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Carter Motorcade En Route To Navy Memorial; Trump Criticizes Carter's Legacy With State Funeral Under Way; Today: Carter To Be Honored At The U.S. Capitol; Carter Motorcade Arriving At Navy Memorial; All Five Living Presidents Expected To Attend Carter Funeral. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired January 07, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

STUART EIZENSTAT, AUTHOR, "PRESIDENT CARTER: THE WHITE HOUSE YEARS": Now, other presidents, President George W. Bush, Bill Clinton have tried to go beyond just a museum to themselves, the center, but no one's been able to get the breadth. And I think that The Carter Center will definitely continue. It's got a very large endowment, got a very good leader in Paige Alexander, had hundreds of employees.

And so, even without, I think, Rosalynn and Jimmy I think The Carter Center will be an enduring legacy.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: One of the things that it's going to be very difficult for people to remember is - Anita - Jimmy Carter in the '70s was kind of cool, right? I mean, it was - this is the era of southern rock.

ANITA MCBRIDE, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO LAURA BUSH: UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

TAPPER: He - I was talking about this with his grandson, Jason Carter, yesterday about when he did that interview wearing an Allman Brothers band t-shirt.

MCBRIDE: Mm-hmm.

TAPPER: But he would go to Dylan concerts, he would go to Allman Brothers concerts, he would go to Willie Nelson concerts.

MCBRIDE: He brought them to the White House.

TAPPER: He brought them to the White House. Again, I don't want to overstate the case, we're still talking about a President of the United States, it's just so cool that somebody can be. But it was a really different era and a culture shock for Washington, D.C.

MCBRIDE: Well, things were changing and actually when John mentioned about technology and, you know, CNN coming to the White House, Jimmy Carter brought the first computer to the White House in 19 ...

TAPPER: And solar panels.

MCBRIDE: ... and solar panels on the roof, an environmentalist, you know, really ahead of his time, but - and I remember going into - in the White House in the '80's, early '80's working for President Reagan. We had this electric typewriter in our office and one Wang computer. I mean it took a while to really modernized ...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That sounds like CNN.

MCBRIDE: ... the White House. But he was attempting to really bring technology to the agencies. Other things that he did, you know this - he was the first president to actually bring championship teams to the White House. Started that tradition in 1978. The Washington Bullets had won the NBA. He invited them. 1980, Pittsburgh ...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The last time they won.

MCBRIDE: ... and Pittsburgh - both teams - for - won the World Series and won the Super Bowl.

TAPPER: Right, they'd done football before but this was all the sports, all the major sports, yes.

MCBRIDE: All the sports. And on the same day that he had the Pittsburgh teams there to honor them in 1980, the "Miracle on Ice" had happened at the Winter Olympics and he called that coach.

So, I mean those things that they are part of bringing a flavor of who you are to the White House and (INAUDIBLE) ...

EIZENSTAT: So, the arc of his life, a hundred years, you start in technology with a battery-operated radio. That was their connection to the world because they had no electricity.

MCBRIDE: Yes.

EIZENSTAT: When the famous Joe Louis-Max Schmeling boxing match occurred, the black sharecroppers wanted to come in. They couldn't come into the house. They weren't allowed by his father. So, he put the radio on the rim of the window and when Schmeling went down to Louis in the first round, the blacks were afraid to rejoice because even though Schmeling was a German the whites in the South were all for him. But he goes from that humble background with a battery- operated radio to AI. And this is a nuclear engineer. He loved and was fascinated with technology.

TAPPER: Yes, the ...

DANA BASH, CNN HOST: Let's go back to the go back to the Allman Brothers really quick.

MCBRIDE: Yes.

TAPPER: Yes.

BASH: Because I just finished Cher's ...

MCBRIDE: Cher ...

BASH: ... memoir. Did you read it? MCBRIDE: I did.

BASH: And she talked - she was married to Greg Allman for a short while. They have a son, Elijah, together. And she talks about meeting Jimmy Carter. That Greg Allman brought her to Georgia and said, you've got - because he is a Georgia native - you've got to meet this guy, Jimmy Carter. He is the real deal.

And she said, politics, I'm not getting involved in politics. And he said no. And she went and met him, and met his family and was completely smitten with him and really worked for him. And I'm sure there were - I mean, obviously we had JFK, and we had Sinatra and other celebrities who were involved in politics before. But you don't necessarily think of Jimmy Carter as, you know ...

MCBRIDE: Cher ...

BASH: ... a person - well, Cher - a person who is in with the Hollywood set. But he was and they really helped him get elected, never mind the governorship, but get elected to the White House. She came at the - whether it was - I believe she was in the White House on Inauguration Day, but she certainly came many, many times after.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR, "NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP": I think one of the things of the legacies, perhaps, of Jimmy Carter is also that he authentically was closer to the people and wanted to bring that sensibility into the White House. And so many, I think, presidents, they tried to tap into that but he actually inhabited that fully as a person, beginning with his inauguration, which was an event that he wanted to be, kind of, open to more people, that he made the tickets inexpensive so that his supporters could attend.

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I think that's the lasting - one of the lasting elements of his presidency. He was an ordinary person and then when he left the White House, he went back to being an ordinary person and he never was comfortable in Washington. He maybe didn't succeed as much politically because of that. There was a disconnect between the kind of career politicians and the person that he believed himself to be, the types of things he was willing to do, the types of bartering he was willing to engage in.

He - at one point - was reading critical letters from regular people to him publicly, which very few presidents would do these days because these are men who ascend to this position because they think very highly of themselves. He was at - to some degree - willing to say, well, I'm accountable to you, the American people.

TAPPER: Yes, one of my favorite things that Jimmy Carter did was he signed into law the Inspector General provisions that we have in the federal government these days. Originally, it was just 12 inspectors general, an independent body within each agency and that lives with us today. I think it's expanded to something north of 70 inspectors general. But it's very, very difficult to criticize a government from within the government, but he created these protections to get rid of waste, fraud, abuse and corruption within the government. And that remains today, at least as of 3:05 this afternoon.

As we watch the Carter motorcade, let's bring in Brianna Keilar at the U.S. Navy Memorial.

And Brianna, tell us more about the ceremony we can expect to see when the motorcade arrives.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Hi there, Jake.

Well, it's - here at the Navy Memorial which Jimmy Carter authorized. It is here because of him to honor those who served in the Navy as he did. He was a submariner. The only president who was sub-qualified. And when his casket arrives here in a hearse, it is going to be greeted by midshipmen from the Naval Academy, which is his alma mater from not far away in Annapolis. You can see them behind us, two companies of them, including the 15th Company, which he was part of when he was there in the Naval Academy. They will be here to meet the former president and the former Lieutenant.

He will be - the - Jimmy Carter's casket will be transferred to a caisson, which is an honor that is available to all presidents, their family members as they are planning their funerals for those presidents. But it's not something that everyone chooses. Reagan chose it, George H.W. Bush did not. We are going to see it again today for President Jimmy Carter.

It's a ceremonial version of an artillery wagon that traditionally would have carried supplies to the front line and would have brought back the dead and wounded. And it's now become this mounted escort to honor the nation's fallen, operated by the old guard of the 3rd Infantry Regiment, Caisson Detachment.

And as we've been reflecting on the life of Jimmy Carter here in recent days, talking about how a peanut farmer ends up in the White House, there's a really appropriate detail about these soldiers who are going to carry his casket on horseback to the Capitol.

The specialist, Chase Redfern, is going to be riding the section horse. That is the lead horse. It's a five-year-old Friesian named "Bullet." And Redfern actually grew up farming in Iowa. Just a really interesting little detail that one farmer is going to be carrying another farmer to the Capitol with a large procession behind him, including family members who will be making this walk, Jake. One that is going to mirror the walk that Jimmy Carter himself made during his inaugural parade with his family.

TAPPER: Oh, yes. I actually kind of remember that. I was seven or something like that. I remember when he walked down Pennsylvania Avenue. Brianna, we'll check in with you in a sec.

This farewell to Jimmy Carter, of course, is coming on the brink just days away from the second Trump presidency. And CNN's Jeff Zeleny is covering President-elect Trump in West Palm Beach, Florida.

Jeff, what are we hearing from Trump about President Carter on this solemn day? JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORREPONDENT: Jake, President- elect Trump seized upon one of Jimmy Carter's biggest and proudest accomplishments and achievements. That was the Panama Canal Treaty that was signed in 1977.

In recent weeks, the President-elect has been talking about how he wants to reverse that and get back to Panama Canal. Of course, this was one of the biggest legislative achievements that Jimmy Carter had.

Republicans at the time supported it as well. Even John Wayne supported it. He included all of these people to get support for this. But Donald Trump seized upon that, even as he called Jimmy Carter a good man.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: Look, I liked him as a man. I disagreed with his policy. So, hey, he thought giving away the Panama Canal was a good thing. I think it cost him the election. That and the hostages. I actually think that was a bigger factor, because that's a deal that just should not have been made. But again, this was a question that was asked of me. I didn't bring it up. I didn't want to bring up the Panama Canal because of Jimmy Carter's death.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: And look, through the course of Jimmy Carter's life, he saw 17 American presidents, including Donald Trump. And it's quite extraordinary when you think that one of his biggest achievements there, which was controversial at the time in the 1970s. There's no question that it reached bipartisan support. Now, it is in the crosshairs of Donald Trump.

But at that news conference earlier today, just 13 days before Donald Trump is indeed sworn into office, so many other headlines, including he said the Gaza hostages should be released before he takes office or all hell will break loose. He also declined to say if he would offer pardons for even the most violent offenders of January 6th and on and on a few other headlines.

But Jake, it was Jimmy Carter who Donald Trump mentioned several times. And I'm thinking back to when Donald Trump was in office, there actually was somewhat of a conversation between the two men about relations with the North Korea and China. But Jimmy Carter also said, yes, he was looking forward to living to a hundred, but he was also looking forward to even more to voting for Kamala Harris, which he did in Georgia a couple months before he died. Jake?

TAPPER: All right. Jeff Zeleny, thanks so much. Let's go back to Wolf.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: All right, Jake. I'm here with Kaitlan and Jamie as well.

And Kaitlan, what do you make of Trump deciding to slam Jimmy Carter over the Panama Canal Treaty on this day?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR, THE SOURCE: Well, you know, the Panama Canal, specifically with Jimmy Carter, you know, when you look back at when - why he made that decision, there were a lot of people urging him not to take that on then. They talked about how much political capital it was going to take for him to get that done. They brought a lot of senators, actually, and had them visit the Panama Canal at the time to try to help build support here on Capitol Hill. They actually felt like it worked.

I watched a recent interview that Jimmy Carter's secretary of state did a few years ago. And just on that front, you know - but when Jimmy Carter pursued that as many of his aides were urging him not to, he felt that it was important because he didn't know if he'd have two terms. A lot of people said, wait until your second term to try to get something like this done.

But he felt that it was important because it kind of speaks to the President Jimmy Carter was that he would do things that were not always politically popular if he thought that they were right. And, you know, looking at his time in the presidency and what that looks like as Donald Trump is preparing to retake power, there are several things that Jimmy Carter did that even norms that Trump then upended.

He was the first president to disclose his tax returns. Every president after Jimmy Carter followed suit until famously Donald Trump did not and still has not done so. And so, it just speaks to how Jimmy Carter viewed that office and what it should look like. And also coming in, of course, at a time after Watergate, when there was such little trust in the executive office that he felt such a need to restore that after Richard Nixon left office a few years before in the shadows of Watergate and what that looked like.

He also required rigorous disclosures from executive branch staff, because he thought it was so important that if you wanted to serve in the White House and you wanted to have a job, a taxpayer funded role, that it was so important that you were willing to be able to share that information and be transparent with the American people.

BLITZER: That motorcade is heading towards the U.S. Navy Memorial here in Washington, not far from where we are up on Capitol Hill.

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: You know, Wolf, to underscore what Kaitlan just said, both Jimmy Carter and Donald Trump do have one thing in common. They were Washington outsiders. But when you get past that, I think you could not imagine two more different leaders from the things you were talking about.

And Stuart Eizenstat mentioned earlier, he cut the White House staff down. He didn't want senior staff to have car services. And also, if you think about Jimmy Carter after the White House, one of the most enduring images that I think most Americans have of Jimmy Carter and Rosalynn Carter had to do with - did I lose a microphone here? There we go.

The Habitat for Humanity President Carter and Rosalynn Carter worked with Habitat for Humanity for, I think, about 35 years. They helped to build, repair, renovate about - I think it's 4,500 houses in 14 countries with more than a hundred volunteers.

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And the reason for doing that was because of the importance of affordable housing, something that Jimmy Carter cared about. And so, from Habitat for Humanity to going back to his home in Plains, Georgia, where he lived this very simple life, two very different men.

COLLINS: And what's so beautiful is that as right now, as the nation is preparing to pay tribute to him, there's still families living in those homes and enjoying the fruits of that labor and what Jimmy Carter passed on to other people.

But I'll say just really quickly, Wolf, as Jake was mentioning there, the inspectors general act that that President Carter proposed and signed into law initially for those 12 agencies, the ramifications of that are still felt here in Washington by none other than former President Trump, now President-elect Trump. His first impeachment may not have happened because we may never have known about his call with the Ukrainian President Zelenskyy had it not been for a whistleblower that obviously infuriated Trump so much at the time. But it just speaks to the ramifications of that.

BLITZER: It certainly does. We're tracking the Carter motorcade as it makes its way to here, Washington, D.C., the U.S. Navy Memorial. Stay with us to see the late president's farewell - journey through the nation's Capital. Right now, a quick break. This is CNN special coverage of the state funeral of Jimmy Carter.

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ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST, "OUTFRONT": President Jimmy Carter's motorcade, as you can see, stopped on the streets of Washington, D.C. right at the United States Navy Memorial. That is where his remains will be moved from the hearse to the caisson, the artillery wagon, the traditional transport for commander-in-chief there at the Navy Memorial.

Now, Jimmy Carter's family is going to be there. There will be a selection of musical pieces played, one of them, "Hail to the Chief," here at the Navy Memorial. As the procession continues, it will, of course, end there in the United States Capitol, where Jimmy Carter will lie in state ahead of his formal state funeral on Thursday. But in just these next few moments, we will hear those next selections. It's important to emphasize here, of course, that these are musical selections and moments that were chosen by Jimmy Carter and Rosalynn Carter over these past 30 years, that they knew that this eventuality would come and all the way back in 1986 began planning it.

Boris Sanchez is on Pennsylvania Avenue. Carter's funeral procession will pass by there. And Boris, there are - many there gathered to see this moment in history, this moment of pageantry and somber moment in American history. What are people telling you who have come out amidst the weather and the cold there in Washington?

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Yes, Erin, several hundred mourners gathered here on Constitution Avenue where that horse-drawn caisson is set to emerge as part of the funeral procession in just moments, once it leaves the Navy Memorial.

Several of the folks that I've spoken to here have come from across the nation to pay their final respects to President Carter. And one of them, Rebecca Lewis, actually came from Pittsburgh, braving the elements to be here today. And I wonder, what is it that motivated you to be here in person to say farewell to President Carter?

REBECCA LEWIS, ATTENDING CARTER FUNERAL PROCESSION: I just wanted to honor someone who is so important in my life. I just have the greatest deal of respect for him as a person who lived his life in love and in service, guided by his great faith. And it's an honor to be here. And it's - I'm - the caisson hasn't gone by yet and I'm very moved just to anticipate seeing his body today.

SANCHEZ: You mentioned President Carter's faith and you had mentioned to me previously that you had an opportunity a few years ago to watch him teach Sunday school. I wonder what you think he will be most remembered for and how his faith plays a part of his legacy.

LEWIS: That's a really good question. I did go down and attend his Sunday school. I taught for 30 some years, I believe, in Plains, Georgia, in a small Baptist Church. And I went down in August of 2019 and I was so inspired by him that the world's greatest leader could very humbly and very gently talk about talk about his faith. What was the other you part of your question?

SANCHEZ: That was it, Rebecca. We're going to let you get to watching that horse drawn caisson on as it steadily approaches us here on Constitution Avenue. Thank you so much for sharing this moment with us.

And Erin, we should point out, as that procession approaches just moments ago, the street Honor Cordon moved into place. These are U.S. service members. Actually, these appear to be a Navy service members standing right before us to greet the former president as he makes his way over to the U.S. Capitol. Erin?

BURNETT: All right. Boris, thank you very much. And, of course, Jimmy Carter going to be at the U.S. Navy Memorial where they will transfer that hearse to the caisson.

And the Naval Memorial, Tim Naftali, of course, crucial to him. He chose these points. He is - and I actually find this fascinating, I would never have thought this to be true unless I knew it to be true, that Jimmy Carter is the only U.S. president to have graduated from the Naval Academy.

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TIM NAFTALI, CNN PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: Yes. And there's another very important part of his biography that we should mark today. Until December, he was the last living president who had been on active duty in World War II. He did not serve in a combat zone, but when you become a midshipman, you enter the U.S. Military. And as Kai Bird knows much better than me, Jimmy Carter entered the Naval Academy in 1943.

And so, this is the end of an era in presidential history. This is our last president who had World War II experience. He is the last of the greatest generation. And he's also the last president who was a veteran of the Korean War. He was certainly on duty during the Korean War. I don't know if he was stationed in the Pacific. I think he was in the Atlantic.

But in any case, there is an enormous amount of history represented by this visit to the Naval Memorial. It's not just because Jimmy Carter liked the National Archives, which was across the street. It's also because ...

BURNETT: Yes.

NAFTALI: ... I don't think you can understand Jimmy Carter without keeping in mind what he learned in the military and what he learned late - learned from Captain Hyman Rickover. Jimmy Carter is always remembered as a peanut farmer. Yes, true. Jimmy Carter was also an engineer. He was also a nuclear engineer. He was a submariner. This is a complicated, highly professional, highly skilled man. And I hope all aspects of this man will be remembered as we pass through today and, of course, Thursday.

BURNETT: Yes, true polymath.

Kai, I am also in this moment as we see Jimmy Carter, his body moving, this procession, this pomp and circumstance that we are going to see, at a moment of profound - it's an unsettled nation. Let's just put it that way. Whatever your politics are, I think we all know it's an unsettled moment. You are going to see five U.S. presidents together - together at his funeral,

Former President Trump, soon to be President Trump, President Biden, President Clinton, President George W. Bush, President Obama. They're all going to be together. They were not all together at Biden's inauguration. Trump refused to go. Carter was ill.

So, this is the first time they've all been together since George H.W. Bush's funeral. And, of course, they weren't all presidents, but they will actually be together. And, you know, I just am thinking back talking to Jimmy Carter 10 years ago and I asked him about his legacy. He said, you know, what's your greatest legacy? He said, I would say keeping the peace. I kept my country at peace during very difficult times.

And it is his passing that is actually causing this moment of these presidents to come together when the country so desperately needs it. KAI BIRD, AUTHOR, "OUTLIER: THE UNFINISHED PRESIDENCY OF JIMMY CARTER": Absolutely. And I'd like to think that these five presidents will, you know, memorialize Jimmy Carter's life and remember his dedication to human rights and to peace. But speaking of him as a naval man, and he's now right at the Naval Memorial there ...

BURNETT: Yes.

BIRD: It reminds me of an extraordinary story that happened to him when he was a submarine officer serving - he was aboard a submarine in the Pacific. The submarine surfaced in a terrible storm. He was ordered to go up top and do watch duty. And suddenly a huge wave crashed into the submarine ...

BURNETT: Like a rogue wave sort o/f a thing.

BIRD: ... and swept him off, swept him into the Pacific Ocean. And seconds later, another wave swept him back right back on top of the submarine. It's - he should have been dead, but he survived this. And it was an extraordinary experience in his life.

Secondly, I can't help but notice that, you know, Jimmy Carter served for seven years in the Navy under then-Captain Hyman Rickover, developing nuclear submarine technology. And he decided to leave after seven years to abandon a very promising career in the Navy for two reasons.

One, his father suddenly died of pancreatic cancer, which ran in the family. And he went back and he was impressed by what his father had done and he needed to go back. But he also later told, many years later, he told one of his aides, Peter Bourne, that he just couldn't - he had decided he didn't want to associate the rest of his life with nuclear weapons.

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