other.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): Musk's divisive onslaught has forced Starmer's hand, triggering new legislation and a new but non-statutory inquiry for

Oldham.

Sam says it's not enough. What she wants from Musk is to stop enabling the right-wing.

WALKER-ROBERTS: He needs to say that this is about survivors, not about everyone else. And too many people are jumping on this bandwagon.

ROBERTSON: A bandwagon Musk perhaps figures might drive Starmer from office.

Nic Robertson, CNN, Oldham, England.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Now CNN has reached out to Musk's team for comment and so far we have not heard back.

Coming up tonight, I got a taste of a Michelin Star dining without a key ingredient, meat. And it tastes delicious.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:50:08]

QUEST: Now you notice I said at the beginning of the program, I was in Paris at the moment. And that's because over the weekend there's going to

be the A.I. summit being held by President Macron. So we've been here talking to people about that, and you'll be able to hear some of that over

the next few days. But that's why I'm in Paris.

And while I was here, I think, you know, I love French food, one of my favorites. Today for my lunch I had a (INAUDIBLE). Very good. Well, it

wasn't brilliant value. I had an entree goat. I had a (INAUDIBLE) and cafe creme afterwards. But traditional restaurants here are known for things

like steak, coq au vin, foie gras and the like. In other words, not exactly vegetarian, certainly not vegan.

Now, back in New York, one of the city's most acclaimed restaurants did away with all that meaty stuff. Eleven Madison Park went fully plant-based

when it reopened in 2021 after the pandemic. Its head chef, Daniel Humm, is now on a mission to help others eat less meat, and he invited me into the

kitchen and gave me an idea of plant-based Michelin Star dining.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: All right, you promised me food.

DANIEL HUMM, HEAD CHEF, ELEVEN MADISON PARK: Yes.

QUEST: Where's the first dish? Come on.

(Voice-over): The kitchen at Eleven Madison Park is a model of efficiency five hours before opening. That is until I arrived.

Listen, by the way, this kitchen is far too quiet.

(Voice-over): Chef Daniel Humm is on a mission to promote plant-based eating.

HUMM: So all these ingredients are from our farm at the beginning of the meal.

QUEST: He was recently named a UNESCO goodwill ambassador for food education, and released a new cookbook. So today he's going to try to

convince me what the fuss is all about.

HUMM: I think for me as a chef the magic of cooking really comes from transforming leeks into something. That can live in a restaurant like

Eleven Madison Park. You know? Like taking a luxury ingredient and putting it on a plate. It's a lot easier than taking a very humble ingredient and

elevating it.

QUEST: What have we got here?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Avocado with Tonburi, aji Amarillo, and basil.

QUEST: Oh, look at that.

HUMM: Want to give it a try?

QUEST: Get an extra.

HUMM: He's going to ruin it.

QUEST: I'll thank you to hold your opinions to yourself.

HUMM: Nice.

QUEST: So what's this in the middle?

HUMM: This is a seed from the cypress tree, and it's sort of also referred as land caviar.

QUEST: I was about to say, are you trying to trick me into thinking this is caviar?

HUMM: We're trying to trick you. We've been trying to trick you since the moment you got here.

QUEST: You're succeeding. So it's not like you've just got the vegetables out of the garden and shoved them in a steamer, I mean.

HUMM: Theres a lot of thinking that goes into it. But, you know what's also interesting is that before, when I look back, I thought maybe going plant-

based would be limiting because we're removing all these ingredients we're no longer using. But today, when I look back, it almost seems like we were

just cooking condiments for meat and fish. And today the entirety of the dish is created from --

QUEST: Right.

HUMM: From the vegetable.

QUEST: It must be satisfying, very satisfying. These are dishes that most people don't eat.

HUMM: Yes.

QUEST: On a regular basis, if at all.

HUMM: Well, it's beautiful to do something with your hand. Then you get an instant, instant feedback.

QUEST: Oh.

HUMM: But, you know, it's something very noble also. And I think we probably need a little bit more in today's world, but on a nightly basis I

know we have people here who have these experiences of a lifetime, experiences that they never forget for the rest of their lives. That's

pretty cool.

QUEST: I'm told that our last course --

HUMM: Is sweet. Do you have a sweet tooth?

QUEST: I love dessert. I've never met a dessert I didn't like. I told you I love desserts.

HUMM: Nice, no?

[16:55:03]

QUEST: How difficult is this to make?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very.

QUEST: Which is a polite way of saying you can't make it at home.

HUMM: You can't make it at home.

QUEST: Tell me what you really think.

(Voice-over): I'm not going to throw out my butter, eggs and steaks anytime soon. That would be foolish. But the experience of this plant-based meal

from Chef Daniel Humm has opened my eyes to new possibilities.

And now for that famous (INAUDIBLE), la frase, Chef.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: I know you want to know exactly what it was. It's about $365 for the nine course tasting menu. $365 per head. That's before wines and everything

else and all that. You get the idea. So next time you pop over, well, we'll have a chat about whether we should go. But the food was superb.

We'll take a "Profitable Moment" after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: A quick look at Wall Street and how trading ended. There was a little blip of green at the start of the session, but that just about

evaporated. Well, not just about, it did evaporate and the market was off its lows of the day. And there's the triple stack shows the S&P and the

Nasdaq rallied in the late afternoon. And they actually gained. But the best gains been seen on the Nasdaq which was up some half a percent. So you

get the idea of how markets are betwixt and between.

Tonight's "Profitable Moment." Now very difficult days of course with USAID and the way in which the administration is essentially shutting it down.

But the way it's being done, of course, we hope to bring to you tonight is a particularly brutal way. By putting people, by furloughing staff, by

putting them on administrative leave, by recalling them, by simply freezing all sorts of programs without further ado.

Not only are the employees of USAID being affected, but also the contractors. As we told you tonight, some of whom have millions of dollars

in unpaid invoices and have themselves had to lay off their own staff.

Now, look, this isn't to say they won't all eventually get paid. They probably will. But the dislocation, the disruption, the destruction to

companies and to people's lives that I think is certainly worth mentioning and worth focusing on, and we'll certainly keep an eye on those companies

that basically say, since these executive orders came about, they're just about out of business.

And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for this Thursday night. I'm Richard Quest in Paris. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable.

I'll be back in London tomorrow.

END