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The Situation Room

International Aid Arrives in Earthquake-Ravaged Pakistan; Terror Threat in New York Turns Out to be Hoax; Bush Supports Miers in Face of Conservative Opposition

Aired October 11, 2005 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Standing by, CNN reporters across the U.S. and around the globe to bring you the day's top stories.
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Ali Velshi. Happening now, it's midnight in the South Asian disaster zone, where earthquake aid is delayed by violent storms. Millions left homeless in the frigid mountains face a new threat.

PHILLIPS: It's 3:00 p.m. in New York. Government sources now say the threat to the subway system was a hoax. How will residents respond to the next alert?

VELSHI: And it's 2:00 a.m., Wednesday, in Thailand, where a top U.S. official used the bird flu fight. He says there's a high risk of a human pandemic. Should the maker of an anti-viral medicine share its secret? You're in "The Situation Room."

PHILLIPS: And thanks for joining us. Wolf is off today. The scale of the tragedy is enormous and likely to grow in the aftermath of the earthquake. Across northeast Pakistan and in disputed Kashmir, divided with India, tens of thousands of people are reported dead. With villages, towns, even entire cities destroyed, millions of people are homeless.

VELSHI: Desperate survivors today fought over shipments that are beginning to reach the mountains. They're living in the open, exposed to driving rain and bitter cold. They now face the possibility of mudslides as winter reaches the Himalayas.

The U.S. is boosting its aid to Pakistan. The Pentagon has sent cargo planes loaded with supplies and officials say dozens of helicopters could be deployed. Pakistan's foreign minister says aid is already arriving from nuclear neighbor and bitter rival India.

PHILLIPS: Let's go live now to the disaster zone. CNN's Becky Anderson is in the Pakistani capital of Islamabad -- Becky?

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. And there are some 41,000 people dead, 11,000 in the Pakistan controlled Kashmir alone. In one city, some 80 to 90 percent of structures have been wiped out. Many people still buried underground.

I'm here in Islamabad in front of a building that collapsed, a 10-story building that collapsed. They are still bringing people out of this building. In the last hour or so they've heard another woman's voice. Earlier on today, a 75-year-old lady and her 55-year- old daughter were pulled out after 72 hours, and they were alive. Her sons talked to her as she came out. She said, "Is everybody else alive? I don't want to come out unless they are."

Her sons were able to tell her that her family were alive. She came out and was taken to hospital. So there are some miracles here, but this is just the tip of the iceberg in Islamabad. The rest of the region absolutely devastating.

The big problem today, Kyra, was this: there were overnight rains and then afternoon storms. And that effectively grounded the relief operation. The American choppers that have been going up north to the most devastated regions brought back to Islamabad an extremely frustrating day for those who need the relief and those who are helping with the effort -- Kyra?

PHILLIPS: Becky Anderson, we look forward to more of those miracles. We'll check back with you later in the newscast.

Meanwhile, President Bush was back in the Gulf Coast hurricane disaster zone in hard hit Pass Christian, Mississippi. He helped celebrate this week's reopening of an elementary school. Earlier, the president and First Lady Laura Bush joined volunteers, building a home at a Habitat for Humanity program near New Orleans.

And at a naval air station in Louisiana, Mr. Bush said, quote, "Out of the rubble is going to come some gold."

VELSHI: In our security watch, the tip that terrorists were targeting New York subway has apparently turned out to be a hoax. CNN's Deborah Feyerick is standing by in New York, but we begin in Washington with our justice correspondent Kelli Arena -- Kelli?

KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ali, I can tell you that officials are still not on the same page. But the law enforcement and government officials that I spoke to say that through investigative means, they are certain that the information that was provided by the informant is false and that he perpetrated a hoax against the United States.

As you know from the very beginning, officials here in Washington were questioning the credibility of the information, saying that it could not be corroborated. We did some more reporting and heard that three people were taken into custody in Iraq.

They were questioned and polygraphed and passed that polygraph, didn't know anything about an alleged attack against the United States. There were reports that there was supposedly an individual who came into the United States as part of this plot. Again, officials here in Washington saying, "We don't even know if such a person exists."

Bottom line today, it was all a hoax, the information completely inaccurate. Although every security expert here says, you know, "This doesn't mean that we're in the clear." Obviously, Al Qaeda and related groups want to do harm. It's just that there's no plot in progress right now.

VELSHI: All right, Kelli. And, of course, we saw this tension building the other day when Washington said they didn't have evidence of this. New York officials did. Does that mean that New York officials now have egg on their face? Joining us now from New York is CNN's Deborah Feyerick -- Deborah?

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Ali, we can tell you that New York City's mayor and its top cop are sticking by their story and their decision to warn New Yorkers. And here's how it all played out. The mayor says that a week and a half ago, an informant in Iraq claimed that three people were going to come to the United States and attack the subway system.

The mayor says that informant passed a lie detector test, and as a result, U.S. forces grabbed the three then that Kelli mentioned. Well, one of those men apparently said something that had everyone in the know on edge.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL BLOOMBERG, MAYOR OF NEW YORK CITY: And when an operation was mounted in Iraq to grab the other three, as they grabbed them, one of them screamed, "You're too late to stop us." This was an attack, or a planned attack, that had a specific time and target and method. It was the first really serious allegation of a direct attack on this city since 9/11.

RAYMOND KELLY, COMMISSIONER, NEW YORK POLICE DEPARTMENT: We have got to get together with federal agencies, and they have a responsibility in Washington to speak with one voice, to proactively put out information that's going to help localities. And a lot of this information was gleaned from our initiative and our contacting federal authorities. So, yes, I think this -- there are lessons here to be learned. I think some congressional committees will, in fact, look into this whole matter.

FEYERICK: Now, it turns out that two of the three men did deny any attack. And the mayor says that a lie detector test supports their story. The police commissioner says that as of this morning, the informant, the one who made the original claims, has not been located.

So the question is, if this threat was real, why did the mayor hold on to the information for several days? Well, he says he wanted to protect U.S. forces and not jeopardize the operation to pick up those three men. That pickup happened last Thursday morning, news broke later the afternoon, and the timeframe for this suspected subway strike using baby carriages, that did not happen until the next day, Friday. So they really thought they were in the clear.

But again, there was miscommunication, but New York City's mayor and the police commissioner sticking by the story. They say they did the right thing, that had they not put that security in place, that's when it could have been a real problem had an attack had taken place -- Ali? VELSHI: Deborah Feyerick in New York, thanks Deb. Stay tuned for CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security.

PHILLIPS: Well, his bloody beating at the hands of New Orleans police was captured on videotape. Now, that the victim is speaking publicly and you might be surprised what he has to say. CNN's Lisa Sylvester is live in New Orleans with the details -- Lisa?

LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Kyra. This investigation is actually going on at three separate agencies. First, you have the New Orleans police department. They're looking at three of the officers who have been suspended without pay and charged with battery. Then there's the Department of Justice investigation, that is a civil rights probe.

And finally, the FBI, at the highest level of the bureau, they're taking a look at the role two off-duty agents may have played. Those agents were also seen on the tape. But earlier today, Robert Davis@, the man you see on that video, told CNN his version of what happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT DAVIS, BEATING VICTIM: I wasn't sure about the time of the curfew. I was very concerned about that, and I had been asking several law enforcement officers about the curfew. I had heard several different times, 8:00, 10:00, and 12:00.

So I finally decided to ask one of the New Orleans police officers who was on horseback at the corner of Conti and Bourbon. And he proceeded to give me the time, and during that, I was interrupted by another police officer who was walking by, really. And he interrupted our conversation, and I told him that was very unprofessional.

And I proceeded to walk on across the street, at which time he punched me, I guess. And from there, I don't really remember much other than a lady in the crowd who was, I guess, just a bystander who kept hollering, "He didn't do anything, he didn't do anything."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SYLVESTER: And Robert Davis does not blame the New Orleans Police Department as a whole. He just sees this as a couple of bad apples. Now, Mr. Davis is scheduled to appear in court tomorrow to face public intoxication charges and resisting arrest charges. But his attorney is confident that those charges will be dropped -- Kyra?

PHILLIPS: Now, Lisa, when I talked to the acting chief Warren Riley yesterday, I asked him about military support, and also other agencies that are there to support the NOPD, because obviously, the department is having a lot of problems keeping the peace. Are you seeing more military patrols? Are you seeing other agencies still active with regard to fighting crime and trying to keep the streets safe?

SYLVESTER: We do still see a heavy military presence here. I mean, it's not something that you see in an average American city. So it is come as somewhat of a surprise just to see the sheer number of men and women in uniform, as well as other law enforcement agencies participating.

But the big question on everyone's mind is, what happens when you have a flood of people, the thousands of residents who start returning to New Orleans, will the will the city, the police department, be overwhelmed? And that's something that, right now, the police department is kind of taking a wait-and-see mode -- Kyra?

PHILLIPS: Lisa Sylvester, live in New Orleans, thank you so much.

Now time for my favorite file. We know what that is, right?

VELSHI: "The Cafferty File." Our Jack Cafferty -- I have always wanted to say that. Our Jack Cafferty joins us now in New York with the question -- Jack?

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you, Ali. In light of yet another disaster, some relief agencies are concerned that Americans might stop digging into their pockets and donating money to the victims. Officials say they've never seen anything like the string of disasters over the last ten months.

According to a roundup in "The New York Daily News" this morning, there was the tsunami at Christmas sometime, the two hurricanes here on the Gulf Coast, Katrina and Rita, the big earthquake in El Salvador. There are reportedly whole villages buried under mudslides down in Guatemala, wildfires in California, and now this horrific earthquake in Pakistan.

The concern is that Americans are worn out by all of this and that something called donor fatigue may set in. So the question is this, are Americans disastered out? You can email us your thoughts at caffertyfile@CNN.com.

VELSHI: Jack, thanks. We'll check in with you when you start getting responses to those.

PHILLIPS: Still to come, she's been called unqualified and a crony of the president, but she still has major support inside the White House. Find out why they're standing behind their woman.

VELSHI: Plus, a possible deadly flu pandemic. One drug company owns the recipe for an anti-viral. But should it release it to the world? We'll have a closer look.

PHILLIPS: Also, rough and tumble politics, the debate that turned ugly. You're in "The Situation Room."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: President Bush said today that there's no reason Harriet Miers can't be a, quote, "great Supreme Court justice," but he's having a tough time convincing many conservatives, including some key members of the Senate. The administration tapped former Senator Dan Coats to guide Miers through the confirmation process. He joins us now, live from the White House.

Senator, thanks for being with us.

DAN COATS, SUPREME COURT NOMINEE ADVISER: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: I want to get to your time with Harriet Miers in just a moment. But first, Robert Bork yesterday had this to say in "The Situation Room." I want to get your response.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT BORK, FORMER SUPREME COURT NOMINEE: It's a slap in the face to the conservatives who've been building a legal movement. They have plenty of very well-qualified conservative judges out there and there conservative scholars out there who could have been chosen. And this is a demoralizing slap at them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: A slap at them, demoralizing. How do you respond to the criticism? It sounds like a disaster, according to him.

COATS: Well, it's not the disaster that he indicates. I have great respect for Judge Bork. This is a situation where perhaps the individual or individuals that he thought should have been chosen were not chosen. But Harriet Miers' record stands by itself and stands on its own. And she is fully capable and ready and able to be an excellent Supreme Court justice as the president has said.

There are some conservatives that are disappointed, there's no question about that. They had a framework in mind, or a type of person in mind, and Harriet Miers didn't come out of that judicial pipeline, but so have many great justices, including some of our great chief justices, did not have that same judicial pipeline experience.

And I think if people go back and look at that, they'll realize that you can get to the court in several ways and make great contributions and be considered a very effective justice.

PHILLIPS: Sure, and you came forward on the Senate floor and said, "Look, there are three things very important: character, experience, intelligence." Very mysterious with regard to the experience. There is a lot we do not know. How can there be enough faith in just taking the president's word to trust him?

COATS: Well, two things. One, there is experience. There's a lifetime of experience and very considerable accomplishments for a woman, a trail blazer, that she has been in the positions she's risen to, not the least of which is counsel to the president, where you deal with constitutional issues and advice the president all the time.

Secondly, I think it's important to remember that the capabilities necessary to be in the court and be an effective justice are those that are gained through life's experiences. She has demonstrated integrity, she has demonstrated loyalty.

PHILLIPS: Tell me how. Give me specifics, Senator. Give me specifics. Give me a couple life experiences that will make her strong on the bench?

COATS: Well, she came from very humble beginnings, and if you recognize some of the trials that her family went through with the incapacity of her father, how she had to work her way through school, almost had to drop out they didn't have the financial means. How she has achieved positions that no woman has ever achieved in Texas, head of the Texas Bar, head of the Dallas Bar, head of a major Texas law firm.

PHILLIPS: All right, I'm hearing strength of character. I'm hearing strength of character, I'm hearing intelligence. OK, tell me experience.

COATS: Experience, look at her volunteer role and the number of volunteer things that she has been engaged in. The pro bono work, hundreds of hours, if not thousands of hours, of pro bono work, free work for legal clients. The volunteer actions that she has done with a whole number of different organizations, her participation in the American Bar Association. On and on it goes.

PHILLIPS: Constitutional law. How about constitutional law?

COATS: Well, as special counsel to the president, that's exactly what she deals with. She is one of the people who were very close to the president in recommending all these judges that would have been very acceptable to Robert Bork for appellate court positions, recommending to the president, examining their qualifications from a constitutional standpoint.

So I think the broad variety and diverse variety of experience that she brings is perfectly suitable for the Supreme Court.

PHILLIPS: Has she ever written about the Constitution?

COATS: Well, she's written about the Constitution a lot in private advice to the president, that's what the special counsel does.

PHILLIPS: Private advice. Boy, you just want to know what the private advice is. Everybody wants to know, Senator.

COATS: Well, sure they want to know. But if you're legal counsel to anyone, whether it's the president of the United States or you or me, you don't want to publish what your lawyer tells you in private. That's attorney-client privilege and no one would respect that principle more than members of the Supreme Court.

PHILLIPS: Now, you've had a lot of time to spend with her, you're coaching her on how to approach the questions. What are you saying to her? What are the challenges you see?

COATS: Well, I don't think coaching is the right word. I'm working with her to, first of all, introduce her to the senators that she will be meeting and talking with on a private basis prior to her confirmation hearings. Secondly, I'm talking to her about the process that the Senate will be going through, having been there and understand that process. For someone not familiar with it, it's hopefully a good advice.

I am answering some of her questions regarding certain senators, what perspective are they bringing in terms of looking, what kind of questions would they ask. But she is fully capable of answering those questions. She understands what the role of the court should be. And I think perhaps the most important thing is she represents the president's views on the role of the court, to adjudicate, evaluate, but not legislate.

PHILLIPS: Dan Coats, special adviser to Supreme Court nominee Harriet Miers. Sir, thanks for your time.

COATS: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: Well, there's much more to come in "The Situation Room," including the next great U.S. quake. It's inevitable, but are we prepared?

Plus, politics down and dirty. We'll show you what prompted this parliamentary brawl.

PHILLIPS: And welcome back to "The Situation Room".

VELSHI: Our Zain Verjee joins us now from the CNN center in Atlanta. She got a closer look. What is she giggling about?

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR: It's so exciting to see you there, Ali, not behind that computer. We can actually see you properly.

VELSHI: Well, thank you. You got enough of a view?

VERJEE: That's good. That's good, keep it there.

Look, if you're flying into Boston, be prepared to wait. A malfunctioning radar system is delaying flights into Logan International Airport for a second straight day. Federal officials are working to repair the problem. An FAA spokeswoman says the radar is showing false targets or blips that aren't actual planes. A backup system's helping monitoring flights. Delays are at least two hours.

Torrential rains and flooding in New Hampshire have left at least three people dead, and at least four people are missing, including a couple whose house was swept away by the flood waters. Police are going door to door to check on families. Six feet of water covered some roads and even more rain's seconds expected this week.

A possible break through in the investigation into this month's deadly Bali bombings. Indonesian police say they've arrested a man who lived with the three suicide bombers near the bombing sight. Police say he disappeared days before the October 1st attacks. Police are also questioning three other men. The bombings killed 22 people and injured more than 100 others. Tempers erupted in Taiwan's parliament. Lawmakers literally went to blows today over an opposition bill. One even got a bloody eye from a tossed mobile phone. It's not the first time fights have broken out. Chairs, shoes, and even food have flown across the chamber on occasion. And, Ali, Kyra, it's much the same when we're competing to replace Wolf in "The Situation Room." Clearly, you both won, but...

PHILLIPS: We signed a treaty, actually.

VELSHI: Look at this stuff. Zain, I know you speak many languages. I don't know if you've been able to figure out what this fight was, in fact, about. Do we know what the bill was?

VERJEE: Yes, actually. The opposition had put forward a bill, and they basically wanted to create an independent media watchdog. And the ruling party and the opposition disagreed over how it should be formed. They also don't agree over who started the fight.

But like I said, this sort of thing is happening all the time in Taiwan's parliament. Actually, just last week, there were two women lawmakers that were arguing over a bill, and they were pulling each other's hair out while the men were standing there saying, "Dissolve the parliament, dissolve the parliament."

VERJEE: They're getting ready with their signs and all that.

PHILLIPS: Did you hear? She said the men were standing there. Thank you. If Zain would have been there mediating, it would have been a whole another story.

VERJEE: I'd have been pulling Kyra's hair out in "The Situation Room".

VELSHI: Zain, good to see you. We will check in with you again later on.

VERJEE: Thanks, guys.

VELSHI: Zain Verjee in Atlanta.

Just ahead, the earthquake didn't choose sides. We're going to look at the devastation and desperation of the area's of Kashmir that are controlled by India.

PHILLIPS: And first birds, then humans. A top U.S. official says there's a very high risk of a pandemic. What's being done about it?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Welcome back. You are in THE SITUATION ROOM.

PHILLIPS: Well tens of thousands are reported dead in Pakistan and it's half of the disputed Kashmir region. India has also suffered losses with more than 1,200 reported deaths and widespread destruction in its Kashmir district. CNN's Ram Ramgopal is live in Srinagar, capital of Indian-controlled Kashmir -- Ram.

RAM RAMGOPAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, as you rightly point out, there are really no borders when it comes to this disaster. On the Indian side of Kashmir, widespread devastation, especially close to that line of control that separates the two territories, one Pakistani-controlled, the other Indian-controlled.

And earlier today the news really was that of the weather which has turned worse in the last 24 hours or so. Heavy rain, there's also been a biting chill in the air and many of the people, survivors of this earthquake are really at a loss in both in terms of what they have lost physically, but they are also having to cope with this new challenge by the way of the weather.

Many of them are actually living in makeshift tents. Some of them do have relatives they have gone to, but it is a big challenge for the authorities. Relief is coming into parts of Kashmir. Into the more remote towns, though, it's not getting there quite as fast as some of those people would like -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Ram, what about rescue crews? I mean, this is an area that doesn't have the most advanced technology. Are there enough people, first responders to get to the individuals and save their lives?

VELSHI: All right. We seem to have lost Ram Ramgopal in Srinagar in Indian-controlled Kashmir. We will check in with him in a moment. Now, one of the things, Kyra, about our ability notwithstanding this, the technological ability to bring all these pictures in very live is it makes it very real to us.

And one of the concerns about making it that real is when that kind of an earthquake hits here in the United States. So that's one of the things that Brian Todd is going to be looking at. He's at the U.S. Geological Survey. I don't know if he's right there, if he's there right now. Brian Todd is at the U.S. Geological Survey in Reston, Virginia. Brian, are you with us? There you are, Brian.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I am, Ali. Yes, how are you doing?

VELSHI: Good.

TODD: We are here at the -- as you mentioned at the U.S. Geological Survey. This is where the top earthquake experts gather to monitor earthquake activity, and they that they record earthquake activity in this building every day somewhere around the globe.

I'm joined here by one of the experts. He is a seismologist Michael Blanpied. Mike, thank you for joining us. Mike, this map behind us here, it is called one of the earthquake hazard maps that you monitor activity on. And it's a real eye opener. Tell us now -- we know that the West Coast of the U.S. is notorious for seismic activity, but show us where else in the United States are some of the hot spots. MICHAEL BLANPIED, U.S. GEOLOGICAL SURVEY: Well, this map shows areas that are likely to have seismic activity that cause strong shaking. And the dots show cities that are particularly at risk. And as you can see, there are zones in the inner mountain west from the Sierras to the Rockies, in the central U.S., eastern Tennessee and even Charleston, South Carolina that are at risk.

TODD: And some of the areas in Tennessee and South Carolina got some really devastating earthquakes in the 1800s. Talk about those.

BLANPIED: Well, in 1811 and 1812 there was a series of three earthquakes at least magnitude of 7.5, perhaps higher, that struck over the course of two months and caused widespread shaking and damage in this lightly populated area that's now near Memphis, St. Louis and so forth. Charleston, South Carolina, in 1886 had a magnitude 7.3 earthquake. It was devastating in that area.

TODD: And the one you said in the Memphis area was felt as far north as where?

BLANPIED: The reports are that church bells in Boston were rung from that earthquake. It's hard to believe but the shaking carries very far in the eastern U.S., even more so than in the west.

TODD: Now at the risk of handicapping something like this, what are the chances these areas in the southeastern U.S., and even in the east -- New York, Boston -- might feel an earthquake of that magnitude again?

BLANPIED: Well, the chance of an earthquake in any one of the areas are rather low. The earthquakes occur relatively rarely compared to the West Coast. However, each one of them is at some risk.

And the chances of an earthquake like that, even though low, the earthquake would be devastating. And so it's really incumbent upon these areas to take a hard look at the seismic risk and evaluate what sort of steps can be taken to preserve the public safety.

TODD: All right, Mike. Thank you very much for joining us. We appreciate that. Now, in this building there they are also monitoring the aftershocks from the Pakistani earthquake. And, Ali, they say that those aftershocks are literally going to be felt for months to come. So there is a lot of activity to monitor both in the United States here and around the world.

VELSHI: Brian, it's information everybody is interested in. Thanks so much for that. Brian Todd, at the U.S. Geological Survey.

PHILLIPS: And there are a tremendous amount of earthquake resources on the Web. Our Internet reporter, Jacki Schechner, is checking the situation on line -- Jacki.

JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Hey, Kyra. Well, the cool thing is the maps that you were just seeing Brian talking about, there's very similar maps online from the U.S. Geological Survey. Let's take a look at some of those.

You go their site, USGS.gov, in the bottom right hand corner, you can select your states. Let's take a look at South Carolina where he was talking about. And this is the earthquake hazard potential. You can see right there, kind of Charleston down in this area. You can see where it's a great amount of hazard potential.

Let's compare this to something like Bismarck, North Dakota. You can see where the colors there are much more muted, not as much of a risk in North Dakota.

Some of the other resources from National Atlas -- this is courtesy of the Department of the Interior. You can see the historical activity of earthquakes across the world. Let's zoom in a little bit, again, in the South Carolina area. This is from the mid 1500s all the way through to 2004.

Let's go over to California on the West Coast, clearly a lot more activity on the West Coast. And then if you take an even closer look you can see how detailed that gets. Now the reason we're talking about this clearly is because of the earthquake in Pakistan.

There are plenty of resources on line to take a look at the comparison there. You can see right here where it's like the red circle, that's where Pakistan is. And then the larger yellow circle would be the earthquake that causes the tsunami of last year. You can take a closer look at the images online, a seismic monitor, as well. All of this information courtesy of the U.S. Geological Survey -- Ali.

VELSHI: I was talking about -- when you said mid-1500s to 2004, is that years?

SCHECHNER: Yes, it was 1568 to 2004.

PHILLIPS: Who was tracking them?

VELSHI: Who was tracking earthquakes back then? What were they using?

PHILLIPS: I don't know them personally, Ali. I'm sure there was somebody who was working on it.

PHILLIPS: Sticks and stones.

VELSHI: Yes, no kidding. Something shook. All right. Thanks, Jacki.

The Pakistani city of Balakot may have been hit the hardest by the earthquake. Virtually every building there was flattened. ITN's Bill Neely reports there. The effort there is moving from rescue to recovery. Now, we've got to caution you; this report contains some graphic images.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BILL NEELY, ITN REPORTER (voice-over): From what is left of a town that looks like a graveyard, they are running away. The mothers, who have no children left, and who have only themselves now for comfort. The generation they gave birth to is gone.

And who can blame them for running away from this? A crushed little boy. In the ruins of Balakot school they break through the collapsed floors. But what they bring out is a sight beyond sadness. It's a little girl in a green dress, all broken. She and nearly 200 other boys and girls have already been pulled out and lifted away, their bags and books useless now.

And then, the work begins again, and the work has paid off. A French rescue team using cameras to probe deep down into the schools saw a face. Three-and-a-half days after he was trapped in his classroom, a scared little boy. He's about 15 feet down. Now it's critical the roof doesn't collapse.

Slowly, astonishingly, the boy's limp body is pulled from the hole and handed to his father. No one could quite believe it. Four other children were rescued like this. Four-year-old Fraz (ph) was too bewildered to eat or drink. Out of 400 children, he is one of the very few who survived.

(on camera): The conditions here for rescuing anyone are getting worse. They think there are still the bodies of 150 children in this school. The last two little girls they pulled out alive, that was 18 hours ago and even that seems amazing, but the weather is getting much worse now.

(voice-over): The rain lashed down on the bodies of children who had not yet been claimed by their parents. Perhaps because their parents, too, are gone. Deep in the debris today, they broke into a new classroom -- seven dead bodies here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seven dead bodies here.

NEELY (on camera): Seven?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seven.

NEELY (voice-over): Six children, huddled close to their teacher. These people are the survivors, but they don't feel lucky. They say they'd rather be dead, like their children.

What they have been through is hard to imagine, leafing through their children's handwriting in English poetry books, their children down below. A sorrow beyond words.

Billy Neely, ITV News, Balakot, Pakistan.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Once again with that sorrow though, there are those survivors. Becky Anderson calling them miracles. And she says those miracles are still happening every day.

VELSHI: Yes, thankfully. And you saw that yesterday where that baby, the little...

PHILLIPS: The two year old.

VELSHI: Yes, the two year old, and the mother coming out, all the flattened buildings, all the pictures of that don't express to you what something like that does, either the miracle or those bodies coming out.

PHILLIPS: Well still ahead on THE SITUATION ROOM, bird flu fears. The health and human services secretary heads overseas to the front lines of a possible pandemic. Stay with us. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt is in Thailand. He's getting a firsthand look at the front lines of a possible bird flu pandemic.

Now, Leavitt is leading an international team visiting Southeast Asia where avian flu has killed at least 60 people. He says the danger of a global outbreak is, quote, "very high."

PHILLIPS: Now, there are drugs that can help fight an avian flu pandemic. But, problems with patients could prevent widespread distribution.

CNN's Mary Snow is in New York with that part of the story. Hi, Mary.

MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Kyra. The concerns mounting about the bird flu, one pharmaceutical company is finding itself under pressure, Roche Pharmaceuticals. It makes Tamiflu, which is an anti-viral medication that would be used to fight a potential epidemic.

And at issue is whether Roche should lift a patent so that other companies can make generic versions that would be cheaper and boost supply. The U.S. secretary general last week warned not to allow patents to be barriers against getting these drugs to the poor.

One health official in Taiwan is quoted in "The New York Times" as saying that its scientists have found a way to begin mass production of Tamiflu quickly and in that same article the official also suggests that the drug company is overstating how difficult it is to make the drug.

Now in response to that, Roche released a statement to say that Tamiflu is complex to manufacture and can take up to 12 months to produce. And it says because of its expertise no one could do it faster. Our assumption is that it would take a generic company about three years according to gear up. And that's is a statement from the company.

Now, another group representing drug manufacturers came out saying that public health officials should not consider imposing compulsory licenses on avian flu medicines, arguing that it would discourage new research needed to address the avian flu.

Now, earlier today I spoke with a spokeswoman for the world health organization, who says Roche has promised 3 million courses or doses of the drug by next year.

A flu expert, though, here in the U.S., says if and if there is a pandemic about 90 million people would need the drug. Kyra?

PHILLIPS: Mary Snow, thank you very much.

VELSHI: Now, we have invited senior executives from Roche Pharmaceuticals to join us here in THE SITUATION ROOM and hopefully, they will be able to do that. But, this is going to continue to be a frightening story to follow.

PHILLIPS: Well, we -- and also with the president meeting with all the pharmaceutical companies, it's going to be interesting to see who comes forward, what company comes forward, how cheap the drug could get, if there will be more drugs ...

VELSHI: How fast it can be made. All good questions.

All right, coming up, a high flying mystery. How did a stolen plane wind up at an airport in Georgia?

PHILLIPS: And we'll tell you who is taking aims at stun guns. Are they a danger online? You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

PHILLIPS: And welcome back. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

VELSHI: Our Zain Verjee joins us now from the CNN Center in Atlanta with another look at some stories she is following. Hello, Zain.

VERJEE: Hey, guys. Guatemalan authorities have called off the search for bodies in the town of Panabaj. It is feared that as many as a thousand people are buried under a huge mud slide there. The area is declared a disaster zone.

At least 500 people died when heavy rains from Hurricane Stan sparked mudslides last week. And authorities are worried that there could be a food crisis.

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is in Kyrgyztan. She met today with the country's new president. They signed off on a written agreement under which Washington can continue to lease a key airbase in the former Soviet Republic. Since 2001, U.S. troops have used the base for refueling operations and resupply missions into Afghanistan. Rice will be in Afghanistan tomorrow.

The FBI is trying to figure out how a charter jet, reported stolen from St. Augustine in Florida, ended up at an airport in Lawrenceville, Georgia. Workers found the $7 million Cessna plane at the tarmac at the Gwinnett County Airport yesterday. The front edge of one wing was damaged. Authorities say that there's no evidence that any weapons or any drugs were on the plane. Martha Stewart knows the rules to success. The domestic diva's new book "The Martha Rules" is on store shelves. Now, in it, she serves up some tips for would-be entrepreneurs who want to create their own business empires. She suggests taking calculated risks, and she also says that having a big idea is a good thing. And she also, incidentally, in an interview, guys, said that whenever she has an idea, whether she wants to remember something, she just sends herself a note from her Blackberry or from her computer.

Do you do that, Ali?

VELSHI: I send myself notes from Blackberry. In fact, I don't really detach from my Blackberry very often. I send myself notes all night, actually.

PHILLIPS: I was anti--Blackberry.

VERJEE: "I'm so great." Note to self: "I'm really good in THE SITUATION ROOM."

PHILLIPS: See you guys, ADD?

VELSHI: Yes, I know, I know.

PHILLIPS: Techno people. And you know, like, I got to get back in...

VELSHI: That's why it always takes you, like, hours to email us back when we send you a message.

PHILLIPS: I know, because I can't figure out how to use the keyboard. I'm working on it. Zain, thank you.

VELSHI: Hey, Zain, I'm kind of worried, Zain, about being in the middle of this next thing. Because we're going from you to Jack Cafferty. Do I -- should I stand in the middle of this? Or do you just want go straight to Jack?

VERJEE: No, no. Stay out of it. Let's get to Jack.

PHILLIPS: Look at Jack's face. Look at this. Look at this shot. Look at this. This is like -- you've got Zain, with this beautiful smile, look at Grumpy Pants up there, right above. Look at this!

VERJEE: I love Grumpy Pants. Lay off Grumpy Pants.

PHILLIPS: All right. It's like "The Brady Bunch" here. He's right above you.

CAFFERTY: Have you checked out a mirror there yourself, Heidi Collins?

PHILLIPS: Oh!

CAFFERTY: Oh, you're not Heidi Collins. VELSHI: I'll just be leaving THE SITUATION ROOM. See you guys.

CAFFERTY: I'm sorry, I was distracted.

PHILLIPS: See you later, Ali.

CAFFERTY: In the wake of the South Asian earthquake, some international relief agencies are worried that Americans are subject to something called donor fatigue. We've had the earthquakes and the fires and the mudslides. It's just been one thing after the other.

So the question this hour is, are Americans disastered out?

Carol in Philadelphia writes: "Of course we are. Twenty-four hour news, Web casts, blog, e-mails, instant messaging. I check the news on my cell phone before I even get out of bed." That's too bad, Carol. "This media mania, combined with the sheer magnitude of these disasters, has numbed Americans."

Fenton in New Rochelle, New York: "No, we're just broke. Financially, physically and mentally broke. Maybe if we had enough jobs and didn't owe the world so much money, we could help more. There is a limit to the riches of the United States and we're not far from it."

Kane in Honolulu, Hawaii, writes: "I strongly believe the majority of the world population is disastered out, war-weary, sick of the corrupt leadership, disgusted by the corporate greed and so very frustrated by how difficult it is to make ends meet, and to live a decent and prosperous life." It ain't that hard, Kane, you can do it.

Ryan in South Carolina: "I think Americans are disastered out, and for good reason. We have our own lives and our own problems. We cannot donate to every single cause."

And Roger in Stephen's Point, Wisconsin, writes: "Not disastered out, but maybe a little worn out. But we Americans always bounce back. However, if Zain Verjee takes another vacation, that may just be a bit too much to deal with. I know Jack would be beside himself, and if Jack was beside himself, that would mean there are two of him."

I've got to stop reading this stuff. It's making me nuts.

PHILLIPS: Did you just say two of Jack Cafferty?

CAFFERTY: That's what the person said there.

PHILLIPS: That could be really scary.

VERJEE: We can clone Jack. But, Roger, they make me work more than three hours a day in THE SITUATION ROOM. So I need to award myself a few days off every now and then. Jack, you'll manage, though, without me.

CAFFERTY: We'll try to muddle through. I got old Ali and Heidi to help me here. VELSHI: I'm back.

PHILLIPS: Are you going to be nice to me, Jack? I'm just wondering. Can we just recapture the love we once had?

CAFFERTY: It may be too late.

VELSHI: We will check in with both of you later, because there's so much more right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.

PHILLIPS: That's right.

Some of Harriet Miers critics dismiss the Supreme Court nominee as a Bush crony. Do newly-leased documents back them up?

VELSHI: And also ahead, we're back to the Asia earthquake zone with an update on the devastation and the desperation that's being made worse by the weather. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: And it's almost time for the markets to close and the closing bell. Ali...

VELSHI: Well, thank you.

PHILLIPS: Your specialty, your background.

VELSHI: Let's take a look what's going on today.

Shots fired again between billionaire investor Carl Icahn and Time Warner, the parent company of CNN. Now, Carol Ichan is a so- called corporate raider. He's been very critical of Time Warner's senior management and the company's board in recent weeks. Today he fired off a letter to shareholders, criticizing what he calls significant missteps that are destroying shareholder values. Among those missteps, according to Ichan, the 2001 merger with America Online that has led to $87 billion worth of write-downs. Ichan asks why many of the directors and executives who pushed for that and approved the merger are still on the company's board.

Ichan also says Time Warner has been selling the company's prized assets, like Comedy Central and Warner Music, on the cheap. He criticized senior management for pulling out of the bidding for the famed movie studio MGM, only to let it fall into the hands of Comcast and Sony, which are two of Time Warner's biggest competitors.

Ichan has written it's clear that there have been a series of significant missteps by the board and Time Warner's senior management, which have resulted in further destruction of value.

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

PHILLIPS: It's 4:00 p.m. in Washington, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where new pictures and information from around the world are arriving all the time. TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com