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Rick's List
Interview With Former White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer; Liberty Bell White Powder Scare; Rand Paul's Controversial Views
Aired May 20, 2010 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: There's a list of breaking news stories that we have followed for you over the last hour. We have been packed with developing stories. I know you have been going along for the ride, as you always do here every day.
Number one: a bag of suspicious white powder found near the Liberty Bell in Philadelphia. Susan Candiotti just brought you up to date on that one.
Number two, we're following a deadly police shooting in West Memphis, Arkansas, among the victims, a police chief's son.
Number three, the White House reacts to our questions about a backroom deal to keep Joe Sestak out of the Pennsylvania Senate primary race -- the race he won, by the way -- after questions I asked him here on the air yesterday.
And number four, we're keeping an eye on that threatening situation in Texas. Have you seen those pictures? If it becomes severe, we're going to be all over this one. Chad's keeping an eye on it, as well as he's keeping an eye on what's going on in the Gulf of Mexico.
And, finally, we are standing by for President Obama's live statement on Wall Street reform -- all breaking, all important. We will take you there to all of these stories, and these as well:
(LAUGHTER)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ (voice-over): OK, here's what's making the LIST today.
RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY SENATORIAL CANDIDATE: Capitalism is freedom. It means the freedom to voluntarily exchange goods and retain the fruits of your labor.
SANCHEZ: New Republican nominee Rand Paul disagrees with part of the U.S. Civil Rights Act, suggesting a private businessperson should be allowed to discriminate -- his full explanation coming up.
He said he served in Vietnam.
RICHARD BLUMENTHAL (D), CONNECTICUT ATTORNEY GENERAL: I may have misspoken. I did misspeak.
SANCHEZ: Why didn't he just say, "I screwed up"? And why didn't an aide back him off of it? Former White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer joins me live.
This is not a sheen, and it's onshore. How did it get past the booms?
GOV. BOBBY JINDAL (R), LOUISIANA: Unfortunately, the day that we have been fearing is upon us today.
SANCHEZ: Is BP trying to hide the truth?
And is that a baby? Hit the brakes!
The lists you need to know about. Who's today's most intriguing? Who's landed on the list you don't want to be on? Who's making news on Twitter? It's why I keep a list.
Pioneering tomorrow's cutting-edge news right now.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: Boy, I -- there's so many breaking news stories right now, that I -- I am not quite sure which one to bring you up to date on, but let's start with the last first, the situation in Philadelphia, at the Liberty Bell, or in that museum where it's encased.
We understand that a white powder has been found near the Liberty Bell in Philadelphia. And the entire area has been cordoned off, and police officers have moved in and taken all the tourists at least several blocks away, while they continue to investigate what it is that is happening there.
Our own Susan Candiotti joined us just moments ago, and she was bringing us up to date. And she's joining us now live once again to bring us an update, so we can try and figure out what it is that they saw there.
Of course, any time you talk about a suspicious white powder, people immediately think of anthrax.
What's the situation right now there, Susan?
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Rick, I just got off the phone with the FBI, and they tell me that they have conducted field tests so far, along with the -- the bomb squad, the police and fire departments there. The substance, the white substance, is testing negative, has tested negative --
SANCHEZ: OK.
CANDIOTTI: -- for an explosive substance, as well as for anything that's radiological. However, they did get an initial positive test for something that's organic. Now, what could be organic? Well, of course, anthrax is organic. They're not saying that that's what this is.
SANCHEZ: Hmm.
CANDIOTTI: They're just making initial tests to try to determine what it is. All they know right now is that it's some kind of organic substance.
SANCHEZ: And the situation --
CANDIOTTI: They --
SANCHEZ: -- there on the ground, have they -- have they still -- are they still keeping people at bay, away from the scene?
CANDIOTTI: Status quo --
SANCHEZ: Yes.
CANDIOTTI: -- status quo at this time, that's right.
It was a security guard that found this balloon near the Liberty Bell building, and that's what touched off all of this. So, it was an alert security guard who noticed this. And, so, they still have people -- it was located near the entrance to the Liberty Bell building.
And, so, as a precaution, naturally, they moved everybody away from the area while they try to figure this out.
SANCHEZ: Some kind of organic material, but they're not able to pinpoint exactly what it is at this point.
Susan Candiotti, my thanks to you. If you get anything else, let us know.
Also happening right now, I want you to take a look at this. These are police -- police officers in action. As you see the video, you are going to be amazed as we were when we watched this happen. They are firing their weapons into a van. Inside, they believe, are two men who killed two police officers earlier in the day.
This is West Memphis, Arkansas, just -- just across the border from Tennessee. In other words, Memphis is in Tennessee. West Memphis is in Arkansas. It's a shoot-out, I mean, a wild shoot-out. We know now that police did kill those two suspects in this white van. That's brand-new information.
Here's what we're told. Officers performed a traffic stop on this van with an out-of-state tag. Suddenly, gunshots started ringing out in both directions. The two officers were killed. Suspects fled, caught by sheriff's deputies. So, you have two dead police officers from West Memphis. That gun battle followed after the two officers were killed with the sheriff's deputies who arrived on the scene. And I should tell you this. Interestingly enough, one of the officers that's killed, one of the officers that's killed, he's the son of the West Memphis police chief. The police chief's own son was one of the officers that originally responded to the traffic stop and was killed on the scene. The -- the pictures have been amazing to watch.
Here's what a Memphis police spokesman told reporters just a little while ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY GODWIN, DIRECTOR, MEMPHIS, TENNESSEE, POLICE: It lets us know of what can happen, what can occur at any moment. And the officers put their life on the line each and every single day. And it just -- it -- it tears me up to think about Bobby and what he and his family and the other officer's family are going through.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: We're going to stay on top of that story, as we will the other developing news stories. And as we get more information, I'm going to be sharing it with you.
Now Rand Paul, he tops our political list. He won the Republican nomination for Senate Tuesday night in Kentucky, but he's really a libertarian who ran with the support of the Tea Party, as most people know.
Well, here's why Kentucky's newspaper of record said that they couldn't endorse him -- quote -- let me read this to you -- "The trouble with Dr. Paul is that, despite his independent thinking, much of what he stands for is repulsive to people in the mainstream. For instance, he holds an unacceptable -- unacceptable -- view of civil rights, saying that, while the federal government can enforce integration of government jobs and facilities, private businesspeople should be able to decide whether they want to serve black people or gays or any other minority group."
All right, well, so, what is the editorial board there talking about when they say that? Does Rand Paul really think that businesses, private businesses, not government, but private businesses should have the right to discriminate without any government interference?
Well, here's what he told the paper's editorial board when he sat down with them.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you have voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964?
PAUL: I liked the Civil Rights Act in the sense that it ended discrimination in all public domains, and I'm all in favor of that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But?
(LAUGHTER)
PAUL: You had to ask me the but. I don't like the idea of telling private business owners -- I abhor racism. I think it's a bad business decision to ever exclude anybody from your restaurant.
But, at the same time, I do believe in private ownership. But I think there should be absolutely no discrimination in anything that gets any public funding, and that's most of what the Civil Rights Act was about, to my mind.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: All right. It's important to also note that that's not the only time that Paul has gone on the record with these views. I want you to listen to him on NPR yesterday.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP, NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have said that business should have the right to refuse service to anyone and that the Americans With Disabilities Act, the ADA, was an overreach by the federal government. Would you say the same, by extension, of the 1964 Civil Rights Act?
PAUL: What I have always said is that I'm opposed to institutional racism, and I would have, had I been alive at the time, I think, had the courage to march with Martin Luther King to overturn institutional racism, and I see no place in our society for institutional racism.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But are you saying that, had you been around at the time, you would have hoped that you would have marched with Martin Luther King, but voted with Barry Goldwater against the 1964 Civil Rights Act?
PAUL: Well, actually, I think it's confusing on a lot of cases with what's actually was in the civil rights case, because, see, a lot of the things that actually were in the bill I'm in favor of. I'm in favor of everything with regards to ending institutional racism.
So, I think there's a lot to be desired in the Civil Rights -- and to tell you the truth, I haven't really read all through it, because it was passed 40 years ago and hadn't been a real pressing issue in the campaign on whether I'm going to vote for the Civil Rights Act.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But it's been one of the major developments in American history in the course of your life. I mean, do you think the '64 Civil Rights Act or the ADA for that matter were just overreaches and that businesses shouldn't be bothered by people with a basis in law to sue them for redress?
PAUL: Right. I think a lot of things could be handled locally.
For example, I think that we should try to do everything we can to allow for people with disabilities and handicaps. You know, we do it in our office with wheelchair ramps and things like that.
I think, if you have a two-story office and you hire someone who's handicapped, it might be reasonable to let them have an office on the first floor, rather than the government saying you have to have a $100,000 elevator.
And I think, when you get to solutions like that, the more local the better, and the more commonsense the decisions are, rather than having a federal government make those decisions.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: So, what he's saying, it seems, is that the government can't mandate someone to not discriminate.
Robert Zimmerman is a Democratic strategist. Ron Christie is the former domestic policy adviser to Bush and Cheney.
Gentlemen, this is going to be pretty simple.
Ron, I'm obviously going to want to know for this, from you, what effect this is going to have on the Republican Party. Did the Republican Party, who, by the way, had somebody else nominated in Kentucky -- but they have got this guy now. They own him. Are they biting off more than they can chew? Will this be bad for the Republican Party, and what are the Dems going to do?
Gentlemen, stay right there. I want you to answer these questions for us as soon as we come back from this break. Stay right there.
This is RICK'S LIST.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Rand Paul essentially says that, look, the government has a right to tell people not to discriminate when it comes to public facilities or government facilities, but, if you're a businessman, you own your own place, you have a right to decide who you want to allow in and who you don't want to allow in, and you're allowed to set your own policies.
It is -- it is very different from what the law says, and that's important as well. But that's his point of view.
Joining us now, Robert Zimmerman, Democratic strategist, and Ron Christie on the other side.
Ron, I want to begin with you.
Look, he's the Republican nominee. Is this now a problem for the Republican Party, given that he's saying something like this, which is bound to attract a lot of noise?
RON CHRISTIE, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT BUSH: It could be, Rick, but not yet. Look, I think Rand Paul needs to hire both a lawyer and a historian.
(LAUGHTER)
CHRISTIE: The United States has struggled for over 100 years to try to figure out how to enforce the Civil Rights Act and how to make sure that all people in this country are treated equally.
It was a case in 1964, and it specifically dealt with a restaurant called Ollie's Barbecue in Birmingham, Alabama, called --
SANCHEZ: Mm-hmm.
CHRISTIE: -- called Katzenbach v. McClung.
The Supreme Court of the United States held 9-0 that you are not allowed to discriminate against black people based on the color of their skin. Rand Paul needs to get a lawyer and a historian. He better do it pretty quickly, because the Democrats could seize on this and it would be political hay for him.
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: You know, Ron -- Ron -- you know, Ron, Rand Paul doesn't need a lawyer and a historian. What he and the Republican Party need are a conscience.
This issue is so beyond partisan talking points, because I have to tell you, I serve as a Democratic National Committeeman, as you know, the governing body of my party. And if we nominated a candidate who did not stand up for the Civil Rights Act of 1964 or the Americans For Disabilities Act, I would be publicly opposed to that nominee, no questions asked.
It's inexcusable. And the fact that the Republican Party leadership continues to support this individual, despite this -- his unconscionable and disgraceful positions on not just the laws of our land, but issues that speak to the very decency and values of our Constitution and our democracy, I think really says this issue's going to have far-reaching implications, much broader than just Kentucky.
SANCHEZ: OK. Ron --
ZIMMERMAN: Rand Paul could unite the -- could represent the Republican Party of the future.
SANCHEZ: Robert, let's let Ron respond. I mean, essentially, he's doing the throwdown for you, Ron.
ZIMMERMAN: OK.
SANCHEZ: He's saying, look, why don't you just stand up and say, we should kick this guy out, we should find somebody else?
Can you do that?
CHRISTIE: Well, I love Robert Zimmerman, but I'm not going to take his hyperbole here.
Look, Trey Grayson was the preferred candidate for the Republican Party. Rand Paul came out and said he was a libertarian who was running under the Republican banner. He said these statements. I don't like it.
I was very clear what I said a few moments ago. He needs to get a grip on the history, I don't think that that represents the Republican Party and it represents our views, period.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Ron, is this one of the problems, as some have suggested, with embracing or aligning the GOP to the Tea Party?
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: Well, the GOP is not embracing the Tea Party.
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: The GOP is not aligned with the Tea Party in a political sense.
(CROSSTALK)
ZIMMERMAN: Excuse me. Excuse me, Ron.
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: In the sense that -- Robert, hang on a second. He asked me a question.
(CROSSTALK)
ZIMMERMAN: Excuse me.
CHRISTIE: In the sense here that the Republican Party is for limited government, and it is very much in favor of the fact that individuals around this country are disgusted with the size and the scope of this government -- Rand Paul is one individual. He has spoken out individually. He does not represent the Republican Party.
SANCHEZ: OK, Robert --
CHRISTIE: He just represents himself. He just happened to win in that election.
SANCHEZ: Robert, same question to you.
ZIMMERMAN: Ron, you know how -- Ron, you know I respect you. And I hope our viewers understand the fact I do as well.
But the reality is, it's not that the Republican Party is embracing the Tea Party movement. They're chasing after the Tea Party movement. And, in fact, you saw it now in Utah, in Florida, certainly now in Kentucky, where the Tea Party, in fact, has taken leadership -- Tea Party advocates have taken leadership roles in the Republican Party.
And they, in fact, are defining the Republican Party of the future. That's just a fact. That's the Republican electorate speaking out.
SANCHEZ: Well --
ZIMMERMAN: And I think it speaks to, in fact, the desperation of the Republican Party for not having clear, defined positions and, in fact, not being able to articulate --
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Well, there's a problem. Gentlemen, there's a problem -- there's a problem on the Democratic Party as well.
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: That's absolutely ridiculous.
ZIMMERMAN: You have noticed, Rick --
SANCHEZ: There's a party -- there's a problem with the Democratic Party as well. Well, let me just be straight here.
You got Democratic Senate candidate Richard Blumenthal, who has not come out and said, look, I screwed up when I seemed to imply or suggest or say --
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: -- that I was in Vietnam.
Do you agree, Robert, that he should just -- well, let me just ask you flat-out, what do you do with a guy like this? Because it's kind of -- it's looking embarrassing.
ZIMMERMAN: Well, it's more than embarrassing. It's unconscionable for the attorney general of Connecticut not to have set the record straight with all the misstatements about his military service in the past.
It's unconscionable for him to repeat those mis -- those statements about -- false statements about his military service.
SANCHEZ: Mm-hmm.
ZIMMERMAN: And I think, very frankly, the Democrats of Connecticut have got to make it clear to him that he has to apologize.
And I'm not following the -- by the way, I'm differentiating -- deferring myself from many of Democrat -- many of the Democratic pundits who are following the party talking points. He did not vindicate himself in that press conference. SANCHEZ: Right.
ZIMMERMAN: Quite to the contrary, I think he made it worse by not saying: I made a mistake. I apologize for what I did.
SANCHEZ: Interesting point.
Ten seconds left to you, Ron. Just finish us out on that one, if you would.
CHRISTIE: Well, those weren't misstatements. He lied. He lied repeatedly.
I think it's honorable that he was a Marine Reservist. He lied. He tried to embellish his record. It denigrates the service of the 58,000 service men and women who lost their lives.
ZIMMERMAN: But you -- but you know something, Ron? But --
CHRISTIE: And I think he needs to go.
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: I think -- Robert, I think he needs to go. He lied, period.
ZIMMERMAN: But you know something, Ron? I think you're right. Democrats cannot give him a pass, in the same way Republicans should not be giving Ron Paul a pass.
SANCHEZ: We will leave it at that. It's Rand Paul, by the way.
CHRISTIE: Well, we're talking about two different things.
SANCHEZ: It's Rand Paul, not Ron Paul.
ZIMMERMAN: Rand Paul. Excuse me.
SANCHEZ: That's OK, Robert.
ZIMMERMAN: OK.
SANCHEZ: Robert, Ron, my thanks to both of you, by the way.
(LAUGHTER)
SANCHEZ: We have got --
ZIMMERMAN: Thank you.
CHRISTIE: Take care.
SANCHEZ: -- the president of the United States coming up in a little bit, and we're going to take you to what he has to say about financial reform. Also, take a look at this video, if you would. Those are new dramatic pictures of how the disaster in the Gulf actually started, as the ball of fire one witness called hell on earth actually exploded, in the moment.
Also, what's got this next Tea Party leader so mad that he said Islam terrorists worship monkey gods? Monkey gods? He also called all Muslims a cult. There's a place on our list for people who say things like that, and that's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: I have got some pictures to show you now that you probably have not yet seen. These are pictures of the oil disaster at the very moment that it became an oil disaster. This is cool.
Roll it, Rog. That's when everyone kind of held their breath and said: Oh, no. I hope something worse doesn't happen a mile below the surface.
And it did, 5,000 feet. Look at that inferno, amazing video. It was released just today, and brand-new to CNN, taken in the first hours of the fire that wiped out the -- the Deepwater Horizon rig. Now, how in the world do you fight a fire like that, firefighters and boats up against what looks like an insurmountable challenge?
This was, of course, before the entire rig just collapsed into the sea, when they thought that they stood a chance of being somehow able to save it. Now, watch for a second and listen carefully here. The National Geographic Channel was kind enough to let us show you some of these pictures.
We have put together a special on the disaster. It's called "Gulf Oil Spill," and it will run next week.
Meanwhile, I should tell you the president of the United States is going to be coming out any moment now. He's going to be -- come back to me, if you would, Rog. I'm sorry. It's my -- my mistake. I just wanted to let the viewers know that there's something going on at the White House. It -- it appears, folks, like the financial reform will move on to debate, that the stoppage or the filibuster has possibly been averted by the new senator from the state of Massachusetts, interestingly enough, a Republican, who has stepped forward and joined ranks with the Democrats, at least for this one issue, to move the debate along.
There, you're seeing live pictures of the White House. As soon as the president comes out, we are going to -- we're going to take that live. You see the podium is already set up. As soon as we see some movement, we will take you to this story.
Meanwhile -- now, Rog, go ahead and hit that sound, if you would.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was planned. It's not like they just all of a sudden started cutting paper there in the field there or something. They brought them. They brought the cards with them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: A high school soccer team accused of racism after what it did with a pile of green cards after the big game, throwing green cards on the field, as if to mock the Hispanic students on the other school.
Also, look out, there's a baby in the street. And the bus is headed right for it. We're all over that story as well. That's next. Stay there. We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Every now and then, you see something that just kind of makes your jaw drop. Time for that type of moment. This is our video list. We call it "Fotos."
San Antonio, Texas. OK, let's say you're taking the bus home after a late shift. What do you not expect to see in the street? How about a baby? A baby? That's right, a 14-month-old child in the middle of the road in the middle of the night. The father swooped in and scooped up the little girl, who was not hurt, but the family's in trouble over the incident and is fighting now to keep the child.
Speaking of surprises in the street, how's this for a road hazard? Amazing pictures. It almost looks like it was Photoshopped, but these pictures are real. It's a sinkhole in Tennessee. Look at that huge section right there of road it swallowed up from a giant sinkhole to a giant demolition.
Wait for it. And there it goes. That's a giant piece of Giants Stadium being demolished, the press box, to be exact. And you notice I didn't say, "Down goes Frazier"? I didn't say it. "Down goes" -- no. The Jets and the Giants will move in a brand, spanking-new stadium next door.
By the way, you can see all of our best pics -- we call it "Fotos" -- on my blog. It's called CNN.com/ricksanchez.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLUMENTHAL: I will not allow anyone to take a few misplaced words and impugn my record of service to our country.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Just a few misplaced words about fighting in Vietnam, despite the fact he was never in Vietnam.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLUMENTHAL: Thank you, Jean (ph), and thank you --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: It tops our embattled politicians list. In fact, he's way up there on the list. He's been caught in what most people describe, as you just heard in our previous segment, a lie.
So, why didn't he just say, "I messed up"? And why didn't somebody on his staff, his family, a friend, anybody, pull him aside and say, "Please stop saying that; you're going to get yourself in trouble"?
This didn't start overnight, folks.
Ari Fleischer -- Remember him? -- made a career of keeping politicians on-message and out of trouble. Well, he's on our LIST. He's joining me next. He's going to take us through the thinking on this story.
We will be right back with Ari and possibly the president of the United States.
That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Here we go with the story that won't go away, because, well, maybe it wasn't handled all that well.
On the political fallout list today, Connecticut Democratic Senate candidate Richard Blumenthal. He's in damage control mode, no doubt, after "The New York Times" reported on numerous claims that he's made over the years about his service in Vietnam. He never actually went to Vietnam.
He says, look, I just misspoke. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLUMENTHAL: On a few occasions I have misspoken about my service, and I regret that, and I take full responsibility. But I will not allow --
(APPLAUSE)
I will not allow anyone to take a few misplaced words and impugn my record of service to our country.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Amen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: All right. We've just gotten the two-minute warning for the president, so let's just bring Ari Fleischer in before we get too deep in the weeds on this.
I think most people understand this story. Do you think, Ari, that he should have been a little bit different in his comport amount at that news conference? Because it seemed to me like he was all but defensive for even being accused of saying something which seems to most of us to have been a lie.
ARI FLEISCHER, FMR. WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Well, I think a normal person would have just apologized. But I think he also realized if he apologized, it might have fatally wounded his candidacy. And he appears to be the type of candidate who will just say what he needs to get through the night.
The good news for Richard Blumenthal is he's running in Connecticut, with a huge Democratic majority. The bad news is this is the absolutely wrong cycle to engage in that kind of behavior.
If he was a ship headed toward port, he's got a big hole in him right now. He's taking on water. He's lucky he's got such friendly water around him in a Democrat state. Linda McMahon is probably going to be his opponent, and I have a feeling this is going to be a very close race now.
SANCHEZ: Speaking of friends, where were they? I've been looking at some of the past articles written about him in Connecticut, where they glowingly talked about his Vietnam experience. This one goes back to 1986, where they said that.
If they wrote a story about you, Ari Fleischer, playing for the 1972 Dolphins and getting a handshake from Don Shula because you won the Super Bowl, would you not call the newspaper and say, hey, I wish that were true, but I didn't play for the 1972 Dolphins?
FLEISCHER: No. And your point, Rick, illustrates why he probably was saying these things deliberately. He wanted to create that impression, he wanted to create the aura, which is slimy.
This is the type of thing that people in politics do when they want to paint the picture that they want the public to have, even if it's a false picture. And that's damaging, especially for an attorney general who's running for higher office.
SANCHEZ: Where were the people who should have stopped him and said, Mr. Attorney General -- oh, we got the president.
Ari, can you just stick around for a moment? Do you mind?
FLEISCHER: I will.
SANCHEZ: You remember when you used to do this. Here's the president.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: -- vote on financial reform in the Senate today. I've said many times that the recession we're emerging from was primarily caused by a lack of responsibility and accountability from Wall Street to Washington.
It's part of the reason our economy nearly collapsed. It's what led to countless home foreclosures, the failure of community banks and small businesses, and a cascade of job losses that have left millions of Americans out of work. And that's why I made the passage of Wall Street reform one of my top priorities as president, so that a crisis like this does not happen again.
Over the last year, the financial industry has repeatedly tried to end this reform with hoards of lobbyists and millions of dollars in ads. And when they couldn't kill it, they tried to water it down with special interest loopholes and carve-outs aimed at undermining real change.
Today, I think it's fair to say that these efforts have failed. Today, Democrats and a handful of Republicans in the Senate have voted to break the filibuster and allow a final debate and vote on financial reform, reform that will protect consumers, protect our economy, and hold Wall Street accountable.
I want to thank Senator Chris Dodd and Majority Leader Reid for their leadership on this legislation, as well as all the senators who put partisan posturing aside in allowing a vote on this important reform. And I want to thank every American who kept the pressure on Washington to change a system that worked better for banks on Wall Street than it did for families on Main Street.
Now, we've still got some work to do. Soon we're going to have a final vote in the Senate, and then the House and the Senate will have to iron out the differences between the two bills. And there's no doubt that during that time, the financial industry and their lobbyists will keep on fighting. But I will ensure that we arrive at a final product that is both effective and responsible, one that holds Wall Street to high standards of accountability and secures financial stability, while preserving the strength and crucial functions of a financial industry that is central to our prosperity and our ability to innovate and compete in a global economy.
Our goal is not to punish the banks, but to protect the larger economy and the American people from the kind of upheavals that we've seen in the past few years. And today's action was a major step forward in achieving that goal.
Because of Wall Street reform, we'll soon have in place the strongest consumer protections in history. If you've ever applied for a credit card, a student loan, or a mortgage, you know the feeling of signing your name to pages of barely understandable fine print. It's a big step for most families, but one that's often filled with unnecessary confusion and apprehension.
As a result, many Americans are simply duped into hidden fees and loans that they can't afford by companies that know exactly what they're doing. Those days will soon end.
From now on, every consumer will be empowered with the clear and concise information that you need to make financial decisions that are best for you. This bill will crack down on predatory practices and unscrupulous mortgage lenders. It will enforce the new credit card law we passed banning unfair rate hikes and ensure that folks aren't unwittingly caught by overdraft fees when they sign up for a checking account.
It will give students who take out college loans information and make sure lenders don't cheat the system. And it will ensure that every American receives a free credit score if they are denied a loan or insurance because of that score.
Because of financial reform, the American people will never again be asked to foot the bill for Wall Street's mistakes. There will be no more taxpayer-funded bailouts, period. If a large financial institution should ever fail, we will have the tools to wind it down without endangering the broader economy, and there will be new rules to prevent financial institutions from becoming too big to fail in the first place so that we don't have another AIG.
Because of reform, the kinds of complex backroom deals that helped trigger the financial crisis will finally be brought to the light of day. And from now on, shareholders will have greater say on the pay of CEOs and other executives so that they can reward success instead of failure and help change the perverse incentives that encouraged so much reckless risk-taking in the first place.
So, in short, Wall Street reform will bring greater security to folks on Main Street, to families who are looking to buy their first car or their first home, to taxpayers who shouldn't have to pay for somebody else's irresponsibility, to small businesses and community banks who play by the rules, and to shareholders and investors who want to see their companies grow and thrive. But let me stress that this is not a zero-sum game where Wall Street loses and Main Street wins.
As we've learned in today's economy, we're all connected. When the economy prospers, we all win. When the financial sector operates under sound rules of the road to ensure fairness and stability, we all win.
Every American has an interest in a healthy financial sector. But for that reason, it's also imperative that those in Wall Street boardrooms and on trading floors be held responsible for the decisions that they make, for behind every dollar traded or leveraged on Wall Street, there's a family looking to buy a House, pay for an education, open a business, or save for retirement.
And the reform I sign will not stifle the power of the free market. It will simply bring predictable, responsible, sensible rules into the marketplace. Unless your business model is based on bilking your customers and skirting the law, you should have nothing to fear from this legislation.
As we continue to emerge from this recession, this reform is one important step that will strengthen our economy. And despite the ups and downs associated with a recovery, that economy is getting stronger by the day. It's an economy that's growing again.
Last month, we added jobs, the fourth straight month of job growth and the largest increase in four years. And we're working closely with our G-20 partners around the world to ensure that growth is balanced and sustained.
I also said when I took office that we can't simply rebuild this economy on the same pile of sand, on maxed-out credit cards or housing bubbles or reckless risk-taking on Wall Street. We're going to have to build it on a firmer, stronger foundation for economic growth.
That's why we invested in renewable energies that currently have the potential of creating new jobs all across America. That's why we're reforming our education system, so that our workers can compete on the global stage. That's why we passed health care reform that will lower costs for families and businesses. And that's why we're about to pass financial regulatory reform, to protect consumers and ensure that we don't have another crisis caused by the irresponsibility of a few.
Along with the steps we're taking to spur innovation and encourage hiring and rein in our deficits, that is how we will ultimately build an economy that is stronger and more prosperous than it was before.
Thanks very much, everybody.
SANCHEZ: There you have the president of the United States talking about the fact that it looks like the financial reform legislation, or at least the debate, will continue. And in large measure, it's because of a Republican, Scott Brown of Massachusetts, who seemed to be the 60th vote who break the impasse so that this can continue.
We are also talking with Ari Fleischer about the situation regarding Richard Blumenthal. Have you heard Richard Blumenthal, who came on yesterday and essentially said -- well, he was almost defiant in his criticism of "The New York Times," for example, and others who are asking why it is that he suggested on many occasions that he went to war in Vietnam and fought in Vietnam.
Here's the question now: Why didn't someone on his staff, his family, someone, come up and say to him, you know, you may not want to be doing this, I've noticed you kept saying this, it's maybe not true?
Ari Fleischer worked for the president of the United States.
At what point do you do that?
Ari's going to answer that question for us when we come back. We're just going to sneak a break in, and hopefully he'll be able to give us some first-person experiences of what it was like in the White House, when maybe he had to deal with something like this. It happens.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Ari Fleischer was, like, the country's anchorman about six or seven years ago. He was, like, in everyone's living room every single day. And he's joining us now live to talk about this perplexing situation for Richard Blumenthal.
And my question stands, Ari, wouldn't you think that somebody would -- I hope somebody does that with me. My executive producer, you know, my wife -- you know, always two women -- they're constantly telling me what I'm doing wrong or what I may want to rethink.
Why didn't somebody, you know, come up to Richard Blumenthal and just whisper in his ear, "You sure you want to say that stuff? Because I checked, you know, it may not be true."
Right?
FLEISCHER: It's the staff's job to do it immediately. But I suspect that the staff didn't know the full truth behind what Richard Blumenthal was saying, or they all bought into it.
It sounded good. It sounded right. So, boy, let's just keep kind of saying and hopefully nothing will happen.
I also have to wonder, where has the Connecticut press corps been for the last 20 years? How come nobody in Connecticut could break this story for a long-standing attorney General?
And this now is where he really get into trouble. If people now start digging and they find a pattern of exaggerating by Richard Blumenthal, that will sink his ship.
This is one big blow, but he might be able to cruise up to port at the end of the election, unless they start to find other issues. And then this is a character issue. This is more than just about Vietnam.
The other thing that's really troubling here for him is I was at a fund-raiser actually last night for the Connecticut Republican Party. And one speaker said that Jane Fonda has spent more time in Vietnam than Richard Blumenthal. Well, when you become the butt of the joke, it's really hard to be a good candidate. And that's what's starting to happen to Richard Blumenthal.
SANCHEZ: Did you ever do deal with a situation like this either with, you know, President Bush, Vice President Cheney, or anyone on the staff where you had to be the tough guy who had to come up with the bad news and say, do you know what, I'm sorry, but I've got to tell you this, and it's not easy to do, but here you go?
FLEISCHER: You know, one of the best parts of my job was I got to give the president advice. And I remember once when the violence started to really increase in Iraq, and the president gave a speech and he was asked about the violence, and he said, "Bring it on. If somebody wants to take on our troops, bring it on."
And said to the president instantly, "Think, Mr. President, about how that will sound to the mother of a soldier or Marine who's fighting for us in Iraq." And he pushed back and he said to me, "All I'm trying to say is I have so much faith in the military." But the point of staff is you instantly try to give your advice -- your boss the best advice possible. And his staff was asleep at the switch, but more importantly, though, is the candidate was running the switch.
This is a real window into who Richard Blumenthal is, and it's a very troubling window. Anybody who would exaggerate, who would lie, who would distort his own record about something you always remember -- you know if you were in Vietnam or not. You know if you were returning from Vietnam and got spit on or not. You don't just --
SANCHEZ: Well, but there's self-denial, too, Ari. There's self- denial.
You know what? There are things that people want so bad -- you know, that was a very difficult time for Americans.
And there's some men -- I've been talking to some psychologists lately who told me that that's one of the most difficult things, because they feel like maybe they didn't do what they should have done, and there's a self-denial going on. And there's a possible -- look, I don't want to get into psychobabble here, because you and I are not psychologists.
FLEISCHER: Yes.
SANCHEZ: But is it possible? Would you give him the benefit of the doubt that he really did misspeak and it didn't really come from a bad place?
FLEISCHER: No, this all has to do with the truth. You easily could have said, well, I served during the Vietnam era. I feel for those soldiers and Marines who returned from Vietnam and they were spit on.
This is not a simple mistake or a misstatement. This is deliberate. You don't talk about returning from Vietnam. You don't say, "I was in Vietnam" unless (INAUDIBLE).
SANCHEZ: Just as we are getting to some of the best parts, we lost him right there.
Ari Fleischer, my thanks to him for joining us and taking us through what the experience was for him, having to deal with politicians and sometimes having to share the information that they don't want to hear.
Brooke Baldwin's up next when we come back on RICK'S LIST.
Stay right there, because that's when the party gets really good.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: I don't think there's any question that one of the most fascinating political stories of the day is Rand Paul. I mean, here's a guy who just won Kentucky, darling of the Tea Party, Republican nominee, kind of a Libertarian, and he comes out and says, essentially, that the U.S. Civil Rights Act, while he agrees with it is in principle, he has problems with the idea that a businessman is told by the government who he can allow into his store or not.
Well, that's essentially what the civil rights law says, you can't discriminate. And he's kind of taking issue with that.
This is fascinating. And do you know who's going to be interviewing Rand Paul? We tried to get him on our show, but thank goodness Wolf Blitzer's got him coming up in just a little bit.
This is a hell of a story, Wolf.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. We're going to try to get clarification on all these sensitive points. He's going to be here in "THE SITUATION ROOM" within the next hour.
And, by the way, tomorrow we're going to interview the Democratic senatorial candidate in Kentucky, Jack Conway. He'll be my guest tomorrow.
But today we wanted to give Rand Paul a chance to clarify, because there's a lot of stuff out there, and he needs quickly, from his own political perspective, to explain to voters in Kentucky, indeed, around the nation, exactly where he stands on these kind of issues.
SANCHEZ: Well, you heard Ron Christie here on this show just a little while ago. Ron Christie's a very loyal Republican. He's also an African-American. And he didn't seem at all happy with Rand Paul. And, in fact, he seems convinced that what Rand Paul's doing is not good for the party either.
I wonder how much pushback he's going to get from the GOP.
BLITZER: Well, it's not just Ron Christie, who used to work for President Bush, who is a good Republican, but John Boehner, the Republican leader in the House of Representatives, the minority leader, says he disagrees with him on this.
There's a lot of nervous Republicans right now. That's why these are critical hours, not days. These are critical hours right now for Rand Paul to explain to the voters out there exactly where he stands. And we're going to give him that shot.
SANCHEZ: Great stuff, Wolf. I'll look forward to watching that interview. And as usual, I guarantee you're going to be good, fair, and you'll get the right questions asked.
BLITZER: Thank you.
SANCHEZ: Listen, Laura Ling's going to be here tomorrow on this newscast. You remember Laura Ling. I was the last reporter she spoke to before she got into that situation in North Korea. And we respected her privacy all this time, but I've asked her to come back.
She's going to join us tomorrow. She's going to take us through her experience. And she's also going to talk to us about this sudden situation that's developed in -- between North Korea and South Korea, where they used one of their subs apparently to sink a South Korean ship. What now?
And Brooke Baldwin's coming up in just a little bit. She's going to take us through her stories as well. Look forward to it.
Brooke, I imagine everything you have is fantastic.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fascinating.
SANCHEZ: Fascinating.
BALDWIN: Fascinating.
SANCHEZ: Good.
We'll have the fascination for you in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: These are the topics that are trending. And Brooke Baldwin follows them for you.
What have you got?
BALDWIN: All right. I know you've been rocking and rolling here. Let me get to these two. I have two topics on my list today.
SANCHEZ: Go.
BALDWIN: First, the question is, is "I'm sorry" good enough? We have the state boys (ph) soccer championship.
Taking you to Nebraska for this story of two teams, Lincoln East High School -- which, by the way, is 88 percent white -- taking on Omaha South High school, 66 percent Hispanic. Well, Lincoln East wins. Students rush out on the field. There they go.
But that's not all. You see they're tossing something up in the air in celebration.
SANCHEZ: Hmm.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MANUEL LIRA, OMAHA SOUTH HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: I thought it was confetti. But once I got -- I saw it close up, I saw that it was green cards.
It was planned. It's not like they just all of a sudden started cutting paper there in the field or something. They brought them. They brought the cards with them. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: The students were tossing green cards, if you missed that.
So I reached out to the principal of the winning team with the students tossing the cards, Lincoln East, and said the school was "disappointed and disgusted" by the actions of a few students. Those students who distributed the green cards, by the way, have been suspended. Their return to school is pending, and I was told lots of letters of apology now heading out there.
SANCHEZ: Kids would be kids, you know, but that's something --
BALDWIN: Not a joke.
SANCHEZ: -- that just doesn't seem right.
What else you got?
BALDWIN: List number two, Lance Armstrong again having to defend himself against claims he used performance-enhancing drugs. But this time it's coming from disgraced cyclist Floyd Landis, who surprised everybody by admitting he used these performance-enhancing drugs after years of denying it.
Well, Landis then tried to throw seven-time Tour de France winner Lance Armstrong under the bike, if you will. All of this in e-mails Landis reportedly sent to cycling and anti-doping officials.
But Armstrong -- we were all watching the TV. We were watching him as he got mobbed, really, by reporters, camera crews, when he got off his bus for the fifth stage of the tour of California. And he says Landis has been threatening him for a long time.
Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LANCE ARMSTRONG, TOUR DE FRANCE WINNER: Finally, a year or so ago, I told him -- I said, listen, "You do what you have to do. We're not going to -- we have nothing to say. We have nothing to hide."
The allegations, the specific claims, they're not even worth getting into. I'm not going to waste your time or my time. I think history speaks for itself here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Wow.
BALDWIN: Yes, wow is right.
SANCHEZ: A cat fight.
BALDWIN: International Cycling Union President Pat McQuaid tells us, Landis' accusation just seems to be "one last roll of the dice from a very desperate man."
Landis won the 2006 Tour de France. He was stripped of the title after he tested positive for testosterone. He spent years fighting the allegation. He still had maintained the testosterone test was inaccurate. He says he used human growth hormones but not testosterone during that time.
By the way, not long after talking to the press, Armstrong and teammate Jose Luis Chechu Rubiera crashed at the Tour of California. The crash is described as huge.
Look at these pictures. This is just what we've gotten in here at CNN.
SANCHEZ: Oh!
BALDWIN: A nasty mess, nasty face.
SANCHEZ: Is that blood?
BALDWIN: That is a gash under his left eye. Armstrong -- got an e-mail from someone. He's been seen by doctors. He had an elbow injury.
You saw the cut under the eye. That will leave a mark. Ouch.
SANCHEZ: Well, you know, it's interesting. We've seen two athletes now who are embroiled in controversies, and then soon after they start their sport again something -- I mean, Tiger Woods hasn't exactly been the greatest golfer in the world since his situation.
BALDWIN: Right.
SANCHEZ: He's embroiled in this. Talks to the media, turns around, then gets in a biking accident. You wonder if focus sometimes -- just a question.
BALDWIN: I don't know.
SANCHEZ: Not an allegation.
BALDWIN: But it's tough for Armstrong and all these other guys to be taken down by Landis.
SANCHEZ: That's amazing.
BALDWIN: They saying not there.
SANCHEZ: Good list. Good stuff. Appreciate your time, as usual.
BALDWIN: Thank you. Thanks for having me.
SANCHEZ: Wolf Blitzer, you know him.
BALDWIN: Yes, I do. SANCHEZ: He's standing by.
Toss it to him. Will you?
BALDWIN: Wolf Blitzer, to you.
SANCHEZ: There you go.
