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The Situation Room
President Bush Names Rumsfeld's Successor; Interview with Nancy Pelosi; Virginia Senate Race Still Too Close To Call
Aired November 08, 2006 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much and we're bringing you our program today from Capitol Hill. To our viewers, you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where news and information are coming in, new pictures all the time and the latest information.
Standing by, CNN reporters across the United States and around the world bringing you today's top stories. And they're happening right now. A post-election bombshell. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld steps down after voters register their anger about the Iraq war. President Bush says the time is right for new leadership at the Pentagon. We're going to tell you who he's tapped to take the helm and what this all means for the war and for Washington.
Plus, the woman poised to be the next speaker of the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi tells us about her plans for the new Democratic run House. Does she feel vindicated by Rumsfeld's resignation? I spoke with her earlier today.
And the final battles for control of the Senate in Virginia and Montana. One we say has now been settled, the other still undecided. The 2006 election isn't entirely over yet. I'm Wolf Blitzer on Capitol Hill. And you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Up first, we begin with politics -- important politics, a political earthquake here in the nation's capital. First came the election night bombshell on Capitol Hill. Today, an almost equally powerful aftershock. After months of saying Donald Rumsfeld was here to stay, President Bush now says it is time for him to go. Today Mr. Bush announced Rumsfeld's resignation as defense secretary. He says he'll nominate former CIA director Robert Gates to succeed him. The three men in the Oval Office just a short time ago.
At a news conference earlier today, the president acknowledged that voters across the nation vented their concerns about the war. And he said he shares a large part of the responsibility for Republicans losing control of the House. Today Mr. Bush is promising to work with Democrats and the woman in line to become the speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi. She too, is talking about partnership after a very bitter election. My one on one interview with Nancy Pelosi, that's coming up.
In the battle for the Senate, the Democrats appear to have picked up a seat in Montana. CNN now projects that Democrat Jon Tester will win the Montana Senate race, defeating incumbent Republican Conrad Burns. As it stands right now, CNN projects the Democrats will win 50 Senate seats, the Republicans will win 49. The Virginia Senate contest still too close to call.
It now appears Virginia will be the state that decides which party controls the United States Senate. The best political team on television standing by to bring us all the latest developments. Let's go to the White House first. Kathleen Koch with late breaking developments there.
KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, a very emotional appearance in the Oval Office just 30 minutes ago. President Bush introducing his selection as his next secretary of defense, Robert Gates, now, the president of Texas A&M. And saying farewell to a man who he has stood by since the start of the Iraq war and who he earlier this afternoon described as a trusted adviser and friend.
And speaking about Robert Gates, former CIA director, President Bush said he's a patriot with a wealth of experience who would not only be able to well handle the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but also lead the Department of Defense and reach out to both parties in Congress.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: He knows that the challenge of protecting our country is larger than any political party. And he has a record of working with leaders on both sides of the aisle to strengthen our national security. He has my confidence and my trust. And he will be an outstanding secretary of defense.
Bob follows in footsteps of one of America's most skilled and capable national security leaders, Donald Rumsfeld. Don is the longest serving member in my cabinet. And next month, he will reach another milestone when he becomes the longest serving secretary of defense in the history of our nation. I appreciate his willingness to continue serving until his successor is in place. Because in a time of war, our nation cannot be without a strong and steady hand leading our Department of Defense.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KOCH: Now, Donald Rumsfeld thanked President Bush for the opportunity to serve as a defense secretary for the second time in his career. He said it has been quite a time and quoting another leader during a time of war, Winston Churchill.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD RUMSFELD, DEFENSE SECRETARY: I have benefited greatly from criticism, and at no time have I suffered a lack thereof. The great respect that I have for your leadership, Mr. President, in this little understood, unfamiliar war, the first war of the 21st century. It is not well known, it was not well understood. It is complex for people to comprehend. And I know with certainty that over time the contributions you've made will be recorded by history.
(END VIDEO CLIP) KOCH: An emotional Rumsfeld concluded praising the patriotism and the dedication of the young men and women in the U.S. military, saying that they have his respect and that they have been his constant inspiration. Wolf?
BLITZER: Kathleen Koch at the White House for us. Thanks very much. Here on Capitol Hill, the ramifications are enormous, especially for the woman who would be the next speaker of the House of Representatives. Dana Bash standing by with more on that. Dana?
DANA BASH, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The Capitol today for the first time as presumptive speaker of the House. She certainly had her talking points down. One of them was to keep pounding away at the White House for new leadership at the Pentagon. Well, little did she know she was about to get her wish.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BASH (voice-over): Democrats called their election night sweep a mandate for change in Iraq.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D), CALIFORNIA: Nowhere was the call for a new direction more clear from the American people than in the war in Iraq.
BASH: They didn't have to wait long to see the spoils of their victories. Just as Democratic leaders sat down for a celebratory photo op, they got the news, Donald Rumsfeld was fired.
PELOSI: I think it will give a fresh start to finding a solution to Iraq rather than staying the course.
SEN. HARRY REID (D) NEVADA: If the vote of last night, from all over America, didn't accomplish anything but this, it was a good night.
BASH: But beyond the Rumsfeld bombshell, Democrats all but acknowledged even with control of the House and maybe the Senate, there is only so much they can do to change Iraq policy.
PELOSI: The president is the president of the United States. I hope that he will listen to the voices of the people and that again putting aside partisanship and looking to a partnership to end this war.
BASH: That's part of this double-barreled approach set by the presumptive House speaker -- a pledge for bipartisanship along with a firm promise to push for new policies.
Beyond Iraq, Nancy Pelosi has an ambitious agenda. In the first 100 hours, she wants to raise the minimum wage to $7.25 an hour, enact recommendations from the 9/11 Commission, cut interest rates for student loans, try to lower prescription drug prices under you Medicare and more.
Democrats also promise new strict oversight of the Bush White House. But the woman whose new caucus will be made up of many conservative Democrats from red districts also tried to allay concerns about her liberal route.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BASH: Now Republicans are also sifting through the wreckage of their losses. Today the current House Speaker Dennis Hastert formally announced that he would not longer be a part of the Republican leadership. And already angry members of the Republican rank and file are saying that Republicans simply got what they deserved because the party had lost their way and many of them are already throwing their hats into the ring to be a new crop of Republican leaders.
For example, conservative Congressman Mike Pence announced formally that he would run for the top slot, what will be minority leader of the House. And he's going to have to run against John Boehner, who currently is the majority leader -- Wolf?
BLITZER: All right Dana, thanks very much. And earlier today, I had a chance to sit down with the new speaker, the incoming speaker of the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi. We spoke about the elections, we spoke about what's going on in Washington. And we also spoke about Donald Rumsfeld's resignation.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: Let's talk about the news of the day, lots of news. But we'll start with Donald Rumsfeld. Bombshell announcement, only a few days ago the president said he was doing a fantastic job, together with the Vice President Dick Cheney. Is this what you wanted, Rumsfeld to step down?
PELOSI: Yes, well, there were two major interventions since the president's last reaffirmation of his support for Secretary Rumsfeld. One was, of course, the vote and voice of the American people yesterday, rejecting the stay the course policy of the president in Iraq. And just before that, the voice of the military in the Army, Navy, Air Force and Marine Corps Times, saying that "Rumsfeld must go," to use their words. The president got the message, thank heavens, and I think it signals a new change, I hope, for the better in Iraq.
BLITZER: What do you think of his designated successor, the former CIA Director Robert Gates?
PELOSI: Well, this is a matter for the Senate to deliberate on. And the president has proposed they will confirm. And I very much look forward to the hearings on that nomination.
BLITZER: But fundamentally, do you think there will be a real change in U.S. policy toward Iraq? Or this is simply changing the cast of characters? Will the president, in other words, do what you want him to do?
PELOSI: Well, first of all, the president is the commander-in- chief. Donald Rumsfeld and whoever the president appoints or is confirmed, Mr. Gates in this case, is an employee of the president. So the policy is the president's. The implementation of the policy is Mr. Rumsfeld. And that's why I think it was important for him to go.
BLITZER: If the president pursues the current policy, as you call it, stay the course -- which he no longer uses, that phrase -- one option would be, in the House of Representatives, the power of the first, to cut funding for the war in Iraq. Is that on the table?
PELOSI: Not really. We would never...
BLITZER: Why isn't it on the table?
PELOSI: Well, because our troops are in harm's way. They have been sent there, whether you agree with the policy or not. And I certainly did not agree with the resolution to go to war. We would not withhold our funding for the troops there.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: We'll have a lot more of our interview with Nancy Pelosi. That's coming up in the next hour, right here in the SITUATION ROOM.
But for now I want to bring in our chief national correspondent John King and our senior political correspondent Candy Crowley.
Candy, first, to you.
Between the notion of the Democrats taking over the House of Representatives and poised, potentially, to take over the majority in the United States Senate, and now Donald Rumsfeld resigning as defense secretary on this, the day after the elections, these are hugely dramatic developments. Give us some context.
CANDY CROWLEY, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, they are. And you couldn't have one without the other. It was interesting to learn that the president was thinking about this, and probably has been thinking about this for a lot longer than a week.
The context of it is that it became sort of unsustainable once the election results began to come in. It -- all of the talk was about Mr. President, the American people have spoken, you have to change your policy in Iraq. All of the House leaders -- the Democratic House leaders that came out did that.
It seems to me that for the president to sort of seize back that commander-in-chief role that Nancy Pelosi was just talking about, he needed to do something dramatic to sort of quiet the crowd. Certainly, accomplished that in the resignation of Donald Rumsfeld.
BLITZER: And John, as you look at this, and you know, you've covered this story for so long, what goes through your mind, as far as the shake-up that we're witnessing right now in the nation's capitol?
JOHN KING, CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, the president has two years left in his term, and he was rebuked very sharply in the election yesterday. He has a woman coming to office as the new Speaker of the House with whom he has sparred repeatedly, using some quite personal language over the years.
What you saw today was a politician who knew that he needs new beginning and he has only two years before the end. And so he had to give them what they wanted. Both Democrats and Republicans wanted Donald Rumsfeld, well, today they got Donald Rumsfeld.
And then the president's trying to pivot: hey, we can do business on the minimum wage, we can do business on immigration, we can maybe do business on a few other issues.
Iraq will still be the issue because he's not budging. And even as Nancy Pelosi says, let's start to bring the troops home, John McCain came out of the box and said, we need to fix Iraq, we need to win Iraq, we might need more troops.
So this drama is in a new chapter, but it's a pretty packed, exciting chapter to go. But the president is trying to say, let's start over, I'm going to reach out to the Democrats, something the Democrats would say has been sorely missing for six years.
BLITZER: And Candy, only within the past few minutes we heard from the junior senator from New York, Hillary Rodham Clinton, who herself was reelected yesterday.
She's weighing in on Rumsfeld's resignation as well. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON, (D-NY): The president made the right decision today. I wish he'd made it earlier. But now we can have a new beginning, a new face, at the Pentagon who doesn't carry the baggage that Secretary Rumsfeld carried.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: So is the campaign for the White House 2008, Candy, already underway?
CROWLEY: Yes. It continues, actually. A part of what Senator Clinton needed to do over this past year or so is, first of all, show her defense and military creds. She needed to be both tough and muscular in her language about the use of force. On the other hand, increasingly on the left wing of her party for the past two years has come this, you know, very loud anti-war "get out now" crowd.
So she had to balance -- and I think has done a pretty good job of balancing those two needs when you want to begin to shape your resume.
She in fact called for Donald Rumsfeld's resignation a little while back, but a number of others had already done it. And when it seemed that she wasn't being sort of tough enough on the administration, that's when she called during a hearing for his resignation, to kind of up that half of her resume.
BLITZER: John, how shaken is the White House by what has happened over the past 24 hours?
KING: Well, clearly they knew it was coming. They said all along they were confident, they were optimistic, they were going to hold their majorities. But you had the meeting with Secretary Rumsfeld and Mr. Gates taking place before the election, so they knew they were going to have to pivot after the election.
They knew at a minimum they were going to lose seats and, truth be told, they were pretty sure they were going to lose the House majority and were holding out hope for the Senate. So it is not a surprise to them, but it is a slap at them.
And one of the big challenges here is, can George W. Bush go back to being the guy who came to Washington as the Texas governor, who had a history of dealing with the Democrats, who said he thought Washington was this partisan, awful town, and he wanted to change the tone.
The Democrats would say -- and most people in the White House would concede -- he has, since being president, run a clearly conservative base -- conservative base driven strategy and pretty much ignored the Democrats on just about every issue.
There was the education deal with Ted Kennedy early on, the Medicare prescription drug deal early on, but he has not, especially on issues of national security, which is now the big -- here's the cliche again -- elephant in the room, Iraq, he has not consulted the Democrats enough.
He said he would today. He laid it out there today. We'll see how this all plays out. And boy, does Mr. Gates have a tough job.
BLITZER: And John, I know you covered this president for a long time. When he said last week in that interview with wire service reporters that the vice president and Donald Rumsfeld were doing, in his words, a fantastic job. And he said that both of them would stay until he left office, January 20th, 2009.
He sort of acknowledged today, you know, he knew that was not necessarily going to be the case. But how is he playing that? Because I couldn't have the -- I couldn't but have the impression that when he said that to the wire service reporters last week, he knew it wasn't necessarily true.
KING: He did know it wasn't true. And that's one of those moments, I guess, where you don't want to be president. And welcome to the presidency. He said that he didn't want to leak then news, didn't want the news to come out before the election because it would be viewed in a political context. So essentially, he didn't tell the whole truth.
Did he lie to the wire service reporters? Did he just withhold information? You know, we can have a semantics debate to the end. But the president conceded the fact. He was not ready to make the announcement. He thought if he gave them any hints or clues, it would throw a whole new dicey bombshell into the political climate before the election. So he fudged.
BLITZER: He fudged indeed, and he had to acknowledge that today.
John King, thanks very much.
Candy Crowley, thanks to you.
John and Candy, Dana, Kathleen Koch: they are all part of the best political team on television.
And remember, for all the political news, at any time, you can always go to our CNN political ticker, CNN.com/ticker.
Also part of the best political team on television, Jack Cafferty. He's standing by with the "Cafferty File".
Hi, Jack.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf, now that the Democrats are the new majority in the House and maybe the Senate, the question immediately arises, where do they go from here?
Iraq's at the top of the list. Another 21 U.S. military deaths there so far this month. Maybe it ought to be number one.
Senator Harry Reid sent President Bush a letter asking for a summit with Congressional leaders on Iraq. The Democrat who is set to become chairman of the House Armed Services Committee, that would be Congressman Ike Skelton, says they will re-examine U.S. policy in Iraq and institute better oversight of the Pentagon.
That's not all, not by a longshot. Nancy Pelosi, expected to be the new Speaker, says in the first 100 hours of the new session, she will push for implementing all of the 9/11 Commission recommendations, raise the minimum wage, get rid of corporate subsidies for oil companies and impose new restrictions on lobbyists. It's a very tall order.
Here's the question, what shall the Democrats' priorities be in the new Congress? E-mail your thoughts to CaffertyFile@CNN.com or go to CNN.com/CaffertyFile -- Wolf.
BLITZER: And Jack, as you know, the Democrats will be, for sure, the majority in the House of Representatives, and they are poised, potentially, to be the majority in the U.S. Senate as well, if that vote count in Virginia goes their way.
Right now the Democratic candidate, Jim Webb, slightly ahead of George Allen. I can't stress to you and our viewers how significant that would be, if the Democrats are the majority not only in the House, but in the Senate as well. This is really going to put a damper on these last two years of the Bush administration. CAFFERTY: It also points out the significance of everyone's vote and how few votes may wind up at the end of the day tipping the balance of power in the most powerful nation in the world.
BLITZER: Jack, we'll see you soon. Thanks very much.
Coming up, we're going to have much more on the breaking news. We're covering the resignation of Donald Rumsfeld as defense secretary. I'll speak with Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan. They're standing by for today's "Strategy Session".
What does it mean?
Plus, more on the battle for control of the Senate. It's all come down right now to Virginia and we're going to go live to Richmond where the voters are still, the votes that is, are still being counted.
And a Big-Sky victory for the Democrats in Montana. We're live on the campaign trail from Billings, Montana. And, I'm live on Capitol Hill. And you're in the SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back. Here on Capitol Hill, the balance of power in the Senate very much hanging in the balance right now. The latest CNN projection gives Democrats 50 seats, 49 to the Republicans. One undecided race will determine which party controls Congress. That would be in Virginia where the battle between Democrat Jim Webb and Republican incumbent George Allen continues. The latest raw vote totals shows Webb with a razor thin lead over Allen. Webb has declared victory but Allen is not conceding and a recount seems almost inevitable.
In Montana, Democrat Jon Tester has declared victory over Republican incumbent Conrad Burns. And CNN projects Tester will ultimately be the winner. Tester has a narrow lead in the raw vote count. A recount is possible, but is considered less likely in Montana. CNN's Dan Simon is standing by in Montana. But first, let's bring in CNN's Brian Todd, he's joining us from Richmond in Virginia. Brian, what's the latest?
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, the latest is we're getting reports that James Webb is already starting to assume the mantel of Senator-elect. We're being told that he's starting to name members of a transition team. One report says he's starting to call himself Senator-elect. That's to be assumed in a situation like this for any candidate.
But right now, it really is too close to call. Some precincts are still being canvassed at this hour. A couple of hours ago, we were told, that at least three precincts were still outstanding and the margin is, as you mentioned a moment ago, razor thin.
We're told about 7,000 votes is the lead for Mr. Webb right now. That is less than one-third of one percent of the vote in Virginia. That is what the U.S. Senate hangs on right now. We've not heard from George Allen today. We've heard from his campaign, the Allen campaign saying that they're going to respect this process. They've not said flat out that they are going to call for a recount. They have until November 27th. Next week is when the canvassing will end.
November 14th the deadline for that. Then on November 27th is the deadline for the vote certification. On that date if Mr. Allen is less than 1 percent of the vote behind, he has the right to request a recount. And we should note by that time whether he will do so. We can expect now that he will probably do so if this result holds the way it is -- Wolf.
BLITZER: And in terms of the actual hard number, the advantage that Webb has over Allen right now, there are a few thousand, what is approximately -- what's that number as far as the latest tally is concerned?
TODD: Right now we're getting that the number is at about 7,000, give or take a couple hundred. We hear different figures. They all hover around 7,000, Wolf. It is a razor thin margin in this state because -- 100 percent of the vote here. That's well within the margin to ask for a recount.
BLITZER: All right, Brian, thanks very much. Brian, we'll be checking back with you. It all boils down right now to Virginia. Brian Todd reporting.
And there's another development just coming in to the SITUATION ROOM from Montana. Let's go to Dan Simon. He's joining us from Billings -- Dan.
DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi, Wolf. CNN and others may have declared this race for Jon Tester, but Senator Burns not ready to concede. We just got this statement a few minutes ago. It's a short statement, I'm going to read it. It says, "Jon Tester ran a good race and has the lead right now, but it is extremely close. The state of Montana has a process in place and it is our obligation to see it through."
Now, Wolf, in terms of the numbers, right now Jon Tester has a 3,000-vote lead. In order for there to be a recount, the margin of victory has to be within one-half of one percent, which would mean 2,000. We understand there are a few votes left to be counted ....
BLITZER: Unfortunately, we lost that connection to Billings, Montana. We'll check back with Dan Simon. But clearly it's not over yet as far as Conrad Burns is concerned, the Republican incumbent. He's not ready to concede even though the indications are that Jon Tester, the Democrat, will be the next United States senator from Montana.
That brings the Democratic total up to 50 if they eventually are certified the winners in Virginia, that will be 51, the Democrats will be in the majority in the Senate. We know they are already in the majority in the House of Representatives. Coming up next, why did the vote go the way it did? Many exit polls are telling us what was on your mind on election day and where Iraq ranked among the issues you care about? Our senior political analyst Bill Schneider standing by with some answers.
And conservative assessment. What are the conservatives on talk radio saying about the big Democratic wins? We're going to bring you the latest buzz. I'm Wolf Blitzer on Capitol Hill and you're in the SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back to THE SITUATION ROOM. I'm Wolf Blitzer on Capitol Hill.
Let's get back to our top story" -- the breaking news, Donald Rumsfeld calling it quits as defense secretary.
Just a short while ago, President Bush appeared with Rumsfeld and the man tapped to replace him, the former CIA chief Robert Gates. Rumsfeld says he's benefited greatly from the criticism he's received in his tenure as the Pentagon chief -- all this coming a day after voters sent a very clear message to the Bush administration about its handling of the war in Iraq.
Let's bring in our senior political analyst, Bill Schneider -- Bill.
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Wolf, does Donald Rumsfeld's resignation have anything to do with the election? You bet.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER (voice-over): What was the message of this election? Ask the winners.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), MINORITY LEADER: Nowhere was the call for a new direction more clear from the American people than in the war in Iraq.
SCHNEIDER: The voters' views were clear in our national exit poll. A clear majority of voters said they disapprove of the war in Iraq. Those numbers closely match people's views of President Bush, suggesting that the Iraq war now defines the president. But did it affect the vote? Yes.
Fifty-nine percent of voters who disapproved of the war in Iraq said they voted to oppose President Bush.
PELOSI: The more the president campaigned on the war, the fewer votes the Republicans who supported that got. And that -- it took its toll on the Republicans.
SCHNEIDER: It even took a toll on Republicans who opposed the war, like Senator Lincoln Chafee, who lost his reelection bid in Rhode Island. Chafee voted against the war, but anti-war voters in Rhode Island went nearly 2-1 for Chafee's Democratic opponent. ALEXANDER BOLTON, REPORTER: As much as they might have liked Lincoln Chafee, they wanted to send a message to Bush.
SCHNEIDER: Message received? Sort of.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe Iraq had a lot to do with the election, but I believe there's other factors as well.
SCHNEIDER: What were the voters trying to say? Simply this: They want to see U.S. troops begin to withdraw.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: Starting with Donald Rumsfeld, because nearly half of Americans polled last month said they thought the secretary of defense should resign -- Wolf.
BLITZER: All right.
What a bombshell today. Bill, thanks very much for that.
Let's bring in our senior analyst, Jeff Greenfield.
Jeff, give us a little historic context right now to what's happening in -- in Washington, D.C.
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN SENIOR ANALYST: Well, the question is whether this signals a change not in personnel, but in policy. And I couldn't help thinking back to the Vietnam era.
Early in 1968, President Johnson had become disillusioned with Defense Secretary McNamara, who himself had become disillusioned with the war and prospects for victory. He was also a close friend of Robert Kennedy, who was contemplating a challenge.
So, Johnson replaced McNamara with Clark Clifford, a longtime Washington insider, a Washington political operative for the Democratic Party, and a well-know hawk, at the time the Pentagon was pushing for 200,000 more troops in Vietnam. There were already 500,000.
Clifford took one look at the situation -- or, rather, a long look -- and decided the war was unwinnable, and, within a short amount of time, convinced the president to change course, go for a bombing halt, temporary, go for negotiations, and, of course, not seek reelection.
A question this time is whether the appointment of Robert Gates signals some kind of decision that they have already decided to change policy, wait for the recommendations of the Jim Baker-Lee Hamilton Iraq security group, and realize that they could not implement any kind of substantive change in Iraq policy with one of the architects of the present policy, Donald Rumsfeld -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Is there -- is there a sense that you're getting that the Vietnam analogy -- and I know it's -- a lot of people have been making those comparisons -- is applicable right now, Jeff? Because this is the last two years of the Bush administration. And this president clearly can't get himself reelected, even if he wanted to.
GREENFIELD: For a while, I was one of those who didn't think there was an analogy. There was no draft, and, therefore, much less political pressure on the president.
The -- the casualties, while awful, are a fraction of what they were in Vietnam. But the analogy I think is -- is best captured by a famous song of the Vietnam era, "Waist Deep in the Big Muddy." Americans do not like long wars, when they can't see either a clear path to victory or progress.
As has often been said by its critics, this now has gone on just about as long as American participation in World War II. And the sense that things were not getting any better is so pervasive that, as you know, Wolf, in this recent election, you have Republican after Republican, including some of the stalwart supporters of Iraq, like Chris Shays, saying, maybe we need a change of course; maybe we need a new secretary of defense.
And that's where, I think, the analogy is applicable -- Wolf.
BLITZER: We are going to continue this conversation.
Jeff, thanks very much.
Coming up soon here in THE SITUATION ROOM, the former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger -- he knows a great deal about wartime elections and their fallout. He will join us in the next hour to talk about the Rumsfeld resignation, the Democratic takeover of the House.
And up next: the rough morning after for Donald Rumsfeld and for President Bush. Is the Pentagon chief's resignation enough to satisfy those angry voters out there? Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan, they're standing by for our "Strategy Session."
Much more of our election coverage live from Capitol Hill -- you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: The winds of change are howling here in Washington right now. Not only do the final election results signal a power shift to Democratic hands in the House, and possibly the U.S. Senate as well -- the Bush administration also signaling a possibly big shift on Iraq, with the defense secretary Donald Rumsfeld's resignation.
Joining us now for today's "Strategy Session," Democratic strategist Paul Begala and Republican strategist Bay Buchanan.
Paul, let me start with you.
Would it have made any difference in this election, do you believe, if Rumsfeld would have resigned, let's say, a week ago? PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, even better for the Republicans if it had been a few months ago.
We saw all across the country Democrats pressing Republicans, saying, Rumsfeld should resign, and Republicans being in the awful position of being disloyal to their president, who has helped them enormously over the years, or hurting themselves politically.
The president, if he was going to make this change, should have done it a long time ago. Worse still, though, he went out of his way to mislead the country. Just a few days ago, he was asked, and he didn't just say his usual response, well, he's doing a good job, or, I have confidence in him. He said, he's going to be here for the next two years.
When he made that statement, he was already interviewing Bob Gates to take his job. That's going to hurt Mr. Bush's credibility terribly in the future.
BLITZER: Don't -- I -- I think a lot of people, Bay Buchanan, will agree that the president was caught in, shall we say, a little bit of a fib there.
BAY BUCHANAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: There's no question. There's no question he was.
But I think what the American people are concerned about really right now is -- is, we have the first step. They obviously -- they have rejected the president's leadership. They have rejected his Iraqi policy. They have even rejected Republican leadership across the board.
And -- so, what did the president do? He receives the message. He says, OK, with Iraq, obviously a key issue, let's get started. Donald Rumsfeld is the face of stay the course. Move him out. It gives both Republicans -- it gives Democrats and the American people the feeling that maybe he's open-minded to some changes here. That's a first step.
But they're looking for the second one.
BLITZER: And, Paul, so, what do you think happens now, as far as Iraq strategy is concerned? Because, as you know, Robert Gates, the man designated to be the next defense secretary, he's got a little bit of a different reputation than Donald Rumsfeld has.
BEGALA: Well, absolutely. He comes out of a long career in public service, but particularly the Bush I administration.
And, of course, President Bush's father and Donald Rumsfeld were famous and pretty intense rivals in their younger days. And, so, now it looks like the triumph of the father over Don Rumsfeld yet again. Of course, it was the father who became president, not Mr. Rumsfeld.
But I have to tell you, I think the president is missing an opportunity here. I'm sure Mr. Gates is a lovely man. I don't know enough about him to pass any kind of intelligent judgment on him.
But he could have -- the president could have today named Joe Lieberman, the Democrat turned independent senator from Connecticut, very strong supporter of the war, and, yet, he was Al Gore's running mate. And the Connecticut voters just reelected their Republican governor yesterday, Jodi Rell. She could then put a Republican in there, and give Republicans control of the Senate for another year or so.
He missed an easy opportunity to both be bipartisan, but also help his political team at the same time. It's a rare opportunity. And I really -- for my sake, I'm glad he missed it, for my party's sake. But I was intrigued that he didn't take that option.
BLITZER: All right, let's shift gears, and talk about Virginia right now, Bay Buchanan, because it -- it would appear that the outcome in that state will determine whether the Democrats or the Republicans are the majority in the United States Senate.
It looks, as of right now, with about 7,000 votes, an advantage for the challenger Jim Webb, as opposed to George Allen. What do you make? Should George Allen demand that kind of recount? Or should he just call it a day?
BUCHANAN: You know, this is a very tough call.
First of all, you're -- you have invested, what, $15 million, $20 million in this effort. You obviously don't want to walk away when you're not sure of the results. I think, if it is not enormously burdensome, this here, in Virginia, it is all electronic. I don't see it's at all -- you have a right to have a recount.
But I would like it not to go to the courts. I think we just have a legitimate recount and stop there. But if -- you know, you could have -- if this thing were to flip, and ended up George Allen winning it, you are going to have resentment going on across this country. It is going to be deeply felt, as if we stole the Senate and -- not only the -- that particular seat, but the Senate itself.
BLITZER: What do you think, Paul?
BEGALA: Yes, I think Bay makes a good point.
Senator Allen presumably still has a desire for a political future. He stumbled desperately. Just a few months ago, dummies like me were seeing him as a very serious candidate for the presidency. And now he's on the verge of being an ex-United States senator. But he's young. And he still has a chance, I think, to have a serious career ahead of him.
This period of time will define him probably even more than his years in the Senate. If he pushes his commonwealth and our country through a long, difficult court battle, the way that Bay is telling him not to -- and I wish he would listen to Bay -- it will hurt him, politically, terribly.
And guess what? He is going to lose. You are not going to pick up 7,000 votes in a recount.
BUCHANAN: Yes.
BEGALA: It is just not going to happen. So -- but I'm sure he has got a lot of pressure from national Republicans, saying, save the Senate. Well, the time to save the Senate was yesterday, when the votes were being cast, not now, in a recount.
BLITZER: Paul Begala and Bay Buchanan, thanks to both of you very much.
And, as you saw...
BUCHANAN: Sure..
BLITZER: ... earlier, Bill Schneider and Jeff Greenfield, all of them are part of the best political team on television.
And, remember, for the latest campaign news at any time, check out the Political Ticker, CNN.com/ticker.
Coming up; She stands to become the first female House speaker in American history. I sat down today here on Capitol Hill with Congresswoman Nancy Pelosi. It's an interview you are going to want to see. That's coming up in our next hour, 5:00 p.m. Eastern, right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Americans took to the nation's modern-day forum today to pick apart the results of yesterday's elections.
Our senior correspondent, Allan Chernoff, spent his day in New York, listening to talk radio -- Allan.
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf.
The radio was buzzing today with calls from Democrats and Republicans, liberals and conservatives, all wanting to share their glory or their grief. After speaking with their votes yesterday, Americans today were speaking their minds on talk radio.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's gratifying to see the Americans finally wake up.
CHERNOFF (voice-over): On liberal talk radio network Air America, Mark (ph) from Oakland was gloating.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was just one of the most...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, Mark...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... incredible and wonderful feelings.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, your point is well taken.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have got our -- we have got our -- we have made the first step. We have got our country back.
CHERNOFF: Democrats were pumped up on talk radio today, energized, feeling new power to demand change.
JOHN GAMBLING, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: You're with John Gambling.
Good morning.
CHERNOFF: New York's Republican-leaning talk show host John Gambling got an earful from some Democratic callers this morning.
GAMBLING: "Bush, wake up." "Now do you have the message?" A couple of them called and said they didn't think he has the message.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have said that we do not want to stay the course anymore. We do not want Rumsfeld. We want a new foreign policy in Iraq. We want someone to listen to us.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think that the Democrats have no intention of working with the Republicans for the next two years. What they're going to try to do is impeach the president.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ladies and gentlemen...
CHERNOFF: The president apparently was listening. An hour later, Derrick (ph) from Brooklyn got a part of his wish, when the president announced Donald Rumsfeld was resigning.
It was a day for Republicans to lick their wounds.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm really sad for this country, because I'm a very disappointed conservative today.
CHERNOFF: But amid the complaints, one Republican caller, Maureen (ph), reminded fellow party members to keep the loss in perspective by recognizing the blessings of democracy.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, we're disappointed, but chins up. We decide our destiny. We can vote in this country.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHERNOFF: When you hear the passion that people have for politics on talk radio, it really makes you wonder why more Americans simply don't vote -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Good question, Allan. Thanks very much.
Up next, we will get reaction to the election and to the Rumsfeld resignation. And it isn't confined necessarily to talk radio. Bloggers, both conservative and liberal, have plenty to stay about what's going on. Also coming up: my interview with Nancy Pelosi, preparing to make history as the first woman speaker of the House. Can she and the president put their bad blood behind them, and get things done here in Washington?
We're reporting live from Capitol Hill on this, the day after the vote.
We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Returning now to our top story, the defense secretary of the United States, Donald Rumsfeld, stepping down, the news, it's being greeted around the world. But how is it being greeted online?
Our Internet reporter, Abbi Tatton, standing by with some details -- Abbi.
ABBI TATTON, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Wolf, and, of course, it's a day of celebrations for liberal bloggers online about their gains in the House, and, also, from conservatives, some of those urging wholesale change in House Republican leadership. That's how the day started.
And, then, with the news about Donald Rumsfeld, the conversation changed a little bit online. And it's the timing of the decision, as much as the decision itself, that is being discussed out there -- one of these to talk about this, liberal Think Progress. They're pointing out that the president told reporters last week that Rumsfeld would not be stepping down, and they're linking to the news conference today, when the president said that he did that to get reporters to move on to another topic. He did not want to inject a major decision on the war into the final days.
And that's been questioned by some, like James Joyner, a conservative at Outside the Beltway, who is asking, well, isn't that exactly the kind of information that would have been useful to voters in the final few days?
But the decision is also getting support from some conservatives online, from "The National Review," calling it very decisive -- Michelle Malkin another conservative, saying that this proves he's not the stubborn cowboy that some people sometimes accuse him of.
But, for the liberals at mydd -- this is a site that's been supporting anti-war candidates throughout this election cycle -- Matt Stoller saying, the Bush administration knew exactly what the election was about, and that's why Donald Rumsfeld is out of office -- Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, Abbi, thank you very much.
Up next, Jack Cafferty returns with your e-mail. The question of the hour: What should the Democrats' priorities be in Congress?
We're live on Capitol Hill, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Let's check back with Jack Cafferty. He's got "The Cafferty File" -- Jack.
CAFFERTY: The question this hour is: What should the Democrats' priorities be in the new Congress in '07?
Jeff in Yellow Springs, Ohio, writes: "Now that the Dems have ridden a wave of voter disgust with Washington into power, they better get some bipartisan work done, pronto. They have got two years to enact the 9/11 Commission findings, promote alternative energy, and end lobbying corruption. If they waste time trying to vilify Republicans with hearings, et cetera, they're going to end up ticking off the voters. And, as we saw last night, the voters can and do show their annoyance at the polls."
Mike writes: "Jack, the first and most important thing the Democrats needs to do is impeach George Bush, so this nation of ours can get back on the right track."
Joe in Kentucky: "Jack, the first priority of the new House should be to bring back the five-day work week. The speaker should give notice that all votes will be taken on Friday of each week. It's time to give the people the right work ethic for the overpay that they now receive."
Mark in New Jersey: "Immigration, immigration, immigration, immigration, in that order."
James: "The day after the election, I haven't heard anyone talking about the genius of Karl Rove. I have three words for Mr. Bush: Touchdown, George. Touchdown."
And Richard in Galena, Ohio: "The Democrats' first priority should be to become the minority party again in 2008" -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Jack, thank you.
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