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CNN Live Event/Special

CNN International: Netanyahu Meets House Speaker Ahead of Speech; Soon: Israeli PM Netanyahu to Address Congress; Many Democrats to Skip Netanyahu's Speech; Biden and Netanyahu Set to Meet on Thursday. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired July 24, 2024 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

PAULA NEWTON, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and a very warm welcome to CNN's Special Coverage of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's address to U.S. Congress. I am Paula Newton in New York. Joining me in just a few moments from now will be my colleague Jim Sciutto, who will be live for us over the next few hours from Capitol Hill.

Right now, though, happening at Capitol Hill and around Washington, protesters have been out on the streets since early this morning, some of them holding signs, calling for Mr. Netanyahu -- calling Mr. Netanyahu a war criminal. You can see some of them there. In fact, police earlier broke up a scuffle between pro-Palestinian and pro- Israeli demonstrators.

Many antiwar protesters are demanding a ceasefire in Gaza. One doctor from Boston said he's protesting Mr. Netanyahu being welcomed by politicians who sent him weapons to "kill children in Gaza." We want to get more now from Tom Foreman, who is in Washington for us. He's been called covering all of this.

Tom, an incredibly consequential few hours to come amid turmoil in U.S. politics. They've obviously spoken about Mr. Netanyahu as being the great political survivor, and yet, here he is in Washington. And listening to all of those protests, again, from different sides of the political aisle.

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This must be testing his political survival instincts to be here at this time when Washington is already so fraught. These protesters have promised a day of rage over this. It's already turning into a week of rage. Protests started outside his hotel on Monday when he arrived. They continued yesterday with a whole bunch of people being arrested in one of the office buildings for the lawmakers here after they were pounding on doors, demanding change. And they are coming at this from all different fronts.

As you noted, Paula, a short while ago, we spoke to, for example, a person who is in great disagreement, a cousin of one of the hostages, in great disagreement with the whole idea that Netanyahu would come to the United States at this time. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) IFAT KALDERON, COUSIN OF HOSTAGE, OFER KALDERON: It's wrong that he's here. He should have stayed in Israel, do the hostage deal and to bring them home now, not to come here and not to speak. It just -- it's a political step for him to come and to talk. So, I think it's wrong.

And I came here because it's important that the American crowd, everybody will understand that the only way to bring the hostages, all the 120 hostages home, is just by a deal, a hostage deal. There is no other way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOREMAN: And of course, our colleague, Miquel Marquez, out there talking to folks out there. But this is a day that certainly has the city on edge. Police have put extra barriers up all around the capital. They have brought in a couple of hundred extra police officers to help keep not only the protesters under some sense of control but away from each other, if possible, so that they don't have some kind of fracas breaking out outside.

But in these extremely tense times, just think of all the things that have happened in the past two weeks around Washington, this is yet another bit of steam on the kettle here. Paula.

NEWTON: Yes, absolutely. And to give everyone some perspective, we just had the FBI director speaking in the last few hours about the failures at that Trump rally. And then, here, we have, obviously, what is a great security challenge in Washington. That's just one of the issues circling around Washington right now.

I mean, look, we heard from that family member of one of the hostages that this was not an appropriate time for Netanyahu, in her opinion, to come to Washington, and yet, here he is. Is there a sense, at this point in time, about what Netanyahu's mission will be, especially given the fact that there is such a divide on Capitol Hill itself with so many Democratic lawmakers actually boycotting his speech?

FOREMAN: Yes. Well, he was invited by the Republicans. And clearly, he is here to bolster whatever ties he can to protect the long and historic alliance between the U.S. and Israel. I mean, look, a lot of these protesters are saying the U.S. needs to start truly cutting off funding weapons to Israel, in part because the argument is that Israel has not listened to entreaties from the U.S. to say, you need to agree to this deal, this peace deal, let's move on from this.

[13:35:00]

So, there's a lot of pressure. His obvious mission is to make sure that those ties remain strong, even though, at this point, everything here seems largely fractured. We'll just see if these crowds can stay under some degree of nonviolence and control as the day goes on and we get closer to the speech itself.

NEWTON: Yes, as you point out, Tom, it is clear that these protesters, while they are exercising their right to free speech, law enforcement wants to make sure that it remains peaceful. Tom Foreman, for us, will continue in the next few hours to come to keep an eye on those protests. Appreciate it.

I want to speak now with Jim Sciutto, who is live for us in Capitol Hill. Jim, good to have you on board for the next few hours. We say it so often, don't we, Jim, you can't make this up. Here we have Netanyahu was first invited by the Republican speaker, Mike Johnson. But this was, in fact, an invitation also extended formally by the Democratic leadership as well.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: That's right. Two of them, both, Chuck Schumer, the Senate majority leader, and the Republican speaker of the House, Johnson, longtime supporters of Israel. So, this was a bipartisan invitation. But the welcome, Paula, is not bipartisan.

When you look to the Democratic side of the aisle, some 80 House members will not be attending Netanyahu's address, that is deliberate, at least nine senators will not be attending, and perhaps most notably, the vice president, Kamala Harris, and now, of course, the presumptive Democratic nominee for president, will not be presiding over this address as the vice president normally would do, all of that to send a message to the Israeli prime minister that they're not on board with his country's response to the October 7th attacks.

Of course, all of them condemned, in the strongest words possible, the horrible events of October 7th, but it is the continuing and growing human toll in Gaza, many tens of thousands of civilians killed, according to the Gaza Health Ministry and the progress of the war, continued attacks inside highly populated areas of Gaza, despite repeated U.S. protests, that is the message that they are sending here.

So, while the invitation is bipartisan, certainly the welcome and the reception is not. And that's a reflection, more broadly, of divisions in this country. Quite sharp political divisions between Republicans and Democrats, but even within the Democratic Party itself, over U.S. policy towards Israel. Because you remember, some of President Biden's -- members of his own party were critical of his response to this, and his unending support for Israel even as the progress of the war has taken the direction that it has.

Paula, I think as we look at this, we should listen to what the prime minister says when he does begin his address. Does he reach out perhaps to the other side of the aisle? Does he reach out to his critics and critics of Israeli policy? Perhaps we should manage those expectations given the Israeli prime minister not being one to do so.

Paula, as I understand it, we're joined now by one of those Democratic members of Congress who is not attending the Israeli prime minister's speech, and that is Sara Jacobs from California. Congresswoman, thanks so much for joining me today. We appreciate you taking the time.

REP. SARA JACOBS (D-CA): Of course, happy to chat with you.

SCIUTTO: So, tell us, in the simplest terms, why you won't be in the room for Netanyahu's address? The fourth such address by Netanyahu to the U.S. Congress, which we should note is a record. He now surpasses Winston Churchill for having received that honor. Why won't you be there?

JACOBS: Yes. Look, I think this speech sends the wrong message at the wrong time. I'm Jewish. I'm very connected to my family who lives in Israel, to my Jewish community. And I was horrified by what happened on October 7th, but that is not an excuse for the decisions that Prime Minister Netanyahu has made since then, that have been horrific and have not actually made Israel any safer.

You know, I met with hostage families earlier today and they told me that they feel like Netanyahu has abandoned them, that he's ignoring them, and that he cares more about his image than bringing the hostages home. And they told me these families, whose family members are still being held hostage in Gaza, that the best thing we can do for their family members is to end the war and get a ceasefire and bring their family members home. That's what hostage families are asking from us, not this political grandstanding we're going to see from Bibi Netanyahu.

SCIUTTO: I've spoken to Israelis, some of whom I've known for some time in repeated trips to Israel who question Netanyahu's motives, particularly as regards a potential hostage ceasefire deal that he's more interested in his own political survival than actually making that deal. And he's drawn some criticism, as you know, from some hostage families who make that same argument. Do you believe that Netanyahu himself is standing in the way of such an agreement?

[13:40:00]

JACOBS: You know, I hear the same thing from my Israeli family. We've seen many, many Israelis take to the streets to protest Netanyahu to push him to make a deal. I think it's clear that he doesn't believe a deal is in his political interest. And that's why it's so important that we in the United States keep pushing for one because that is what will bring the hostages home.

SCIUTTO: Of course, your party now has a new presumptive presidential nominee in the Vice President Kamala Harris, who, like you, will not be inside the room today for the Israeli prime minister's speech. But before I get to your sense of her political prospects, let me just ask you about Kamala Harris' position on Israel.

She was one of the first senior U.S. officials to publicly criticize the loss of civilian life in Gaza at the hands of Israeli forces. Do you believe that Kamala Harris represents a shift for Democrats from Biden's really almost unequivocal support for Israel and the Israeli leader?

JACOBS: Look, I've had many conversations with both Vice President Harris and the second gentleman, Doug Emhoff, the highest-ranking Jewish person ever in the history of the country. We've talked about issues. I know it's something that they both care deeply about.

And I think we have seen President Biden push the Israelis and to do more and to do more around getting to train aid in to do more around getting to a ceasefire deal. I don't think we would even be this close without the efforts of President Biden and his administration. And I'm glad we have a presidential nominee now who has been so forward in talking about the need for a ceasefire.

SCIUTTO: So, bigger picture, political question, if I can. As I said, you have a new likely, almost certain democratic nominee for president. Do you believe that Kamala Harris has a greater chance of beating Donald Trump than President Biden did? In other words, is the change at the top of the ticket good for well, Democrats not just at the top, but down ballot?

JACOBS: Yes, look, I worked as a staff member on the 2016 presidential campaign. So, what I can tell you is this far out, we'll never know all of the counterfactuals, but I'm very excited about Kamala Harris as our nominee. And I think we are seeing a lot of excitement across the board.

We saw her raise record breaking donations. We've actually seen more people register to vote, the majority of whom are under 34 than we saw (INAUDIBLE) people to register to vote on her Instagram. And I think the excitement and energy we're seeing in particularly from young people, is really exciting. And I think going to be, what, brings us to victory in November.

SCIUTTO: Congresswoman Sara Jacobs, we appreciate you joining. Look forward to hearing from you more in the coming days and weeks. And to all of you. We are just moments away from the Israeli prime minister addressing the U.S. Congress. The fourth such address Prime Minister Netanyahu will have given, that is a record, an honor. He now surpasses Winston Churchill for that honor.

You see there the House Speaker Mike Johnson who, just a short time ago, spoke alongside the Israeli prime minister. We will bring you those remarks as soon as they begin. Meanwhile, we're going to take a short break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:45:00]

NEWTON: And welcome back to our continuing coverage as we await the address of Prime Minister Netanyahu to a joint session of the U.S. Congress. You see the speaker there, Mike Johnson, getting ready, and to his right is, in fact, Ben Cardin, who is there in -- sitting in, in fact, for Vice President Kamala Harris, who had a conflicting appointment in Indiana. She just gave a speech there. It was a campaign speech.

I want to bring in U.S. Security Correspondent Kylie Atwood, who's at the U.S. State Department for us. And. Kylie, you've been following, you know, these ceasefire negotiations so closely. Top of mind as we await this speech, of course, the fate of that ceasefire deal hangs in the balance. What do we expect here about that, precisely, from Netanyahu, if anything?

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN U.S. SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think that is one of the biggest questions of this address. How does it impact those ongoing negotiations to reach a ceasefire, reach a hostage deal? Frankly, we really don't know. We haven't been given much insight into what the prime minister is expected to say, but whatever he does say about those ongoing negotiations is going to be critical, particularly because, of course, he is heading into a meeting with President Biden tomorrow.

They continue to try and work towards a deal, and U.S. officials have essentially said that they believe a deal is within reach. So, is really, you know, on Israel to provide its latest response to Hamas. And go forward from there.

One thing we'll also be watching for inside that chamber is what the atmosphere is like. Of course, the prime minister is going to set the tone. Does he reach out and thank President Biden for all of the support during the Israel-Hamas war? How much does he thank him? Does he make any gripes about needing more U.S. assistance as he has done in the past? We'll watch and see, you know what his tone is like with regard to the Biden administration.

But we'll also watch and see what folks in the room who opposed Netanyahu, giving this speech in the first place, are going to actually do. We know that Rashida Tlaib, a member of a Palestinian member of Congress. who is called Netanyahu a war criminal is going to be in that chamber today. We'll watch and see what she does. She has a guest, she says, who lost more than 150 members of their extended family throughout the course of this war, in the -- on the Palestinian side, of course.

And then, we should also note that there's going to be a number of family members, of hostages who are still held by Hamas in the chamber as well. And I'm told that they have been grappling over how they should respond to the prime minister's address. Of course, they are frustrated with him. They believe that a deal should be achieved at this moment in time. They believe he is standing in the way of a deal.

But they also are being careful. They don't want to you know, get Republican members of Congress frustrated with them. They think Republican members could actually be beneficial to pressuring Netanyahu to get this deal. They want to be respectful of the U.S. chamber here. So, they're thinking of ways that they can silently protest perhaps in that chamber today.

And we should note that Speaker Johnson has threatened that there would be arrest if there was any sort of protest inside the chamber. So, that's one thing, of course, to consider, but we're watching to see how all of these different elements set the tone, set the atmosphere for what happens up on Capitol Hill today.

NEWTON: Yes, Kylie. And thanks to you as you continue to stand by with us as we await that speech and indeed, a very delicate balance for a lot of the lawmakers in there who have been very clear that this was not the way they wanted Netanyahu invited and certainly not now, but they are sitting in their chairs waiting for this address to come nonetheless. Kylie Atwood for us. We'll continue to check in with you.

[13:50:00]

We want to now bring in for some perspective on what to expect from the speech, former Israeli consul general in New York, Alon Pinkas, and Aaron David Miller, a former Middle East negotiator for the U.S. State Department. And of course, our own Jim Sciutto is standing by for us also at Capitol Hill.

Alon, I want to start with you, you know, undoubtedly, Netanyahu is a divisive figure at home and abroad. If he sticks to past history, you and I both know he's not exactly the conciliatory type. Are you expecting something different here, especially given the atmosphere and the fact that he's really skating on thin ice when it comes to the ceasefire deal with so many, now, again, at home and abroad, blaming him for why there is no ceasefire deal?

ALON PINKAS, FORMER ISRAELI CONSUL GENERAL IN NEW YORK: Well, Paula, I expect nothing from his speech and I expect nothing from his speech for a variety of reasons. First of all, let's put it in a political context. A prime minister who still refuses to take responsibility for the worst debacle, the worst catastrophe, the worst day in Israel's history.

In the midst of a three-front war with the Hamas in Gaza, with Hezbollah in Lebanon, and with the Houthis in Yemen, with 120 hostages still in captivity in Gaza for no apparent reason is going on a vanity tour to Washington. So, that's inexplicable. So, no matter what he says, I have little expectation.

Now, as for the trip itself, look, you've all subscribed to this theory that he was invited. He invited himself. And it began with Republicans who wanted to make this into a wedge issue to highlight divisions amongst Democrats who gullibly joined Republicans because they didn't want to be seen or perceived as making this into a partisan issue. And before you know it, he's coming to Washington.

Now, as for conciliatory, look, he knows how to deliver speeches. He's going to thank Biden. He's going to thank the U.S. He's going to thank the U.S. Congress for authorizing $14.3 billion. All of that could have been done on a Zoom or that could have been done on Twitter or X.

And then, days from now, Friday, he's going to Canosa, which is a euphemism from Mar-a-Lago, where he's going to kiss the ring of Mr. Trump. So, honestly, this is all about politics. This has nothing to do with foreign policy. This has nothing to do with Mr. Netanyahu's conduct or prosecution of the war.

NEWTON: Aaron David Miller, to you as well, and I hate to break it to you, but several months ago when you and I spoke, you predicted this, that there would still be no ceasefire. You just could not see a way that Benjamin Netanyahu could make it happen, or for that matter, anyone on the Palestinian negotiating side as well.

I want to ask you, though, can this possibly be an opportunity? Is there a way, now with Netanyahu on American soil, that the Biden administration can make it clear, especially with Biden being unshackled right now, he's no longer running, to make it clear this ceasefire deal must happen and must happen in the coming weeks?

AARON DAVID MILLER, FORMER U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT MIDDLE EAST NEGOTIATOR: Yes, you know, thanks for having me, Paula. I would never want to disagree with my very good friend, Alon Pinkas, who's going to forget more about Israeli politics than I'm ever going to know. But I think the main thrust of what Alon is saying is correct.

This is a trip about Netanyahu's politics and our politics. And I would argue to you, even though Middle East negotiations have two speeds, I've made this point to you before, Paula, slow and slower, that there is a reasonable chance by mid-August for reasons that have nothing -- very little to do with the Biden administration, much more to do with pressures, both on Hamas and Mr. Netanyahu, that it's conceivable, with the Knesset out of session, which is going to be -- make it very difficult to bring this Israeli government down, that there's a possibility, shouldn't Mr. Netanyahu want to go for of an actual deal, that deal probably would last no more than through phase one, a limited exchange of hostages for Palestinian prisoners, and a six-week ceasefire, but even that would be unaccomplished.

One last point. I mean, I do agree with the Alon on this point. Mr. Netanyahu did not come here to negotiate, did not come here to make concessions. He came here and he was not expecting the environment in which he's now entered. He came here to maintain a functional relationship with an outgoing president, which he's going to need for the next six months.

He's not interested in angering a putative, new American president, possibly Kamala Harris. And Alon is right on target as far as his forgiveness tour, the apology tour to Mar-a-Lago, which could, in fact, be the most important piece of this, other than vanity politics that Alon had alluded to with respect to this trip.

[13:55:00]

So, I think you'll hear a lot of very nice talk. I would call it show bipartisanship. But make no mistake, Benjamin Netanyahu has made the Republican Party his party. And I think that he -- and he has a lot of responsibility to bear for the eroding bipartisanship. The real adhesive that holds the U.S.-Israeli relationship together.

SCIUTTO: Yes. To your point -- and I might put this first to Alon. Given the divisions with -- that we're going to see on -- at play here during this address, 80 House members, Democrats not attending, nine senators, the vice president not presiding as she normally would, but also to Aaron's point, to yours, Alon, Bibi Netanyahu's own quite close relationships with Republican lawmakers and the origin of the invitation to visit here, perhaps a self-invitation pointedly, is it his preference that a Republican wins the presidency in the fall? Does he perceive that as better for his own interests?

PINKAS: Absolutely. Listen, Jim, I don't know that he's necessarily going to be the prime minister when the next president of the United States enters office on the 20th of January 2025. But if he assumes that he still gets to be in office, he undoubtedly, unequivocally wants a Republican. I'll go even farther than that, Jim. He is not coming to Washington as prime minister of Israel. He is coming to Washington as the Republican Senator from West Virginia. And in that respect, his affinity with the Republican Party, which I can understand, I'll see you (INAUDIBLE). And in his defense, he's never concealed it, it's going to be (INAUDIBLE) in the next 24 hours.

SCIUTTO: We should notice we're watching a live feed from the floor there, of course, as Paula mentioned, you have the house speaker, Republican Mike Johnson, presiding and Democratic Senator Ben Cardin know Kamala Harris. You might typically see a vice president there, but we should also note that the Israeli prime minister is going to be bringing family members of some of those hostages still held in Israel. 116 hostages held. It's believed that 44 of them are dead. But five of the 116 still living are Americans.

Aaron David Miller, is it in Israel's long-term security interests to throw its hand in so transparently with one political party here in the U.S.?

MILLER: It's in Benjamin Netanyahu's political interests. But is it -- in my judgment, is it in the interest of a healthy, resilient, reciprocal U.S.-Israeli relationship? No. I mean, I worked for Republicans and Democrats. I voted for Republicans and Democrats. And I've never seen Israel, an issue on which R's and D's and independents, frankly, have united in time and over time, descend into what you now have.

You have a Republican Party that is now the Israel right or wrong, or the Israel can do no wrong party. You have a deeply divided Democratic Party, not just between progressives, who are arguing for the imposition of serious costs and consequences on Israeli behavior, but you now have mainstream, moderate, centrist Democrats. Chris Coons, Chris Murray, Chris Van Hollen, calling openly for conditioning military assistance to Israel.

And I think what is so stunning to me is that the divisions within the Democratic Party, the debate is what in essence does it mean for Democrats to be pro-Israel? It's an extraordinary transition and transformation, Jim, from what we've seen before, because in the end, bipartisanship is the adhesive that has held this relationship together and it's critical for those who want to see it continue in a healthy and reciprocal manner with real reciprocity. And I'm one of those people.

It's critically important that sense of bipartisanship continue. Mr. Netanyahu is certainly responsible for degrading much of that bipartisanship, but so is this sort of argue culture of our own politics and the Republicans that have clearly made it a wrong case that they are the only -- in their view, the only truly pro-Israeli policy in Washington, the party in Washington.

NEWTON: Yes, and this is something that could have scarcely been imagined. Netanyahu in 2015, in fact, said in his speech, he said to both Republicans and Democrats.

[14:00:00]