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Rick's List
Website Wikileaks Publishes Classified Documents About War In Afghanistan; Simon Cowell Being Sued; Conservative Argues Bush Tax Cuts Shouldn't Be Allowed To Expire
Aired July 26, 2010 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Here is what is making THE LIST tonight:
The bombshell out of Afghanistan: insurgents used stinger missiles, dead civilians, the Iran connection, the Pakistan connection. Why didn't we know these things?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JULIAN ASSANGE, WIKILEAKS: I've really only just scratched the surface.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: The WikiLeaks, what is it? We take you through it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TONY HAYWARD, BP CEO: You know, I'd like my life back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: The PR disaster that is BP may claim its biggest victim. Is Tony Hayward out?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you want a good service, you deserve to get a good man.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Yes, but do you need a $400,000-plus-a-year police chief? And how about a city manager that makes almost double?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: How do you justify $800,000?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: There is a city council meeting tonight. Will the mayor step down?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You're taking our money and you're paying each other!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: We continue on the story we brought to the nation's attention.
Who is suing Simon Cowell and why?
Why is this woman walking out in front of an oncoming train? She can't see. What happens next?
The lists you need to know about. Who's today's most intriguing? Who's landed on the list you don't want to be on? Who's making news on Twitter?
It's why I keep a list -- pioneering tomorrow's cutting-edge news right now.
(MUSIC)
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back, everyone. I'm Rick Sanchez. This is your list, RICK'S LIST.
I want you to know that you can do whatever it is you want with the information that's contained in these documents. But you probably should know what's contained in these documents. You will, in many cases, not believe what we are learning today as we go through these. It involves secret military documents posted online that present a bleak picture of America's war in Afghanistan. There's probably no other way to express that.
I've been looking into this story, sorting through the mountains of material that is suddenly available seemingly out of nowhere.
Overnight, the Web site WikiLeaks -- that's a Web site that allows people to give them information that they have learned that they believe is true and verifiable. WikiLeaks does that, gets information from regular people like you if you have something and they post it. They posted tens of thousands of classified military reports online for all to read. This is information usually the public is not allowed to see.
So, I want to do this for you today: I'm going to drill down and try and show you exactly what is in the reports in as simple a term as we can put it for you. And for transparency's sake, I want you to know this: WikiLeaks handed these documents to three newspapers -- because, I know, I keep using that word WikiLeaks. It sounds like a child's book or something. No, it's a legitimate Web site. But they are not -- they don't publish information. They're not a news- gathering information. They just get the information. And then after they get it, they say, well, what do I do with it now?
Well, they gave it to three newspapers, all right? They gave it to "The Guardian," out of England. They gave to, what, "Der Spiegel," right, out of Germany. And they also gave it in the United States to "The New York Times." To allow those newspapers to try to comb through the mountain of data that they had.
The papers agreed not to print the story until now. "The New York Times" was one of those newspapers that we have been using to get much of the information that we will share.
So, let's start now with number one on this list. Are you ready? This is interesting.
The Taliban, did you know, may have used portable -- as in shoulder-harnessed -- heat-seeking missiles to bring down American aircraft. The militaries never copped to this. They've never talked about this. Those are shoulder-mounted devices like these that you see right there. An American C-47, or a Chinook as it's often called -- it's a transport helicopter -- was struck shortly after taking off.
Now, here's what's interesting that we get from these reports. I want to take you through this as carefully as I possibly can. "Multiple witnesses saw the smoke trail behind the missile as it rushed toward the helicopter." You follow? This smoke trail is an important indicator. Rocket-propelled grenades do not leave them. Heat-seeking missiles do.
The crew of other helicopters reported the downing as a surface-to-air missile strike. That would be important, right? That would be -- why would that be important? Well, that's important because remember when the Russians were fighting against Afghanistan, remember the mujahedeen, remember how most of the stories say the Russians finally gave up on that war -- why? Because of the stinger missiles, because so many of their helicopters and so many of their aviation, their aircraft was being brought down by stinger missiles. Some guy hiding in a cave, boom, shooting these down.
So, are these now being used against our guy, our gals? That's not the public story, by the way, but a NATO spokesman was putting out at the time that this happened. This is important.
Let me give you a quote from "The Times." We got that up? Here it is:
"Clearly, there were enemy fighters in the area," said the spokesperson, his name is Major John Thompson. "It's not impossible for small-arms fire to bring down a helicopter."
So, that statement makes it sound, in fact, like -- that was not a heat heat-seeking missile. It was a guy with small-arms fire, whatever that is. That's an important distinction.
Now, I want to take you into another area that we're learning from this, that I think Americans in general should probably be aware of. This concerns threats that are being made against Afghan national army brigade commanders -- these are guys that are supposed to be working with the allies, with the United States troops, working alongside us. But you would not believe the pressure that they're under to turn down what would seem to most people something that would be very tempting, especially in southern Afghanistan. They're being offered by the Taliban big bucks to turn their backs on the United States and on the allies.
Let me give you an example of this. This is a commander Jamaladin, he receives a phone call, all right? Phone call from Taliban commander Mullah Ezat, all right? So, here's -- again, here's a Taliban guy calling one of our guys or one of the guys that's supposed to be working with us, right?
So, Mullah Ezat tells the ANA commander, all right, Afghan National Army commander, to surrender and he offers him $100,000 to quit working -- to quit working for the Afghan army. Ezat also stated that he knows where the ANA CDR commander is from and knows his family.
So, maybe he's threatening him there. Either you take the $100,000 or something else might happen. A commander called the number that Mullah Ezat had called from, but there was no answer.
These are just of the pieces of information that we're learning from this that we are going to be taking you through. Here's another one.
Robert, come on over here if you possibly can.
I just want to go through some of the information in here that I think is important for all of us to go through. And I'll only give you this piecemeal because we're working -- look, there are thousands and thousands of documents. And I'm going to take you through this as best I can. But it's difficult.
We have people here at CNN still reading through these documents trying to glean the information. But just -- but just at a glance, you see some of the information about the intelligence summary, about how the Taliban recruits.
When I was reading this, I wrote on the side, Maoist recruitment. It almost sounds like Chairman Mao at the beginning of what happened in China, where they go out and they tell Afghans: look, you need to attack the United States.
They say, they go to funerals, Juma (ph) cried -- Juma is a Taliban -- Juma cried while telling the people an unnamed woman and her baby were killed while the woman was nursing the baby. Finally, he makes his pitch, Juma tells the people they need to be angry at the coalition force, Americans and the Afghan army, and for causing this tragedy and then invites everyone who wants to join to fight, to join the fighters who traveled with him. This is part of the recruitment that's going on.
I'll take you through corruption. I'll take you through how some believe that all the money that the United States and the allies are pouring into Afghanistan -- see here, I wrote, money, money, money -- how all the money that's going in there is actually -- here, look at this quote, "The corrupted government officials are a new concept brought to Afghanistan by the Americans." The oldest member of the group told the civil affairs team, fears that, in fact, we are using so much money in this war that it's creating a mentality there where a lot of the people involved in some of these groups are becoming even more corrupt.
So, that's the overall information. Again, as we continue to go through these documents, and we are by no means finished, nor are most news organizations, we will take you through it. We will bring people on who will be able to give reference and explanation to this and perspective -- and as we do, you will see it over these next couple of hours on my list.
Meanwhile, we've just scratched the surface of the damaging documents. We do plan on actually having a little bit more reaction, things that you might be able to see on the war in Afghanistan in a whole new way. That's ahead.
Now, it looks like -- take a look at this:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HAYWARD: There's no one who wants this thing over more than I do. You know, I'd like my life back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: It looks like Tony Hayward is getting his life back sooner than he thought. How long before he's the ex-head of BP? That's right. How long before he's the ex-head of BP? We're hearing could be today, could be this week. When it happens, you'll hear it. And who's likely to replace him and will he be an American?
Stay with us. This is your list, your national conversation. I'm Rick Sanchez, and we're taking you through it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Ironically, I just told you about the problems that money can sometimes cause in the war effort in Afghanistan -- according to this report we told you a little while ago. Now, how about the problems that money can cause in the United States? This is important.
You heard last week about a city manager making close to $800,000 a year in a city with like 35,000 or 40,000 people; a police chief making upwards of $400,000 a year; and an assistant city manager making upwards of $300,000 a year. Well, people in California are outraged about this. Most would say as well they should be.
And we understand now that the attorney general there, Jerry Brown, is briefing reporters on this. I think he's taking questions. The three people have resigned, by the way. Now people want the mayor to resign as well.
Will charges be filed? What will -- what will happen? Let's listen in for just a little bit.
(INAUDIBLE)
REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE) foundation for fiscal responsibility. There's over 10,000 state workers who make over $100,000 a year. This -- the need to address municipal workers as well.
SANCHEZ: Attorney Jerry Brown --
JERRY BROWN, CALIFORNIA ATTORNEY GENERAL: I'm proposing a -- wait, wait. Hey.
(INAUDIBLE)
BROWN: Can I answer his question? Will you pledge silence for 30 seconds?
REPORTER: I've been doing this for years, sir.
BROWN: OK. I just want to -- I want to just make it so it works. Say your question again.
REPORTER: Municipal employees are big part of the effort of pension reform, as state workers as a vital part.
BROWN: Yes, there should be a cap on these excessive salaries, particularly spiking. And now, we have the example of just the regular employment. We have to take a look at this.
Different cities have different circumstances. And we have a proper allocation between the state and the localities. But I believe reform is needed and I think we can craft some controls that will involve transparency and limitations.
One time when I was governor and I cut back the salaries of the professors, I said, they can make it up in psychic income. I have to say, there's a lot more than psychic income in Bell, California.
SANCHEZ: Well, there you go with Jerry Brown. He's, by the way, running for governor. But we've booked him. He's going to be talking to us today about this situation that has so many people outraged out there.
And you just heard him mention caps, that there should be a cap. Well, we've done a little digging on this here on RICK'S LIST and we found that there was a cap. Now, we're not quite sure why this cap didn't kick in.
But let me read to you from "The Los Angeles Times" here. Are you ready? "State law enacted in 2005 -- state law enacted in 2005 limits the pay of council members in general law cities, a category that includes most cities in southern California. That law was passed in reaction to the high salaries that leaders in Southgate have bestowed upon themselves earlier in the decade."
So, it sounds to me like this issue's been dealt with out there in California one time and they even passed a law to make sure it didn't happen. But it happened anyway.
Look, I'm not an -- I'm not an expert on municipal government nor am I a lawyer. All I know is what I can read to you. And as we ask more questions, we'll be able to get to the bottom of how this city was either grandfathered or bypassed with this law that I read to you just moments ago.
And we're going to stay on this story because I know so many Americans -- especially given the economic times we're all going through -- are very frustrated about this story out of Bell, California, a city with 35,000, 40,000 people paying its city manager upwards of $800,000? And the police chief and the assistant city manager -- and the mayor says he's OK with it. We'll be all over it.
Meanwhile, take a look at this. Top of the hour, follow-up list: the oil disaster in the Gulf, it could take days before drilling resumes on that relief well. Operations were suspended last week due to the bad weather from Tropical Storm Bonnie.
Now, over the weekend, the storm passed and crews and equipment started heading back out to the site. In the end, Bonnie didn't cause much damage. And some local officials complained that the government was overreacting to the storm.
But the man in charge, Admiral Thad Allen, he's saying that he will play the cat-and-mouse game of protecting and removing the equipment for the remainder of the hurricane season.
Now, back to the corporate headquarter story. Here's the news: BP's CEO, Tony Hayward, is still in charge for now.
Here's what's going on, folks. There are reports circulating back and forth out there that Hayward is going to be leaving the company. You may have heard this. Whether he's jumping ship or being pushed off is really unclear right now. But officially, BP is saying that any management change would be announced tomorrow morning when earnings are released.
Now, Hayward has faced lots of criticism over his handling of the disaster but it's some of his public comments that have sparked the outrage. And guess what? We do lists here, right? So I'm going to give you a list of the things that we call "Hayward's greatest hits."
Take the first, Rog.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
HAYWARD: This wasn't our accident. This was a drilling rig operated by another company. It was their people, their systems, their processes. We are responsible not for the accident.
I think the environmental impact of this disaster is likely to have been very, very modest.
There's no one who wants this thing over more than I do. You know, I'd like my life back.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
SANCHEZ: It's modest and he wants his life back.
Now, interestingly enough, do we have the stroll on the beach?
Remember the famous stroll on the beach that took place right here? As a matter of fact, it first aired during our newscast. You were as shocked as the rest of us, as you sent me tweets going: is this guy serious? Look at his comportment, look at his behavior, before one of his first news conference, when this -- when this leak occurred.
Hit it, Rog.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please, please, stand by.
HAYWARD: Look, guys, if you can't go back and stay over there, I'm not going to be able to (INAUDIBLE).
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can we have a press conference (INAUDIBLE)
HAYWARD: We'll come back to you -- we'll come back to you in a second.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, guys, we're going to back to the press briefing right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. We'll do it right over here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everyone go back to the press conference back here now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Kind of like he owns the beach now, huh?
All right. But maybe the most important and the one that he's really received the most heartfelt criticism from many Americans is this: whether Hayward is in charge or not, U.S. senators are going to want to question him about whether BP was involved in the release of a terrorist, a terrorist who was convicted of the 1988 Lockerbie bombing that killed 270 people -- a release that on the surface could be interpreted as a way to curry favor with Libya.
You see, BP had a drilling deal with Libya -- a deal that BP called the biggest financial commitment that an international energy company had ever made. They wanted to drill off the coast of Libya. That's the long and the short of it.
Obviously, as new developments come out on this, as Tony Hayward avails himself of information to either U.S. officials or journalists, we at CNN are committed and will be all over this story, especially here on RICK'S LIST.
Now, this -
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You believe for a week that that was Marlena.
Ultimately, it's the hospital who told my dad.
They came out and said, your daughter is on the second floor and then that's it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Talk about heartbreaking. A family thought that their daughter was critically hurt in a terrible accident. Turns out, they had been sitting with and praying for the wrong girl. Their daughter was actually on the second floor in a morgue. That story is ahead right here.
Also, the strongest immigration law in the country goes into effect this Thursday in Arizona. Can the White House block the law before then? Who likes it? Who doesn't? All that's being said as they count down in Arizona.
Jessica Yellin's in Phoenix. She's at ground zero for the immigration showdown and she's going to be all over this for us on your list, your national conversation, RICK'S LIST. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC)
SANCHEZ: Here we are, another week and suddenly it does seem like there's an awful lot going on, doesn't it? Time for the Yellin List now -- where there's always a lot going on.
We're three days away from -- the toughest immigration law in the country is scheduled to take effect in Arizona. We've got fresh polling this afternoon showing a nationwide majority of Americans are dissatisfied, some are just downright angry about the number of illegal immigrants in the United States.
But that's the emotional toll of the national conversation on immigration and what it's taken so far. But when it comes to policy, what do we do next? What do Americans want to do next?
Most Americans believe that the federal government's focus should be to stop the flow of illegal immigrants into the United States and deport the ones already here instead of a plan that would lead to illegal immigrants becoming legal residents.
Then there's a racial split on this one. Take a look at the numbers here. Most white, Anglo-Saxon Americans want a policy that focuses on deporting illegal immigrants. Most Hispanic-Americans want to plan to legalize those illegal immigrants currently living and working in the United States. That's the national pulse.
But, now, let's take it out to Arizona -- that's ground zero, right? This where it all seems to come from for this heated immigration debate.
Our Jessica Yellin who's live there right now in Phoenix.
Jessica, what is -- Thursday this thing kicks in. Today is Monday. People haven't stopped talking about this around the country since they first introduced it. So, what do you see in there? What's the mood as they anticipate the law new -- the new law actually kicking in?
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Rick, as you can imagine, there's a lot of passion and debate about it here. It's a little different from what you get nationally. You hear people saying on one hand, look, something needs to be done and at least people locally are taking action. That's one point of view.
And then there's also the view within the immigrant communities, both legal and illegal immigrants, who are incredibly angry here. We visited a talk radio show hosted by Carlos Galindo locally, "Straight Talk" is the name of the show. Callers described the feeling, they said it must be what it felt like to live in Germany during the Nazi era, they called the governor a racist. There's a lot of fear.
And a lot of people, more than one called in and saying that they plan to leave the state or friends of theirs plan to leave the state in protest and fear.
Here's a sound bite from the host himself from his show this morning played to local Arizona residents.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GARLOS GALINDO, TALK SHOW HOST, RADIO CASA: They find themselves with a (INAUDIBLE) economy, Latinos in panic mode, immigrants fleeing Arizona, an exodus like never before seen in Arizona. Even during Eisenhower's infamous and offensive operation wetback of the 1950s, we didn't see such aggressive persecution of Latinos. Arizona has successfully turned back the hands of time and upped the ante on the persecution of Hispanics of Mexican descent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
YELLIN: He was referring there, Rick, to a program back in the 1950s where the U.S. rounded up and took back Mexicans that they found living here in the U.S. Now, obviously, there are passions on the other side, too. We will visit with them, but we just wanted to give you, first, a taste of some of the fear in the community here now, Rick.
SANCHEZ: How much weight do we put on these numbers? After all -- I mean, you and I both know that, you know, look, polls are great. But oftentimes, you know, they only give you a cross section of what people are thinking at any particular time. If you asked them if they wanted to get rid of most of us journalist, they probably would be in favor of that as well because they have us right there with new car salesman.
And you look back historically when Americans --
YELLIN: Right.
SANCHEZ: -- have essentially wanted something that wasn't necessarily in the national interest. So, fact that the numbers are -- as I see them here, what, 55 percent support the law, 35 percent oppose it, is that a real reflection of what's going on if you walk the streets of Phoenix or Tucson, for example?
YELLIN: Here -- I want to point out another number. I hate to go back to a poll. But the same poll that shows 55 percent support the law also showed that 62 percent of people in Arizona would like illegal immigrants to be able to stay if they're working and are not criminals, have not committed a crime.
SANCHEZ: Hmm.
YELLIN: Sixty-two percent want illegals -- working illegals to stay and yet 55 percent support the law. What does this tell us? It tells us that people are a lot more conflicted about what should be done. And when you listen to people talking about it here, even folks who say they support the law, many of them also say, Rick, they support it because something needs to be done, nothing's being done --
SANCHEZ: Yes.
YELLIN: -- and they're relieved that some action is being taken.
SANCHEZ: You're absolutely right. And by the way --
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: I think what this says is that -- what I just heard you say is, there's so much nuance with this that often gets overshadowed by extremes on both sides.
YELLIN: Right.
SANCHEZ: And by the way, one more thing, if you look at George Bush's -- George W. Bush's immigration -- comprehensive immigration reform package that he tried to get through when he was in office, it says exactly what that 62 percent seem to say. If you want to stay in this country, you better damn well not have a criminal record, you better be willing to pay a fine, and you better be willing to get in line and do everything you have to do to do so.
So, you know, it's interesting that those 62 percent are supporting the very thing that was once proposed but then ultimately defeated.
YELLIN: Yes. I suspect if they were asked another question, the people they'd be angriest with, the highest poll rating would go to the federal government for not taking action. Folks here want something to be done here, Rick.
SANCHEZ: And they're right. Jessica Yellin, all over this. We're going to be on this all week long, counting down to Thursday, getting reaction and points of view from both sides of this debate for you.
All right, the group that first released this unbelievable video of U.S. troops shooting unarmed men is back with more -- 91,000 pages on the fight in Afghanistan. We brought you part of that report. But there's even more you need to know. That's coming up in a little bit.
Also, a woman walked right in front of an oncoming train. Look at this. She walks right in front of an oncoming train. A, why is she doing it? B, what happened as a result? We'll take you through all of this. Stay right there. This is your national conversation. I'm Rick Sanchez. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: By the way, I want you to know that we've been working -- I asked some of the folks who do research for us and book guests to look for someone that we can talk to that might be able to take us through this story about these WikiLeaks out of Afghanistan.
A lot of Americans are perplexed by this. On the one hand, you want to get as much new information as possible. On the other hand, if they classified this stuff, they probably classified it for a reason, right?
Should we be in the business of imparting information that was meant originally to be classified? This is something that's perplexed those of us who gather news for a living for decades in this country.
I understand now -- yep, we've got -- let me tell you who we've got coming up. Paul Rickoff is going to be joining us. He's the executive director of Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America. He also is the author of "Chasing Ghosts." Great get on this. He's coming up in a few minutes. Stay with us.
Meanwhile, we're obviously getting a lot of tweets as we follow you and those people who are relevant to the news that we follow. Go to it, Robert. Thank you. "The tragedy is that this person would risk the lives of troops from all around the world based mostly on years-old information." That goes to that question that I just posed. It's information that's important. Americans need to know what's really going on there. On the other hand, it's also stuff that's supposed to be classified.
Here's another one -- "so many other choices than putting classified info out there. They should be charged. How did they get them? Find them." And we've got one more. "A Pakistani -- too many people focusing on what reports allege instead of focusing on whether allegations are true." There you go.
Take a look at this --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You're taking our money and you're spraying each other and you think we're not going to get mad about it? You're out of your minds!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: That's right. Boy, is she mad about it. Outrage in Bell, California. Already forced-out city officials making more than $800,000 a year in one case -- there are two others, the police chief and an assistant city manager I talked about moments ago -- almost $1 million for running one of California's smallest and certainly not one of the wealthiest cities.
So now the state's attorney general just made a big announcement about this investigation they're going to be doing there. And we're all over this story.
And then a hungry bear, lunch in the backseat -- a dangerous combination. The rest of the pictures are coming up in "Fotos." That's next after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back. This is your national conversation. This is "RICK'S LIST." I'm Rick Sanchez.
And now for your favorite musical part. There are good Samaritans and then there are great Samaritans. Let's do "Fotos."
We begin in a town from where we're broadcasting. A visually impaired woman in Atlanta walks on to a train station platform, doesn't stop. She falls directly onto the tracks. The worst part, the train is fast approaching.
What is to be done? One brave man rushes to pull her out. Other commuters then pitch in. The train stops four feet from where the woman lay on the tracks and the crowd pulls her to safety. Amazing story. Good for them.
Voorhees, New Jersey -- how's this for irony? The truck is supposed to anchor the crane. But when the crane fell on this Olive Garden restaurant, the tables were turned. The crane pulled the truck off the ground where it hung in midair for quite a bit.
Denver -- apparently this bear was tired of walking. It climbed into a car, evidently knocking it into neutral. The car rolled down the hill and the door slammed shut. The bear was trapped and that's when the real damage started. Yep, he had his way in the backseat.
You can see all of our "Fotos del Dia" by going to my blog any time you want. To check them out, get a laugh or maybe even look at some of the more serious stuff we have on there. That's on CNN.com/RickSanchez.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I think there's no doubt that this is a concerning development in operational security. And as we said earlier, it poses a very real and potential threat to those that are working hard every day to keep us safe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Operational security -- WikiLeaks releases thousands of classified documents and gets pushback from the White House. They say troops are now at a greater risk. But are they?
We put a team of producers on this case. They're drilling down on some of the most unbelievable revelations that are coming out of this to see just how damaging, for example, the leak might be. A lot more is coming your way on this in just a little bit.
Also, who's suing Simon Cowell? Shouldn't it be more like who isn't? Here's a hint. An angry singer. Well, that ought to narrow it down to a few 1,000 people. Brooke Baldwin has all the things trending for us. And Simon Cowell is trending because he's getting sued?
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: He is. Big bucks.
SANCHEZ: I'm think who would want to sue him, and about a million people come to mind.
(LAUGHTER)
We'll be right back. Stay right there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: We were kidding about this just a little while ago, but in trending topics, everybody wants to get in on this Simon Cowell thing. He's getting sued?
BALDWIN: He's getting sued. And if you think about it, what's your favorite part about "American Idol"? My personal favorite are all the people that can't carry a tune. So, case in point, there's a lady from the British TV equivalent called "Britain's Got Talent." This particular episode aired last May. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COWELL: What are you going to do?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: To sing for you?
COWELL: Do you believe you have the talent to win this competition?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, Simon, I'm wonderful. You will go home and you will think, I'm so glad I met that woman.
When I am down and my soul so weary when troubles come and my heart burdens me, you raise me up --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Whoa, Sanchez.
SANCHEZ: I just got into it. Couldn't help myself.
BALDWIN: Wow, I had no idea you had such range.
(LAUGHTER)
Maybe you'd be suing Simon Cowell as well. This 54-year-old singer wannabe is now suing Simon Cowell, according to reports. She's suing $4 million, claiming humiliation after this exchange --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COWELL: Emma, how do you think it went?
(LAUGHTER)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it would be really nice if you gave people a chance.
COWELL: We did. You just had one. Emma --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I mean, this song is a really lovely song.
COWELL: But Emma, it is a beautiful song when you're not singing it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Ouch. So according to "The Daily Mail," Emma Zigat was her name -- she was humiliated. She was degraded, ridiculed in front of 20 million viewers. She also says the show is not sensitive to her medical condition. Apparently she has fibromyalgia. According to Cowell's attorney, though, they're fighting this thing. The staff says they had no prior knowledge of her disabilities and the show and the hearing goes on.
SANCHEZ: When you go on this show, don't you have to come with an expectation that you might very possibly get ridiculed since that's the premise of the entire show?
BALDWIN: He's mean to people all the time -- you would think.
SANCHEZ: You would think.
BALDWIN: But it was just kind of fun. My personal highlight of this entire segment was your soprano.
SANCHEZ: Did you like that?
BALDWIN: And move on.
(LAUGHTER)
SANCHEZ: The producers are laughing at me.
BALDWIN: They're like "Wrap it up."
SANCHEZ: All right, 8:00 tonight?
BALDWIN: 8:00 tonight. But I'm back next hour.
SANCHEZ: We'll keep doing this.
Bell, California, is a story we've been telling you about that so many Americans are angry about. Residents have already forced out several leaders earning huge salaries while the city suffers. The mayor survived, but that could change tonight. And now Attorney General Jerry Brown is looking into some important records.
Folks, this could get ugly. Remember, it's about three city officials who apparently ended up with salaries that most people would think are just completely unrealistic.
You know that tax cut gift the rich received according to Dems during the Bush administration? Well, it's about to expire. We're going to talk with a conservative who says ending the breaks could doom an economic recovery. That's coming up in just a little bit. Here he is. Erick Erickson. We'll do this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: So this idea that there's new information that tells us or gives us a perspective on what's really going on in Afghanistan good or bad. Here's Joe Lieberman. We follow people relevant to the news here. That's why we call it "RICK'S LIST." Joe Lieberman is on "RICK'S LIST."
He says "A leak of Afghan war materials is profoundly irresponsible and harmful to our national security." Lieberman is known as a bit of a hawk even though he's always been a Dem but tends to caucus with the Rs now.
You are more of an R than a Dem. I'm interested, Erick Erickson, on getting your perspective on this as well, as well, as well as the potential tax cuts. That's what we'll talk about when we come back. You ready to go?
ERICK ERICKSON, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, REDSTATE.COM: Sounds good.
SANCHEZ: Let's take a break. We'll be back with Erick Erickson. This is your list, "RICK'S LIST."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Rick Sanchez here. Welcome back. We are going to go ahead and do exactly as we told you we would. Joining me now is Erick Erickson. The issue is the Bush administration cuts taxes, Democrats say, just for the wealthy.
ERICKSON: Right.
SANCHEZ: Now it's an opportunity for these lawmakers to once again revisit this. It appears like the Democrats are going to try and say we're going to get rid of that. Bad move you say?
ERICKSON: I think some, particularly in a recession. We know from the IRS itself that 70 percent of the people affected by the Bush tax cuts in the upper income bracket are what the IRS calls flow- through entities, LLCs, independent contractors, in other words, job creators.
So it makes for great class warfare, but we also know objectively that in 2002 to 2005 after the Bush tax cuts went into effect, the rich actually paid more into the Treasury than anyone else.
SANCHEZ: Why don't we say, look, if we have a problem with debt and deficit as everyone seems to be screaming, especially the right, then why don't we say nobody gets tax cuts because, you know what, we can't afford tax cuts because when we cut taxes that means less money going into general and less money going into general means we'll be able to, we won't be able to knock down the deficit.
ERICKSON: The problem with that, I think even your most ardent Keynesian would say in a deficit and recession period it is bad to cut taxes because that money builds uncertainty into the economy so businesses can't pour their money back into their business.
SANCHEZ: So then you are saying during the Bush years when the economy was flourishing and things were going very well before we go the 2007 and 2008 we had to give a tax cut to the wealthy?
ERICKSON: No, no.
SANCHEZ: And now that things are bad we also have to give a tax cut to the wealthy. When do the not so wealthy people get their tax cut?
ERICKSON: The tax cut went into effect during the first recession 2001. Remember they came into office and pushed through the tax cut and after the tax cut, the recession went away. Money came into the treasury and in fact it came in at a higher rate than in 2000 --
SANCHEZ: Right.
ERICKSON: -- from the upper income. What the Republicans are saying, and I think they're right, is that if we take this back, then the rich are going to go back to their accountants and find more loop holes and go back underground.
We know for example in 1980 when the tax bracket was 70 percent for the rich they paid less money than at the end of the Reagan administration when he cut it into the 30s.
SANCHEZ: Let me stop you real quick, because I do want to leave some time so I can ask you about this question of WikiLeaks. Americans are probably going to tussle with this. On the one hand, they want to know what is really the truth.
ERICKSON: Right.
SANCHEZ: What is going on in Afghanistan? On the other hand it's a slippery slope when you start using documents that you're not supposed to have at your disposal to get that information. So let's talk about that when we come back.
ERICKSON: OK.
SANCHEZ: You heard what Joe Lieberman said. I want to know what you think. We'll be right back. Stay with us. This is your national conversation. This is "RICK'S LIST."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: So WikiLeaks is an organization that gets material that is leaked, in this case classified information about what's going on in Afghanistan. And some of what is contained in this report is, well, a bit of a bombshell to most Americans as they read it.
The question on the table now as we bring in Erick Erickson once again. I'm reading my tweets during that commercial and people who are saying hurrah for WikiLeaks, job well done. Other people are saying, you know what, this is treason. You don't report, you don't give information that the government when it comes to war doesn't want reported. Where do you stand on this?
ERICKSON: It's a fine line. We know the government sometimes doesn't tell us everything, and then there are times we don't need to know everything. A lot of what's being reported on Pakistan could further destabilize the region. We risk in the interest of information hurting the troops and hurting our behind-the-scenes efforts with Pakistan. SANCHEZ: But don't you worry about the possibility that if a lot of the war effort is being done through contractors and we know there's money involved in that, and we wonder if members of the media are getting all of the information they need to get, and we question that, including many of ourselves at times, and then along comes somebody who says, here. The answers you wanted are right here.
Do we say, no, I'm not going to look at them, or is it our responsibility as journalists to give the people the information, whether it hurts or not? Let the truth be told.
ERICKSON: You know, my problem is the Saudi Arabian media, the German media, the Dutch media, the Italian media -- they are Italians, Dutch, Germans, Saudi Arabian. The American media for some reason takes this view we transcend nationality. We'll just report the facts. You wade through it and figure it out.
The problem is the American media in reporting this may be undermining the American war effort. And I've got a real problem with that. At the same time it does look like the government is hiding from people --
SANCHEZ: Some information. Didn't like the stuff about the stinger missiles didn't that jump out at you?
ERICKSON: Yes.
SANCHEZ: What you and I read about the mujahedin fighting the Russians, for example, scared the hell out of me. And when I read this report saying these guys may have the same weapons they used against the Russians, I'm thinking, oh, no.
ERICKSON: I would be surprised if they didn't. I would just assume that's what they were doing given their history for two decades.
SANCHEZ: Should Americans know that?
ERICKSON: I don't necessarily think they need to. The danger though is if we go back several months to the WikiLeaks video of what happened in Iraq, the editors there pretty much admitted they had an editorial slant against this and they only released 10 percent of the video.
What aren't they showing us with the Afghan stuff? Are they leaking it out? Just as much as you may not trust the government, why can we trust WikiLeaks?
ERICKSON: That's a good question. You're right. You're absolutely right. They probably have a dog in the fight, as they say, and it's important for viewers to know where their information is coming from and what some of the interests are of the people who are either disseminating the information or in this case gathering the information.
We're going to continue this, OK? I'm going to bring in somebody else to talk about this as we start our next hour.
