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The Situation Room
Prominent Sunni Sheik Killed in Baghdad Home; New Info on When Troops are Coming Home; Hussein's Trial Resumes on Monday Despite Lawyers' Boycott Threats; China Confirms 3rd Case of Bird Flu in Humans; Firefighter Injured in Atlanta Apartment Blaze; Weather and Travel Concerns for Holiday Season; Winds may Damper Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade; Visitors Pour in to Georgia Aquarium
Aired November 23, 2005 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: It's 5:00 p.m. in Washington, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where news and information from around the world arrive at one place at the same time.
Happening now, It's 1:00 a.m. Thursday in Iraq. There's new talk of cutting back the U.S. presence there, but only under certain conditions. We'll show you what it will take to bring U.S. troops home.
It's 2:00 p.m. in Los Angeles. Travelers there and across the country are heading out for the holiday on one of the busiest travel days of the year. We'll get the latest on the situation from coast to coast.
And it's 6:00 a.m. Thursday in Beijing, where officials are announcing another human case of bird flu. We'll show you the new steps being taken in this country to stop a possible pandemic.
I'm Ali Velshi, in for Wolf Blitzer. And you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
A prominent Sunni sheik, his three sons and a son-in-law all killed in their Baghdad home by gunmen wearing Iraqi army uniforms. The brutal assassinations were apparently designed to send a message.
We have reports on the fight for Iraq from Aneesh Raman, Zain Verjee and Barbara Starr.
But first, our Chief International Correspondent Nic Robertson is live with us from Baghdad on the story of that assassination -- Nic.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What we know about this, it changing the dynamic of what we've seen in the Sunni- led insurgency up to now. We've seen them target the Shia Muslims here in an effort to divide, make sectarian tension. This is a departure, or at least it appears to be.
What happened, a Sunni tribal sheik sleeping in his house at 4:00 a.m. in the morning, he was attacked by -- by people dressed as army soldiers. They came, according to neighbors, in 10 trucks.
They entered his house, shot him and three of his sons while they were sleeping in the building. This is -- it seems to be at least the first attack that we've seen on a tribal sheik, Kadhim al-Dulami, the head of the Batta tribe, a small but significant tribe here, part of the larger al-Dulami tribe. The al-Dulami a very big tribe in Iraq.
This is the sort of attack that can spread throughout the tribe. If somebody in the tribe is killed, then the tribe takes that on. And this perhaps a step to create divisions within the tribe set, tribe upon tribe, to spread, you will, the terrorism that's happening inside Iraq.
VELSHI: Nic, we've heard reports that there were up to 10 army vehicles, people dressed in army uniforms. It seems unclear as to whether those were in fact Iraqi army soldiers or impersonators. Now, that has got to be a problem for the Iraqi army, trying to continue to recruit and train more people.
Does this slow it down for them? Do we know whether or not these were impersonators?
ROBERTSON: We don't know that for sure at this time. Yes, it does hamper, because what it does is, anyone in the Dulami tribe is going to look at the army now and say, do I really want to join them? They're killing people in my tribe.
It puts Sunnis off from joining the army. One of the important things right now for the -- for the Iraqis, for the multinational force, for the United States, is to build an army here in Iraq that is representative of the whole country, Sunnis, Shias, Kurds.
When you set Sunnis up for failure for joining the army by hitting their tribes here, then you don't get a representative army. That spreads dissent.
We hear criticism in some Shia towns -- in some Sunni towns. Shia army coming into their town. All these things make problems for ending the insurgency here.
VELSHI: Nic Robertson in Baghdad.
That information isolated, though it might seem to some viewers here, is key to decisions that have to be made in Washington about troops. There is new information on when some U.S. forces might be coming home from Iraq.
CNN Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr is live with us with those details -- Barbara.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ali, as that violence continues in Iraq, U.S. military commanders are adamant they are far from ready to set a firm timetable for a troop withdrawal.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
STARR (voice over): If the December elections go well in Iraq, and the violence declines, and Iraqi security forces take more responsibility, then U.S. military commanders may recommend a significant reduction in the number of U.S. forces in Iraq for next year. But as the violence continues, withdrawing troops is a careful calculation.
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is optimistic.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, SECRETARY OF STATE: I expect that the American forces are not going to be need in the numbers that they're there for all that much longer.
STARR: Top military commanders are more cautious.
LT. GEN. JOHN VINES, COMMANDER, MULTINATIONAL FORCE, IRAQ: I believe ultimately the stability of the government and its ability to support its security forces and provide for the basic functions of governance is the greatest long-term challenge.
STARR: There are about 155,000 U.S. troops in Iraq. About 20,000 are expected to leave shortly after the December elections.
CNN has confirmed that military commanders have drafted an option to gradually reduce levels to about 100,000 over the next year, with perhaps 10,000 troops on standby in Kuwait. But one official warned it's an extremely bold scenario. He says it's "... foolhardy to think we are just going to pack up our tents and head for Kuwait."
Any withdrawal will be gradual, commanders say.
Senior military officials are said to be increasingly concerned that the debate about troop levels will begin to hurt troop morale and worry military family members.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
STARR: And Ali, so far the violence has not significantly diminished in Iraq. Those sophisticated improvised explosive devices that first started appearing in southern Iraq several weeks ago are now being seen in larger numbers and in different locations, including Baghdad -- Ali.
VELSHI: All right. A wait and see with a timeline before action is taken on pulling out U.S. troops. But we have seen action on Zarqawi. What's the latest on the hunt for the terror mastermind?
STARR: Well, it was very interesting. General Rick Lynch (ph), the chief military spokesman in Baghdad, earlier today from the podium had a very interesting statement. He said, "We are continuously coming close to Zarqawi."
What does that mean? Are they really close? An awful lot of other generals are fairly skeptical.
But there is some thinking out there that they have wrapped up so many of Zarqawi's lieutenants that they are now forcing him closer out to being in the open. Time will tell -- Ali. VELSHI: Barbara Starr, Pentagon correspondent. Thank you so much.
Now, the debate over whether or not to pull troops out of Iraq has been criticized by the administration as affecting morale with the forces on the ground. And it is being head by U.S. forces.
CNN's Aneesh Raman is embedded with U.S. troops in central Iraq, and he joins us now live via videophone.
Aneesh, what's the situation there? What's the morale there? And what's the reaction to the debate?
ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's difficult to judge morale, especially with a troop that you're only with for a few days. But morale is high here. They are committed to each other, they are committed to this fight. But that is why we came.
Amid all the debate in Washington, it is the troops on the front line who have the clearest view of what's happening in Iraq.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RAMAN (voice over): The best days in Iraq are the slow ones when there's no engagement with the enemy, when there's a chance to get some downtime. Killing time, killing flies.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He ain't flying.
RAMAN: And for us, it's a chance to talk to soldiers about the war raging here and the debate about it raging back home.
CPL. JAMES PARSLEY, U.S. ARMY: Whatever they are fighting for over there, this is our fight. You know, we are trying our best. And pretty much soldiers, whether they want to be here or not, this is our focus.
CPL. CHARLES JOHNSON, U.S. ARMY: I think it's right for people to argue. In college and regular office days, argue about what we're doing over here. Hey, it might help our benefits get higher or something, you know?
I don't know. They just -- they just don't understand what it's like over here, what it's like driving down a road full of BB IEDs or IEDs, or something.
RAMAN: The fight in this part of Iraq just south of the capital remains a tough one. Roadside bombs found on a near daily basis. Car bombs detonated, insurgent groups operating among the civilian population. The soldiers are trained, though, to confront these dangers. But not the risks they can face back in the U.S.
JOHNSON: When I went home, you'd mention you were from Iraq and stuff, it's not the greatest thing to mention to a girl when you are at the club. It doesn't work. Someone asks me what I do, I'm like, "I'm in the Army, in Iraq." You know? But something I try to avoid from saying just because it starts a whole conflict.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
RAMAN: Now, Ali, what has changed is the answer to the question why they are out there fighting. A time ago if you asked soldiers -- and I did -- why they were in this fight, it was the war on terror, it was to build a democracy in Iraq. But today when I asked them that question it was more about getting home and getting home alive.
This squadron lost 18 of its troops in the past nine months. And so they are doing everything they can to keep each other alive -- Ali.
VELSHI: Aneesh, good job out there. Stay safe while you're out there.
Aneesh Raman in Iraq.
One of the stories Aneesh follows when he's not embedded is the trial of Saddam Hussein. It resumes on Monday despite threats of a boycott by defense lawyers following the killing of two of their colleagues.
Zain Verjee is live for us at the CNN Center in Atlanta with more on that trial -- Zain.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR: Ali, security issues expected to take center stage when the Iraqi tribunal reconvenes with Saddam Hussein's lawyer demanding a solution to ensure the safety of the defense team.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
VERJEE (voice over): A U.S. official close to the Iraqi high tribunal says the court's prepared to provide full security to everyone involved in the trial of Saddam Hussein. The official says the court's already acting on requests from several lawyers and urging all defense attorneys to accept the offer of security.
Saddam's own lawyer, Halil al-Dulami (ph), says his team of defense lawyers might boycott the trial following the assassinations of two attorneys involved in the case in the last five weeks. Adil Mohammed al-Zubaydi (ph) was shot and killed on November the 8th. He was representing the country's former vice president.
And on October 20, Sadoun Janabi (ph) was kidnapped and killed. He was the lawyer for the former chief judge of Saddam's revolutionary court.
The U.S. official also gave a preview of what's expected to happen in this next phase of the trial. They court's expected to call witnesses, although it's not clear who, how many, or whether they'll appear on camera.
The proceedings could run several days before a break is called. And a break is already scheduled during parliamentary elections on December 15.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VERJEE: And Ali, security concerns have spread beyond Baghdad. A European Union lawyers' group is urging officials to just move the trial out of Iraq to guarantee safety for everyone involved.
VELSHI: Zain, you were talking about it could go several days before a break is called. And it's unclear as to who the witnesses will be. How long -- any estimates as to how long this entire trial could last?
VERJEE: Yes, that's unclear as well. There are several officials that say it could last several months. But there could be even more delays if you factor in the security risks.
VELSHI: All right. Zain Verjee. Good to see you.
Zain Verjee in Atlanta.
Up ahead, in China, another bird flu death. It's caused Asia to stay on alert for outbreaks, and it's further inflamed fears of a global pandemic.
Also, for millions of holiday travelers, places to go, things to do, miles to go before they're through. We are going to tell you how things are going in the air and on the ground.
Also, forecasters are predicting high winds in New York City during the famous Macy's holiday parade. And for something -- that's the kind of thing that's raising worries that an unfortunate balloon accident from a few years ago could repeat itself.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: China is reporting its third case of human avian influenza, the so-called bird flu. Two of those victims have died.
Now, that high mortality rate underscores why there's so much concern about a global pandemic. China's Ministry of Health says a 36-year-old female farmer in eastern Anhui province is the country's latest bird flu victim.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI (voice over): She died last week just four days after falling ill. That's the third confirmed human case of bird flu in China. The World Health Organization reports 131 total human cases so far across Southeast Asia, with victims in China, Indonesia, Thailand, Vietnam and Cambodia. Of those, 68 have died.
And while the virus is not yet known to transmit between humans, fear of that possibility is prompting new precautions around the world. And travelers are reacting to new precautions we showed you yesterday. Those flying into Japan from countries affected by bird flu are being asked to disinfect their shoes by walking across mats that are soaked with antiseptic liquid.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm not really surprised. But I don't think it's necessary.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think there's so few cases of it, I don't understand why people are so afraid of it.
VELSHI: The measure is being taken at four main Japanese airports which handle 90 percent of travelers arriving from countries that are known to have the virus.
And here in the U.S., the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is proposing new rules to prevent the spread of diseases, including bird flu. Among other things, they would give the CDC easier access to airline and cruise ship passenger lists and set up new rules for treating quarantined passengers.
The U.S. has recently increased the number of quarantine facilities to 18 at airports, seaports and border crossings nationwide.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI: For more on the threat of bird flu, we're joined by Dr. Anthony Fauci. He's the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.
Dr. Fauci, thank you for being with us.
DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INST. OF ALLERGY & INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Good to be here.
VELSHI: Let's just go to this -- somebody in the story here was talking about the fact that there are so few cases of it, what's everybody worried about? In a nutshell, I know we've heard a lot about this, but is this worthy of concern, particularly to Americans?
FAUCI: It's worthy of attention and preparation. It certainly should not instill panic or fear.
When you talk about the small numbers, it's true that it is small, relatively speaking. But the concern is the potential of the virus evolving to be able to do what it's not doing now; namely, spread efficiently from human to human. The more human cases you have, you have a greater probability of that happening if in fact the virus is programmed to ultimately get there anyway.
It might dead-end. It might dead-end...
VELSHI: Tell me about that. What makes a virus prone to mutating? How does that happen? FAUCI: You really can't tell. The more you replicate, the more you turn over, the greater chance you have of mutating. And we see those mutations all the time.
Some of those mutations might point the virus in the direction of doing something really dangerous such as jumping from a chicken to a human. And then the thing that has not happened yet that we're concerned about is getting to go from human to human in an efficient, sustained manner.
So the more there's infection, the more opportunity you give to the virus to get those mutations that might -- and again, you have to underscore, that might not ever happen, but you have to be prepared. Because the consequences are very severe.
VELSHI: You present it in a very balanced fashion, but just over a month ago we looked at an opinion poll which asked how people what they -- how they thought a person gets avian flu. Let's take a look at this.
Fifty-eight percent of people surveyed said that you get it through contact with someone who has it. Fifty-four percent, contact with a chicken that has it. Forty-seven percent by eating an infected chicken.
So people are awfully concerned about it.
FAUCI: Right, they are. And as is sometimes if not more often than not the case, when you have a lot of information going out, that a lot of it is misplaced and incorrect. For example, you say that 50- plus percent of people think you can get it from another person. And that's the one thing we were just speaking about a moment ago.
VELSHI: Which doesn't happen.
FAUCI: That doesn't happen except in an extraordinary rare instance.
VELSHI: Now, one of the things that -- one of the advantages that the United States has and one of the advantages that a lot of countries who have dealt with SARS have is this concept of early -- early detection, surveillance. And we've seen that there are some airports that check people as they come in.
Dr. Jonathan Fielding, the director of public health for Los Angeles County, said, "We may well catch people early, but to assume that we can prevent entry in all cases simply by increasing surveillance is very optimistic. The reason we're freaked out is we don't know the likelihood that this could be transformed into a virus that could easily be transmitted from person to person."
But what we do know, doctor, is that though it's not a similar strain, we've heard reports of a -- of a -- of a strain in Canada.
FAUCI: Right.
VELSHI: The U.S.has banned poultry imports from Canada.
What should we be fearing, particularly as we get to Thanksgiving, and people have turkey on the mind?
FAUCI: Right. I don't think we should be fearing anything, Ali, to be honest with you. We see the situation now in Canada.
People need to understand, there's highly pathogenic avian influenza, which is what's going on in Southeast Asia right now. And then there's low pathogenic avian influenza, which has been around the world for decades and decades and decades.
It generally goes unnoticed. It doesn't make chickens sick. And it doesn't make humans sick, certainly.
So what we're see in Canada is because of the increased alertness that people are now focusing on that. But a duck who has H5N1, the concern is that it's an H5N1. But it's a low pathogenic H5N1.
VELSHI: Right. Now, one of the things they did have in Canada was SARS.
FAUCI: Right.
VELSHI: And China had reportedly the highest incident of SARS. And I was just in China a little while ago, and of course this bird flu matter is consuming people there.
There's certainly a lot of talk that there's a belief that there was some under-reporting and that SARS might have been more serious at the time in China. We now have two -- three confirmed cases, two confirmed deaths in China.
Are you concerned that you're not getting all the information you need, or has the cooperation amongst countries been pretty good?
FAUCI: I don't think it's as good as it can be. And I think there are two levels of cooperation.
There's deliberate holding things back, which we certainly hope we don't see any of that. China is coming forward with their three cases right now. And that's good news.
VELSHI: But you're not worried that it's 300?
FAUCI: Well, you know, I have some skepticism because we have a track record with China, with all due respect, that they're not always forthright in their reporting. To me, it's good news that they're reporting these. And we need to keep our eye out to make sure there's not anything to be held behind.
But in addition to the potential for a deliberate holding things back is the fact that when you're dealing with countries in which you have a widespread number of chickens out in provinces that are distant from where you can have good monitoring, that there may be almost inadvertent non-reporting. VELSHI: Can you look into that camera and tell anybody who's preparing their turkey tonight that it's OK?
FAUCI: Yes. I can tell you, don't worry about your turkey. Enjoy it. We don't have H5N1 bird flu in the United States of America. So enjoy your turkey.
VELSHI: My producer, Eric Sherling (ph), really didn't want me to ask this question, but what about eggnog?
FAUCI: You can have eggnog, too.
VELSHI: It's OK?
FAUCI: It's OK.
VELSHI: Dr. Anthony Fauci, thanks so much for being with us. He's the director of the National Institute of Allergy and infectious diseases.
Now, for more on the bird flu threat, here is our Internet reporter, Jacki Schechner.
JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Is it OK if I don't like eggnog? Is that...
(CROSSTALK)
VELSHI: (INAUDIBLE) force you to eat eggnog, except at the company party.
SCHECHNER: I just wanted to show you, we've seen about the cases in Southeast Asia of bird flu. There's one country that hasn't seen it so far, but they are well prepared online, and that is Singapore.
They have an incredibly comprehensive Web site. They are ensuring people that it's OK to eat poultry that is sold in Singapore.
They also have an alert level system. You can see this is very similar to what we have in terms of color-coding.
They're currently at the alert level of green, a 1, nothing to worry about. But I will tell you that when it gets to black, a level 5, they're not mincing any words on this Web site: "Out of control, many deaths, panic."
But what's interesting, I thought, about the site is they have a lot of information in the form of a slide show. And all you have to do is -- I'll touch the screen here, but you roll your mouse over it, it tells you what is bird flu, completely interactive. How do humans get affected.
All sorts of information available for you online.
Now, of course we're hoping that nobody will have a need for this information in Singapore. But they're doing a very good job of preparing just in case -- Ali.
VELSHI: You don't really like eggnog?
SCHECHNER: Oh, it's awful. I'm sorry.
VELSHI: Well, it's safe. Does that change your mind about it?
SCHECHNER: Well, now you're going to tell me there's a family recipe I have to try or something and I've offended somebody. But no, I'm not a big eggnog fan.
VELSHI: Jacki Schechner, spoiling the fun.
Coming up, amazing lengths that we go to for home-cooked meals. Right now, millions, millions of people, are loaded up on airplanes, they're crammed on the highways. They're hoping to make Thanksgiving dinner.
We're going to tell you exactly how things are going out there on the road, in the airports.
And the floats in the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade are surely fun to look at, but after a freak balloon accident a few years ago, some people are wondering if they're safe. We're going to tell you about those concerns when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: And many places this Thanksgiving Eve, the weather outside is frightful. It's complicating travel conditions for many people.
We're watching traffic in several cities, including New York, where you can see those New York taxis making it around. It looks like Manhattan is not doing too badly.
Let's have a look at Houston right now. We have a look at Houston, where traffic is moving along as people get ready to get home to Thanksgiving dinner.
Let's take a look at Raleigh-Durham. That is I-40 we're looking at in Raleigh-Durham, North Carolina. And it's looking all right.
Number four on our list of cameras, Orlando. Now there we have some traffic. People in Orlando are making a move to get to where they want to be.
In Los Angeles, a few minutes ago I commented that it didn't really look much worse than L.A. traffic typically does. Remember, this is 2:30 in the afternoon in L.A. And that does look a little heavier than it typically would.
San Francisco, always a beautiful shot to look at, seems to be humming along nicely. A little early for rush hour, even in San Francisco. But pretty soon that will pick up.
And in Chicago, Chicago is bracing for some of that bad weather. Conditions are cold, and people are heading out of the city.
And finally, in Dallas, that is I-35 we're looking at. And if that's not Thanksgiving traffic, what is?
We've got reporters from east to west and in between.
Allan Chernoff is at LaGuardia airport in New York. Meteorologist Bonnie Schneider is at the CNN Center in Atlanta with the weather report. Abbi Tatton is here checking the situation online.
But let's begin with Chris Lawrence. He's at Los Angeles International Airport, where at least at the airport earlier, Chris, it wasn't looking that crazy.
The roads are looking busy. How is it doing at the airport?
CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Still about the same, Ali. You know, it was really busy, from what I'm told, early in the morning, around 6:00 or 7:00 in the morning. But you can see now hardly anybody.
The gentleman right here checking people in says he got here at 10:00 this morning and it's been pretty much like this. A little bit more off and on, but overall, just not a lot of traffic out here. Not what you would expect.
The folks here at LAX tell us a lot more folks, a lot more families are taking the entire week off. What that does is stretch out that travel day so not everyone is trying to get out on the day before Thanksgiving.
Also, we got about the same number of travelers coming out here as last year. But they've added a lot of security lines. That's pushing folks through a lot faster.
Overall, they expect things to pick up again in a couple of hours when people start getting off work again. But overall, easy day out here at LAX.
VELSHI: And on your screen over to the right, Chris, you're looking at, that is L.A. traffic. It is very, very heavy.
Chris, we'll keep in touch with you at one of the country's busiest airports.
Over to another very, very busy airport. Allan Chernoff is at New York's LaGuardia airport, where Allan and I have both experienced as reporters and as travelers major, major delays.
How is it looking over at LaGuardia, Allan.
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN SR. CORRESPONDENT: Ali, a similar situation compared to Los Angeles. We were here yesterday at the same time and, frankly, there was more of a crunch here yesterday than today. Lots of people arriving very early. They're familiar with the security situation. They're well prepared. And as you see behind me, they're going through very smoothly. That is the security line right behind me.
In terms of delays, we have got a few, but nothing terrible. The worst all day has been Cleveland -- right now, the delay getting out to Cleveland, about an hour, a similar delay also for Detroit and Houston -- Ali.
VELSHI: All right, Allan Chernoff, we're going to keep checking on the situation at -- at the two airports, two major airports we're covering and bring you up to date -- updates on other airports around the country where there are delays.
Now, one of the reasons there might be delays is because of the weather. How are things going for travelers in -- in places around the city that are -- around the country that are bracing for bad weather?
Bonnie Schneider is joining us now from CNN Center in Atlanta.
Some of the parts of the country are looking a little rough, Bonnie. How is it going?
BONNIE SCHNEIDER, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Absolutely, Ali.
When you look at this screen, this indicates all our advisories that we have posted. The areas in orange or red, well, that's where we are expecting the heaviest know. The areas in blue, moderate snow. And then look at this, yellow warnings here. This indicates high wind warnings.
And, Chicago, this means you. We are expecting wind gusts over 35 miles per hour tonight. It is just going to be so blustery out there in much of the Great Lakes. And when you look at our temperatures for lows, Chicago drops down to 18 degrees. Factor in the wind chill, it's going to feel like it's in the single digits or colder out there, blustery weather with that strong wind blowing.
Over areas where the snow falls, well, that makes for whiteout conditions, certainly. And we're also looking at some blustery weather, with a lot of wind and snow to contend with, certainly, for much of the region.
Now, as we look towards our forecast map, it shows this Alberta Clipper continues to pull down this colder air over the Great Lakes. And that complicates matters, because, normally, we will just get some moderate snow from a Clipper storm like this. But we're expecting a lot more snow, possibly up to two feet in some areas, some parts of Michigan and Upstate New York as well overnight tonight.
And, then, as we approach Thanksgiving, all this cold air will move to the east. So, folks in the Northeast will be waking up to chilly conditions, especially in New York for the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade -- Ali. VELSHI: Bonnie, I was just looking at that temperature map that you had up with Minneapolis and Chicago. And I grew up in -- in Canada, where measure -- we measure it in Celsius. And those look like cold -- cool Celsius temperatures. It's unbelievable that, in Fahrenheit, that's like -- I don't even how to do the math on that. That's so cold.
(LAUGHTER)
SCHNEIDER: It's very cold, definitely.
VELSHI: All right. We will -- we will check in with you again, Bonnie Schneider at CNN Center.
Abbi Tatton is following traffic and how you can figure out on the Internet whether or not to leave now or wait until later -- Abbi.
ABBI TATTON, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Actually, looking at the airports, how the weather is affecting the airports right now, this is a useful site here, Ali, from the Federal Aviation Administration. It's tracking delays at airports across the United States.
If an airport is in green, that means everything is doing OK, but some of them experiencing a little bit of difficulty.
Here in the Midwest, if we go to Chicago's O'Hare Airport -- this site is being constantly updated, so it's going to jump around a little bit there -- O'Hare, some of the arriving flights there being delayed, on average, 41 minutes.
Going across to La Guardia in New York, the average delay for some arriving flights is one hour and eight minutes. Now, if you look across to the other side of the country there, all those airports in green, out West, not experiencing any trouble right now, according to this FAA site -- Ali.
VELSHI: All right, Ali, we will continue to check on that. And, of course, I said you were looking at traffic. We are looking at traffic. We have got cameras in major cities across the United States tracking how that develops. We will keep on that story.
Coming up, fire drives dozens of people from their homes on the eve of the holiday, and one firefighter is hurt battling an intense blaze. We will get a live update from fire officials.
And it's a holiday tradition, but it's not without its dangers. Mary Snow will show it -- show us what's being done to keep the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade safe.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: Well, let's take it over to CNN Center in Atlanta -- Atlanta.
Zain Verjee is joining us with a closer look at other stories that are making news right now. Zain, what's going on?
(LAUGHTER)
VERJEE: Sheriff's deputies, Ali, arrested a dozen anti-war protesters outside President Bush's ranch in Crawford, Texas. The president and his family are spending the Thanksgiving holiday at the ranch. Following weeks of protests during the president's summer vacation, a local ordinance was enacted banning camping on the roadside near Bush's property. Protesters say they plan to challenge that law.
Spanish police report the arrests of 11 alleged members of a terror cell in that country. The suspects are accused of providing logistical and financial support to a radical Algerian group linked to al Qaeda. Authorities say members of the cell financed terrorist activities through petty crimes such as drug trafficking and credit card fraud -- police emphasizing that there is no indication that the group was planning an imminent attack.
Chileans who say their loved ones disappeared or were jailed during the 17-year rule of former dictator Augusto Pinochet celebrated his indictment today on corruption-related charges. Pinochet is thought to have stashed some $27 million in bank accounts abroad. In recent years, he has been ruled too ill to stand trial on various human rights charges, dating back to a 1973 coup.
And, Ali, court-appointed doctors have recently -- as recently as early November said, you know, yes, he suffers from dementia and neurological problems, but he is actually fit to stand trial. So, we will see.
VELSHI: Almost 90 years old.
Zain, good to see you. Thanks so much, Zain Verjee in Atlanta.
Now, earlier, in Atlanta, we showed you some pictures of flames and some fear -- an apartment complex ablaze. Several walls collapsed as firefighters rushed in.
Captain Byron Kennedy of the Atlanta Fire Department is with us now to tell us a bit about what's going on.
Captain Kennedy, thanks for joining us. We understand that one of your firefighters was injured in this -- in -- in fighting this fire.
CAPTAIN BYRON KENNEDY, ATLANTA FIRE DEPARTMENT: Absolutely.
He was part of the team that we had on one of the sides, actually between the adjacent structure that also became involved. This firefighter, along with several other members, were manning hand lines protecting that exposure in an attempt to -- to stop all of the fire from actually getting to that unburned portion of the building.
VELSHI: What's the state of the fire right now? Is it -- I -- I -- certainly see stuff behind you, over your left shoulder. Is it still a working fire?
KENNEDY: It still is a working incident.
The fire is basically out. Right now, if you look over my left shoulder, you can actually see we're still putting water on it. There are a lot of places that we haven't been able to get to because of the structural collapse.
VELSHI: And everybody who lived in there is safe?
KENNEDY: Yes. You're looking at quite a few families that were displaced because of this incident. Everyone was able to get out of the structure prior to the collapse.
VELSHI: It's a tough way to go into Thanksgiving.
Thanks for joining us, Captain Byron Kennedy, in Atlanta.
Well, still to come, it's a holiday tradition, but could it turn deadly? Next up, we are going to go live to New York and to Mary Snow to see what's being done to keep Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade safe.
And we will also go live to Atlanta again, where the world's largest aquarium is now open for business.
Stay with us. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: Well, there will be clowns and confetti, food and fanfare, and, certainly, plenty of floats. For nearly 80 years, Macy's has pulled off its Thanksgiving Day Parade in New York City, mostly without a hitch. But that wasn't the case in 1997. In a freak accident, a Cat in the Hat balloon injured several people.
Now, today, despite new safety guidelines for the floats, some people still want to know that the parade is safe.
CNN's Mary Snow is in New York City with more.
Hello, Mary.
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, there, Ali.
And, you know, this is a tradition. The night before Thanksgiving, you see Macy's blowing up these balloons. This is Humpty Dumpty behind me.
The crowds have streamed in. Tomorrow, Macy's estimates that there will be two-and-a-half million people here watching the parade. But there are forecasts for winds. And the city will have to decide whether or not some of those balloons can go up, this because of safety guidelines put into place a few years ago.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(CHEERING)
SNOW (voice-over): With forecasters expecting strong winds on Thanksgiving, Macy's and New York City officials will be closely monitoring the weather, this after updated safety guidelines were put into place following a tragic accident in 1997, when handlers lost control of the Cat in the Hat balloon in 40-mile-per-hour winds.
The balloon sliced the top of a lamppost, injuring several people, including a woman who ended up permanently brain-damaged. A year later, the city came up with new safety guidelines, including increasing the number of balloon handlers. They announced:
JEAN MCFADDEN, MACY'S THANKSGIVING DAY PARADE DIRECTOR: We have increased the number of handlers from 40 -- what used to be 40 to 50 people per balloon is now 50 to 60 people per balloon. Plus, they had a much more intensified training program.
SNOW: Macy's says training for all of the 2,000 handlers is not mandatory, but it is required for about 300 members of the flight management team.
JOHN PIPER, VICE PRESIDENT, MACY'S PARADE STUDIO: The training is more extensive. The training has been updated. The training is very successful.
SNOW: John Piper, who oversees the balloons, says the emphasis is on training pilots and flight managers, who go through courses several months before the parade. About 1,700 other balloon volunteers get manuals, like this one, and watch videos before navigating through the parade. Macy's say handlers must be at least 125 pounds, 18 years of age, and be able to walk two-and-a-half miles.
PIPER: You have got to be able to hold, all right? And that weight is pulling up on you, instead of carrying a weight that would -- you know, that would be down.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How am I doing?
SNOW: Handlers say each balloon line weighs about three to five pounds, and the lines can be a handful.
MICHAEL GIURICI, MACY'S THANKSGIVING DAY PARADE: It is a bit of a challenge. The golden rule is always to watch the pilot.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: Now, there is a rule that, if the winds are 23 miles an hour, gusts of up to 34, that some of the balloons won't be able to go up. The city will make that determination before 8:00 tomorrow morning -- Ali.
VELSHI: Yes.
And, Mary, you're high a high-tech whiz when we are up in New York. You don't have to wait for the city to make that determination. There's some kind of technology to figure out how windy it is? SNOW: Yes.
One of the stipulations that came about in these safety guidelines is, these teams that are with the balloons, one person actually has a portable wind meter -- since you're Mr. Gadgets, I'm sure you're familiar with this -- to watch the wind.
But, also, you know, forecasters are in touch with the police department. And they're really monitoring this.
VELSHI: Mary, they equipped me here at CNN with a windbag meter, not a wind meter.
But thank you for joining us. Stay safe out there. It's -- it's going to get windy -- Mary Snow getting ready for those -- those parade balloons.
Now, the parade route winds through many of New York City's most well-known streets. It's got a lot of spots for optimum viewing, none better than the ones that our Tom Foreman has mapped out for you.
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes.
It's a beautiful place to go, even if you're just there visiting for the day or you get to see it on TV. Let's take a look at where the parade route is, because it starts right up here, in front of the Museum of Natural History. On Central Park, if you're ever there, it's up on the western side of the park, right around there.
And it starts moving down the way. As it goes down, you will find out that it goes right down to the mother ship for us. This is where all of our programming in New York comes out.
VELSHI: That's right.
FOREMAN: That's where you work most of the time.
VELSHI: That's where I work. That's right.
FOREMAN: And then it keeps going right down this way here.
This is where they keep things under control as they go past the park. They try to keep them under control as they go further on. But they let them go up higher between the buildings. And, then, they finally get down here.
If you get those gusts tomorrow, 35 miles an hour, like they're talking about, you are going to get this wind-tunneling effect between all of these buildings.
And we have an example here. This is the latest balloon they're developing. This is a -- the Blitzer balloon, which...
(LAUGHTER)
FOREMAN: Well, they're not actually developing it, but they ought to.
If you're wondering where Wolf was, they're doing the final fitting today. This is where they really have to hold on. You get between the buildings here and your Blitzer balloon gets caught by the wind. And what you don't want to do is have it get spinning out of control, because then look what is going to happen.
VELSHI: Look what is going to happen.
FOREMAN: The Blitzer balloon will take off.
VELSHI: It is going to be Wolf everywhere.
FOREMAN: And before you know -- oh, yes, it's going to be unbelievable. And then it's just going to be out of control from there. And it's just -- the whole Blitzer thing, it could sail off into space.
Interestingly enough...
(LAUGHTER)
FOREMAN: Interestingly enough, in the past...
VELSHI: Wolf will be in China.
FOREMAN: ... they did...
VELSHI: In India.
FOREMAN: ... let the balloons go. It was an old tradition. They let the balloons go at the end.
VELSHI: Yes.
FOREMAN: And, if people could find them, they could turn them in for a prize -- but not anymore.
VELSHI: As you know, because you have been everywhere in the world, New York in particular, Manhattan can be windy even when there isn't any wind outside.
(CROSSTALK)
FOREMAN: ... Capitol Hill over here.
VELSHI: Yes. No, exactly.
FOREMAN: Right.
VELSHI: Good to see you, my friend.
(LAUGHTER)
VELSHI: Tom Foreman. Up next, a record-setting season reaches a new milestone with a brand new tropical storm. It's named Delta. We will show you where it's headed.
And something fishy in a big way. We are going to take you live to the world's largest aquarium, opened its doors for the first time today.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: It's the largest facility of its kind in the world -- the Georgia Aquarium throwing open its doors to the public for the first time today.
Among its 100,000 residents, two juvenile -- juvenile male whales. Now, officials say they would love to find a girlfriend for one or both of them and -- and breed them. That would be a first. It's not that easy for a whale to get a date these days.
Also, two beluga whales named Niko and Gaspar from a Mexico City amusement park. Jellyfish are always a hit. These ones are called lagoon jellies, because they live in bays and harbors and lagoons in the South Pacific. There are Japanese spider crabs. These are considered a delicacy by many, but these guys are just for watching, not for eating.
You might have to look closely to see the seahorses. They're masters of camouflage, which makes up for their poor swimming abilities. There are, of course, sea-somethings which are attached to rocks and coral -- yes, the sea anemones -- anemones. I -- you know, I don't get to aquariums much, other than Manhattan.
Now, a lot of people don't think of a reef as a living thing, but it is, apparently, very much alive. The one at the Georgia Aquarium is among the largest on display anywhere in the world.
There's also a kelp forest on display. And I will bet you, you haven't been to a kelp forest lately. Some kelp are actually known to grow almost a foot a day.
Another guys that grow almost a foot a day, CNN's Chad Myers. He's been getting an up-close look at the exhibit. He joins us live now from the Georgia Aquarium.
Chad, you're looking mighty tall.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Ali, did you -- did you not see "Finding Nemo."
VELSHI: I loved "Finding Nemo."
MYERS: It's the sea -- it's the anemone.
VELSHI: Anemones.
MYERS: Ane-ne-ne-ne-mone-mone-mone. VELSHI: That's what it is.
MYERS: Right. Exactly.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
MYERS: We are standing in front of what I call the big wall.
And everybody goes and, hey, no, no, no, it's the big window, over 60 feet wide. Look at this. I'm going to let you zoom all the way up to big whale sharks. They're not whales at all. In fact, they are sharks. And we get a little treat, the sawfish coming right on by us. But that's the biggest creature at this aquarium. And they're only juveniles.
In fact, they haven't even hit adolescence yet. They could grow to almost twice the size that you see now. You talked about the belugas, two males that were rescued from a park under a roller- coaster in Mexico, and three females brought in from New York City lately for a love connection there. We will have to see.
These guys aren't old enough here to even mate. But we are going to -- they are going to try to see if they can't breed some whale sharks in captivity -- so far, never been done before, but have never put 6.2 million gallons of behind a piece of acrylic either. That acrylic there, Ali, is 20 inches thick to keep the pressure from the water from blasting in here on all the people watching, including us.
VELSHI: Chad, what's the -- what's the advantage of something like this? What's -- what's the reason for it, other than being an attraction? You are mentioning the breeding, but what do they hope to get out of the world's biggest aquarium?
MYERS: Well, this is -- this is Bernie Marcus' brainchild.
And, if you don't know the name, people in Atlanta do. He was the co-founder of Home Depot. Home Depot's first store and many of its first stores were in Atlanta. Mr. Marcus, now a billionaire, spent $250 million of his own money to put this together. That wasn't enough. They got some sponsors to make more money. Then they and put this all together and donated it to Atlanta. This place opened today a debt-free nonprofit organization, 22 bucks for an adult, 17 bucks for a kid to get in, though, but all that money goes back to research and rescue.
VELSHI: Chad, good to see you. Thanks so much for joining us -- Chad Myers from what is now the world's biggest aquarium.
Well, can you believe it? A 25th storm has formed in the Atlantic. We're going to bring you an update from our hurricane headquarters when we come back.
Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PAULA ZAHN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): He's a four-time world champion and a 1984 Olympic gold medalist. With his signature backflips and big showmanship, Scott Hamilton put a new spin on men's figure skating.
Discouraged by the lack of commercial exposure for male professional skaters, he created his own touring company, which evolved into the wildly popular Stars on Ice. A competitor at heart, he continued winning titles, and, by 1990, was inducted in the U.S. Olympic Hall of Fame.
At the height of his career, Hamilton received devastating news. He was diagnosed with testicular cancer. His grueling two-year battle with cancer inspired both his nonprofit organizations, CARES, which promotes cancer research and education, and his autobiography, "Landing It: My Life on and Off the Ice." Now Hamilton lives in California with his wife, Tracie, and their son, Aidan.
But another challenge loomed. Last year, Hamilton learned he had a benign brain tumor. He remains undaunted as he undergoes treatment.
SCOTT HAMILTON, OLYMPIC GOLD MEDALIST: It's focused me spiritually. So, it's been an amazing experience and one that I probably wouldn't trade for anything in the world.
ZAHN: Anything that is but skating.
HAMILTON: Skating got me through my last cancer experience, with this tumor and these issues. I really feel like the only way for me to get back to my best health would be get back on the ice."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: All right.
There's only one week remaining in this record-breaking tropical storm season. And there's a new storm out there in the Atlantic.
Let's check in with meteorologist Bonnie Schneider at the Weather Center -- Bonnie.
SCHNEIDER: Yes, Ali, I didn't think we would have any more storms to talk about.
VELSHI: Yes, no kidding.
SCHNEIDER: But you're right. Within one last week, we have another one.
This is a tropical storm, and it's a powerful one. Let's take a look at Delta on the map. It's way out into the Atlantic, so our satellite pictures barely pick it up. It's actually closer to Portugal than it is to the United States. And if we look at the track for Delta, the good news is, this storm is going to be well, well away, thousands of miles, from the U.S. mainland, not affecting us at all.
But what is interesting to note, that even though the storm is still far way, it's a powerful one, with maximum winds at 60 miles per hour. And Delta could become a hurricane, possibly. We will be watching it closely.
VELSHI: Bonnie...
SCHNEIDER: Ali.
VELSHI: ... Schneider in Atlanta, thank you so much.
We are back on air at 7:00 p.m. Eastern here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
"LOU DOBBS TONIGHT" with Christine Romans starts right now.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Ali.
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