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The Situation Room
Illinois Manhunt; Will Biden Run?; Trump Rising. Aired 18- 19:00p ET
Aired September 07, 2015 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:07]
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now: the Donald 's rise.
He's steamrolling his competition in two early battlegrounds in new polling that includes surprises for both parties. Can anyone or anything stop Trump?
Significant evidence. As a beloved police officer is laid to rest, authorities suggest there's an important new clue in the mystery surrounding his death. Are they any closer finding suspected killers believed to be on the loose right now?
And taunting the law? A stunning photo surfaces that may show the obscured face of an escaped drug kingpin just weeks after his brazen jailbreak through a tunnel. Did El Chapo's son tip off authorities or send them on a wild good chase?
We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Tonight, Donald Trump's domination of the GOP presidential race grows stronger as the nation marks the unofficial end of summer and the campaign gets more serious. New polls give Trump commanding leads in Iowa and New Hampshire, the states that hold the first two contests of this primary season.
On the Democratic side, Hillary Clinton's front-runner status is taking a serious new hit in Iowa, and in New Hampshire, Bernie Sanders now is number one, surging ahead of Clinton.
Also tonight, the hunt for a brutal drug lord who tunneled his way out of jail. Investigators are closely examining a photo posted online. Experts say it could be a critical clue to El Chapo's whereabouts or a cunning diversion.
We have correspondents, analyst and newsmakers standing by. We're covering all the news that is breaking right now.
First, let's go to CNN national correspondent Suzanne Malveaux. She has the latest on the race for the White House -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is a campaign tradition for presidential hopefuls to take part in Labor Day parades, the picnics, of course, and to court the voters. We have seen plenty of that today, but it's also a critical
turning point as the holiday signifies a sprint to the early contests in Iowa and New Hampshire. But absent on the trail this holiday weekend, Donald Trump, who is dominating the polls in those key states.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX (voice-over): Tonight, the clear front-runner in the Republican race for president.
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I will be totally pledging my allegiance to the Republican Party, and the conservative principles for which it stand.
MALVEAUX: Donald Trump leading his rivals in Iowa with 29 percent, followed by retired neurosurgeon Ben Carson with 22 percent.
BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I believe that this is the greatest nation in the world.
MALVEAUX: No other Republican candidate receives double-digit support.
JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And now it is our turn.
MALVEAUX: Far behind is Jeb Bush with just 6 percent, down from 12 percent in July. And Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker's support has plummeted from 19 percent two months ago to just 5 percent now.
Walker spent the holiday in New Hampshire on a two-day motorcycle campaign swing, trying to project confidence despite the drop in his support.
GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R-WI), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We don't have ads up. I think we get out message out, we talk about who we are, we will be in good shape.
MALVEAUX: In New Hampshire, the number two spot now belongs to Ohio governor John Kasich, who sits at 12 percent to Trump's 28 percent. Kasich's bump in the polls part of a New Hampshire strategy that includes a heavy dose of town halls and paid television ads by a pro-Kasich super PAC.
GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're doing fine here. I always felt that if I could do the town halls and really let people see me, then we would do OK. That's been the history of my political career.
MALVEAUX: Just as in Iowa, Bush and Walker are also losing ground in New Hampshire. Bush down to 8 percent. Walker at 4 percent. Carly Fiorina has moved up to fifth in New Hampshire, saying her campaign is moving in the right direction.
CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have come a long way since May 4. I have come a long way. I'm not worried.
MALVEAUX: But the focus continues to be on Trump. Sarah Palin even pitching him this weekend could possibly serve in his contact.
SARAH PALIN (R), FORMER ALASKA GOVERNOR: I think a lot about Department of Energy. And if I were head of that, I would get rid of it. And I would let the states start having more control over the lands that are within their boundaries. If I were in charge of that, it would be a short-term job.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX: Well, we see Fiorina and Walker and Kasich in Salem, New Hampshire, today. Marco Rubio, who is polling 4 percent in Iowa, 5 percent in New Hampshire, well, he's now moving on to the critical state of South Carolina, where he's participating in a town hall at this hour. Later this week, get ready. Jeb Bush, he's going to be on "The Late Show" and Trump back on the trail on Wednesday. Happy Labor Day, Wolf.
BLITZER: It's going to be exciting from now on. All right. Thanks very much, Suzanne.
[18:05:00]
Let's get to the Democrats and a new slide for Hillary Clinton in the early nominating contest. Check out the numbers. In New Hampshire, Bernie Sanders is building on his lead over Hillary Clinton. He's now nine points ahead, according to a new NBC News/Marist poll. The survey includes Joe Biden, even though the vice president hasn't decided whether to run.
In Iowa, Clinton is ahead, but losing ground. Her lead over Sanders has dropped to 11 points in the new NBC/Marist poll. Will all this encourage the vice president to jump in?
Our senior political correspondent, Brianna Keilar, spoke with the president today. She's joining us live from Pittsburgh.
Brianna, before we talk about Biden, you cover Hillary Clinton at the same time. She must be concerned about these numbers. Right?
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf.
Talking to campaign sources, they won't say, oh, no, we're not concerned. But they are concerned. But they're not hitting the panic button yet, I guess you could say. The way they see it is this. Looking at Bernie Sanders, they think that ultimately Hillary Clinton will be able to contrast her policy proposals with his in a way that will win over supporters, for instance, on things like free college or breaking up the banks, that they will be able to point out where maybe some of his ideas are not realistic.
And then when it comes to the Joe Biden issue, which as you saw in this poll, he outperforms Hillary Clinton against Trump and against Jeb Bush in both of these early contest states, they think that's going to change if Joe Biden gets into the race. They think if he's a candidate and he's under that harsh political spotlight, that he's not going to be performing as well as we see in these polls.
Today, Hillary Clinton, Wolf, was talking in Illinois just a short time ago. She said she has the vision and the policies and the tenacity to really make this campaign work, but, really, the campaign believes that it comes down to organization, and they certainly in Iowa and New Hampshire feel confident where they are in that process, Wolf.
BLITZER: Brianna, you're traveling with the vice president in Pittsburgh today. You got a chance earlier in the day to ask him about a possible run. How did that go?
KEILAR: He really cannot, Wolf, avoid this question of, will he or won't he? He's getting it from reporters during this trip, during his other trips. Even on this parade route that he was on today, a lot of people along the parade route were asking him.
He's starting to have a little bit fun at our expense. Check it out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Mr. Vice President, it sounds like you have a rationale for running.
JOSEPH BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm going to run part of this parade.
QUESTION: You're running? Is that a declaration?
BIDEN: No. I'm going to run part of the parade.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Wolf, this was a very energized Joe Biden that we saw here today in Pittsburgh talking to union members. His speech really sounded like a campaign message in the works.
He was railing against trust fund babies. He was saying that community college should be free, as is the Obama administration proposal. And he said that taxes should be increased on the wealthy to pay for that. He was -- especially compared to last week, where we saw a somber Joe Biden, he looked much more like a candidate today.
BLITZER: Brianna, stand by. I want to bring you back, but I also want to bring in Rebecca Berg. She's the national political reporter for RealClearPolitics. Our political commentator Ryan Lizza, he's a Washington correspondent for "The New Yorker" magazine. And our CNN political director David Chalian.
As Brianna just said, David, it certainly seems like a more energetic Joe Biden today. Looks like he's inching closer and closer to this decision. DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Have you ever seen any
politician love a parade as much as Joe Biden loves a parade?
I don't know that we saw him inch closer to the decision. I definitely think we saw somebody who was much more actively engaged in this process of deciding. He today, listen, you got talk to my wife about that, and then he caught himself, said, actually, I need to talk to my wife about that.
We know that he's in the process of talking with his family, bringing together very close advisers and looking at potential for a plan. But you heard him last week, Wolf. He's got to make a gut check with the family if there's the emotional fuel to do this. And I don't think he's made that decision yet.
BLITZER: He's run for president twice before and didn't do so well either time. Let's see if does the third time a charm, as they say.
If he does run, he's running right now without even announcing third, an impressive third, but not necessarily right up there with Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders. But how does it shake it up if he announces, Rebecca, he's running?
REBECCA BERG, REALCLEARPOLITICS: It certainly shakes things up, Wolf, because Biden is pulling from all of these different parts of the Democratic Party. He would be a great alternative for a lot of Democratic voters to Hillary Clinton, who obviously is in a rough patch in her campaign.
He also could pull some voters though from Bernie Sanders. He sees a lane for himself, and that's why his supporters are urging him to run and many Democrats are urging him to run, but you're right. He's in third place right now. He has run for president before, and not done particularly well.
[18:10:03]
Being able to run as vice president is a huge advantage, but Hillary Clinton is still the prohibitive front-runner in the race. She has more money, more name I.D. And she would be running as the first woman president potentially, which is a huge trump card for her.
BLITZER: Ryan, I think all of us are impressed by Bernie Sanders. Few people thought he would do as well as he is clearly doing right now. If somebody would have said to you only a few weeks ago, in New Hampshire, a state she carried in 2008 over Barack Obama at the time, she would be nine points behind in a very significant New Hampshire poll right now, that NBC News/Marist poll, we would have been stunned.
RYAN LIZZA, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Absolutely.
Nobody predicted that Bernie Sanders would be the main alternative to Hillary Clinton. He's not even a Democrat. He's an independent. (CROSSTALK)
LIZZA: But he's talking -- you have got give the guy, his campaign some credit. He's not attacking Hillary Clinton personally. Remember, Barack Obama, he went after her character in 2008. He's talking about substantive issues, money in politics, things that Democrats really care about.
He's running a good, clean campaign, but his problem is the demographics of the Democratic Party. And unless he can show some appeal beyond these voters in New Hampshire and Iowa, unless he can break through in the Southern states, where non-white voters matter a lot more, he's going to be just like Howard Dean, just like Bill Bradley, just like Gary Hart, these Democrats that had summer surges, maybe even startled the front-runner, but in the end couldn't put together a broad enough coalition to take down the establishment candidate.
BLITZER: Brianna, you mentioned this, but go a little bit more in-depth. How worried are the Clinton people right now? You say they are by no means in any panic mode, but they certainly are worried.
KEILAR: They are worried, Wolf.
I think if you get farther -- I think this is Labor Day. Right? They think of this as a very key moment where people, voters, caucus- goers start to pay more attention to what's going on to the different candidates, to the different policies. And they think during this period where we are expecting to see Hillary Clinton do some more interviews and try to combat some of this e-mail controversy, that she's going to be able to talk more to voters, and that voters, just because they are going to be paying more attention to the policies, they think that ultimately they are where more voters and more caucus- goers are.
Now, keeping in mind as we get next month, mid-October, into the first debate, Democratic debate, which is -- CNN, of course, is hosting, I think if we see these numbers persist or this trend line continue in this direction, that may be panic button time.
KEILAR: Look at this poll over here, David. You see Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders. They're obviously on top, but Martin O'Malley hasn't gone anywhere, Jim Webb, Lincoln Chafee. Why has Bernie Sanders all of a sudden done so well and these three other Democrat presidential candidates are still at, what, 1 percent or 2 percent?
CHALIAN: Because he's running the issues-based campaign that Ryan's talking about. It is sort of like appealing to some of the things that Democratic die-hard, ideologically pure Democratic voters have cared about for a very long time.
But I will tell you, when you talk to people who come out to listen to Bernie Sanders, supporters of his, they still have a question that hangs over, which is like, I really like what he has to say, but I'm not sure he can win this win in November 2016. I think he still is going to have to resolve that question as
well, whether he can be the standard-bearer for a party he's not a member of, and actually win this fight November 2016, because at a certain point, as you know, Wolf, from doing this through many presidential cycles, these voters want to make sure they're putting together -- putting forward the person that can actually deliver the White House.
BLITZER: Guys, stand by, stand by.
We have a lot more to discuss, including Donald Trump. It's amazing what's going on in the Republican side right now. Lots more when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:18:45]
BLITZER: Tonight, new polls show Donald Trump's campaign juggernaut is plowing ahead even stronger, while his Republican opponents are scrambling to play catchup.
We're back with our political team. We're talking about the new ups and downs in the presidential race.
He's the clear front-runner, Donald Trump, David, as all of us know. How do the other Republican candidates deal with this?
CHALIAN: We're starting to see them try to figure that out.
As we turn from summer, past Labor Day into the more heated campaign season, you could say certainly Jeb Bush, for example, has completely changed his strategy from first dismissing him as a joke to now actually taking him out. His super PAC put out a video last week trying to make him and Hillary Clinton two sides of the same coin.
Jeb is out there every day on the trail saying that he's not a true conservative. They are clearly building now a negative frame around Donald Trump. And I think you are going to start to see some others. We saw Marco Rubio take on Donald Trump's comments to Hugh Hewitt last week about some foreign policy matters.
They cannot just wait back and see if Donald Trump falls apart. Republican candidates for president are going to have to take him on if they believe that they're better equipped than he is for the Republican nomination.
LIZZA: Prisoner's dilemma. Everyone wants someone else to do it.
CHALIAN: Exactly.
BLITZER: Yes, because as soon as they start attacking Trump, he's going to start attacking them.
And he points out, look, Rick Perry went after me. See how he's doing. Lindsey Graham went after me. See how he's doing. So he makes a point.
[18:20:01]
LIZZA: Right. If you're Marco Rubio, you would much rather have Jeb Bush's $100 million super PAC take care of this problem.
BLITZER: Yes.
Brianna, what about the Clinton campaign? How do they view Donald Trump? Because you cover that campaign.
KEILAR: They view Donald Trump as the gift that keeps on giving, Wolf.
And you don't see Hillary Clinton going after Donald Trump the way you might think she would go after a front-runner. They believe he is nothing but good for her. They believe, talking to campaign sources, that he's alienate too many people, especially with this demographic shift that we're seeing.
They think that he's pushing Republicans to the right, which they're thrilled about, because then, assuming she's the nominee, she will just try to keep them there in a general election. And they're trying to really lump Republicans all together.
If you look at the positions of some Republicans, say, like Jeb Bush, who does have a more moderate stance on immigration than Donald Trump, he's also still very far from where Hillary Clinton is, supporting a pathway to citizenship for undocumented workers.
So her strategy is to look at all of them, kind of lump them together, as she has put it hostile towards immigrants, women. Really, you kind of name it, and that's her strategy, and they think that's very much going to work for them. They say more Trump. They say bring it on.
BLITZER: Rebecca, in New York, we see John Kasich, the Ohio governor, twice elected, smart guy, as I have pointed out. He's now, what, second in this new poll. Jeb Bush is being pushed. What's going on here? Is the Donald Trump attacks on Jeb Bush working?
BERG: That could be part of it, Wolf.
I think John Kasich is such an interesting person to look at right now, because he spent a lot of money in New Hampshire. That's probably part of why he's doing well, but he's also the only traditional politician right now who we see going up in the polls. Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio, Scott Walker, all going down in the polls, all doing very poorly, while Ben Carson, Carly Fiorina and Donald Trump, who have never held elected office, all doing very well, because you see voters very angry with politicians at the moment, very angry with Washington.
But John Kasich is the only one right now who is threading that needle, giving a message, saying, you know, I could be the pragmatic politician who can come to Washington and solve problems, but I'm not one of these bad politicians. I'm a cool politician.
That's kind of so far the John Kasich message, and it's doing very well for him in New Hampshire.
BLITZER: And a lot of people point out, no Republican has ever been elected president of the United States without carrying Ohio.
LIZZA: Right.
So at the very least, if Kasich continues to equate himself well and maybe doesn't win the nomination, he will certainly be looked as a potential running mate for the Republican nominee. But not to bash the polls, but I'm still of the school that most of these polls, what they're picking up is who's famous at that moment, who is in the news, who are people talking about.
Donald Trump, as the news media interest in him picked up, his polls picked up. And John Kasich, he's running ads in New Hampshire and that's boosting his name recognition and boosting his poll numbers a little bit. We have got a long way.
(CROSSTALK)
CHALIAN: I think right now, no doubt, his super PAC ads up in New Hampshire is making a big difference in his poll numbers there, but I think he's kind of like Jeb Bush, but with entertainment and energy value that Jeb Bush doesn't have right now.
I think that is what he's able to provide in this race, and I think he is so dangerous to Jeb Bush, because if he blocks that establishment lane to Jeb Bush in New Hampshire, Jeb Bush really has to find somewhere in those four early states to post a victory, or his ability to win the nomination is going to be threatened.
LIZZA: Absolutely. And he's got deep roots within the establishment of this party. Right? He's a member of the House. He has a lot of people he served with in the House. He's a successful two-term governor.
He's been involved with the RGA. This is someone who's got the kind of roots that only Bush -- that Bush has.
BLITZER: All right, guys, thanks very, very much.
To our viewers, remember to stay with CNN for the second Republican presidential debate. It will air right here on September 16, a week from Wednesday, live from the Reagan Library in California. CNN, by the way, will also host the first Democratic presidential debate on October 13 in Nevada.
Just ahead, you're looking at live pictures. Take a look at this, live pictures of people along the route of the funeral procession for a slain police officer known as G.I. Joe. Are investigators getting ready to reveal new information about what could be a significant clue? And a photo apparently tweeted by a fugitive drug lord's son
could be a tipoff about his whereabouts, or it could be a cunning trick to lead the manhunt into the wrong direction.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:29:18]
BLITZER: Mourning and mystery in the Illinois town where a police officer was shot dead.
The law enforcement veteran known at G.I. Joe is being laid to rest today. The funeral procession is under way as we speak, with crowds lining the 18-mile route to the cemetery.
Investigators are poring over new evidence, and the suspected killers apparently remain at large.
Our national correspondent, Ryan Young, is in Antioch, Illinois. He's got the very latest.
A sad day over there, Ryan. What's the latest?
RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A sad day and an outpouring of emotion.
The procession for this officer has lasted for more than an hour. I'm going to take you out to the road here to show you some of the cars that are going by live. People have tied ribbons on trees, on telephone posts, everyone wanting to be out here for a man known as G.I. Joe.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
[18:30:12] YOUNG (voice-over): Officer Lieutenant Joe Gliniewicz, last call for his community. Police say the husband and father of four was shot and killed in the line of duty last week. His family, including thousands of brothers and sisters in blue, all here to pay their respects before laying the 30-year police veteran to rest.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Heaven was needing a hero.
MICHAEL GLINIEWICZ, JOE GLINIEWICZ'S BROTHER: Which we ween we were growing up we all knew Joe was a hero. But now the nation knows he's a hero. You will always be part of my life.
YOUNG: Many who don't wear a uniform simply came to show their support for those who do.
BATTALION CHIEF MATTHEW HAORTER, KENOSHA FIRE DEPARTMENT: I hope it sends society a message that, that this needs to stop. We all support each other, and we can't do it without the public's help.
YOUNG: And while the lieutenant known as G.I. Joe was laid to rest, hundreds of officers from multiple agencies, including the FBI, ATF, homeland security and the Lake County sheriff's office, continue analyzing tips and several surveillance videos, working to catch three suspects.
GEORGE FILENKO, COMMANDER, LAKE COUNTY MAJOR CRIMES TASK FORCE: We have images of people that we believe are subjects that we'd be interested in talking to.
YOUNG: Investigators claimed, live on CNN, they've found a significant new piece of evidence.
FILENKO: I will tell you that today our evidence technicians were at the scene once again, and they did recover a piece of significant evidence that wasn't found in the last few days. But I can't reveal exactly what that is or any of the other evidence, because it's extremely relevant that we keep some of this information away from the public.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
YOUNG: Seventeen miles of respect. You can still see the officers streaming down here.
Something I want to point out to you, Wolf. There's a couple people just across the street from this location from where we're standing. They've been saying thank you, almost as every car has gone by. Some people have been out here since about 8 a.m. this morning. All of this happening just outside the high school where he graduated.
I can tell you, so many people want to know what that significant clue is, because they want that reward to go out there or someone to call so they can capture whoever's involved in this -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Let's hope they do. All right, Ryan, thank you.
In that huge crowd that's turning out for the officer's funeral today, police are being joined by local officials including the United States Congressman who represents the Fox Lake area. We've been checking in regularly with Congressman Robert Dold. He knew Officer Gliniewicz. He's been in touch with police as they investigate this very disturbing case, hunting for these possible killers.
Congressman Dold is joining us now live.
Congressman, let's talk about this 30-year veteran of Fox Lake, set to retire in only days. How were the mourners remembering him today?
REP. ROBERT DOLD (R), ILLINOIS: Well, there's literally thousands of police officers from around the country that came in, as well as tens of thousands of citizens of Fox Lake and Antioch that were lining the streets of this 18-mile route, hand-painted signs. People showing their respect and love for Joe Gliniewicz, who was part of the very fabric of this community.
BLITZER: Investigators say critical evidence was found on Friday. Do you have any details on what that evidence is? DOLD: Wolf, I don't have any details on the new piece of
evidence that Chief Filenko revealed to the media earlier.
What I can tell you is that they are moving forward. They are absolutely vigilant, and if anybody out there has any tips, please make sure, reach out to the FBI tip line. There's a $50,000 reward that's out there right now, for anybody that can provide evidence that will ultimately lead to the arrests of these three murderers.
BLITZER: The community -- you represent this community in the United States Congress. Here's the question: Are the folks there unsettled that more information has not been released?
DOLD: Well, I think everybody's a little bit frustrated that more information has not been released, but they have tremendous amount of faith in the police force. Nobody is working harder than the those over in Fox Lake and for the Major Crimes Task Force and for the federal agencies that are engaged. So they know that they want to make sure that we get these three criminals, put them into custody and go from there.
BLITZER: There is also some video that they discovered, but that hasn't been released, as well. Do you understand why?
DOLD: I do not understand why at this stage of the game, but I do know they have gotten additional pieces of footage that they are going over, and that Chief Filenko and his team are optimistic going forward.
BLITZER: Have they actually seen the video, these Illinois officials?
[18:35:6] DOLD: I have not, and Wolf, I have not had the opportunity to look at this footage. And that's not really my role. I want to make sure that, again, we're providing all the tools necessary to those that are trying to solve this crime and to move forward so that we can not only give the Gliniewicz family some peace but also for those in the Fox Lake community and, obviously, for the Fox Lake Police Department, as well.
BLITZER: Well, give police, pass along our deepest, deepest condolences to the family and all the friends there, Congressman. We'll stay in close touch with you. Thank you very much.
DOLD: Thank you, Wolf.
BLITZER: Just ahead, a photo of a fugitive drug lord. Is it a new clue to his whereabouts or a ruse to throw pursuers off his trail.
And an 850-mile Journey for Justice. Is the goal within sight? I'll speak live with the NAACP president, Cornell William Brooks.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:40:40] BLITZER: Tonight we may be seeing another brazen move by an escaped drug lord who tunneled his way out of prison and then vanished. At issue, a photo apparently posted by his son. The big question: Could it lead authorities to the kingpin known at El Chapo or farther away?
Brian Todd is digging into the story for us. It's a fascinating story, Brian. What's the latest?
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is, Wolf. You know, tonight this tweeted photo is being analyzed by law-enforcement agencies in several countries. It is believed to have been posted on an account belonging to the son of Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman. This is the son. We've had one official tell us this is believed to be the fugitive drug lord, but it's also possible this picture could be a decoy to taunt and to mislead law enforcement.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TODD (voice-over): Sources tell CNN this seemingly harmless photo could be a tantalizing clue, a brazen taunt, or a brilliant diversion in the search for one of the world's most wanted men, Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman, believed responsible for the deaths of hundreds of people.
The photo was apparently posted on Twitter by Alfredo Guzman, the 29-year-old son of the brutal leader of Mexico's most dangerous drug cartel. That's Alfredo in the center, flanked by two men. Their faces are obscured by oversized emoticons.
Tonight a Mexican official tells CNN the man on the left is believed to be El Chapo. A former DEA official agrees.
MICHAEL VIGIL, FORMER DEA CHIEF OF INTERNATIONAL OPERATIONS: It appears to be Chapo Guzman, because the cleft right under his lower lip looks very similar in both photographs.
TODD: In English, the caption reads, "Comfortable here. You already know with who." And the photo is tagged with the location Costa Rica.
A Costa Rican official says his government doesn't believe El Chapo is there, and others point to a city near El Chapo's base in Mexico called Costa Rica. But experts say it could be another trick, a fake location designed to mislead police.
VIGIL: This will cause the Mexican government to react to the photographs and take resources from the area where he's actually at and move them someplace else, which gives them a little bit more freedom of movement.
TODD: Michael Vigil says if the photo is recent and really was posted by Guzman's son, it would leave him vulnerable to being tracked by law enforcement.
But experts say El Chapo is notorious for playing cat and mouse with police. He's known to change his appearance. And in July, he escaped from a high-security Mexican prison through this elaborate tunnel. Years earlier he slipped away from police who had him cornered through a different tunnel hidden under his bathtub.
Tonight, analysts say authorities are likely expanding their search for El Chapo focused not only on his son, but they're also likely tracking his wife, Emma Coronel, a former beauty queen, said to be seen here in photos posted in Mexican media. Coronel is a U.S. citizen and gave birth to Guzman's twin daughters near Los Angeles in 2011. A Mexican official says her phone was one of the leads used in El Chapo's capture in Mazatlan last year.
Tonight there's enormous pressure on the Mexican government to find him again.
(on camera): If they ever close in on El Chapo, do you think he'll be taken alive?
ARTHUR RODERICK, FORMER U.S. MARSHAL: Well, if he's in Mexico and the Mexican military closes in on him, I think there's going to be a fight, and I'm pretty sure he's going to end up like Pablo Escobar. He'll be shot in the exchange of gunfire there.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: But it will likely take a massive and very well- coordinated operation to find El Chapo and to corner him. It's believed he's likely hiding out in Sinaloa state where analysts say he's got a criminal infrastructure of corrupt officials sympathetic to him and local residents who consider him a Robin Hood-type hero. They're known to tip off El Chapo whenever authorities approach -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Is it possible, Brian, this picture was tweeted to show that Guzman's son is aligned to run his operations in the future?
TODD: WE spoke with former DEA agents and other analysts who say it's not likely that he'll have either this son or another son of his run the cartel. U.S. officials say they are part of his criminal enterprise, but analysts said -- say that they're not quite as savvy as their father. Not able to run a multi-national operation stretching into about 50 countries.
BLITZER: All right, Brian. Thanks very much.
Let's bring in HLN legal analyst Joey Jackson; also former ATF executive Matthew Horace; and our law enforcement analyst, Tom Fuentes.
What do you think, Tom? Did his son inadvertently reveal the location of El Chapo?
[18:45:06] TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: It's hard for me to believe that his son that age would be that stupid. So, to me, I think he's probably playing a cat and mouse game. Normally, when you take pictures, it leaves the metadata in of your global position. You know, leaves information about your location. So, if that was a clue for the authorities, I think they'd have already had him in custody by now. So, I think he was probably somehow playing, had somebody else in
the photograph. If I grew my mustache back I might look like El Chapo if I covered half my face. So, I don't know, I don't buy it.
BLITZER: You don't buy it? You don't think he's that stupid?
FUENTES: I don't.
BLITZER: Matthew, what's your analysis?
MATT HORACE, FORMER ATF EXECUTIVE: Well, Wolf, I think it's clearly a counterintelligence strategy to see how law enforcement reacts or responds.
BLITZER: And, Joey, I know you don't necessarily focus on all of this kind of stuff, but what do you think?
JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: Listen, there would be no practical way that I think that a person who's gone up through the lengths of building a tunnel a mile long, escaping and evading authorities would have this son this cavalier who was with his father. So, I tend to believe it's some ruse of some sort to misdirect and cause a diversion for law enforcement in capturing him.
BLITZER: Let me pick your brain, all of you. I'll start with you, Joey, on Lieutenant Gliniewicz, the funeral today, very, very emotional time in Illinois. How unusual, though, Joey, is it officials so far have still not released the autopsy results?
JACKSON: You know, Wolf, may he rest in peace certainly. It's a very sad and tragic day there that he's laid to rest. It's not unusual at all. When you're in the middle of an investigation, you're always going to be tight-lipped concerning certain details.
Obviously, an autopsy, Wolf, has the cause of manner of death could reveal other intimate details regarding how he died, the distance away, any defensive wounds only a person who was there would know. And so, you don't want to alert criminals who you may debriefing later and you have unique details that may incriminate themselves and certainly with false confessions, too. People will not be able to testify and give false confessions if you have details that actually occurred.
And so, at this point, we'll get the autopsy report. The public will examine it. When they're brought to justice, the people who did this, their attorneys will have it, but not now. This is not the time and place.
BLITZER: What's your analysis, Tom?
FUENTES: I agree with Joey completely. You want to withhold specifics about the manner of death, what they found at the scene, where the weapon was, how far away from the body, because you want information that only the killers would know, and that's because people come out of the woodwork to confess to these crimes to get famous, to get attention, unfortunately. So, you do want to withhold that.
The part we need as the description of the people that they've seen in these videos. This has been a week now that they've had videos and we have yet to hear any additional details over and above two white guys and a black guy.
BLITZER: Is there any explanation you know, Matthew, why they wouldn't release at least some images of these three suspects who are on the loose apparently right now?
HORACE: Well, Wolf, absolutely. Let's take into consideration if one of the suspects was injured as a result of gunfire at the incident. Police would know that and they already know that that suspect might have needed hospital attention and the like. So those kind of pieces of evidence we can't release at a time like now.
BLITZER: Do they need more help out there in Illinois right now from the federal government, Tom, or they are getting enough help from the FBI, ATF and other federal authorities?
FUENTES: They have all the help they need, all the help that they've asked for, they have. No one would hold back anything in the case like this. So, if they need more help, just ask and they would have it.
BLITZER: All right. Guys, thanks very much. We'll stay on top of all of these stories.
Just ahead, another story we're following, an important one. An 850-mile journey for justice, now nearing an end. I'll speak live with the NAACP president about the march, the new backlash against Black Lives Matter, that movement.
Much more coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:53:17] BLITZER: Tonight, the NAACP is taking its fight for voters' rights right here to Washington. An 850-mile march from Selma, Alabama, to the nation's capitol is now getting closer and closer to an end.
The group's president and CEO, Cornell William Brooks, is joining us now live. He's not far from Richmond, Virginia. That's not too far from Washington, D.C.
Cornell, thanks very much for joining us.
So, tell us how it's going. What have you accomplished?
CORNELL WILLIAM BROOKS, PRESIDENT & CEO, NAACP: Well, we think we have accomplished quite a bit. I mean, we have engaged in a journey from Alabama en route to Washington, D.C. We have marched hundreds of miles. Close now to 800 as a consequence of some detours we had to take. But we are building a civic army, if you will, to make the case,
to press the case we have to fix the Voting Rights Act. And as you know, Wolf, we are marching under the banner -- our lives, our votes, our jobs, and our schools matter. So, we are pushing hard to fix a badly broken Voting Rights Act, but also to end a racial profiling.
And given what's going on in the country right now, everything that we see happening in the news and occurring in people's communities underscores the importance of this multi-racial, multi- ethnic, multi-generational coalition of citizens who are headed to Washington to go door to door, to make the case in Congress that we have to bring about fundamental reform. And now is the time to do it.
So, we're greatly encouraged. It has been tough. You know, the temperatures have been searing from 104 degrees to -- in the 90s in big cities, small towns. And it's been physically challenging.
[18:55:02] But that said, it's been emotionally and spiritually inspiring.
I mean, when you see ministers and rabbis coming in from all across the country, people from all walks of life, grandparents and their grandchildren coming together on America's journey for justice. It says people believe in their country, believe in the country enough to, in fact, do something, as opposed to merely complaining about something. And that is what we are endeavoring to do on this journey for justice.
BLITZER: It has been a pretty amazing journey, I must say. I want to get back to some of these other issues.
But let me also pick your brain about this. Some comments recently made by Matt Staver, he's the lawyer for the Kentucky court clerk, Kim Davis. Staver had this to say about his client saying, "She's not going to resign. She's not going to sacrifice her conscience, so she's doing what Martin Luther King Jr. wrote about in his letter from the Birmingham jail, which is to pay the consequences for her decisions."
We're also looking at some tweets. The Iowa Representative Steve King drawing comparisons between her and Rosa Parks.
What goes through your mind when you hear these comments?
BROOKS: Well, I would simply note that the widow of the Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King, Coretta Scott King, was clear and unambiguous in terms of her support of gay and lesbian Americans being treated as full citizens under the law.
The Supreme Court has spoken clearly on this. Most Americans believe that we need to treat all of our citizens fairly. And so, while we respect our people's religious views, the fact of the matter is you have to treat citizens fairly. And if people are seeking to exercise their rights under the Constitution and enjoy a right that anyone else and everyone else has, you got to respect that, if you are an employee of government, because you represent the face of the Constitution to the average citizen.
So, the NAACP has taken a clear stand on marriage equality. And so, we expect people in government to adhere to the rule of law and rule of the Supreme Court and also common sense and compassion. So, this will ultimately work itself out. I think it's headline for the moment, but at the end of the day, you can't have a clerk standing as a roadblock to the Constitution and roadblock to justice.
BLITZER: Last week, the South Carolina Senator Tim Scott, he spoke with our Brianna Keilar. She was filling in for me here at in THE SITUATION ROOM, about the Black Lives Matter movement. I want you to listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TIM SCOTT (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: Well, I will tell you that if it causes offense, then I say, all lives matter, black lives, white lives, police officers, jurists, all of us, even politicians, all of our lives matter. If that is somehow offensive to someone, that's their issue, not mine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: All right. What do you say to the senator?
BROOKS: I'd simply note this. When we have our young people saying strongly and clearly that Black Lives Matter, they're making the case by saying black lives matter that black lives matter is a premise to a conclusion that all lives matter. And so, there's nothing that says that all lives do not matter by asserting that black lives do, in fact, matter.
Now, when we know that black lives often are profiled and brutalized and discriminated against, we can't blame people for asserting that which should be morally obvious. But we've got to be clear here. The NAACP has said all along that our lives matter whether your skin is black or your uniform is blue.
The fact of the matter is that public safety is too important to be held hostage, to polarizing thinking or rhetoric. And I don't believe that simply saying that black lives matter is, in fact, polarizing. It's simply a moral assertion that we need to protect the rights and lives of people live Tamir Rice, who's 12 years old, or Michael Brown, who was 18 or Walter Scott who was 50 years old or Eric Garner who was 50 years old.
Of course, all lives matter. But does it undermine the proposition to say that black lives matter or the lives of police officers matter? I don't think so.
BLITZER: All right. Cornell, we'll continue this conversation as we always do down the road. Good luck with this journey. I know you are getting closer and closer. Give my best wishes to all your friends on this journey to the nation's capitol. Thanks very much for joining us.
BROOKS: Thanks, Wolf.
BLITZER: Remember, you can follow us on Twitter. Go ahead, tweet me @wolfblitzer. You can always twee the show @CNNSitroom. Please be sure to join us right here in THE SITUATION ROOM tomorrow.
Thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer.
"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now.
