Return to Transcripts main page

Quest Means Business

Spanish Prime Minister Calls November Election Amid Housing Protests; Researcher At Russian Plague Lab Dies Of Unknown Infection; Rubio Downplays Removal Of U.S. Bombers from U.K. Base; Survey: Most Software Developers Try To Avoid Using A.I.; A.I Startup Offers Tools To Minimize Flight Delay Losses; Lula Da Silva And Flavio Bolsonaro Face A Runoff Vote. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired October 05, 2026 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:12]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": The closing bell is ringing on Wall Street. Sony ringing the closing bell for us

tonight, and the market has been a betwixt and between over the course. But again small gain which is interesting over the course of the day. Bring

trading to an end. One, and a two, and a one, two, three, four.

Trading is over. Those are the markets and the main events of the day that we are talking about.

Brazilian stocks are jumping nine percent after Flavio Bolsonaro forces a runoff in the presidential race.

Spain's Prime Minister has called a surprise early election amid protests over housing crisis.

And in Siberia tonight, dozens are now in quarantine after a mysterious death of a researcher at an anti-plague lab.

We are live in London tonight. It is Monday, it is October the 5th. I am Richard Quest, and yes, in London I am in business.

Good evening.

We begin tonight with weeks of unrest that have come to a head in Spain. The Prime Minister, Pedro Sanchez, has now called a snap election for

November the 29th. His government's housing reforms were defeated in Parliament and subsequently, mass protests erupted nationwide.

The case of an 87-year-old woman who was evicted after a rent surge from $560.00 to almost $3,000.00 became a symbol of this crisis. Now, for over a

week, hundreds of people have camped outside Madrid's Central Puerta Del Sol in protest. And polls suggest that Prime Minister Sanchez is facing a

tough fight.

The conservative Popular Party is now leading. CNN's Pau Mosquera has more on the upcoming contest in this dispatch from Madrid.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAU MOSQUERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): After two days of deliberation, the much anticipated outcome.

PEDRO SANCHEZ, SPANISH PRIME MINISTER (through translator): I have decided to convene an extraordinary Cabinet meeting this very morning to dissolve

the Spanish Parliament and call a general election to be held on Sunday, November 29th.

MOSQUERA: Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez cornered, forced into the decision after right-wing parties in Parliament struck down a last ditch

effort on Friday to tackle the country's housing emergency.

The face of that crisis is Maria del Carmen Abascal, or just Maricarmen, as she is known across Spain.

An investment fund bought her flat more than quadrupled her rent and at 87, Maricarmen was kicked out from the place she called home for more than 70

years.

For many, after years of price hikes and rent rises, that was the final straw. Sanchez is hoping to capitalize on the anger and frustration over a

housing crisis. The measures he tried to pass and the economy where his party has done well. That would shift the gaze away from the corruption

scandals that have plagued some of his close allies.

And migration, which exploded this summer when thousands streamed across the border in Spain's northern Africa exclave of Ceuta. But it is still a

gamble, he trails the center right popular party in opinion polls.

ALBERTO NUNEZ FEIJOO, LEADER, PEOPLE'S PARTY (through translator): Finally, finally, Spain will speak its mind.

MOSQUERA (voice over): And one crisis after another has left the far-right Vox Party as potential kingmakers.

SANTIAGO ABASCAL, LEADER, VOX PARTY (through translator): We must reverse the migrant influx, which is having so many negative consequences for

Spaniards' pockets.

MOSQUERA (on camera): But for those who have been camping here at the heart of Madrid, it has been a bit of a mixed feeling. Some, like Sanchez, others

would prefer a new leadership, but what everyone really wants is a quick solution to housing emergency. And with this election, that feels a long

way off.

Pau Mosquera, CNN, Madrid.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Not surprisingly, the political upheavals across Europe is having an impact on the economy. The euro has now fallen to a 17-month low against

the U.S. dollar, down more than four percent against the dollar this year and a selloff in French debt.

[16:05:06 ]

You remember, of course, their own riots and their own problems in France has only raised concerns for European investors.

Geoffrey Yu, who is a senior market strategist at BNY. He joins me here in London.

So I guess the core point is whether this is turbulence that we are seeing in terms of investor reaction, whether it be in stock markets or in in

FOREX, or is it structural and actually the markets are saying we are not happy.

GEOFFREY YU, SENIOR MARKET STRATEGIST, BNY: So I would say mild turbulence, a bit more than mild turbulence. But the structural things have already

been there. They ve been long standing. It is just with the way yields have been pushed higher by, let's just say, a scarcity of capital and a demand

for fiscal discipline, plus inflation. It is showing up more than expected. But the underlying structural issues have always been there.

QUEST: Right. But if we now look at what Spain is doing, the Prime Minister calling an election where there is the very potential for the populist

movements which have been successful elsewhere to gain ground and gain Spain as well. Whether it does or not, time will show.

But this is the risk now that is in the Spanish or that's in the European political firmer.

YU: Well, Spain is a rather interesting case because it has been one of the stronger economies over the last few years or so, helped by improved

productivity and strong demographics. The migration aspect, which was mentioned in your report there. So I think on the economic side, people are

less concerned about that. On the politics, it really still is about what happens in France next year with the presidential election and of course,

the recent gyrations in Germany.

QUEST: Let's go back to this idea, though. I mean, taking France, for example, take to Spain. The reality is that there isn't money to buy voters

off. Debts are too high. Borrowing is overburdened. There is not much more that can be done on the fiscal front.

Monetary interest rates are going up and probably still got some way to go. It is a perfect storm against those parties that are in power.

YU: So the environment clearly is challenging and one point I would agree with you there is on interest rates, the European Central Bank has been

much more hawkish than peers compared to the Bank of England and for example, they ve had two hikes already since this recent round of inflation

began in the second quarter, but was that wise heading into a fiscally stretched environment when growth was just about recovering? That's where

some parallels have been drawn with 2010-2011, that phase as well.

So on a common basis, however, in Europe, helped by Germany's balance sheet, there is fiscal capacity. The taboo behind joint issuance, I think

that's been broken. It was broken a long time ago, so we will see. But growth is off the essence.

QUEST: So, I mean maybe I am just being a bit of hyperbole here and you'll forgive me, Geoffrey, but is there a real feeling that the wheels are

coming off the European wagon?

YU: There is always room for hyperbole, Richard, but I would say markets right now they are examining the wagon. The wheels are still on, let's be

clear about that. We are a long way from 2012, but markets are on watch. Four or five years ago, even before the pandemic it was zero rates ad

infinitum. No concerns on the fiscal side. It is a very different environment right now, and I think all the capitals they need to look at

their balance sheets very, very closely. Markets want structural reform.

QUEST: And when we talk next, we will talk about who is actually driving the wagon. Good to see you, Geoffrey. Thank you for taking time to join us.

And tomorrow night at this time, we will be joining, we will be coming live from Paris, the French capital, to get a first-hand look at the political

and economic challenges that France is facing.

QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tomorrow night, live from Paris.

As we continue tonight from London, concern is growing after a Russian town and the question of a plague with a researcher -- a Russian plague

researcher dies of a mysterious illness, in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:12:29]

QUEST: Multiple countries, including the United States, say they are monitoring closely the situation in Russia after the death of a laboratory

worker at a plague research facility.

Russian officials say a 28-year-old woman died after being diagnosed with pneumonia of an unknown origin. Although authorities are playing down any

link between her death and her work, precautionary measures are being introduced in the area that is surrounding the Siberian research facility.

Dozens of people from the lab are reportedly in isolation. The inpatient facility at the hospital, where she was treated has been placed under

quarantine.

Fred Pleitgen joins us from Berlin.

Well, Fred, what do we say? Has it reached panic stations? I mean, the level of concern we hear is high. This was an anti-plague league lab. Who

knows what was going on?

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I would say for people who live in that area, Richard, we've been in touch with

some of them, I wouldn t say that panic is the correct word, but people certainly do seem to be quite concerned, especially after some of the

measures that have been put in place. And one of the things that we are seeing from the Russian authorities is, on the one hand, they are saying

that there is no visible link right now to this person possibly having contracted the plague in what they are seeing with the lab results.

At the same time, we are seeing the reaction to this from the Russian authorities. That is a very serious one. I want to read you a statement

from the Russian agency that's tasked with infectious disease control. They say, and I am quoting here, "... no microorganisms associated with the

employees' professional duties were detected in samples taken from the patient."

Now, they put this in the statement. At the same time, though, the head of that very agency very quickly went down to that area, which is near Lake

Baikal near the border with Mongolia, and the head of the neighboring province, which is called Buryatia, said that this patient possibly died of

the plague.

And at the same time, we have all these quarantine measures that are in place in that area, as you just mentioned, some 200 people, Russian media

are saying, are apparently under quarantine at this point in time -- Richard.

QUEST: So, what actually happened? Have they said the connection? What actually took place?

PLEITGEN: It is not clear at this point in time. There are some media reports out there that this worker in this lab, which, as you say, is

dedicated to fighting the plague, was actually put in place and started institute in the 1930s to combat the plague now deals with various other

infectious diseases as well.

[16:15:10]

There were some media reports that possibly this worker, this female worker, was handling a vial that may have contained the plague and that

that vial might have broken, but that, as of this point, is not confirmed. We don t even know the exact time that that she was brought into hospital

and died of that pneumonia, which they say is of undisclosed or unknown origin.

It appears to have been possibly towards the end of this week, towards the weekend, but even that at this point in time is not clear. What we do know,

however, what the authorities are saying is that they are quarantining everybody that this person had contact with and also quarantining the

hospital itself, where she was staying, for instance, that people who were in that hospital in-patients are not allowed out. And of course, no new

patients are allowed in.

At the same time, you have the World Health Organization who said at this point in time, they believe the risk is low. But of course, people who live

in that area, Richard, still somewhat concerned about the situation.

QUEST: I am grateful. Thank you. That's Fred, who is in Berlin.

Dr. Jonathan Reiner, I am joined by, CNN's medical analyst, Dr. Reiner, who is a Professor of Medicine and Surgery at George Washington.

Professor, I mean, what do you make of it?

DR. JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Well, it is hard to know until we have more information, until we have confirmation that this is actually

plague, until we understand exactly the circumstances with which the lab employee contracted the illness. It would be great to know if this is just

an old-fashioned research plague, or whether this institute in Russia has been experimenting with weaponizing plague.

And so whether it has changed at all, these are all important things for us to know.

But what I will say is that one of the main lessons from, from the COVID experience is that all the early reports are always wrong or incomplete or

misleading. So I think jumping to either conclusion, assuming that this is the beginning of a next pandemic, which I think is highly unlikely or

assuming that this is nothing to worry about, I think both of those tendencies should be tempered with our experience in COVID, and let's wait

until we have a little bit more data.

And the other thing I want to say, Richard, is that this is not the novel coronavirus. This is a much different organism that there are literally

have been centuries of experience with and we now actually have very good treatments for them when this disease is caught early.

QUEST: Okay, but I guess the issue is going to be one of whatever the pathogen, the issue is going to be one of transparency. Are we told how

much openness is there? Do we give -- are we given right facts? Misinformation? Because that determines how much we can trust what we are

being told?

REINER: Exactly. It also dictates what the world's health response should be to this event. And again, what we learned again from COVID is that if

the world has an understanding early on about the path of this kind of outbreak, then we can become organized very, very quickly.

But, you know, we are getting conflicting information. We are getting on the one hand that they are not sure that this is even an illness related to

the work that this lab worker had. We are also told that there might be hundreds of people under quarantine and evaluation. We will know over the

next few days. We should know, because this pathogen, unlike the coronavirus, has a fairly short incubation period.

So, you know, we don t have to wait, you know, probably a week or 10 days. This is really an incubation period of just a couple of days.

QUEST: Jonathan, I am going rogue here, so forgive me, but I know you'll have followed closely the events over the weekend, of course, of the

botched execution of Christa Pike and who is now, of course, in hospital, unconscious, on ventilator, et cetera.

I just want to get a feeling for what the medical -- as best you can gauge, the medical community. I saw a particular phrase that she went from the

execution gurney that was destined to kill her, to take her life, to the hospital bed with doctors saving her life. What does the medical -- I mean,

I know there is no consensus of the medical community, but you must all be talking about it.

[16:20:07]

REINER: Well, I can tell you what this member of the medical community thinks about it. And I think that the inmate is now being tortured. So if

you have two attempts to execute an inmate and you fail, and the only thing you success is to put the inmate in a coma that now requires literally

invasive, you know, heroic efforts on a respirator in an ICU to try and keep her alive, you are torturing her. This is torture. This is the

definition of cruel and inhuman punishment, which is against the Constitution of the United States.

So, I am glad that the prison head in Tennessee was fired or resigned. I am glad that the governor has put on hold all executions until we understand

better, but there is an inherent problem with trying to execute people with this method. And that problem is that it is never done by physicians

because it is completely against the ethics of the medical profession to participate in this.

So it is being done by sort of paramedical personnel and this kind of thing happens not infrequently, botched executions. So we really have to have a

national discourse on this, but this is torture.

QUEST: I am grateful to you, sir, and thank you for taking the question. We didn t give you -- I didn t warn you that I was going to go down that road,

but I felt confident, and I knew I was right that you would happily take us to where we needed to go.

Thank you sir.

As we continue tonight on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, the U.S. has brought home all of its long range bombers stationed at a British air base after an

unspecified new threat.

The U.S. Vice President J.D. Vance, says the move was out of an abundance of caution. The event happened over the weekend, of course, and it was a

great surprise to everybody. But this new threat comes days after multiple arrests in connection with a suspected Iranian plot against RAF Fairford.

U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio, downplaying the redeployment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARCO RUBIO, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: The Department of War is constantly reallocating resources where they need to be. There are regular rotations

that happen as well. So I think you guys are just -- well, I mean, we've documented what happened last week. I wouldn t directly tie that to the

move that was made.

The only reason why you guys are focused on how many planes at Fairford is because of the threat that happened last week. But it is not unusual to see

rotations happen and movement of assets to different parts of the world based on exercises, redeployments, people changing out and new people

coming in, new planes coming in, old planes going out. So crews are changing all the time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Brian Todd is in Washington. Good way of spinning it, Brian. Nothing to see here. Keep walking. Don t look.

But the reality is, Brian, I mean it does strike us a bit strange. First, whiff of grapeshot and they pull the planes out.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Richard, what Secretary Rubio said is being just roundly disputed by our own sources and by our own analysts who say

that it is, in fact, a very unusual move to send these planes out of the U.K. and back to their home bases.

We have new reporting now from our colleagues Piper Hudspeth Blackburn and Zachary Cohen, they cite a U.S. official as saying the U.S. has in fact,

moved long range bombers back to their home stations in the United States after an unspecified new threat, which that official called, "a real world

incident."

The official says, now, "... we can acknowledge now that all U.S. bombers that were deployed to RAF Fairford have redeployed to their home stations

in the United States." The statement did not include details on why the planes were moved, but as Richard just said, this comes just days after the

British government arrested a number of individuals in connection with an alleged Iranian plot to target that same airbase, RAF Fairford. Those

arrests coming a week ago yesterday, on September 27th.

This U.S. official who we spoke to said it is unusual that the U.S. Military would move the bombers back to their home bases in the United

States instead of deploying them to another airbase in the same region. Now, U.S. Vice President J.D. Vance was saying this was done out of an

abundance of caution. Take a listen to what he said to reporters just a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J.D. VANCE (R), VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I think that we are going to be as careful as we possibly can be. Obviously, doing

these missions is sometimes inherently risky, even flying a training mission, as we sometimes find out, unfortunately, a training mission in the

United States of America can be risky because these are very powerful, very next generation pieces of technology.

So, what you saw there is the Secretary of War, our of an abundance of caution, trying to protect our guys. We do feel with some confidence that

the Iranians are, you know, they're trying to do what the Iranian state has done for 49 years, which is engage in acts of terrorism against the United

States and against a lot of other people as well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[16:25:07]

QUEST: Now, Brian, at the end of the day, they can always bring them back, so I guess, nobody is really worried about that. I am worried -- I am

interested to know, is there a wider message being telegraphed here?

TODD: Well, Richard, the wider message might be one that is a little bit behind-the-scenes at this point, because we don t really know what the

specific reasons are for this deployment. What we can piece together from talking to our sources, talking to analysts and looking at the timing of

all of this, is that there is probably a lot more to this alleged Iranian plot at RAF Fairford than we have been led to believe that some of the

reporting has told us in the last few days.

Theres probably more there, there than we know right now. And, of course, we will be digging on this in the coming days. But Richard, to redeploy

this many planes and one of our analysts, Alex Plitsas, says that it is likely that several dozen U.S. B-1 bombers were stationed at Fairford -- to

redeploy several dozen B-1 bombers, which have been so crucial for the U.S. in the war with Iran, as well as in other long range U.S. airstrikes, to

redeploy them all of a sudden to their bases in the United States seems to be a fairly drastic move, and there seems to be a lot more there, there

than we know at the moment.

QUEST: Brian, I am grateful. Brian Todd, who is in Washington. Thank you.

Now, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, tonight, as we continue, we are going to be talking the resurgence of a political dynasty in Brazil. The stocks are up

nine percent. Flavio Bolsonaro now facing and forcing the runoff in the presidential race. We will be live in Sao Paulo next, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:30:02]

QUEST: A new survey shows a majority of software developers are actually trying to avoid using A.I. in their workflows. The responses come from

around 30,000 workers in 169 countries, and they paint a mixed picture of how A.I. is reshaping their workforce.

A growing number say they are unhappy with their jobs, in part, because of burnout, tech fatigue, and anxiety about being replaced by A.I. Investors

are questioning how much the sector will be upended. One ETF tracking software companies is up five percent into just last week. 45 percent off

from its lows.

Lisa is with me, Lisa Eadicicco, from with the exclusive survey results.

I'm not surprised. Everybody you talked to is terrified.

LISA EADICICCO, CNN BUSINESS TECH EDITOR: Yes, Richard, and I think this is a really interesting one to follow, in particular, because software

developers have kind of been at the forefront of this shift in the workplace with A.I.

It's really one of the first fields where A.I. has had a direct impact on what the day-to-day work is like in a big way. So, there is questions about

maybe whether some of these frictions-not all of them, of course, because it's a very specific type of work, but whether some of them might also be

felt in other industries as other fields are managing that shift.

And so, the other thing that's interesting here is that, as you mentioned, this is a mixed picture. Adoption is high. A lot of AI developers who

answered this survey are using it for coding and debugging and things like that.

But at the same time, six in 10 respondents said that they are trying to avoid using it, and there are, I think, a few anxieties there that have

been pointed out, like economic uncertainty, uncertainty about their role and whatnot.

QUEST: So, here is the here is the tough part, though. It doesn't matter, Lisa. It's coming. It's arriving. So, those people who are got a bit of

agita and anxiety and legitimate anxiety as well. We are going to have to find ways to manage, handle, and deal with that, because the one thing we

know is not going to happen is that genie going back in the bottle.

Exactly, and the software developers I've spoken with that have some of these feelings, you know, they are the ones that are adopting it and are

using it, and it's not about like a resistance to new technology. It's that there are frustrations with how the technology actually works, and it

doesn't, in all cases, really behave in the way that it -- that these developers need it to, to do their job.

The other concern as well is this question of, if software developers are not doing as much coding, it might be more challenging for them to kind of

build that broad institutional knowledge about how these tech systems that they are working on actually work, so that they can do that higher level

work that A.I. can't do.

So, I think, it just kind of raises a lot of questions about the future of the job overall and what it looks like for sure.

QUEST: Lisa, I'm grateful. Thank you very much. We'll talk more about this one. I know over the days, months, weeks, and years ahead. Thank you.

Now, let's look at the last 10 days, where I have traveled from New York to London. Then, I went round trip London to Johannesburg, back to London, and

this week, I'm going to Malta, and then, at the weekend, I will be off to where am I going? I'm going to Bangkok.

All in all, the flights so far have been delayed around about 38 minutes.

Aircraft turnaround times are a big reason for these sorts of delays. A lot has to happen from when the flight lands to when it takes off.

You have got to get the passengers off the plane. You then got to get more of them on. The luggage has to be put on, and then reloaded. The plane has

to be refueled and cleaned, ground crews prepared. Next, takeoff, you get the idea.

A.I. startup Assaia estimates turnaround times and delays are costing the industry more than $40 billion.

It's betting on A.I. to help cut these losses by reducing the turnaround time, and the tools monitor operations like boarding, bag scanning in real

time, automatically flagging delays and sending progress to update crew members.

Christiaan Hen is the chief executive of the company. Who will first of all start off by telling me how it properly should be pronounced.

CHRISTIAAN HEN, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, ASSAIA: Hi, good afternoon, Richard, and thanks for having me on the broadcast.

Yes, we are Assaia. So, we pronounce it as Assaia.

QUEST: Right. Now, with Assaia, I mean, delays are inevitable. Delays happen for a multitude of reasons.

What is the A.I. component that's going to help?

HEN: Yes. So indeed, delays are happening. However, in our 2026 turnaround report, we have actually seen that almost 80 percent of all delays are

solvable within the direct sphere of influence of airports and airlines.

And our company kind of goes by the motto: "You can't manage what you can't measure."

[16:35:00]

And so, what our A.I. software is bringing to airports and airlines is basically automating oversight. So, we are tapping into cameras, and the

software is basically overseeing the operation.

And so, what our AI software is bringing to airports and airlines is basically automating oversight. So, we are tapping into cameras, and the

software is basically overseeing the operation and basically alerting users in real time to deviation from how things should be happening.

QUEST: But this is, I assume, is a predictive thing in the sense of the A.I., I mean, you know, if the flight is already delayed, I don't need A.I.

to tell me it's delayed to tell everybody else. The A.I. surely has to be able to say we don't like what's happening here. We know that in two hours'

time that flight is going to be delayed from X, Y, Z. Or is that asking too much?

HEN: No, you are absolutely right. One of the things that we do with this real-time understanding of the turnaround is also predicting delays before

they actually occur, which gives operators the chance to intervene to allocate additional resources in avoid -- in order to avoid this delay from

happening, but also in order to proactively manage certain side effects of these types of delays.

QUEST: Who does it --

It will benefit everybody, but who is your primary customer? Is it ATC? Is it airlines? Is it airports? Is it all of them?

HEN: Well, there is something in it for everyone, but our main customers are airports and airlines. And, you know, what we see is that if you look

at the time that this aircraft turnaround takes, actually versus the schedule, there is almost an 11-minute gap, which we call an execution gap,

and this gap has been consistent a lot across the last 11 quarters that we researched, and it's not getting any smaller.

And there is huge, huge costs associated with this gap, as every minute of delay basically holds a cost to airlines. And for the airports, every

minute that the aircraft is occupying the gate is a minute they cannot use it for another aircraft.

So, it basically means that the airport can do less turnarounds per gate per day, if you will.

QUEST: Do you aspire to sort of -- to have a few airlines and airports? Because obviously, your A.I. will give any airline using it a competitive

advantage vis-a-vis its competitors. Or are you Robin Hood and good for all?

HEN: Well, you are absolutely right there. We did compare actually 125 turnarounds that were A.I. monitored, and compared them against an industry

benchmark of turnarounds which were not A.I. monitored.

And interestingly enough, we can see that the performance was 36 minutes better, which means four minutes on average less delays on those turns that

were A.I. monitored.

QUEST: I'm grateful, sir. Thank you. We'll talk more about it, and we will perhaps get a demonstration and see it in action. Thank you, sir.

Now, to Brazil's, where the political right now senses and smells potential return to power after strong results in Sunday's elections. The

presidential race is headed to a runoff. You have got Flavio Bolsonaro, son of the former president Jair Bolsonaro, who is in the lead. He got 47

percent of the vote, narrowly outpolling the incumbent from the left, Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva.

Bolsonaro's right-wing Liberal Party made big gains right the way up and down the ballot. Several other members of the Bolsonaro family were elected

to former first lady Michelle Bolsonaro, win a Senate seat. Jair Bolsonaro's son Carlos -- along with Carlos. Another of his sons, was

elected a federal deputy.

His eldest son Flavio is now well positioned to become Brazil's next president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FLAVIO BOLSONARO, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE, BRAZIL (through translator): I am very happy about the real possibility that three weeks from now, Brazil

will give a definitive answer that it wants a modern government, a government with fewer ministries, a government that will restore democracy.

LUIZ INACIO LULA DA SILVA, PRESIDENT OF BRAZIL (through translator): It is time for us to show the true picture of Brazil today and the Brazil we

want. So, starting tomorrow, we are beginning a new campaign, a campaign in which, with only two candidates, we will be able to show the difference

between the proposals that exist for Brazil.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Stocks on Brazil surged on the results. The Bovespa gained nearly nine percent. 7.7 percent, you can see there.

CNN's Brazil's William Waack joins me from Sao Paulo. We have a terrible delay between us, William, which means we can't do too much question and

answer. But it does allow me. To say to you, give me an assessment, please, on exactly where we are, how it looks, and where the smart thinking is.

[16:40:06]

WILLIAM WAACK, CNN BRAZIL ANCHOR: Richard, it's great to be here with you in your own program. Well, it doesn't look very nice the situation in

Brazil so far. We have, regardless who wins the election, he has a terrible job to do.

So, we have the fiscal situation in a very difficult, dire straits, I would say. We have a problem of debt, public debt, and we have an economy which

is running is lower and is lower. This sort of frustration is very important to understand what happened in Brazil yesterday.

So, it was, in a sense, something unexpected that the opposition candidate, Flavio Bolsonaro would start head-on for the second round, for the runoff.

He is starting ahead. That was not predicted 24 hours ago.

Now, what that means that Lula has lost his ability to govern. Because we don't know who the next president will be. We suppose it will be Flavio

Bolsonaro because of his head-on start, but the legislativity, which is so powerful in Brazil, we know already the composition. So, and -- whoever

takes the seat at the executive branch, Lula or Flavio Bolsonaro, in three weeks' time, he will face a Senate which is center right, and he will face

a House of Representatives which is even more center right. So, how could you govern?

(CROSSTALK)

QUEST: Right.

WAACK: If Brazil will be a part of a military republic, the government will be gone right now. So, this is the first challenge.

Second one, Richard, is a very, very difficult institutional crisis, where all the branches of government are fighting each other. We have no

leadership in this moment in political terms to say who is going to prevail in this sort of institutional crisis.

So, this scares a lot of people.

(CROSSTALK)

QUEST: All right.

WAACK: Particularly, investors who are looking for a long-term compromise in Brazil. They don't know how the rules of the game will look like in a

matter of, I say, six to -- months to one month.

This is why I said we are in dire straits.

QUEST: We will. We will talk more about this, and I'm very grateful for your analysis tonight, which is exactly what we needed to hear. Thank you,

William.

That's QUEANS MEANS BUSINESS tonight. I'm Richard Quest in London. Whatever you are up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. Join me. We are

in Paris tomorrow night for special (INAUDIBLE).

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:45:48]

ELENI GIOKOS, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to CONNECTING AFRICA. I am Eleni Giokos.

Manufacturing is crucial for economic growth, industrialization, and job creation across Africa. However, as of 2023, the manufacturing sector made

up less than 15 percent of GDP in many countries throughout the continent. Several countries are trying to ramp up manufacturing.

In Kenya, Haco Industries is a major producer of personal care and household products. It also sources raw materials for its products from

over 500 farmers across Africa, and its brands reach more than 3 million families across the continent.

Victoria Rubadiri looks at its ambitious plans to export to 30 African countries by 2030.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VICTORIA RUBADIRI, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Here, in the heart of central Nairobi, a steady stream of household hair and

skincare products roll off the production line.

PETER NDICHU, MANUFACTURING DIRECTOR, HACO INDUSTRIES LIMITED, NAIROBI, KENYA: We have the plastic factory that does plastic components: the

bottles, the jars, the cups, and the plant is has an installed capacity of 5 million pieces per month.

Then, on the other side, we have HPC or Homecare Personal Care plant, that does now the actual packing processing of personal care products that is

hair care and skincare. So, that plant has an installed capacity of 1365 metric tons in a month.

RUBADIRI (voice over): Haco Industries manufactures 90 different types of personal and home care items for Africans by Africans.

MARY-ANN MUSANGI: MANAGING DIRECTOR, HACO INDUSTRIES KENYA LIMITED: How do we reach the African continent, the African consumers, with products that

they do want, that they do need. Manufactured by a company that understands them.

RUBADIRI (voice over): Mary-ann Musangi and her family launched the company 50 years ago. Today, it exports to eight African countries.

MUSANGI: Our biggest market is Kenya, where we have obviously our roots and tentacles are here because this is our home base. But we are also very

strong in Uganda, and Rwanda, and Congo. But the distances are can be a challenge, and you know, Africa logistics is one of the key challenges in

terms of penetrating across the continent.

RUBADIRI (voice over): The company says sourcing raw materials from within the continent is beneficial for both the consumer and their bottom line.

NDICHU: Here we store frequently used soil materials.

RUBADIRI: This is Russia.

NDICHU: Yes, Russia.

RUBADIRI: Wow.

NDICHU: And this we get from Uganda or Ghana.

RUBADIRI: So, how easy or difficult is it when it comes to sourcing these products locally?

We have a list of all the SMEs that are dealing with these natural oils. We offered them technical support in terms of how can you achieve the quality

that we want. They now started now delivering to us. This year, but we used to import from USA.

RUBADIRI: Yes.

NDICHU: They used to sell to us 5,000 Kenya shillings a kilo. When you are getting from Uganda here, they are selling to us 1,000 per kilo.

RUBADIRI: Massive difference.

NDCHU: Massive savings.

RUBADIRI: Wow.

RUBADIRI (voice over): For them, automation is key. While some of their machines are semi-automated, the company has plans to modernize and expand

production capacity.

NDICHU: So, we want to do a new factory that we can also embrace automation. In terms of packing, we are currently achieving 3,000 pieces in

an hour. So, we want to grow that by four times.

RUBADIRI (voice over): To meet its goal of entering 30 countries by 2030, Haco is looking to create five hubs across the continent. Its newest

addition will serve the West African market.

RUBADIRI: Ghana is now becoming one of your hubs. Talk to me about how that model works.

MUSANGI: Africa is so fragmented, in many ways. The countries, the boundaries, our taxation laws, our policies, our culture, our language, our

money, currency. We have got to see how do we reduce these points of fragmentation, and the only way that I see we can do it is through these

partnerships, working with local people.

Ghana is going to be our West Africa manufacturing factory, and from there we will then export into the West African markets, taking advantage of

ECOWAS. Right? The trade agreements.

[16:50:10]

RUBADIRI (voice over): Its Ghanaian partner, Ayewa Labs is embracing the chance to utilize free trade agreements and ramp up production to meet

demand.

NANAYAA BATES, FOUNDER, AYEWA LABS: After it's helping us to get clients from other African countries, Haco as an example, they send us raw

materials.

The partnership between Ayewa and Haco has created this exponential move from development to manufacturing. So, we are manufacturing, you know, 10

times we were ready in terms of capacity and capability.

But what we had to learn from Haco's manufacturing experience, and it's actually the operational discipline that comes with that high level of

manufacturing.

RUBADIRI (voice over): Back in Kenya, Haco is aiming to set a new bar for manufacturing within Africa.

MUSANGI: Industrialization happens because manufacturing sector, as one of them, is a key driver of that. Industrialization is what will create jobs.

The manufacturing sector today in Kenya is the second largest employer in this country.

The opportunities are there. We just have to see how do we leverage those opportunities in order to create economic development. We have the

technical skills. Our youth are highly skilled, highly educated, well versed.

We need to make sure that we develop and continue developing the manufacturing sector so that we can add value to these raw materials.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GIOKOS: Still to come: How one company is enabling the movement of goods across the continent.

GIOKOS: Welcome back. D.P. World operates ports, inland container terminals, logistics hubs, and economic zones across the continent. It

works with Africa's manufacturers to make, store, and deliver their finished products around the world.

Mohammed Akoojee is the CEO and managing director of. D.P. World's Africa region. I sat down with him to discuss the continent's industrial

prospects.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GIOKOS: D.P. World is known as you know a company that handles ports, and you also handle a lot of goods. Give me some examples of where you have

seen an increase in local manufacturing, and where, you know, we still have a lot of work to do. I mean, have you seen any improvement in local

processing and manufacturing?

MOHAMMED AKOOJEE, MANAGING DIRECTOR, D.P. WORLD: Yes. So, they are definitely examples of where we are seeing more localization of the

product.

If you look at in Nigeria, for example, where we distribute FMCG products into wholesale, into retail, I would say five years ago, 40 percent of what

we were selling was all imported. Today, it's 90 percent is all local, meaning it's brought in some raw material form or in some bulk form, and

then, it's repackaged, and or contract manufacturing.

So, a lot of companies are contract manufacturing and using local companies. So, if you look at our business, like I say, in consumer, what

we were importing and distributing has reduced because it's now on --

(CROSSTALK)

GIOKOS: So, that's changed.

AKOOJEE: That's changed, and it's changing.

GIOKOS: You have got fantastic plans. What's the timeline on actually all of this coming to fruition with the new free zones as well?

AKOOJEE: So, over the next 12-18 months, we are developing a new port in Senegal, in Ndayane. So, this is a new deport-to-port outside the city. We

are developing a new port in Banana in the DRC.

[16:55:04]

Those two investments alone are about $1.7-$1.8 billion. We are doing upgrades in Dar es Salaam. We are building, you know, a dry port in

Kumatipoort.

So, all of these investments are going to achieve two things. One is better infrastructure on the quay side, so that we can cater for larger ocean

vessels, and number two, better connectivity, you know, from the ports into the hinterland that those markets are.

Because a big part of Africa is land linked, right? So, you need gateways and you need efficient corridors into that.

And part of that is also economic zones to bring cargo owners closer to where the raw materials are, closer to where the end consumers are, and

create this ecosystem, where you can manufacture where the raw materials are, bring down your production costs, bring down your logistics costs,

make it more efficient.

GIOKOS: Let's talk about the African Continental Free Trade Area. I mean, you're wanting to link the continent up through railways and you know

through easier access, but you also need, you know, harmonization of trade rules. Are you seeing any impact thus far?

AKOOJEE: We are seeing, you know, easier border movements. You know, one of the biggest challenges in Africa is cross-border. If you look at Africa's

road network, logistics network. It's been set up to export our raw materials. It's never been set up to, you know, to create trade, you know -

- you know, between us.

Now, it will take time for us to create that right infrastructure, the right harmonization and customs processes to allow for easy flow of product

between markets. But it will come.

GIOKOS: All right. So, five years from now, what does industrialization and manufacturing on the continent look like for you, based on the investments

that you are making?

I think that, you know, the trends we are seeing of imported goods versus locally manufactured or where there is value addition is definitely going

to shift.

I believe that with the economic zones, you are going to get more and more companies wanting to get closer to Africa, because just that is where the

raw materials are. Get closer to the consumer markets. Companies want to diversify their supply chains.

They want to diversify where they are sourcing product, where they are manufacturing, and new hubs will be created.

So, all of these factors will drive industrialization in Africa, will drive localization of the product, and will drive growth.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GIOKOS: And that's it for this month's CONNECTING AFRICA. If you want to know more about the subjects we cover on the program, you can check out our

web site. Until next month, from me, Eleni Giokos. Let's keep on connecting.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

END