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Rick's List

Soldiers Returning Home; President Obama's Religion

Aired August 19, 2010 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Yesterday, we started telling you about some of our own soldiers coming home.

Well, something pretty magical just happened a little while ago. In fact, you know what? Let's watch this together. All right. There was going to be sound on that. And we promise that we will re-cue it and we will let you hear it, because it was actually quite an outburst.

We're following this. It happened about five, six minutes ago. And we are going to take you through it once again. In fact, my top correspondent, Brooke Baldwin, is standing there. She's going to take us through it. We will be back with RICK'S LIST.

But, first, here's what we got coming up.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ (voice-over): Making the list in prime time.

A chase through the streets of Dallas turns into a gate crash into an active runway at Love Field, shutting down the airport.

And then:

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's going to ram that gate.

SANCHEZ: Boom. How did it get so close to these planes?

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe that Muslims have the right to practice their religion, as everyone else in this country.

SANCHEZ: A fifth of Americans now believe the president is a Muslim. That's up, way up. What's the White House say? I will ask the president's religious adviser.

SARAH PALIN (R), FORMER ALASKA GOVERNOR: Thank you so much.

SANCHEZ: Sarah Palin, zero for five on endorsements, now backing Sharron Angle. And guess who else Palin's backing? Dr. Laura Schlessinger.

And the Rocket now a defendant. Roger Clemens charged with lying under oath to Congress.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: All right. Want to take you through this, because this is going to really be something. Topping the LIST right now, first of all, welcome, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez.

As you know, this is RICK'S LIST. So glad that you're here.

Seven years-plus in Iraq, and tonight it looks and it's starting feel as if in fact the war is over. Some loose ends? Of course there are. And we are going to talk about those loose ends. But we have got so many neat pictures coming in today.

I want to take you back to what Republican strategist Ed Rollins has told me, because this is the key. And maybe this is why this is most historic.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ED ROLLINS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: The thing that makes me feel good, having lived through the Vietnam War, having been around during the Korean War -- I'm so old -- this is the first time our troops are marching out with their heads high, and they accomplished what they set out to accomplish.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Now, think about that for a moment. Our troops are marching out with their heads held high and they accomplished what they set out to accomplish.

It is just after 3:00 a.m. in Iraq right now, more or less, just after 3:00 in northern Kuwait as well.

And that's where we find CNN's Ben Wedeman. He's there among some of the United States troops who have just left Iraq for good, crossed over into Kuwait.

Ben, how are these soldiers reacting? What are they saying? I want to know. What do they do and say when they cross over into Kuwait? What are you seeing?

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, what we're seeing is a lot of relief, and these men, this -- they were in Iraq for 12 months, but this is the second deployment for this brigade.

They have spent a total of 27 months in Iraq, and they said their first deployment in 2004 was really rough, that they lost more than 40, 50 of their comrades during that deployment. This latest deployment, which has just ended this morning, they lost nobody, nobody killed in action.

And they feel that that is an evident sign, proof, that things have improved in Iraq. And, of course, they're greatly relieved to be out. Now, we're among their Stryker vehicles here, and they have spent the last seven or eight hours taking off all the weaponry, the communications equipment, and now it's 3:00 a.m. in the morning.

They're finally finishing. If we can just pan the camera over and just show you that they're just sort of just cleaning up, done the job for the night, and now that they have done this work, they're really looking forward to going home.

Now, we were told by their officers that they expected this operation of dismantling the Stryker vehicles, taking the weapons off, Rick, would take around two weeks. But because everybody's so eager to get out of here, they understand that the sooner that this job is done, that they will be able to go home, so it's only going to take seven days.

So, there's a lot of relief, a lot of anticipation about finally going home Rick.

SANCHEZ: That must be one heck of a place to be. Ben Wedeman is there for us and he's going to follow that story, and Ben's going to be joining me in just a little bit to answer the questions that many of you have. What about the 56,000 that are staying there? What happens to them? What are the eventualities inside Iraq still? So Ben's going to join me in just a little bit. He's going to be hanging tight.

Meanwhile, I want to show you something now. This is the part of the story that I have been wanting to share with you, because when you look at some of these, you may get a little mist gathered right there in the corner of your eye.

I'm going to start showing you some reunions now, OK? This is part of the Stryker brigade members arriving in Washington State. Watch this. You see that? That is amazing stuff to watch, isn't it? In fact, one more time. Would you mind, Kelly? Could we re -- I want to see from the moment -- because I talked over that, and I hate when I talk over video.

Take it from the top again, the one from Washington State. Before we take you to -- before we take you to Fort Benning, Georgia, I want to stay on that Washington shot, if you can. Hit it. Look at that little guy hanging on to his daddy's knee. I got to tell you, it's hard to watch this. It's really hard to watch this and not get just a little bit feeling of goose bumps watching this develop. There's the chaplain, by the way.

That's a special lei that they have made for him. And they put junk food on it because he's got a healthy appetite. We have been learning some of the stories of some of these guys that are coming home now, and we're proud of them.

That same scene is going to be repeated around the country. In fact, just moments ago -- I'm taking you now from the video in Washington to the video in Fort Benning, Georgia.

That's where our own top correspondent, Brooke Baldwin, is standing by. She's been following this for us.

And I understand that just a little while ago there was a very similar reunion there.

Go ahead, Brooke. Cue it up. Take us through it.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

Rick, I think it was less than five minutes ago, the crush of families and soldiers. And I tell you, I have covered deployments. I have never covered homecomings. When you see those men and women walk through those doors, I don't care if you are related to them or not, it just gives you goose bumps.

That said, I just want to get straight you to the Sunday family. As you are looking at that big moment, as men and women here from across the country have gathered after 11 months of these men and women being deployed in Eastern Iraq, I want to introduce you to Sergeant Jason Sunday.

Sir, a pleasure. Thank you for serving our country. And the lovely the lovely Emily Sunday, who I see, your eyes are still kind of glistening.

Just a minute, sweetie.

Your eyes are glistening. You're standing next to your husband. It's been 11 months. What's going through your head?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just feel really blessed. You know, God has blessed us with an amazing marriage and family, and I'm just really thankful to have him home.

BALDWIN: How was the trip home?

SGT. JASON SUNDAY, U.S. MILITARY: It was long, but well worth it. Just glad to be back in Georgia, and next to my wife and kids. And hopefully I don't have to go back over there again anytime soon.

BALDWIN: This was your second tour.

SUNDAY: Yes, roger.

BALDWIN: Tell me -- roger, roger that. Tell me briefly, what missions, were you doing when you were gone for those 11 months?

SUNDAY: Basically, this time, we were just an assist-and-advise brigade. We just escorted different provincial teams throughout the provinces basically on humanitarian missions.

BALDWIN: Good to be home?

SUNDAY: Absolutely.

BALDWIN: All right, and then the guys who I'm sure will steal the show, tell me your poster, tell me your name, and how old are you?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My name is Thatcher (ph) Sunday. I'm 9 years old. And my poster said, welcome home, dad, and it has my dad's name, Jason. And on the back, it says Sunday, because that's our last name. And it has the American flag on it.

BALDWIN: And, Thatcher, you got out of school early today. I know you were really psyched about that. I'm guessing you're a little more excited to finally see your dad.

What's the plan once you head home tonight?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, tonight, I think we will just hang out and tomorrow we will do a lot more fun stuff.

BALDWIN: Hang out, do fun stuff. Sounds pretty good.

You're kind of quiet over here. I know you've been very excited about seeing your dad. What are you doing with him?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Umm...

BALDWIN: She's speechless. You should have seen her two minutes ago.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to jump on the trampoline with him.

BALDWIN: Jump on the trampoline with your dad.

Dad, do you think you are up for that, jumping and jumping?

SUNDAY: Absolutely. I think I can do a little trampoline jumping.

BALDWIN: And you still have some colleagues back in Iraq. I understand 3rd Infantry still has a couple thousand.

SUNDAY: Yes, we just -- a certain portion of 3rd Brigade was ordered -- drawdown of forces through the United States Army, so only a portion of us are back. The rest of will be back in late September, early October.

BALDWIN: How do you feel about leaving? You think you're done for good?

SUNDAY: I will leave that up to higher.

BALDWIN: Higher powers here.

SUNDAY: Absolutely.

BALDWIN: All right, well, the Sunday family, you are all lovely, as are you. I don't know if we can get a shot of this little one.

But, Rick, I'm going to send it back into you, but it's been incredibly impressive seeing these families coming together tonight. It's amazing.

SANCHEZ: The Sunday family, we wish them well. We're so happy that dad is home, and I can only imagine how joyous the times are going to be in the next couple of days as they get reacquainted.

Job well done, Brooke Baldwin, following that story for us from early this afternoon to when the guys came marching home, as they say.

Now, take a look at this, folks

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's going to ram that gate. He's on the runway. As I look up here, there are -- there are four jets that are waiting on 13 left to depart and he at this point is headed towards those jets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: This is crazy. Talk about a security breach. Have you seen this? The driver of that pickup truck just busted through the gates of a major U.S. airport. How did something like this even happen? We're going to be drilling down on this for you.

Also, Sarah Palin takes her defense of Dr. Laura Schlessinger to a new level. She says she knows what it's like to be shackled. She uses that word. And she's getting some pushback tonight. Her words, not mine, once again.

By the way, there's some new information tonight about what Dr. Laura Schlessinger says about Sarah Palin. And it ain't good.

Also, back to Iraq now for just a second. We have obviously paid great sacrifices in the war, but there were accomplishments as well. Here's my list for tonight.

First off, the fall of Saddam Hussein, captured nine months after the start of the war. He would be tried, convicted and executed in December of 2006. There are other notable milestones, and I want to take you through them, as we think back. We have got those on the other side of the break. Stay right there.

This is your national conversation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Hey, welcome back, everyone. I'm Rick Sanchez. This is RICK'S LIST. Glad you're here.

The heavy toll paid during Operation Iraqi Freedom did not come without some achievements. My list includes elections. January 2005, millions of Iraqis go to the polls to cast ballots in their country's very first free elections in more than 50 years. That's important. Their expatriate brothers and sisters the world over, including here in the United States, also were able to take part.

Here's number three, the lasting accomplishments that could help shape the future of Iraq. The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers has managed the construction of more than 1,100 schools, just part of the 5,000 projects that they have worked on around the country valued at more than $9 billion.

I want you to listen to something now. In fact, let me bring in my colleague Ben Wedeman. This is important, because I want him to listen to this as well. Ben right now is in Camp Virginia in Northern Kuwait. That's where the Stryker brigade has been crossing over into Kuwait, leaving Iraq with lots of relief, as they say.

All right, here's the fellow I want you to hear from. This is major General Stephen Lanza, Stephen Lanza, from Baghdad, explaining whether this is mission accomplished. But then he says this as well. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAJ. GEN. STEPHEN LANZA, U.S. ARMY: Where we are right now is, there is a point where Iraq has an opportunity, an opportunity right now to move forward as a sovereign nation, to achieve self-reliance and to achieve a place in this region that can achieve security and some type of economic development that will help stabilize the region.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Is he essentially saying, Ben -- let's have a conversation about this -- is he essentially saying, look, Iraq, we're out, you're on your own, guys?

WEDEMAN: Well, in a sense he is, Rick.

Basically, you know, the U.S. forces have been there, what, for seven-and-a-half years. They have given it their best. But at the end of the day, it's the Iraqis who are going to have to fix their country. And you have to remember, there were elections four ago and they have still not been able to agree on a government. There are fundamental elements of instability that the Americans just cannot solve.

SANCHEZ: Let me follow up on that then. Since there's so much instability, let me just ask the question that I hate asking, but I must. What if this thing blows up again? What if things turn worse?

Can we definitively say that we're out, or is there still a door halfway open that may cause us to go back in? What are your sources telling you about that?

WEDEMAN: Well, certainly, that is one of the real concerns. And around the Arab world there are a lot of people who say, look, Saddam was the devil that we knew. He was predictable, whereas the current sort of semi-democracy that exists in Iraq is very unpredictable.

You have problems between Kurds and the Sunnis, the Sunnis and the Shiites, and all of this could blow up. And let's not forget, after September 1, there will still be 50,000 U.S. troops, not in a combat capacity, but 50,000 U.S. troops on the ground.

And that's a worry. And there's no guarantee at this point that political stability is -- is a given. And, in fact, many people worry that Iraq in its current sort of situation is fundamentally unstable and could easily go into chaos. So, that is a concern.

SANCHEZ: Trainers and advisers, that is how they're described, those 50,000 that occur -- occurs when New Dawn begins at the end of the month.

Ben Wedeman's been covering this region for decades. He knows it as well as anybody. And we're so glad that he had a chance to give us his perspective on this.

Thank you, Ben. Appreciate it.

Take a look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not a coincidence that the first president whose father was a Muslim, some Americans think, maybe, like father, like son.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: It is also not a coincidence that more and more Americans believe that a Christian president really is a Muslim president. So, what does the president's religious adviser say about that?

I'm going to talk to Pastor Kirbyjon Caldwell, live about the politics of the president's faith.

Also, Sarah Palin's latest Facebook post dives straight into the Dr. Laura Schlessinger N-word controversy and rant. What did Sarah Palin say to elicit a reaction like this one on my Twitter board?

Now, I follow a lot of folks, including this lady, Holly Robinson Peete. She writes -- quote -- "Palin says shackles to make us feel bad for wealthy conservatives. Does she realize some of us have ancestors who were actually shackled in USA?"

That's Holly Robinson Peete.

Jessica Yellin is here with some of the answers to this new controversy that's boiling over once again on your LIST. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: I want you to know that we have just turned around some sound that's extremely controversial, and I'm going to be sharing that sound from Franklin Graham in just a little bit. It's going to make you think. It's going to make a lot of folks think. And expect there to be reaction. We're going to get to that in just a little bit. Hang tight on that. I'm guaranteeing that it's going to elicit reactions from a lot of folks.

But, first, Sarah Palin wants you to know, she really, really wants you to know, that she's supporting Dr. Laura Schlessinger, after Schlessinger's N-word tirade. Palin tweeted about this as much this morning and then she followed this afternoon with a lengthy post on her Facebook page.

It's, like, wow, she's really diving into this headfirst. In this Facebook entry, the one we got just this afternoon after we went off the air on RICK'S LIST earlier, she says that Sarah Palin knows what it's like to be shackled. In fact, here, take a look.

She writes: "Does anyone seriously believe that Dr. Laura Schlessinger is a racist? Anyone, I mean, who isn't already accusing all conservatives, Republicans and Tea Party Americans of being racist, I and obviously many others have been" -- quote -- "shackled" -- close quotes -- "too by people who play games with false accusations, threats, frivolous lawsuits, misreporting in an effort to silence those with whom they disagree."

Jessica Yellin is our national political correspondent and she's been following this controversy now for a bit, and we can't help but wonder, why is Sarah Palin thrusting herself so vehemently into this defense of Dr. Laura Schlessinger's rant, when Dr. Laura Schlessinger herself has said, I was wrong to do that?

JESSICA YELLIN, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Rick, but Sarah Palin has made it clear she is now in her view the leader of conservative women, that she would like to take that mantle, and if there's a conservative woman who is under attack, she's saying, I got your back.

And so Dr. Laura is saying she's been attacked for some of the same things Sarah Palin complains about, being in her view attacked by the liberal media, so she's saying, I got your back.

But here's what's interesting. We were looking around and found that Dr. Laura didn't necessarily have Sarah Palin's back, back in the day.

SANCHEZ: Really?

So here's Sarah Palin coming to her defense, but you have got evidence that Schlessinger is no fan of Sarah Palin's.

YELLIN: That's right. Well, at least when John McCain announced that he was choosing Palin as his running payment, Schlessinger posted on her blog -- I think we have a piece of it...

SANCHEZ: Yes.

YELLIN: ... a line saying -- it was actually a very long blog post.

And she said: "I am disappointed that John McCain has picked Sarah Palin as his running mate. I'm extremely disappointed in the choice of Sarah Palin as the vice presidential candidate of the Republican Party."

She went on to say, next page: "Really, what kind of role model is a woman whose fifth child was recently born with a serious issue, Down syndrome, and then goes back to the job of governor within days of the birth?"

So, she was slamming Palin for being a working mom who had a sick child at home, who wanted to keep her job.

SANCHEZ: Wow. Think about that. She's criticizing her for keeping her baby?

YELLIN: It wasn't for keeping her baby. It was for having five kids at home, including an ill child, and saying, why would such a person take the big job of being vice president?

SANCHEZ: I see. I see.

YELLIN: That she's too busy.

SANCHEZ: Yes, I misunderstood that, because I was seeing it for the very first time. Still, that's one heck of a knock.

You know what's interesting about Sarah Palin, though? Sarah Palin, has she always been as polarizing as she seems to be these days?

YELLIN: You know what? The truth is, she has. We in the media give her a lot of attention because she's sort of great TV copy. But if you look at the polling, even today, her negatives are higher than her positives nationwide.

We have some polling that shows nationally she is viewed as in a favorable light by 35 percent of the American people, but unfavorable by 49 percent. And if you break it down by party, who's she popular with? She's popular with base Republicans. Republicans, 66 percent have a favorable view. But independents, those key swing voters, 33 percent is not a big favorable number, Rick.

SANCHEZ: That's interesting.

So, it's an audience, but it's a very confined audience.

YELLIN: It's confined and passionate. so, the people who like her adore her. Republican women right now, very popular there. Elsewhere, not as much.

SANCHEZ: That's interesting. Good stuff. Really interesting. I did not know that about Dr. Laura Schlessinger or what she had specifically said about Sarah Palin in the past. And that is strong stuff.

YELLIN: It is. That was two years ago, almost two years ago. We will see. I have a feeling this story is yet to have finished. There will be another page.

SANCHEZ: Thanks someone.

Roger Clemens was once a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. But if the feds have their way, he is not headed for Cooperstown. In fact, he could be headed to prison. Roger Clemens? What do they have on him? That's coming up in just a little bit.

Also, can a president prove he's a man of faith and should he even have to? Well, that's the position that the White House finds itself in tonight. I have got one of President Obama's religious advisers with me. He's next. And he's ready, he says, to set the record straight.

We're going to be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back.

I want you to listen now. This is what I was just telling you about moments ago. I want you to listen carefully to the words that Franklin Graham says moments ago when he was talking with my colleague John King.

He gets into this argument about President Obama, whether he's a Muslim or whether he's a Christian, and this is what he said about President Obama and his religion.

Do we have that? Can we roll it?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKLIN GRAHAM, SAMARITAN'S PURSE: The president's problem is that he was born a Muslim. His father was a Muslim. The seed of Islam is passed through the father, like the seed of Judaism is passed through the mother. He was born a Muslim. His father gave him an Islamic name.

Now, it's obvious that the president has renounced the Prophet Mohammed and he has renounced Islam, and he's accepted Jesus Christ. That's what he says he has done. I cannot say that he hasn't. So, I just have to believe the president is what he has said.

But he -- the confusion is, is, because his father was a Muslim, he was born a Muslim. The Islamic world sees the president as one of theirs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: He was born a Muslim because the seed of Muslims is passed through their father. A respected new poll today also talks about this, and we're going to be talking about that in just a little bit.

Findings about President Obama staying on this topic, now, according to the Pew Research Center, nearly 1 in 5 Americans, a full 18 percent, believe the president is a Muslim. Here's the shocker in all of this, though. The number is climbing. It was 11 percent back in March of 2009. And, get this, only about one-third of adults, 34 percent, say they think the president is a Christian down from 48 percent just last year. This is amazing, considering how openly the president has been about talking about his Christian faith.

In fact, you want to see it? Let's go back to 2006, if we can. I want to play something for you now. A bit of what then-Senator Obama had to say about how he came to Jesus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: You need to embrace Christ precisely because you have sins to wash away, because you're human and need an ally in this difficult journey.

And it was because of these new found understandings that I was finally able to walk down the aisle into the United Church of Christ on 96th Street on the south side of Chicago one day and affirm my faith.

And it came about as a choice, not as an epiphany. But kneeling beneath that cross on the south side, I felt that I heard God's spirit beckoning me. I submitted myself to his will and dedicated myself to discovering his truth.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: I want to bring somebody in now who's very important to this discussion, Pastor Kirbyjon Caldwell who's one of the president's religious advisers.

Before we do anything else, by the way, I should let our viewers know that you were also close to former President George W. Bush and counseled him in the same way. Before we do anything else, I was just taken aback and I think you may have seen the expression on my face when I played Franklin Graham's interview with John King moments ago.

Before we do anything else, Kelly, if you can re-rack that, I want to make sure I heard it correctly again. And then I want to get your reaction, Pastor, to this. Can you guys do that for me in the control room? All right, here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REV. FRANKLIN GRAHAM: The president's problem is that he was born a Muslim. His father was a Muslim, the seed of Islam is passed through the father like the seed of Judaism is passed through the mother. He was born a Muslim. His father gave him an Islamic name.

Now, it's obvious that the president has renounced the Prophet Muhammad and he has renounced Islam and he's accepted Jesus Christ. That's what he says he has done.

I cannot say that he hasn't, so I just have to believe the president is what he has said, but he -- he -- the confusion is because his father was a Muslim, he was born a Muslim. The Islamic world sees the president as one of theirs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Pastor Caldwell, I want you to react to what you just heard.

KIRBYJON CALDWELL, ONE OF PRESIDENT OBAMA'S FIVE RELIGIOUS ADVISORS: Yes, sir. Good evening, Rick. Thank you so much for having me.

SANCHEZ: It's a pleasure, sir.

CALDWELL: Thank you, sir. Well, obviously, I have great deal of respect for the Graham family, and in this particular case I respectfully disagree with Franklin Graham, and we don't want to get involved in a deep theological discussion, but let's be clear about this.

When one accepts Jesus Christ as your Lord, liberator, savior, and deliverer, as far as I'm concerned, as far as the Bible is concerned, as far as the mainline Christianity is concerned, the blood of Jesus blasts and just blocks out all that stuff, if you would, which Franklin Graham just referred to. You know, the president is not responsible for --

SANCHEZ: Yes, but what he's saying, Pastor, is --

CALDWELL: Right.

SANCHEZ: -- let's suppose that my biological father was a Hindu, for example and for some reason --

CALDWELL: Exactly.

SANCHEZ: -- something happened and I ended up leaving a country where the principal religion is Hindu and I ended up --

CALDWELL: Right.

SANCHEZ: -- in the United States, for example.

CALDWELL: Yes.

SANCHEZ: And someone else raised me, and they brought me into the world and I found Christianity. I happen to be Catholic, for example.

But by Franklin Graham's argument, then, being Hindu is something that will stay with me, simply because my father was Hindu, or he says in the case of different religions because your mother is a particular religion. That -- that -- is there any base to that theologically or --

CALDWELL: No, not at all.

SANCHEZ: It's the common sense of it. CALDWELL: Exactly and that's precisely my point. I think Franklin is mistaken and, you know, to make that statement implies that there is no power in the blood of Jesus Christ and there's no power in one confessing to be a Christian.

Once you confess to be a Christian, you're a Christian. It doesn't matter who your mom or dad is. Once you've confessed to be a Christian, in fact, your Heavenly Father becomes your father.

So, you know, I mean, again, we could go on with this. I just think that Brother Graham is mistaken, and I have heard the president very clearly, systematically and scripturally express his faith in Jesus Christ.

SANCHEZ: So, where do these numbers come from, Pastor? We're looking at numbers that last year may have shocked --

CALDWELL: That's the question.

SANCHEZ: Go ahead, where do you think these numbers are? Where are they coming from?

CALDWELL: First of all, let me confess, while we're confessing here tonight, I don't know. My suspicion, however, is that there's a 24-hour clamor box that goes on somewhere, noise box, that goes incessantly, and the purpose of this noise box is to convey that the president is a Muslim when in point of fact he's not a Muslim.

As you indicated earlier, well, you didn't indicate this, but let me say. Never in the history of modern day politics has the president said, I'm a Christian, and folks say, no, you're not a Christian, you're a Muslim.

As my grandmother used to say, that's downright uncouth. It's way over the top. Doggone it, if a man says he's a Christian, we have to believe him.

SANCHEZ: Well, you know him. I mean, you know him --

CALDWELL: Yes.

SANCHEZ: -- and you know him through his faith. So, tell the American people, convince the American people, if you would, and I hate to have to put you in this situation, but the polls seem to suggest that maybe you should.

Convince the American people of why this president really is a Christian, in your eyes, as a pastor from what you've seen and experienced.

CALDWELL: Well, I greatly appreciate that question, and clearly, you know, I'm probably not in a position to convince anybody that he is a Christian. But I will say to you unswervingly, you know, that I have prayed for the president.

I have prayed with the president. The president has clearly confessed his faith in Jesus Christ, and I thoroughly believe that this attack, if you would, is simply designed to define the president in a way that is utterly false, utterly false.

SANCHEZ: Pastor Kirbyjon Caldwell on an interesting argument that seems to be taking hold around the country, and now may be solidified with the words of Franklin Graham moments ago, which I'm sure many will have much to say about. We'll stay on top of it. Pastor, thanks, sir, for taking time to join us tonight.

CALDWELL: Thank you, sir.

SANCHEZ: Watch this --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let me be clear, I have never taken steroids or HGH.

SANCHEZ: He swore that that was the truth, but now he's being charged officially with lying. That's Roger Clemens, folks. Did he commit perjury? And just how much trouble is he really in now?

It's a high-speed chase I'll show you now. This is a high-speed chase as well that I'm going to show you right. This is on a runway of a major airport. How did that truck get on to the runway in the first place? Driving past passenger jets, no less, and then a terminal. You've got to see how easy this was and then wonder how it could happen. That's what's we'll ask when we're back on "Rick's List."

This is a real story about a real person who is not going to be able to see her husband and you start to understand just from hearing the emotion in her voice, the actual sacrifices that she and so many other Americans

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Look who's here, Max Kellerman. Let me tell you something, this is a guy who not only knows his news, this guy really knows his sports so he's a perfect guy to talk to now.

You've seen him on ESPN, you've seen him on HBP. Tonight, you'll see him talking about Roger Clemens. Why is Roger Clemens in the news?

Here let me tell you why, one of the most dominant pitchers in baseball in decades. In serious trouble tonight, folks and here's why. He said under oath during a congressional hearing, this is back in 2008 that he didn't use steroids.

Well, today, a grand jury in Washington, D.C. has indicted him on perjury charges, Roger Clemens, for lying to Congress. It didn't take Clemens long to fire back on Twitter. Can we go to the Twitter board?

Here we go. I never took HGH or steroids and I did not lie to Congress. I look forward to challenging the government's accusations and hope people will keep an open mind until trial. I appreciate all the support I've been getting. I'm happy to finally have my day in court.

All right, we took you through some of that. I want to bring in Max now. Look, they're saying, you lie, you lie to Congress, it's a crime, a crime that needs to be punished with the charge of perjury.

MAX KELLERMAN: And you feel sorry for the guy, because you can imagine -- look, first of all, why does everyone assume that Roger Clemens is guilty? Because when you talk to people in sports, they say he should plea bargain because he looks guilty.

It's not like Bonds and Sosa - well, started with McGwire, in terms of the public - McGwire, Sosa and Bonds, those guys suddenly and dramatically showed up one day looking different. And their stats, I saw you talking about this other day. Their stats were unlike anything they had ever done.

SANCHEZ: Watermelon heads all of a sudden, right?

KELLERMAN: And suddenly their home runs -- shows were doubling in their late 30s. That wasn't Clemens. Clemens had a gradual change in appearance and his stats simply became as good as they once were. It's not like he was suddenly better than he'd ever been.

SANCHEZ: But there's a thing you and I know it's called gall, and gall is when you take yourself so seriously, that you think that nobody can hit you. You are not vulnerable.

KELLERMAN: And I think the issue with Clemens really is he looks like he's lying. People say, do you remember Nathan Stern from "Saturday Night Live," Martin Short's character?

The pathological lying lawyer who is always nervous. Why do you think I say that? That's what Clemens looks like. He looks like Nathan Stern from an "SNL" skit from the '80s denying what seems to be true.

SANCHEZ: In defense of Roger Clemens, in defense of Mark McGwire, in defense of A-Rod, in defense of Sammy Sosa, major league baseball had to know what these guys were doing. They're not stupid. They know that when you go from 37 home runs to 70-something home runs, something's going on.

KELLERMAN: He hit 73 home runs. Barry Bonds hit home runs. Never hit 50 and now hit 73.

SANCHEZ: So really - I mean, we talk a lot about the players and they deserve the heat, because if you do something wrong, you do something wrong. But institutionally baseball failed those guys.

KELLERMAN: I - listen, baseball after the '94 players strike, there was no world series, suddenly offense was way up when the players came back, I'm sure baseball was happy about it.

I agree with you, that Clemens, the gall that he showed to voluntarily show up and say, no, I want to defend my name. I want my day in court. He's going to get it and I think the sense space that he is maybe he didn't want his day in court.

SANCHEZ: Great segment. Enjoy - you're going to come tomorrow?

KELLERMAN: I sure will. You got a fun show here.

SANCHEZ: I'm going to spend time with my daughter, Savana and my son, who have been needing me lately. Thanks, Maxi.

All right, here we go. Take a look at this, folks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's going to ram the gate. He's on the runway.

SANCHEZ: This is likely the story of the day. I mean, imagine being on an airplane, about to take off, and this guy is heading straight for you.

I mean, this is a major airport, major runway. How did he get through? How was he able to bust through? What's the deal with security in this case?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: And making the list that you don't want to be on, the political endorsement that's just too good to be true, but, wait, photos don't lie, or do they?

Your national conversation continues in just a little bit. Stay right there, I'm Rick Sanchez. This is "Rick's List."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Hey, welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez. We follow people who are relevant to the news that we cover, so we just got this tweet from "Politics Daily." This is their religion correspondent, David Gibson. Here's what he sent me, and the "Rick's List" show.

Obama is Christian by baptism and practice. Quotes, Jesus more than G.W. Bush. Cites the old testament like a prophet, that should be enough. So, that's what David Gibson thinks from "Politics Daily." We're glad he sent that to us. We appreciate it.

Now, let's hear from Larry King. He's following what's going on in the news today. Knowing Larry, he's probably following sports stories as well, like I do when he gets off work. What is going on, Larry? What do you have?

LARRY KING: You know, Rick, once George will was asked what kind of baseball fan was he. He said if the front page headline in "The Washington Post" said "George Wills' Secret Life Revealed" he would first turn to the Cub box score.

SANCHEZ: Me, too.

KING: OK, we've got -- me, too. We've got an exclusive with Jose Conseco, the man who blew the whistle on all the steroid stories in baseball. He started it, and he'll tell us what he thinks about Roger Clemens' indictment for perjury.

And then we'll talk about texting while driving, which to me is insane. Is it even more dangerous than drinking and driving?

And you'll meet the woman who called Dr. Laura prompted that notorious "n" word rant. It's all at the top of the hour on "Larry King Live," Rick.

SANCHEZ: Tell Jose I said hello from his --

KING: Miami guy.

SANCHEZ: We're from the same hood. You know that, you, too. Thanks, Larry. Sounds like a great show.

Two major incidents today at major airports. OK, the first one, and we followed these as they were going on. A hijacking threat was phoned in against American airlines flight about to be taking off from San Francisco that's headed for New York.

The passengers had to be taken off the plane, interviewed and then rescreened. We just got word a few minutes ago that the threat was deemed non-credible. They are saying at this point it was bogus.

But this sure wasn't. Let me show you the next one. Take a look at what happened this afternoon in Texas. This is amazing, not to mention frightening.

A carjacking suspect being chased for more than near -- an hour. He smashes his way through a security gate and goes right onto the tarmac at Dallas Love Field, as police continue chasing him. In fact, can we -- let's do this, let's get that sound up, guys. Let's hear it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's going to ram that gate. He is on the runway. This may take a whole different turn as to how they attempt to -- attempt to apprehend this suspect because he could very easily ram into one of these jets.

There's civilians walking around. Ramp personnel walking around the area. He is coming to the northeast corner. As he makes his way northbound, as I look up here, there are four jets that are waiting on 13 left to depart. And he at this point is headed towards those jets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Can you imagine? They had to shut the airport down. Finally police get on to him, and they do this pit maneuver. You know what a pit maneuver is, right? You hit the car from one angle and the police officer comes from each other quadrant of the car stow o he can't get away.

One of the officer comes out and you see they take him out of the vehicle. That is an amazing maneuver. But as a result the airport, again, had to be shut down. This guy was getting very close to some of the planes that were trying to take off and land.

And we're going to continue to follow that story for you and ask about some of the security questions that obviously will be asked about Love Field as a result of that video.

How about this? Roll, tide, roll! That's what they say in Alabama on game day, the rest of the days as well. But they're saying something else tonight about the guy who had tried to use the good name of a football team's star coach, and landed his own self on the list you don't want to be on. Stay right there. I'm Rick Sanchez. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Getting a political endorsement from a big time star is every candidate's dream, but unfortunately many dreams are not true. Time now for the list you don't want to be on.

Meet Kevin Morris, he was the campaign manager for a woman running for mayor in Bessemer, Alabama, as you probably know Alabama's crazy about its football. The Crimson Tide has appeared in 56 bowl games in the last 83 years. The team's coach superstar, Nick Saban, is a pretty big sport star.

In fact, he's so well known that Kevin Morris thought an endorsement from Saban would boost Dorothy Davidson's chances of winning next week's election. So Morris printed out flyers showing how Saban fully supported her.

He even Photoshopped the picture to make it look that Ms. Davidson joined Saban for a day on the golf course. They look like best buds, don't they? They're not. Saban never endorsed her.

We spoke to Miss Davidson. She said she's mortified and embarrassed by the Photoshopped picture and she apologized and said she gave Morris the boot just yesterday. Listen to what Morris told a reporter.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN MORRIS, DAVIDSON'S FORMER CAMPAIGN MANAGER: I mean, I just -- I lied about everything. I lied about the whole thing. I'll just put it there. I just lied about everything.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: He just lied about everything. Morris also said, he thought, quote, "damn, if we had an endorsement from Nick Saban, I bet it would help. Yes, it would have, but the truth it might have worked as well." Occasionally, Kevin Morris, former campaign manager and professional liar, makes the top of the list that you don't want to be on.

You recognize the rocker? This Aerosmith front man might want to work on his crowd surfing. We've got the story and the video in "Fotos," that is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Here we go. There's a rising star that has developed a unique talent and I want to share it with you. It's a performance that tops "Fotos Del Dia."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Can you believe that? That's 23-year-old Liam Way lost both his arms and in an accident when he was 10 years old. That didn't stop him from becoming an amazing musician. Viewers were spellbound by his flawless piano recital on "China's Got Talent" the audience was moved to tears as they gave him a standing ovation.

Meanwhile, another musician now, who famously sang "Walk This Way" he should probably watch where he's walking. Take a look at this video from TMZ showing Steven Tyler, the front man for the rock band Aerosmith getting hip-checked offstage by guitarist Joe Perry. Tyler landed without injury. It's the second time the seasoned rocker has taken an off-stage tumble just this year. That's "Fotos."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: I'm Rick Sanchez. Thanks so much for being with us. Max will be here tomorrow. Here's Larry King.