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Rick's List

Times Square Suspect Arrested; Disaster in the Gulf

Aired May 04, 2010 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: There's no story more important today to most Americans than what has been going on this weekend in Times Square, especially now that there's an arrest.

Let's do the LIST.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ (voice-over): Here's what's on this special edition of RICK'S LIST: Times Square suspect captured.

ERIC HOLDER, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: The intent behind this terrorist act was to kill Americans.

SANCHEZ: Stop that plane. What happened on board? Who gave him up?

MICHAEL BLOOMBERG (I), MAYOR OF NEW YORK: Our bravest did exactly what they have been trained to do in such situations.

SANCHEZ: Who is he? A husband, a father, an American, but a native of Pakistan.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was a private person, kept to himself.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Once in a while, I would see, he would take one -- children or a stroller or -- carry a child in and out of a car.

SANCHEZ: Why was he allowed to be naturalized? We list how many are naturalized each year. Did he do it alone? Where was he for 48 hours?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is no longer the old type of al Qaeda terrorism. This time, the intention is to recruit individuals domestically.

SANCHEZ: Your questions answered on this special edition of RICK'S LIST.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: There's nothing Americans are more interested in than terrorism, and we're going to be focusing on this day.

Hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez. Topping the LIST right now: the Times Square bomb suspect. We're going to be looking at this from every possible angle that you can think of. The suspect's name? Faisal Shahzad. And he's due in court any moment now. We're there, by the way.

We're learning also a lot more about him in these ways. There have been arrests in Pakistan. What is the connection between him, Faisal, and the arrests in Pakistan?

But, first, this arrest was a very close call. Have you heard? We're drilling down on this. He was reportedly -- key word here is reportedly, because this story may be changing during this hour -- already on a plane heading for Pakistan by way of Dubai.

The plane had already pulled away from the gate. And listen to what happened. This is -- what I'm going to show you now is some air traffic control audio that's just come in.

This is the tower -- this is the tower telling the plane after it's almost ready to taxi and then take off, stop everything you're doing, turn around, make a quick left turn, come on back. There's something going on here that you need to know about. Let's listen to this together.

Hit it, Rog.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) 202 (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) Good evening. Left bravo. Little Alpha 228. And (INAUDIBLE) your frequency 125.7.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And listening to bravo zulu alpha (INAUDIBLE) 125.7 Emirates 202.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two-zero-two, it looks like you're going to be number one. Monitor the tower on (INAUDIBLE) at this time.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One-two-three (INAUDIBLE) emirates -- 202 (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) runway 22 right position.

Actually, I have a message for you to go back to the gate immediately. So, make the left turn when able.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two-zero-two turning left here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All right. Emirates 202, make the left turn onto echo left alpha back to the ramp. I don't know exactly why, but you can call your company for the reason.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I will do that. Left on to echo, then on to alpha and back to the gate via (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, whatever is convenient.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Emirates 202.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ground to Emirates 202 heavy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Emirates 202 heavy. Go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, ma'am. We're trying to figure out what's going on here right now, but as far as I know we know, I would like to request that you just keep the flight line open for now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Emirates 202 heavy, no problem. The flight plan's good for another two hours.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thanks.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Also now, for the very first time, we're hearing from some of the passengers on that flight. And people are starting to wonder, what did they know? What did the pilot say if, in fact, Shahzad was on that flight, to make sure that he didn't panic or that anybody else on the plane panicked? Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK SUTHERLAND, PASSENGER: We were actually ready for takeoff. But we pulled back into the (INAUDIBLE). And then there was a couple of security personnel coming on and off. And then we all got deplaned, and then they just went through our luggage. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So, you have a guy who apparently wanted to kill Americans, no less on Times Square.

The questions that are being asked now are, who else was in on this with him? What organization may have been he connected to? These are important questions, questions that he's being asked. And from what we understand right now -- and this is obviously very important to this story -- he's talking. Shahzad is, in fact, talking. That is according to the attorney general of the United States, Eric Holder.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOLDER: Faisal Shahzad was arrested late last night in connection with his alleged role in the attempted car bombing in Times Square last Saturday. Shahzad, a naturalized United States citizen, born in Pakistan, is in federal custody today. He has been and continues to be questioned by federal agents. As a result of those communications, Shahzad has provided useful information to authorities.

We anticipate charging him with an act of terrorism transcending national borders, attempted use of a weapon of mass destruction, use of a destructive device during the commission of another crime, as well as assorted explosives charges.

Now I want to emphasize that this investigation is ongoing, and we continue to pursue a number of leads as we gather useful intelligence related to the terrorist attack.

Based on what we know so far, it is clear that this was a terrorist plot aimed at murdering Americans in one of the busiest places in our country. We believe that this suspected terrorist fashioned a bomb from rudimentary ingredients, placed it in a rusty SUV, and drove it into Times Square with the intent to kill as many innocent tourists and theater goers as possible.

Now, make mistake -- make no mistake. Although this car bomb failed to properly detonate, this plot was a very serious attempt. If successful, it could have resulted in a lethal terrorist attack, causing death and destruction in the heart of New York City.

It is a stark reminder of the reality that we face today in this country. The reality that there is a constant threat from those who wish to do us harm simply because of our way of life. There are organized terrorist networks that are targeting us. There are lone terrorists here at home and abroad who are targeting us. As months, even years go by without a successful terrorist attack, the most dangerous lesson that we can draw is a false impression that this threat no longer exists. It does.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So, what about the possibility that this guy was, as you heard there, the term described as lone wolf, maybe acting alone? Maybe he just had a crazy idea and he decided to go out and do this. The answer, not likely.

Why? This case, we learned today from sources of CNN, is stretching all the way to Pakistan, several people arrested in Pakistan today.

Sabrina Tavernise is a foreign correspondent for "The New York Times." She is joining us now. She's in Islamabad to fill us in on exactly what has been taking place there.

Sabrina, how are you?

SABRINA TAVERNISE, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": I'm fine. Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Good.

I imagine it's very early in the morning there or very late at night, however you want to look at it. But tell us, if you could, about these arrests that have taken place.

TAVERNISE: Well, the first one was actually very early Tuesday morning, even before it is got light out, before Friday prayers, around very early morning prayer time, which is, like, 4:00 or 5:00 in the morning in Karachi, in a northern kind of industrial area of the city.

It was of a gentleman who had been connected with Mr. Shahzad. Apparently, they had traveled to Peshawar, which is a northwestern city in Pakistan. Driving in a pickup truck, he was arrested from the mosque. And the mosque had connections, believed to have links to a militant group named -- called Jaish-e-Mohammad.

SANCHEZ: I'm reading from reports that he spent five months in Pakistan prior to coming back and attempting this, according to police on Times Square.

Are these individuals that are being arrested today the people that he may have spent some time with during those five months in Pakistan?

TAVERNISE: Yes.

The one in Karachi definitely was. And then we learned later this evening from some Pakistani intelligence officials that there were probably between six and seven other -- other people arrested from his hometown area, which is actually in Northwestern Pakistan, so it's in -- it's far away from Karachi, but in two different parts of Pakistan, between seven and eight people arrested in connection with -- with this -- with Mr. Shahzad.

SANCHEZ: Is there any way of trying to nail down at this point, or is it simply too early, whether, in fact, these folks helped him plan this while he was there, that, in other words, the master plan actually came to fruition during that five-month period somehow?

TAVERNISE: It's pretty unclear. It's pretty early to say. I mean, people from his town and his area say they're very -- they're shocked, they're surprised. He's, interestingly, from -- from a military family in Pakistan.

His father is a retired vice air marshal, which is -- you know, it's a relatively unusual connection. It's not clear -- apparently, there were sort of friends of his in the area, in his home area, that were arrested. So, there was one Pakistani official who said that he might have had links to an al Qaeda-related fellow named Ilyas Kashmiri, but that's very tentative and unclear so far.

SANCHEZ: Well, let me just ask you, then, the money question, since you just raised that possibility. I think most of the folks watching us now on CNN would want to know, is there any indication, perhaps aside from what you just told us about Mr. Kashmiri, that this was somehow tied to some terrorism organization, whether al Qaeda or any other?

TAVERNISE: It's possible. We just don't know yet.

But the mosque in Karachi was known to have links to a militant grouped called Jaish-e-Mohammad, which has been very involved in a lot of very vicious attacks in Pakistan for a number of years now. So, you know, that's a possibility. And then the area where he was born and raised and grew up was an area that had a number of Afghan refugee camps. And that is -- that has been -- they have been -- they have tended to be problem areas and areas that have -- have had, you know, some militant connections because of the back-and-forth between Pakistan and Afghanistan.

SANCHEZ: But no quid pro quo, at least at this point? That doesn't mean that we may not see one subsequently.

TAVERNISE: That's correct.

SANCHEZ: Sabrina Tavernise with "The New York Times," a foreign correspondent, I know it's early in the morning there, and you have been very kind to take us through this story that so many Americans are interested in knowing so much more about. Thank you. We appreciate your time.

TAVERNISE: I want to take you now to some of our other correspondents.

We at CNN have our own bureaus around the world that we have been getting information from. Tom Foreman's been putting information for us together. So has Mary Snow. We have, as you see, correspondents in part of Pakistan, and obviously Afghanistan.

But I want to begin now with our senior correspondent, Allan Chernoff, because he's at the federal court in Manhattan, where we understand that at any moment now, we might see Faisal showing up for his first appearance.

Has it happened yet? What's the expectation there? Allan, take us through it.

ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Rick, the U.S. attorney's office says that they are still planning to have this happen, to have Faisal Shahzad show up in court for his first appearance.

But when I got off the phone with them a few minutes ago, they still had not filed the charging documents with the clerk of the court. That document is still in the works. Now, they have to get that document in with the clerk within the next hour-and-a-half. Otherwise, this is not happening today.

But they say it will happen. Now, those charges will include, according to the attorney general, an act of terrorism transcending national boundaries and attempted use of weapons of mass destruction.

Rick, we could be talking here a maximum sentence potentially of life in prison.

SANCHEZ: Yes, and he's -- and he's -- and, by the way, as I understand it, and you can confirm this for me, he's admitted to it, right? He's copped to what he did, according to U.S. officials.

CHERNOFF: Well, the officials are saying that he is cooperating, that he's providing very helpful information, so that much, we do know. I don't know of an actual confession from it. That, I have not heard just yet.

SANCHEZ: Well, that -- actually, that's what Mr. -- the FBI official during the news conference today, Mr. -- what was his name, Pistole? I'm sorry. Say again, Angie? Pete -- Pistole, yes.

He said -- he actually used -- I remember I wrote it down on my notes -- he says, he had admitted to it.

CHERNOFF: OK.

SANCHEZ: So, I don't know if it's a confession or not, but that's the word that they're using at this point. I don't think he's going to fight this thing, Allan.

CHERNOFF: Right. They said -- they said that he's had -- he's giving good information, cooperating. And keep in mind, the more that he talks, the more he cooperates, well, they want to get everything they can before he appears in court and he's got a lawyer assigned to him and then the defense begins, essentially.

SANCHEZ: That's the American way. Thanks so much.

This is obviously an ever-changing story. Allan, you and I will get back together throughout this newscast, as we get more information.

Also, take a look at this:

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The concern right now is there may be others out there still. He's claimed he's the only one, but if he was radicalized enough to launch an attack against his adopted country, he's radicalized enough to lie to the FBI.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So many questions in this case.

By the way, we have just gotten information that we're going to be taking you to the White House -- that's in about 14 minutes from now -- to get the very latest from there on this.

And there's also a tweet coming in now. This is from Secretary Gibbs. What's he saying? He says the president was briefed six times yesterday about the investigation, and notified of the arrest at 12:05 a.m. by John Brennan.

Interestingly enough, on this newscast, if you were watching us yesterday, you may have heard from the very first time from some of our FBI and fed agency officials that this arrest would happen quickly, as in soon, as in not long after we got off the air yesterday. And, in fact, that's exactly what happened. Also, this story we're following. BP, could they only have to pay $75 million for that spill in the Gulf? I mean, that's crazy, right? Well, just to put it in perspective, we have put a list together. I want to show you the list of the top five most profitable companies in the world. How much do you think they bring in every year? Oh, and by the way, you think BP's on that list? You will find out next.

You're watching RICK'S LIST, your list, your national conversation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: All right. This suspect is scheduled to arrive any moment now at the courthouse, and this should be interesting. We're also going to be getting any moment now more information from the White House. The briefing is scheduled to start now about, oh, nine minutes or so, and you're going to take it live right from the very beginning, and also the very latest on what's going on with the situation in the Gulf of Mexico, as you know.

A lot of talk today about what is your responsibility, my responsibility, and BP's responsibility, perhaps even vis-a-vis what the government's responsibility is in what's going on, on the coast. And that's an interesting -- that's an interesting question, folks.

Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

Case came together like a prime-time cop show, we're being told. Tom Foreman is going to be drilling down on that for us. He joins me now to bring us up to date on what the very latest is on this story.

Tom, what do you got?

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, I will tell you, Rick, you described it just right.

Look at this -- 6:28, almost 6:30 Saturday evening, Times Square, New York, I'm telling you, there's almost no busier time, if you have ever been there, tourists everywhere. That's when police say a Nissan Pathfinder crossed an intersection on 45th Street, then stopped on 7th Avenue.

It was believed to be driven by this man by the police, but they didn't know it at the time. A street vendor notices smoke in the vehicle. They smell some things. The police come around. They say this is a problem. They immediately set up an evacuation area this broad. And you know how big that is in Times Square on a Saturday night, so they knew it was serious. They just didn't know what it was.

By 3:00 a.m. Sunday, a remote-control device punched a hole through the rear window of this vehicle and retrieved a metal box. By 6:00 a.m. Sunday, they feel like the vehicle can finally be moved, so they tow it out here to a bomb facility. There, a police officer crawls up underneath it and he gets the vehicle identification number, awfully important thing to have, because now they can figure out where they're going to it.

That leads investigators up to Bridgeport, Connecticut, where they're checking out this report that a man sold this to some guy three weeks earlier for cash. It's a crucial breakthrough. Sources say that what they found out there also was from the daughter of the guy who sold it. They found out some cell phone information about the buyer.

At the same time -- this is all up in Bridgeport up here -- at the same time, they're investigating other leads, including the posting of a video on YouTube claiming responsibility for the attack, and then, on Monday, all of this really quickens.

The president, as you mentioned a minute ago, Rick, received six briefings from his counterterrorism adviser, John Brennan, during the course of that day. And, by 10:00 last night, just as you said, investigators are saying to us at CNN that a Pakistani-American is a potential suspect in the case.

And, at that same time -- this is the part that is absolutely like something out of a novel -- at the same time that we're being told that, out here at JFK Airport, they say Faisal Shahzad is arriving in a white Isuzu Trooper, 10:00 at night. They say he has ammunition and a gun that were later found in the vehicle, and he goes inside to get onto a plane, a United Arab Emirates flight.

He boards the plane, which actually leaves the gate, and there's some confusion over exactly how this was decided. The Emirates people say, hey, we alerted airport security because he got a reservation at the last moment, paid with cash. Feds say, we never had a thought that we were going to lose him. They say he was on a watch list, all sorts of things.

But the bottom line is, this plane is taxiing -- now, it shown in daylight here, but we're actually talking about in the dark -- when it's told to come back. It pulls in. It's boarded. And at 11:45 p.m., Faisal Shahzad is arrested. Soon after, detectives move in to search his Bridgeport home, a great deal more up in Connecticut.

And just after -- about around midnight, John Brennan informs the president that Shahzad had been arrested right before, if he had done what he apparently planned to do, he would have jumped on to a flight and gone all the way across here to the United Arab Emirates, to Dubai, and then on over here to Pakistan, Rick, just an absolutely amazing story that truly came down to the last few minutes before he would have taken off.

SANCHEZ: Stop that plane. Unbelievable.

Tom Foreman, thanks so much for bringing -- listen, we're going to be checking back in with you over the next hour-and-a-half or so, OK? So, any tidbit, any new piece of information, any changes in this story, let Angie know in the control room, and I will get right back to you.

FOREMAN: Absolutely. Sure thing, Rick.

SANCHEZ: Appreciate it, Tom.

Take a look at this, folks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOLDER: It's clear that the -- that the intent behind this terrorist act was to kill Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: How many people would have been killed on Times Square if that bomb had gone off? Again, we have reporters all over the world. We are covering this story for you.

And we're also covering the story in the Gulf of Mexico, which doesn't seem to be getting any better or any easier to clean up. BP is meeting with Congress. Are they briefing or getting drilled? Which would you say should be happening?

By the way, why is this a behind-closed-doors meeting? Isn't it, in part, our money that's going to be used to clean this up? Oh, wait. BP says, no, we will pay for the whole thing. We're going to drill down on that.

Jessica Yellin's joining me in just a little bit to take us through this part of RICK'S LIST, her list. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We think lists give Americans perspectives on stories. So, every day, we're going to give you one, two, maybe three lists that are relevant to the stories that we cover.

Time for today's newsy list. And guess what we want you to know? Who are the most profitable companies in the world right now? And is BP on that list? After all, we need to know if they can possibly afford to pay more than the $75 million that the statutes say that they have to pay for this oil spill disaster, right? Seventy-five million.

Keep in mind, these five companies I'm about to show you, they average, they average $25 billion in profits a year, $25 billion. Here we go, in descending order.

Number five, Chevron. Number four, there you go, BP. Number three, the only non-oil or petroleum company on the list at all, Wal- Mart, the third most profitable company in the world. Number two, ExxonMobil. And number one on the list of the world's largest companies, Royal Dutch/Shell.

There you have it, average, something like $25 billion a year. Jessica Yellin's going to join us in just a little bit, and this is where she comes in to the political part of this story, not to mention the economic part of the story, because now that you know just how much money BP makes, are you asking yourself why their problem has become our problem? How much are they going to pay? What are they doing to clean this thing up? And what if it starts hitting the beaches in Florida and Mississippi and Alabama? You think $75 million will do it?

I don't think so, folks. We're coming right back with Jessica's list. Stay right there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back.

I want to put this in perspective for you, and, obviously, the best way to put a story in perspective is to actually visualize it, right?

So, there's the visualization of what we're talking about right now in the Gulf of Mexico. You can see that mustard area right there. That's where the spill is contained right now.

But as you look around, you can actually see some places where some of the oil has also spread into some of the shipping areas and also some of these areas over here. The question is, where will it go? Will it move in this direction? Will it move back toward Florida and part of the Florida panhandle as well?

And if that happens, if they're not able to cap this thing as they're planning to cap it in the next couple of days, then this thing could be Katie by the door. We could be talking, like, Exxon Valdez style proportions, which, as you know, is going to cost a lot of money.

Now, there is a law that essentially was passed, after Exxon Valdez of all things, that says that a company that is responsible for something like this, in this case BP, only has to pay $75 million. But, $75 million you ask, if this thing gets as bad as they say it could get, it would be, what, a drop in the bucket? Shouldn't they pay a whole lot more?

Well, they, BP, is meeting with Congress today. Interestingly enough, it's a closed-door meeting.

Let me bring in Jessica Yellin now. She's following this part of the story. Hey, I guess, first question, $75 million? I mean, I just characterized it as a drop in the bucket for what this could become. Am I wrong?

JESSICA YELLIN, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: It is a drop in the bucket. You're not wrong on that. Let me clarify one thing. BP is on the hook for all costs related to the cleanup of the spill, so no matter how high that part gets, even if it's in the billions, they are legally bound to pay for the cleanup. But the $75 million cap is what BP's liable for for any economic or environmental damages. So that's the effects on local businesses, fishing, cleaning, you know, the down-the-line effects on the water and the ecosystem.

The example I was thinking of it's sort of like if your insurance company will fix the thing that leaked in your car, but it won't fix what the effects of what that leak are.

SANCHEZ: Yes, which sometimes can be your entire transmission.

YELLIN: Right.

SANCHEZ: And if we're talking about tourism in Florida, during the early summer months, it is a transmission problem.

(LAUGHTER)

YELLIN: I guess so. Is that a car joke?

SANCHEZ: Well, no, but it is very, very significant. That's why you listen to astronaut, Florida astronaut, Nelson, Bill Nelson, and he's pushing for -- he's saying, the first thing we got to do is we got to get that capped from $75 million to $10 billion. Well, that's one heck of a difference.

And he's also -- in fact, we've got tape of him talking, Jessica, about something else he wants to do from now on when it comes to drilling off the coast. Let's listen to that, and then I want your reaction on the back side.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BILL NELSON, (D) FLORIDA: The president's proposal for offshore drilling is dead on arrival. If I have to do a filibuster, which I had to five years ago when Senator Dimenichi (ph) was going to ram through drilling off the Gulf Coast of Florida, if I have to do that, I will do so again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

YELLIN: All right. He's a Florida guy. But he's a powerful guy, former astronaut, and he's fired up about this, isn't he?

SANCHEZ: Yes, he's angry. Look, he's opposed offshore drilling and it proves to him why he's opposed it all along. And he is among those pushing for the change in the law as you say to make companies liable to pay a lot more.

One of the things I've heard from folks I talked to on the Hill is that they're still figuring out what kind of legislative responses they want to have to the BP spill and what's going to come. This idea of increasing the amount that the company could have to pay could be an amendment. It could be part of the bigger picture.

It's not sure it will get a lot of traction. I have to point out, Rick, that part of the way that everything has been paid for in the past, there's a bailout fund that's been created after Exxon Valdez to help pay for some of this, and it's with an eight cents a gallon tax on oil per gallon, eight cent per gallon and I can imagine --

SANCHEZ: So, we paid for it?

YELLIN: Well, the companies pay for it, but the argument often in Washington is if the companies paid, they pass it on to the consumers. So, if BP has to pay more, I wouldn't be surprised if someone would say, hey, listen, we'll all end up paying it. You pay it one way or another so --

SANCHEZ: But do you know what, that just seems so terribly unfair. It's their screw up, it's their mess. Why does it have to become our mess? Why can't we take it off of their profits instead of us having to pay for it with some kind of bailout?

I know the difference between a trust fund -- or a trust account and a bailout, but it seems to me there will be some angry people and I wouldn't be surprised if there's more. Bill Nelson is coming forward saying, hey, wait a minute, this is ridiculous. You caused it, you fix it.

YELLIN: And already a few senators have signed on to the proposal that you talked about to increase their liability. So, yes, it is gaining some steam.

SANCHEZ: Thank you. Good conversation. I appreciate it. Let's just hope in the next couple days they get the giant concrete cone on the thing and maybe we can avoid the problem altogether.

YELLIN: That would be great.

SANCHEZ: All right, Jess, we'll be looking forward to it. Thank you.

Meanwhile, take a look at this -- Bobby Jindal. What does he say? Local leaders know best. Coast guard should approve and BP fund their plans. "Approve and BP fund their plans," I have no idea what that means. We're not waiting. We're acting now. There's Bobby Jindal. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

I want to clue you in now on some brand-new information that we've just learned from our CNN sources. Some of our correspondents have been working this part of the story for quite some time now and I think we now got a better handle on this.

We have been reporting throughout the day, as has the general media, that, in fact, Faisal Shahzad was onboard a plane that was turned around before it was able to take off and that he was then escorted off the plane. There is now a revision to that story. As it turns out, it's true that the plane was turned around. It's true that the plane was getting ready to take off. But Faisal Shahzad was not onboard.

This suspected terrorist had already been detained prior to boarding the plane by FBI and New York officials, and he was actually apprehended before he went on.

Officials say they still needed to bring the plane back, perhaps to talk to some others who may have been at the time thought to be traveling with him. As this story develops, I told you that there would be changes and we expected that there might. As the information comes in, we'll be bringing it to you.

Here's some more sound from this story as it's been developing over the course of the past several hours.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is no longer the old type of Al Qaeda terrorism where individuals will be imported into the United States to carry out an attack like the 9/11 atrocities. This time the intention is to recruit individuals, domestically.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Does the botched Times Square bombing raise a red flag or another major issue?

Also, how many times does this car flip over? And how's the driver doing? This is one heck of a piece of video for you. I'll show it to you coming up in "Fotos."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We're going to be getting the latest word in just a moment about what happened on Times Square and the subsequent arrest because we're going to be taking you to the White House any moment now. That should have actually begun, the briefing about five minutes or so ago. We understand it's going to be coming up in just a little bit, and as soon as it does, I am going to take you there.

But in the meantime, I want to continue to talk to some of the folks who can maybe better inform us about what's going on with this story. The arrest of the suspect in Times Square's bomb plot went down like -- some are saying is was like -- you ever watch the show "CSI" on TV? It happened just about as fast, by the way.

Ty Fairman is a former FBI agent, and he's good enough to join us now. Mr. Fairman, how are you doing, sir?

TY FAIRMAN, FORMER FBI AGENT: Doing great, Rick. Thank you for having me.

SANCHEZ: The first thing I want to do is try to get some news out of you. What do you know that we don't know that you might be able to share with us, because I know that you FBI guys talk to each other all the time? So, what have you found out about this story?

FAIRMAN: Well, no, we don't really talk, because there's information that we can't receive. It has to be protected from the public.

But what I do know, as, you know, as a former national terrorism expert and former counterterrorism agent, Faisal Shahzad's life is an open book right now. There's no secrets or privacy clauses that the FBI can't get to right now. There's nothing that they won't find out about him.

SANCHEZ: And he's copped a plea, though, by the way. I want to go back. I was having a conversation with one of my correspondents, one of my colleagues, my correspondents, and maybe he hadn't heard it, by I looked at my notes to make sure I had it right.

I believe it was Ray Kelly who said, in fact, he has admitted to it, and so did Attorney General Eric Holder. What does that mean when you hear that the suspect has essentially come clean, that he's copped to what they're accusing him of doing? How big is that?

FAIRMAN: Well, that's police talk, but as far as the Bureau's concerned, they're trying to gather intelligence to find out if he's part of an organization, any kind of group. If he received any kind of funding, or is there a much bigger picture.

SANCHEZ: Hold on, who better to get the information than him? If you were saying who were you talking to? He said I talked to Joe in Pakistan, Fred in Karachi, et cetera, et cetera, I mean, you got leads to go on there, right?

FAIRMAN: But he's going to protect his source. He's the first lead. He's not going to give up any real information. He's going to tell you what he wants to tell you, and it's up to the Bureau to find out the rest, because I believe it's much bigger than it looks like right now, and we can't take any chances.

SANCHEZ: Wait, wait, wait. I keep doing this "wait, wait, wait," thing, and I apologize. You keep saying things that perk my curiosity, and I imagine if it's perking my curiosity, it's perking the curiosity of many of our viewers who are sitting at home trying to figure this thing out.

You just said that you think this thing is, quote, "going to be a lot bigger." What do you mean by that, and why do you say that?

FAIRMAN: First of all, he had to come up with the idea. He had to observe and surveil those areas to find out these are vulnerable areas, this is where no one's looking, you know. And he had to be able to buy that equipment and get the idea.

Plus he's been in Pakistan for the past five months talking to somebody, you know, being able to plan this -- this attack or supposed attack on, you know -- in Times Square. So, I don't feel that he's doing this alone and just made this stuff up. SANCHEZ: Can I ask you a question out of my own curiosity about the idea -- the fact that he's an American. He's a naturalized citizen of the United States. And yet as I was going through -- we did a little research today. We went and pulled all the paperwork that's necessary for someone to become a naturalized citizen of the United States.

And I went through there. I wish I'd brought it here. I left it on my desk downstairs. We got this new studio here. And as I was going through that thing, do you know what I saw, I saw, "Have you ever been a member of the communist party? Have you ever been a member of the Nazi party? Were you involved in Nazi activities or communist activities in World War II?" "Were you involved in this, that, the other, how long have you been here?" A lot of excellent questions.

But it almost seemed to me the questions were outdated. There was only one question about terrorism and that was "Are you a terrorist or have you ever been involved in terrorist activity?" Well, Allen Iverson was charged with terrorism in Philadelphia for some domestic incident.

Is our process for screening people who become naturalized in this country outdated?

FAIRMAN: Not only is it outdated, it's ridiculous. I mean, how are you going to give someone a test? The true test is people observing your actions over a long period of time. You can't say four or five years, you know, because that person was not born in the U.S. So, even though on paper, he's a U.S. citizen, he's naturalized, his heart, his belief systems are all based on his religion and his family and his culture in Pakistan.

SANCHEZ: But isn't there a way of trying to get to the heart or root of that, when you make him fill out a piece of paper? Hell, if we're asking him about his communist activities, shouldn't we be asking him if he has any ties to terrorist organizations, either in the Middle East or any other part of the world, or would that be politically incorrect?

FAIRMAN: Well, it would be nice to ask that question, but we have no way of proving that he isn't. I mean, we don't have a way to conduct a due diligence over in Pakistan. The government's not going to put forth that amount of activity and the money to do so.

So they just put out these basic questions, they ask these basic questions, and get these basic answers, and that's it. So, we have to rely on the paperwork, and that's ridiculous. It should be changed.

SANCHEZ: By the way, I think you're right. You know what, looking through this thing today, I was amazed at how antiquated this thing seemed, but it's something we're going to look in to a little bit later as well. We're curious. I'm sure a lot of our viewers are curious.

We've actually put together a list that we'll show in a little bit -- how many people have actually become naturalized citizens over the past couple of decades? We've got the numbers and we'll share them.

Mr. Fairman, you've been very kind to join us today and share your expertise and your wisdom with us.

FAIRMAN: Thank you, Rick. Thanks for having me.

SANCHEZ: We look forward to seeing you again.

Coming up on "RICK'S LIST," country music star Keith Urban is joining me live. Why? The southeast flooding has hit him hard -- him, his family, his neighborhood, the family he loves, the warehouse that stores all his guitars and equipment, gone. Once again, Keith Urban will be live with me in just a little bit.

As we wait for the White House briefing to begin, our special investigations correspondent has new information. We've just learned the suspect was taken into custody before he got on that plane that was pulled back at the gate. Drew Griffin will be joining us here in a little bit to take us through this.

This is your national conversation. This is your list. This is "RICK'S LIST."

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SANCHEZ: Breaking news on the very latest on Faisal Shahzad, the suspected Times Square bomber. We have just learned that he has told investigators that he actually trained in Waziristan, trained in the mountains of Waziristan with terrorist groups.

Now, if Waziristan sounds familiar to you, it is the mountainous region where Usama bin Laden is said to have been hiding for many years now, the place where he ended up where he crossed over from Tora Bora where he essentially escaped from Afghanistan.

So this starts to draw a little bit of a clearer picture as to, if nothing else, what Shahzad's intent may have been in those five months that he spent in Pakistan prior to coming back here to the United States.

Drew Griffin is joining me now to talk about this, and also Drew is the one who just was able to nail down that discrepancy or that revision in the story we've been telling you about, which is that Shahzad was not on board the plane when it was turned around. He was actually detained somewhere at the airport.

What do you know about this, Drew? How did you find this out?

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Rick, we've been trying to knock down the idea that somehow or another this guy was about to escape and this was an arrest kind of in the nick of time.

An administration source is telling CNN that this is exactly how it went down. That Shahzad was indeed on the plane, that the door to the plane was closed, but that the gate -- the gate was still attached to the plane and they simply opened the door up, walked in, and took him off the plane.

He began to cooperate with officials immediately. He was being questioned there at the airport when the Emirates jet was allowed to push back. Now, at that time, out of an abundance of caution I'm being told by a federal law enforcement source, they had a ping on two more people on that plane.

They brought the gate, as you have showed and the video showed and they had that audio from the tower, they brought the plane back. They opened the door. They brought those two more potential suspects off the plane, they later turned out to have nothing to do with this and they were cleared. So the plane with Shahzad never pushed back from the gate.

SANCHEZ: I've just been given the actual complaint, United States -- here, Roger, maybe you can use one of these cameras. Who is over there? Robert -- this news studio confuses me.

There's the official complaint. It's just been given to me moments ago. It's the case of the United States of America versus Faisal Shahzad. There it goes on to say all that he will be charged with.

"Count one, including on or about the district of Columbia, knowingly and without lawful authority did attempt to use a weapon of mass destruction, namely a destructive device as defined by title 18 United States code, et cetera, et cetera." So there's count one, count two, count three. Count two I think is terrorism.

Drew, they're throwing the book at this guy, right?

GRIFFIN: Enough to keep him in, no question about it. He was fleeing. And they will add more and more charges. I don't have privy to what you're seeing but I imagine there's going to be a host of explosive charges and --

SANCHEZ: What about now -- pardon me for interrupting you, but what about now with this new information that he has told investigators he trained in Waziristan? I bet that makes your ears perk up.

GRIFFIN: In a sense it does make my ears perk up. I think there has to be a great deal of skepticism, because what did he train in? This guy was a complete dunce when it came to pulling this thing off. I don't know what kind of training he got other than this is the exact wrong way to pull something off and get away with it. I don't know what the training was.

SANCHEZ: By the way, we'll hear from the White House in a moment and they'll probably be answering questions like the ones we're discussing right now as we get more information on this. We were told they're a minute away from starting that White House briefing. And two big subjects are going to be coming up, obviously this situation with Faisal Shahzad, the suspect. And then, of course, what's going on in the Gulf of Mexico.

Drew, do you have any sense at this point whether or not this guy had any kind of accomplice in this case? I know you mentioned there are a couple people on the plane that had nothing to do with it, but could he have put all this stuff together? What are your sources saying?

GRIFFIN: You know, Rick, quite frankly I think that's where the confusion is, because one source will tell me his hunch is yes, there were accomplices, and the next one will say no.

So the short and safe answer is I simply do not have any direction one way or another. Common sense seems to think he couldn't do it alone, but then again there's nobody else coming forward and they're all over this guy.

So they'll have to look at the forensics, anybody's fingerprints, any other human remains. That sounds kind of bizarre, but was there a fingerprint, a hair fiber of somebody else in that car? Did somebody else buy the propane? These are the things they'll be looking at.

But right now, I don't see any indication that they're out trying to find somebody else.

SANCHEZ: Well, we'll move with the story as it moves us. We thank you so much, Drew. I know you got some of the best sources on CNN. My thanks to you for reaching out and sharing the very latest information on that.

Here's what we're going to do. We're planning to come back and when we do, as promised, the White House briefing will begin. Obviously today is the kind of day when the White House briefing takes place. We go there because there will be a lot of news made there.

Stay right there. You're watching your national conversation. This is your list as well. This is "RICK'S LIST." We'll be right back.

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