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CNN Live Event/Special

Chris Cuomo On His Fight Against Coronavirus; New York Governor Cuomo On His State's Battle Against Coronavirus; NFL Patriots' Plane Brings 1.2 Million Masks To U.S. Aired 9-10p ET

Aired April 02, 2020 - 21:00   ET




ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: Welcome again to our CNN Global Town Hall: Coronavirus Facts and Fears. This is our fifth Town Hall.

In just the last hour, cases in for the - cases have risen and the number of dead in the United States has also increased. There're now 243,453 positive cases in America and 5,926 people have died. That's more than a 1,000 new cases and 76 more people who have died.

In this second hour, we'll be - going to be joined by New York's Governor, Andrew Cuomo, and talk about the fight to secure ventilators for his State, and also about states, unlike his, that still don't have stay-at-home orders in effect.

Also, we'll talk to Robert Kraft, Owner of the New England Patriots, as Patriots have helped secure more than a million masks from Massachusetts and 300,000 more for New York.

Also, we'll talk to experts who are going to answer more of your questions about the medical and psychological impact of this pandemic.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Now, usually at 9:00 P.M., Chris Cuomo is anchoring his program. Of course, he's now suffering, as you probably know from the Coronavirus. So, before we do anything this hour, we want to check in with Chris.

How are you doing, buddy?

COOPER: Chris? How are you - how are you feeling?

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST, CUOMO PRIME TIME: I'm doing well. I'm - I'm doing well.

The Beast comes at night, you know. As we know, the healthcare workers have taken to calling the virus "The Beast." I understand why. My fever has gone up a couple of degrees in like the last 30 minutes. Nights are tough.

And I've learned something that I didn't know before. It is responsible journalism to say that 80 percent of people who get this statistically wind up OK, meaning they don't go to the hospital. They get through it.

It is not humanly responsible though, from an ethical perspective. Now that I'm one of the anointed, and these people reach out to me, you suffer when you have this at home, unless you are ridiculously lucky, statistically, and maybe karmically as well.

I can't tell you how many stories I've had of people who've had over 100, 102 fever for 8, 10, 12 days.

And just to tell you what kind of toll that can take, look, it's not about life or death. I don't mean it that way. Otherwise, I wouldn't be doing the show. I'm not looking to scare people. I'm trying to do the opposite. I've lost 13 pounds in three days.


C. CUOMO: Now, I'm a big guy. I started off at 230 pounds. My wife is feeding me like, you know, we were still in the dating phase. You know, so it's not like I'm not - I'm hurting for nutrition. I'm eating and drinking constantly. I'm just sweating it out, and it's the sickness.

So, yes, 80 percent, we're going to make it through, but the idea that it's easy, so you can be nonchalant, that is so misleading fellas. That I now know for a fact.

COOPER: Are you saying she fed you better in the dating phase?

C. CUOMO: Oh, yes.

COOPER: Well that's a whole new story.

C. CUOMO: That's a whole - that's a whole other situation, Anderson. I can't--



C. CUOMO: That will take us a long time.

GUPTA: Hey, Chris, I just need to say for the record, I think Anderson agree with me, we - we had suggested you not work right now. I mean I know you're - you're incapable of not working and - and talking about this. But, just for the record, we - we did suggest that.

I do have a question though for you because, you know, you're a journalist. And now you're dealing with this for real - for real time. And you're - you're probably always trying to figure out how to - how to take care of yourself and - and digging like a journalist does.

What are you learning? I mean you're really in it now. Have you learned anything that works for you? C. CUOMO: Here's what I know that the chicken soup is not just anecdotal. You look online, even if you go to JAMA, you know, The Journal of American, you know, go to The Medical Association Journal.

The - that has worked for me, I believe. I believe that it has helped me lower my fever in periods. I have been counseled to try to endure fever as much as I can because the fever is the body's fighting mechanism.

Now, what I've also learned is there is so much BS on the internet that people are trying to peddle as cures, fake pills, fake tonics, these mixtures of things that are actually decent ingredients.

Vitamin C, Vitamin D, are great supplements to have. But 10,000, 20,000 units, they want you to take of this. You're not going to overdose. But, you know, it can be really hard on your system.

People are selling a lot of lies, and people are buying them up because of the desperation, and I get it, but they don't work. There's no proof in any of them. And I think we have to be very careful about people preying on desperation.


COOPER: So, what is, you know, what do you anticipate tonight? I mean you talked earlier with - with the Governor, with your brother, and revealed that he came to you in a ballet costume with a wand during your - the bad night you had last night.

C. CUOMO: Yes.

COOPER: What does the night look like for you? You said your fever spiked. What do you think your fever is about right now?

C. CUOMO: Well I could probably tell you if you want. But it's probably around 101-ish. Now, I run a little cool. My normal temperature is 97.6, not 98.6. So, even when I'm at 99 that would not be a big deal for most people. But, for me, I'm already warm.


So, what happens is, at night, you know, your body temperature goes up in the late afternoon anyway. This is, you know, this is - anybody with a kid, you know, knows that dance.

But I will get pain in my face now, headaches, profuse sweating. Literally, my vision in my left eye is a little blurry from pressure, from sinus pressure, and some manifestation of the virus. I've talked to several clinicians and experts in this. They've all said it's a very common thing.

And then, you can't sleep because you have a fever. And you have these wicked phantasmagorical experiences that are not dreams.

When I say I saw my father sitting on the end of the bed, I would have gladly raised my hand, as an affiant, and testified to it under oath easily. Why, because of the fever, because your body's all screwed up.

So, what I'm saying is yes, I'm going to make fun of some of this stuff. But it isn't funny when you're living it for people, and I do not mean to dismiss their pain. I'm just trying to help people not be too spooked because everybody's so spooked about getting this that if I get it what will happen. You'll survive.

But, at the same time, if you think you're going to take the social distancing lightly, or you're going to be nonchalant with any of the beautiful things that Sanjay laid out in that video, I am asking them to send me a copy of your video, Sanjay, because Cristina has been going through those protocols in the house.

You know, she's taking care of all of us right now. And it's so important to do everything the right way. Otherwise, you wind up exposing yourself.


C. CUOMO: But I'm just telling you, Anderson, you'd make it. But it's so hard that to say that it's nothing, don't worry about it--

COOPER: Right.

C. CUOMO: --is totally disingenuous because you are going to experience things you likely never had.

COOPER: I'm glad you said it because part of me has thought, you know, I'd rather just get this now, and get it over with, and I mentioned that to my doctor the other day. And my doctor's like "That's idiotic. You don't want to get this at all" obviously.

C. CUOMO: Look, I wish I would've gotten it sooner but, you know, so I could've told this stuff to people a month and a half ago, and we could have broken this bubble of "Everything's going to be OK," you know.

And obviously, I'd always rather have it than any of the people in my family. Thank God, they're still non - you know, they're still asymptomatic. But you don't want it, brother. I tell you that.

GUPTA: Yes, I mean it's funny. We talk about, you know, the numbers of people who lived and people who have died. But, you know, this is the in-between part, which can be pretty brutal.

I mean, you know, Chris, it's interesting because obviously you're here talking to us, you're at your brother's briefing today. He said that he thinks that you having the virus is - is going to be a great public service. And I think he was being honest. I don't think he was being ironic when he said that.

But I mean is it - is that your goal here, I mean, right now, talking to us even?

C. CUOMO: Yes, it's my only goal because in between doing this hit, or doing my show, sorry about the phone call, the - you know, we - we have a gate in - at the house that we're renting. So, every time somebody drops something off, the thing goes off, sorry about it. Anyway, I can't let anybody in the house. You know what I mean? They

can't come through the gate--

GUPTA: Right.

C. CUOMO: --because I don't want to get them to expose to anything.

In between the hits, and in between when I'm doing the show, I am a waste. I sleep probably 10 hours of the day, if I can, you know, in and out. I try to walk and do these breathing exercises because I'm petrified of getting pneumonia.

I have a really good friend who had the same symptoms I did. She's every bit as strong, if not in better shape, than I am. And she had three, four days good.

And now she's got this thing attached to her face that I never want to see in person, let alone have, and it scared the hell out of me because the unknown is frightening, and you lose any illusions about yourself real fast.

And I'm hoping that people say "All right, he's making it. But he's not full of it either. He's not telling me this is some cake walk" because that would be a lie.

And I want people to know that you can deal with it if you get it. Don't be so afraid of this virus that had put you into a panic, and that it keeps you from making smart decisions.

Conversely, don't make reckless decisions either because you think you'll breeze through. I haven't heard of anybody who has.

GUPTA: And, Chris, just quickly, I know we're running out of time. But you - I mean, again, because I want people to realize it. And we talk even after the show, so people are checking in on you because, you know, people are really worried.

But you also have an oxygen monitor as well. Is that right?

C. CUOMO: Yes.

GUPTA: I mean you are checking your own oxygenation.

C. CUOMO: Yes. And--

COOPER: And what is that for?

C. CUOMO: So, it's really important, Anderson, thank you. The - it gives you two measurements. You put your finger in it. It's an infrared. They're like sold-out now.

People sent me a bunch. I'm trying to get them at the office, so I can give them to people. People have been so generous, man, I got to tell you. When we say that in the worst of times, the best of us comes out, it is so much more true, than it is just right (ph).

And what it does is you put your finger in it, and you have to have warm fingers. And as my doctor explained it to me, in a very funny way, she said, she - you should take it the way somebody takes a marriage proposal. Never go with the first offer, always work it a little bit.

So, when you put your finger in it, you will get your blood oxygen level. You need it to be above 94 or so. But it may not be because you're - it's infrared and it's not precise, so you do it a few times.

And it tells you what the percentage of oxygenated blood is that you have. And if it's below 94, you're starting to get into an area of potential distress, and it gives you that, and your heart beat.


The heart beat is not as sensitive unless you're in a labored breathing situation. But I check it eight, nine times a day.

COOPER: Chris, we wish you the best. And I hope tonight's not as bad as last night.

C. CUOMO: And I hope if I have to have somebody dancing around, doing funny things, it's neither of you two guys because I don't want to have to have that image in my head.

No, listen, thank you. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to tell people. It's not a cake walk. But we can get through it. And if you don't have people, around you, to take care of you, the way I'm blessed to have, reach out to people who you know who have this.

COOPER: And Chris?

C. CUOMO: Do whatever you can to help them. Yes?

COOPER: And just to be clear, I mean you don't know necessarily how you got this. I mean, you were doing--


COOPER: --as much as anybody on social distancing and - and stuff, right?

C. CUOMO: Probably no because of the job. You know, I mean I was talking to a lot of people.


C. CUOMO: And going to places. And I was not thinking that I wouldn't get this. I thought I would get it. But I was not going out of my way to be a fool about it.


C. CUOMO: You know, I mean I was trying to do things that are reasonable within the lines of what our work is, especially given the situation I'm in with the State right now like when I do have a couple of good hours, I'm still trying to help with procurement for the State because they really are fighting State by State, which is so stupid, to get the equipment that they need.

So, I don't know how I got it, and most people don't, Anderson. And we're so far behind on testing. We're telling ourselves these lies about testing. We're nowhere near where we need to be.


C. CUOMO: And we're not going to be in this race, so nobody knows how they got it really.

COOPER: Yes. Chris, thank you very much. Appreciate it.

GUPTA: Call you later.

COOPER: Chris is a perfect example of how the virus is spreading, no known contacts, following as much as possible social distancing, health guidelines, still contracting.

And, as we've been reporting, there are now more than 1 million cases worldwide. If you have questions, tweet them at the #CNNTownHall. At the bottom of your screen, you'll see our social media scroll.

It's a good time to bring in Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove who's the Technical Lead for COVID-19 for the World Health Organization.

Doctor, thanks so much for being back with us. When we last spoke with you on March 12th, there were more than a 100,000 cases worldwide. Tonight, just three weeks later, there are more than a million cases worldwide.

Overall, what's the biggest message you want people around the world to know right now about this virus?

DR. MARIA VAN KERKHOVE, WHO TECHNICAL LEAD FOR COVID-19 RESPONSE: Well, thanks for having me back. Sorry if I'm whispering. I have a baby next door, so I'm trying to be quiet.

COOPER: That's all right.

VAN KERKHOVE: Yes. We, as you said, the - the case numbers are increasing, and - and they're increasing in a lot of places across the globe. My message is similar to what I said on March 12th.

There's a lot that we can do to actually control this and to bring transmission down. There's a lot that individual viewers themselves can do to try to protect themselves from getting infected. And there's a lot governments and leaders can do to protect their citizens.

We know what works in terms of finding the virus and looking for cases. First thing we have to do is be able to know where the virus is, so that we can take measures to actually reduce the possibility of people transmitting the virus from one person to another. And so, there's a lot that that can be done, and I think that's - there's hope.

And I think people need to understand that we have learned a lot from many countries, in Asia, we're learning a lot from countries in Europe right now, and there's hope. There's a lot that needs to be done. It's not going to be an easy fight.

And I just heard your previous guest, Chris describe what this actually means to be infected. It's going to be tough, but we can get through it.

GUPTA: There's a big discussion going on, Doctor, right now, in the United States around masks.

As you may have heard, the Mayors of New York and Los Angeles now urging, you know, their millions of residents to wear some sort of face-covering in public. The Trump Administration seems to be moving towards some similar sort of recommendation.

I've looked closely at the World Health Organization's guidance on this. I'm wondering what do you - what do you think? Is this the right direction to be going in?

VAN KERKHOVE: So, thanks for mentioning the guidance. So, a lot of people here, the Director General, Dr. Mike Ryan, and I, on the press conferences, and they hear what we say there, and we - we highlight some - some key aspects.

But we have a whole series of guidance that's much more detailed that's online, as does U.S. CDC. So, there is a - there is a significant debate that's out there. But scientists like to debate, so that's nothing new.

What we know is that what we recommend is that people who are sick, wear masks, medical masks I'm referring to, not N95 masks or those respirators. Those must be reserved for our front-line workers who are caring for patients.

We recommend that people who are sick to wear a medical mask because we know that people who have the virus can transmit through these droplets, so that's important.

We also need people who are caring for those who are sick to be wearing the masks. And so, we know because it's called source control, which means that we're preventing for onward transmission.

But we have to prioritize the use of masks for our front-line workers, if that's one thing I can stress, medical masks, respirators, gloves, gowns, these are people who are putting their lives on the line to help us, to care for other people, and they must be protected.


COOPER: So, for other people, I mean the President has said, you know, people could wear scarves or bandannas things. Would that be something the World Health Organization would suggest? VAN KERKHOVE: So, we are constantly looking at evidence, all the time, for the use of masks for anything that is related to this and related to health issues.

We are talking with scientists around the world, including U.S. CDC scientists, they're - they're such a strong partner of ours, about this issue, and the use of this. And we're looking to see what is - what works in terms of preventing people from being infected or for onward transmission.

We're constantly looking at what's coming out. There's a lot of studies around influenza. We have very few studies around COVID-19. But it's a respiratory pathogen. So, we make some assumptions that they can be transmitted in a similar way.

We're looking at what will work and making some recommendations for the general public. What I can say is that the judgment needs to be risk-based.

It needs to be based on what is the potential exposure that that individual have in whatever they're going to be doing. It relates to where the virus is. It relates to their vulnerability, you know, if - if they have a risk of developing, you know, more severe disease.

So, any of those decisions that Governors and Presidents and Heads of States and leaders make need to take that into account.

COOPER: You were part of the World Health Organization team that traveled to China earlier this year. Independent experts, and officials in the Trump Administration, and others, are - are questioning the official numbers coming out of China.

Are you confident about the information from Chinese authorities on the number of cases they were handling?

VAN KERKHOVE: You know, I - I question numbers all over the world. That's what we do. What we're working on is with - with countries having the ability to find cases, test cases. And the only way we can do that is actually if we're looking for them.

So, there's reporting that's coming out through the - the identification of testing of suspect cases and their contacts who develop symptoms. But it depends on the testing strategy in each country.

What we're trying to do is - is you mentioned we're almost at a 1 million, or we just reached a million cases. It depends on how each country takes those steps to look for cases.

I know. I've spent two weeks in China, as you mentioned, and saw what they were doing to actually look for those cases, how aggressive they were in looking for them.

In addition to looking for known cases, they actually went out into the communities, and tested other samples, respiratory disease samples, which a number of other countries are doing as well. But it is difficult to interpret all these numbers in terms of where each country is in its trajectory. Some countries are - you're seeing very large growth.

But even in the United States, transmission is not even. You know, you have differences at - at state level. It's not national levels. So, it's important that - that people are looking.

COOPER: All right. Let's turn to viewer questions.

This one actually, the first one actually is about China. The question is why is China cleaning the streets and store walls and we are not doing that, I mean, in the United States? Do they know something that we don't?

VAN KERKHOVE: So, we don't recommend the spraying. So, I don't - I don't know exactly why each country's deciding to do that. Some of them are doing that. Others are not.

What we know about this virus is how it transmits and how it transmits through droplets, through close contact, through the touching of fomites or surfaces, contaminated surfaces, which can be cleaned with - with simple disinfectants.

But the virus is not lingering in the air. It's not, you know, out on the streets. You have to be in close contact with one another. So, cleaning those - those surfaces right around where patients is, that's important.

GUPTA: Let's get to another viewer questions from Jennifer. And she writes in this, "I currently have COVID-19 and believe after 16 days that I'm finally coming out of it.

I understand that I have antibodies and I'm not likely to be re- infected. However, I'm wondering about the possibility of a mutated version/strain resurfacing in the fall or next year that I may be susceptible to."

What do you think, Doctor?

VAN KERKHOVE: Well I'm glad that Jennifer is feeling better, and I'm glad that she's getting out of that, and I think that's an important message for your viewers, is that people who do get infected with this, many will have mild disease, and they will recover just fine.

And there are people who will have more - more severe disease, and that's where we need to make sure our front-line workers are cared for, so that they can care for patients who are sick.

In terms of the virus, the virus is stable, and we haven't seen changes. We've seen normal changes in viruses as - as all viruses change just slightly.

What - we don't have great data right now on an immune response. We've seen some preliminary data, which suggests that people will have a strong immune response. We're only - we're only in our fourth month right now. So, there are many people, more than a 100,000 people who've recovered.

We need to follow those individuals over time to see how long that immunity or that immune response will last.


COOPER: Jerry King from Gretna, Louisiana, sent in this video question. Let's watch.


JERRY KING, INSURANCE AGENT: If an overactive immune response is causing Coronavirus deaths, would an immune-suppressing drug like Prograf benefit by slowing overactive response to the virus?


COOPER: Doctor?

VAN KERKHOVE: Yes. That's a good question. So, that that's - there's a number of therapeutics that we're looking at right now, as you know.

These medications, some of which are - are repurposed for, for COVID- 19, are under evaluation for COVID-19. They need to be evaluated in appropriate trials, clinical trials, so that we know which drugs work in an appropriate setting.

At the present time, we don't have any drugs that are specific for COVID-19. There are medications that are being used to alleviate some symptoms. But in terms of treating COVID-19, we don't have any drugs that are currently approved for that.

But there are a number of clinical trials that are ongoing. And we should have results of those in the next month or two, or a few months, so that we can actually come out and say "This works, and this is safe, and this can help people."

GUPTA: And, you know, it sort of raises this question, Doctor, you know, is it, you know, when people get really sick, or even die from this, is it because of the virus itself, the infection, or is it because of this, the body's response to it, the inflammatory response to it? I think maybe that's what he was sort of driving at as well.

VAN KERKHOVE: Yes. So, we're working with our clinicians across the globe to really understand how people are dying, and what they're dying from.

Because as this virus invades the body, and - and affects different - different parts of the body, some people will, as you know, some people will have infection, and they won't develop severe disease, and some people do.

So, we need to really understand why that is, and that needs to be done through these studies that are - that are happening in hospitals right now, and what - what is actually happening in causing people to die through multi-organ failure or through sepsis. Those are critical questions right now. And - and that information is still being gathered.

COOPER: Dr. Van Kerkhove, we appreciate your time. Thank you very much.

VAN KERKHOVE: Thank you.

GUPTA: Thank you.

COOPER: Earlier, Dr. Fauci said in our Town Hall that the whole country should be under a stay-at-home order. We'll talk to Governor Andrew Cuomo about that. His State of course is - this State is at the very heart of the pandemic. We'll be right back.



COOPER: This is our fifth CNN Global Town Hall. We're getting answers to your questions ahead.

GUPTA: First though, we want to welcome New York Governor, Andrew Cuomo, to the discussion. It's no overstatement to say that his State is dealing with far by the heaviest burden of the pandemic in the United States so far.

COOPER: Governor Cuomo, I don't know if you've seen this yet.

But Outside Elmhurst Hospital, just a couple hours ago, the FDNY showed up with fire trucks, sirens blaring, to show their support for doctors, and nurses, and everyone, working to save people's lives. I just want to show the - the video while we're talking about this.

I'm wondering what your reaction is when you see something like this. I mean you're - you're in the - you're in the midst of this.

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO (D-NY): Well, Anderson, you have to remember, in the - in the darkest of days, New Yorkers shine the brightest, right? We went through 9/11, and that changed us, as I believe this situation is going to change us.

But we dealt with terrible adverse - adversity. We dealt with loss. We dealt with pain. We cried. We went to funerals. And we came together, united, stronger than ever before. And that's the New York instinct. That's the American instinct.

We have a problem, we rally, and we rally together, and that's what you're seeing at Elmhurst Hospital. But you're seeing it all across the State.

COOPER: You said today that New York only has six days left before it runs out of ventilators. We also learned this week that the National Stockpile has been depleted. Where - where are you going to get more ventilators from? I mean, where - where does this go?

A. CUOMO: Well, look, we're going to a place we've never been to before, right? This comes down to a very simple proposition.

Can your healthcare system deal with the number of incoming at the apex of the curve? That's all this comes down to. It's an organizational question. Can your hospital system deal with it?

And there are three elements. It's beds, it's supplies, and it's equipment. Beds, frankly, are the easiest to get. It's the - the staff and can the staff keep up with it with all the physical exhaustion and the emotional exhaustion? And do you have the equipment?

And the key piece of equipment is the ventilator, something I never heard of a couple of months ago, but now, I know intimately well.

And these ventilators are very - it's very simple. Person comes into the ICU unit. They need the ventilator or they die. It's that basic a proposition. We have about six days, at the current burn rate, of ventilators.

And B, you can't buy any more ventilators. This State had purchased 17,000 ventilators, more than any other state in the nation.

And they never got delivered, because they're all coming from China, and 50 states are competing. And my - I suspect that it's been a bidding war, and the highest order won. But we can't get any more ventilators.

So, we have a very elaborate plan on what to do if we run out of ventilators. We're going to move to splitting of ventilators where there's a protocol. One ventilator can handle two tubes, two patients.

We're going to use BiPAP machines and retrofit BiPAP machines. We're using the anesthesia machines as ventilators. We've canceled all the non-elective surgery, so that's freeing up ventilators.

And then, we took an inventory of all the ventilators in every hospital in the State of New York, and I'm going to re-deploy the ventilators to the places that need them.

GUPTA: You know, you and I talked on the - on the phone, Governor, I remember, before one of your - your press conferences.


And, even at that time, you know, I think we're struck by the fact that this was kind of known, right, predicted at least, from models, how many ventilators would be needed for some time.

And now, you're in a situation where you have to sort of bid against other states. I know you have other - other things up your sleeve, in terms of splitting and BiPAPs and stuff. But now you have to bid against other states for these - these very, very necessary pieces of equipment.

Everybody in the planet wants these ventilators now. So, how is this going to work? I mean, the prices go up? How's this going to work for you? A. CUOMO: Yes, it doesn't work. That's how it works, Sanjay. It doesn't work.

50 states bidding for ventilators, China is basically the only company that has ventilators available. The President's working with General Motors, Ford, et cetera, to create more ventilators.

But that's, for me, down the road, and not really relevant, because I have one of the shortest curves, right? My apex is as soon as seven days to 21 days. So, a company tooling up and producing a ventilator in two months doesn't do anything for me.

But that's - nobody would have designed the system where 50 states scramble to get their own equipment. And, by the way, in the cruelest irony, you have to buy it from China.

GUPTA: Right.

A. CUOMO: They're making the gowns. They're making the gloves. They're making the ventilators. And then, the federal government, FEMA, when they got involved, they're buying from China. So, you can't buy a ventilator.

You're it's - when I started buying the ventilators, they're about $22,000. They then went up to about $50,000, and you just can't get them. So, that - the horse is out of the barn on that.

Obviously, nobody would say that this was the best way to do it, hindsight 2020, if you could go back and re-design it, to have 50 states compete, but that's where we are.

COOPER: The - I don't want to get you in a tit-for-tat with the President. But he has been critical of New York's response to the virus, again today, saying, "New York unfortunately - unfortunately got off to a late start." You should have pushed harder, essentially saying, "Stop complaining."

Now, I know a lot of states still haven't done it. But in retrospect, should these stay-at-home orders, should they have gone into effect earlier? What do you make of the President saying that, you know, that calling people "Complainers" essentially?

A. CUOMO: Yes. Look, I don't want to get in to a tit-for-tat--

COOPER: Right.

A. CUOMO: --with the President. Truth is there's been no governor who's been more critical of the President in the past, and there's been no governor who this President has attacked more than me in the past either. So, there's an inequity there.

But, in this situation, I think we have a very honest relationship. He's been helpful to New York. And I said, "Look, if you partner with us, and help New York, I'll call it the way it is. And if you don't help New York, I'll call it the way it is." Today, the President was very helpful, actually converting our Javits Center, which is 2,500 beds, to a COVID facility. I called him this morning. He got it done by the afternoon, so kudos to the President.

But this is not about what states could have done. I - I ordered 17,000 ventilators. I only have 4,000 ventilators in the State. I ordered 17,000 ventilators. States cannot perform this task right?

Emergency Management Rule 101 is defer to the localities, let the states handle it, let the localities handle it.

That's why Hurricane Katrina, if you remember, President Bush said, "The Mayor messed up" because the Mayor was supposed to handle Hurricane Katrina. That's rule one.

Rule two is yes, the locals handle it, unless they cannot handle it. And then, the federal government handles it, right? I did federal response, during the Clinton Administration, and we did hurricanes, floods, Midwest floods, L.A. earthquake. The local handles it unless they can't handle it.

This is not a situation that states can handle. A state's emergency management response, we do moderate hurricanes, moderate flooding et cetera. But we don't do public health emergencies. A state doesn't have the capacity.

I have a 50,000 bed health system. I don't have the resources to be able to build an additional 50,000 beds, just in case there's a public health emergency and a pandemic every 10 years, you know, it doesn't work that way.


But I think that's all hindsight. Look forward, there is - there is an opportunity here that this is not nationwide at one time, OK? This has a different curve in different places.

New York has the first curve, right? And every locality is - is watching their own personal curve, and getting prepared for the apex of that curve, to make sure the healthcare system doesn't get overwhelmed.

But New York has one curve. New Orleans has the second curve. Detroit has the third curve. And it's like watching a slow-moving hurricane across the country where you know the path that it's taking.

Why not deploy the national resources and just stay ahead of the hurricane, just stay ahead of the hurricane? Help New York, because we have the first curve, help me with ventilators, help me with staff.

The top of the apex is only two or three weeks. Dr. Sanjay can tell you, average length to stay on a ventilator is 17 days. I hit that apex. I'm on the other side of that apex. I'll pack up everything we have, and I'll move to the next place in the country that can help.

There is a rolling deployment that is possible that says not everyone has to have everything. We will bring support staff, and bring equipment, and stay one step ahead of the hurricane. That I think is--

COOPER: Has that message been received at the White House?

A. CUOMO: --a better way to deal this.

COOPER: I mean, are - do other people buy into that?

A. CUOMO: Well look, I don't know an alternative strategy. You can't buy a ventilator. You can't buy PPE equipment. You can't buy a gown. You can't buy a hospital bed. You tell me an alternative. I just don't see it. Now, it has to be nationally organized.

But I'll tell you, Anderson, the American people are there. I said at a press briefing, I do these press briefings in the morning, I asked for public health volunteers. 20,000 people from across this country volunteered to come help New York State.

Public health professionals, 20,000 in two days, they want to help. They get it, by the way. When you - when we have a disaster like a hurricane, or a flood, or something, this is what we do. We call it mutual aid, right?

So, if New York has a hurricane, and there are downed power lines, and we have no power service, that's when you see those utility trucks driving all - all across the country on the highways, right?

If Florida has a problem, I send my entire utility crew to Florida. If Arizona has a problem, I send it to Arizona. And vice versa.

If we see that common logic there, and that commonality, why wouldn't you do it here, where you have lives on the line?

COOPER: Governor, we want to talk about masks in a second.

But I also want to - just right now, want to bring in Robert Kraft, the Owner of the New England Patriots. His team partnered with Massachusetts to purchase at least 1.2 million N95 masks. Kraft also purchased another 300,000 protective masks for - for New York State.

Robert Kraft, welcome. Thank you for what you did. Tell us how this - how you decided to do this, how it came about?

ROBERT KRAFT, OWNER, NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS: Well we - the Governor of our State has a close relationship with my eldest son, who's the Chair of the Board of Mass General, a great hospital. And he asked if there was a way that they could get these masks that they had bought in China back to America.

And he's a great Governor. He's doing a great job. And we happen to have a little plane that we use for our team that was idle, and we put it together, and had our team work with a lot of individuals, and flew to China.

And with the help of companies like Martin Lau at Tencent, and the Ambassador, and people on the ground, and our crew who flew, they just went in there, and they did a great job, and bringing it back-- COOPER: And you're giving 300,000 to New York as well.

KRAFT: Well what happened there, I've been watching Governor Cuomo over the last few weeks. And I just think he's done an outstanding job. He's at the epicenter of this crisis. And he has a calming way about him, and he brings confidence.


And I thought his - and I have a personal tie to New York City. Columbia was good to me, and gave me a full scholarship, as a kid. I love the city. I love the people there. I don't - I don't think what's going on is - is something any of us could imagine.

So, I spoke to the Governor. And he - he requested that is there a way we could get some of these masks for New York. And I spoke to our Governor, and he said, we're bringing them back. He'd love to help Governor Cuomo.

I love that a Republican Governor, a Democratic Governor, putting the country first and we agree - we agreed to buy them and given them to the people of the City of New York, just to try to bring some hope and goodwill, and let people know we're trying to bring everything together, and generate some good feelings.

And also to give Governor Cuomo confidence, like he brought those workers, the fact that they responded, we wanted to know that people like ourselves also care about the City of New York and the State, the - the government that functions there.

COOPER: Governor, I imagine that's a good call you got and - in all the days probably you get a lot of bad calls. That was probably a good call. Do you know what you're going to do with the masks where they're going to go?

A. CUOMO: I think that - Anderson, I think that was the only good call I've gotten in about 10 days. Mr. Kraft is a special man. And what he did here is just pure generosity and goodness.

Governor Baker, my colleague, in Massachusetts, he's a good friend. We have a good working relationship. But even - even for Governor Baker, for a Governor to say, "I'll help another State besides my State," that really is says something about his character.

So, it's heart-warming. It's much needed. As everybody knows, these masks are - are so rare, and so necessary. So, it was not only a beautiful gesture and kindness. And I thank Mr. Kraft, and I thank Governor Baker. But it's also much needed.

You have - you have nurses who are afraid, frankly, that they don't have the proper PPE. So, this is - this is a big deal.

GUPTA: And--

KRAFT: We have landed 6 o'clock tonight, got unloaded. We have a big tractor trailer loaded with 300,000 masks. They'll be coming to the Javits Center late tomorrow morning.

GUPTA: Was this - was thing challenging, Mr. Kraft to--

A. CUOMO: Thank you. Thank you.

GUPTA: --to go - to fly into China and - and I mean I'm not sure what the status of the - of the travel restrictions or anything. I mean a lot of people I know are trying to help. But just to get it done, to get into China, get these masks come out, how challenging was it just the - the process of that?

KRAFT: Well I like to think I'm 35. I'm a little older. This probably was the most challenging operation our organization and team ever had to do. It was - there was a lot of red tape. But a lot of people cooperated.

We have three Governors. We had a Counsel from China, the Tencent people, our crew who flew probably more hours than they should have, but they knew how important it was.

And, you know, it's just - it's like doing your job, and never taking time-off when something is really important, and the team effort, and I'll just tell you, the response we've gotten from America that when our plane came back, people are looking for good things.

We are - there's so many great people. And this is the greatest country in the world. It's time for us to rally together and solve these kinds of issues.

COOPER: Hear! Hear!

Hey, Governor, let me just ask you. Would you recommend for New Yorkers who, you know, go outside tomorrow, should they be wearing some sort of covering, some, I don't want to say masks, because I don't want to, you know, imply that you don't want to do anything that takes away from the front-line, from the - the medical workers, the police who need masks.

What do you - what's your recommendation on that?

A. CUOMO: Look, what the - what the scientists will tell you is that if unless the fabric has a certain density, the virus can get through. But look, it - it couldn't hurt unless it gives a person a false sense of security, right?

Don't think because you're wearing a bandanna over your mouth that you're - you're immune. It could help if someone is - has the virus, and it could block some exhaling, sneezing et cetera.

It couldn't hurt. It's not exactly fashion forward. But it couldn't hurt from a public health point of view.

COOPER: Fashion forward! I know Governor you're - I don't think you're one to be concerned about fashion forward, so wisely so. Governor Cuomo, thank you--

KRAFT: Well--

COOPER: Robert Kraft?

KRAFT: Could I just say one thing?



KRAFT: I think that your brother, Chris has, you know, been inspirational. And him being vulnerable and speaking the way he has is - is a great service to the country.

And I - I want to thank your family for being willing to share that, and bringing us in the bedroom, and it's a great lesson for everyone that thinks we can be cavalier about this.

A. CUOMO: No. Thank you, Bob. And I - I agree 100 percent.

You know, the day he found, my brother, Chris, the day he found out that he was positive, that night he did the show. I mean you want to talk about guts and courage.

And he said to me - first thing he said to me is, you know, this could actually be a public service because I can show people who are so afraid of this mysterious disease what someone actually living with it goes through, and demystify it.

And he's so right there because, you know, we're fighting a virus. We're fighting fear and panic and anxiety as much as we're fighting this virus. So, to see someone on the TV, who has the virus, and can talk to you about it, and they're still doing their job, I mean God bless him.

I don't like to give him too much credit because his head tends to expand quickly but--

KRAFT: Well I think he was trying to show--

A. CUOMO: --I was shocked.

KRAFT: --who your Mom's favorite son was.

A. CUOMO: Well he's - he has a thing with that Bob because I'm clearly my mother's favorite son, and she said it many times, and he still is a little upset about it. But he'll get over it.

COOPER: Well, Governor, it was nice of you to show up in his fever dream last night, and I can only imagine how you're going to show up in his fever dream tonight.

A. CUOMO: That was so mean what he did. That was so mean.

KRAFT: Your ballet--

COOPER: Governor Cuomo. A. CUOMO: And don't repeat it, Anderson, do not repeat what he said--

COOPER: It's actually in my mind.

A. CUOMO: --about me (ph).

COOPER: Governor - Governor Cuomo, thank you for what you're doing. Keep at it. Robert Kraft, thank you so much for - for all--

GUPTA: Thank you.

COOPER: --you are doing. Appreciate that. And thanks for being with us. Straight ahead--

KRAFT: Sure.

COOPER: --we'll take on the psychological impact for the pandemic because it shows no sign yet of slowing down. We'll be right back.



COOPER: Welcome back to the CNN Global Town Hall. Want to turn now to the mental health component of this health crisis, and its widespread impact, not only here in the United States, but across the globe.

Joining us again is Dr. Christine Moutier, who's a Psychiatrist.

Dr. Moutier, it's good to see you again.

I mean it's certainly fair to say that across the world right now, so many people are struggling with very big emotions, which play out in all sorts of different ways for - for every individual.

And a lot of folks are, you know, we're - we're not together with the people we might normally be together with, and - and have that kind of - to help share that burden. I know a big point of yours is to recognize the - the - to recognize those emotions, and not try to suppress them, which I must say is my natural instinct.

DR. CHRISTINE MOUTIER, PSYCHIATRIST: Yes. That's so true, Anderson.

None of us really grew up, learning how to experience and process our emotions really all that well. But, you know, I think the most important thing to remember right now is that even in the face of the current situation, and even with the spread continuing, we are not powerless.

In fact, those effective strategies that we've known how to use, to optimize our resilience, and manage our mental health, are as effective now as they ever have been. And so, it's, you know, in a way, it's kind of back to the basics.

All of us, as human beings, need regular sleep, and we can protect that, some regular exercise, nutrition, make sure you're hydrating, you know, limit your alcohol intake, have some routine and structure to your day, stay connected to each other, and limit media, and other - and sort of sensationalized influences in your life right now, so that - there are things we can all be doing.

GUPTA: You know, one of the things, Doctor, you know, I think you - you talked about last time was that it's - there's not a lot of certainty, right?

I mean, and one of the most common questions I get is, is how long is this going to last? Is it - you know, is it going to be a new sort of way of life? It's that uncertainty that really, I think, fuels a lot of people's anxieties.

You can't give them certainty right now. So, what do you - what do you tell people? And what do you tell patients?

MOUTIER: Right. Well when we face uncertainty, which actually is a lot of the time, throughout our lives, and not just during this period of time, but there are some exercises we can do.

And, in fact, there are - there's one concept that is actually about inoculating yourself from overwhelming anxiety, or overwhelming depression, by taking a look and kind of breaking it down.

You know, when things are uncertain, it helps to kind of put some boundaries around it, and actually even thinking about what is the worst-case scenario here, what is the best-case scenario, and what are - what is the most realistic scenario, and then planning for that.

And those are all things that we can do to, you know, really just help ourselves have some boundaries around that. Even writing it down can help, and talking to others, trustworthy people, in your life, or if you have a therapist.

Again, a reminder about telehealth, right now, it's a great time to connect with that.

COOPER: I just finished reading, or re-reading, I should say, Viktor Frankl's "Man's Search for Meaning," which is a book I re-read a lot. And it's about how one man survived the concentration camps.

And it does give me hope to - to think that, you know, terrible things have happened to many people throughout time, and they have survived it, and they have, and we are the descendants of those people who have gotten through terrible things.

And I mean it's not - I don't know, for some reason, that - that gives me hope that it gives me a sense of strength that we are not the first. Yes, this virus may be a novel virus. But we are not the first to undergo trials and tribulations.

MOUTIER: That is such an excellent point and, by the way, one of my favorite books as well.


And as I think about it, we've been through, even in recent history, many pretty massive-scale natural disasters, other outbreaks.

And many people, including our first responders and healthcare professionals, who are up-front, right now, they have been through this before, we have been through this before, and been resilient.

And it is so true that the human spirit is incredibly naturally resilient. And there are things that we can do to take care of our mental health that will actually enhance that natural resilience.

GUPTA: And we want to take care of each other. I think that's a natural instinct as well.

Doctor, let's get to a couple viewer questions. This one is from Glenda, came in via Facebook, and she asks, "What are the long term effects of social isolation?"

MOUTIER: Well, first I want to make the point that - that you all have been making a lot as well, which is social distancing, which is the term right now, isn't quite accurate. It's actually physical distancing.

And so, even though we may be physically separated from those in our lives, we do not need to stay socially disconnected. And so, that's the first and most important thing.

It is actually fine to be physically in your own space over a long period of time, if you're having communication with people, who you can support, and they're supporting you back.

It really goes beyond words to try to describe the power that we feel when we encourage and give each other loving kindness and support. It's bigger than fear, so it's a time for that.

You know, I just heard about the firefighters of New York, coming out, and parking in front of hospitals, running their lights, and standing outside, and clapping for the nursing staff and the medical staff for five minutes. I think it was just - just yesterday.

And that kind of encouragement just fills up our human spirit, and we can do that for each other.


COOPER: Yes. Last time you were on, you talked about brain health and - and taking care of the brain.

And I really thought about that a lot after you were on and - and you mentioned the importance of sleep, and I've really been focused on just trying to go to sleep earlier and actually work on improving my sleep, and it's made a really huge difference.

I've noticed the difference just in a matter of days. So, I want to thank you for that, and urge everybody to kind of take that into consideration, just the thinking about your brain and taking care of it.

I know, Sanjay, you need - you need sleep.

GUPTA: Yes. I--

COOPER: You and I were talking about this.

GUPTA: It's good advice. I need to take it for sure.

But Dr. Moutier, thank you. We hope to talk to you again soon. And - and beyond the resources, she just mentioned the CDC also has a page of resources. You can see the web address right there on your screen.

COOPER: And before we leave tonight, I want to salute the people risking their lives for us. They're first responders, and doctors, and nurses, and lab specialists, and X-ray technicians, and physical therapists, and firemen--


COOPER: --and EMTs, and paramedics.

GUPTA: Grocery store clerks, and delivery drivers, bus drivers, mail carriers, I don't think they ever thought they'd be risking their lives to do their job.

Our CNN Heroes team put together this tribute to the hard-working men and women to whom we owe a lot of gratitude.






UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm a New Yorker. It's essential that I'm out here.


GRAMMER: No matter what this world'll throw. It won't shake me loose.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a little risk coming outside but kind of feel like a superhero, saving the world.


GRAMMER: I'll reach my hands out in the dark. And wait for yours to interlock. I'll wait for you.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a warzone. It's a medical warzone.


GRAMMER: I'll wait for you.


A. CUOMO: This is an extraordinary time where you need to see the people at their best.


GRAMMER: I'm not givin' up. I'm not givin' up, givin' up. No not yet. Even when I'm down to my last breath. Even when they say there's nothin' left. So don't give up on.


DERMOT SHEA, NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: It is in our heart, and it is in our soul, to sacrifice, to serve, to fight, for you.


GRAMMER: I'm not givin' up. I'm not givin' up, givin' up. No not me. Even when nobody else believes. I'm not goin' down that easily. So don't give up on me.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I travel coast to coast. As long as we can haul food for the American people, you will have plenty of food on those shelves.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My heroes are all of the people that I work with who are showing up and helping us fight this pandemic.



GRAMMER: I will fight. I will fight for you. I always do until my heart is black and blue.



COOPER: Don't give into the fear, let's keep going. Awesome! This is truly an effort by everyone in America to get through this crisis together. Sanjay, I think your daughter, I understand, is even getting involved.

GUPTA: Yes. You know, it's - it's been one of my, I guess, favorite things, in the midst of all this, seeing how kids have been adapting to this new normal, doing their part to help as well. You know, you forget, you forget the kids. END