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The Situation Room

Wildfires Burning Outside Los Angeles; Judith Miller Testifies in CIA Leak Probe; Pentagon Mixed on Iraqi Military Forces

Aired September 30, 2005 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

WOLF BLITZER, HOST: It's 5:00 PM here in Washington, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where news and information from around the world arrive in one place simultaneously. Happening now. It's 2:00 PM in southern California, where a second wildfire is now burning, even as thousands of firefighters struggle to contain the first. It's 5:00 PM here in the nation's capital, scene of two major developments in the CIA leak probe, a source revealed and a jailed reporter freed. And it's 5:00 PM in Cuba, where Elian Gonzales is speaking out in detail for the first time about his childhood ordeal which captivated two countries.
I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Two fires are now burning in the hills outside Los Angeles. We'll show you some live pictures we're getting in right now from Chatsworth. One of those fires in the Chatsworth area, 20,000-acre giant that's testing the skills, literally, of thousands of firefighters who have come in from all across the state. The other fire nearby. It's a brand-new fire. Specifically, in Burbank.

CNN's Peter Viles is live for us in Simi Valley. He's joining us now with more. These pictures are very, very dramatic. They say, Peter, it's getting better. It certainly doesn't look like it.

PETER VILES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This is where the fire is not necessarily getting better. It is certainly getting close to us, and we're standing in Simi Valley, where nobody wants this fire to come because this is a neighborhood of $800,000 homes. It's very heavily populated. The fire that they're fighting is right up there. It's making a run at that ridge. And just in the past 15 minutes or so, this army of firefighters made a change in tactics and started to literally fight this fire with fire, creating a fire break.

Joining me now from the California Department of Forestry and Firefighting is Cheryl Goetz. Cheryl, tell us what's going on up here.

CHERYL GOETZ, CALIFORNIA DEPARTMENT OF FORESTRY: Well, just recently, as you saw, the wind's picked up a little bit. A lot of that is from the fire itself. But the fire had a little unexpected turn of events. It kind of came to life again. We had temperatures just a little while ago of over 101 degrees. The humidities have dropped down to 10 percent. So the spotting (ph) potential is what has carried this fire as the wind has gone on. It made a run at that canyon, as you saw. And right now, the firefighters are engaged in a firefight right now to put some fire down on the ground and try to create a break in between that, to keep it from jumping over the ridge.

VILES: So some of the smoke we're seeing is from fires that the firefighters up there are deliberately setting. How far are those fires from the flare-up that's running up the canyon?

GOETZ: Oh, probably less than 100 feet.

VILES: Right. Right. And can you tell? I mean, are they -- are they holding their own up there, or is this fire moving on them?

GOETZ: It's moving pretty good. With putting that fire down on the ground, that should create a good break. The dozers have been working up there for the last hour, widening that fire line to give them a good chance to hold that up on the top of the ridge.

VILES: Terrific. Cheryl Goetz, thank you very much.

So as you can hear, Wolf, a little bit of drama up here as this fire is making a run at the ridge behind me. If it makes it to that ridge, it has maybe three quarters of a mile to go to hit a very heavily residential area, Wolf.

BLITZER: Let's hope it doesn't. Peter, thank you very much -- Peter Viles on the scene for us.

The other fire we're watching -- and we'll show you some live pictures -- in Burbank, California. That's about 10 or 15 miles away from this first fire. Let's bring in helicopter reporter J.T. Alpaugh. He's nearby in Van Nuys. You've covered a lot of these fires from the air, J.T. What's going on here?

J.T. ALPAUGH, HELICOPTER PILOT: And good afternoon, Wolf. We first made contact with this fire in the Burbank area yesterday afternoon, started to be a very small fire, about 10 to 15 acres, that was burning directly uphill, some very steep and rugged terrain. But what has happened is a lot of the resources that are committed over to the Chatsworth fire have not been able to get into this area to help work this fire. But they're starting to get more lines. And this fire specifically in the Burbank area has grown throughout the day.

BLITZER: How worried are you that a lot of these very expensive, beautiful homes, whether in Chatsworth or elsewhere in that area, in Topanga or in Burbank, could be in danger.

ALPAUGH: Well, I can tell you right now, in Burbank, there's not so many homes as there are in the Chatsworth fire and Topanga fire. Again, firefighters doing extraordinary job, as you see this LA County Fire Blackhawk, or what they call a fire hawk helicopter, come into Burbank to do a drop. This helicopter holds nearly up to 1,500 gallons of water, and he's going to put a drop right in here, as you see from the KKAL (ph) station here in Los Angeles. He comes around downwind of this fire, right above, and he'll be dropping that load onto the fire, as you see.

But this fire in Burbank not directly threatening any homes right now. There's a famous restaurant up on that hilltop called The Castaways that is directly affected. But I can tell you the Topanga fire, on the other hand, has been extremely dangerous -- as we go back to that fire. The area that Peter was talking about there was Meyer (ph) Canyon and Los Alicos (ph) Canyon, where they are starting to set backfires and trying to get that fire away from making a run at some of the Santa Suzanna (ph) Knolls homes that they were talking about earlier. So an extremely dangerous situation going on in both these fires.

Yesterday, we did get a break. The winds slowly shiftd and instead of having what they call a Santa Ana wind, which is a hot, dry wind out of the north, the wind shifted out of the ocean -- out of the way of the onshore flow from the southwest. So that brought humidity levels up just a little bit, and the winds died down completely to about 10 to 15 miles an hour, where they were 30 to 40 miles an hour.

My home is not very far from what you are seeing, on the fire on the left side of your home (SIC), and we had a very sleepless night that Wednesday night, the first Wedensday night where the fire made a run at our home. So very, very trying times out here. We're hoping that the weather continues to cooperate, so we get a knockdown on these fires in Burbank and the Chatsworth/Simi Valley area.

BLITZER: What are those helicopters that dropped that fluid -- is it water, retardant? What are they dropping?

ALPAUGH: Well, some helicopters you're seeing are dropping water. But we have the heavy sky crane, the Erickson Skycranes, which can hold up to near to 1,500 to 2,000 gallons of water. And what they added, it's called wet water, or some people call foscheck (ph), and that's a material added to the water to make it penetrate the fire more deeply and to lay down retardant -- retardant lines (ph). You can see a retardant line right down on the bottom of your screen, that orange line put down by these tankers to help create a firebreak, stopping that fire from moving any closer to any homes. But they do add chemicals to some of those water tankers to make -- make the water penetrate that brush a lot further and help put out those fires.

BLITZER: J.T., I'm going to have you hold on for a second. Tom Foreman is here in THE SITUATION ROOM. He's going to show our viewers what we're talking about, the locations specifically. Tom, you're looking closely at these two fires.

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: These are very difficult places to fight fires because when you're on the uphill side of it, you can't be there. That's the end of it because no matter what the weather's doing, fires like this create their own micro-weather systems with wind in them that'll blow up these hills like you wouldn't believe.

Let's look at Simi Valley and get a sense of what we're looking at. As we move in here over Los Angeles, Simi Valley lines up facing out toward the Pacific Ocean. That's where a lot of this fire action has been. Burbank is quite removed from this, but it gives you an idea of how spread out we are. Look at this. We move back. There's Burbank. We're coming over some of the other areas, Chatsworth, where it was burning before. Now we're angling south, and this is where some of the others fires are, in Burbank. An awful lot of television production here, film work going on here. Lot of people in here.

These hills over here, if you want a sense of where you are -- perhaps you've been out to LA -- you'll notice that this is where Universal Studios is located, right up on the hill here. So this is where you are in relation to Burbank. If you go a little bit further over, you'll see that just on the other side of these hills here, where Burbank is over here, is a landmark everybody knows, the Hollywood sign.

So this is an idea of where they are. And you can see how steep these hills are, how hard it is to fight fires on them.

BLITZER: I want to bring back J.T. Alpaugh, the helicopter reporter, who's covered a lot of these fires, wildfires over the years in California. J.T., we saw that tall tower, got some cable equipment, satellites on it, in Burbank. You see the flames getting very, very close to that tower. I assme you've seen that. Do you know what that is?

ALPAUGH: Yes, that's called a Verdugo receive site. That is a major receive site that a lot of the local television stations use in this area for one of their microwave live shot receive sites. So again, that -- those towers and those infrastructure up on top of the hills immediately threatened by this fire making a run up the Verdugo Mountains in the Burbank area.

BLITZER: How unusual are these two fires in California? Because you've been around a long time, J.T.

ALPAUGH: As you can see, that Erickson Skycrane just came through and dropped right on that, a great drop by that Erickson Skycrane fire crews. But yes, we've been covering fires like this, I have been, for the past 20 years. In relationship to this type of fire, this is actually a very, very large fire. We had one came through this area about two years ago that was extremely dangerous, as well, that threatened my home, along with -- well, it went all the way into the Malibu area. So this is rating right up there.

As you can see, this fire making a run for one of this microwave -- what looks like a TSL (ph), a direct line. That -- that tower you see right there in extreme danger, and they're trying to get those Erickson Skycranes to drop water in there and get water line in between that and that tower to save it.

But this is definitely -- definitely one of the -- one of the worst fire seasons we've seen so far this early in the season.

BLITZER: J.T., last week we were speaking to you as you and your team were flying over New Orleans and Louisiana in the aftermath of Rita, and before that Katrina. This is quite a different story. What goes through your mind, juxtaposing these two big stories you're working on?

ALPAUGH: Well, the Helinet (ph) team has been working hard to go around the country in all of our contracts to make sure that we bring these pictures to everybody across the country. But again, it is a different type of disaster. And as you know, Wolf, coming away from the disasters of Katrina and seeing this, it just seems like you can't run from it. Everywhere I go, it seems like these things are following us.

But again, this is typical for this time of year in the -- in the southern California area, this heavy dry brush that's dried out from all the rains that we got last year, just a lot of fuel out there. And when these winds kick up, these fires start. So it's very typical to see. But compared to Katrina, again, we've been very lucky with the excellent firefighting activities that have been going on here. We've only lost one home in both of these fires. A couple of out structures have been lost, but no one has lost their lifes or no one -- there's only one person has lost their home. So it's a testament that the fire departments out here are extremely coordinated and working these fires and really getting -- doing a great job protecting structures and homes.

BLITZER: J.T., one final question before I let you go. Based on your own reporting, your experience covering these fires -- and we're looking at these live pictures from Burbank, California, right now -- how much longer do you think these fires are going to continue to rage on?

ALPAUGH: Well, we're figuring right now, since the weather is starting to cooperate, in the next day or so, the marine layer, the marine influence from the ocean's going to keep coming up. The humidity levels are going to rise, and the winds are going to stay like they are. We think that this Burbank fire may -- we may be able to get a handle on this in a day or two. We're hoping that -- that's what fire department is giving guestimations.

As far as the Topanga fire, it is doing extremely well. There's only 20 percent containment, but there's only a few hot spots left on that line. Some of these hot spots that Peter was showing you earlier, that is the right rear flank of a heel of the fire that's being contained right now. So we should see more containment on that fire very closely.

But again, we've got another Santa Ana wind condition coming next week, so they're trying to get all these fires down before those northerly dry winds come out of the north and start causing so many problems for us in again here in the southern California -- (INAUDIBLE)

BLITZER: And before I let you go, J.T., what are we seeing now? You're seeing CNN. These fires look to be getting very close to this little building there.

ALPAUGH: Again, that's another transmission building that you're seeing, and right next to it should be a tower of some sort (INAUDIBLE) see in the lefthand part of your screen as you pull out. It is definitely making a run for these infrastructures and the receive site towers. That could be an extreme problem for some of the television stations here in the Los Angeles area if some of the towers go. Very -- a lot of communications equipment, cell equipment up in those areas, so there may be some cell phone -- cell phones anre radio repeaters, two-way radio repeaters, that may go down here very shortly.

BLITZER: J.T. Alpaugh, the helicopter reporter. He was in New Orleans just recently. He's back home in Los Angeles right now, watching this story for us. J.T., thank you very much. Tom Foreman, thanks to you, as well, for the explanation of where this is all going on.

Let's go to New York. Jack Cafferty is standing by. Can you believe what's going on in this world, Jack?

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: It's -- it's not pleasant. I feel sorry for those folks in southern California.

You know, by the time Friday rolls around, Wolf, you wonder how you're going to fill up the broadcast and keep people interested. And then you come to work, and it's like the tooth fairy left a shiny new quarter under your pillow. Former education secretary Bill Bennett, who has given us so much to work with in the past, had this to say on his radio talk show Wednesday, when he was criticizing a theory that draws a link between a decrease in crime and legalized abortions.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

WILLIAM BENNETT, FORMER EDUCATION SECRETARY: I do know that it's true that if you wanted to reduce crime, you could -- if that were your sole purpose, you could abort every black baby in this country and your crime rate would go down. That would be an impossible, ridiculous and morally reprehensible thing to do, but your crime rate would go down.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

CAFFERTY: Now, Bennett just released the following statement. He says this, "A thought experiment about public policy on national radio should not have received the condemnations it has. Anyone paying attention to this debate should be offended by those who have selectively quoted me, distorted my meaning and taken out of context the dialogue I engaged in this week. I renounce all forms of bigotry. My record in trying to provide opportunities for, as well as save the lives of, minorities in this country stands up just fine," unquote.

Here's the question then. What do you think Bill Bennett meant by his comments? Caffertyfile@cnn.com. We'll read some of the answers in about a half-hour, and -- thanks, Bill.

BLITZER: I'm anxious to hear what our viewers think, as well. Thanks, Jack, to you. We'll get back to you soon.

A mystery partially revealed, but many questions remain about reporter Judith Miller and the source who leaked classified information to her. Also, training Iraqi troops. The Pentagon scrambling to explain conflicting numbers on battle-ready Iraqi battalions. Plus, unions urging their members not to see the new movie "Flight Plan." We'll show you who and what the controversy is all about.

You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Quickly, I want to show you these pictures. These are live pictures we're getting in from southern California right now. Two fires under way, one in Burbank. This is in Burbank. You see the smoke. You see the fires getting near those relay stations, television transmission towers. And then there's a second fire in the Simi Valley are, Chatsworth. You see smoke continuing there. About 20,000 acres have already burned. They estimate 20 percent contained. But clearly, some serious work still needs to be done.

We'll go back there live shortly, but there's other important news we're following, as well. Here in Washington, the special prosecutor investigating the leak of a CIA operative's name now has a missing piece of the puzzle in hand, the grand jury testimony of "New York Times" reporter Judith Miller. But it came with a price. Miller spent almost three months in jail for refusing to do what she finally did do today.

Let's bring in CNN special correspondent Frank Sesno. He's looking into the story -- Frank.

FRANK SESNO, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Fascinating story, Wolf. And what's really interesting, you know, we've got a reporter out of jail today, but there are a lot of questions and some very serious consequences that are very much still up in the air.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(voice-over): It took 85 days in jail for Judith Miller to get here to, a Washington, D.C, courthouse, where she testified before a grand jury investigating the leak of a CIA operative's identity. "The New York Times" reporter says she agreed to break her silence after her source provided what she calls a personal, explicit, voluntary release from the confidentiality she once promised.

JUDITH MILLER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": I concluded from this that my source genuinely wanted me to testify. These were not form waivers. They were not discussions among lawyers.

SESNO: In her public comments, Miller never named her source, but in its story on her release, "The New York Times" did: Vice President Cheney's chief of staff Lewis "Scooter" Libby. Several aspects of this whole thing are still unclear. First the timing. Libby's lawyer says he and his client signed a waiver more than a year ago freeing Miller to testify. But Miller's camp apparently did not ask for Libby's personal assurance until recently, after she'd spent weeks in jail.

Bob Bennett represents Miller and appeared in THE SITUATION ROOM a short while ago.

BOB BENNETT, JUDITH MILLER'S ATTORNEY: Mr. Libby knew where Judy was. He had her phone number. They knew each other. There was no secret where she was. So I find it amazing that somebody would suggest that Judy would unnecessarily spend 85 days in jail. Judy is not protecting anybody else.

SESNO: Miller cites another important factor in ending her stand-off with the special prosecutor, Patrick Fitzgerald. He allowed her to limit her testimony to communications with the source who let her off the hook.

MILLER: I said to the court before I was jailed that I did not believe I was above the law and that I would therefore have to go to jail because of my principles. But once I satisfied those principles, I was prepared to testify. I have a meal that I want my husband to prepare, a dog I want to hug, and I'd like to go home to Sag Harbor.

SESNO: Also unclear, the chain of events that started all this, a 2003 newspaper column by CNN contributor Bob Novak identifying Valerie Plame as a CIA operative. Plame is married to former ambassador Joe Wilson, who'd gone public with his doubts about President Bush's early justification for invading Iraq, that Saddam Hussein was trying to develop nuclear weapons. Critics accuse the Bush administration of engineering the leak of Plame's identity to get back at Wilson. The White House denies that.

And Scooter Libby says he's done nothing wrong. Same goes for deputy White House chief of staff Karl Rove, previously identified as a source in connection with the CIA leak.

Will any one from the White House be prosecuted for leaking the name of a CIA operative? Also unclear. The grand jury is expected to wrap up work in the coming weeks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SESNO: So this story hasn't played out. Wolf. But really, the bigger issue and the bottom line here is the impact that this is having on journalism, confidential sources, people who would talk to nosy reporters like you and me all the time. It has tamped things down a bit, and general consuls in news organizations across the spectrum are now telling reporters things like, Be careful, don't even write their names in your notebooks, if you think it's confidential. You don't know where that notebook's going to end up. Could be subpoenaed.

BLITZER: It's already had a chilling effect, at least anecdoteally, from my own personal experience. I think what all journalists really want is a new federal shield law that would protect them and not force them to reveal the identity of confidential sources. Is that going to happen?

SESNO: Well, you know, people think that there are improved prospects. There are shield law bills in both houses of Congress. Hearings may be proceding. The shield law that has the best prospect, or at least the most political support right now -- it's not to say it's going to pass -- is one that would have an absolute protection on confidential sources, unless you could demonstrate, as a lawyer, that the journalist has information that could pose an imminent threat to national security. The question is whether you can get that information flowing.

You know, a lot of the courts have said that not to have a free flow of information undermines democracy itself in the context of this. But there's a patchwork of court cases out there that make this very confusing. It's why so many people feel a federal shield law is necessary.

BLITZER: All right, Frank. Thanks very much, Frank Sesno, reporting for us.

As U.S. troops pay an ever-increasing price in Iraq, U.S. commanders have been making it clear new Iraqi forces are not yet ready to fight on their own, by any means. Let's go to our Pentagon correspondent, Jamie McIntyre. He's standing by -- Jamie.

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Wolf. Here's a math quiz. Three minus two equals one, right? Well, the Pentagon says it's not that simple.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(voice-over): A day after the top commander in Iraq told Congress that that he was down from three to just one Iraqi battalion that could operate without U.S. help, his boss, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, was on the offensive at a Pentagon briefing.

DONALD RUMSFELD, DEFENSE SECRETARY: There are an all of lot of people chasing the wrong rabbit here, it seems to me.

MCINTYRE: The Pentagon insists the important number is how many Iraqi battalions can lead operations with U.S. support, not how many can do it all by themselves. That actual number remains classified, but General Casey says it has doubled.

GEN. GEORGE CASEY, U.S. ARMY, CMDR., MULTI-NATIONAL FORCE IN IRAQ: Over 75 percent of these Iraqi units are out there with us in the fight every day. They're just -- some are leading, some are operating with us, OK. So you asked me, Is it a setback? And I say, No, it's not a setback.

MCINTYRE: Casey says after Iraqi battalions were recently reevaluated, three that had been considered able to operate independently were downgraded, while one that was rated lower was given a top rating. Still, the Pentagon argues that's not the significant indicator.

RUMSFELD: And so people say, Well, the numbers have moved around, and it looks like we're getting worse. We're not getting worse, we're getting better! Every single day, the Iraqi security forces are getting bigger and better and better trained and better equipped and more experienced!

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MCINTYRE: General Casey said today the one thing that has made him reconsider whether there can be significant troop cuts next spring is the upcoming vote on the new Iraqi constitution. He called it divisiveness in the constitution, and he wants to see how the Sunnis react to election results before he makes any decisions -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Jamie McIntyre, our senior Pentagon correspondent. Thank you very much.

Does lack of readiness among Iraqi forces mean American troops are stuck in Iraq for an even longer haul? Joining us now, our world affairs analyst, the former defense secretary, William Cohen. He is the chairman and CEO of The Cohen Group here in Washington.

Mr. Secretary, thanks very much for joining us. There seems to be this disconnect. On the one hand, Rumsfeld, some of the generals are painting a relatively upbeat position. But it looks like, on the ground, it seems to be getting worse. How do you make this?

WILLIAM COHEN, FORMER DEFENSE SECRETARY: Well, it looks like it will continue to get worse, at least in the short term, running up to the ratification or affirmation of the constitution on October 15. So everybody is predicting that. The real issue will be following that. Will there be a ratification of it? If not, what does that mean? If it's a rejection, we're back to square one. That could mean even more chaos, and the likelihood of American troops coming home any time soon following that becomes problematic.

Secretary Rumsfeld a year or so ago asked the following question. He said, Are we creating more insurgents than we are killing? And a similar question can be asked now. Are we, in fact, losing more battalions than we're training? Now, at level one readiness, the answer is we'e losing more. It seems to be. Level two -- and we don't know the number, but apparently has doubled. So Secretary Rumsfeld may be correct that we're actually training more people. They're not up to level one yet, but they're up at a higher level than they were yesterday and the day before.

BLITZER: Let me explain to our viewers. General Casey, the U.S. military commander in Iraq, months ago suggested to a visiting Senate delegation, Joe Biden included, there were only three Iraqi battalions that are ready, really ready to take charge without U.S. cooperation. Now General Casey and General Abizaid are back here in Washington saying that there's only one Iraqi battalion that's ready. And they need -- they need 100 that are eventually going to be ready.

Listen to Senator McCain, Republican of Arizona. He was bewildered when he heard this yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: They'd -- there was a report sent over, I think last June, that three of the 100 Iraqi battalions were fully trained and equipped, capable of operating independently. What is that number now?

XX: The number now is -- if you're talking about level one trained, it's one.

MCCAIN: You have one battalion?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: A lot of people were shocked. It's supposed to go the other way, from 2 to 10, then 30, then 100.

COHEN: Right. Exactly.

BLITZER: And going from three to one, that does not sound encouraging.

COHEN: It doesn't sound encouraging. The question is, why have we gone from three to one? And again, I come back to the question that was raised by Secretary Rumsfeld, are we losing more than we're creating? And what he was suggesting from the taped interview I just saw is that we're actually increasing the level -- the numbers at the level two. That doesn't explain why we're losing at that top readiness level, where battalion can operate on its own without American support.

BLITZER: I've heard one theory is that the Iraqis are never going to be ready as long as the U.S. has a big footprint there, the U.S. is there in big numbers. They don't have the incentive. Why should they risk their own lives when Uncle Sam will do it for them? What the U.S. has to do is reduce the footprint, reduce the number of troops, and then maybe the Iraqis will step up to the plate.

COHEN: WEll, as I've indicated before, I think that we needed more a long time ago in order to secure the borders. I still believe we need more people -- we won't get American troops there -- but more soldiers, seal the borders off from Iraq (SIC) and from Syria and elsewhere to make sure we're not having more insurgents coming in doing the kind of damage they are today.

That appears to be unlikely to be achieved, so we are where we are. The real issue is, how much political support's going to be there following October 15th vote and the elections in December? And if that doesn't appear to be going positively, then you can see that the political support for our continuation there is going to decrease. So you may see an actual confluence here, where those who suggest a smaller number will actually be more beneficial, it may come about through political pressure, if not through a military strategy itself.

BLITZER: William Cohen, thanks very much for joining us.

Coming up: A defense contractor pulls an offensive ad. Wait until you hear what it showed. Plus, who could forget Elian Gonzales, who was famously caught up in a tug-of-war between the United States and Cuba and between members of his own family? He's now speaking out about what happened to him. And are you mad about Bill Bennett's comments about abortion, crime and African-Americans? Jack Cafferty heading back to THE SITUATION ROOM. He's been reading your e-mails. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BLITZER: We're not very far away from covering the fires that have been continuing in the Los Angeles area. Southern California. These are live pictures we're getting right now. Planes flying overhead. Helicopters flying overhead. They're monitoring the situation and they're dropping water to try to contain these fires. Some of them getting so close to various installations.

These helicopters are also clearly in the Burbank, California area as well as in Chatsworth, Topanga area, about 15 miles or so away. Smoke very, very intense right now. About 3,000 firefighters continue to deal with this fire. In the Topanga area, maybe 20 percent contained; 20,000 acres have been scorched already.

But the fires continue in both areas. Again. These are live pictures. As we see these helicopters struggling to drop water and retardant on these helicopters -- On these fires to contain them. And to avoid them from going to -- to homes and other installations. Where people are located.

They're making some progress. But clearly they have got a lot of work and a lot of serious problems on their hands.

Two major U.S. defense contractors are pulling an ad that they now admit was offensive. Let's get some details. CNN's Ali Velshi is in New York. He's got the bottom line. Ali?

ALI VELSHI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Very interesting story, Wolf. Just yesterday, yesterday, right? Just yesterday the Pentagon approved full production of the V-22 Osprey, this is a helicopter with a tilt rotor. It does fantastic things. There is the helicopter.

And of course, before this some ads went in. And you are looking at one of them that have caused some problem. Now that ad shows a -- a V-22 Osprey and the copy says it descends from the heavens, ironically it unleashes hell. Now if you look down at the bottom of the page it says - I'll read it to you because you can't see it.

It says "Before you hear it, you see it. The CV-22 delivers Special Forces to insertion points never thought possible." Seems to show a picture of Osprey releasing soldiers on to what is clearly depicted to be a mosque.

Well, that upset the Canadian -- Canadian? The Council on American Islamic Relations, CAIR, they wrote to the companies, Bell and Textron, Textron is Bell Helicopters and Boeing, the two main contractors on this. And said they were unhappy about it.

It appeared in the "Armed Forces Journal," September edition and the September 24th edition of "The National Journal." Now the response has been pretty swift. Bell Helicopters has given us this response.

"Despite our directive to 'The National Journal' to replace the ad it was not replaced as requested which resulted in its publication this week. We recognize that some organizations and individuals may have been offended and regret any concerns this advertisement may have raised."

Boeing has also given us a response. It is -

"We consider the ad offensive, regret its publication and apologize to those who, like us, are dismayed with its content. When the company became aware of the advertisement, we immediately requested that our partner agency withdraw and destroy all print proofs. Unfortunately, despite our best efforts to have the ad replaced, a clerical error at "The National Journal" resulted in its publication this week."

"National Journal" has also responded by saying, "The advertisement that ran in the September 24th issue was run as a result of a clerical error. We had received specific direction from the agency representing Boeing and Bell not to run the ad."

The Council on American Islamic Relations has now said they are happy with the swift response. A new ad designed and is on its way. That's the new ad right there. Nothing about it, that's probably going to offend anyone. And that matter has been settled. Wolf?

BLITZER: And Osprey has been controversial for 15 years going back to when I was a Pentagon correspondent, takes off look a helicopter. Flies like a plane. It's very powerful. Unfortunately, a lot of people convinced doesn't yet live up to its billing. Ali, thank you very much.

VELSHI: All right, Wolf.

BLITZER: It's a very determined fire being whipped along by strong wind and temperatures around 100 degrees. Coming up more on battling the blaze out West. We'll tell you what's happening right now.

And it's Elian Gonzales look you have never heard or seen him before. That cute, adorable little Cuban boy once lost at sea, is now speaking out about his American ordeal. And we'll tell you what he is saying.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Lovely day here in the nation's capital. Not so lovely out in Southern California. Two fires that we are watching. J.T. Alpaugh and Zev Yaroslavsky both joining us once again. Helicopter reporter J.T. Alpaugh has been watching these fires for us. Update our viewers, J.T., what is happening right now.

J.T. ALPAUGH, HELICOPTER REPORTER (voice): What you are looking at here, Wolf, is the Burbank fire. We have two major fires burning right now in the Southern California area, the Topanga and the Burbank fire. What you are looking at Burbank fire. Burbank on the right side of your screen, Chatsworth on your left, the Topanga fire on your left side.

What's happening with the Burbank fire is it's growing to about 100 acres right now. It's rushing up a hill right now near the Debelle (ph) golf course. Mount Verdugo (ph). And it's making its way up to the fire roads on the top of the hill where some structures are being threatened as you can see on the right side of your screen.

Some of the microwave structures and receive sites thatat local television stations use in the area. It's making a run up that hill. They're hoping to stop the fire at the ridge line. And if the winds comply, they're hoping to do that. If not there is a possibility this fire could burn down the back side of the Verdugos and start threatening in the neighborhoods near the 210 and 2.

These are some of the canyon areas, like Henderson Canyon, Engel Canyon (ph), Sheep Corral Canyon. Some of the residential areas on the back side of Verdugo but they're hoping to get a stop to that.

What you're seeing is L.A. City fire number one. That's a 412 helicopter dropping its load down on one of the ridge lines trying to prevent the fire from spreading up into the backside, into the La Crescente (ph) area.

BLITZER: Zev Yaroslavksy, L.A. County supervisor, are you making progress?

ZEV YAROSLAVSKY, L.A. COUNTY SUPERVISOR: I think in the case of the Chatsworth Topanga fire, yes. As long as weather continues to cooperate. The firefighters have transformed this from a defensive posture of protecting homes and life and property to going aggressively after the fire.

They're in a position to do that now. They've been given the opportunity thanks to the shift in the winds and the reduction in the velocity of the winds. And they are making progress. We started the day at five percent containment. We're up to 20 percent, maybe more by now. And if the weather cooperates we should, should be moving in the right direction. Through the weekend.

BLITZER: All right, let's hope for the best. Zev Yaroslavksy, thanks very much. J.T. Alpaugh, we'll be checking back with you as well.

They are scorching images on bright crimson orange and gray. Pictures of those wildfires burning in California. We want to show you some of the photos that people are posting on line. Our Internet reporter Abbi Tatton is checking that situation. She is joining us now live. Abbi?

ABBI TATTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, the Topanga fire that is northwest of L.A., Los Angeles, threatening local neighborhoods and the residents are posting their pictures. As you said. This is the area where it's burning right now. Using the tool geomac.gov.

Simi Valley, focusing in there, lots of photos coming in at the site flicker.com. You can see just how close people are to this fire. One resident there looking on. This part of the fire got so close that aircraft were dropping flame retardants near to it to protect that one neighborhood. The smoke, as well, getting so close to the neighborhoods right here. And also the view there from Downtown L.A. You can see just how extensive the smoke is. Also, creating this thin layer of ash everywhere. This is the blog, koganuts.com. This blogger, Jeff Koga, returned to his car to find out it had been raining ash and his car was absolutely covered. Wolf?

BLITZER: Abbi, thank you very much. When we come back, his rescue at sea almost six years ago captivated the world. So did his dramatic seizure and return to Cuba. Coming up Elian Gonzales then and now. A little bit older. He has some incredible thoughts on his mind on what happened to him in Miami as well as what happened involving Fidel Castro.

We'll tell you what Elian Gonzales is saying right now. And you'd think of movie with pilots and flight attendants as stars would be embraced by those airline workers. But not "Flight Plan." We'll tell you why so many are so outraged over this film. You are in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Let's check what's happening around the world right now. Our Zain Verjee has an update on a deal that began almost six years ago. Zain, what's going on?

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf, it's a story of international custody battle. Really burned into the psyche by many Americans by one unforgettable image.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VERJEE (voice-over): Elian Gonzales, a 6-year-old Cuban being seized by U.S. federal agents from the home of some of his relatives in Miami, Florida. That was April 22nd, 2000. This is Elian Gonzales now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you ever want to see them again?

ELIAN GONZALES, CUBAN BOY (through translator): Yes, despite everything they did, the way they did it was wrong. They are my family. They are my uncles.

VERJEE: The CBS News program "60 Minutes" recently interviewed Elian, now 11 years old in Cuba. The interview airs this Sunday. Elian expressed affection for Cuban President Fidel Castro saying, quote, "Not only do I think of Castro as a friend, but also as a father."

Elian also said of his Miami relatives who refused to return him to his father in Cuba, quote, "They were telling me bad things about my father. They were also telling me to tell my father that I did not want to go back to Cuba and I always told them I wanted to."

Elian's American ordeal started out at sea on Thanksgiving Day, 1999. A fisherman found him clinging to an inner tube about two miles off the coast of Florida. His mother and ten others died when their boat capsized as they tried to flee Cuba. Elian was one of three to survive.

After nearly five months of protests and negotiations.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They got the boy. They got the boy.

VERJEE: Following a ruling by the Supreme Court Attorney General Janet Reno ordered federal agents in to take the boy by force, effectively ending the international custody battle.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VERJEE (on camera): In the "60 Minutes" interview one Cuban American who led demonstrations against Elian's return to Cuba says the boy is being used as part of a propaganda plan by Fidel Castro saying Elian is being brainwashed by the Cuban regime. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right. Zain, thank you very much. Zain, have a great weekend. Appreciate it very much. Race and rhetoric very often make a very combustible combination.

The Former Education Secretary Bill Bennett mixed the two and he's gotten burned. What was he thinking? We'll get your thoughts? And number one at the box office but many flight attendants are no fans of "Flight Plan." They're calling for a boycott. We'll tell you why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Jack Cafferty has been going through your email and he is joining us oce again from New York. Jack?

CAFFERTY: Former Education Secretary Bill Bennett on his radio show earlier this week talked about aborting every black baby in this country as a way of reducing the crime rate while criticizing a theory that draws a link between a decrease in crime and legalized abortions.

Today Bennett defended his comments and said they had to be taken in context. Our question is what do you think Bill Bennett meant by his comments?

Jeanne in San Jose, California, "His responses on the radio further demonstrate the institutionalized racism in our country and the fact Mr. Bennett refuses to apologizes brings to light more deeply since Katrina and Rita, how white privilege has little self-reflection and lots of justification.

Edna in Pratt, West Virginia, "I'm not sure what Bill Bennett meant by his comments, but that kind of thinking and philosophy 65 years ago led to what we now call 'The Holocaust.'"

Avery writes "I think he meant that forced abortion would lower crime and it's a completely stupid idea. I know as an African American, I've had the same thought at one time or another, especially when you don't feel safe walking through your own neighborhood."

Doug in Springhill, Florida writes, "The comments Bill Bennett made yesterday are so reprehensible they deserve everyone's disgust. How in heaven's name will we ever erase the stain of racism in America when people in any kind of authority continue to pay lip service to such hideous perceptions."

And P writes, "To even ask this question, this perpetuating his awful words and inviting discussion on him is almost as reprehensible as the words themselves. Who even wants to get into this guy's head to try to figure out what he meant? Come on now it doesn't merit the air time."

Wolf?

BLITZER: All right, Jack, thank very much. This footnote -- we invited Bill Bennett to join us in THE SITUATION ROOM. He has a contractual obligation with Fox News Channel and declined.

The fight over "Flight Plan," why some major unions are urging their members to boycott the film. That will come up. You're in THE SITUATIO ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: It's not often you hear about flight attendants protesting a movie. But they are. The film is called "Flight Plan." CNN's Brian Todd is joining us to explain. Brian?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, it's a motion picture with a major star and according to a group of very powerful unions it's committed a major insult.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JODIE FOSTER, ACTRESS: Captain, I have to speak to you. Captain, I need to speak to you?

TODD (voice-over): In "Flight Plan, Jodie Foster's character is confused, frightened and furious. You would be too if your young daughter had gone missing on a transatlantic flight. One group wishes another character might have gone missing.

PAT FRIEND, ASSOCIATION OF FLIGHT ATTENDANTS: Not only have they -- have they made the flight attendant the terrorist in this plot but they also portray flight attendants as just generally cold and unfeeling people.

TODD: One line in the movie, not in the clips we received, has a flight attendant saying it's OK to hate the passengers.

FRIEND: We don't hate the passengers. And, the idea, I mean, I think they have taken it to an extreme that is unnecessary and could in fact contribute to creating additional conflict on the airplane.

TODD: For all those reasons, Pat Friend, head of Association of Flight Attendants is joining with two other attendants' unions calling for some 80,000 members to boycott the film. A spokesperson for the Walt Disney Company which owns Touchstone Pictures says Disney is sorry and disappointed the flight attendants' unions feel that way and, quote, "There was absolutely no intention by the studio or filmmakers to create anything other than a great action thriller."

Disney officials say they're confident the public can tell the difference between fiction.

FOSTER: Do you know where my daughter is?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ms. Pratt, I'm sorry but I don't think that she's here.

TODD: What they call the incredible job that real flight attendants do every day. One critic calls the plot of "Flight Plan" "silly." But the boycott he says is even sillier.

MICHAEL MEDVED, MOVIE CRITIC: I mean the idea that there is one flight attendant, there really is only one who is portrayed in an unflattering way that should be an occasion for a group to protest, I mean, good grief.

TODD: Pat Friend says he may be overlooking grief of a different kind.

FRIEND: Flight attendants were the first to die on September 11th. And the very idea that, that -- that they would portray, now, a flight attendant as a terrorist, to us it denigrates the memory of our flying partners that died that day.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TODD (on camera): But so far the boycott hasn't hurt business. Since its debut last week "Flight Plan" has been number one at the box office grossing nearly $30 million in ticket sales. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right, Brian. Thank you very much. I want to update our viewers on those two fires now in Southern California. Helicopter reporter J.T. Alpaugh on the phone with us, he is standing by. J.T. give our viewers a sense of what's happening right now.

ALPAUGH: Real quick -- Wolf, a recap on the Burbank fire you can see right now. That's the fire that's the greatest concern right now. About 100 acres plus making a run through the Verdugo Mountains in Burbank are, causing some problems.

The bigger fire, the Topanga fire, 20,000-plus fire getting a handle on that. The weather cooperating. So they're hoping weather and winds hold down so fires can get put out quickly before more Santa Ana conditions continue here in Southern California later next week.

BLITZER: J.T., they seem to be making progress despite images which show a lot of fire and a lot of smoke.

ALPAUGH: Yeah, Wolf, definitely making a lot of progress in the Topanga fire. Right now we have 30-plus, 30 percent containment right now. But there is only one or two large hot spots. One you are looking at now in Simi Valley area. The right flank of the fire. But the Burbank fire is still burning very greatly. You see the shot there. Making runs at some of the infrastructure, television infrastructure towers in the Verdugo area. So that's quite a concern. We're watching the wind. Seeing what they do. And we're hoping weather cooperates and we'll get the things knocked down very quickly here in Southern California.

BLITZER: J.T. Alpaugh, we'll check back with you Monday. Thanks very much. Let's hope the fires are out by then. We're in THE SITUATION ROOM every week day afternoon, 3:00 to 6:00 p.m. Eastern. I will be back Sunday for LATE EDITION, the last word in Sunday talk. Among my guests this Sunday. General George Casey. The top U.S. general in Iraq. LATE EDITION starts, special time. 11:00 a.m. Eastern.

Until them, I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. LOU DOBBS TONIGHT starts right now. He is in New York. Hi, Lou.

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