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The Situation Room
First Public Playing Of Flight 93 Cockpit Voice Recording; Bush, Iraq & WMD; Should Rumsfeld Resign?; Toxic 9/11 Cloud May Now Be Claiming Victims; Tom Cruise Unleashes New Attack On Psychiatry And Depression Drugs
Aired April 12, 2006 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: To our viewers, you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where new pictures and information are arriving all the time.
Standing by, CNN reporters across the United States and around the world to bring you tonight's top stories.
Happening now, the fight for Flight 93, the disturbing play-by- play of passengers battling the terrorists on the flight that crashed in Pennsylvania on 9/11. It was played for the first time in the trial against an admitted al Qaeda conspirator.
Also, reckless reports or a reflection of realty? The White House is blasting a report suggesting President Bush knowingly cited bad intelligence on weapons of mass destruction to help justify the war in Iraq. Depending on the outcome, it could weaken or strengthen the president's credibility.
And Tom Cruise is back promoting a new movie and touting the benefits of Scientology. He has more arguments against psychiatry. Do some findings from the government help support Cruise's arguments?
I'm Heidi Collins, in for Wolf Blitzer, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
It is the first public playing of the Flight 93 cockpit voice recording. And it captures the horror of 9/11 as it happened. That recording was played for the jury in the trial of al Qaeda conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui.
CNN Justice reporter Kelli Arena is live at the courthouse in Alexandria, Virginia, now with details -- Kelli.
KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Heidi, this was a very difficult recording to listen to, especially with victim family members sitting right there in the courtroom. I did my best to dramatize what we heard, because the audio was not released by the court.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ARENA (voice-over): The courtroom was riveted as the recording was played. The turmoil, suffering, and heroism of Flight 93 brought to life. After hearing the hijackers yell at passengers to sit down, shut up and not move, you can hear a man pleading, "Please, please, don't hurt me... Oh, God."
This is followed by more yelling, hijackers telling passengers to "Get down!" Then more agonizing pleading from another person, this time a woman who prosecutors identified as a flight attendant.
"I don't want to die," she said. Another voice answers, "No! No! Down! Down!"
Again, she pleads, "I don't want to die. I don't want to die." Then all you hear are cries.
A hijacker icily reports back, "Everything is fine. I finished."
As passengers approach the cockpit, you hear a hijacker saying, "Is there something? A fight? Yeah?" The plane at this time is rocking wildly.
"They want to get in there. Hold, hold from the inside!"
You hear screaming. It sounds like one of the hijackers has been injured or killed. This is followed by an American voice saying, "In the cockpit! If we don't, we'll die!" Then, Roll it!"
You hear the crashing of what sounds like the drink cart. Unbelievable chaos followed by a struggle.
"Give it to me! Give it to me! Give it to me!"
Then, "Allah is the greatest!" And silence.
Hamilton Peterson lost his father and stepmother aboard that flight.
HAMILTON PETERSON, RELATIVE OF FLIGHT 93 PASSENGERS: I think it captures the American spirit. It is truly remarkable that when one appreciates the brutality and the complexity of the conspiracy, that in a matter of moments, these brave Americans overcame a horrific challenge.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ARENA: The jury has had to relive the horror of 9/11 each day as prosecutors try to convince them to sentence Moussaoui to death. They rested their case today. The defense will start theirs tomorrow -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right. Kelli Arena, thank you.
And tonight, a one-two punch, said the Bush White House on Iraq. A published report is raising new questions about the president's credibility and his past claims that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. And for the first time, a general who actually commended troops in Iraq is calling for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to resign.
Our Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr, is standing by. But first, to our White House correspondent, Suzanne Malveaux -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Heidi, the White House is really taking issue with this report, calling it irresponsible and reckless from "The Washington Post," as well as ABC News, any suggestion that the president knew that the bad intelligence that he was putting forward was leading our country to war.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX (voice-over): On May 29, 2003, several months after the U.S. invaded Iraq, President Bush declared the U.S. was justified in going to war.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We found the weapons of mass destruction.
MALVEAUX: The evidence, two trailers seized in northern Iraq that U.S. intelligence claimed were mobile weapons factories previously cited by top officials in making the case for war. At it turns out, the trailers were not being used to make biological weapons, but rather, to fill weather balloons, a conclusion reached by the U.S. government's Iraq Survey Group 15 months later.
But today, "The Washington Post" reported that experts on a Pentagon-sponsored mission concluded the trailers were not biological weapons labs two days before President Bush made his declaration and that they sent their findings to Washington in a classified report. But the White House says the president did not get that assessment until much later, and took strong exception to any suggestion that Mr. Bush knowingly was giving out inaccurate information.
SCOTT MCCLELLAN, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: That is absolutely false and it is irresponsible. The president was saying what the intelligence community assessed to be right, that they had discovered a "mobile biological production plant."
MALVEAUX: The debate comes at a time when polls show Mr. Bush has lost ground in one of his strongest areas, trustworthiness. More than half of Americans say they believe the president is not honest. Since the beginning of Mr. Bush's second term, the administration has been faced with a series of setbacks, from the failed Dubai port deal to the CIA leak investigation.
DAVID GERGEN, FMR. PRESIDENTIAL ADVISER: There's a drip, drip, drip that's occurred, that's worn away his credibility for much of the public. And that's -- I think it's terribly unfortunate from his standpoint, because it's very hard to govern.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX: And three years after the U.S. invasion of Iraq, the president continues to make the case that it was justifiable going to war with Iraq. And Scot McClellan saying he doesn't believe it's a credibility gap that is with the president, but rather, those who continue to insist that he deliberately misled the public into going to war -- Heidi.
COLLINS: Suzanne Malveaux outside the White House tonight.
Suzanne, thank you.
A quick fact check now on this story. We asked our nation security correspondent, David Ensor, about the time frame for intelligence information to make it from the field to the White House. He says in almost every case, raw data would not arrive on the president's desk in a matter of a day or two.
As President Bush deals with that report, his defense secretary is dealing with calls for his resignation. Another military general wants Donald Rumsfeld out.
More from CNN Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr -- Barbara.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Hello to you, Heidi.
Well, this time it is just a bit different, because for the first time, a general who commanded thousands of combat troops in Iraq, indeed, is calling for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to resign. Major General John Batiste commanded the 1st Infantry Division until he retired from the military about five and a half months ago, did a long combat tour in Iraq. And this morning, when he interviewed on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING," he was remarkably blunt about his views.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAJ. GEN. JOHN BATISTE, U.S. ARMY (RET.): When decisions are made without taking into account sound military recommendations, sound military decision-making, sound planning, then we're bound to make mistakes. When we violate the principles of war with mass and unity at command, and unity of effort, we do that at our own peril.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: So the secretary should step down?
BATISTE: In my opinion, yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STARR: A pretty startling admission, Heidi. Of course, three other generals in the last month, retired generals -- but they did not command combat troops in Iraq -- also called for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to resign.
All of this yesterday leading the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Peter Pace, to make a very public statement about all of this, saying that generals have ample opportunity to complain in private when they're on active duty. And he says he never heard any such complaints.
But I have to tell you, all of this causing a good deal of dismay in the Pentagon. A lot of speculation about who might be next to complain -- Heidi.
COLLINS: We'll continue to follow it.
Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr.
Thank you, Barbara.
And time now for what we call "The Cafferty File." Our Jack Cafferty is in New York.
Jack, hi there.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Heidi, I want to go back to that story Suzanne Malveaux was talking about a couple of minutes ago. As if the administration isn't in enough trouble, along comes this report in "The Washington Post" this morning that President Bush was declaring to world, "We have found the weapons of mass destruction," 50 days after the fall of Baghdad in 2003.
But that statement was false. And some U.S. intelligence officials knew it was false.
A secret fact-finding mission to Iraq had discovered that those much-publicized trailers touted as biological weapons labs were nothing of the sort. ABC News has even reported that President Bush knew what he was saying about those trailers was false.
Well, needless to say, the White House is not very happy about any of this. They pooh-poohed "The Post" story and they want ABC News to apologize. What the White House did not do is answer this question: Did President Bush know what he was saying about the weapons of mass destruction was false?
No answer.
Here's our question, though? Who's to blame for the president's credibility problem? Is it the White House or the media?
E-mail us at CaffertyFile@CNN.com or go to CNN.com/CaffertyFile -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right, Jack. We'll check back a little later. Thanks.
Coming up, how big of a credibility problem does the White House have on its hands? We're taking a closer look at the political implications.
Plus, former FEMA director Michael Brown, he's been blamed for the slow response to Hurricane Katrina. So why would a Louisiana parish consult him on the cleanup?
I'll ask him. Michael Brown is in THE SITUATION ROOM.
And Tom Cruise is a "Top Gun" in the Church of Scientology, and he's claiming new progress in the church's campaign against what it calls an industry of death. We'll have the story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Still unfolding tonight, the fallout from a new report that the Bush administration is calling reckless. The White House flatly denies the president declared the existence of biological weapons labs in Iraq three years ago knowing the information was false.
"The Washington Post" reports that two days before Mr. Bush made that announcement weapons experts concluded the information was wrong.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MCCLELLAN: I saw some reporting talking about how this latest revelation, which is not something that is new -- this is all old information that's being rehashed -- was an embarrassment for the White House. No, it's an embarrassment for the media that is out there reporting this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COLLINS: And joining me now to get some more insight on all of this is David Gergen.
And you know, David, this latest story in "The Washington Post" has the White House back answering questions once again about their credibility. How much trouble do you think they're really in at this very point?
DAVID GERGEN, FMR. PRESIDENTIAL ADVISER: I think they're in deep, deep trouble. And they may not be able to get out of this hole before it's over.
You know, when we woke up today -- and it's still very early -- there may be counterpoints here, there may have been contradictory memos inside the administration. But it's just stunning to wake up once again to another story about an administration that said one thing, and lo and behold, there's inside information which suggests just the opposite was the case.
COLLINS: And White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan, when he spoke earlier today, he was pretty combative? Is this the right thing to do in talking about the media?
GERGEN: Well, you know, I understand that instinct. And you can get very -- you can get battered and then become combative inside the White House.
But I have to tell you something, they're never going to get out of this hole unless they say -- they stop what they're doing and say, look, let's adopt a new philosophy. When stories like this come up, let's find -- let's not say anything until we know basically what's going on, and then let's make it public. And let's -- if we've made a mistake, let's say we've made a mistake. We didn't make a mistake, let's show people why.
But you cannot -- you'll never regain your credibility by attacking the press. It's a -- it's a defensive action that's a way to ward off the blows.
But the way you deal with your credibility is you get the truth out, and you get it out on a continuing basis. And the administration has acquired a reputation now, unfortunately, for both secrecy and duplicity, and that's not a healthy thing for anybody, including the country.
COLLINS: And because you have served under both Republican and Democratic administrations, that's exactly what you would advise them to do at this point, just get the truth out and maybe have waited for some more facts to come in?
COLLINS: Well, I think, look -- I think you can say, look, we don't know all the facts, give us three days, ladies and gentlemen. We'll be back to you in 72 hours. We'll give you the complete story. And then go to work and find out inside.
But what you can't do is just sort of lash out at the press. I mean, you know, before this, they were -- they were nailing people who had leaked classified information and they were going to have, you know, criminal investigations. And those are still -- those criminal investigations are still under way for some leaks, such as the whole question of the eavesdropping program.
But then it turned out that it was indeed the president of United States who was declassifying information. The leak came from -- and the ship of state (ph) came from the top.
You know, so, I think this series of stories is just poison for the administration's credibility. And I really think it hurts the country.
And there are some tough, tough decisions President Bush must make in the next few weeks, if not the next few months, on Iraq, Iran, and other issues. And his credibility is a precious in order to address it and persuade people in this country about the tough things, and to persuade people overseas. So, I think this is a big problem.
COLLINS: What about, though, David, some full-scale changes or addition? I mean, is bringing in a new chief of staff really enough at this point?
GERGEN: No, I don't think so. I mean, I really believe that they could have recovered, that there was a window way back last fall, months ago during the Scooter Libby period, the Katrina period, and everything else, where they could have changed course.
They could have brought in a whole series of new faces, thank the people. You know, Andy Card is a wonderful human being and a great chief of staff. You know? And I think they ought to promote him to the cabinet. Give him some rest and promote him into a terrific cabinet job.
But they did need some fresh blood at the White House. They needed new people, and they needed new people outside and around the administration.
They needed to change course on a variety of things. They needed to move more to the center just the way everybody talked about it. I talked about it, everybody else talked about they ought to embrace the Reagan philosophy after the Iran-Contra, they could rebuild.
They decided not to do that. They decided to put a stick in people's eyes, we're going to do it our way.
Fine. You want to do it your way? But now the window has passed. I mean, you know, it's very, very hard at this point.
COLLINS: And so that being said, when we then look at the president's declining poll numbers on both his approval rating and his credibility, is there a fear that he could become a lame duck?
GERGEN: I think you can hear the quacking now. You know, he's -- he -- it would help if he could find a few policies.
I think "The Washington Post" sort of expected the impossible today in their editorial page. They said that basically he (INAUDIBLE) of new policies, which he won't do. But I do think there are some things -- let's take the immigration bill.
He has taken what I think is a -- is a solid -- is a progressive stance towards immigration, but he hasn't come down hard on it. He hasn't gone out to fight for it.
Now, if he took that immigration debate, which is, you know, is rolling around and really divisive for the country, and said to the Congress, look, I want to work with you, we're going to get a bill passed as soon as you get back here, let's get that done, and he got a bill passed in a couple of weeks, then he would have better footing.
So there are a few things he could do on the substantive side that would help, but he's got to get the truth out about this run-up to the war in Iraq and what the administration has told us since the war began, much of which now many people believe that you guys deceived us, you didn't tell us the truth. He's got to get back into the truth-telling.
This was a guy who was, as you know, most of the country thought only a couple of years ago, you could agree or disagree with George W. Bush, but he's a straight shooter. And he had that reputation. He had that reputation in Texas.
I believe that's what he thinks he is. But this series of mishaps I think has really damaged his credibility in a serious way.
COLLINS: All right. Well, David Gergen, we always appreciate your analysis here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
GERGEN: Thank you.
COLLINS: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COLLINS: And we spoke with David Gergen, our political analyst, a little bit earlier today.
Meanwhile, still to come tonight in THE SITUATION ROOM, he's the face of the government failure in the Hurricane Katrina response. So, is former FEMA chief Michael Brown the right man to advise one hard- hit Louisiana parish?
Michael Brown will join me in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Plus, an autopsy concludes exposure to Ground Zero killed a New York City police officer almost five years after the 9/11 attacks. Is it an isolated case, or are there others? CNN's Mary Snow is investigating.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Zain Verjee is on vacation, so Fredricka Whitfield is joining us now from the CNN global headquarters in Atlanta with the very latest news.
Hi, Fredricka.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening to you, Heidi.
In Cincinnati, Ohio, today, while the city council meets inside, shots are fired outside. Police are now hunting for the person who shot a well-known black activist several times. Kabaka Oba, whose real name is Michael Bailey, was rushed to the hospital, where he is in critical condition. It happened shortly after Bailey had addressed the council.
Cincinnati's mayor says the shooting was not random.
Some families of 9/11 victims are suing a government lawyer involved in the trial of 9/11 conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui. Carla Martin is the lawyer whose alleged improper coaching of witnesses in the Moussaoui trial nearly derailed the proceeding. The plaintiffs charge that Martin's actions deprived them of their constitutional rights. Those families are already suing two airlines of negligence and wrongful death related to the 9/11 attacks.
Duke University's lacrosse team has a new advocate in the court of public opinion. A group of the team's boosters has hired former federal prosecutor and Washington attorney Bob Bennett. He has signed on to spearhead a public relations effort to argue that players did not rape an exotic dancer at an off-campus party. Bennett represented former president Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones sexual harassment case.
One of the Pointer Sisters has died. A statement from the family says June Pointer died yesterday with four of her five siblings, two sisters and two brothers, at her side. She lost her battle with cancer at UCLA Medical Center in Santa Monica, California.
June was the front person on the trio's hits "Jump" and "He's So Shy." June Pointer was 52 -- Heidi.
COLLINS: Oh, she'll be missed. All right. Fredricka Whitfield, thank you.
Just ahead now, they are accused of smuggling dozens of illegal immigrants into the United States. And now they have been busted. We'll have details on this late-breaking announcement by law enforcement officials.
And some Hurricane Katrina victims are still angry at Michael Brown. So why is the former FEMA director up for a job to help the New Orleans area recover? My interview with Brown is next right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: We are getting word of a major cross-border bust involving a human smuggling ring.
We want to get right to CNN's Brian Todd with the very latest details -- Brian.
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Heidi, just a short time ago, U.S. and Canadian law enforcement officials announced that they have dismantled a major human smuggling ring which they believe brought dozens of illegals from India and Pakistan into the United States. Fourteen people now face human smuggling charges; two of them are still at large.
This is a result of a year-long investigation. Much of it involving undercover work by U.S. Homeland Security officials and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.
Officials released these night scope pictures that we're going to show you right now. These are pictures of people being led through the woods near the border between Washington State and Canada. They're by a road. They're seen crouching down. Then they are shown being picked up by a vehicle.
Officials have detained at least 50 illegals who they say were first brought into Toronto from Indian and Pakistan on commercial flights using forged documents. An official with U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement described other details of the operation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The aliens were charged as much as $35,000 a piece to be smuggled from their home countries through Canada, into the United States. Once the aliens arrived in the United States, they were moved into the inland part of Washington, housed in hotels until the smuggling organizations could arrange to have them moved domestically throughout the United States in a number of different cities.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: Officials say some of those smuggled in were children. All of them have been recovered and are being deported. Officials tell us they know of no connection to terrorism here, but they say it doesn't raise more concerns about the vulnerability of the U.S.- Canadian border -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right, Brian Todd. Thank you.
And today in New Orleans, the head of the Army Corps of Engineers announced that the levees in and around the city are in worse shape than the Corps first thought. CNN's Gulf correspondent Susan Roesgen is live in St. Bernard Parish with more -- Susan.
SUSAN ROESGEN, CNN GULF COAST CORRESPONDENT: Heidi, I'm on a levee in St. Bernard Parish that's just outside of New Orleans. It's about 12 feet high, and during the hurricane, the water came right over the top of it.
Today the Army Corps of Engineers said that we could expect that same kind of flooding in the next big storm, even though the corps is doing everything it can to try to shore up the levees in this area.
But there's one kind of hurricane help that the people here say they don't want. The parish president had invited Michael Brown, the former director of FEMA, to give advice as a hurricane consultant to this parish and the people we talked to say no thanks.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PATRICK WISCHER, HOMEOWNER: He can't tell nobody right. He couldn't even do the FEMA right when Katrina hit.
ROESGEN (voice-over): Standing in front of his flooded home, Patrick Wischer says bringing Michael Brown to St. Bernard Parish is a bad idea. The former FEMA director, who resigned under pressure for FEMA's bungling of the federal response to the hurricane, had been invited to offer his services to the parish as a hurricane recovery consultant.
Parish Councilwoman Judy Hoffmeister says, stranger still, this is the parish that has complained about FEMA louder than anyone else.
JUDY HOFFMEISTER, PARISH COUNCILWOMAN: I think it's ironic that Mr. Brown could not come to the parish during the disaster, the first 10 days we were SOS, saving ourselves. But he can find the time to come down and try to be an employee of St. Bernard Parish. I think that would just complete the insanity that has taken over this community since Hurricane Katrina hit.
ROESGEN: While some council members say they are willing to at least listen to Brown, Patrick Wischer says don't even ask what Brown can do for him.
WISCHER: Personally, I don't like the man.
ROESGEN (on camera): You don't know the man.
WISCHER: It don't matter. It's just his ideas that I don't like.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROESGEN: At last report, Heidi, the deal was off. Michael Brown isn't coming to advise the parish, though I have a funny feeling, in talking to some of the council members, that he might be back when some of the media is off. He might meet informally again with some of the parish folks.
The parish president is in Orlando, Florida at that hurricane conference. He won't be back until tonight. And the parish president, Junior Rodriguez, is a pretty powerful man. If he wants something, he usually gets it, so we'll see what happens.
COLLINS: Susan, is there any talk of whom they might look to in St. Bernard's Parish then, if not Michael Brown, for help?
ROESGEN: Actually, Heidi, they say we look to ourselves. This is a parish that pulled itself up by the bootstraps. They feel that they've been doing pretty well. They say we really don't need Michael Brown. I mean, Junior Rodriguez, the parish president, and a couple of the other council members met him in Washington, they talked to him.
Somehow this invitation came about. He says they asked him. I guess they did. But the other council members here and a lot of people in the parish say we have done what we have done so far by yourselves and we'll keep on keeping on.
COLLINS: All right, Susan Roesgen, thank you very much.
And now let's hear it from Michael Brown himself about his job prospects in Louisiana. Brown is in Orlando for the National Hurricane Conference, and I spoke with him earlier in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COLLINS: Former FEMA director joining us from Orlando, Florida, where he is attending the National Hurricane Conference. Thank you for being here.
And I, of course, want to ask you right off the bat, was canceling this meeting bowing to the pressure of those people who really didn't want you to take that job?
MICHAEL BROWN, FORMER FEMA DIRECTOR: Well, actually, Heidi, I find it kind of ironic that I never sought the job. I never sought a job with St. Bernard Parish.
Junior Rodriguez, the president of the parish and the first person that I saw when I was able to get in to St. Bernard on a Black Hawk helicopter landing in the refinery and finally making my way over to their storm-ravaged shelter, approached me in Washington, D.C., two weeks ago. And here's what I told Junior Rodriguez, and it still stands true today.
I will provide whatever advice, whatever direction and guidance he needs free of charge -- that's always been my position all along -- and he is free to call me any time and get that advice, get that recommendation -- get those recommendations, what he should or should not be doing to speed the recovery to those people. It's not a job that I sought. They came after me and I'm willing to provide them whatever advice they want.
COLLINS: Mr. Brown, what did you think when he first came to you with this proposal?
BROWN: It didn't surprise me in the least. Look, while some -- and I heard the previous story about some people don't like me, and they are mad at me, and that sort of thing, I understand that completely. But I know in my heart what I was doing.
I think the videotape showed, that came out a few weeks ago, what I was doing to try to help people in New Orleans, and I'm still trying to help people in Louisiana and Mississippi, I'm still trying to help emergency management in this country.
I think those videotapes show that I knew what I was talking about, that I know how this system works, and what needs to be done to fix it. So I'm willing still to be out there in front and still willing to help people in any way that I can.
COLLINS: All right, listen if would, for just a moment, Mr. Brown, to the New Orleans City Council president. This is Oliver Thomas. I want you to listen to this and I will come back and get your reaction.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OLIVER THOMAS, NEW ORLEANS CITY COUNCIL PRESIDENT: I would rather go out there and hire somebody who's proven that they can cut through the red tape, you know? You know, don't give me the guy who added tape to the tape, you know, give me someone who can cut through the tape.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Can you be effective in this role, Mr. Brown?
BROWN: Absolutely. I can -- in fact, what that commentator or that comment points out is that the red tape that exists within the Department of Homeland Security is exactly what created the problems for me and FEMA in Hurricane Katrina.
The problems that we experienced at the state level, even at the local level, even in St. Bernard Parish, the people that I'm trying to help, we would all recognize that it was the red tape that was causing us problems. And that's what I can cut through, because I know where that blasted red tape is that created problems for me down in New Orleans, in Mississippi, and in Alabama.
COLLINS: Specifically, though, what is it that you think you can help with the most in St. Bernard Parish?
BROWN: I can help them understand what exactly it is that FEMA is looking for when it comes to documentation. I can explain to them what they are doing in terms of their procurement process, what they are trying to do to get the debris removed, the ways that they might be able to do that within the confines of the law, what meets the law, but yet expedites it and makes it occur quicker.
There's so many things that go on between the FEMA and the Army Corps of Engineers, that at the end of the day, it's kind of the basic contractor for that, working with James Lee Witt, working with Joe Walbaugh (ph) and the others, we can make certain that they are doing things just right to speed up that process for us.
COLLINS: You know, Mr. Brown, I have to say it sounds like you want the job.
BROWN: I want to help in any way I can. Look, I have got a great group of clients all over the country. You see one of their products behind me right now, Redialert Onscreen. I'm working with people to do housing projects down in Mississippi. We have a lot of things going that are helping people.
That's why I took the FEMA job, was to help people. They can criticize all they want to about how things fell apart in Katrina, and I'm the first to admit that they did and I'm the first to spell out things that we could be doing to make it work right.
COLLINS: Is that why you want to help so much now? I'm sorry, is that why you want to help so much now, Mr. Brown? You are taking responsibility for some mistakes that were made. Do you feel like that's a way that you can feel better about that?
BROWN: Heidi, I did that in both -- I took responsibility in both congressional hearings. I have taken responsibility in speeches I have given around the country about things that went wrong. I'm willing to shoulder and admit those mistakes. I want the administration and Congress to do the same thing, and then fix the stuff that needs to be fixed so this doesn't happen again.
COLLINS: All right, Mr. Brown, I know that you are at the hurricane conference in Orlando right now as we are talking to you. How do you feel, after everything that you have learned while you were there, about if the state is ready, or the area is ready for a hurricane season? It begins June 1st.
BROWN: Well, can I tell you one thing. The state and locals are ready. They are doing everything they can. State and local emergency management understands that they are going to have to be the first line of defense when it comes to these kinds of events. What worries me, quite honestly, is the administration and DHS. I heard today two speeches in which people gave the same kinds of platitudes, the same kind of talking points that I had been given about how things worked better within DHS, and I'm telling you that's simply not true. We need to have more accountability. Just like I've stepped up and made myself accountable, the department needs to do the same.
COLLINS: And time is running out. As we said, June 1st, that hurricane season will not wait for anyone.
BROWN: That's right.
COLLINS: That's for sure.
BROWN: That's right. That's right.
COLLINS: Former FEMA director Michael Brown, thank you for your time here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COLLINS: Up ahead tonight, the toxic cloud at Ground Zero on 9/11. Are rescue workers who were exposed to it dying more than five years later? We'll tell you about a first of its kind case.
And Tom Cruise says he knows the secret to mental health, but some psychiatrists think his ideas are dangerous. We'll tell about the actor's latest attack on their profession.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: We have some news just in to CNN about a situation in Cincinnati. Our Fredricka Whitfield has been monitoring that situation. Fred, what's happening?
WHITFIELD: Hello again, Heidi. Well an arrest has been made in relation to a shooting that took place outside the Cincinnati City Hall earlier today. A man known as Kabaka Oba who is also Michael Bailey, who was a well-known African-American activist just spoken before the Cincinnati City Hall. When he walked outside and was shot several times. Police say he was able to identify the gunmen and that being Howard Beatty. Police were able to make an arrest.
And a short time ago, Cincinnati's lieutenant colonel James Whalen had this to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LT. COL. JAMES WHALEN, CINCINNATI POLICE DEPT: There's been an ongoing dispute between Kabaka and the Beattys that goes back several months. Exactly what led to the incident today that sparked this kind of violence, I can't speculate on. But we are aware that did exist. Additionally, there was a restraining order in effect that ordered Howard Beatty to stay at least 500 feet away from Kabaka Oba.
(END VIDEO CLIP) WHITFIELD: So Howard Beatty is now in custody and will likely face charges of this alleged shooting of Michael Bailey, also known as Kabaka Oba, there in Cincinnati, who remains in serious condition at a hospital right now -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right, Fredricka, thanks for the update.
Another 9/11 death, almost five years after that dark day. An autopsy says the death this past January of a 34-year-old New York City police officer is quote, "directly related to the terror attacks." CNN's Mary Snow is live for us in New York now with the story. Hi, Mary.
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Heidi. This is the first known case of an autopsy officially linking a death to the recovery work at Ground Zero. The officer's family says it's proof of what they suspected all along.
A New Jersey coroner concluded that officer James Zadroga died of respiratory failure due to a history of exposure to toxic fumes and dust.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW (voice-over): Is the toxic cloud that engulfed Ground Zero following the September 11th attacks now claiming victims? A coroner confirms police officer James Zadroga's lung failure and subsequent death in January was linked to the officer's 400-plus hours of work at Ground Zero.
Quote, "It is felt with a reasonable degree of medical certainty that the cause of death in this case was directly related to the 9/11 incident."
Dr. Jacqueline Moline was not involved with the autopsy but is tracking 9/11 related health problems.
DR. JACQUELINE MOLINE, WTC MEDICAL MONITORING PROGRAM: In some very susceptible individuals, they may develop this profound scarring of the lungs that can actually lead to respiratory failure.
SNOW: Zadroga's family is going public because they want Zadroga's death to be classified as dying in the line of duty. So four-year-old daughter Tyler Ann can get his full pension benefits. Tyler's mother died two years ago. The NYPD tells CNN it is evaluating the proposal. Zadroga's family acknowledges officers were aware of the risks of working at Ground Zero.
JOSEPH ZADROGA, FATHER OF DECEASED OFFICER: They all knew that it was detrimental to their health. You had to be a fool not to realize that. They knew that, yet they still stayed there and worked.
SNOW: Officers who worked alongside Zadroga at Ground Zero joined his family at a press conference. They said this official cause of death raises questions about their own illnesses.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My name is Detective Ernest Vilavona (ph). I have non-Hodgkin's lymphoma.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm Detective Al Shuey (ph), I have multiple myeloma.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have lung disease.
SNOW: Doctors say the mystery remains why some are reporting problems and others are not.
MOLINE: It's individual susceptibilities. In the same way that we know that smoking causes lung damage and cancer, but not all smokers get lung damage or cancer.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: Now late today, city officials responded to questions about health concerns of 9/11 officers saying quote, "there is no scientific evidence showing an increase of cancer rates among uniformed services personnel or other persons who worked in World Trade Center or that links cancer to work done at the site" -- Heidi.
COLLINS: Mary Snow, thank you.
Turning back now to our top story. There is a development in the trial of al Qaeda conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui. Let's go ahead and get the latest from our Internet reporter Abbi Tatton -- Abbi.
ABBI TATTON, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Heidi, this just posted at the U.S. District Court Web site in Virginia, where the trial is taking place.
A special verdict form, this is the actual form that jurors are going to be looking at when they decide whether Moussaoui gets the death penalty. It goes through point by point whether the prosecution has proven or not proven a whole list of things, and there are many here.
Whether Moussaoui's actions resulted in the deaths of 3,000 people. It goes on to specify who those people were, 343 members of the New York City fire department, members of the port authority.
It even talks about the disruption -- the destruction of equipment, of services on trains. The closure of parks in New York City. There are 37 pages of these details. And then, ultimately, when the sentence of death should be imposed on Moussaoui. This now one of hundreds of documents available online at the U.S. District Court Web site pertaining to this case -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right, Abbi, thank you.
Up ahead, actor Tom Cruise takes a new shot at psychiatry and medication for depression. We'll tell you what he's saying now.
Plus, who's to blame for the president's credibility problem: the White House or the media? Jack Cafferty's taking your e-mail.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: The bottom line on the markets today. The Dow, the NASDAQ and S&P all ended the day in positive territory, so that can't be bad.
Well, tonight, Tom Cruise is sharpening his role as leading advocate for the Church of Scientology. And, as someone who knows how to stir up controversy, the actor has unleashed a new attack on psychiatry and prescriptions for depression.
CNN's Chris Lawrence is covering the story for us in Los Angeles.
Hi Chris.
CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey Heidi.
Tom Cruise is coming down hard again on certain psychiatrist drugs, and it looks like his criticisms may be having an effect.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LAWRENCE (voice-over): The Church of Scientology released this promotional video last year to celebrate the opening up its psychiatric museum, a building dedicated to exposing what members call an industry of death.
In the latest issue of "G.Q.," Scientologist Tom Cruise supports natural treatments that include vitamins. He criticizes doctors who prescribe drugs to people with mental or emotional problems, quote, "Certainly children should never, ever, ever be on these drugs, because they don't want to be on them. They don't have a choice."
Cruise says the Church of Scientology's campaign is paying off, quote, "It is not just me. Look at the FDA, look at the black-box warnings."
Some psychiatrists say efforts by the church and others help convinced federal officials to tag many medications.
DR. MARC GRAFF, PSYCHIATRIST: Warning labels have scared people off. There are less prescriptions written for certain kinds of medications than there were just a year or two ago.
LAWRENCE: Dr. Marc Graff says the best example is anti- depressants for teenagers.
GRAFF: If you have people frightened even to come into the office and get a comprehensive evaluation, you have done people a disservice. I think the FDA heavy-handed black-box warning warnings is really not accomplishing much but frightening people.
LAWRENCE: Psychiatrists say all the criticism is demonizing drugs that help people.
GRAFF: I take medication for cardiac problems. And people don't say, oh, my God, you're on a medication for cardiac problems. And people say, oh, I'm glad you're getting treatment. I think that should be the attitude toward psychiatric illness too.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LAWRENCE: Yes, in the magazine Cruise says he's always been suspicious of the rationale, as long as it makes me feel good, it's OK. Cruise says he has personally helped people get off drugs using the Scientology programs -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right, Chris Lawrence in Los Angeles tonight.
Chris thanks.
NASA scientists have announced they intend to ram a object, the size of a SUV, into the surface of the moon at thousands of miles per hour. Why? Well, they're looking for drinking water.
Our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner has the details.
Jacki, what is this about?
JACKI SCHECHNER, INTERNET REPORTER: Heidi, the video is really cool. NASA has animated the mission. You can get it off their web site, Nasa.gov. Basically this is what it is, it is a satellite called LCROSS and they are going to crash it into a crater near the south pole of the moon. That is going to emit a plume, and then a second orbiter is going to study it to find out if there is water inside of it.
The idea is that if there is water, they might be able to mine it, purify it, turn it into drinking water. We can also use the hydrogen and the oxygen from this and turn it into rocket fuel. This would help with future lunar landings. We can even set up a colony. It would also help for future missions to Mars.
Now, all of this information -- again, you can see the crash there it is pretty great -- on the NASA web site. And this mission is set to launch October 2008. It is the first of a series of missions that will continue until 2016 -- Heidi.
COLLINS: Yes, that was pretty cool.
All right, Jacki Schechner, thank you
Let's go ahead and find out what's coming up next hour on "PAULA ZAHN NOW."
Hi there Paula.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Hi Heidi.
Coming about seven minutes from now, we will have more from the federal court in Virginia, where jurors in the Moussaoui trial heard the absolutely incredibly painful cockpit recordings made aboard flight 93 on September 11. I'll be talking with the son of two of the victims, who has had to endure listening to these audio tapes several times now. His reaction coming up. Also, one of the most powerful people on Capitol Hill using his personal staff as personal servants. We're going hear their stories as well.
And then you have seen those little cameras on car dashboards. Well, if everybody had them in their cars, would it make our highways any safer? We're going to show you some absolutely pictures of things that have happened along our nation's roadways. Not something that you want to have happen to you, but some people are hoping these cameras might save the rest of the same kind of pain.
COLLINS: Interesting all right, Paula. We will be watching 8:00. Thank you.
ZAHN: Thanks Heidi.
COLLINS: Still ahead tonight, the White House attacks the media. Who's really to blame for the credibility problem? Jack Cafferty's taking your e-mail.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Back now to Jack with "The Cafferty File" in New York.
Hi Jack.
CAFFERTY: Thanks Heidi.
We have found the weapons of mass destruction or at least that's what President Bush declared in May 2003, almost two months after the fall of Baghdad. A report in "The Washington Post" said that was false and that some U.S. intelligence officials knew it was false. ABC News reported this morning, the president knew what he was saying was false. ABC has since clarified that statement.
The White House of course not too happy about any of this, and our question is, who is to blame for the president's credibility problem? Is it the media or is it the White House itself?
Scott writes from London, "If the media didn't report on it, we wouldn't know what a dishonest person this president is, so I guess it is the fault of the media that the president has a credibility problem."
John writes from Beaverton, Oregon, "Lying is the problem. The media are the ones discovering the truth."
Meryl in Brooklyn, New York, "It is the media. No, it is the liberals. No, it is the Democrats. It is the anti-war crowd. It is the Axis of Evil. It is the unusual sun spots. It is the moon bounce. Yes, that is it. It is the moon bounce. So pay no attention to the articles coming out about just how many lies our president has told. The one thing we can be sure of, no matter how lies he tells, it is never his fault."
Ginger in Augusta, Georgia, "The one thing the Republicans have been consistent about is staying on point and blaming the messenger. That particular message is getting very old. The media didn't get us into the trouble we're in today. This administration did."
And Joseph writes in Maryland, "If the media in this country would mind their own business and not report everything our president says, most people wouldn't have heard all of Bush's gaffes and lies" -- Heidi.
COLLINS: All right. Jack Cafferty we will see you tomorrow. Thank you.
And thank you for joining us, everybody. I am Heidi Collins in for Wolf Blitzer.
Let's head over now to Paula Zahn in New York.
Hi Paula.
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