Return to Transcripts main page
The Situation Room
Bush's Poll Numbers Drop; New Documents Reveal More About Alito's Views on Abortion
Aired November 14, 2005 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: You're in THE SITUATION ROOM where new pictures and information from around the world are arriving all the time.
Happening now, President Bush exits Washington even as his poll numbers go from bad to worse. It's 4:00 p.m. here in the nation's capital and our new survey is packed with insights about Mr. Bush's problems and some surprises. We'll share those numbers with you this hour.
Also, running away from the White House. Some politicians and voters now are saying what many people have been thinking -- that the president has become a drag on Republican candidates.
And Samuel Alito's opinions on abortion. New documents from the Supreme Court nominee's paper trail. Will they inflame interest groups working for him or against him?
I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Also this hour, in Indiana, a Pennsylvania man suspected of killing his 14-year-old girlfriend's parents and then abducting her is now in custody. Authorities set to hold a news conference shortly. We'll carry that live once it happens.
Our new poll shows the public is more disapproving than ever about the way President Bush is doing his job and more skeptical than ever about whether they should trust him. Details on those numbers coming up.
Against that backdrop, though, Mr. Bush is preparing to slam Iraq war critics again during a stopover on his way to Asia. Democrats on Capitol Hill aren't letting up on Iraq or on the president.
Let's begin our coverage with our correspondent Ed Henry. Ed, there was an interesting new twist from the Democrats earlier today on Capitol Hill. Tell our viewers what's going on.
ED HENRY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right. As Democrats ramped up rhetoric on the Iraq war, questioning whether the administration twisted intelligence in the wake of the Scooter Libby indictment, the Republican refrain has been the Democrats throw stones. Where is their plan on Iraq?
Well, today Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid finally unveiled a bit of a Democratic plan in the form of an amendment to the defense bill on the floor right now that sets several benchmarks for the U.S. to reach -- the result of some very quiet meetings in recent week among some top Democrats like Joe Biden and Chris Dodd.
Most significant part is that for the first time, Democratic leaders now advocating a flexible timeline to start withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq. They don't use the word withdrawal. They know they'll be accused of cutting and running. But the amendment calls for the president to come to the Congress with a plan to -- quote -- "with estimated dates for the phased redeployment of the United States armed forces from Iraq as each condition is met start withdrawing troops." What's most interesting, here's the Senate leader, Harry Reid.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. HARRY REID (D-NV) MINORITY LEADER: 2006 should be a significant year of transition to full Iraqi sovereignty with Iraqis taking more and more responsibility for their own security. It's time to take the training wheels off the Iraqi government. Iraqis must begin to run their own country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Now, the Republican majority leader, Bill Frist has crafted an amendment of his own that cribs about 90 percent of this Democratic plan. That's going to put some more pressure on the Bush administration to come up with answers on Capitol Hill about Iraq. More reports, more quick reports to Congress about progress. Also provisions even in the Republican amendment saying that 2006 must be a year of transition in Iraq where the Iraqi security forces finally take the lead. But one big exception, the Frist amendment cuts out that flexible timetable for bringing home the troops. Republicans do not want to go there, Wolf.
BLITZER: All right. Thanks very much. Ed Henry reporting here in Washington.
This note, we'll get more on the Democrats' take on Iraq and the president's policy, the lead-up to the war and exit strategy. Senator Chris Dodd, key member of the Foreign Relations Committee will be joining me. That's coming up here in THE SITUATION ROOM in the next hour.
Let's move on now to some of those hard new numbers and the increasingly hard time the president is having with the American public when it comes to issue of an issue and even to his own integrity.
Our senior political analyst Bill Schneider is joining us now with new poll numbers just coming in to CNN. What are we getting, Bill?
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well Wolf, the polls all seem to be going in the same direction for President Bush these days: down.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) SCHNEIDER (voice-over): President Bush's job approval has reached a new low in the CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll. Thirty-seven percent approve of the way the president is handling his job. That matches Bill Clinton's all-time low in 1993. Character was a quality that helped get Bush elected after the Clinton scandals.
GEORGE W. BUSH, THEN-GOP PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So when I put my hand on the Bible, I will swear to not only uphold the laws of our land, I will swear to uphold the honor and dignity of the office to which I have been elected.
SCHNEIDER: Now for the first time ever, a majority of Americans say they no longer consider President Bush honest and trustworthy. Only 36 percent said they trust what President Bush says more than what Clinton said while he was president. 48 percent say they trust Bush less than Clinton. And 15 percent say they're no different.
Since 9/11, this president has showcased his resolve, most recently in his Veterans Day speech.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We will never back down. We will never again give in. We will never accept anything less than complete victory.
SCHNEIDER: But Americans are now split over whether Bush is a strong or a weak president.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: Any good news for President Bush? Well, he's holding on to his Republican base. Eighty percent of Republicans are still behind him. But he's tanking among everyone else. Two-thirds of independents now say they oppose President Bush. Nearly half voted for him last year.
Wolf.
BLITZER: Bill Schneider reporting for us. Thank you, Bill, very much. We'll have much more on these numbers coming up.
And President Bush is expected to take his Iraq critics -- take on his Iraq critics again when he lands in Alaska within the next couple hours. He'll be speaking at Elmendorf Air Force Base, a stopover on his way to Asia. He'll be visiting Japan, South Korea, China and Mongolia. A just-released excerpt of his remarks in Alaska shows Mr. Bush will accuse some Democrats of sending mixed signals to our troops and to the enemy.
And in our 5:00 hour -- that's in the next hour -- I'll be speaking live with the White House communications director Nicole Wallace about the president's trip, his Iraq critics and reaction. We'll get her reaction to this new poll that just came out here on CNN.
Let's go up to New York, Jack Cafferty standing by for another week, another question. How are you doing, Jack? JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: I'm good, Wolf. Did you say the president is going to Mongolia?
BLITZER: Yes.
CAFFERTY: Why?
BLITZER: That's an important place. Very important country.
CAFFERTY: Has a sitting president ever gone to Mongolia?
BLITZER: I don't know the answer to that. But would you like to go to Mongolia?
CAFFERTY: No.
BLITZER: What do you mean, no?
CAFFERTY: Unless.
BLITZER: It's an interesting country.
CAFFERTY: I'm sure it's fascinating. But I mean, Mongolia? Air Force One is going to touch down in Mongolia?
BLITZER: If he's in China, if he's in Japan, or Korea, it's in the neighborhood.
CAFFERTY: It's not a neighborhood. It's like going to Saks, to Bloomingdale's and the little joint, the bodega on the corner to buy a lottery ticket. It might be in the neighborhood, but it ain't the same deal, if you know what I'm saying.
BLITZER: I understand what you're saying.
CAFFERTY: Anyway, on to other -- Mongolia?
He's back. Remember that California atheist who has been trying to ban the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools? Michael Newdow is this guy's name. Now he thinks that the phrase "In God We Trust" ought to be taken off American currency. Says he's going to file a federal lawsuit this week asking that the motto be removed from both our coins and paper money. Newdow said he wants to see the government stick to the U.S. Constitution, and that this has nothing to do with an atheistic agenda.
Opponents say such references to God honor our country's religious roots. So, here's the question. Should "In God We Trust" be taken off American currency? The other question is, what the hell's the president going to be doing in Mongolia? You can email us at am@ -- no, AM, I'm sorry. This is not the morning show. This is THE SITUATION ROOM. CaffertyFile@CNN.com. Or some other version of that which escapes me at the moment.
BLITZER: All right. Jack, you're going to get a lot of e-mail on Mongolia. Just wait. Jack Cafferty. We'll check back with you. Let's check in with CNN's Zain Verjee. She's joining us for another week from the CNN Center in Atlanta with a closer look at some other stories making news. Welcome back, Zain.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Wolf. I'm with you, not Jack, on Mongolia.
Now Wolf, in Jordan, a chilling confession on Jordanian TV from a female suicide bomber who says she was supposed to be the fourth attacker in last week's deadly bombings in Jordan. Thirty-five-year- old Sajida Mubarak al Rishawi says she was with her husband at the Radisson hotel, but after his bomb detonated hers failed. She said that he had gone to one end of the room and she went to another. She also said when people start fleeing the scene, she just ran and took off with them.
There's been a deadly attack on Western contractors in Iraq. A roadside bomb hit a convoy this morning at a checkpoint near Baghdad's Green Zone. Two contractors were killed, three were injured. All of them worked for the American security company Dyncorp.
The Supreme Court will hear a case on whether prison inmates can be denied access to materials including newspapers and magazines. A Pennsylvania inmate says the restrictions violate his First Amendment rights. But prison officials say it's effective punishment for some inmates. Supreme Court Justice nominee Samuel Alito ruled on the case as an appeals court judge recently. Now, he's likely to recuse himself if he's confirmed to the high court.
The justices have declined to hear a controversial case over the phrase "In God We Trust." That inscription on a government building in Lexington, North Carolina, prompted a lawsuit. But the Fourth Circuit Appeals Court ruled that given the patriotic and historic context, the inscription does not violate the separation of church and state. The high court rejected the case without comment.
Wolf.
BLITZER: That's Jack's question for the hour, as well. Zain, thank you very much. We'll check back with Zain Verjee shortly.
We're standing by, this note, for that news conference on that Pennsylvania teen apparently kidnapped. Now found. We'll bring it to you live as soon as that starts. That's coming up.
Also, more on Samuel Alito and the "Culture Wars", as we call it. New fuel today for the fight over the Supreme Court nominee and the battle over abortion.
Also ahead, the war of words over Iraq. The president and Democrats going after one another. Will Joe Lockhart and Torie Clarke do the same? They're coming up here in our "Strategy Session."
And a little bit later, bird flu on agenda for the president in Asia. What can he do there to protect Americans here? We'll check in with Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt. He'll be here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: We're standing by for that news conference expected to start very soon on that double homicide in Pennsylvania. The 14-year- old daughter apparently abducted. She was found together with the 18- year-old boyfriend accused of kidnapping her. We're going to go there as soon as that news conference starts, that's expected very shortly.
In the meantime, in today's look at our "Culture Wars," the Supreme Court nominee Samuel Alito's possible stance on abortion. Just released new and revealing documents that may shed light on where Alito stands on this very sensitive issue.
Our chief national correspondent John King is standing by with more.
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Now Wolf, these documents quite startling. The White House says they do not tell us how a Justice Alito would vote, should the issue of Roe v. Wade come before the Supreme Court again. But there is no question in reading these documents from the Reagan administration when then Samuel Alito was applying for a job at the Justice Department that he personally opposes abortion and shared the Reagan administration's efforts to repeal Roe v. Wade. Sam Alito at the time saying, again, 20 years ago. He said I'm particularly proud of my contributions in recent cases that have led the government to argue that - quote -- "the Constitution does not protect a right to an abortion".
So this will become part of the already very bitter debate over the Sam Alito nomination. Abortion is the key difference right now between the interest groups not only to come up at his confirmation, Wolf, but also the subject of a major fundraising battle, as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KING (voice over): Consider these the warm-up act. Conservative appeals outlining the stakes for Supreme Court vacancies. Direct mail legend Richard Viguerie now ready for the main event.
RICHARD VIGUERIE, AMERICAN TARGETING ADVERTISING: You think we can be up by the end of the week.
KING: In the increasingly bitter battle over Judge Samuel Alito, liberal and conservative groups share one common refrain. Send money.
VIGUERIE: What you're going to see in the next two-and-a-half months is as close to a political Armageddon as we're going to have.
KING: "Donate Now" jumps out on this NARAL-Pro-Choice America appeal, warning abortion rights hang in the balance. In this email, the liberal group People for the American Way more than a half-dozen times offer a link to a contribution site -- calling Judge Alito's nomination the moment the radical right has been dreaming about for years.
PROFESSOR MARK ROZELL, GEORGE MASON UNIVERSITY: They oftentimes have to use overheated sounding rhetoric because they have to convey to their core supporters there is a real threat to your interests out there.
KING: Email appeals dominated the initial wave of outreach and fund raising. JudgeAlito.com, for example, is a registered domain of Progress for America: A White House ally that was early into the TV ad war over Alito. Its email saying a gift of $25 or more will keep the ads coming. But, for all the speed of the Internet, direct mail is still a superior fundraising medium. And the Alito confirmation battle will be waged and financed through perhaps 10 million pieces of mail between now and the January confirmation hearings. Each letter carefully targeted based on the voting habits or contribution habits of the person on the receiving end.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Over the last five years, we've identified a lot of people who are interested in getting involved on the Supreme Court nominations.
ROZELL: Abortion, school prayer, gay rights in particular, those are the hot buttons that really hit the core constituencies and get people to say, I need this group to work on my behalf.
KING: It is a classic liberal-conservative clash -- a dramatic shift from a few weeks ago.
VIGUERIE: When the Harriet Miers nomination came along, that really was a blow to the solar plexus of the conservatives.
KING: Back then, conservatives like Concerned Women for America were opposing Miers and raising money to fight a Republican president. Now, with Miers gone, and Alito in her place, Concerned Women for America is thrilled and ready for his confirmation battle -- back on Mr. Bush's side and still looking to cash in on a confirmation, and fundraising battle, intensifying on the Internet and increasingly now in the mail.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: Now, in his private meetings with senators on Capitol Hill, many sources in both parties say that Judge Alito gives great deference to precedent. That has led some to believe he would not vote to overturn Roe v. Wade if it came before the court. But Wolf, I can tell you since the release of these documents, these from the Reagan Presidential Library earlier today, both sides of the abortion fight say look for Judge Alito to face much more pointed questions. Some say when he answers, he won't say how a case comes before the court -- he will face much more pointed questions because he is clearly on the record in these documents saying, both from a personal and policy standpoint, he does not believe the Constitution guarantees a right to an abortion.
BLITZER: All right, thanks very much, John King reporting for us. Those hearings set to begin in January before the Senate Judiciary Committee.
Still ahead, here in THE SITUATION ROOM, are GOP candidates afraid to be seen with their president? There's new reason to believe that some Republicans are running scared right now.
And can America's Health secretary sort through some of the confusion about the new Medicare prescription drug benefit? You can start signing up for that tomorrow. We'll have serious questions for Mike Leavitt, with just hours to go before older Americans can begin signing up.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: One note. We're standing by for that news conference on that Pennsylvania double murder the other day. The 14-year-old daughter who was being -- they were searching for the 14-year-old daughter. She has been found together with the 18-year-old apparent boyfriend accused of kidnapping her. He's been found, as well. We'll go to that news conference with local authorities once it starts. That's the live picture you're seeing from there.
In the meantime, almost a week after the Democrats swept governors races in Virginia and New Jersey, one defeated Republican is pointing a finger of blame at the president. And our new poll may give some GOP candidates even more reason to be wary of getting near Mr. Bush.
Our national correspondent Bruce Morton is joining us now live.
BRUCE MORTON, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, Republican Doug Forrester lost the New Jersey governor's race to Democrat Jon Corzine. He thinks he knows why.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MORTON (voice-over): Republican Doug Forrester lost the New Jersey' governor's race to Democrat Jon Corzine. He thinks he knows why. Forrester told the "Newark Star-Ledger" it was President Bush's fault. His campaign, he said, did all the right things we were supposed to do, but if Bush's numbers were where they were a year ago, or even six months ago, I think we would have won on Tuesday.
Really? The old saying is, victory has a thousand fathers, defeat is an orphan. But Forrester lost 53 to 44 percent, not a razor thin margin. In a battle of multimillionaires, Corzine outspent him 25 million on TV ads to 15. And Forrester used a negative ad that angered some voters.
Still, the president was probably a factor. And if you're Jerry Kilgore, the defeated Republican in Virginia, you have to wonder whether having the president campaign for you on election eve was such a swell idea.
Some Republicans are running away from Bush. The "New York Times" quotes Congressman J.D. Hayworth of Arizona as saying he doesn't want the president to campaign for him.
And in the latest CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll, 56 percent of our samples said they'd be less likely to vote for a candidate if Bush supported him. The lesson for candidates in 2006?
AMY WALTER, COOK POLITICAL REPORT: If we look to what vulnerable incumbents are going to do about President Bush, the first is, they're certainly not going to embrace the president. And the question is, how much do they distance themselves from him both legislatively and politically? We're already starting to see that.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MORTON (on camera): Some Democrats ran away from President Clinton in the 1994 midterms. His party lost control in Congress, but he recovered. 2006 is a year when this president too, may bounce back. Wolf?
BLITZER: All right Bruce, thank you very much. Bruce Morton reporting.
Here's another nugget from our new CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll. When asked if President Bush share their values, a majority of Americans, 55 percent now say no.
Let's talk about the president, last week's elections, campaigns, values, all that stuff with our senior analyst Jeff Greenfield.
The values, that was a very important issue the last time around when the president was reelected. You're seeing some trends in these most recent elections. What are you seeing?
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN SENIOR ANALYST: At least a straw -- the most interesting election from this point of view was that for governor of Virginia where Tim Kaine, the Democratic lieutenant governor, ran a campaign that explicitly talked about his faith. Indeed, he used his faith as a way to explain away a very tough issue. He's against the death penalty and did an ad where he said this is what my religious faith teaches me. But, I will enforce the death penalty. I'm personally opposed abortion, but that's my faith. But, I will enforce laws protecting abortion.
A lot of people who are looking at Virginia, looking at soon-to- be ex-Governor Mark Warner as a possible contender in a few years are saying, you know what? If Democrats, if we can put Democrats in red states particularly, that can talk about values that they don't get this from consultants, but they actually live this idea -- that we go a long way to disarming one of the key Republican tools for turning out the committed base voters among religious conservatives.
BLITZER: A lot of people are suggesting what happened last Tuesday was a reaffirmation of, sort of the moderate center, that the real liberal side of the Democratic Party is not going to win, certainly not in those so-called red states. But, get back to that center and you have a better shot. GREENFIELD: Well, you know, in New Jersey, which is a blue state, if we can use these terms, Jon Corzine -- one of the more liberal members of the Senate -- won handily. But I think the point -- what you're pointing to is that Democrats have worried after election losses, that too much of the country has become uncompetitive on issues that have nothing to do with their economics. Places like West Virginia that used to be solidly Democratic have now voted Republican in the last two elections on things ranging from guns, God and gays is the cliche. And so, you're seeing for instance, an interesting notion that Democrats seem to be looking in some states to find candidates who don't fit the national Democratic mold on these issues.
The most noteworthy of which is in Pennsylvania, where Senator Rick Santorum, the Republican incumbent is considered the most vulnerable Republican and Chuck Schumer, a liberal Democrat from New York and the chairman of the Senate Campaign Committee, cleared the field for Bob Casey, Jr., the state auditor, a pro-life Democrat. You'll remember, Wolf, the son of the former late Governor Bob Casey, a pro-life Democrat who was denied the right to speak on this issue at the 1992 convention.
The argument that's being made is, look, if we can take Rick Santorum out and in other states like that, get a Democratic majority in the Senate on issues you liberals care a lot about, like judges, and other issues, you'll still have the votes.
That's what we're seeing at least in Virginia and with their candidate in Pennsylvania, is a sign that the kind of litmus test, you've got to be with us on all these social issues or you're not a real Democrat, may be changing, Wolf.
BLITZER: A lot of people noticed last Friday that Rick Santorum was not with the president when he went to deliver that speech in Pennsylvania last Friday. He's up for a tough reelection. Arlen Specter, who isn't up for any reelection, he was in fact with the president at that event last Friday.
Jeff Greenfield, thank you very much.
We've been standing by for a news conference in Indiana on that teenager, the police said was kidnapped. Now found. Let's go there. It's starting right now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID BURSTEN, FIRST SERGEANT, INDIANA STATE POLICE: I will make introductions going from my left to my right. So we'll start on the far side here. We have the prosecutor of Hendricks County, Patricia Baldwin.
Sitting to my immediate left is the Assistant Superintendent of the Indiana State Police, Colonel Larry Furnace (ph). Myself, first sergeant -- I'm sorry, Colonel Larry Rollins, myself -- I've just been fired. Myself, First Sergeant David Bursten, Indiana State Police.
Sitting to my immediate right is Senior Trooper David Cox, and to the right of him is -- I'm sorry Master Trooper David Cox and Senior Trooper, I've reversed it again, David Furnace (ph), senior master.
We'll start out with a brief overview of the circumstances as to what occurred and then we'll be able to direct questions to specific people involved.
As you're all aware, earlier this afternoon, an arrest was made of a suspect wanted for a homicide in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. This occurred yesterday afternoon. Excuse me, yesterday morning.
And it started with the disturbance in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. Law enforcement officials arrived at that scene and they discovered Cathryn and Michael Borden deceased in the residence. They both had apparently died from gunshot wounds.
Their investigation developed a suspect as being a David Ludwig, 18-years-old from Lititz, Pennsylvania, and also information that abducted or possibly abducted was the daughter of the Bordens, Kara Borden, K-A-R-A, B-O-R-D-E-N, 14 years old, who is the daughter of the deceased. Lancaster officials issued a nationwide Amber Alert based upon the circumstances yesterday around 11:00 Eastern Time.
That information came across all points, and shortly after 8:00 this morning, sometime around 8:20 this morning, it was reported by a citizen that a vehicle matching that description was observed as a truck stop around the 78-mile marker on I-69, which would be in the Fort Wayne District area. Troopers responded to that scene.
Information was put out that the vehicle had left the area sometime after initially being sighted, around 8:30 in the morning, and based upon that information, a statewide broadcast was put out via the Indiana State Police to all law enforcement agencies. We also initiated contact with Lancaster, Pennsylvania, about their Amber Alert and began culling information from their investigation to do another Amber Alert here in Indiana.
Prior to that Amber Alert being put out, sometime before noon this afternoon, Troopers Cox and Furnace (ph) observed the suspect vehicle on I-70 westbound just west of Indianapolis. And they attempted to stop the vehicle, and there was a pursuit after that time. The pursuit ended in the area of state road 39 and U.S. 40. Mr. Ludwig was taken into custody. And Kara Borden was also recovered unharmed.
I can tell you that we will not be able to answer specific questions about the Lancaster, Pennsylvania investigation. That is being handled by their authorities. We really don't have that much information on it, after this news conference is over, I do have a copy of their news release that I'll be able to give to all of you here.
We will be able to talk about specifics as related to what could happen with Mr. Ludwig, the prosecutor will address that. Assistant Superintendent Rollins has a comment to make about the agencies working together. We'll also have an opportunity for you to speak with Trooper Cox and Trooper Furnace as far as the circumstances that they observed. I would ask that you please raise your hand. Let me identify you; who you are with. And then we will let you address your questions. So we'll go ahead and begin. Bonnie Drucker (ph).
QUESTION: Dave, why were they in Indiana? Do you know?
BURSTEN: We don't know. This is still a very fluid investigation. We just know that the suspect was wanted in connection for a murder. Warrants issued for his arrest. They were fleeing the area, and why someone goes to a particular state on what their ultimate destination was we don't know. I can tell you that he has cooperated with the investigation that we've had here thus far. But we are not able to discuss any of the specifics that we've had with him.
QUESTION: Has he made any statements? If so, what type of statements has he made to law enforcement officers?
BURSTEN: As I just mentioned, I can tell you that he has been cooperative in the investigation, but we will not be discussing specifics as to what he has said or did not say.
Tom?
QUESTION: Dave, was she abduct or did she go willingly?
BURSTEN: That is an unknown item. I can tell you, that because she is a 14-year-old, as you're aware, there has to be a responsible adult in Indiana for us to do any questioning with her. She has not been questioned. Ultimately, she will be going back to Pennsylvania, and whatever the processes they have they will follow there.
Eric (ph)?
QUESTION: Since there was a crash at the end of this, (INAUDIBLE) did Ludwig put up any resistance after the chase?
BURSTEN: If you'll hold that question when I have the troopers come in here, we'll refer to that. Please raise your hand and I'll recognize you.
Yes?
QUESTION: Can you talk about how the 14-year-old girl is doing and what her condition was like, how she was communicating, how she's doing?
BURSTEN: I can tell you that she suffered no physical harm, and that she is alive and well at this time.
Yes?
QUESTION: Dave, was there only one sighting or were there multiple sightings up in northwest Indiana.
BURSTEN: Those are things we're trying to flesh out now. There was a sighting in the Fort Wayne area. We also believe there was a sighting in very close proximity to when the troopers observed the vehicle. They made their observations independent of that other sighting reported to us. QUESTION: What time was the sighting this afternoon? (INAUDIBLE)
BURSTEN: I don't have that exact time. Yes?
QUESTION: Is the young lady in custody, under arrest? What's her status at this point? In other words, is she a suspect or is she at this point a victim?
BURSTEN: That is unknown. By virtue that she's 14 years old, we're not able to question her. We're not going to question her. We're going to maintain her in safe custody for the Pennsylvania authorities. That will be an issue for them to look at.
QUESTION: Did Ludwig admit to the kidnapping and to the murders?
BURSTEN: As I mentioned, I can tell you that he was cooperative in the investigation. We will not discuss any specifics of the investigation. Yes?
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) they be (ph) returning to Pennsylvania?
BURSTEN: That's not yet determined. In just a moment, the prosecutor can make a comment that may address some of that.
QUESTION: Does Ludwig have any relatives in Indiana? Does he have friends here?
BURSTEN: None that I'm aware of.
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) Miss Borden know who that was going to be in charge of her?
BURSTEN: That's not been determined.
QUESTION: Does she have any relatives here?
BURSTEN: That's unknown.
QUESTION: Can you give us the route of the pursuit and also some details of the pursuit? How many troopers were involved? Were there any other cars involved?
BURSTEN: I'll defer that to the troopers that were involved.
QUESTION: Did you find any evidence in the cars? Handgun, anything in the car?
BURSTEN: Anything to do with the vehicle and the recovery as part of the investigation is nothing that I would be able to discuss now.
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) piece together (INAUDIBLE)
BURSTEN: That is unknown at this time. Yes?
QUESTION: So there were three sightings? BURSTEN: There were at least two, may have been more. We have not fleshed that out completely. The bottom line is that we know that people had heard the broadcast that was initially put out by Pennsylvania that was followed up with information from the news media, and then members of the public did see it and they did take action to call it into law enforcement. That was -- that aided in the ultimate apprehension of Mr. Ludwig.
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) a truck driver, at a truck stop? (INAUDIBLE)
BURSTEN: I don't have the specifics. I don't know.
QUESTION: Were troopers waiting on I-65? (INAUDIBLE)
BURSTEN: I think we've had a couple of questions directed to that. What I'm going to stand up, and I'm going to stand up and I'm going to have Trooper Cox take the seat here, I'm going to let him give a brief overview of what the dispatch that they heard. How it came to be, what they did. And then he can answer some of your questions related to the sighting.
TROOPER DAVID COX, INDIANA STATE POLICE: I've never done this before. So --
BURSTEN: Go ahead and give them a brief overview of what happened.
COX: You just want me to start from the beginning?
QUESTION: Tell us a little bit about the chase. How far, how fast, what was his demeanor after the accident?
COX: After the sighting and Trooper Furnace and I tried to initiate a traffic stop, it started approximately the 60-mile marker, which is in the area of State Road 39 on I-70. The vehicle, the suspect vehicle exited on to State Road 39, which is the 59-mile marker and proceeded northbound on State Road 39 up unto the area of U.S. 40 about four, four and a half miles. The pursuit distance was probably five miles, at speeds of 90 plus, 95. The driver was operating northbound on State Road 39 at those speeds and traveling northbound in the southbound lane.
State Road 39 is a two-lane highway and when the highway was open, he was still proceeding in the wrong lane on the wrong side of the road. He was meeting vehicles head on and at the last second when he would run them into the ditch, he was swerving back over into his lane. Very reckless, very dangerous at that point.
He didn't make contact with any vehicles, however, until the end of the -- and until the end of the pursuit when he hit the tree. That was the only contact he made with any vehicles or anything during the pursuit.
QUESTION: What was his demeanor? Did you drag him out of the car? Did he try to run? What happens then? COX: I pulled him from the car. There was some slight resistance, but that was it.
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)
BLITZER: All right. We're going to break away from this news conference. We will monitor it, get more information and bring it to you as it comes in.
Once again, the capture of David Ludwig, 18 years old, and finding Kara Beth Borden, the 14-year-old girl who apparently was kidnapped by him. Details coming in the aftermath of that double murder; her parents Michael and Catherine Borden early Saturday. Our Mary Snow is on scene for us.
Mary, this has been quite a day out there in this Amber Alert as it had been called. I suspect people are relieved that Kara Beth Borden has been found.
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Relieved, yes, that she was found and unharmed, Wolf, but so many questions still remain.
And prosecutors here earlier today were asked whether or not Kara Borden is going to face charges. They say at this point they are still investigating. Also another question is when will David Ludwig be extradited here. Here he faces two counts of criminal homicide, one count of kidnapping, and one count of reckless endangerment.
Still a lot of questions about exactly how it all played out. People who know them say both were home schooled. Police say they apparently met at a home schooling event and one thing they do know is that they had communication on Internet. Wolf?
BLITZER: Thanks very much, Mary. We'll check back with you.
The suspect in this case, as Mary points out, maintained his own Web site and so did his girlfriend, apparent girlfriend.
Our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner is checking that situation online. Jackie?
JACKI SCHECHNER , CNN INTERNET CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, we'll show you David's web page in the next hour. First we wanted to show you Kara Beth Borden.
You can see that she maintained a Web site online, two online communities where she registered as being 17. We know now that she is in fact 14.
The first is Xanga.com. This is an online community where kids post their interests. She had everything from Jesus to candy to shopping, just a typical teenager. The other profile on the very popular myspace.com, you can see here again, she registered as being 17. She posted photos of herself. You can also see the photos of her 45 friends and her immediate network of friends. Up at the top, you can see David Ludwig was one of them. The other thing is that we wanted to point out to you, is that Kara Beth's profile has been updated later today. It says now that she is 14 years old, which makes this profile private. Means only the people in her immediate network can view her profile. When she was 17, the whole world, Wolf, could take a look.
BLITZER: Jacki, thank you very much.
Up next, here in THE SITUATION ROOM, Democrats are hammering him on Iraq and some Republicans are wary about even being seen with him. What can President Bush do about that? Tough question in our "Strategy Session", that's coming up next.
In the aftermath of the attacks in Jordan, we'll take you inside the mind of a suicide bomber. We'll have a chilling report in our 7:00 p.m. hour in THE SITUATION ROOM.
All that coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: As CNN's Bruce Morton reported just a little while ago, Republican Doug Forrester, who recently lost the New Jersey governor's race, says he would likely be New Jersey's new governor if President Bush 's popularity were not so low.
Is President Bush a liability for his party? Here to discuss that and other issues, Democratic strategist and former Clinton White House Press Secretary Joe Lockhart and CNN Contributor Torie Clarke, also a former Pentagon spokeswoman.
Thanks very much for joining us.
Torie, what do you think about what Doug Forrester just said? Pretty tough.
TORIE CLARKE, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I think he's going to come to regret it.
BLITZER: Why?
CLARKE: We all hate to lose. When you lose, you step up to the plate and say I was the candidate. I lost. I take responsibility. And I think he's just flat wrong. I think especially in local races, state and local races, it is so much the candidate. I don't think presidents, Republican or Democrat, have a whole lot of influence one way or the other.
BLITZER: Well, Joe, forget about whether he should have said it, but is he flat wrong?
JOE LOCKHART, FMR. WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I think he lost by enough that he wasn't a good enough candidate himself. I don't think there's any doubt that there's a movement in this country that is so dissatisfied with total Republican rule in Washington that's now beginning to affect local races around the country. I think he has a point. I think he would have lost anyway, though.
BLITZER: Let's talk about Iraq. Because that seems to be hovering over so much of what's going on. Listen to what Senator John McCain said yesterday. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I happen to believe that it is a lie to say that the president lied to the American people. Every indication, that every intelligence agency in the world had that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. So I think it's very legitimate for the president to respond to these criticisms, which I think are unfounded.
Was there intelligence failures? Absolutely. Where they colossal? Yes. But they do not mean, in any way, that the president lied to the American people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Do you agree with Senator McCain?
LOCKHART: I don't know that anybody's saying he's lied.
BLITZER: There are plenty of people who say he lied.
LOCKHART: Well, then I'll say what I'm saying, which is I think there is ample evidence out there that the administration cherry- picked intelligence. They went in with an idea and said we want to build the strongest case we can, for going to war. And then they put the things together.
There's enough evidence out there now through reporters digging in and people at the CIA and intelligence service who want to share this information, that shows there was a lot of warning bells. And those warning bells were not shared with the American people. I don't think they were shared with members of congress either.
CLARKE: It's not reporters who are coming forward saying that the information was manipulated. It is some Democrats -- not all of them, but some Democrats, just taking cheap shots, that I think will come back to haunt them. The French, the Russians, the Italians, the Germans, the United States, United Nations, everybody thought Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, had the intent to use them.
Everybody should be deeply concerned about that colossal intel failure, as John McCain called it. And we should be working on, in a bi-partisan, constructive fashion -- not trying to take cheap shots. Count my words, it will catch up with them.
BLITZER: Here's what...
LOCKHART: I don't think it's -- you know, the president is out there jumping up and down about Democrats. His harshest critics right now are in his own party -- about the mission here. And that really is what we should be focusing on. Because the mission is failing and the president won't even admit that there's a problem there.
BLITZER: Here's former Senator John Edwards, the Democratic vice presidential nominee, put it in an op-ed piece he wrote in yesterday's "Washington Post".
"It was a mistake to vote for this war in 2002. I take responsibility for that mistake... While we can't change the past, we need to accept responsibility, because a key part of restoring America's moral leadership is acknowledging when we've made mistakes or been proven wrong and showing that we have the creativity and guts to make it right."
That's a Democrat who voted for the resolution to go to war.
CLARKE: Sure, and I think the president, again and again, says he takes full responsibility for this. And he's is trying to work with others, including Democrats, on the way forward, rather than taking shots.
BLITZER: What does he need to do on Iraq, right now? To turn these horrible numbers around?
CLARKE: Couple of things he is doing. First of all charges unanswered, sometimes are charges accepted. So they have to refute completely these allegations that this information was in any way deliberately manipulated.
Secondly, it is a very, very tough issue. It is very tough times. You can't give one speech a month and thing that everyone is going to get it. You have to be out there again and again with an offensive game plan.
LOCKHART: Well, Wolf, by my count this is the third or fourth -- PR offensive that the president has gone on, to try to salvage the Iraq policy. He needs to stop thinking so much about PR and start thinking about the policy. And making the tough decisions and leveling with the American people and saying, we got this wrong. We need to do it right.
If you read on in the John Edwards piece, you'll see some very specific ideas how the mission should be changed. You've heard it from other Democrats. I think the cheapest shot of all here, is coming from the president when he somehow says that questioning him is undermining the troops and is somehow questioning our patriotism. Democrats from the beginning have rejected that.
They are just as patriotic as Republicans. Listen, I went through the Kosovo war with President Clinton. There were a lot of Republicans who questioned that. There were a lot of Republicans out there talking publicly about how it wasn't working. President never went out and said you're undermining the troops. He said we all have a right to debate this. We all have a right. President Bush is wrong in doing that.
BLITZER: We'll leave it there because we're out of time, unfortunately. Joe Lockhart, thanks very much. Torie Clarke, thanks to you, as well.
CLARKE: Thank you, Wolf.
BLITZER: Still to come, in THE SITUATION ROOM, the words "In God We Trust" and the paper they're printed on. Is it a fitting phrase for a dollar bill? Jack Cafferty has a penny for your thoughts.
And Iraq pressure points. The Democrats keep hammering at the president. Are they sending mixed signals to the enemy as Mr. Bush alleges? I'll talk to one of the top Senate Democrats, Chris Dodd, he's is standing by in our next hour. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: President Bush is on his way to Asia where avian flu fears are on the agenda. On the health care agenda at home, the new Medicare prescription drug plan. Enrollment begins tomorrow. Seniors are being urged to sign up now. But many are wary of the plan and its maze of options. Just a short while ago, I spoke with Health & Human Services Secretary Michael Leavitt; he joined me from out New York bureau.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: Secretary Leavitt, thanks very much for joining us. Welcome to THE SITUATION ROOM.
MICHAEL LEAVITT, SECRETARY, HEALTH & HUMAN SERVICES: Thank you.
BLITZER: I want to get to the Medicare prescription drug benefits in a moment. But a few questions on bird flu, while I have you. The director general of the World Health Organization, Lee John Wolka (ph) is quoted as saying this, "It is only a matter of time before a avian flu virus, mostly likely H5N1, acquires the ability to be transmitted from human to human, sparking the outbreak of a human pandemic influenza. We don't know when this will happen, but we do know that it will happen." That's a hard and fast statement. Do you agree with him?
LEAVITT: The operative word there is that an H5N1-like virus. We don't know with any certainty that it will be the specific virus we're dealing with now that will trigger a pandemic. But pandemics happen. They happened before and they'll happen again. We just need to be ready. If it isn't the H5N1, history demonstrates it will be another. We need to be prepared.
BLITZER: Well, on the issue of preparedness, David Nabarro, the U.N. coordinator for this influenza, the avian and human influenza, says this: "I'm actually getting more worried as time goes on, not less, because I see the size of the job we have to do to prepare for the pandemic, and the size of the job we have to do once the pandemic comes. I sense that pulling people together is much, much harder said than done."
Is the enormity of this task overwhelming?
LEAVITT: It is a big job. But for the first time in human history, we may have an opportunity to do something to prepare for a pandemic as opposed to just simply suffering its wrath. We are moving to create international surveillance and domestic surveillance, to have vaccines and create stockpiles of anti-virals and other necessities. We're working very -- in a robust way with state and local governments to help them prepare.
Over the course of the next several months, meetings will be held on preparedness with local officials, state officials, public health, medical community economic leaders throughout the entire country. If it isn't H5N1 that ultimately sparks the pandemic, there will be a pandemic at some point. We don't know if it is next year or 10 years from now. But we're not ready whether it's next year or 10 years and we need to use the time to our advantage.
BLITZER: What about regular flu vaccine? I called up my doctor the other day and wanted to get a flu shot. He said we don't have any right now. Call back in a few weeks. Is there a shortage once again this year as there was last year?
LEAVITT: We continue to believe that the manufacturers are making enough. They're just not getting it where it's needed at the time it's need. It is a distribution problem.
We're asking people or suggesting that they call their doctors, just like you did, in advance -- and then make certain that they have it. We're assured by the manufacturer that there will be enough.
However, it's clear to me that we're going to have this problem year after year after year. One of the things we can accomplish in our pandemic planning is to create enough vaccine production capacity that we can take this problem off the table forever.
BLITZER: Let's move on and talk about prescription drug benefits. Tomorrow seniors can start signing up for this plan. A poll that was put out by the Kaiser Family Foundation and the Harvard School of Public Health showed only 35 percent of those who responded say they had a very or somewhat well understanding of this new drug benefit.
And 61 percent said they did not have a very good understanding of what was involved. And Barbara Rabson of Massachusetts Health Quality Partners is quoted in the "Boston Globe" as saying I can't even approach it, I'm so confused. It's mind boggling to me and I'm supposed to know this stuff.
It sounds very complicated and a lot of viewers who are on Medicare right now don't know what to do. Where do they start in this process?
LEAVITT: Well, health care is complicated. Let's just acknowledge that. Any time you're dealing with health insurance or going to pharmacy or the doctor, it's complicated.
One of the good things is that this is going to give us an opportunity for the first time to have prescription drug coverage as part of Medicare. And it will begin to turn us away from just treating health conditions to preventing health conditions. There are lot of places people can and should get information over the next six months.
They can go to their pharmacy, to their doctor, they can -- they'll receive it in the mail. If they're inclined, they can go to 1- 800-MEDICARE or www.medicare.gov. That's a terrific site. I've been on it myself working to work out my parents' situation. You can put the information on where they live and what drugs they take, and it will create a very clear list of the plans that would be best for them.
I know that you're working with your mother to do the same thing. We're reaching out to parents -- or rather to family members all over the country saying if you've got a parent who can use your help, give it to them, because health care is complicated.
BLITZER: Give the complicated nature of this some Democrats are now calling for an extra six months to give seniors, Medicare recipients, an opportunity to study it right now, they have till May 15 of next year to sign up. What do you think about giving them extra six months? They are proposing legislation so they'd have an extra six months beyond May 15 of next year to really come to grips with what's going on.
LEAVITT: Wolf, six months is a long time. We can accomplish a great deal in the next six months and I feel optimistic that the Wall Street analysts are right. We'll have 28 to 30 million people will enroll.
And we will, for the first time, have prescription drugs coverage. This is a remarkable moment in health care history. It may be the most significant thing that has happened in health care in some 40 years. And it is going to require people to take time and to learn about it. We know about Medicare now. We know we like it or we don't like it, but it's part of our life. In a year or two from now, Medicare prescription drugs will be exactly the same way.
I was in Asia not long ago and a man said to me, there is an old Asian saying, that one time doing is the same as 100 times hearing. As people get a chance to sit down and work this through we'll be able to figure it out. They'll choose a plan that is good for them. And it will save them money. And it will allow them to start worrying about staying healthy as opposed to just being treated, and have the peace of mind that their savings are not going to be eroded as a result of prescription drugs.
BLITZER: Secretary Leavitt, thanks very much for joining us.
LEAVITT: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
