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WH Won't Unequivocally Declare Trump Condemns White Supremacists; Trump Peddles Baseless Fraud Conspiracy as Early Voting Surges; White House Stands by Trump's Baseless Claims about Ballot Fraud; Chris Wallace on Chaotic Debate: Trump Bears "Primary Responsibility" for what Happened"; Virus Surge Prompts Trump To Move Wisconsin Rally; U.S. Deaths Top 207,000 As Cases Surpass 7.2 Million, CDC Projects Up To Another 25,000 Deaths By October 24; Companies & Cities Brace For Unrest Around Election Day; GOP Texas Governor Orders Sharp Reduction In Drop-Off Location For Mail-In Ballots; Trump's Call For Supporters To "Watch" Polling Places Raises Fears Of Intimidation & Violence. Aired 5-6p ET
Aired October 01, 2020 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[17:00:00]
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: -- a series called "First Ladies" this weekend. You can watch it Sunday night at 10:00 Eastern here on CNN.
Our coverage on CNN continues right now. I will see you tomorrow.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer in the Situation Room.
We're following the truly stunning refusal by the White House to unequivocally declare, once and for all, that President Trump denounces white supremacy. It's been nearly 48 hours since the President failed to do so on the debate stage but the White House says he did not misspeak.
Mr. Trump is also fueling new baseless conspiracies about the integrity of the election as early voting surges across the country. He's going after the Commission on the Presidential Debates as well tweeting he might not allow the group to change the rules ahead of this next showdown with Joe Biden.
All of this as the coronavirus pandemic takes a menacing turn here in the United States. More than 207,000 Americans have now died and the CDC is now forecasting up to another 25,000 U.S. deaths by October 24.
In just a moment, I'll speak with our Kaitlan Collins who directly questioned the White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany about the President's refusal to condemn white supremacy.
But first, let's begin our coverage with CNNs Ryan Nobles. He's over at the White House with more in the late breaking developments.
What are you learning Ryan? RYAN NOBLES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, the Pew Research Center says that more than 30 percent of eligible voters in the 2018 election were people of color, but here we are, with votes already being cast in the 2020 election, and President Trump is being forced to explain exactly where he stands when it comes to white supremacy.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NOBLES (voice-over): Tonight, despite multiple opportunities to specifically condemn white supremacist groups, the President and his administration continue to dance around the question.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you right now denounce white supremacy and the group that has found it?
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I just did. The President has renounced --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You read a bunch of quotes from the past.
MCENANY: -- white supremacy, the KKK and hate groups in all forms.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: If someone denounced you, you probably wouldn't put it on a t-shirt makes badges of it, right?
MCENANY: This president did denounce them. He was asked we tell them to stand down, he said sure. He went on to stand --
COLLINS: Which seems like a destruction.
MCENANY: He said stand back. And then just yesterday when he was asked he said specifically stand down
NOBLES: White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany, using old quotes from the President to respond to the direct question, and then refusing to acknowledge the outright embrace of the President by organizations like the Proud Boys.
MCENANY: He didn't know who the Proud Boys were. The first time I heard of them was in the debate. But the media continues to put these names into circulation and give them a lot of public attention.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Who would you like me to condemn?
JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: White supremacist and Proud Boys.
TRUMP: Proud Boys, stand back and standby.
NOBLES: But leading Republicans are also taking issue with what the President said.
SEN. TIM SCOTT, (R) SOUTH CAROLINA: I think he misspoke. I think he should correct it. If he doesn't correct it, I guess he didn't misspeak. SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL, (R) MAJORITY LEADER: He said it was unacceptable not to condemn white supremacists. And so I do so in the strongest possible way.
SEN. JOHN BARRASSO, (R) WYOMING: I certainly condemn what we've been seeing in terms of white supremacy, in terms of racism.
NOBLES: And as early voting surges across the country, Trump continues to make baseless claims about fraud in the electoral process.
TRUMP: This is crazy what's going on. This is crazy.
NOBLES: His rhetoric only part of what is raising concerns. The Trump campaign is preparing to send thousands of volunteers to polling locations across the country.
TRUMP: I'm urging my supporters to go into the polls and watch very carefully.
NOBLES: Critics are accusing the Trump team of employing an intimidation tactic, despite the FBI's clear assessment that there's no evidence of widespread voter fraud.
CHRISTOPHER WRAY, FBI DIRECTOR: We have not seen, historically, any kind of coordinated national voter fraud effort in a major election.
NOBLES: Meanwhile, the President continues to believe that he won the debate.
TRUMP: You know Biden lost badly when his supporters are saying he should cancel the rest of the debates.
NOBLES: This despite real concern from his own team that his rocky performance could hurt him with persuadable voters.
The Debate Commission now considering tightening up its rules to prevent a repeat of Tuesday's fiery affair that lacks substance.
BIDEN: I just hope there's a way in which the Debate Commission can control the ability of us to answer the question without interruption.
NOBLES: A move that the President says he's opposed to, tweeting, "Why would I allow the Debate Commission to change the rules for the second and third debates when I easily won last time."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NOBLES: And tonight the Biden campaign is saying that they will abide by whatever rules the commission puts forward while the Trump campaign continues to work the reps including the President saying that he doesn't want to see the rules changed. His campaign held a press call today with reporters where they attacked the commission.
[17:05:01]
Jason Miller, one of the senior advisors to President Trump calling the commission a bunch of creatures from the swamp. They are insisting that the commission not change the rules ahead of the next debate.
And Wolf, they wouldn't say definitively if President Trump would participate if the commission does, in fact plan to change those rules. Wolf.
BLITZER: We'll see what happens on that front. Ryan Nobles, thank you very much. Let's get some more of the dangerous failure by the White House to unequivocally assure the American public that President Trump condemns white supremacy.
Listen to this exchange between our Kaitlan Collins and the White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: The Proud Boys are people who consider them to be members of this group, give voice to these misogynistic, Islamophobic, anti- Semitic anti-immigrant views. They're a despicable group by pretty much anyone's standard.
So when the President was asked about them, and you say he denounced them, that's what you're insisting that he did on the debate stage the other night? If that's the case, then why are they celebrating what the President said on the debate stage in front of millions of people?
MCENANY: Well, I don't speak for that group. So I'm not sure why you're asking me why they're saying at a certain point --
COLLINS: What I'm saying is if someone denounce you, you probably wouldn't put it on t-shirt and make badges of it, right?
MCENANY: The President did denounce them. He was asked we tell them to stand down. He said sure. He went on to stand --
COLLINS: Standby which seems like a destruction.
MCENANY: He said stand back. And then just yesterday when he was asked, he said specifically stand down, a synonym with stand back. And the President said sure, when asked by the moderator whether they should stand down.
So again, another -- it's really interesting too to see that the media seems to be the only one putting the names of these groups into headlines, into media reporting. He didn't know who the Proud Boys were. First time I heard of them was in the debate about the media continues to put these names into circulation and give them a lot of public attention.
COLLINS: When he was given about 12 hours more than that, since from the debate, when he was asked to clarify yesterday, and he didn't come out and clarify yesterday. Instead, he did what you did when John asked you to unambiguously denounce these groups. You just pointed to past things that you've said. You can't -- I just don't understand why you knew you're going to get these questions and you don't want to say you're ready to just say we do unambiguously denounce these statements -- MCENANY: You know, what is -- do you know why people have lost trust
in the media? There is a reporter from your network yesterday, your network and in a tweet said, quote --
COLLINS: I'm asking you a question. I know what you're going to bring up with us has nothing to do with what I'm asking you right now.
MCENANY: I sat here when you loved your partisan attack question. So you will allow me to give an answer. The President and someone from your network said yesterday in a tweet, the President dodges a question about white supremacy. That was a tweet from a CNN reporter.
The President specifically, verbatim, was asked yesterday, white supremacy, do you denounced them? To which he responded, I have always denounced any form of that. Those are the facts.
And CNN I know that truth is of no moment to your network. But those are the facts.
COLLINS: They're not the facts. Why are Republicans, they're calling on the President to be more forceful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: All right, Kaitlan is with us right now.
Kaitlan, you've been covering the President for the past several years. Why do you -- why did they refuse to explicitly denounce white supremacy every time they are given this clearly simple chance?
COLLINS: I can't say why Wolf, but it certainly is a pattern with this President that we have been going through ever since he took office and during even his time on the campaign trail back when he used to say I don't know who David Duke is, when he was asked about that endorsement of him. Even though he's on camera talking about David Duke.
And now he's employing a similar tactic with the Proud Boys. He didn't say he didn't know they were on the debate stage the other night, Wolf, instead, he repeated them after Joe Biden brought the group up.
So, this is a pattern with the White House and with this President where he makes comments about white supremacy about neo-Nazis, about these groups that then aides have to spend days struggling to defend them. The President eventually backpedals and we repeat this cycle again and again.
So one of the main defenses there in the briefing today was appointing by Kayleigh McEnany to what the President has said before, often in scripted pre written remarks that were done by aides when the President has come under fire for something he said. And most people will remember what happened after Charlottesville when he talked about there being good people on both sides.
And Wolf, remember the President came back to the White House, gave this scripted speech to reporters, and then later was seen saying or was heard saying, you know, there were not all neo- Nazis in that group. They were not all white supremacists in that group. So he has often even undermined his own comments on this, the ones that the White House has been using all day to point to.
BLITZER: But it's not just his usual critics who are speaking out. The Republican leadership, including Senators Tim Scott, Mitch McConnell, the majority leader, all took issue with how the President handled that question, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Yes. And Wolf, Republican lawmakers are never eager to criticize the President. They know how popular he is within their party. Often they avoid reporters and cameras on Capitol Hill or they give vaguely worded statements about what the President said. And we did not even see that from the upper echelons of the Republican Party this week with Mitch McConnell saying he aligned himself with the views of Tim Scott. Tim Scott saying that the President misspoke he needed to clarify.
[17:10:09]
And of course the White House said today they did not believe that the President was misspeaking when he made those comments on Tuesday night. But other Republicans as well, John Thune, Senator Barrasso, Senator Romney.
Republican after Republican saying that the President does need to be more forceful on this, Wolf. And it's not just a matter of semantics and what the President says even though what the President says does matter.
Listen to the FBI director who testified about the threat of white supremacy right here in the United States, saying that these racially motivated extremist events that are mostly white supremacy in recent years is seriously a big, legal -- lethal domestic threat facing people who live here in the United States.
So even the FBI director says it's significant, yet the President when he's given multiple opportunities and when his aides are given three opportunities by three different reporters in one 24 minute briefing today, simply just can't put out a statement that most people believe would just be something really easy to say,
BLITZER: Yes. It's easy to say I condemn white supremacists, period. It's not that hard to say that.
Kaitlan, thank you very, very much.
Let's continue the discussion with Martin Luther King III, a Global Human Rights Leader. Martin, thanks so much for joining us.
And as you heard, it's been what, two days since the presidential debate, we've yet to hear a clear denouncement of white supremacy from the White House, from the President. You've dedicated your life to fighting for human rights.
Why do you think this President and the White House, for that matter, refused to unequivocally denounce white supremacy?
MARTIN LUTHER KING III, GLOBAL HUMAN RIGHTS LEADER: Well, the only thing that any of us can come to the conclusion of is that that is who he is. I mean, he is -- he told us who he is. People who are close to him have told us who he is in relationship to issues of race.
And so we cannot mandate anything in terms of what he does. But what we can do is, you know, our government, I preamble talks about we the People. We the people must come together. There are so many far more people in this country who do not embrace this.
I think the bigger question is, why are so many persons embracing him with an attitude that refuses to denounce racism and homophobia and so many tragic things in our society? I think that is the biggest question that should be perplexing in 2020.
We can, we must, we will do better. We will not let a president just as in my dad's era, talked about injunctions, an injunction which was a court action would not allow people from operating around freedom. We will not let a president just allow us from voting and other things.
We got to change this nation. This can be an incredible nation, but we got a lot of work to do. I think that's what this tells us.
BLITZER: It's an important point, indeed. The White House press secretary, Martin, he -- she claims that Mr. Trump has condemned racism more than any president in modern history. I wonder what do you think your father would have said to that, hearing an assertion like that from the White House press secretary?
KING: You know, I don't know or if any of us can speak for dad. But certainly dad tried to challenge us to always deal with truth. And unfortunately, we see so much truth coming out of the White House every day out of the President's mouth, as well as out of even his whole apparatus.
People need to deal with fundamental truth. Be truth, be honest. And unfortunately, we're not going to get the truth by the honesty, and then they try to denigrate everyone else because they have that apparatus. That's very sad.
I mean, -- get back to honesty and truth. That reminds me that people are not willing to deal with truth. And, you know, I understand she's doing her job, she probably does her job well, in terms of protecting those things that are not true.
And I, you know, I don't think we can worry about what he does. It really is what we do as Americans, Americans voting like they never have before. And I think we are seeing that around this country in many areas.
BLITZER: Despite some attempts to try to clean up the President's words, Martin. We do know that these far right groups use what he says as a rallying cry. And it's not just rhetoric that is so concerning, but potentially the violence that results. You've seen that, right?
KING: Yes. And on that issue specifically, I think that governors and secretary of states and attorney generals have an obligation to protect right -- voter's rights to come and vote and not have confrontations taking place.
Normally we go to the Justice Department and the Justice Department would assure that fairness comes. But unfortunately, this Justice Department operates basically as a rubber stamp for the President and not in terms of enforcing the law for all people.
[17:15:02]
And so, that's why I think it's important for governors and secretaries of states and attorney generals around this country to ensure that there are no confrontations and that people can vote in an unencumbered way, in a fair way and in a safe way, most importantly.
BLITZER: Yes. And I'll just leave you with this thought the FBI Director, Christopher Wray. He is specific in contrast to what the President says. He says these white supremacists represent the biggest domestic terror threat here in the United States.
People ascribing, he says, to some kind of white supremacist type ideology is certainly the biggest chunk of that. Very, very significant statement from Christopher Wray, who was handpicked by the President to be the FBI Director.
Martin Luther King III, thank you so much for joining us.
KING: Thank you, Wolf.
BLITZER: All right. Just ahead, a disturbing new CNN investigation uncovers American cities and businesses preparing. We hope it doesn't happen, but preparing for violence and civil unrest after the election on November 3.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:20:20]
BLITZER: The White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany passed up multiple opportunities today to directly denounce white supremacy. She also backed up the President's baseless claims about early voting irregularities.
Joining us now, CNN's Chief Political Analyst, Gloria Borger, along with CNN Contributor Ben Ginsberg, who's a Republican election lawyer. Both of you, thanks for joining us.
Ben, we've known each other for years, you have a lot of experience as an election lawyer, you've done this work, what for three or four decades, is there any proof at all that would justify the President's sustained attacks on the integrity of the upcoming presidential election? BEN GINSBERG, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: There is no evidence of widespread fraud, Wolf. Republicans have had people in polling places for four decades, the summon substance of what's been found or a few random events and fraud.
BLITZER: And really have had no significant impact as all the experts have concluded.
Gloria, do those claims -- these claims sound more like something you'd see put out by, let's say, a Russian troll than by the President of the United States?
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, it sounds like something put out by somebody who does not expect to win the election, and wants to make sure that hippie is not likely to win the election, that he wants to de legitimize the election.
I mean, you have to think of this as disinformation has been a way of life for this president. Give you hydroxychloroquine is a cure for COVID. And the list goes on and on. I mean, you know, the President's talking about foreign countries are going to invade the ballots and somehow fix the ballots in our country. And Ben could label chapter and verse of this over and over again.
It is built for one purpose. It is built to raise questions about the outcome of any election, and I would argue also to suppress the vote.
BLITZER: It's an important point. And then I just want to note, the FBI Director Christopher Wray, on this issue also totally disagrees with the President.
He testified on September 24. We have not seen historically any kind of coordinated national voter fraud effort in a major election, whether it's by mail, or otherwise. You have total faith in the system. You believe we can weather the President's attacks. But you do predict that could be a delay in getting the actual results of this election if it's close.
So what happens if the President, for example, were to declare a victory before all the votes are counted?
GINSBERG: I suspect what would happen is that state election officials, both Republicans and Democrats would refute that until they're comfortable with what their final votes are.
On election night, the responsible states will give you the totals that they have that night, and also the number of absentee ballots that are outstanding that have not been returned, so that you'll know how much movement there could possibly be. But the President declaring something on a nationwide basis stands in the face of the way we do our elections, which is on a state by state basis.
So this is not going to be a one size fits all statement, you're going to have to go to the individual states to look at the results. So that's going to be really tough to proclaim. BLITZER: That's an important point as well. On a separate but very important issue, Gloria, I mean all the fallout from that chaotic debate the other night, the moderator Chris Wallace, is laying blame with President Trump. Watch it and listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWA ANCHOR: He bears the primary responsibility for what happened on Tuesday night. That was frustrating, because -- frustrating for me, because I tried hard to prepare for a serious debate. Much more frustrating, and more importantly, for the American people because they didn't get the debate they wanted and that they deserved.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: So what do you think, Gloria? What do you make of that?
BORGER: Well, good for Chris Wallace, because it was obvious at the time for those of us who were watching it, and there are 73 million Americans who were watching it, that the President the United States would not let his opponent get in word.
And that when Chris Wallace tried to kind of even the scales and talk the President down, he wasn't allowed to. Now the Commission on Debates, as you know, which has been disparaged by the Trump campaign is saying they're going to have to try and change the rules. And they're saying right now, we don't want any rules change.
But I was just talking to a source in the campaign, who's told me, look, this is this really doesn't mean that Trump would withdraw from the debates. It's just that he doesn't want any rules change because, of course, he thinks he did brilliantly.
[17:25:01]
And don't forget, the next debate for the presidential candidates is a town hall. So it's a very, very different kind of debate where the questions largely come from the audience and not from a moderator.
BLITZER: And the President, as you correctly pointed out, he is angry about any possible changes he tweeted today, "Why would I allow the Debate Commission to change the rules for the second and third debates when I easily won last time?"
BORGER: Well, but that's ridiculous. Wolf, as you know, that is completely ridiculous.
BLITZER: Yes. I'm just reporting what the President of United States is saying in an official statement --
BORGER: Still ridiculous. Yes.
BLITZER: -- in Twitter. An official statement --
BORGER: Yes. BLITZER: -- for the President.
Gloria, Ben Ginsberg, guys, thank you very much.
Coming up, coronavirus surging right now in at least 27 states as new cases and hospitalizations climb. Stay with us. We got new information, we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:30:42]
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Breaking news, the coronavirus pandemic has now claimed more than 207,000 lives here in the United States and at least 27 states right now we're reporting a spike in new cases. Brian Todd is joining us now. Brian, the situation I understand is especially grim in Wisconsin.
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is, Wolf. Just a short time ago, Wisconsin Governor Tony Evers said he's concerned by what he called the alarming trends they are seeing across the state. Nevertheless, President Trump still plans to hold two campaign rallies in Wisconsin this weekend.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TODD (voice-over): In the state of Wisconsin tonight, the coronavirus pandemic is back to crisis proportions. What officials call, disease activity is high in all 72 counties, they say. Hospitals are stretched, some pushing capacity. A top medical official in Wisconsin says, the local public health infrastructure is falling apart, that they can't even identify individuals who've been exposed to tell them to quarantine.
DR. RYAN WESTERGAARD, CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER, WISCONSIN DEPT. OF HEALTH SERVICES: When the volume gets so high, they fall too far behind. They don't have enough resources to communicate to the people who need this. So, we have to move to a large -- a population wide, a large scale mitigation strategy and rely on a shared sense of public responsibility in order to turn the corner.
TODD (voice-over): President Trump's own White House Coronavirus Task Force warning people in Wisconsin to increase social distancing. But the President is still planning to hold two rallies in the state this weekend.
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: He is having a rally, people can choose whether or not to come.
TODD (voice-over): A plan Trump rally in one Wisconsin town, La Crosse, is now being moved to another town, after the Mayor said flat out, they didn't want the President to come.
TIM KABAT, MAYOR OF LA CROSSE, WISCONSIN: We're really hoping that we can get this event either cancelled or postponed to another time based on what we're experiencing right now here in La Crosse. TODD (voice-over): This comes as case counts continue to rise in more than half the states tonight. And the CDC projects up to 232,000 Americans will have died from coronavirus by October 24th. The White House Task Force trying to mitigate the damage in potential danger zones, warning officials in Georgia, Iowa and Wyoming which don't have facemask mandates to get their residents to wear them. Still, Iowa and Mississippi have just loosened their rules.
DR. CELINE GOUNDER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: It's really dangerous to be loosening restrictions, especially as we're seeing a surge in cases already and we're about to go into the fall. This is not the moment to be letting our guard down.
TODD (voice-over): Officials in New York doing their best not to let their guard down, while the positivity rates in 20 hotspots across the state have increased. In New York City, the Mayor says certain neighborhoods may have to be targeted for tough measures.
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D), NEW YORK: We're watching and the decision will be made based on the facts of whether we need to do a fuller shutdown in those communities.
TODD (voice-over): The primary drivers of transmission in the U.S. and around the world, young and middle aged adults because they're the ones who come into contact with the most people. That's according to a new study out of India based on the contact tracing of more than 3 million people, making the race for a vaccine as critical as ever. The head of the FDA promising again this week, his agency will use strict scientific guidelines and not political pressure from the Trump administration to approve vaccines.
DR. STEPHEN HAHN, FDA COMMISSIONER: We won't cut corners, we will use our rigorous criteria.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: And regarding that change of venue of the Trump campaign rallies in Wisconsin this weekend, the Trump campaign now says that the venue was moved from La Crosse, Wisconsin to another town because of an issue with the venue, specifically, an issue with the lease of that venue in La Crosse. The Trump campaign claiming that that move was not COVID related at all. But, of course, officials from the Governor on down are very critical of the President for even coming to the state at all right now, Wolf, given their spike in cases.
BLITZER: Yes, that's clearly something that's very, very worrisome. Brian Todd reporting for us. Thank you.
Let's get some analysis from the Dean of the Brown University School of Public Health. Dr. Ashish Jha. Dr. Jha, thanks so much for joining us. And as you heard in 27 states across most of the northern part of the country, cases of coronavirus, they are clearly on the rise. You can see it on the map right there. We know arise in cases is typically followed by an increase in hospitalizations and then sadly, an increase in deaths. How concerned are you Dr. Jha, about what the next few weeks may bring? [17:35:11]
DR. ASHISH JHA, DEAN, BROWN UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF PUBLIC HEALTH: Yes, Wolf, thanks for having me on. I am very concerned. Certainly, what we're seeing across the Dakotas, in Wisconsin, Utah, Montana, lots of other states on that map is a large increase in cases. And then a few of them are starting to see more hospitalizations, and deaths are starting to go up. So, we've seen this pattern play out over and over again. We always seem to wait too long to act and intervene, but we've got to act now, and especially in places like Wisconsin, where things are so bad.
BLITZER: The President, as you know, is planning a pair of rallies this weekend in Wisconsin, as that state is seeing a sharp rise in cases potentially. What kind of damage can a large public event, even if it's outdoors, do especially in a state that is already vulnerable, and especially if people aren't necessarily wearing masks, and they're not engaged in social distancing?
JHA: Yes. So, any large gathering can be a problem in a place that's got exponential growth as Wisconsin does. It's very concerning. And then what we've seen from previous rallies of the President is that people don't wear masks and they don't do social distancing. So, I am thankful it's outside, I think that'll help. But if people are packed in together and they're not wearing masks, it will set off more cases, more hospitalizations, and unfortunately, more deaths.
BLITZER: Moderna now says it won't have the necessary vaccine data to move forward with the authorization process until after Election Day. The company says their vaccine won't be widely available even until this spring. Does this seem realistic to you? What's your analysis?
JHA: Yes. So, again, the vaccine production, the making, and the testing of the vaccine has been going incredibly well, has had high levels of scientific integrity. And I've always said that we've got to let science drive the timeline. And what I hear from Moderna is exactly that.
So, as long as we're making these decisions based on scientific principles, I'd like it soon, but I'll take it when it's ready. Just make -- to make sure that political processes don't end up getting involved.
BLITZER: I just checked, by the way, Dr. Jha, the Johns Hopkins University says 42,812 Americans were, you know, tested positive for coronavirus just yesterday, and sadly, 946 Americans died from the virus just yesterday. So, those numbers are continuing, this crisis is by no means over.
Stay safe out there. Dr. Shah, thanks so much for joining us.
JHA: Thank you, Wolf.
BLITZER: I just ahead, a very disturbing look at the very real possibility of extremists sparking civil unrest around Election Day here in the United States and our cities and businesses are already preparing for other worst.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:42:21]
BLITZER: Once again today, the Trump White House refused to specifically condemn white supremacists. President Trump is calling on his followers to watch people at polling places. The threat of violence around the election is very frightening and real. As a result, CNN has learned cities and businesses already are preparing for the worst.
CNN Senior Investigative Correspondent Drew Griffin has been looking into this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They have shown up armed face-to-face in cities across the country. Extremists from the right, the left and those that don't seem to follow any political beliefs. Violence between them has led to confrontation, assaults, killings.
JOEL FINKELSTEIN, DIRECTOR, NETWORK CONTAGION RESEARCH INSTITUTE: The groups are revolutionary and violent and they're seeking to attack our constitutional traditions and replace the founding narrative.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): And with Election Day looming, experts are warning it could get worse. CNN has learned law enforcement cities, banks, corporations are all quietly bracing for the possibility of violent clashes around an after Election Day fueled by extremists. Federal law enforcement sources tell CNN the FBI is concerned about the possibility armed extremists might try to interfere with local vote counting.
JONATHAN WACKROW, MANAGING DIRECTOR & GLOBAL HEAD OF SECURITY, TENEO: The stakes are so high that this political chaos could transcend into something worse, into physical action in the event that we come up to a contested election.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): Former Secret Service agent and corporate security consultant Jonathan Wackrow says he is assisting major financial institutions and fortune 100 companies to prepare for what he calls a decline into chaos.
WACKROW: We want to prepare them for the entire spectrum of threats so they can use sustain operations in the midst of chaos.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): What is so troubling is that President Trump is stoking the confrontations.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Proud Boys, stand back and stand by.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): When Donald Trump told the alt-right Proud Boys to stand by, he said a signal to the extremists to follow him. Two former DHS officials who worked under Trump say that only makes matters worse.
ELIZABETH NUEMANN, FORMER DHS ASSISTANT SECRETARY: I am concerned that if he really digs in and cannot accept defeat, that things will be tied up in courts, and that you will have an increasingly aggressive right-wing group of folks trying to take matters into their own hands.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): A second former Trump DHS official Miles Taylor tells CNN, warnings about right-wing domestic terror threats were discounted in White House briefings. Everything from the white supremacist movements to QAnon networks were ignored by the White House and dismissed, Taylor tells CNN, because those groups were seeing as basis of support for the President.
[17:45:06]
That includes the Boogaloo, whose followers sometimes have right-wing beliefs, other times not.
BENJAMIN RYAN TEETER, BOOGALOO MEMBER: So, I'm with the Boojahideen.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): This summer I interviewed Benjamin Ryan Teeter, a heavily armed 22-year-old from North Carolina, patrolling the streets in Minneapolis after George Floyd's killing. Unlike some Boogaloo followers, he made it clear he doesn't support President Trump.
GRIFFIN (on-camera): Reluctant (ph) anarchist.
TEETER: Yes, it's commonly misunderstood term.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): On September 4th, the FBI arrested Teeter and another member of his Boojahideen, claiming the men were ready to support Hamas as mercenary soldiers, and even destroying government monuments and targeting politicians and members of the media. Teeter has yet to enter a plea. But the case makes his previous comments all the more chilling.
GRIFFIN (on-camera): Do you advocate any kind of civil war?
TEETER: You know, I'm willing to do. We have to.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): And while right-wing extremists and white supremacist groups are still considered the top threat by U.S. officials, extremism expert Joel Finkelstein, for the first time documented loose coordination of left-wing anarchists using social media to organize.
FINKELSTEIN: The anarchist media was already pitching the event as the beginning of a revolution.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): On July 25th, four U.S. cities erupted in violence. The research shows that what anarchists shared online happened on the ground. Across the cities, almost identical drifts (ph), tactics, even the use of umbrellas to hide their identities. Fringe extremists on the right and left seek to destroy our democracy, no matter who wins in election. FINKELSTEIN: People seem to think the election is the thing that's going to solve that. There's every reason to believe that the election is something that's going to make that much worse.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRIFFIN: And, Wolf, multiple police agencies across the country are already telling us they are canceling police officers time off around the election days. Baltimore P.D. going one step further. They have opened up an incident command room looking for any information of unrest as we lead up to this momentous election. Wolf?
BLITZER: Yes, hard to believe this is happening here in the United States of America. Drew Griffin, thank you very much. Very disturbing.
Coming up, election officials fear polling places could become the scene of intimidation, even violence after President Trump urged his supporters to, quote, watch the voting process.
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[17:52:30]
BLITZER: The breaking news we're following, Republican Texas Governor Greg Abbott has just ordered a significant reduction in the number of drop off locations for mail-in ballots. The state Democratic Party is already calling that move, blatant voter suppression.
Our Pamela Brown has more on the latest election integrity developments from across the country.
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TRUMP: Go into the polls and watch very carefully.
PAMELA BROWN, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Trump's call for supporters to stakeout polling places has state officials scrambling to respond to the potential for Election Day intimidation and possibly violence. The Massachusetts Attorney General is trying to calm her voters and warn about intimidation.
MAURA HEALEY, MASSACHUSETTS ATTORNEY GENERAL: We're not going to let Donald Trump undermine our election. It's a crime.
BROWN (voice-over): While 11 governors united to condemn the President's message as a threat to democracy writing, there is absolutely no excuse for promoting the intimidation or harassment of voters.
TRUMP: In Philadelphia, they went into watch. They were called poll watches, a very safe, very nice thing. They were thrown out, they weren't allowed to watch. You know why? Because bad things happen in Philadelphia, bad things.
BROWN (voice-over): But it wasn't a bad thing. Under state law, poll watchers are not allowed in early voting locations. But earlier that day, a false narrative began when a Trump campaign staffer claimed Pennsylvania Democrats were scheming against the President, asking in a tweet, what are they hiding?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No one's being turned away because there aren't pole watchers in the satellite offices. That is complete propaganda.
BROWN (voice-over): The RNC aims to dispatch tens of thousands of election monitors across the country, which both parties are entitled to do. But language and Republican sponsored Facebook ads directing supporters to a campaign website called, Army for Trump, is raising concerns.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need every able-bodied man or woman to join Army for Trump's election security operation.
BROWN (voice-over): As is this ad warning supporters, Democrats are trying to tip the scales and to fight back. This is playing out as a federal court in Montana is serving up a win to the state's Democratic governor. Republicans and the Trump campaign sued to stop an expansion of mail-in voting there on the basis of widespread fraud. The judge called that a, quote, fiction.
BEN GINSBERG, REPUBLICAN ELECTION LAWYER: The President's allegations of fraud now have to be proven in court. And I know from my years of looking for this, that that proof is not going to exist.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[17:55:01]
BROWN: And tonight the Trump campaign is defending the President's comments on poll watching releasing the statement saying, "Poll watchers are critical to ensuring the fairness of any election, and President Trump's volunteer poll watchers will be trained to ensure all rules are applied equally". And some campaign officials have told me the President meant for people to register to be poll watchers.
But here's the bottom line, Wolf, the President didn't say that. And the concern is that people will hear his words and view it as a call to action to be a poll watcher unofficially, which critics warn could lead to voter intimidation. That's why you're seeing so many state officials speak out about this.
BLITZER: Pamela Brown reporting for us, thank you.
Coming up more in our top story, the White House's refusal to say that the President flatly contends white supremacy.
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