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The Situation Room
Grass Fires Rage In Oklahoma, Texas; Wet Weather In California; Schwarzenegger Under Fire From All Sides In California; Trent Lott Mulling Not Running For Re-election In Mississippi; Political Implications Of Iraqi Election Protests;
Aired December 27, 2005 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TOM FOREMAN, CNN ANCHOR: To our viewers, you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where new pictures and information from around the world are arriving all the time.
Happening right now, fire and rain out West, grasses blazing in Texas and Oklahoma, and another drenching forecast along the coast. Live updates are ahead on threatening winter weather.
Also this hour, Arnold Schwarzenegger gives the president competition. If you think Mr. Bush had a rough year, stop and think about the California governor's troubles in 2005.
And Jimmy Carter takes on the current occupant of the White House. The former president talks candidly with Wolf about the Iraq war and whether the Bush administration misled the nation.
I'm Tom Foreman. And you are in THE SITUATION ROOM. Wolf is off this week.
We want to show you these pictures just coming in right now to CNN. This is suburban Dallas, Texas, in East Arlington. And you can see neighborhoods on fire there -- unbelievable pictures -- rushing up around houses, around roads, into people's backyards.
Big winds blowing out there. These are blowing through dry grasses in Texas and in central Oklahoma, fanned by these gusting winds, threatening homes there and firefighters are on the job. We have a live camera in the fire zone.
On the West Coast, further away, residents are bracing once again as the weather pushes in there -- rain, high winds and even snow. We have live pictures from the Oregon coast; Seattle, Washington; and Marin County, California. We'll have all of that.
Our meteorologist Chad Myers is standing by in the CNN Weather Center with more on all of that. And CNN's Rusty Dornin is in Marin County tracking the storm.
But first, those Oklahoma grass fires.
Major Brian Stanaland of the Oklahoma City Fire Department is with us on the phone. Major, tell us what's going on right now, please. MAJ. BRIAN STANALAND, OKLAHOMA CITY FIRE DEPT.: Well, we've had around 10 different grass fires in the Oklahoma City metro area. We're literally swamped with grass fires right now. We're assisting the city of Mustang, which is in southwest Oklahoma City, with a large grass fire that spreads a couple of miles, and unfortunately did devour several homes in neighborhoods there. We've had one report of an injury there.
And then we've had about seven to eight other grass fires in Oklahoma City, as well. We've had two reports of injuries, one a child with some burns on his hands, and then one of our firefighters did suffer from some heat exhaustion.
We're starting to get a handle on these fires right now, but I'm telling you, it is extremely dry out here in Oklahoma City. We've got high winds, about 40 miles an hour, out here. Extremely dry, all the vegetation is dormant. And unfortunately, when that fire started, it just took off.
FOREMAN: Major, do you have any idea what caused these fires?
STANALAND: Really the only one that we know right now was kids playing with fireworks. Other than that, the other fires are under investigation at this point. It's really hard to say at this early hour.
FOREMAN: And Major, my understanding would be that a lot of these homeowners were really caught off guard because this moved so quickly.
STANALAND: It did move very quickly. We had to evacuate the neighborhoods to make sure that they were safe, to get everybody out of those neighborhoods. We were successful at that and, again, unfortunately we have one injury.
But, again, it moved just so rapidly. Things are so brutally dry out here that it's amazing. It was also amazing to see the video of what's going on in Texas. It looked almost identical what they're going through down there.
FOREMAN: Major Stanaland, thank you so much for your time.
We're going to move to those pictures in Texas, again, right now, and take a look at what's happening down there. East Arlington -- this is out in Tarrant County, outside of Dallas -- look at what's happening here. Fires exactly like they're talking about in Oklahoma, the wind moving so quickly. And let me tell you, out West, this time of year, it can be unbelievably dry.
Look at this. Whipping up in this backyard, getting under these fences, coming right under that fence -- look at that -- the wind blowing so hard it's crawling right underneath on that dry grass, very dry out West. This is surrounding a pool in a backyard there, working up to the backside of the house.
This is a highly, highly dangerous situation for those homes, let me tell you, because it doesn't take that much to get the home itself caught on fire.
Let's bring in our meteorologist and severe weather expert, Chad Myers. He's watching these fires and most importantly, Chad, these winds in Oklahoma and in Texas.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: And they're going to pick up as the afternoon goes on, Tom. I have winds now 20, 30 miles per hour here. And the amazing part about Doppler radar, it is so fine, the beam is so small, it can actually pick up the smoke.
There's a fire very close to Seminole in Oklahoma. The one that was in Oklahoma City was out here near Mustang, not that far from the airport near Will Rogers. Most of that area there, that has almost dried up when it comes to the rain or the signature on the radar because of the smoke.
But another very large fire down near Pauls Valley, that down across -- just blowing across the I-35 right now. And as soon as I get a chance, I'll run over and put the Dallas radar in there. We'll be able to see where the Arlington fire is right to the pinpoint neighborhood of where that fire is burning at this point.
The grass you see here -- people in the Northeast are saying how does grass catch on fire? It's green. No, these are late season grasses. They turn brown, they go dormant. And, in fact, some people actually burn them on purpose in a controlled situation, not when winds are blowing at 30 to 35 miles per hour. And the grass catches on fire, all the shrubs catch on fire. You can see it right there.
And when you get so many hot spots, it overwhelms the firefighting units. They just don't have enough people to come up with that many fires. At one time in Oklahoma in that Mustang fire, Tom, I was counting 12 buildings -- 12 homes -- on fire all at the same time. You can't keep up with that. They were totally engulfed.
FOREMAN: Chad, you've raised a very good point here. One of the things people may also not realize about a lot of the western plants, if you haven't lived out there, many of these bushes that are gathered in areas like this actually are western bushes that contain oils which make them highly -- not -- explosive is not quite the word ...
MYERS: Almost.
FOREMAN: ... but they light up very quickly, especially this time of year.
MYERS: Yes, those cedar trees -- boy, they really go up very quickly and they're really fuel to the fire itself, so we're going to keep watching the situation -- a dangerous situation for anyone downwind of the fire.
If you're upwind, it's not so bad. But I'll tell you what. I have been through many of these fires when I lived in Oklahoma City and it's dangerous for the homeowners. You just -- you almost -- you want to stay there and protect your home, but when it gets too close, you need to evacuate to protect yourself. FOREMAN: And this really is a fire season out west in some ways. It's not the normal summer fire season but winter because of the dryness.
MYERS: Right, because it gets so dry in the winter. And I've been all the way -- the biggest fire that I ever experienced was actually in the middle of February on the way down from Oklahoma City to Austin. Closed the interstate for hours on end because you couldn't literally see across the road. You couldn't see down the road at all.
And as we did get through, as the smoke went away, we found about 12 cars completely involved in that fire itself. Everybody was OK, but that's what you have to be careful about. Obviously, cars catch on fire very easily compared to homes that have good, steel, strong roofs or whatever it might be. But the asbestos roof or the asphalt roof and also the cedar shakes on some these more expensive homes down there -- boy, they can go up so quickly. You don't even -- you can't even catch it.
FOREMAN: Stand by, Chad. We're going to get back to you in just a moment. I want to go back to these pictures in Texas and look at this a little bit more. Look at the speed at which this fire is moving. You don't often get to see this on videotape. You can actually watch it skipping through this neighborhood that quickly.
Look at the wind up above. You see how fast those clouds are moving? That's a measure of what they're dealing with on the ground, and you can tell just by looking at this that these neighborhoods have been caught quite off guard.
Firefighters are trying to move quickly, just as they are in Oklahoma where it's a big problem right now. They're trying to get it under control there. And as we were told a little while ago by the mayor there, the authorities, very difficult to get under control.
Moving more toward populated areas -- these appear to be some sort of apartment buildings, this sort of thing. This part of East Arlington would be one of the areas where you have a lot of suburban growth around Dallas, a lot of people living in fairly dense populations.
But look at this -- all of that brush in there, all of those trees, this time of year with a fire like that, every firefighter will tell you that is all fuel just waiting to go because it can be very, very dry out west at this time of year. And that's a big issue out there. We're going to keep on this fire and tell you more about it as we can check on it.
But right now, we want to go further out west to check on a winter storm watch which is helping to drive all this wind in some ways, on the West Coast.
CNN's Rusty Dornin is with us from Marin County, California. Rusty, I guess the issue there is not going to be so much the dryness but the wetness. RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We've been waterlogged, Tom, for about the past week. We've had these series of storms coming and going with a day or two break in between. Right now it's a little calm. It's wet, but the winds have not picked up. But we are expecting storms to come through -- three to five storms in the next few days, bringing lots of gusty winds.
Show you the Golden Gate Bridge and the water. We're also expecting some very high waves, big swells supposed to come in tonight and Wednesday morning. They're expecting waves anywhere from 21 to 25 feet. Of course, the local surfers love that, but it does pose a danger for people this time of year who are coming out just to look at the ocean. People have been swept away along Ocean Beach and Baker Beach, which is what we're showing you right now.
Up in the Sierra, yesterday, there was a lot of snow. Today, they're going to be getting a lot more. The snow levels are going to be dropping to about 5,000 feet. But it's a very wet snow because this series of storms are very warm. Down here, it's about 50, 60 degrees. Up in the Sierra, it makes the snow very wet. And it causes the river, Sacramento and American Rivers, apparently, have surged 10 to 20 feet. Now, the Army Corps of Engineers right now is saying it's OK, we don't have to worry about flood yet. But certainly, that can pose a problem.
Also in this local area, with the bay, you have to deal with the tidal situation and the high tides. You get a lot of springs running out of these hills from the heavy rains, combined with high tides, we have a lot of flooding, a lot of traffic problems.
In my own hometown often, it's hard to get out of town because the flooding from the bay matches the flooding from the gullies. And they close off a lot of the streets and there's only one way out of town. And you've got 30,000 people trying to get out of town one way.
FOREMAN: And oddly enough, Rusty, there's that relationship when you have a big fire in the summertime and it burns away the vegetation, more mudslides, more runoff, more erosion when the big rains come.
DORNIN: Sure. And you're going -- we can expect that. Of course, in these areas, even in the bay area, we have a lot of areas mudslide. You never know where they're going to crop up. But of course they do crop up, as you said, in areas where there have been fires recently. And the hillsides are denuded of vegetation.
FOREMAN: All right, thank you very much, Rusty. We'll be checking back in with you a little bit later, too.
I want to go back down to East Arlington right now, outside of Dallas. Look at these pictures. We have another structure, this is moving in among some swing sets and this sort of thing. Look at the ferocity of this fire, how quickly it's moving. You can see the wind inside there. There's something you have to know about fires like this that are easy to overlook. And you can see it very well illustrated here. When a big fire starts moving quickly in a wind pattern like this, it also starts creating its own localized weather in very small amounts, in some ways. And if it spreads out bigger, you'll get a bigger weather pattern created by the fire itself. It's very localized, but it helps make those flames whip around a great deal.
Chad is going to come back in now, our meteorologist. Chad, let me ask you something about this. What is the relationship between what Rusty is seeing out on the coast and what we're seeing in Oklahoma and Texas right now?
MYERS: In fact, what Rusty saw two days ago is what's making the weather in Oklahoma now. The storm that came through put down 30 inches of snow, Tom, at Kirkwood. Mammoth Mountain, that's like 160- inch snow base already, not even the new year yet.
But the storm went up and over the Rockies and now it's redeveloping in the Plains. And the wind from the jet stream is translating down to the ground and making all of this wind in Arlington, in Oklahoma City, Mustang, Edmond, Pauls Valley, all those other areas that we showed you, where there were fires going at this point.
And the winds will not calm down until after sunset. And sunset is the key place for the fires and the wind because right now, the air is going up and down because of the sun. The sun warms the ground, making air bubbles going up and down. Those bubbles go up into the winds aloft. They are higher than -- it could be 80, 90 miles per hour up there.
That wind gives it a little -- that air particle -- parcel, just maybe it's the size of a basketball. It gives it a little push; that push then translates down to the ground. And the winds get gusty during the day. Well at night, the air stops going up and down. So the winds don't get pushed by those heavier winds aloft.
You decouple the atmosphere. The winds settle down at the surface. But yet, the jet stream keeps going at 20,000, 30,000, 40,000 feet. So sunset will be key to getting a handle on these fires. We won't get any relief from the wind until then.
FOREMAN: And take a look at this, in Tarrant County, Texas, right now, it's 3:13 p.m. there. So we still have two, three hours of warm day left, or as warm as you're going to get this time of year, to drive all of this before you get into nightfall.
And we're not going to have -- one of the things that helps with fire is a little bit of dew, a little bit of dampness overnight. They're not going to have any of that in these neighborhoods as this evening goes on, because it's too dry out West this time of year.
But look again at these pictures. This is moving into clearly one of the subdivisions out there, where houses are all pretty much on top of each other. That's the way subdivisions are built out West. Many times homes are built fairly close together in western neighborhoods, because of dryness.
The simple truth is, supporting a lawn in the West takes a lot of water. So many subdivisions are built fairly close together so that people don't have to support a lot of lawn with a lot of water. Chad has a few more thoughts what's happening out here.
MYERS: The temperature right now in Dallas, 81 degrees. The relative humidity is eight percent. So there's not a chance of any dew like you were talking about there. The air is so dry down there, it is ripping out of the mountains. We call that a dry line or a dry air slot that comes out of the mountains, it rolls down, warms up. And obviously 81, well above where you should be in Dallas, Texas, this day.
FOREMAN: This is almost like a summer temperature, not the 100 degrees that they can get, but this is a cool summer day.
MYERS: It is a cool summer day except in the summer, your relative humidity is 65 or 70 percent right now, not the 8 percent because the wind comes from a different direction.
When the wind or the air comes from the Gulf of Mexico, Dallas, and well, Houston, very muggy places. But when the air comes out of the mountains, it's almost like living in New Mexico, or Taos, anywhere out -- Amarillo, one of the dryer spots in the entire country. And that's the wind -- that's the air they have now. They have mountain dry air, not the Gulf moist air like the firefighters would like.
FOREMAN: Well, Chad, we're obviously going to be getting back to you with a little bit more on this.
I want to turn now to our Internet reporter, Jacki Schechner, who has some more information on what's happening out there. Jacki?
JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Well, Tom, we like to give you an idea of where you can go for yourself online to get some information about the wildfire conditions in your area.
And NOAA is a good example, where they have these intricate maps online that tell you where the red flag warnings are. You can see the red sections on the map there, and those are where the conditions are unfortunately ideal for the spreads of these kinds of wildfires. We're going to keep checking in on this and some other sites we know about as the program progresses, and give you an idea of where you can go on your computer and take a look at your particular area.
Tom.
FOREMAN: So this is what we're watching right now. Thank you, Jacki.
This is outside of Dallas, Texas, in East Arlington. Look at these fires, whipping through here. This is really a rather explosive situation here and in Oklahoma. It has just come up, these grass fires driven by fierce winds, 40 mile-an-hour, whipping through the neighborhoods.
Clearly there have been some homes that are being affected, some -- obviously fences and yard structures. The homes themselves, we have no idea yet how many are involved. We will find that out for you and we'll be staying on this story and keeping you up to date with all these pictures, as we go on. A terrible situation out West right now, and big, big storms coming in to keep driving them.
Coming up, right here. As 2005, draws to a close, is it good to be Arnold Schwarzenegger out in California? We'll look back at the governor's action-packed year, for better and more often, for worse.
Also ahead, one Republican's impending reelection decision and how it could trigger big problems for his party in the Senate.
And later, what should high school students be taught about the Clinton impeachment saga, the full story or a censored version? We can't wait to hear what James Carville has to say about that.
You are in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOREMAN: Take a look at this, big fires in East Arlington, Texas, driven by 40 mile-an-hour winds, whipping through the suburbs of Dallas, and really doing a lot of damage fast. This is a developing situation that we have been following here ever since we started the show. You can see it moving through these subdivisions among all of these houses here and moving very rapidly.
One thing you do not see in many of these pictures is a whole lot of fire activity, apparently because this fire is moving so quickly, they're having a difficult time getting around it and trying to hem it up with that kind of wind. We'll be staying on top of that.
A red flag warning is in effect for all of North Texas. What that means is that fire conditions are extremely high for this time of year. With winds blowing hard, a lot of dry grass, there's no burning allowed outside of any sort. Yet these fires have broken out here. A big problem, we'll be bringing you up to date on that.
President Bush is holed up at his ranch in Texas today. He's clearing brush, probably a good idea under the circumstances, reading books, and no doubt enjoying down time after a very tumultuous year in Washington. In California, another top Republican also may be eager for 2005 to be over.
Our senior political analyst, Bill Schneider, is in Los Angeles with that story. Bill?
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: President Bush certainly has had a rough year. But if misery loves company, he might want to spend time out here in California to commiserate with Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER (voice-over): Think President Bush had problems this year? So did his fellow Republican, California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger. Bush is saddled with an increasingly unpopular war. Schwarzenegger, who got elected in 2003 as a centrist, also declared war -- on labor unions, special interests, and the Democratic legislature in California. Schwarzenegger's enemies fought back.
ROSE ANN DEMORO, CALIFORNIA NURSES ASSOCIATION: Teachers join, firefighters join, the police join when Arnold attacked them.
SCHNEIDER: They handed the governor a blistering defeat in last month's special election.
GOV. ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER, (R) CALIFORNIA: I should have also listened to my wife, who said to me, don't do this.
SCHNEIDER: Now the governor is trying to move back to the center. He appointed the former executive director of the state Democratic party as his chief of staff. He's trying to make peace with the unions.
SCHWARZENEGGER: I also will get together and contact all the union leaders, and let them know that I want to work with them and that I'm not anti-union.
SCHNEIDER: He's reaching out to Democrats by supporting major new public works spending on...
SCHWARZENEGGER: Infrastructure that we need, the growing population, the challenges of building more classrooms, more schools and more highways and freeways and so on.
SCHNEIDER: Now the governor's got problems with his fellow Republicans who don't like the new spending or the outreach to Democrats. Unlike Bush, Schwarzenegger is facing reelection next year. As of late October, the majority of California voters said they were not inclined to reelect him.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: The center is usually a fine place to be politically unless you discover that both sides don't trust you, in which case the center can get pretty lonely.
FOREMAN: Well, Bill, who would they trust more? Is it clear who's going to run against him?
SCHNEIDER: There are two, two Democrats competing for the Democratic nomination. A lot of people thought celebrities like Rob Reiner or Warren Beatty might run. But they say no, they're not going to run.
Who have they got? State Treasurer Phil Angelides, State Controller Steve Westly -- ever hear of those guys? No, most Californians haven't either.
Are they going to elect someone who's largely unknown over an outsized personality like Arnold Schwarzenegger? You know what, California has a history of electing, well, shall we say boring white men. George Deukmejian was elected twice. Pete Wilson was elected governor twice. Gray Davis was elected twice. So yes.
FOREMAN: We'll have to see what happens. Bill Schneider, thank you very much.
Governor Schwarzenegger's attempt to cut ties with his Austrian hometown is now spilling over from the real world into the virtual realm.
Our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner has that story.
SCHECHNER: Tom, let me give you background. What happened was the Austrian hometown of Graz was not happy with Arnold Schwarzenegger and his refusal to commune the death penalty sentence of Stanley Tookie Williams. They voted to take his name off of the stadium there.
Schwarzenegger then wrote a letter to his hometown and said, basically, you're not going to be happy with anything I do in the future, why don't you just remove me from all of your materials altogether?
What they did is took him off the Web site.
Now, we went and took a look at their city Web site, Stadt Graz (ph). It is in German, and I don't speak that language, particularly, but there were no references to Arnold Schwarzenegger. We looked at old Web site pages. There weren't any references to him necessarily either.
But if you click through to the one English-language button on the Web site takes you through to a tourism page. There are in fact references to Arnold Schwarzenegger there. There's a whole page under the frequently asked questions interesting facts section, talks about how his mother was famous for strudel and how he was a citizen of honor since 1999. It also links to his official page which is aptly named schwarzenegger.com.
FOREMAN: You know my mother's famous for strudel too, Jacki?
We're following a very serious situation out in Texas right now, and Oklahoma also. They have the same thing going on there. Big fires being driven by big winds -- just sprang up here -- 40-mile-an-hour winds pushing fires through all of these dry grasses and vegetation. And it's hot down in Texas, making it even worse. We're going to be staying on top of this story throughout the show. Stay with us.
Still ahead, why are some Iraqis protesting early election results? We'll have the latest from Iraq. And new anger and evidence of torture.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOREMAN: Down in Texas, and out in Oklahoma, we're following wildfires which have cut loose on this winter's day out there, driven by very strong winds and very dry grasses.
We're going to be keeping up with those fires and showing you what happens with them. They're quite bad right now. Clearly in some residential neighborhoods, people are trying to fight them with hoses. Fire departments are out there trying to respond. As you can see they're spread out over quite large areas. With the winds blowing as they are, they're moving quickly. We'll stay on top of that story.
On to politics. In these final days of the year, Senator Trent Lott has a big decision to make. Will the Mississippi Republican run for reelection? Republican Party Chairman Ken Mehlman reportedly pleaded with Lott last week to go for another term. Why is he so worried?
Let's bring in our national correspondent, Bob Franken. Bob, how important is this for Republicans?
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's important because Mississippi has been considered for quite some time now a safe Republican seat. But the Democrats are putting up some strong candidates. And if Trent Lott decided not to run -- he's had a terrible year, of course, in Hurricane Katrina he lost the family home, that type of thing. And if he would not run, the Republicans are quite concerned that in a year where there's suddenly pressure on the party, pressure that has gone in the wake of President Bush and some decline in the ratings, if Trent Lott would decide not to run, Mississippi could be in jeopardy for the party.
FOREMAN: Clearly, Senator Lott was not happy in many ways with some of the response from Washington, from his own party, after Katrina happened. Now there's pressure from the party saying, we need your help. Is that going to work?
FRANKEN: It's going to be an interesting question because it is well-known that Senator Lott, who lost his position as majority leader, believes that the White House helped to shove him out. So the question is, will pressure from the party and presumably implicitly from the White House, will that help or hurt in his decision to decide whether he's going to run?
FOREMAN: Any indication at all from the Lott camp about how they feel about that?
FRANKEN: Silence at the moment.
FOREMAN: Silence at the moment. Well, I guess that's how it goes in politics. Thank you, Bob Franken, on that update.
Up next, what's fair game for classroom lessons about the Clinton era? I'll ask Clintonista James Carville about that in our "Strategy Session."
And gay marriage and the "Culture Wars". An end of year snapshot of what we can expect in 2006. This story is not over.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOREMAN: Waves of smoke and flame now pouring across some apartment buildings in East Arlington, Texas, outside of Dallas. Part of these wildfires out west that we're following that have just sprung up this afternoon quite unexpectedly with the winds running all across the west out there.
This is happening in Texas, it's also happening in Oklahoma that we know of at the moment. Some homes have been lost already in Oklahoma, as we're told. We're not sure in Texas yet. We're trying to find out what's happening with that.
But we have been listening to a man on board one of the helicopters flying over this area who may have a better idea. His name is Scott Wallace with one of our fine CNN affiliates, KDFW. Let's take a listen to what Scott Wallace had to say a few moments ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT WALLACE, KDFW CORRESPONDENT: Gotten some of these homes caught on fire here. We're just south of Sublet Road (ph), just west of 287, and we can see firefighters from several agencies down here, police officers and homeowners all out here with hoses trying to save their property. A lot of fences on fire right now.
And it has actually gotten on to a couple of these homes in this area -- some outbuildings, ranch buildings and things like that. They're fighting the very gusty winds, gusting up to about 30 miles an hour out of the west and the southwest right now. You can just see flames everywhere.
And the firefighters have their hands far enough away, and we are not upwind of the fire. So there's no danger of us making it any worse than it already is. But there's plenty of surface wind on the ground. And as you can see, it is burning into this neighborhood. And firefighters have had to make their stands all over this neighborhood to try to just beat down the flames with whatever they have. Sometimes they use water, sometimes they use sacks and shovels and things like that, just whatever they have at their disposal. Whatever tool that they can get their hands on they're using to try to fight this. It's a very desperate fight at this time.
But these winds are what's really causing the problems. Very dry conditions. We haven't had much rain lately. And then with these high winds and high grass and brush in this neighborhood right here, it's causing this to stay out of control at this time.
Heather?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOREMAN: Well, you can see the fires. That was Scott Wallace from KDFW up on a helicopter flying around there. You can see what the wind is doing, exactly as he said, pushing it through the neighborhoods. Quickly and clearly jumping all around, which makes it a highly dangerous situation and a very difficult one.
Our meteorologist Chad Myers steps in to explain about what is driving all of this, Chad? MYERS: Tom, the air is mixing with a big jet stream aloft, and we're getting gusty winds in the afternoon, but the sparks now flying everywhere. And trust me, there is not a cloud in the sky over Texas, yet we have returns on the radar. That's the smoke that the Doppler radar is actually seeing.
There's one fire there. Here's Dallas right there. Here's Fort Worth, another fire south of Texas, south of Fort Worth. There's one right there. That's the one through Arlington. And look at the other ones, Granbury, a couple others out the I-20, a little bit farther down to the south. These are popping up all over Texas now, and they're being sparked by, well, just a number of things. I mean, you could go drive your car with the catalytic converter at almost 1,000 degrees. If you drive your pickup or car onto the lawn or onto a bush and just park it there, you can actually get fire.
FOREMAN: Chad, let me interrupt you for one moment here. We're going to jump in and listen to Scott Wallace again in the KDFW helicopter.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: So they may have to call in some aircraft to finally get this one out, here. We'll keep an eye on it for you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOREMAN: Well, we just got the end of it, there. We got a sense of them saying they may have to call in aircraft to do this. Not an easy thing to do either with the weather conditions you're talking about.
MYERS: Humidity, Tom, it's 8 percent. So as these firefighters are blowing water onto these flames, if you're not putting it right down on the fire itself -- like this one's getting pointed up in the air because the firefighter can't get to where the fire is. There's a structure in the way. By the time that air gets there -- the water gets there, half of it's already evaporated.
And so this is going to be a difficult situation all night long, all day long here, obviously. When the winds die off somewhere around 8:00 or 9:00 tonight after sunset, it'll get a lot easier. But the number -- I've been watching the satellite. I know you've been doing your job, and I've been watching satellites. The numbers of fires now just in this one neighborhood must be over 30, just popping up one at a -- but so far, not one structure fire. It's all been just the wild land, the grasses and the shrubs and the cedars and all the -- anything else that burns. I haven't even seen one car on fire yet.
FOREMAN: These are pictures now, Chad, from WFAA down there. You can see pictures of an apartment complex off to one side there a moment ago. They've moved out this way.
Maybe one of the advantages here with the speed of this fire if it stays in these low grasses is that it may flash through some areas and not do so much damage. But clearly, when it starts getting on top of these buildings, as we were told a moment ago from someone in a helicopter there, it makes a big difference.
On the phone now, we want to go to Traci Weaver from the Texas Forest Service. They're obviously watching this very closely. Traci, can you give us an idea of what's happening here, and how fast this has been developing?
TRACI WEAVER, TEXAS FOREST SERVICE: Basically, we have fires all over Texas right now. But here in Wise County, where I'm at, we were leaving one fire from yesterday and two more smokes came up and grew large in a hurry. The wind is so strong that these fires were getting to be 50 to 100 acres in just minutes.
FOREMAN: Traci, in my experience when forest service people and firefighters, wild land firefighters, encounter fires like this with the wind blowing like this, all you can really try to do is head them off a bit and keep them from going into the worst areas. You can't really try to put them out at this point, can you?
WEAVER: Not really. We just kind of try and herd them away from structures and try to do our best to protect homes and businesses. These two fires are both very close to town, so there's businesses around -- close to Boyd, Texas. So they're just trying to protect the structures and get the head knocked down when they can. But we're seeing flame lengths that are just incredible, and you can't put a firefighter right in front of those.
FOREMAN: Explain just what you mean by flame length.
WEAVER: Excuse me?
FOREMAN: Explain to us, if you could, what you mean by flame lengths. What are you talking about, and how big?
WEAVER: How tall the flames are getting. You know, we're seeing 30, 40 foot flame lengths off of grass, which is way too...
FOREMAN: Off of grass alone?
WEAVER: Yes. It's way too tall to put a fire truck and a firefighter in front of. And fortunately, we have a lot of resources. The volunteer fire departments here are fantastic. Their mutual aid is really working well with fire departments from other counties coming to help. But this is just two of many of the fires we're on right now.
FOREMAN: All right, thank you very much, Traci Weaver from the Texas Forest Services. Good luck with that down there. I know it's a huge, huge challenge that's not going to end at sundown, I don't think.
Jacki Schechner is watching online on the Internet to see what's going on. Jacki, what's the latest over there?
SCHECHNER: Tom, we wanted to dig a little deeper into the NOAA Web site. We showed you that they have a specific area for the southern Plains region. And you can take a closer look at that perfect storm of unfortunate conditions that Chad was talking about. You can roll your mouse over it.
Take a look at how the temperature moves throughout the day. The numbers are probably a little small on your screen, but you can even see just by the color demarcations how the temperature is getting higher. And then you can take a look at the wind speed and how that picks up over the course of the day. Starts at 7:00 a.m., goes all the way until just about now. And you can also see the relative humidity and how that progresses throughout the day. Unfortunately, that dropping, making for those wildfire conditions.
We've also got pages for Norman, Oklahoma, that area. We're going to take a closer look at those and show you what those warning sites look like, as well.
Tom.
FOREMAN: Thank you very much, Jacki. So we still have a couple more hours until the sun even goes down there, so we'll be staying right with this.
Coming up here now, though, some Iraqis are angry over the outcome of their election. Are protests the precursor to civil war? Join us for our "Strategy Session" next.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
And in our 7:00 hour, a key player in the controversy blamed for Dan Rather's demise at CBS. Wolf sits down with former CBS producer Mary Mapes. Don't miss it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOREMAN: Turning away from the western fires for just a bit, in today's "Strategy Session," more than 3,000 protestors taking to the streets of Baghdad to contest preliminary election results. Now, is this a sign that the country is headed toward greater unrest, or just working toward democracy? Is there a real fear of civil war there?
Plus, what should your children be learning about Bill Clinton in their history books? Should impeachment be the focus or the footnote? Joining us today, our CNN political analyst and Democratic strategist James Carville, and Republican strategist Cheri Jacobus. Thanks for joining us, both of you.
Let's talk about Iraq first. Elections have happened. James, better off, worse off?
JAMES CARVILLE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, we're trying to force a country to be a country that obviously doesn't want to be a country. And the voting showed that. It was almost 100 percent on sort of what sector -- either Shia or Sunni or you're Kurd or Arab. And we're going to have to figure a way.
I think it's just going to come to -- we're either going to have to partition the country and figure out a way to get out of there because right now, we're in the position of offering our support to a theocracy aligned with Iran, which doesn't seem a very tenable position to be in over a period of time.
Hopefully, the ambassador can cobble together -- help them cobble together some unity government for a short period of time and give us a chance to get out.
FOREMAN: The Sunnis, who have been the big stumbling block in this, participated a lot more this time, though. I'm guessing, Cheri, that you're going to say that that's a good thing.
CHERI JACOBUS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think it's a very good thing. I think it exceeded expectations. And I would say just the opposite of what James thinks. I think that the Iraqis, all the Iraqis, want democracy. They want it bad. Otherwise, they wouldn't have bothered to go out, they wouldn't have purple fingers, they wouldn't be protesting.
They have something now, as hard as it is, and what they're going through is very difficult. They have something now they didn't have a chance to have under Saddam Hussein. I think they want it bad. You've got people on opposite ends of the political spectrum that are coming together to try and figure out a way to cobble together a government that works.
FOREMAN: I want you to both listen to something from Sajjan Gohel, the terrorism expert with the Asia-Pacific Foundation. He said something about what he thought might happen in this region. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SAJJAN GOHEL, ASIA-PACIFIC FOUNDATION: There are very much prospects for the potential of civil and ethnic conflict developing in Iraq because of the fact that the country is a mesh of different ethnic groups with very different agendas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOREMAN: Cheri, let me ask you this. Let's say -- the Sunnis came out and participated more. Maybe there are a lot of people who want a unified country. The fact is, it only takes so many from each group to not want it to create civil unrest, to create civil war.
JACOBUS: I think what we're seeing now are sort of the labor pains of the birth of a democracy. And if people want it to be easy or pretty, there's no guarantee of that. Yes, you have the insurgents, you have some people that are still fighting it. There are also reports that some of the Sunni-Arab insurgents are trying to be a part of it. They want to put down their arms, and they want to join the democracy. That's incredible news.
So while it is difficult, the news coming out of that region is incredible. And I think it's only a matter of time before even people like James have to admit that democracy is a good thing wherever it is.
(CROSSTALK) CARVILLE: Let me make a distinction here. They want a democracy, they just don't want a country. And right now, the United States is in the almost embarrassing position of having to support a theocracy whose closest relation is with Iran. And the point is, is that they went -- they all voted, and they for themselves. They didn't vote for an Iraq. And we have to figure out a way to help them cobble something together and partition the country and get our people out of there because they don't want to be a country.
FOREMAN: Is there a way, though, that these different camps can come together for, first of all, the safety and the success of American troops over there, secondly, for the safety and success of that society?
JACOBUS: I think certainly they can, and I think we see that happening. And as long as you have the Sunnis involved in the elections, as long as you have Sunni commanders on the ground with the Iraqi army, as long as you have Sunnis completely involved in this, I think that we will not have a civil war. And I think that that's...
CARVILLE: I hope not.
(CROSSTALK)
FOREMAN: Let's talk about a history that has been made. Bill Clinton showing up in history books for high school students, many of which were totally unaware when he went through the events he went through. What should be in it?
CARVILLE: History. I mean, it's just like you ought to teach...
FOREMAN: The impeachment first?
CARVILLE: Well, I don't know first. But first, it should be -- just like you teach evolution because that's what scientists do. I'm part of the...
FOREMAN: You know, you're starting a whole new fight, here. We're not getting into evolution.
JACOBUS: I think that's the point. I think that's what he's trying to do.
CARVILLE: What I'm saying is that I'm part of the fact-based community, all right? And you don't -- a high school history book -- certainly that the American people never supported this, that 70 percent approval rating at the height of it, that it was some kind of a craze thing by a bunch of nutty right wingers that never caught hold in the country. All of that should be in there.
JACOBUS: This is revisionist history, now.
CARVILLE: I'm part of the fact-based community. I don't believe -- I believe you should teach children history.
FOREMAN: Cheri? JACOBUS: The reason these kids that are reading about it now -- I'm sure in a very awkward situation in the classroom -- the reason they didn't know about it before is because it was so awkward in every American home. The parents didn't know how to explain this to their kids. Now, teachers have to go through the same thing where they don't know how to explain it to their kids. Bill Clinton, the gift that keeps on giving.
CARVILLE: Let me tell you, right now if the election were between Bill Clinton and George W. Bush, Bill Clinton would win by 15 points. This country -- impeachment, no impeachment, history books or no history books, that's fact. And you know what? We ought to teach kids facts. And just like these nutty creationists and all these people, they ought get out of the classroom.
FOREMAN: If we could only agree on what the facts are.
JACOBUS: And I don't think we should teach them revisionist history, and I think that's what James is engaged in right now.
(CROSSTALK)
FOREMAN: Thank you both for being here. We have our own wildfire in the studio, now.
Up next, more on Texas ablaze right now -- wildfires erupting all over the Lone Star state. It's unbelievable this afternoon. We continue to monitor efforts to get them under control.
And in our 7:00 p.m. Eastern hour, learning to live under the shadow of terrorism. CNN's Kelli Arena continues her remarkable series on extreme security. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOREMAN: As you can see, we are having a picture-perfect, beautiful sunset here in Washington, D.C., but across the nation out West, not so good. They're waiting for sunset there and for temperatures to drop. These are fires in Texas right now, East Arlington outside of Dallas. Look at that. That is a house completely gutted by the fire, another one being wiped out right next to it.
These brush fires came up very suddenly, and they have spread throughout that area. We're following this story closely.
Right now, we want to listen a moment to Scott Wallace from KDFW. He's in a helicopter over the fire as he gives us a little more description of what's happening on the ground there this afternoon.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: As long as these winds stay gusty and there's some kind of ignition source, either a spark from a train going by or a carelessly thrown cigarette or people burning trash or whatever, then we're going to see this continue to happen. Low humidity, gusty winds, dry conditions, and that's a disaster formula. (END VIDEO CLIP)
FOREMAN: Well, look at these pictures from KDFW. We're losing there a little bit because it's difficult to stay settled down over fires like this. You get a lot of dust coming up at the helicopter. But moments ago, you saw their homes that were completely gutted by these fires. This is happening in Texas in a big way right now.
You see it rushing up on WFAA's pictures here behind some other homes. Another home with it going through the trees and up into the house. You see the smoke coming out the eves, there. That means the fire is deeply into the homes. This is unbelievable what's happening out there. We'll have much more on all of this at 5:00.
We do have, of course, many other stories going on.
Zain Verjee is off this week, and Kimberly Osias is joining us now with a closer look at all the other stories that are making news in the midst of this very fiery afternoon in Texas. Kimberly?
KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Tom, let's actually start in Iraq. The preliminary results of the December 15 election are meeting with protests in two cities. Hundreds of students demonstrated today in Baqubah. Up to 3,000 took to the streets of Baghdad. The demonstrators are protesting what looks like a government that will be headed by religious Shias. Iraq's electoral commission says the Shia United Alliance has posted a strong lead there. The group that organized the Baghdad protest is calling for a revote.
And about 50 miles south of Baghdad, a grim discovery for construction workers there. Crews laying a pipeline in Karbala found a mass grave containing the skeletal remains of at least 20 people. They're believed to be the bodies of people killed by Saddam Hussein's security forces during a 1991 Shiite uprising. Roughly 300 possible mass graves have been reported since Saddam's fall in April of 2003.
And certainly a very sad day for Indianapolis head coach Tony Dungy. Dungy's entire team and NFL stars and officials were among the hundreds of mourners at the funeral for his son today in suburban Tampa, Florida. Later, a tearful Dungy called his son a good young man, praised his players as role models, and thanked supporters for standing by his family. Eighteen-year-old James Dungy died last week, an apparent suicide.
Tom, back to you in THE SITUATION ROOM.
FOREMAN: Thank you so much, Kimberly.
Up next, we've got several live pictures of winter fires in Texas coming into THE SITUATION ROOM. We'll be bringing those up to you. We'll get a live update in a minute, too.
And in today's "Culture Wars" segment, gay marriage in 2006. A state-by-state look at the legal and political battles that are looming around this issue. You don't want to miss it. Stay put.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOREMAN: Look for 2006 to be another busy year in the "Culture Wars" over gay marriage. At least 16 states appear likely to have some kind of legal or political battle over same-sex unions in the months ahead -- 16. Activists on both sides of this debate have been engaged in more than two years of heated and high-profile face-offs even since the Massachusetts Supreme Court ordered that state to marry gay couples up there.
Here's a rundown of what's ahead based on a variety of reports. Gay couples in seven states have filed lawsuits aimed at legalizing same-sex marriage from New York and New Jersey in the east to Washington State and California in the west.
Californians battled over same-sex marriage this year when Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger vetoed a gay marriage law which was approved by the state legislature. California is also one of 10 states where gay marriage bans either will be or may be on the ballot next year, or are likely to be approved by state legislatures.
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