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Bush Favorable Rating Hits All-Time Low; Raging Fires Blaze in Eastern Oklahoma; Some States Require Drivers to Speak English; 9/11 Loans Didn't Go to Firms Hurt by Attacks; Presidential Portraits in New Book

Aired December 29, 2005 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, a political popularity contest. It's the president versus his wife, Democrats versus Republicans and other big names and surprises in our brand new poll.
Also this hour, the western grasslands smoking and charred. It's 3:00 p.m. in Oklahoma and Texas, where dry, windy weather is fanning new flames and adding to the danger for new fires.

And a new drive to speak English only: Should you need to know the language to get a license? It's 3:00 p.m. in Alabama where this question is before the court, and a leading figure in the culture wars is taking sides.

I'm Ali Velshi. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Wolf is off this week.

First up, emergency crews in eastern Oklahoma are battling two new large grass fires this hour. Hundreds of acres are involved in the latest blazes. The weather is sunny and windy, and that makes it ripe for these fires to spread fast.

Let's take a look at these live pictures now of a Chinook helicopter, which is picking up water from a nearby lake, dropping it on those areas that are catching fire. This is one of the helicopters that have been sent to the area. Cattle, horses are fleeing the area.

This is Oklahoma County. Oklahoma City is part of Oklahoma County. We understand that these fires are to the east. These are the pictures from earlier of cattle. And, behind them, you can see the smoke of the area.

This is an area that is north - well, north of those fires we've been following in Texas. That whole area is charred and has been suffering a drought. We are seeing these cattle and these horses.

Now, we understand that they are trying to put these fires out with helicopters like the Chinook that we just had live pictures of -- picking up water, dumping it on these areas. We know that people in the affected areas in Oklahoma and Texas have been trying to do what they can to protect their homes, protect their crops.

But this continues to be a serious, serious issue in these affected areas. These grass fires in Oklahoma have left one person dead, dozens of homes destroyed and nearly 30,000 acres charred.

Let's go to our severe weather expert, Chad Myers. He's been following these weather developments in Texas and in Oklahoma for the latest on what's happening.

Chad, what's going on?

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Ali, the winds are about 15- 20 miles per hour. Out in (inaudible) in Clinton, Oklahoma, winds like 30 miles per hour. So at least it's not that bad.

The fire is -- two fires, actually, almost side by side. They are right to the east of Oklahoma City, right around Spencer and Jones. And firing up to the north, because the winds are out of the south, they'll eventually get up here to the Turner Turnpike, which may be a very good fire break. Also right there -- that dark spot -- that's Lake Arcadia.

The winds -- here are the live wind speeds: Oklahoma City, 14. I checked Midwest City; that was about 16 miles per hour. That's just a suburb. But then out farther out to the west, the wind speeds are a little bit higher out there.

We can go back to some of the pictures because I lived about six miles from where these fires are happening right now. This is kind of a wild-land area, Ali. A lot of newer homes, people going in, kind of bedroom community, now.

You can go out there, pick up a five-acre plot, put a big house on it. And then what you have to do -- and you can still do this; it's not too late -- if you're anywhere in Oklahoma or Texas, you must cut your grass very short. If you leave it long, like if it's for hay for cows or for horses, you have a risk of making big fires like this.

People go out there and they scalp their lawn down to dirt. Well, dirt doesn't burn. And that's what you have to do to protect your property, especially with conditions this dry.

Believe it or not, Ali, since November 1st, Oklahoma City has had a quarter of an inch of rain.

VELSHI: Wow.

MYERS: Sixty days, and a quarter of an inch. That's it. No rain at all in November.

VELSHI: And we were looking -- and we'll see this later on. But really, if you look at the map of the country and the areas right now, which are going through severe droughts and most prone to this sort of fire, it's exactly where it should be. This is what's going on.

You mentioned that the turnpike might be a break for the fire. We're looking at these live pictures: We see regular roads, county roads, things like that. Those are not effective, necessarily, as fire breaks? MYERS: Not really. No, if you're out and about Wilshire and Britton (ph), maybe out near Post Road, these are really very thin roads, not big when it comes to shoulders. And these fires with winds of 18 have been jumping these roads with no sweat at all. The fire companies are trying to use them as a natural fire break because so many times there will be a clump of cedar trees. And, boy, I'm sure we'll have pictures of some cedars burning at one point in this newscast.

But when he they go up, they just -- they explode in the air because that oil that's in a cedar tree is just so flammable. When they go up, their sparks then jump far in advance downwind with the wind. The sparks go up, then they come down, and they start new places on fire. I've seen new fires like a quarter mile away from where the old fires are. That's how quickly these fires can spread.

This is not the same type of situation we had two, two and a half days ago, when the winds were 40. This is 20. This is better. Still not great.

VELSHI: Now, we've got active fires in Oklahoma County, east of Oklahoma City. Let's take it back to Texas for a second. Right now, we don't have those kind of active fires, but we've got exactly the same kind of conditions that make fires like this likely and possible?

MYERS: Yes, a little bit less wind in Dallas. The farther you get closer to the low -- the low that actually brought all the rain to California and snow to the Sierra -- the low is father to the north. The closer you get to the low, the bigger the wind speeds are. Down in Texas, like 13, 14 miles per hour.

And there's some critical threshold that you will pick up a spark and throw it a certain distance. And firefighters are finding out that threshold is about 20, 25 miles per hour. That's when it becomes dangerous to even try to fight the fire.

VELSHI: All right, Chad. The severe weather takes lots of different forms. We'll keep on checking with you on the fires in Oklahoma and Texas.

Right now, Jacki Schechner, our Internet reporter, is checking the situation online. And she's got that map of that drought picture that we were just talking about that makes these fires, creates the conditions for these fires.

JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Yes, Ali, it's the Wild Land Fire Drought Assessment System. Take a look at this. You can see the areas. And what this shows you is essentially the organic material on the ground and its flammability. You can see the areas in bright, bright maroon, there.

We've got a map that shows you moving from October through December, you can see as that cycles through, and how those drought conditions are changing over time. You can take a look at this yourself online to take a closer look. We go back to NOAA. We've been taking a look at this. And we've honed in specifically on Oklahoma and Oklahoma City area. We were talking about the wind speed.

Now, if you remember, when we were taking a look a couple days ago, those wind speeds were very, very high, like Chad was talking about. But if you take this through the day, as they change, they don't go much higher until we get about 1:00 p.m. And now they're up in the high teens, you can see as that progresses over the course of the day -- Ali?

VELSHI: All right. Jacki, we will continue to keep an eye on the situation in Oklahoma and Texas, those fires throughout the course of the program and here on CNN.

Let's turn over to the president's popularity, now. It's at an all-time low heading into the new year. For months now, most Americans have been disapproving of the way Mr. Bush handles his job. But this brand new poll -- it's releasing just this hour -- is about whether people like him. It's not approval. It's his favorable rating.

Well, 46 percent say they view the president favorably. And that's his lowest rating yet. 53 percent view him unfavorably. And that's at an all-time high.

The figures nearly mirror his latest job-approval ratings. As you can see, favorable opinions of Mr. Bush have fallen 13 points over the course of the year. The president may take some comfort in knowing that people like him more than they like President (sic) Dick Cheney or Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.

But look at this. There's only one white house figure who Americans seem to really like, and that's First Lady Laura Bush. She gets a whopping 73 percent favorable rating. Now, given the president's political troubles, many Democrats are heading into 2006 relatively upbeat about their prospects in congressional elections.

Well, there's more takes on our new poll and political prospects in 2006 from Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan, and that's coming up in our "Strategy Session."

Well, President Bush is spending the final days of this challenging year at his Texas ranch. Our White House correspondent, Dana Bash, is in Crawford, Texas, and she's been looking back at Mr. Bush in 2005.

Dana, good to see you.

DANA BASH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good to see you, too, Ali. And a challenging year, indeed. I haven't talked to one Bush aide who is not really ready for this year to be over. But, remember, 2005 started in a quite different way.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BASH (voice-over): He started the first year of his second term in classic Bush style.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I earned capital in the campaign -- political capital -- and now I intend to spend it.

BASH: With that, he aimed for the scoreboards, vowing not only to touch, but revamp the third rail of politics.

BUSH: We must make Social Security permanently sound, not leave that task for another day.

BASH: In Iraq, January's relatively peaceful elections brought hope. American support for the mission went up, so Mr. Bush turned nearly full-time to Social Security; some 40 carefully choreographed town meetings and speeches across the country. But his "be bold and others will follow" instinct failed him. He could not convince a skeptical public or Congress to go along with his signature issue.

VIN WEBER, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT: We found that an ambitious domestic agenda, which the president outlined in the beginning of this Congress, is not necessarily what the country wants right now.

BASH: Meanwhile, Americans continued to see daily violence from Iraq. Yet it was not until June that Mr. Bush tried to calm spiking concern with this primetime address.

BUSH: It is worth it.

BASH: Polls showed it didn't work. Then the summer ushered in Cindy Sheehan's anti-war protests.

WEBER: The biggest lesson the White House has learned is they can't the stop communicating about Iraq. Something else cannot take center stage, whether it's Social Security or tax reform or anything else. The nation's at war, the nation wants to know why they're at war...

BASH: Bush aides say they figured that out by summer's end and planned a fall campaign to rally support for Iraq. Then his already bumpy political ride took a nosedive.

Katrina hit, and he was accused of sleeping at the switch. He made a major miscalculation in nominating, then withdrawing, a top aide for the high court. The investigation into an administration leak left one top aide indicted for perjury, another in legal limbo, while the U.S. death toll in Iraq passed the 2,000 mark.

There was no doubt Iraq was the biggest force behind the country's souring mood so the White House belatedly set up a methodical plan to try to stop their political free fall: four speeches and a primetime address packed into 19 days.

BUSH: I know this war is controversial.

BASH: And the president, who began the year with a confident swagger, ended with uncharacteristic candor, even contrition. (END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH (on camera): And though they know Iraq will still be the X factor going into next year, they also hope to better capitalize on what they say is an improving economy.

And, Ali, Bush allies say there is another reason for a 2006 comeback. And that is the president himself. They say he has navigated tough political waters before, he is a competitor by nature and, also, he has taken more control over strategy with what's going on from his administration -- Ali?

VELSHI: What's the tone that you feel, Dana? Is it energized for 2006 because it can't possibly be as rough as 2005, or is it beaten down a little bit by the big year that you just described?

BASH: I think that, because of the way the year has ended, which has been -- from the perspective of the White House -- certainly better than the past several months, aides are feeling better about the way things are going. They feel that -- and part of it is perhaps it can't get worse, in terms of the way the fall was.

But they also know not only is Iraq an X factor, but as aides say over and over again, there are so many things out there unknowable that could happen, that could throw them off the course that they are on right now, which is to really focus primarily on the economy and on Iraq at the beginning of the year.

VELSHI: Dana Bash, live in Texas -- Crawford, Texas.

Thanks, Dana.

Well, now more on our new poll: With a midterm election coming up, who do Americans like more, Democrats or Republicans? Our Tom Foreman has a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BUSH: I hope the world is more peaceful. I hope democracy continues to take root around the world. And I hope people are able to find jobs.

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Bush offering high hopes for the new year. But many members of his party have been wringing their hands about 2006. They fear Mr. Bush's political problems and slumping poll numbers will bring them down on Election Day.

But our new poll suggests, at this stage of the game, the two parties are heading into more of a horse race than some might think. Republicans now have a 45 percent approval rating in the CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup Poll. That's actually up five points from October, despite Mr. Bush's fall and early winter blues.

And Democrats have lost ground in the last couple of months. The party's approval rating now stands at 46 percent, down six points from October. So much for a Democratic groundswell amid public concerns about the war in Iraq.

SEN. HARRY REID (D-NV), MINORITY LEADER: The troops and the American people have a right to expect answers and accountability worthy of that sacrifice.

FOREMAN: Democrats have also been trying to make questions about Republican ethics stick with indicted Congressman Tom DeLay as their poster boy.

But based on our survey, some Americans have yet to focus on the campaign finance allegations against the former House majority leader. While DeLay's favorable and unfavorable ratings fall along lines you might expect, look at this: More than a third of Americans aren't sure what to make of DeLay.

Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: Let's take you back to some live pictures outside of Oklahoma City, east of Oklahoma City in Oklahoma County, where those grass fires are spreading. What you can see in the picture behind me -- you can see some of the ground -- where the fires are, you can see the edge of the dark ground. You'll see that more clearly in a moment. This is all grass fire land that's been charred by the fires that are moving across.

At the same time, we've got pictures of helicopters carrying buckets, which are -- they go to nearby water sources, fill up those buckets, come back to this charred land and try and quell those grass fires.

Now, these grass fires on cropland are very, very close, and you can see some of the fires burning very clearly in forested, wooded areas. As Chad Myers, our severe weather expert, was describing to us, a lot of those trees in those wooded areas contain oils which are very conducive to this fire spreading.

So right now, what you've got is in the areas around Oklahoma City, to the east of it in Oklahoma County, very, very dry, drought conditions. And fires are spreading now -- grass fires are spreading -- posing danger of even greater, more serious fires.

Winds are lower than they've been in the last couple of days, which is seen as beneficial to the efforts to quench those fires, to quell those fires. But, at the moment, we're still struggling with this. There's still a few more hours of daylight, and these helicopters are trying to do what they can.

Let's bring Chad Myers back in, our severe weather expert. He's following these fires and the ones in Texas closely. What's the situation that we're looking at now?

MYERS: You know, Ali, I've been basically looking at this Chinook helicopter all day. For a while, it was actually on the fire that was in Seminole County, a good 80 miles east of here. Then they actually brought in a plane for those fires there, much more out of control to the east of Oklahoma City, Seminole County right there.

The fire's much more intense right about here. But the storm itself, the firestorm that we have around Oklahoma City now just to the east of that city, look at the winds. Look what the winds have done just in the time you and I have been talking -- 23 miles per hour.

VELSHI: They were in single digits a few minutes ago.

MYERS: Right. They're very gusty, coming up now.

VELSHI: Chad, we talked earlier about fire breaks. When you get closer to a developed area, when you get closer to Oklahoma City -- and I know these fires are sort of going south more than -- I'm sorry, north more than going west, which is where the danger would lie. But obviously, as you get closer to a developed area, are there more fire breaks? Is it less likely to cause damage into a more populated area?

MYERS: Well, you have more yards. And if the yards are cut short, like I was talking about, the fire doesn't burn as tall. For a while here -- we're looking at some of the hayfield grass, probably a good foot tall, and the fire is coming out of that one-foot tall grass, Ali. Those flames were 15 feet tall.

They came right through a home in this area. And less than a minute after those flames were touching the home, the home was fully engulfed.

You want to keep that away. As you get closer and closer to development, though, more people have planted trees, and they don't plant cedar trees. Those cedars are the wild land. You don't plant sage and all that other kind of stuff around your house, the stuff that's going to go up like that when it gets so dry.

So, yes, It's going to get better as it gets closer to people. But of course, then, more people are affected when it gets closer to people. So it's kind of a - it's good on one hand and bad on the other.

VELSHI: Chad, we'll keep checking in with you. Our severe weather expert, Chad Myers, following these fires -- the grass fires -- in Oklahoma County east of Oklahoma.

Also, coming up, the National Security Agency is caught breaking the rules for Internet privacy. Has the agency been tracking you?

Also ahead, a legal test: Must drivers know English to take an exam and get a license? A controversial figure is involved in this issue. I'll talk to Alabama chief justice turned candidate for governor, Roy Moore.

And later, portraits of the president: a public face and some intimate moments of the 43rd commander in chief.

You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Well, the right to drive is at stake in the culture wars. An Alabama judge could soon weigh in on this question: Should the state require driver's license exams to be given only in English?

Brian Todd has more on this legal battle and who's caught in the middle of it. -- Brian?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Ali, you're conversant in different languages yourself, maybe?

VELSHI: I can scratch out a few words in French.

TODD: Could you read a road sign in French?

VELSHI: Maybe. I don't think I'd be able to take a driver's exam in it.

TODD: I couldn't either. And that debate over making immigrants learn English, this has, as you've said, lit controversy in American schools. U.S. government programs now hotly contested on the road very literally.

Right now, here you have it. Six states make residents take their written driver's license exams only in English. There, you see them: Alaska, Maine, New Hampshire, Oklahoma, South Dakota and Wyoming.

Could there be a seventh?

One group, called the Southeastern Legal Foundation, is suing the State of Alabama to force it to make its license exams English only. Alabama voters had previously approved a measure making English the state's official language. But now, after a suit over that, the state offers the test in 13 languages, including Greek, Farsi, Vietnamese and Thai.

But the director of one group that sides with the Southeastern Legal Foundation says there is nothing less than safety in the balance.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

K.C. MCALPIN, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, PROENGLISH: It's definitely a hazard if they cannot understand a road sign that says, you know, "Yield to oncoming traffic," or "Stop for children in a crosswalk," or "Dangerous intersection ahead."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: K.C. McAlpin also says those same immigrants may not be able to communicate with emergency personnel in the event of an accident. But we also spoke to an official with the largest Hispanic advocacy group in the U.S., who makes this point about safety...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MICHELLE WASLIN, NATIONAL COUNCIL OF LA RAZA: If you're discouraging people from getting a driver's license, that doesn't mean that they're going to stop driving. That will only increase the number of uninsured, unlicensed drivers on our roads.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: We spoke to an aid to Alabama Governor Bob Riley. The governor is against making the tests English only. The aide says they don't believe that mandate could stand up in court. But a state judge should rule pretty soon in this lawsuit - Ali?

VELSHI: All right. This is an interesting story. Brian, thank you so much.

Brian Todd on that story.

Now, a Republican candidate for Alabama governor is weighing in on the English-only driver's license debate. It's someone you may remember.

Roy Moore is a former Alabama chief justice who fought a losing battle to keep a Ten Commandments monument at the state judicial building. Roy Moore joins us now from Montgomery, Alabama.

Judge Moore, good to talk to you. Thank you for being with us.

ROY MOORE, REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE FOR GOVERNOR OF ALABAMA: Nice to talk to you, Ali.

VELSHI: What's your take on this whole thing?

MOORE: Well, I think it's clear that it's not unfair or wrong to require that our driver's tests be taken in English.

VELSHI: OK. Not unfair or wrong. Do you think it's a problem that it's offered in other languages?

MOORE: I think when you have to take your driver's license test in Persian or Farsi, that you certainly can't read some of the signs we've got in English or some of the warnings over the major highways that we have printed out.

VELSHI: Let's take a look, if we can, at that map that Brian was showing us in his story about the states that do have English-only tests. Now, if Alabama were to become one of those states -- you can see from the map, there's nothing else around Alabama that has English-only tests. So are you just talking about being able to take the test in English or being able to drive in Alabama if you speak English?

MOORE: Well, if you take an Alabama driver's license test, it's to drive in Alabama. If other states recognize it, as many do, then of course, they will be able to drive there, also.

VELSHI: So people from surrounding states which don't have English-only laws -- if this were to happen in Alabama, would they not be able to drive in Alabama?

MOORE: I think we would still recognize their license. We can only speak for Alabama law.

VELSHI: Alabama is an interesting place in particular because there are a number of foreign automakers -- if you can even say foreign automakers, because they're built in Alabama -- but Mercedes- Benz, Hyundai, Honda, Toyota all have plants in Alabama, which may have something to do with why the test in Alabama is offered in 13 different languages.

It seems pretty inclusive right now. Could it be that a lot of the workers in Alabama are from other countries?

MOORE: No, I think that has nothing to do with the number of languages given in Alabama. We certainly don't have Persian plants here and Greek plants. We simply recognize English as our language, and that it should be.

It's never unfair in the past for immigrants to take their -- be required to learn English to enter this country. Now we're talking about not immigrants at all. We're talking about illegal aliens. And certainly they should be required, not even to get a driver's license; but if they take a test, they certainly shouldn't take it in some foreign language.

VELSHI: What do you think of -- in Brian's story, he was talking to somebody who had said that people are not likely to stop driving because they can't get the driver's license. So you may end up causing more people...

MOORE: That's like saying we shouldn't have laws against stealing because people are not likely - they'll continue to steal. If you're breaking the law, you're breaking the law. It doesn't mean you should remove the law.

VELSHI: Judge, there are -- there certainly have been moves throughout the world to try and standardize traffic signs and street signs. Stop signs look the same; if not all over the world, in most of the world. Is this not different from having to speak English for other reasons? I mean, it does sort of - it could sound a bit xenophobic, as opposed to safety-oriented.

MOORE: Well, I think, for safety purposes -- you had an earlier guest taking the statement for someone. For safety purposes, it's common sense to have driver's license test being given in English because that's what your signs are.

If we have to start taking languages as they come, then we'll never get all the languages anyway. What's to say we stop at 13? Why not 53? It just doesn't make sense. English should be required to understand our driver's license and our road signs.

VELSHI: Although it's not required...

(CROSSTALK) MOORE: Are we going to start giving road signs in Hispanic and Greek and whatever language?

VELSHI: But that they have all these -- you've got people from Alabama from all these places, and Americans go travel all over the world. And, largely, countries respect other people's driver's licenses. So if you can drive around in Spain for a week, why can't you drive around Spain for a year, even if you don't speak a word of Spanish?

MOORE: Well, that's a different question than: What should our driver's license tests be given in, what language? It should be English. If I went to Greece, I'll bet you we wouldn't take the driver's license test in English.

VELSHI: But does that make it less safe? If somebody from Greece comes here with a Greek driver's license and the state of Alabama allows people with Greek driver's licenses to drive around, why is it okay for them to drive around for a week as a tourist, as opposed to for a year or for five years?

MOORE: I can't speak for other countries, but it's common sense if our languages - or if our signs are in English, if we have road signs, detours and bridge signs and this and that, that we learn to speak English and we take our driver's license test in English.

VELSHI: Judge Moore, this isn't anything to do with your run for governor, is it?

MOORE: No. It's common sense.

VELSHI: Thank you for joining us. It's good to talk to you.

Judge Roy Moore joining us from Montgomery, Alabama.

Well, now, a story that's sure to spark some outrage.

A new audit finds that federal loans that were meant for businesses that were hard-hit by 9/11 often went to firms that were barely touched by the terror attacks. In fact, some of them weren't touched at all.

Gary Nurenberg is here in Washington with more on a loan program that went awry -- Gary?

GARY NURENBERG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ali, the Small Business Administration launched an investigation of its program after the Associated Press reported some of the loans went to a dog boutique in Utah, a perfume shop in the Virgin Islands and more than 100 Dunkin' Donuts and Subway sandwich shops. The AP reports that even while those businesses were getting the loans, some businesses at Ground Zero were having trouble getting loans under another program designed specifically for them.

The new SBA study of its Star Loan Program says most companies questioned about getting the loans were not hurt by the terrorist attacks and didn't know they were getting money from a terrorism relief program.

It says: 85 percent of the time, lenders failed to prove recipients of the loans were eligible to receive them. The SBA interviewed 42 recipients, and only two of them said they were aware they were getting terrorism relief money. Thirty-six of those businesses said they weren't asked or couldn't remember being asked if they'd been affected by the attacks. And in 34 cases where eligibility could not be determined, 25 businesses said no, they hadn't been affected by the terrorist strikes.

The SBA put out a statement saying the new report doesn't prove the recipients were unqualified. What it does say, Ali, is the SBA can't prove that they were qualified.

VELSHI: This is a government agency. It kind of looks like they don't have control. It's good that the SBA itself was able to find this problem. But how'd this happen?

NURENBERG: Well, Ali, there's no question here that the intent was to be as flexible as possible in granting the loans. From the very outset, it was clear from guidelines and statements by SBA officials regarding the loans that they were to grant more of them than they were to refuse.

For example, some guidelines from an SBA spokesman early in the program: Quote, "The SBA has not established any requirements regarding the severity or duration of the adverse impact that the small businesses suffer." When the SBA started getting congressional pressure to push the loans, there was initially very little interest.

An SBA official gave a speech to lenders saying, quote, "We have an expansive definition of economic disadvantage. As a matter of fact, we believe that every business can probably demonstrate some degree of economic disadvantage as a result of the terrorist attacks." And essentially, Ali, that was enough.

VELSHI: Wow. All right, Gary. Thanks very much. Gary Nurenberg.

Let's go to our Internet reporter, Jacki Schechner, who's been looking into that same story, the Small Business Administration story.

And, Jacki, you've been able to reconstruct more details on those federal loans and why this may have developed into a problem?

SCHECHNER: Well, here's the thing. Everything is so automated these days online that you don't have to actually talk to anybody to get some of the forms that you need to fill out for these types of things.

So we went to the SBA online at sba.gov. Just took a look at the Web site and some of the things that were available.

Now, you can read through the report and that audit that we're talking about to get a better idea of the details that we were just mentioning. But the other thing you can read into is the supplementary terrorist activity relief portion of the SBA. See, it's even tough to say.

But that will tell you specifically what the qualifications were for those specific terrorist-related loans. Also on the Web site are the general disaster relief forms, and these are just general forms. This is the kind of thing that small businesses have to fill out.

So you can see even where it can get all sorts of complicated when you take a look at a Web site like this that has all sorts of loans and applications and things you need to fill out, and you never actually talk to a person when you go and look for them -- Ali?

VELSHI: You know, Jacki, I've spent a lot of time dealing with the SBA on that Web site. And it does occur to me those are paper forms that were made into Web forms. It doesn't have that same ease of use that things that were just designed for the Web have. They are complicated forms to get through.

SCHECHNER: Yes. You download them, you print them out, you fill them out yourself, you send them in. There's not a human being you need to talk to, necessarily, to get your hands on these things.

VELSHI: Right. Jacki, thanks very much.

Jacki Schechner, our Internet reporter with the situation online.

Still ahead, emergency crews in Oklahoma are battling raging wildfires. It's our top story this hour. These are live pictures from Oklahoma, Oklahoma County, just east of Oklahoma City. An update is just moments away.

And later, the battle for Congress: Do our new poll numbers give Democrats or Republicans something to brag about? I'll ask two experts, Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Kimberly Osias joins us now with a closer look at some other stories making news.

Hey, Kimberly.

KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Ali.

Well, let's start in Baghdad. It has been another deadly day there. A suicide bomber detonated explosives at the main gate of the interior ministry. The blast killed three police officers and a civilian.

In eastern Baghdad, a U.S. soldier was killed by a roadside bomb while on routine patrol. The loss brings the number of U.S. deaths in the Iraq war to 2,175.

Three people are dead and another nine wounded; victims of a suicide bombing at a West Bank checkpoint today. The bomber, who also was killed, detonated an explosive vest after getting out of a taxi at the roadblock. The taxi driver, another passenger, and an Israeli officer died in the blast. The Israeli Defense Force blames the Palestinian militant group, Islamic Jihad.

And a National Security Agency spokesman says the NSA has disabled tracking files -- those are called cookies -- used by its Web site. You've heard a lot about it today.

He says the cookies were installed for easier site navigation and were supposed to be (inaudible) when done. He says when the NSA learned (inaudible) were tracking users' Web activity, they were (inaudible). A privacy activist inquired about the cookies earlier this week. (inaudible) Much more on that story in the next hour.

Ali, I've got to confess, I really wasn't sure what cookies were exactly. I knew it was one of those techno terms that was sort of bandied about. I have to have our own Jacki Schechner fill me in and give me the scoop.

VELSHI: Yes, it's a three-hour show. Let's not talk be talking about cookies right now. Jacki will be back on that. Kimberly, good to see you.

A quick shot of the fires in Oklahoma, which we are going to keep our eye on and keep you posted on right now. You can see the fire line in about the middle of the shot now moving over to the right. Those are the fires in Oklahoma County, Oklahoma, east of Oklahoma City.

The winds are blowing north at the moment, so not much risk to Oklahoma City at the moment. But that risk is spreading right through that area because it is so dry. We'll keep on top of that story for you, as well.

Up next, the president's agenda. Did Iraq overwhelm everything else in 2005? Will it be the same story in 2006? We'll get expert opinion from Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan in today's strategy session.

And next hour, a CNN exclusive. We are on the frontlines in Afghanistan, embedded with U.S. forces battling the Taliban and Al Qaeda. Stay tuned with us. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: All right, today in our strategy session, new poll numbers show that President Bush has got some work to do in the new year to win over the American public. Will he be able to get any other of his items on his agenda accomplished, or is Iraq going to eclipse everything else like it ended up doing in 2005? Why haven't Democrats been able to capitalize on recent bad news for Republicans? That remains a key question.

And joining us to discuss it all are CNN's political analysts, Democratic strategist Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan, president of American Cause.

Welcome to both of you. Thank you so much for being with us.

Bay, let's start with you. It's not like it's a big surprise at this point. I don't think you could tell the president anything right now that he wouldn't like to just write off and keep in 2005. But those favorable numbers that have just come out, and we looked at them earlier.

Let's take a look. 46 percent are viewing the president as favorable, that's his lowest yet in his presidency, and 53 percent, unfavorable. This is a brand new poll. What does that mean, and how does the president need to read this?

BAY BUCHANAN, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN CAUSE: You know, first of all, I don't think the numbers are all that significant. It's a popularity poll here. It could be somewhat of a lag indicator. The key is that more and more people are now supporting his policies. He's really turned that around dramatically in the last two months.

But this is an unfortunate number. I'm sure the president is somewhat concerned about it. But it's strictly popularity. It's much more important that the people feel good about what he's doing, the direction he's moving the country. And they are coming around in those areas.

VELSHI: Paul, I'm going to give you one to hit out of the park. Vin Weber, former congressman, isn't always on the same side as you, had this to say in the "Washington Post": "I don't think they," -- and I think he's referring to the administration. "I don't think they realize that Iraq is the totality of their legacy until fairly recently. There's not much of a market for other issues." Do you remember this is the year in which they talked about Social Security and all sorts of other things -- it seemed like a lifetime away?

PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: The year in which the president put his hand on the Bible, was sworn in for a second term, triumphant. A year that most Democrats like me thought that he would lose. And now, just one year later, his chief domestic initiative, Social Security, is through. It is dead.

His chief foreign initiative, Iraq, is desperately unpopular with the American people. And the president himself -- I think what he hasn't wrapped his mind around -- and I don't mean to be mean. I like him. He's a nice guy. He was an acquaintance of mine when I lived in Texas, and he was my governor.

The country doesn't like him. This is a personal -- Bay is right, a personal popularity number in the new CNN poll, it's below 50. The rejection is over 50. And that's as a guy, as a personal level. His approval for his positions, for his job, the work he's doing, is even worse and lower.

VELSHI: But trending differently. It's going...

BEGALA: Let's wait and see. I think the Republicans are going to look back on '05, as bad as it was, and think it was the good old days. I think '06 is going to be so much worse.

Let's hope Iraq turns out well. Even if it does, we have Jack Abramoff, the sleaziest lobbyist in the world, about, I think, to cut a plea and rat out a whole bunch of Republican congressmen.

You have this horrible scandal where the president was authorizing wiretaps without warrants, which even conservative scholars are saying may warrant impeachment. So I think he's going to look back on '05 and say, "Boy, those were the days."

BUCHANAN: See, that's where the Democrats have faltered here. There's now question the president had a rough year. We all agree there. He's brought it back. I think the direction of the polls are excellent for him right now. And in the last two months, it's been significantly on the uptick.

But the key here is, what's happened to the Democrats during that time? They are not gaining any kind of ground, and in fact, they're dropping because of...

VELSHI: Let's see that, actually. Let's take a look at the Democrats -- for the party's favorable ratings in December compared to October. In October, the Democrats were at 52 percent favorable and the Republicans at 40 percent. Now, in December, after all of this has happened, the Republicans are up 5 percent and the Democrats are down to 46. What's that about?

BEGALA: I think opposition party has to do two things, oppose and propose. I think my fellow Democrats have done a pathetic job of opposing President Bush. Too many of them went along with this deeply dishonest war. Too many of them went along with his tax cuts. And a lot of Democrats like me are frustrated with the party.

But then they've also now -- but they've begun in '05 to oppose in a more effective way. They killed the president's Social Security privatization plan. In '06, they have to propose if they want to win. It will not be enough to simply say, "Bush stinks, we're different."

We have to say we can do better, as Democrats, and here's how. Here's our plan for energy independence. Here's our plan for health care. Here's our plan to get control of Mr. Bush's deficit. Here's our plan to try to restore America's credibility in the world. If they do that -- and that's not too hard a thing to do -- if they do that, they'll take back the Congress in '06. We should save this tape, Ali. Democrats can take back the Congress.

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: We'll always save the tape.

BUCHANAN: But you know, Paul is right that the Democrats have done a terrible job. But they have opposed the president. They are well-known as critics. That, they've done a superb job, so people expect them always to be carping and complaining out there, OK?

But on the other side, they've also reintroduced that theme that indeed, they could be national security wimps. The perception is now, in some polls, they're ten points down on being able to fight terrorists against the Republicans. You go into this year...

BEGALA: They used to be 50 down, though.

BUCHANAN: You guys have failed. You have worsened the situation than you were three months ago.

VELSHI: We'll leave it at that, folks. Thanks so much for being with us. Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan. It's my pleasure to be here.

(CROSSTALK)

BEGALA: Usually, I think that's your box.

VELSHI: I'm right there in that second box. Exactly.

Coming up, a deadly plane crash in Nebraska. Details on that and some of the other stories making headlines when we return.

Plus, call it one pricey Jeep. How much would you pay for this ride? You might be surprised to find out what the Marine Corps is coughing up. We'll go live to the Pentagon to find out.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Kimberly Osias joins us now with a closer look at some other stories making news.

Hey, Kimberly.

OSIAS: Hello, Ali. Federal investigators are trying to figure out why a small plane crashed in a field near Omaha, Nebraska, killing all three people on board. The wreckage was discovered this morning about a mile south of Omaha's Millard airport. Federal Aviation officials say it's unclear if the plane went down late Wednesday or early Thursday. The plane is registered to a Nevada-based leasing company.

The wife of a Milwaukee man beaten by a mob of young men Monday is calling for an end to the violence in her community. Linda Johnson calls the attack on her husband, Samuel McClain, senseless. McClain is recovering from wounds inflicted by as many as 15 attackers. They dragged him from his car and pummeled him after he honked for them to move from the street. So far, no arrests.

A 41-year-old woman is China's third confirmed human death and seventh human infection from avian flu. She was a factory worker who lived in an eastern Chinese province. The area has not officially reported outbreaks among birds. Health officials say the woman died from the disease December 21st. The virus has killed more than 70 people in Asia since late 2003, and we'll of course have much more on the story in the next hour -- Ali?

VELSHI: All right, Kimberly. Thanks very much. Kimberly Osias.

If you're a bumper sticker collector, stay tuned for what's coming up next. But we will continue to follow the raging wildfires in Oklahoma. It is our top story this hour. We'll have a live update next. Plus, see President Bush in ways you haven't seen him before. Photographers capture the commander in chief in public and in private. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: All right. It's five minutes to 5:00 Eastern, it's five minutes to 4:00 in Oklahoma.

Take a look at these pictures behind me. We have two shots from our affiliates. On the right, you've got a Chinook helicopter carrying water that it's taken from a nearby water source, taking it over to those grass fires that you can see in the picture here on your left.

Now, it's hard to see because those fires are spreading. That grass is burning, and it's obscuring the images that we've got. But at certain points in this shot, you can see a very clear fire line that is approaching. This is east of Oklahoma City. We will continue to follow that. Stay with us in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Next up, we're going to take a look at President Bush up close and personal. The best of what White House photographers have to offer all in one book.

And in our next hour, the latest chapter in the fight to save an Iraqi baby's life. We're following the case of Baby Noor and the U.S. servicemen fighting to help her.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: President Bush is one of the most familiar faces in the world. But White House photographers often try to show him in new ways, close up and candid, as well as the usual pomp and circumstance.

Here's our national correspondent, Bruce Morton.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRUCE MORTON, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The book, called "George W. Bush: Portrait of a Leader," was produced for the president's second term inaugural committee. David Kennerly, who also worked in the Ford White House, is one of the White House photographers whose work is seen in it.

DAVID KENNERLY, WHITE HOUSE PHOTOGRAPHER: We like to think of ourselves as the fly on the wall. We're always the other person in the room. So no matter what's going on, there's, like, one of us there.

MORTON: There are intimate moments. The president and his parents on the White House lawn shortly after his inauguration. The Bushes straightening the oval office. Barney inspecting the lawn through one of its windows. Clearing brush on his ranch. Practicing is high hard one before throwing out the first pitch of the 2001 season. Laura and a niece at Camp David. But... KENNERLY: I think the best pictures came out of the drama of real things going on, definitely right after the 9/11 attack.

MORTON: Bush at the Emma Booker Elementary School in Sarasota. He'd just been told of the attacks. Bush looking at the damaged Pentagon on September 12th. With a bullhorn at Ground Zero, New York, September 14th. With Arlene (ph) Howard, whose policeman son was killed in the attack. At the National Cathedral service that same day.

A contemplative president, February, 2002. On Air Force One descending into Baghdad on that surprise visit, Thanksgiving, 2003. Hands reaching out in Parkersburg, Virginia, during his 2004 campaign. With his wife, Election Night. They know they've won.

And, finally, the Bushes at an inaugural ball, 2005, dancing on the presidential seal. A happy start to what's been an uneven second term.

Bruce Morton, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

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