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Rick's List

Icelandic Volcano's Economic Impact; Wall Street Reform Showdown; Interview With General Odierno; Two Major Al Qaeda Operatives Killed in Iraq; How Much Does Talk Radio Influence Extremists in America?

Aired April 19, 2010 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Ali, we've got a couple of exclusive interviews that we're going to bring you.

First of all, let me tell you what's going on in Iraq. Number one and two number for al Qaeda in Iraq have been captured and the commander, the General, Odierno, is going to be joining me by phone from Iraq to explain to explain to you the lowdown.

Here's what else we've got.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ (voice-over): Here's what's making THE LIST today.

Finally, time for a vigorous prosecution on Wall Street. Who's responsible at Goldman Sachs? And what's Washington doing?

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), MINORITY LEADER: For the president to politicize this in the same speech in which he said we ought to depoliticize is really quite amusing.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In doing so, he made the cynical and deceptive assertion that reform would somehow enable future bailouts -- when he knows that it would do exactly the opposite.

SANCHEZ: President Clinton on what's fueling hate in America -- comparing the mood to Oklahoma City.

WILLIAM CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I don't want something bad to happen for us to get this thing.

SANCHEZ: How much does talk radio play into the problem?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, not extremist. It might extreme to some, but I don't call it as being extremist.

SANCHEZ: What about the militia movement? We're drilling down.

Sandra Bullock's marriage mess is now sparking a new show? Featuring the other women? Say it ain't so!

SANCHEZ: Take a look at these pictures we're going to be sharing with you. I was just asking Chad, how can you get a volcano in Iceland?

And there's a reason I'm laughing and smiling. I'll tell you who didn't get it. Which list do you think he's going on?

The lists you need to know about. Who's today's most intriguing? Who's making news on Twitter?

It's why I keep a list. Pioneering tomorrow's cutting-edge news, right now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: And hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez. This is your list, our national conversation.

Big news coming out of Iraq: two bad guys have been caught. How bad? Well, they're calling them number one and number two from al Qaeda in Iraq.

So, moments from now, I'm going to be having a live interview with Commander Odierno, who is in Iraq. He's going to be calling in and he's going to be taking you through the significance of these arrests and what else might be taking place there.

But first, topping THE LIST right now, you know the volcano in Iceland continues to erupt, right? But did you know just how expensive this thing is now turning out to be? Some are actually comparing it to what happened after 9/11.

Remember when planes were grounded for weeks? Airline losses are now said to be at more than $1 billion. Let me say that again -- airline losses are now at more than $1 billion as a result of all these of flights and all these airports being closed.

Richard Quest, he's in New York. He's following this for us. And he's at JFK International Airport, because he just so happens to be following this story on his own newscast internationally.

Let's talk first of all, Richard, about the economic impact. They're saying over $1 billion. Are they inflating this because they're going to want some help, or does this seem reasonable to you?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think it is reasonable. $200 million a day is the estimated cost. Lufthansa, German airlines, believes it's losing $34 million a day. U.S. carriers, like United Airlines, Continental, those that have large European operations like Delta, are losing millions of dollars a day.

The analogy, Rick, to the 9/11 -- 9/11 is in many ways an interesting analogy, because you had two aspects to 9/11. You actually had the time when the air space was closed.

SANCHEZ: Right.

QUEST: And then you had had the fear -- and then you had the fear and fright factor following on from that. Now, in this particular case, with this crisis, the air space closure is now longer than 9/11. Of course, as flying gets started again, you're not going to have that same fear and fright factor.

(CROSSTALK)

QUEST: Go ahead.

SANCHEZ: But wouldn't this be a bigger range, though? Because after 9/11, for the most part, it was a U.S. fear and fright -- people living in the United States, not all over Europe and other parts of Asia, for example. This has got a wider reach, doesn't it?

QUEST: It does, and, you know, one hesitates to make -- I mean, 9/11 was such a heinous incident in this country's history, that one hesitates to make any sort of compares in that regard. So you've got to put that in perspective.

Instead, let's just look at it. You've got Asia, you've got the United States, and in the middle, you have Europe -- Europe being the crossroads of transatlantic travel to Asia, backwards and forwards. It is the size and scale of the dozens of countries within the European Union, and beyond, that really shows this.

Now, how much of it is what I would call crocodile tears to get money from governments and European community? I mean, even I'm not that cynical, and I'm pretty cynical about that. I think you have -- I mean, I think you have an industry, Rick, that has been very badly affected. It is expected to suffer billions of dollars of losses this year, anyway. The last thing you need to do, having been shot in one foot, is to shoot yourself in the other.

SANCHEZ: Yes, but this is -- I'll tell you what this is, though. This is different.

And by the way, let me just cut away from myself and Richard for a moment to let you -- to talk about what we're looking at here. We got some of the very first pictures today of the latest lava flows that were actually coming from this Icelandic volcano. And these are some of the pictures that we've been sharing or receiving throughout day. And we're going to be putting them up and you'll be seeing them just on the right of screen as Richard and I continue this conversation.

I'll tell you what, though, Richard -- I know most people shudder to think of another bailout, and they hate the possibility that we're going to have to give anybody anymore of our government's money, and that's what they're asking for. But this is what we often call, and you see the term in contracts, a force ma jure.

I mean, there this is nothing that could have done to prevent this. This is not a screw-up. This is something that's come out of nowhere. And for them to come forward and actually say in this case, "Is there anything you can do to help us to just get us through this period," might not be unreasonable. QUEST: And, you know, I think that is their point. The reality is -- and the truth of the matter is, airlines play a unique role in the economy of any country. Love it or hate it, that's the truth. It brings commerce, it brings tourism, it brings inward investment, and outward investment. So, you're right.

It also employs tens of thousands of people and has a massive ripple effect, probably one of the largest ripple effects. So, it is perhaps not unreasonable.

Tonight, though, let me tell you, some facts, though -- tonight, it does look as though -- into tomorrow, Lufthansa will start flying. British Airways, tomorrow night, will start flying from the U.K., bit by bit. What they've done is carved up the European air space into three zones, and some of them will be no-fly, some of them will be fly with caution, and some of them will be fly at will. And that's how they're going to get things moving again.

SANCHEZ: Let me ask you one more thing. I'm curious about. And then I'm going let you know because I know you've got a lot of other work to do and you've been on the air for a while, and you probably want a bathroom break. And I appreciate the fact that you just said I'm right. I think it's the first time I'm writing it down that you said I was right about something.

Scientists are saying, look, you can't put a plane in the air, it's just too dangerous, and there's a possibility that the silica could actually get into the engine and get sucked in and bring a plane down. The business guys at the airlines are saying, look, you've got to let us fly, or this is going to kill us.

Is there starting to be a fight brewing here between these two, Richard?

QUEST: Well, yes. And that's original for you, Rick, an interesting, sophisticated question that takes us into nuance.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: I knew you'd be going there! Go ahead.

QUEST: Give me a break. No, Rick, the truth is, and that's a good point because the airlines will say, and they will mean it, the airlines will say that, of course, they're as interested in safety as anyone else. But once you get into that nuance of what is safe and what is not, is it safe to cross the road, looking left, right and right again? Is it safe to cross if you cross fast? You get the idea.

SANCHEZ: Yes.

QUEST: Nobody will ever say to you, we've got to get that plane the in air to make money, if we don't, we're out of business. But the devil is in the detail on this particular one. I suspect the planes will start flying. The worst thing that can happen is, of course, the lava flows and the plume goes back up again. SANCHEZ: Richard Quest, doing it like no one else does. And I thank you for having this spirited conversation with me once again. There you go.

Goldman Sachs is busted. Why are they being called out? And what's that going to do to the financial markets today? Well, we're going to be there live, following this thing, and counting down. We've got another about 50 minutes. I'm going take you to the very end, and then we're going to have some analysis from Wall Street.

Also, are we actually coming out of the recession? I mean, think about that. Is there a possibility we're really nailing it down -- actually coming out of the recession?

So, here's what we need to do. Let's look at the facts. How about that?

And did you hear what Geithner said over the weekend on this very topic? You will hear him. Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

A lot of folks are wondering what's going to happen on the Dow today now that there's been this Goldman bust. Well, we've been checking. I think I'm getting it up there.

Look, it's up 60 right now. See it on the plus side? Sixty-one. And it's pretty much hovering in that direction, and we're going to be following it throughout the rest of this newscast. And then count you down to the witching hour, when we're going to be joining some of our colleagues who are there live on Wall Street.

By the way, look at what the president is talking about. Let's check the tweets now. This from the president of the United States -- he's tweeting a lot again lately. "Every day that we don't act, the same system that led the bailouts for big bank reforms" -- he's obviously talking a little bit about Goldman there -- "It's time for Wall Street reform."

So, this is the president making his pitch for that Wall Street reform package that he seems to be presenting, along with the Dems, getting some resistance -- not from all -- but from some Republicans. And we're going to be looking at that at length in just a little bit.

Now, let's hope we, in the media, and that includes me and just about everybody else, have it right this time. Did you see the cover of "Newsweek?" I told you about this a little bit last week. "America's Back! The Remarkable Tale of Our Economic Turnaround."

Now, is that hype? If so, "Newsweek" would not be alone, talking about these signs. We keep reading these sunny headlines here. I've got a couple of them. I read a couple to you last week. But let me give -- let me share a couple more of this with you.

Numbers point to a strong recovery. The well-off are spending once again. Job market confirms the end of the recession.

All right. That's for the most part media talk, right?

So, now, let's look at some economic facts. The Dow has been having a pretty nice ride of late. We all know that, staying over 11,000. And there it is today, over 56, and that's even with the news of some busts on Wall Street.

Auto sales? They're going up. Sales of luxury items, up; furniture, up; retail sales -- seven straight months, up; gasoline demand, up. Cargo volume at the nation's major ports also is up.

Now, you probably knew that, right? Maybe not. But you probably do know that the jobless rate remains unacceptably high. That's not good.

And then there's this -- this is the sunniest outlook we have heard from this guy, anyway -- yet.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TIMOTHY GEITHNER, TREASURY SECRETARY: These are very encouraging signs, and I think they should -- they allow us to be much more confident today that we're going to come out of this stronger. But, you know, we have to deal in reality, too. And the really still is, is that this crisis caused a huge amount of damage. It's going to take a long time to heal that damage.

But again, I think we're in a much stronger position today than now today than we were three months ago, six months ago -- stronger than we thought. Faster recovery than many people expected because of the actions the president took.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Stronger than we thought, and faster recovery than we expected, he says. For someone as dour as Geithner usually, that's like, you know, crowning that it's morning in America.

And therein lies the irony, the opposition party, whether it's the Dems or the Republicans, always has a political interest in talking down the state of the economy if the other guy is in charge. It's politics. And it's what many Republicans are doing right now.

But how about the Obama administration? They also have reasons for low-balling expectations. Just to name one, we still don't know if there is going to be some kind of economic landmine out there that we haven't stepped on just yet.

Might things be even better than they are saying they are? Let's just keep watching. Let's keep score. And we'll see.

All right. Wall Street needs a fixing, and maybe investigating, as well. So who's going to do it? Or why won't they do it?

Jessica's list is coming up, and she's going to join me and take you through this, and then remember, we're counting down to the close today of the Dow. And we have been looking at it. Let's look at it one more time as we go to break.

What's it saying right now, Rog? You put it up there. Let's see, 57 -- up 57. Let's see if it stays in the up category as we head into the 4:00 hour. I'm going to be right back.

You're watching your national conversation, your list, RICK'S LIST.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: The president of the United States -- you're looking at live pictures. He's getting on board -- is this -- Air Force One, yes. Wasn't sure if he was going to get on the helicopter first, Marine One. No -- yes, he's getting on Air Force One. He's heading to California.

And the reason he's going to California, is because he's going to be doing a fundraiser for Barbara Boxer and the DNC at the California Science Center.

So there you go. You caught up on the president's itinerary.

This caught my ears over the weekend. Did you hear the president talking about Wall Street reform, and then did you hear what he said about Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell? Now, this is strong language. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The leader of the Senate Republicans and the chair of the Republican Senate Campaign Committee met with two dozen top Wall Street executives to talk about how to block progress on this issue. Lo and behold, when he returned to Washington, the Senate Republican leader came out against common sense reforms that we've proposed. In doing so, he made the cynical and deceptive assertion that reform would somehow enable future bailouts -- when he knows that it would do exactly the opposite.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: When he knows that it would do exactly the opposite. That's pretty darn close to calling Mitch McConnell a liar, isn't it?

And then Mitch McConnell -- well, he talked to our Candy Crowley afterward.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MCCONNELL: We certainly didn't talk about blocking the bill. I didn't know anybody who was in favor of blocking this bill. I also met recently with the Kentucky bankers, who are also opposed to this bill, the community banks, the little guys on Main Street. We're all meeting with a lot of people. This is the current subject.

For the president to politicize this in the same speech in which he said we ought to depoliticize it is really amusing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: OK. It's time for "Yellin's List" now with all that back-and-forth and with our national correspondent, Jessica Yellin.

As I understand it, there is this -- because this is the crux of the matter here: is this thing a bailout or is this thing really reforming the bad guys on Wall Street?

Now, you took me through part of this last week, Jessica. You said there were $50 billion in the financial reform bill that may or may not be used as a bailout or constitute a bailout. So, what's the $50 billion for, and is it a bailout?

You're joining me now. So, let me start you off with this. First of all, this idea about this $50 billion in reserve, in case it has to be used one way or another -- where did that idea come from?

JESSICA YELLIN, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: According to Senate Democrats, it came from Republicans who wanted it. Now, the Obama administration has opposed that fund from the beginning. Senator Dodd, who runs this committee's bill, says he included it to accommodate Republicans.

It might not actually be from the Senate Republicans, Rick. The biggest champion of this fund is Sheila Bair, who runs the FDIC. She's a Republican appointee -- and it's her idea to model it after how it currently works when we take apart banks.

The banks pay into this fund, call it a bailout fund, call it an unwinding fund. The banks pay in, and then when they need money to die, it's the money they paid. So, it doesn't come from the taxpayers, it comes from the banks. That's the whole idea.

SANCHEZ: So, it's not -- so calling it a bailout, which is what we've come to agree on is money from you, Jessica, and me, Rick, to help somebody in industry, it wouldn't -- that's not a bailout then.

YELLIN: It's not a taxpayer bailout. It's not an American people's moneys bailout. It's not a government money bailout. It's a pot of money that would come from the industry to go to the industry when it's in trouble.

SANCHEZ: So --

YELLIN: In no way is it taxpayer money.

SANCHEZ: So, it's not a bailout, really. It didn't come from the Obama administration. It came mostly from the Republican side.

The president said he doesn't care if it's there or not, because it's not the integral part of his bill, and yet, Mitch McConnell is telling Americans that they should vote against this legislation, and they should not believe in this legislation because it's a bailout. I -- YELLIN: I should point out one thing --

SANCHEZ: I can't understand all of this.

YELLIN: Yes. It is in -- there is a version of this also in the House bill which was passed by Democrats, written by Democrats. They have a $150 billion fund --

SANCHEZ: OK.

YELLIN: -- that the banks pay into, to unwind banks.

But, really, everybody's sense was this was a political winner because the American people would like the idea that in no way are the taxpayers on the hook, that it's all bank money. But, somehow, the Senate Republicans have said that's a bad idea and they're calling it a bailout. And so, now, there's a debate over it. It's a head- scratcher.

SANCHEZ: Yes, it certainly is, but certainly I'm glad that we've got you to take us through the facts of the case and I think you've done a formidable job doing that as usual doing just that, Jessica. My thanks to you.

All right. Toyota has agreed to pay a record $16 million in fines for the sticky pedal that affected its vehicles. That report is just ahead.

Also, who is the most intriguing person on the list making news today? Hint. He is responsible for keeping Wall Street in check. There's a tough job! The answers -- next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez. Time to check the list for the most intriguing person in the news today.

Goldman Sachs -- you'll be hearing that a lot today. It may be just the beginning. This is the guy who makes sure that massive corporations follow the federal investment rules.

His agency, the SEC, is suing Goldman for fraud, saying they knowingly let investors put money into a hedge fund that made money only if the subprime lending market collapsed. And they knew it. Well, that's one.

But our most intriguing today says other companies who made similar shady deals had better watch out because he'll go after them, too. It's Robert Khuzami. He's the enforcement director for the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission. He's leading what will be called a tougher and more embolden SEC, and says the subprime meltdown probe is not over.

So, get your books in order, folks. Big investment firms, our most intriguing today is making sure this time you do it right. We'll see. (MUSIC)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: Then you had the rise of the extremist voices on talk radio, here you've got a zillion Internet sites.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: President Clinton is weighing in on what is fueling hate in America. Talk radio? Question mark. Internet sites -- question mark. Militias. We're going through all of them. We're drilling down today on this very thing.

Also, now, that's what I call a pothole. One car pulled out. What else is down there?

I'm Rick Sanchez. This is your national conversation, your list, RICK'S LIST. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

We now have an opportunity to take you live, exclusively, into Iraq. That's where General Ray Odierno is joining us now by phone. There is what appears to be some fantastic news that's coming out of Iraq.

General, are you there, sir?

GENERAL RAY ODIERNO, COMMANDER, MULTINATIONAL FORCE-IRAQ (via telephone): I am, Rick. How are you this evening?

SANCHEZ: I'm doing fine, sir. I hope you're holding out OK out there. Would you go ahead -- rather than me give the news to our viewers, you give the news to our viewers about these two big arrests today.

ODIERNO: Sure. On -- actually, it was on early Sunday morning, Iraqi forces, long-supported U.S. forces, conducted operations about ten kilometers south of Tikrit, and in the operation we killed Abu Ayyub al-Masri, AAM, who was the of AQI. He's been the head of AQI since 2005. He's Egyptian born.

SANCHEZ: AQI being Al Qaeda in Iraq?

ODIERNO: That's correct, Al Qaeda in Iraq.

And then along with him, we also killed, AUAB, his name is, Abu Umar al-Baghdadi, who has served AQI as the leader of the proclaimed Islamic state of Iraq, which held the title of "Prince of the Faithful." That is the Iraqi side of Al Qaeda that has been developed here in Iraq over the last several years.

SANCHEZ: How do you -- ODIERNO: This is a very significant operation, because they are the two leaders of the organization.

SANCHEZ: Well, but, and here's the question that a lot of folks would have when they think about this, general, the possibility that, you know what, those are great figure heads, and those are big numbers, one and two. But can they easily be replaced? Or can't they? That's what we want. Your perspective, sir?

ODIERNO: Yes, I think it will be very difficult for them to be replaced. You know, frankly, over the last 60 days or so, we have been able to conduct a number of operations that have gone after several levels of the Al Qaeda network. And some of that culminated in the killing of these two on Sunday.

There are still some mid-level leaders who will probably attempt to reinvigorate Al Qaeda here. I think it will be difficult for them to do that, but us working with the Iraqi security forces will do the best we can to suppress that and continue to degrade Al Qaeda network here.

SANCHEZ: When we hear stateside, sir, the terms "Al Qaeda in Iraq," is there a -- is there a direct, or can you explain to us what the operational line is between that organization and Al Qaeda in general, maybe leading even all the way to bin Laden?

ODIERNO: Well, Abu al-Masri, who was Egyptian, was, in fact, the link to Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda. That was the foreign element of Al Qaeda that was established here in Iraq back in 2004 and '05. And he has been the leader since al Zarqawi was killed in 2005.

And he has been the link between Al Qaeda in Iraq and mainstream Al Qaeda in the Pakistan/Afghanistan area. So that's why he is so significant.

And then they learned, in order to try to win over the Iraqi people, they formed this Iraqi network called Al Qaeda in Iraq when the leader was Abu Umar al-Bagdadi, the other individual killed. That's why that was so important.

Over the last two years, Iraqi people have rejected Al Qaeda completely, and that has made it obviously easier for us to attempt to get after these individuals.

SANCHEZ: And just as you're coming to this, there are still plans to bring some 45,000 American troops out of Iraq come September. Is that still the plan, the goal, sir?

ODIERNO: Yes, it is. And I think we're on plan. And this was a good example of why. You know, this -- this was an Iraqi-led -- both by their commando units, security forces, as well as their intel organizations.

We obviously provided them some support, and some of our special operations forces contributed to this mission. But that's the way it is in Iraq. The Iraqis lead operations, and we have been slowing moving toward this the last year. And this is what is allowing us to reduce our presence.

And I feel very comfortable with us going down to 50,000 as the Iraqi security forces significantly continue to increase their capacities and capabilities.

SANCHEZ: General, could you give us a sense of your working relationship with this White House -- with the president of the United States, how often you're in contact, and whether you're both in agreement in terms of the way things are working out right now on the Iraqi theater?

ODIERNO: Well, first off, since the day -- the first day -- first full day President Obama was in office, I did about a three-hour BTC with him. And since then, we have been in regular contact. I know he reads my report I submit every week. I meet with him whenever I'm back in Washington.

I speak regularly with the vice president, who he's kind of given the Iraq pile to. I talk with him quite regularly. And we developed a plan here together over time, based on the security agreement that was signed back in December 2008 under the Bush administration.

And then President Obama and his administration have taken this over now, and we have continued to execute it with their new policy guidance.

And there's been great collaboration between myself and General Petraeus and the chairman, the secretary of defense, and the White House in developing this policy. And we're all in line with it, and we continue to work very closely. We assess the risk on a constant basis, and so far, we believe our plan is working very well.

SANCHEZ: General Ray Odierno joining us live from Iraq, on two Iraqi -- or two Al Qaeda leaders, I should say, who have been taken out, as he described for us. My thanks to you, general, job well done, sir. Thanks for joining us. We appreciate it.

ODIERNO: And thank you, rick. And I do appreciate all the great men and women over here who sacrifice every single day. They work awful hard, and continue to do it every day. So thank you very much, sir.

SANCHEZ: Well said, sir. We appreciate it.

Here is another story we're going to be following in a little bit. Toyota agrees to pay a record fine for its sticky pedal effect in its cars. Yes, it continues.

And then -- the "Brooke Block." And here she comes. And we love saying "Brooke Block." What did you think of the general?

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Awesome.

SANCHEZ: Thumb's up. I like that. We're going to be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez. It's time for the "Brooke Block." And I love saying that.

BALDWIN: I know you do.

SANCHEZ: And I love when you come out here and share your list with us. Tell us what you've got.

BALDWIN: So pretty big news. This one essentially from the follow-up file. We're talking Toyota and specifically Lexus. We brought you the story last week.

Now Toyota confirming they have issued this voluntary safety recall of this car. This is the 2010 Lexus, GX-460. We told you last week, they suspended sales after that "Consumer Reports" don't-buy designation. So "Consumer Reports" did a test, Toyota confirmed the test, and the deal is there are these rollover concerns on this particular SUV. That's just new, just this afternoon.

Point number two on Toyota. You remember -- I tried finding our gas pedal, by the way, our prop we loved so much.

SANCHEZ: Somebody stole it.

BALDWIN: But somebody has a souvenir somewhere around here, people.

SANCHEZ: It's on eBay.

BALDWIN: Probably. But you remember the big pedal concerns from certain Toyota models, the sticky accelerator, and involved 2.3-ish million vehicles.

Toyota now officially agreed to pay a record $16.4 million fine. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration are the ones who actually sought the fine. They say they have these documents that proved Toyota did, in fact, fail to notify the Department of Transportation of that particular defect four months after Toyota was aware of the problem.

I want to get in with Toyota is saying. They agreed to pay the fine, they want to avoid any kind of possible issues, litigation. But they deny these allegations -- quote, "We have acknowledged that we could have done a better job of sharing relevant information within our global operations and outside the company. But we did not try to hide a defect to avoid dealing with a safety problem." End quote.

And that's list number one.

SANCHEZ: What have you got for number two?

BALDWIN: I've been kind of excited about this. I want to tell you about Bill Milliken. It's not too often you get asked to make a beer run to the White House. But that's precisely what Bill Milliken from Maine has been called to do, a pretty big task, right, after the president singled out during a town hall meeting on health care just a couple weeks ago.

SANCHEZ: I remember this.

BALDWIN: Yep.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: I want to give a little plug to Bill here. Bill owns Market House Coffee and the main beer and beverage corporation right here in Portland, Maine.

(APPLAUSE)

In exchange for this publicity, I hope that I'm going get some samples of the beer.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Well, guess what. Bill Milliken, thank you, has done this crash course on Skype, joining me via Skype, via Maine right now. There is Bill the beer guy. And Bill, I've got to ask this really tough question here -- by the way, nice publicity, presidential publicity for your beer. What's in the beer basket?

BILL MILLIKEN, SMALL BUSINESS OWNER (via Skype): What's in the beer basket?

BALDWIN: Yes.

MILLIKEN: We have -- I don't know, maybe a dozen or so bottles of beer from various brewers in Maine. We got in touch with the Maine Brewers' Guild, and asked them to each provide a sample. And so we have this great basketful of locally-made beer.

BALDWIN: So when the president singled you out back on April 1st, you know, you were talking about the health care and you were specifically talking about because you're a small business owner, the issue with these tax credits. And essentially, my question to you today is how has your business improved? Has it?

MILLIKEN: Yes, it's improving. But it's springtime, anyway. So I would like to think that the publicity has helped. But I also like to think it's my own business acumen which is doing it, too.

BALDWIN: But specifically, with these tax credits, you know, he was -- you wanted to, what, make sure you had your part-time employees, make sure they were covered with health insurance, bring on a couple additional employees. How is that shaking out for you?

MILLIKEN: Right. Well, actually it's going to work really well. I talked to my accountant after the speech and said, you know, we've got to crunch the numbers and see how much I'm going to be getting for a tax credit. And we went through the formula, and it looks like we probably qualify for the entire 35 percent credit. And we have three employees that we're trying to get on. So basically, if I get two on, I get the third on for free.

SANCHEZ: That's all great, Bill. And all that business talk you and brook are having fantastic. Let's you and I talk beer, huh?

How hard is it, if like brook and I wanted to do a microbrew in our communities, how hard is that to get going? Is it hard to do?

MILLIKEN: It's not hard to do, but it's probably hard to do if you want to be successful at it.

SANCHEZ: Is your beer bitter?

MILLIKEN: I don't brew beer myself. I own a beer store. And so I sell the beer from all the main brewers' guild members.

SANCHEZ: I see. But you're pretty much -- you're a beer expert, right?

MILLIKEN: Yes, anything about Maine and beer, I can let you know.

SANCHEZ: OK. Well, I'm not allowed to receive any, because I have to remain down the middle, but if you want to send a couple to Brooke.

BALDWIN: Hey, I'm just saying, I'm coming to Maine for a wedding.

SANCHEZ: And I happen to be walking by --

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: Bill, do you get to deliver -- do you get to crack open a bottle of cold brew with the president in the rose garden, or do you have to FedEx it? What's the deal?

MILLIKEN: Well, I don't think you can FedEx beer. But I hope to. It's up to the White House how they want to accept it. But we're sending it down to him. He asked for it, after all.

SANCHEZ: He sure did. We heard him, as a matter of fact.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Bill, appreciate your time.

BALDWIN: Cheers!

SANCHEZ: Cheers!

BALDWIN: I'm going Maine. My brother is getting married up there.

SANCHEZ: You have an excuse. BALDWIN: I know, right?

SANCHEZ: All right, what's it like inside a militia group, a real, honest to goodness militia group? We're taking you inside so you can see it and experience it yourself. That's ahead.

Also, the angry words of talk show hosts, for example, and politicians and others, are they fueling the fires of hate in America? You heard what the president of the United States said, the former president of the United States.

Well, I'm going to be talking, because of what the former president said, with Michael Harrison from "Talkers" magazine. He's one of our favorite guests, and he's joining me in a little bit. How much of it is out of control out there, and could it cause something more serious? We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. This is RICK'S LIST. We're collecting all the important information out there, people who tweet, people on MySpace, on Facebook, people who are sharing new information with us.

And I want you now to listen to part of a brand-new interview that was done with the former president of the United States, Bill Clinton. This is where he's addressing the growth and the tone of some of the hate talk over the last 15 years.

And now the U.S. has to monitor these voices in order to be prepared for the possibility of something like -- and he mentioned this -- what happened in Oklahoma City.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: In fairness to the public officials that we're the main victims here, and their families, I think that we've done a much better job over the last 15 years of preparing for it and guarding against it, and trying to be alert to the most extreme members of groups that advocate violence, for example.

Then you had the rise of the extremist voices on talk radio. Here you've got a zillion Internet sites, people, you know, pumping up a lot of this --

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: So you're saying it potentially could be worse today because of this echo chamber.

CLINTON: Yes, the echo chamber is bigger today, and there are more voices in it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Perfect guy to talk to about this is Michael Harrison. You have seen him on my show before. He is the publisher of "Talkers" magazine, the leading trade publication of the talk radio industry.

Michael, thanks for being with us, as usual, man.

MICHAEL HARRISON, PUBLISHER, "TALKERS" MAGAZINE: Thanks, Rick.

SANCHEZ: You advised President Clinton once about talk radio, didn't you?

HARRISON: Oh, yes, I did. And he understood talk radio very well. He's a media expert, if there ever was one in the White House.

SANCHEZ: Do you think he's referring in many ways to talk radio when he said also to Wolf, and we didn't hear that part of it here, but that people need to be careful what they say?

HARRISON: Oh, sure. The Democratic politicians loved to blame talk radio for anything that goes wrong in the country because so much of news talk radio, as you and I have discussed in the past, is dominated by conservatives. So talk radio's a great target.

But I think this issue is much broader. And I think the First Amendment is something that we have to always keep in mind when we're talking about shutting up conversation about politics.

SANCHEZ: No, you're absolutely right -- you're right.

HARRISON: I saw somebody hit somebody in the head with an elbow in a basketball game the other day. That was a blatant act of violence. People are watching that. I think that's far more dangerous for violence in our society than intelligent, or semi- intelligent, as sometimes the case unfortunately is, political talk on the radio.

SANCHEZ: Yes, but -- all right, let me not come at you with that yet. Let me ask you this, somebody who is in a militia, for example. And by the way, not all militias are bad. But there are people in militias who tend to have this thinking that maybe the government's coming in a helicopter to get them at any moment.

Would those people tend to be listening to or would those people be easily swayed by someone on the radio, for example?

HARRISON: I don't think that the average person, if you can call them an average -- everything has averages -- the kind of person who would join a militia and run around with guns and think the government's going to break into their home and that type of person is listening to the kind of talk radio that's being targeted by people blaming talk radio for inspiring this.

They would consider talk radio to be mainstream, almost boring mainstream media.

SANCHEZ: But it's not -- but you know it's not. And you and I have talked about this, but there are people in talk radio who are very responsible, they vet their information, and they at least try to be fair and give the benefit of the doubt.

And then there's people out there who are just a constant drumbeat of real hate. And one thing after another, it doesn't matter if it's substantiated or fact-checked or anything. Do you worry about some of those folks at all?

HARRISON: Of course. I worry about any type of distortion in the media because people hear it, they read it, they see it, they believe it. That's a problem that's an educational problem.

But I don't think that the kind of person that's going to pick up a gun and join a militia is sitting there listening to your typical talk show host. They're not -- they have their own grapevines. They have their own leadership. They have their own media. They're on the Internet.

There are all kinds of bizarre things on the Internet, I'll agree. But I don't think you're hearing that type -- I don't think there's a connection between what you're hearing in commercial talk media -- which in some cases is nasty, no question about it -- and what's going on in this so-called fringe. There's a big disconnect. And the mainstream talk media is a great target for it.

The problem is -- I hate to see people suddenly saying, oh, these people are dangerous, because that what you have in totalitarian states.

SANCHEZ: You're right.

HARRISON: And any kind is dissent if feared to lead to military action against the government.

SANCHEZ: You're absolutely right. The last thing you want to do is take away someone's right to say whatever the hell it is they want to say based upon the First Amendment of the United States, which keeps me and you talking on the air.

On the other hand, there are people who are driving their cars around who may not be a member of any organization today but could be tomorrow. And the information they're receiving, we have to be cognizant of. I think that was the point in many ways the president was making.

Michael, we are out of time. But you know I'm going to have you back, right?

HARRISON: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: I always enjoy these conversations. I think a lot of people like it, as well, and I get a lot of e-mails and tweets on it. We'll see you next time.

HARRISON: You got it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're not extremists. We're camouflaged up, holding guns, running through the woods might seem extreme to some, but I don't count it as being extremists. (END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So let's gear into this. What is it like to go inside a militia group? I'm going to take you inside a militia group. That's coming up in just a little bit.

And remember, I'm going to be sharing with you a lot of information that's coming on our tweet board today. And the DOW, up, down after the information on the bust on Wall Street? We'll find out in a minute. Stay right there, folks. This is "RICK'S LIST."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: There's about three and a half minutes left. Let's look and see what's going on with the DOW. Is it up? Is it down? How is it going to finish today based on some of the things that have taken place there? Roger, let's see it. There it is -- oh, up 68, still over 11,000. That's important news.

You'll hear the "ring, ring, ring" when Poppy Harlow joins us live from Wall Street in a minute and a half.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)