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The Situation Room

Power Lines Sabotaged in Baghdad; Rove Testifies Before Grand Jury for Fourth Time

Aired October 14, 2005 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ABBI TATTON, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: For example, AmericaBlog, this is the Washington, D.C., blogger, liberal blogger, John Aravosis, who is saying, "Fear, panic, a White House without Rove itself. Doesn't get much better."
Wolf, back to you.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Abbi and Jacki.

It's 5:00 p.m. here in Washington, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where we're getting word potentially of sabotage in Baghdad, this in the hours just before Iraq's constitutional referendum scheduled to begin. What's going on? We have our reporters in Iraq standing by to tell you.

Also happening right now, it's 5:00 p.m. over at the White House, where Karl Rove works. But the Bush adviser spent half his day with the grand jury investigating the CIA leak scandal. What could Rove have to say for three and a half hours before the grand jury?

And it's midnight in Iraq, where tensions are high, and polls will open in hours, Iraqi voters preparing to make history. Will they say yes to that new constitution?

It's 5:00 p.m. in New Jersey, where rivers are rising, dams are breached, and police are conducting door-to-door rescues, not by car, but by boat. Will the deluge ever end?

I'm Wolf Blitzer, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

We start with an update on a developing story we've been following here in THE SITUATION ROOM, a massive blackout in Baghdad, just hours before voting scheduled to begin for Iraq's constitutional referendum.

CNN's Aneesh Raman is joining us now live from a very, very dark Iraqi capital, total pitch-black behind you, Aneesh. What's the latest information we're getting?

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, we understand that 70 percent of Baghdad is right now without power. It happened after an insurgent attack on a line coming in from northern cities into the capital city. Water in parts of Baghdad also out, because the pumps are out in the capital as well. It comes, of course, on the eve of Iraq's constitutional referendum and reemphasizes for Iraqis, what is their top priority? Not the political process, but the very basic needs that they still want to address, electricity, water, and security. And that will be in the back of their minds.

Now the electricity ministry says they are working through the night to get power back by tomorrow's vote. They are trying to get power from other cities into the capital. It's unclear whether they will make that deadline, and whether there will be power in the polling stations tomorrow morning, Wolf.

BLITZER: Aneesh, this is highly unusual. We've heard of blackouts in Baghdad and elsewhere, but this is such a huge one. Has anyone there remembered anything like this?

RAMAN: Well, it's much larger than anything I can recall, than many of us here can recall. And often, as you mention, we do see blackouts in the capital city. It is often because of failures within the infrastructure, the electricity, is not as the result of insurgent attacks. It's been some weeks, if not a few months, since we've seen an insurgent attack that has taken out anywhere close to this amount of power.

The electricity ministry, of course, acknowledging that the timing makes it incredibly suspicious that the insurgents might have something more planned. A curfew is in place on the streets tonight, so no one is out and around the capital city.

But again, Iraqis will wake likely to no power as they head to vote on the constitutional referendum.

BLITZER: So just to be straight, Aneesh, it's the power, the electricity, as well as the water coming into Baghdad, is that right?

RAMAN: Well, the water pumps in the capital city are out, given that the electricity is out. And so those who are part of the pumps, and we don't know how many at this point are out, have lost their water as well. And those main electricity lines coming from the north into the capital have been disrupted by an insurgent attack.

It's unclear how quickly Iraqi authorities can be in getting power from other sources and linking it into the capital. Big questions for them tonight.

BLITZER: Huge questions. And if this is, in fact, the work of insurgents on the eve of the election, a very, very significant development. We'll see how it impacts on the actual election. Aneesh, we're going to get back to you very soon.

Let's bring in our own Ali Velshi and Tom Foreman. They're joining us here in THE SITUATION ROOM.

What are you picking up, Ali?

ALI VELSHI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we, as Aneesh said, this is, with some regularity, power goes out in Baghdad. Part of it is the infrastructure. They have demand for about double the amount of energy that they're able to actually produce. And one of the things that the governing council had said is that it's going to need a big cash infusion just to get that -- get enough energy out there.

And that doesn't include protecting it from saboteurs. Saboteurs have done a lot of damage in -- to the electrical system, and it's an easy way to disrupt society.

Now, on the eve of this referendum, the feeling amongst Iraqis is they're dissatisfied with these little basic services. And a lot of them say, at least under the Ba'ath Party, under Saddam Hussein, this kind of stuff, this kind of third-world stuff didn't happen. Now it happens a lot more, and that's got to at least affect some people's psyche as they go to the polls.

Even if it doesn't do that, it could just disrupt people going to the polls. It could disrupt the fact that these -- this referendum may take place. So there are serious implications, even though this kind of thing has happened before in Baghdad.

And typically, residents of Baghdad might even be more used to it than we would be here.

BLITZER: Tom, you're looking at these power lines coming into Baghdad, and where there may have been sabotage. What are you seeing?

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Sure, a point of reference here. If we take a look at Baghdad right now, and take a look at the area we're talking about here, this goes all the way into Iran -- or to Iraq, excuse me. And I want you to just look at right now, if we look at Baghdad, the areas being hit, nice big city here, where people are preparing to vote.

Question that you raise is really interesting. Are they going to hold this against the insurgents, or say the coalition government's not working, or the new Iraqi government's not working? It's all been a big package of a disaster.

Baghdad's a big area here. It hit and has not only affected the city itself, which, as you know, is quite extensive, but, by all accounts, has reached out throughout the entire central region of Iraq. So people in smaller towns way out here are saying they don't have power either. But it's coming back online.

The origin of it, as you said, is north, though. Let's fly up north here. This is where Kirkuk is, and this is where the problem originated. And the point is, look at all this ground in between. Every time you have all of that turf, somebody's got to cover it. There are targets there to hit those power lines and knock things out.

Clearly, that seems to be what had happened, what has happened here. And we'll get more details of how they hit it and how quickly it can be restored.

BLITZER: It's, it, it's, let me bring back Aneesh Raman, he's in Baghdad for us. If, in fact, insurgents or terrorists did this, sabotage the power lines, of course, we don't have Aneesh right now. But I'll ask the same question to Ali.

If, in fact, insurgents did this, it would show a level of planning and sophistication that would seem to go well beyond improvised explosive devices or suicide car bombings. This would be a pretty sophisticated operation.

VELSHI: Except that it's not the first priority, has not been the first priority of the Iraqi government before the war or now, to protect the electrical grid. Electrical-built grids are not the most secure things anywhere. It's not, in some level, it's a sophisticated tactic, but it's not sophisticated to take out power. It can be always restored. You can keep on sabotaging power, electrical power will come back. There are ways of getting around this.

So it may be a last-ditch kind of thing. It may be the kind of thing that Tom suggested is designed to make people think, Your government is not in control. Your vote doesn't matter right now, because we're still messing your life up.

BLITZER: It can be very demoralizing. We know they've gone after oil pipelines around the country, Tom, as well.

FOREMAN: Sure, and the Iraqi officials are already saying, as they look at the problem up here in Kirkuk, they're already saying, Look, we think we can get power back on to Baghdad here maybe even by 7:00 a.m. And by the way, the voting happens in the daytime, it's paper ballots. So it won't actually stop the voting.

The funny thing is, if they can actually get much of this power on by daylight again, or by midday, how much will that say to people, Look, we are in control, even if they throw us a curve ball?

BLITZER: All right. Aneesh is back with us in Baghdad. Aneesh, are you getting some more information?

RAMAN: Yes, Wolf, we've just spoken with the minister of electricity himself, confirming, as we were just suggesting, that in Beiji and Mussaev (ph), those towns as well, the power is completely out. This is bigger than they originally thought. A main power tower in that area that had the lines going from those northern towns into the capital has been disrupted. It is, they confirm, by an insurgent attack.

We don't have details on what exactly happened, whether it was an explosion or something else the insurgents did. This is, as they say, bigger than they thought. They are looking now to bring power in from other areas. It is unclear, and they could not answer whether we would have power by 7:00 a.m. local tomorrow, which is when the polls open.

But as they have been mentioning, the poll stations are not run by electricity. It's a paper ballot. And if there's enough light, they think they can go forward. But it will nonetheless wreak havoc, in a way, for Iraqis and reemphasize to them what it is that they want out of this government. Whether or not they will then affect their vote in terms of this constitution, if it gets rejected, a new government comes in, if it gets accepted, this current government goes forward.

That is what we'll wait to see in terms of the impact of this blackout, Wolf.

BLITZER: I assume, Aneesh, that in the so-called green zone, the most secure area, where the U.S. embassy is located, the Iraqi government is located, they've lost power there as well. They don't have their own private generators, necessarily, for a huge area like that, do they?

RAMAN: Well, not for all of it. Certainly for the key infrastructure, they will. We glanced over there. It's on the other side of where I'm standing. And a lot of the power is still running because of those generators. Our offices as well operating now on generators.

And only the affluent Iraqis will have that option at this moment. The vast majority of the 6 million to 7 million Iraqis in the capital city, 70 percent of which now don't have power, those in Beiji, those in Mussaev, they will be in complete darkness tonight.

But for the highly fortified green zone, as you mention, there is extensive generators. Blackouts happen often here, not usually the result, in recent days, of insurgent attacks, but because of system failures. There's such an overload of demand. A lot of Iraqis have televisions now, they have satellite dishes. They are stealing electricity from the lines in some areas. The demand is enormous, and the supply really is just starting to get to that level, just getting to where it was before the war and under Saddam.

A lot of the issue is security, the budgeting for setting up infrastructure in Baghdad. A lot of the budgeting went for the actual systems that were needed, and not enough of the budgeting went to security. And now, the majority of the money is being spent on securing these pipelines for the sewage as well as the electricity lines, and that is why it is taking quite some time to get the power up and running on a consistent basis, Wolf.

BLITZER: The U.S. military facilities are in and around Baghdad. Camp Victory, for example, near the airport, I was there earlier in the room. I assume they have their own generators to keep the military in business during this kind of a blackout.

RAMAN: Exactly. I mean, the question becomes, for all of us who have generators, how long we can keep them up and running. It's a matter of fuel. Again, the minister of electricity, who we just spoke with, says they hope to have power back in the greater Baghdad area, as well as these other towns, Beiji and Mussaev, hopefully by some point tomorrow, not guessing any specific time, just saying it will happen gradually.

But for a key infrastructures in this city, blackouts, again, a consistent issue here. They've got the generators, they've got the fuel, and hopefully they can get the power up and running at some point tomorrow, Wolf.

BLITZER: And finally, Aneesh, before I let you back, get back to work over there, the elections themselves, these are ballots. They're not electric voting booths or anything sophisticated. They go in there, they do the thumbprint once again, they get the finger in the ink, is that it? And then they go out and place the ballot in a box?

RAMAN: Exactly. There's some 6,000-plus polling centers throughout the country. Iraqis will go in, have a paper ballot that essentially says Yes or No on the country's draft constitution. They will check one, they will place it into those Tupperware boxes, you might recall from January, that will then be counted later in the day.

So power in any sort of logistical sense isn't really necessary for the vote to go off. It could affect turnout in the capital, as well as these other areas. But officials say, as long as the sun is out, hopefully, at these polling centers that are affected, the voting can go on, Wolf.

BLITZER: And the voter hours are just during daylight. Once it gets dark, voting is done.

RAMAN: Exactly. They begin at 7:00 a.m. It's unclear exactly when officially they will end. We saw in January that a number of polling stations kept themselves open well past the official end time, because Iraqis were just coming to the polls. The thought was that they had risked their lives to get there, they weren't going to be kept away. So it could go into the night, but not too far in. Of course, when darkness comes, curfew hits, and Iraqis need to be at home, as we're in this sort of security lockdown until next week, Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh, we're going to let you get back, make a few phone calls. We're going to get back to you very, very soon.

Very significant, the demoralizing effect on the Iraqi population. It may not necessarily be all that inconvenient, because they are used to...

VELSHI: They're used to it.

BLITZER: ... these blackouts. But the fact that on the eve of what -- of this huge election, the whole world watching, they lose this...

VELSHI: It's supposed to be about hope, and you're muddling around in the dark.

You know, Aneesh made one very interesting point. People are stealing electricity. That's still common. Now, stealing electricity is not entirely difficult. You could steal electricity, I imagine, in most American cities. We don't do it, because we don't need to. There's enough power generally around.

But the fact that that happens, most cities, municipalities, countries don't invest a lot of money in ensuring that that infrastructure's safe. They'd just rather have enough electricity go to everybody, and no one thinks about stealing it.

So there is vulnerability in that system. As Aneesh says, it's never clear to anybody why it's happening, whether this is infrastructure or sabotage. But in the end, tomorrow's an important day, and it would be nice to wake up with the lights on.

BLITZER: With at least some power. Hold on one second, I want to go right back to Aneesh in Baghdad.

Aneesh, you're getting some new information?

RAMAN: Yes, the minister again just confirming that this was an insurgent attack. We mentioned earlier, they did not know exactly what happened. They're now saying that that tower was blown up, by what level of explosive they don't know. But emphasizing again, this is an insurgent attack. This is not a system failure. This is something deliberate to undermine the elections that are set to take place tomorrow.

Again, he is not giving any time frame on when the power will get back, hoping for tomorrow, but not guessing that that's a definite, Wolf.

BLITZER: Well, CNN obviously now has confirmed an insurgent attack takes down the power lines going in and out of Baghdad. The city is potentially very, very dark for the time being.

Aneesh, what kind of security do they normally have around these towers, these -- bringing the power, the electricity into Baghdad?

RAMAN: Well, they tend to be heavily fortified. The key is that these lines run extensive miles throughout the country. And this tower itself, we're not sure exactly where specifically it was, what the security was there.

But a lot of the issues here, Wolf, are simply numbers. They don't have a lot of Iraqi police and troops to put throughout the country at the infrastructure throughout Iraq. They really concentrated on key places in the capital city, as well as in Kirkuk, or key pipelines in terms of oil.

And it's a numbers issue, when you talk about Iraqi security forces, when you talk about the U.S. military. There's a finite number of troops on the ground, of boots on the ground, of Iraqis who are armed and ready to protect infrastructure. And it becomes a game as to where the paramount concern is.

And the insurgents are incredibly adaptive. We've known that for some time. And they find the vulnerabilities. They are sophisticated. They stake out these locations. They look at what the security is, what time it changes over. And they plan their attacks because of that.

So we're waiting exactly for more information on this tower itself. But it's a consistent issue this government deals with. It's trying to protect an entire country with not nearly the troops it requires.

BLITZER: Aneesh, when I interviewed the U.S. ambassador to Iraq earlier today, Zalmay Khalilzad, he said they were bracing for something big. He said -- he used the word "big" in advance of the election, the insurgents trying to undermine the elections. Obviously, he didn't know this was going to happen. But everyone, I take it, over there has been bracing for some supposedly spectacular insurgent attack to mar the nature of this election.

RAMAN: Yes, if you'll recall back in January, the election day itself saw some of the highest levels of attacks that we have seen in Iraq, 300-plus attacks on January's election day. That ranged from gunfire to suicide bombings.

And in the past week, while we have seen an escalation in attacks, two suicide bombings, day after day, in that northwestern town of Tal Afar that killed about 60 people, we haven't seen the steady surge that we saw in January. And U.S. military officials have told CNN that their fear is, the insurgency is laying low, is preparing attacks for tomorrow itself.

The biggest threat, they say, because vehicles are being kept off the road, are going to be suicide bombers waiting in line with Iraqis at the polls and detonating. And in some parts, there are already urging -- there is already caution being put out to Iraqis not to wait in line too close to one another as they wait to vote, to space themselves out and not make themselves more of a target.

But incredibly high security. The borders are closed, the provincial borders are closed, the streets are empty. A curfew is imposed, virtual lockdown, similar to what we saw in January, to try and prevent any large-scale attacks. But there is fear that that could happen tomorrow, Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh, stand by for a moment.

I want to bring Tom Foreman back into this discussion. Tom, you would think that on the eve of an election like this, with the whole world watching, basically, there would be enormous security around those towers, around those facilities, to make sure something like this couldn't happen. But what you're suggesting, that a well-planned terrorist attack could take this kind of power system out for a big city like Baghdad.

FOREMAN: Well, again, it goes back to this question of just square yardage, square miles. This is the problem. Power systems, one of the reasons they're not guarded so well is because they're everywhere. They reach all throughout communities. They have to for any kind of modern community.

And you can't guard every place that it goes. A lot of power systems also have been designed over the years to have certain redundancies in them, certain ways to get around the back door. That's one of the reasons why your power goes out in a neighborhood, or a big part of town, and it comes back fairly quickly. It's not because somebody has necessarily spliced a given wire. It's because they've rerouted it around that.

Now, what I don't know is how much that's been rebuilt into the power structure here of Iraq. Can you knock out one line here and have them out for a long time? Do they have to patch that line? Or can they go around it a little bit with some other things and bring parts of town back up, and then get that line repaired?

BLITZER: Ali, for years under Saddam Hussein, one of the things they did, they spent tons of money on military, tons of money on palaces for Saddam Hussein, little money for infrastructure...

VELSHI: Yes, and that's a big...

BLITZER: ... like this. So when the U.S. and coalition forces went in, they were shocked at the oil industry, the electron -- the electric industry, all of the major...

VELSHI: It was in remarkable disrepair.

BLITZER: ... infrastructure, it was in, it was a total mess.

VELSHI: Twenty-nine power plants supply electricity to Iraq, around Iraq. There's a very big one in Baghdad, the Baghdad south power plant. And what the United States military found when they got in there, is that -- you know, we hear about these refineries that come offline for servicing, and we hear about plants that go down.

But they weren't doing that. They didn't take plants offline for servicing and reroute the power during Saddam's days. They just had to keep them running. That was what the engineers had to do, keep them running all the time, because a blackout wasn't supposed to happen.

And there's just an amount of service that has to be done to these things. They weren't there. So, A, they're not secure. B, they're fundamentally not reliable right now. And they're trying to rebuild them. So the question is, while this is an insurgent attack, can they get it online, can they reroute power? Which is how you might do it around here.

BLITZER: All right, we're going to take a quick break. We've got Aneesh Raman in Baghdad for us. We've got our other reporters standing by. Tom Foreman's here in THE SITUATION ROOM, Ali Velshi is here.

Breaking news out of Baghdad, insurgents have attacked the power lines, the electricity going into the Iraqi capital. It's dark in Baghdad right now on the eve of these historic constitutional referendum elections.

We'll go back there. We're watching the story. Stay with us in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BLITZER: Breaking news here in THE SITUATION ROOM. There's been a power blackout in Baghdad and the surrounding areas. A huge part of that city of some 7 or 8 million people now without power, the electricity ministry saying that this is the work of sabotage. Insurgents have destroyed the power lines, at least some of them, significant ones, coming into the Iraqi capital. We are watching the story.

Very significant right now in the eve of these elections for the constitution, elections scheduled to begin only a few hours from now.

CNN's Nic Robertson is joining us. He's north of -- northwest of Baghdad in Baquba. What do you see where you are, Nic? And what are you hearing?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on phone): Well, Wolf, I am on a military base at the moment here. There's certainly power on this base. We can see lights in the city. We just called somebody in the city of Baquba, which is about 45 miles northwest of Baghdad. We talked to them. They told us that there is power where they are in the city. As far as they know, the city has power throughout the city of Baquba.

We have not heard from any officials here that they have a power problem in this area. From what we can see, and from what we've heard talking to one person we know in the city of Baquba, the power (INAUDIBLE) in and around the town of Baquba does seem to be normal at this time, Wolf.

BLITZER: Do we know, Nic, if the power lines in Baquba are the same power lines that supply power to Baghdad?

ROBERTSON: The power supplies in Baghdad are complex. They supplies from different, from both the north and the south of the city. I talked to power engineers. Indeed, the last electricity minister told me that while he was minister of electricity, he believes, and his associates believe, that the insurgents had a very good idea of how the power grid worked. And he believed that there were times when they intentionally attacked the power grid, knowing exactly what effect it would have and at what time.

But it's -- the electricity supplies here in Baquba, to my knowledge, are not dependent directly on those at Baghdad. But it's a complex grid system that operates in Iraq. Power can be certainly switched around the country from different power stations to feed in and out of the city. Where exactly Baquba gets its power, I could not tell you. There are hydroelectric dams to the northeast of here outside the town of Samarra, which is perhaps 30 or 40 miles away.

But at the moment, Baquba's electricity seems to be normal, and not dependent on the situation in Baghdad at this time, Wolf.

BLITZER: Just to recap, Nic, the electricity ministry in Baghdad saying insurgents attacked the main power line bringing power into the Iraqi capital, cutting off about 70 percent of the city to power. That's a city of about 7 or 8 million people. Water also out now, because the water pumps largely need that electricity to keep those pumps working.

If the insurgents did manage to undertake this kind of sophisticated operation, Nic, on the eve of this election, what does that say to you?

ROBERTSON: Well, that says that they've studied carefully. And this has been very interesting, Wolf, because we've heard election officials here telling us how they've studied carefully from the last elections to figure out how they can better defeat the insurgents. And it appears at this stage that the insurgents may well have studied what they did during the last elections. They realized that even though they had quite a large number of single-man suicide bombers wearing explosive vests trying to get into the polling stations, they did not have a major impact.

And most of the reporting at that time talked about the insurgents waiting for the big day of the elections to have a strong show of force that they had promised, and it was seen largely ineffectual.

The insurgents have certainly targeted electricity lines before, they've certainly targeted the water supplies of Baghdad. They know that that is in, as some people would describe it, a spectacular, something that's going to draw attention to their cause and their case.

It would seem, however, that it's not the sort of action that is going to strike fear into people's hearts, that is, fear that if they stepped out to go and vote, that they might get caught up in some kind of blast. But it will certainly be a very visible reminder for the people of Baghdad that the insurgents are around, that they are capable of interrupting power supplies, water supplies.

(INAUDIBLE) before has taken a number of days in the summer to get the water supply switched back on in Baghdad, about five days in one case, when a water supply station was targeted, a number of days for electricity supplies to be targeted.

New power stations have been built in Baghdad, have come online, a 200-megawatt power station came online in Baghdad, serving about 200,000 homes over the summer.

But certainly, from electricity ministry officials in the past, they've said they believe insurgents know very well how the grid works, how the system works, and exactly what the weak spots are to target.

While we've been talking, Wolf, I've learned here that in Diyala Province, in Baquba where I am, the electricity quite often is fed into the grid here from Iran. So the electricity supply from where we are would definitely be independent of Baghdad, Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Nic, stand by.

I want to bring back Aneesh Raman. He's in Baghdad for us. And to our viewers looking at Aneesh right now, it's totally dark behind you. Usually we see some lights behind you, Aneesh. We see nothing but darkness behind you right now. What else are you picking up on this blackout in Baghdad?

RAMAN: Yes, complete blackout in 70 percent of the city, from the Iraq electricity minister, Moshan Shalash (ph), who we've spoken to just a short time ago, confirming that an explosion happened at a main tower of the lines coming into Baghdad. The cities of Beiji and Mussaev also were affected. There are some reports the explosion took place in Beiji. We are looking to confirm exactly where this tower was.

And as Nic was just talking about, the insurgency incredibly adaptive at finding vulnerabilities. The streets of this capital have been virtually on a lockdown basis for the past day. The borders have been closed, the provincial borders have been closed.

And they seem to have found a weakness at the security apparatus that was in place, allowed them to penetrate, to blow up that tower, and on the eve of Iraq's constitutional referendum, as Nic pointed out, send a message that they are still operating here in this country.

The fear, of course, is that tomorrow they will make their presence known again by suicide bombings. That is what the security apparatus is trying to prevent, Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh Raman, we are going to check back with you.

Aneesh is in Baghdad for us, following this breaking story.

Our senior Pentagon correspondent, Jamie McIntyre, is joining us now from the Pentagon.

What are you picking up there, Jamie?

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. MILITARY AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, as you can imagine, Pentagon officials are watching with some interest, what's going on in Iraq, getting some of the initial reports back here.

They don't seem to see this, initially, as something that's going to derail the elections, obviously. As you have already pointed out, there are paper ballots involved. And it will be conducted during daylight hours, anyway.

Nonetheless, they are saying that efforts are under way to restore the electricity. The reports they are getting here is that that's on a timeline of within about 12 hours or so. I think that's consistent with what Aneesh is reporting from Baghdad there, what he's hearing from the Iraqi officials there.

And I -- I think the main thing they -- they are saying here is that, you know, this kind of infrastructure is extremely vulnerable. It's very difficult to defend against every possible act of sabotage that can be conducted. And the message that they continue to drive home here, from the Bush administration, is that these attacks are essentially attacks on the Iraqi people, trying to deny them the opportunity to take part in this democratic process.

So, that's sort of how they portray it. They don't see it as a -- a show-stopper. It's something that, I think, they said they are going to deal with. And, again, they are hopeful that the timeline for restoring the power, in large measure, will be somewhere in about the 12-hour time frame. So, I think they are -- they're bracing for, obviously, attacks and a rise in violence, in concert with the vote on the ref -- the referendum on the constitution.

You never know exactly what's going to happen. Something like this certainly is not unexpected -- and, again, infrastructure, electricity, that sort of thing, very difficult to defend every possible point of attack. And so, assuming this is, again, an insurgent attack, it appears that they have been able to score some success. But, again, the Pentagon says, not going to derail the election process tomorrow.

BLITZER: All right, Jamie McIntyre reporting for us.

And I want to note that our viewers around the world on CNN International are joining us here in THE SITUATION ROOM for our continuing coverage of this story, breaking news out of Iraq, only hours away from the start of the elections, the vote on the draft constitution, the referendum.

There has been an insurgent attack -- according to the Iraqi Electricity Ministry, an insurgent attack on the power lines coming into the Iraqi capital -- about 70 percent of Baghdad and the surrounding area now without power.

Ali Velshi is here in THE SITUATION ROOM. Tom Foreman is here -- Aneesh Raman.

Let's go back to Aneesh first in Baghdad.

Aneesh, this is a political statement that these terrorists are now -- are now making right now, more than anything else, I would assume, because the people in Baghdad and the surrounding areas, God knows, they are -- they are used to these kinds of disloc -- these power dislocations.

RAMAN: It is. And it undermines the credibility. It undermines the legitimacy of the current government.

Keep in mind, also, when we talk of sectarian strife in Iraq, the current government is a Shia-Kurd coalition. And, while we have Iraq in Iraq that is part of the insurgency, fighting a jihadist battle, there are also Saddam loyalists, Sunni loyalists, who are actively against this government, because of the very fact that it is built on a Shia-Kurd coalition.

And the more they can undermine credibility of this government, the more they think they can bring Sunnis back into power. And, keep in mind, as well, that this vote is not just about a constitution. It is about this political process. If the constitution fails tomorrow, this national assembly is dissolved. A new one is elected, one we can presume Sunnis would have more representation in. And they would then go through the entire transitional process again.

If the constitution is ratified, in mid-December, we have permanent elections. And it is all -- it is, by all likelihood, set to have a similar situation, in terms of those who are running the government -- so, again, a sign of the insurgency striking the government, its credibility, and playing not to the fear, but to the brewing anger among Iraqi citizens, who want their lives back in order -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh, stand by.

I want to go back to Nic Robertson. He's joining us from Baquba, just outside of Baghdad, about 40 miles northwest of Baghdad.

You are looking at all of this. You are looking at the eve of the election, only hours away from the start of this election. And -- and you recognize the -- the enormous symbolic impact this kind of terror attack, destroying the power grids, if you will, going into Baghdad, could have on the Iraqi psyche, the Iraqi mentality right now, presumably, Nic, precisely what the insurgents would like to do.

ROBERTSON: It's a big message.

It's -- it's an easy message for them to get out. It's already, obviously, had a lot of media coverage. They know how to -- to try and grab the headlines. And that would appear to be part of their intent here, is to show that they're still a force, that they're still a very big force to be -- to be reckoned with, and that, even if they are not striking people down in the streets, they are still capable of affecting the -- affecting the lives of thousands, if not more than one million, several million people, indeed, in Baghdad in -- in what amounts to be, or what appears to be, at this stage, according to the Electricity Ministry, just one attack.

In the summer, Wolf, I met with two insurgents and discussed with them some of the tactics within the insurgency. They described to me that, even within the insurgents, there were debates about whether or not this type of attack should be carried out, the type of attack that will potentially alienate any part of the population, because any kind of attack -- any terror group will know this, that they if they strike the civilian population -- and they -- certainly, the -- the terror groups here in Iraq have shown no hesitation -- or some of them, at least, show no hesitation -- in killing Iraqis by the tens, even hundreds, on the streets.

But there is a debate among some of the insurgent groups, I was told, whether or not this type of attack that will -- that will cut the power off to more than a million people, cut the water off to more than a million people in the city of Baghdad, whether that helps their cause or whether it hurts their cause. When I talked to the particular insurgents I talked to in the summer, it was not long after an attack on the water system in Baghdad. They said they were aware or knew of the person or people, or some of the people, behind that particular attack. They said that wasn't something that they would want to get involved in. They described themselves, those particular insurgents, as Iraqi nationalists. They said, the people they believe who would be responsible for -- for the type of attacks, destroying the -- destroying the -- part of the water system supply in Baghdad, they described them as Baathists, people that were still loyal to the Baath Party, still loyal to -- to Saddam Hussein.

So, there is -- there are certainly debates within some elements of the insurgency whether or not this type of attack does benefit them in the long run, because it hurts so many people across the city. However, it -- it does seem very, very clear that this is designed to send a very, very big message, a spectacular, if you will -- that they are still out there and that people should remember they are very much a force to be reckoned with, even if they can't drive their suicide bombs around the city because of the -- because of the ban on vehicle movement.

And even if they were -- can send suicide bombers wearing -- wearing explosive vests at the polling stations, even if that doesn't stop the polling, this gets a very, very big message out for them, Wolf. And that -- that very much appears to be what they are trying to do here.

BLITZER: All right, Nic, stand by for a second.

Nic Robertson is in Baquba for us, outside of Baghdad. Aneesh Raman in Baghdad. Jamie McIntyre is over at the Pentagon. Ali Velshi is here, with Tom Foreman, in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Earlier today, I spoke with the U.S. ambassador to Iraq, Zalmay Khalilzad. And he expressed his view, that the insurgents were plotting to do something on the eve of this election.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ZALMAY KHALILZAD, UNITED STATES AMBASSADOR TO IRAQ: Well, we anticipate the possibility of something significant and major to happen. The insurgents and the terrorists would like to do that.

Our forces and the Iraqis are on guard, trying to disrupt and prevent and deter those sorts of activities.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: U.S. Ambassador to Iraq Zalmay Khalilzad, speaking with me just a little while ago, before the lights went dark in Baghdad and the surrounding area.

Scott Ritter is a former United States Marine, a former U.N. weapons inspector in Iraq, someone who has been very critical of the war. He has got a new book that is out entitled "Iraq Confidential."

He's joining us now live. Scott, what do you make of this development?

SCOTT RITTER, FORMER CHIEF U.N. WEAPONS INSPECTOR IN IRAQ: Well, it shows that the insurgency knows Iraq better than the United States military, and that they can strike at a time and place of their choosing and then achieve the desired results.

It means that the struggle that we face in Iraq is going to be a lot longer and a lot harder than a lot of people are saying. It's not going to be resolved by one vote cast tomorrow regarding a constitution of -- of dubious origin.

BLITZER: Well, if -- if the constitution, though, is passed tomorrow, despite this blackout in Baghdad, despite all the threats from the insurgents, that would be a step forward. I assume you would agree with that.

RITTER: No, I wouldn't.

First of all, this constitution is not derived from the will of the Iraqi people. It's pretty much been dictated to the Iraqis by the United States. At -- at a minimum, the United States played a heavy influence. And look at the last vote on the draft constitution, or the last vote that took place on January 30. People said that that would be a step forward.

And Iraq, if anything, has gotten worse.

BLITZER: When you say, Iraq is getting worse, they did elect a government. And -- and some of the Sunnis now, in addition to the Shiites and the Kurds, they seem to be coming aboard.

RITTER: Well, let's see what the future holds.

I'm very pessimistic. I question whether or not the heart of the insurgency has deviated from its course one iota. You might be able to pick people off at the fringe. But the people who are causing most of the problem in Iraq today are staunchly against, not only the American-led occupation, but also the -- the government of Talabani and Jaafari.

And they are -- they're not just going to, you know, pick up and go home after this -- after this vote tomorrow.

BLITZER: So, tell us what your strategy is, Scott Ritter. You were one of those voices before the war -- before the war in 2003 -- saying there were no weapons of mass destruction to speak of in Iraq. What would you have the U.S. do at this stage, right now, simply cut and run, as they say?

RITTER: No. That would be irresponsible in the extreme.

We need to recognize, as many American generals and British generals have, that it's the presence of American troops that -- it -- it plays a large part in fueling the insurgency. So, if you view a nation as a -- Iraq as a nation on fire, and the fuel is American troops, separate the fuel from the flame. Get the troops out.

But this doesn't mean cut and run. We have three issues in Iraq -- one, the -- the fact that we have pro-Iranian Shia governing Iraq today, Jaafari. Talabani is not a Shia, but he's a pro-Iranian Kurd. This -- this is not good for Iraq. This is not good for the Middle East.

Two, the secular Sunni that we viewed as a, you know, bulwark against the spread of Islamic fundamentalism back in the '80s and '90s, have been disenfranchised. They have turned western Iraq into a festering cesspool of anti-American sentiment, a new Afghanistan, a new breeding ground for al Qaeda. This needs to be dealt with -- and, three, a Kurdistan that thinks it's going to be independent. This is very bad for Turkey, a nation that just got invited to enter in discussions with the European Union.

Turkey will not allow this. And they will initiate action that will alienate it from Europe and maybe get Europe to turn its back on, you know, one of these very large Muslim nations that we need to be our ally. All three of these need to be dealt with, not by unilateral military action, but by a multilateral diplomatic approach. And the United States can take a lead. This isn't cutting and running. It's doing the responsible thing.

BLITZER: All right, Scott Ritter, stand by for a second.

Aneesh Raman is our man in Baghdad. He's getting some additional information on this blackout, an insurgent attack on the power lines coming into the Iraqi capital.

What are you picking up, Aneesh?

RAMAN: Well, Wolf, we have been talking about where they could get power from. And that would, inherently, mean how quickly they could get power back -- the Electricity Ministry saying the power is on its way back to parts of the 70 percent of the capital that is without power now, that is in a blackout.

It's unclear exactly where they are getting it from. But the grid allows them to bring it from other areas of the country. They don't have to fix that exact line that is down from the suspected insurgent attack on the tower there.

But, again, as we were talking about and Nic was mentioning, these types of attacks do drive the insurgency away from any sort of support that they could have among Iraq's population. And that has been keen for this government to capitalize on when it comes to intelligence, when it comes to areas of Iraq where the insurgency is being supported by the local population, whether that be safe haven houses, whether that be weapons coming through.

These types of attacks really hurt the insurgency on the ground level in Iraq. They do, though, completely undermine the legitimacy and the effectiveness of this government. And, so, how this type of attack will play in the referendum, the timing of which we cannot ignore, coming just tomorrow, that is what we will wait to see, whether it will embolden Iraqis to vote for this political process to continue, just because they want these insurgent attacks to end, or whether they will lose faith in a government and vote to reject the constitution, and have another government come into power in mid- December -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh, thanks very much. We are going to back to you in a moment.

Let me just wrap it up with Scott Ritter.

What do you make of that point, that, by going after the power lines, which affect all Iraqis, Shiites, Kurds, Sunnis, everyone else, that the insurgency is going to eventually undermine its own credibility with the Iraqi people?

RITTER: Look, the attack just took place. To -- to speak about how this is going to have an impact vis-a-vis the insurgency or the government is -- is far too early.

The point has been made, however, by the insurgents that they can strike at a time and choosing of -- of their own volition. And -- and that's the important point. This is a viable insurgency. And it's not just going to go away tomorrow, regardless of which way the vote goes.

BLITZER: All right, if you could stand by a moment, Scott, I want to bring in retired U.S. General James Marks, our CNN military analyst.

He's joining us on the phone.

General Marks, thanks very much for joining us.

What do you make of this attack, apparently, an insurgent attack on the power lines coming into Baghdad, on the eve of this election?

RETIRED BRIGADIER GENERAL JAMES MARKS, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Wolf, first of all, I think it's important that we keep in perspective the following.

Power outages in Baghdad are the norm. And attacks by insurgents in various forms, whether they are suicide bombers or whether they are attempts at coordinated efforts, have happened before. So, we need to kind of keep in mind that the perspective that we all have on this, is, it is certainly is a combination of factors now, suicide bombers, or at least insurgent attacks, that have achieved some degree of a power outage.

But this is not -- frankly, this is not new. Now, on the eve of a referendum, a tremendous political event that's about to take place, certainly, it puts it in a little bit of a different perspective. The fact that the insurgents can continue to attack, the fact that the insurgents have some form of a viable backing, they do have a network, they have an enterprise of support, the coalition forces are very much aware of this, and they are going to make an effort to go after it. In other words, the insurgency has demonstrated its hand and a capability. But, also, there is going to be intelligence that will be derived from this, Wolf. There's going to be a lot of forensics that will allow an effort to go after those that have perpetrated this.

BLITZER: But it is, General, you -- I think you will acknowledge, an -- an unusual blackout. There has been power shortages in Iraq, as all of us know, going back over the years, since -- since the war started, in March and April of 2003. But this seems to be much more spectacular attack. And the timing, as you point out, on the eve of this referendum, is potentially very significant.

MARKS: Well, it is.

And -- and you look at it from several different levels. Let's start, certainly, at the strategic and policy level. And -- and you have spoken about it. It is something that needs to be addressed. And there are concerns that certainly will be derived -- that we will all derive from this, in terms of security posture, training of forces, where are the coalition forces, where are the Iraqi forces in the various forms that are prepared to interdict, participate -- good, solid intelligence -- interdict and do something about these attacks before they occur.

But, when you bring it back down to the tactical level, what is happening in Baghdad right now on the street? And, clearly, there are what -- what's called priority of tasks. There has to be security around, an increased security, that's going to take place around all the voting stations. And that's taking place right now.

BLITZER: All right, Spider, General Marks, hold on a second.

Aneesh Raman is still in Baghdad.

Aneesh, I see some lights behind you now. If you turn around, you will see them as well. What -- what are those lights?

RAMAN: Yes, that's the mosque that our viewers will often see over my shoulder.

We think it's a generator that has kicked in. That light had come on briefly a short time ago, and then it went away. But the entire area around it -- and if you can see, over my other shoulder, a building that is usually lit there remains in dark. And that is really what Iraqis are dealing with now. Those that have generators have the luxury of power at this moment -- but, again, the Electricity Ministry saying that they are slowly bringing power back into the 70 percent of Baghdad, into areas of Beiji and Mussaev (ph), that are also in a blackout right now.

Whether that's a result of the light coming on behind me is unclear. We think it's a generator. But, hopefully, the electricity minister says, we will see similar signs throughout the city some time tomorrow -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh Raman in Baghdad, you will stick around with us.

Nic Robertson is joining us as well from Baquba. We have got Tom Foreman here in THE SITUATION ROOM. And Ali Velshi is in THE SITUATION ROOM. Scott Ritter, the former U.S. weapons inspector, is joining us.

Jeff Greenfield is joining us as well.

Jeff, you are watching all of this develop. Give us the unique Jeff Greenfield perspective on what we are seeing.

JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN SR. ANALYST: Well, Wolf, I have got to tell you, it reminds me of an old blues song.

If you're sitting in the White House right now, I -- I think it goes, if it weren't for bad news, there would be no news at all. I mean, every single thing that this White House is trying to do on a variety of fronts seems to be coming a cropper. Yesterday, you had the discussion with the president and American officers there. The story was about the -- the scripted nature of it.

They're leading up to a referendum and there's a sign, however serious, that the insurgents can strike. You have got the president and the White House now in desperate need of its base to hold. And what happens? A Supreme Court nomination that has got the base not just disappointed, but, in many cases, furious.

And I think you put all of these things together, and I -- I think they do connect. That is, if the president wants support for his Iraq policy, if he wants people to stay the course, the first thing he needs is that the people who voted for him and put him back in the White House have to stay with him. And the Miers nomination, I think, hurts that.

The country, right-track/wrong-track numbers are almost at a historic low. The public is in a very pessimistic mood. News like this, even if it's superficial, just is part of the problem that adds to the notion that things aren't going well.

And when you -- when you portray it, when you look at it on the broad scale, you just realize that this is clearly -- and I'm -- I'm stating the obvious here -- the -- the toughest period that this administration has gone through since they got into office.

BLITZER: And -- and so much of the popularity, or lack thereof, of this administration, Jeff, involves Iraq, what has been accomplished, what has not been accomplished. They were clearly hoping that the referendum tomorrow and the start of the Saddam Hussein trial in the days that followed would help turn things around a bit and show some light at the end of the tunnel.

GREENFIELD: Well, in fact, even last year, during the reelection, Iraq was not a positive for the president. What was, was the general notion that he was an effective leader on this war on terror. And, here again, looks at the other elements. It may not seem connected. But reaction to Katrina really hurt the president's standing, in terms of what a strong and effective leader he is. And we -- I haven't even brought into this mix the small detail of one and perhaps two very high-ranking administration aides who are in the crosshairs of a grand jury.

You know, I'm -- I'm just thinking, this -- this has got to be a weekend where the folks, when they finally go home from the White House -- they work long hours, as you well know, Wolf. This is not going to be a weekend of -- of great relaxation, it seems to me, between the news from Iraq and what they're waiting for next week from the grand jury. And did I mention $3-a-gallon gas?

BLITZER: You didn't. But you just did.

The president is going to try to relax, I assume, a little bit at Camp David for the weekend.

Scott Ritter is still with us, the former U.N. weapons inspector. He has got a new book out entitled "Iraq Confidential."

The trial of Saddam Hussein -- you spent years in Iraq searching for weapons throughout the 1990s. That trial is supposed to begin within the next few days. I assume you are happy he is now going to be on the witness stand and he's going to facing these charges against him.

RITTER: I -- I would love for Saddam Hussein to be on trial before a court that had some legitimacy. My concern is that the -- the nature of the charges that are being tried, a very narrow charge based upon, you know, a village that attempted to assassination him, and, in retribution, linked to Dawa -- Jaafari is the head of Dawa, the prime minister -- that this seems more like payback than a legitimate trial of a brutal dictator who committed....

BLITZER: But...

RITTER: ... who committed crimes against his people.

BLITZER: Let me just interrupt, Scott.

You well know that, what happened was, Saddam Hussein went into that village. And there was an assassination attempt that was foiled. Saddam Hussein then ordered his troops to go into that village and simply start slaughtering people randomly, if you will. The people had nothing to do with that assassination attempt against him. That -- that was a crime against humanity.

RITTER: Look, these are the allegations. And, if they can be sustained before a court of law, Saddam should -- should pay the price. I'm not here to defend Saddam.

I'm here to defend the rule of law. And, if there's anybody out there that can tell me that the Iraqi court system today is reflective of the norms and standards that we Americans and the international community adhere to, I'd like to debate that, because that's my biggest concern, is that, by trying Saddam, who should be tried for these crimes, if you don't do it right, you end up making this man a martyr, and he does not deserve that status.

BLITZER: All right.

Let me bring in the Iraqi ambassador to the United Nations. He's joining us now on the phone.

Mr. Ambassador, I don't know if you have been following what's happening in -- in Baghdad right now, with this blackout. But what is the latest information that you are getting?

FEISAL AL-ISTRABADI, IRAQI AMBASSADOR TO UNITED NATIONS: Well, unfortunately, because of the lateness of the hour there, the latest information I'm getting is probably not much different than what you have.

There appears to have been an attempt at -- or, in fact, perhaps a successful attempt at sabotage. And it's very clear -- in respect to the electrical grid, and it's very clear that the actual target is tomorrow's -- is tomorrow's referendum. I expect that this attempt to disrupt the referendum will fail, as attempts in January to disrupt the elections failed.

BLITZER: How big -- how big of a political statement, though, is this on the part of the insurgents, to be able to knock out the power to the Iraqi capital?

AL-ISTRABADI: Well, it's actually not that difficult to do, technically, as I understand it, particularly because of the way the grid system in Baghdad is set up.

It's fairly highly centralized, as I understand it. So, it's not that difficult to do, actually. And, in the grand scheme of things, unfortunately, we -- this has been a constant target, the electrical grid has. And so, I'm not actually sure that it makes a tremendous difference in -- in the ordinary lives of -- of -- of Baghdadis, I regret to say.

BLITZER: We just heard Scott Ritter, the former U.N. weapons inspector in Iraq, say that this upcoming trial of Saddam Hussein, in his words, was really not legitimate, because this is not a legitimate court and a legitimate government. I want to give you a chance, Mr. Ambassador, to respond to that.

AL-ISTRABADI: Well, first of all, I -- I -- I think that he backed off immediately, because the way he began was to say that it's not legitimate because somehow this was a political trial.

When you pointed out that the allegations, if they are true, were crimes against humanity, he clearly backed away and started to make a different argument. Let me tell you that the crime of which he is accused, if he is guilty of it, reminds me of -- of Heinrich Himmler's number two, Reinhard Heydrich, who, under similar circumstances, committed a very similar crime in Yugoslavia, eliminating a village because there had been an attempt on his life.

These are horrific crimes. And the people of Iraq have paid with their blood for 35 years. We have an elected government. I don't know what -- what Mr. Ritter's standard is for legitimacy. We have an elected government for the first time in 50 years in Iraq's history. We have a court which has been established by the National Assembly of Iraq, an elected assembly.

We intend to try Saddam Hussein. He has the full protections of a modern, civilized court system, protections he denied his victims.

BLITZER: Feisal Al-Istrabadi, the Iraqi ambassador to the United Nations, joining us on the phone -- Mr. Ambassador, thanks very much.

Let's go back to Baghdad.

Aneesh Raman is our man on the scene.

Update our viewers, Aneesh, what you are picking up.

RAMAN: What we are hearing now, in terms of new information, that some power is returning to residents of Baghdad.

We mentioned, some 70 percent had their power knocked out by this suspected insurgent attack. We don't have word yet on Beiji or Mussaev, the other cities that have seen blackouts within their communities.

It is important to note, Wolf, though, that we are not reporting right now three or four or five suicide bombings in the capital, that we are reporting an attack on the electricity. We are reporting a blackout, clearly, an insurgent attack. But those on the ground will, at some levels, say that this is -- this is better than if we were seeing the violence that we are used to in this city, a sign, perhaps, that security is tightened enough, as we head toward that vote -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Aneesh, thanks very much.

Jacki Schechner is checking the situation online in Baghdad.

Jacki, what are you picking up?

JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN BLOG REPORTER: Well, Wolf, we just sound -- found some photographs online that we wanted to show you from the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers in Iraq and Afghanistan.

These are some electrical substations. This gives you an idea of the infrastructure that we are talking about here. Here's one in Najaf and then another one in Najaf and then another one in Duluiyah. We have got a power station here in Nasiriyah. Now, I wanted to show you the feeder lines we were talking about earlier. These are the ones that bring electricity to the homes and the businesses in Baghdad.

And you can see that these are not very far beneath the surface of the earth. So, if it was something like this that was attacked, it probably wouldn't be that tough to get to it.

To give you an idea, also, from the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, there's 529 electricity projects that are planned for the Iraq reconstruction project, and, so far, according to them, 56 completed. So, that would speak to the electricity shortage that Aneesh was talking about earlier -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, thanks very much, Jacki.

Jane Arraf has been our longtime Baghdad bureau chief. She's on leave now. She's joining us from New York.

Jane, in the old days -- and you spent years in Iraq -- I take it that the -- the elite of the Iraq in those days, the Iraqi Sunnis, were in charge of all of the infrastructure. So, they -- if -- if there are Iraqi Sunnis who are part of the insurgency, they clearly would know how to disrupt power to Baghdad.

JANE ARRAF, CNN BAGHDAD BUREAU CHIEF: You know, that's the thing about Iraq, is, it's really quite complicated.

And it wasn't just Sunnis in charge of the infrastructure. It was Shia engineers. It was everything all together. But I would say, when the sun comes up tomorrow morning, those Iraqis who are going to go out to vote will go out and vote. It's hard to tell you how incredibly resilient they are.

And I saw amazing scenes in the voting in January, where bombs going off, mortars, did not deter these people. And it's likely to be the same tomorrow -- Wolf.

BLITZER: So, you're -- you're -- you are saying, they are going to vote no matter what. Is that what you are saying, Jane?

ARRAF: I don't think the lights going off late at night, even though it's a very effective signal by the insurgency that they can strike where they want to and they do have the coordination, is going to deter those people.

Now, car bombs, as Aneesh mentioned, (AUDIO GAP) bombs, might deter some, probably would deter some. But this, by itself, would not be enough. Iraqis have been through an awful lot.

And, for those who see this as an important milestone, they are going to go out there and vote, no matter what.

BLITZER: All right, thanks very much, Jane Arraf, our -- our longtime Baghdad bureau chief. She's on leave now. She's joining us from New York.

Ali Velshi here in THE SITUATION ROOM. Tom Foreman is in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Ali, we heard the ambassador, the United States ambassador to Iraq, say to us, just a little while ago, before the lights went out in Baghdad, we anticipate the possibility of something significant and major to happen.

Clearly, he didn't know what was going to happen, but there's no doubt they were trying to disrupt this election.

VELSHI: Yes.

And, remember, when you spoke to the ambassador to the United Nations, he was saying, they're not -- it's probably not that hard to get at the system, partially because the Iraqis need every dollar they have got going toward their electricity system to build it out, to have enough capacity. They don't have the money to -- to sit and guard it. Major power stations do tend to have some military guards.

But, at the moment, it was probably an -- an -- an attack of opportunity. And it looks like at least it will have had some effect.

Tom, button this up for us.

FOREMAN: Well, if it comes down to this, you can look at it either way.

Some people can say, look, they struck on the eve of the election. It matters. On the other hand, you can listen to what Jane said, and say, if this is it, if they have to work by candlelight for a few hours, and they get up in the morning and vote anyway, how much does that show the strength of the people to stand up against the insurgency, and say, we will decide on our own?

BLITZER: We are going to stay with this story here on CNN and CNN International throughout the night.

We are in THE SITUATION ROOM here weekdays, Monday through Friday, 3:00 to 6:00 p.m. Eastern.

I want to thank all of our staff today, especially our producer Megan Clifford, who is leaving us, heading back to California.

Thanks, Megan, for doing an excellent job.

Thanks to our viewers on CNN International, as well, for staying with us.

"LOU DOBBS TONIGHT" starts right now. Lou is standing by in New York.

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