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The Situation Room
Trump Withdraws From Next Presidential Debate; Interview With Commission on Presidential Debates Co-Chair Frank Fahrenkopf; Michigan Governor Says, Hate Groups Heard Trump's Words as a Rallying Cry; Fourth Journalist Who Covers Trump Tests Positive for COVID-19; U.S. Coronavirus Deaths Top 212,000 With 7.5 Million Cases, CDC Now Projects Up to 21,000 More Deaths by October 31. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired October 08, 2020 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:09]
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer in THE SITUATION ROOM.
We're following breaking news on the second Trump Biden debate now derailed, this after the president rejected the Debate Commission's new plan to hold the event virtually amid deep concerns about his COVID-19 infection.
I will speak to the commission co-chair, Frank Fahrenkopf, this hour.
The House speaker, Nancy Pelosi, meanwhile, says the president's behavior since his illness suggests he's in a -- quote -- "altered state." House Democrats are now planning to introduce a bill creating an oversight commission the president's health in a possible move toward invoking the 25th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.
Also breaking, at least 13 suspects now are implicated in an alleged militia plot to kidnap Michigan's Democratic governor and overthrow several state governments, federal and local authorities announcing charges today.
First, let's go to our chief White House correspondent, Jim Acosta.
Jim, the president, he's back in the West Wing tonight, despite his COVID-19 infection.
JIM ACOSTA, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf.
And we saw Marines stationed outside the West Wing earlier this afternoon, and there's one outside this evening. We can show you that picture right now. That means the president did return to the Oval Office today, White House officials confirming that, even though Mr. Trump is still shedding the coronavirus and potentially spreading it to people around him.
The president claims he's no longer contagious, even though health experts say, don't bet on it. And the president, as you said, is also backing out of next week's debate with Democrat Joe Biden, insisting he won't agree to a virtual face-off with the Democratic nominee.
And the president has had some choice words for Senator Kamala Harris, calling her a monster. One Trump adviser told me earlier today that likely will not help with the president's problems with women voters.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ACOSTA (voice-over): Still dodging the White House press corps and opting for his own West Wing video crews to send out proof-of-life messages to the world, President Trump is backing out of his next debate with Democrat Joe Biden, refusing to agree to a virtual, virus- free format.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I heard that the commission a little while ago changed the debate style, and that's not acceptable to us. I'm not going to do a virtual debate.
ACOSTA: Claiming the president won't be contagious in a matter of days, the Trump campaign proposed postponing the debate for a week, drawing a tart response from one top Biden official, who said -- quote -- "Trump's erratic behavior does not allow him to rewrite the calendar and pick new dates of his choosing."
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We don't know what's the president's going to do. He changes his mind every second.
ACOSTA: It was just one week ago when Mr. Trump accused Biden of wanting to skip the remaining debates.
TRUMP: Now I understand he's canceling the debates. Let's see what happens. I think that's not going to be a good move.
ACOSTA: Candidates have debated remotely before, as John F. Kennedy and Richard Nixon did from two different studios in 1960.
SEN. KAMALA HARRIS (D-CA), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Mr. Vice President, I'm speaking.
ACOSTA: Democrats are accusing Mr. Trump of sexism after he called Kamala Harris a monster and a communist in response to her performance at the vice presidential debate.
TRUMP: And this monster that was on stage with Mike Pence, who destroyed our last night, by the way, but this monster.
ACOSTA: In a White House video, the president, who's been administered a combination of experimental medications, is claiming he's been cured of the coronavirus. But that's not true, as there is no cure for COVID-19.
TRUMP: But we have medicines right now. And I call them a cure. I went into the hospital a week ago, I was very sick. And I took this medicine. And it was incredible. It was incredible. I could have walked out the following day. ACOSTA: Mr. Trump is boasting his natural attributes are an asset too.
TRUMP: I'm back because I'm a perfect physical specimen and I'm extremely young.
ACOSTA: House Speaker Nancy Pelosi isn't buying that one.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): Specimen? Did he say specimen? Maybe I could agree with that. His disassociation from reality would be funny, if it weren't so deadly.
ACOSTA: Dr. Anthony Fauci cautioned, the president could still suffer a setback.
DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: One of the issues that we all have to be aware -- and his physicians are aware of this -- that the history of COVID-19 is that you could look and feel like you're doing reasonably well, and, after a couple of days, you could have a downturn.
ACOSTA: Aspects of the president's health remain a mystery. CNN has confirmed some medical professionals at Walter Reed Medical Center were asked to sign nondisclosure agreements when the president made a last-minute visit there almost one year ago.
Mr. Trump is speculating that he caught the virus at an event for Gold Star families, but one Gold Star group says the families tested negative beforehand.
TRUMP: I'm not going to be at a basement saying, hey, I can't see you as you traveled in from California and all the different places. It's OK.
ACOSTA: The White House is trying to clean up that one too.
ALYSSA FARAH, WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS: And I appreciate you asking that, so we can clarify. His point was merely that, in the time frame that he was potentially exposed, there were a number of different venues that he'd been at, individuals he'd interacted with.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ACOSTA: And the White House communications director, Alyssa Farah, told reporters officials won't be specifying exactly when the president had his last negative test for COVID-19, insisting that Mr. Trump's private medical information.
[18:05:03]
She added, the doctors for the president would like to keep that information private.
Of course, Mr. Trump could make all of that information public if he wanted to. But, as we reported yesterday, the president is not being tested or was not being tested daily prior to his positive test results for the virus last week.
And, Wolf, we should note, as the Marine is standing outside the West Wing, with the president in the Oval Office, we're told by officials that the president's doctor, Sean Conley, should be releasing some sort of statement, some sort of update on the president's health. We're waiting for that. And we will get that to you as soon as we get it -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Yes, when that Marine guard is there at that door outside the West Wing, we know the president is in the Oval Office. When he's not there, the guard, the president is the residence or someplace else.
Jim Acosta, thank you very much for that report. We will stay in close touch with you.
Let's get some more now on how Joe Biden's campaign is responding to the new debate drama.
CNN's Jessica Dean is covering up part of the story for us.
Jessica, Biden now plans to hold his own town hall next week, after the president pulled out of their scheduled town hall debate. So what's the latest you're getting?
JESSICA DEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, the Biden campaign was prepared to do the virtual debate that had been proposed by the commission.
It was once, as you mentioned, that President Trump pulled out of that debate that they decided to do their own thing, which means now, on October 15, Joe Biden will be doing a televised town hall from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, instead of doing a virtual town hall with the president.
The Biden campaign also requesting that the October 22 debate, which would be the scheduled final debate, be a town hall format, so both President Trump and Vice President Biden would get to interact with voters in some capacity before this was all over during an official debate.
The Biden campaign really of the mind that President Trump cannot, in their words, rewrite the rules here at the end. They go back to the fact that everyone had agreed to and committed to these dates back in June, and they want to stick with them as closely as possible.
And remember this, too, as well, Wolf. The Biden campaign has made COVID and President Trump's response to COVID, as well as leadership, the two key issues of their campaign. And the more that Joe Biden gets to talk about those things, the better position that they are in.
So this is a very strong position for them that, on the 15th, Joe Biden can say that it is because the president has contracted COVID-19 himself that they are not allowed to debate, as they had previously scheduled.
BLITZER: You know, it's interesting, because we heard Biden defend his running mate, Kamala Harris, after the president of the United States called her repeatedly a monster and a communist.
It's unbelievable.
DEAN: Yes, it truly is.
Kamala Harris and Joe Biden on the trail together for the first time in a very long time out in Arizona. And they spoke to the press. Here's what Joe Biden had to say about that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: It's despicable. It's despicable. It's so beneath the office of the presidency.
And the American people are sick and tired of it. They know who this man is. It's got to stop. It's not only -- this is one of the finest persons I have ever dealt with. This is a person who is ready on day one to be the president of the United States of America.
This is a person who has more integrity in their little finger than most people have in their whole body. And the idea -- it's obvious he cannot -- he has great difficulty dealing with strong women, great difficulty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DEAN: Biden/Harris launching a bus tour of Arizona together.
But, Wolf, interesting to note, the two will be writing in separate vehicles, out of an abundance of caution.
BLITZER: Which is smart.
All right, Jessica, thank you very much, Jessica Dean reporting.
Let's discuss with our experts.
And Sanjay Gupta is with us right now.
Sanjay, the president claims that an in-person debate would be perfectly safe, even though he does have COVID-19, that he might no longer be contagious. Would it be safe for Joe Biden and the president to share a stage next week at what was supposed to be the second debate?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, I think there's two issues here.
One is that we don't really know where in the disease course the president is, because we still haven't gotten a clear idea of when his last negative test was. So it's important, not just because of contact tracing, which is critically important, but also his own health and trying to figure out his contagiousness.
We can show you -- I mean, it does seem like, typically, people can -- after -- 10 days after they first start having symptoms, they are usually no longer contagious. But it depends a little bit again on when that time period is and what the negative tests are.
Also, at least 24 hours since last a fever without using medications. He's likely still on steroids, Wolf, because the course of that is usually 10 days as well. So, that would suppress a fever. Are these medications just suppressing symptoms or not? That's going to be critical.
[18:10:03]
And, obviously, you want him improving in his symptoms overall.
But, Wolf, the second thing is, regardless of whether or not the president has COVID, even before the first debate, you and I were talking, and I said, we're in the middle of a pandemic still. And I think any time you aggregate people together indoors like that, there is a concern.
I mean, that's just the way it is. I get the need for the discourse and debates and stuff like that, but, virtually, obviously, would be a lot safer. Doing it outside would even be incrementally safer.
But doing it inside, when the virus could potentially aerosolize, they can make it as safe as they possibly can, but they can't say that it's safe.
BLITZER: Yes, that's absolutely true.
The White House, Sanjay, claims that the date of the president's last negative test is a private medical history matter. Is that good enough?
GUPTA: Well, I don't think so, Wolf, because this is a contagious disease. That's the issue here.
I mean, it's not just about the president's health. I mean, I think people are certainly entitled to their own health privacy, no question about it. But with regard to this particular issue, if you have potentially put other people at risk, exposed other people to the virus, they may not know it yet, but they -- because they haven't been contacted.
That's an issue, obviously. So, it's not just about the president in this case, or anybody who has COVID. I don't know what the legality of it is. This has probably come up with things like HIV in the past. But there's some duty to inform, if not legally, at least morally.
BLITZER: Laura Coates is with us, our legal analyst.
Laura, the speaker, Nancy Pelosi, is preparing something truly extraordinary, to unveil a new bill that would actually establish a Commission on Presidential Capacity. It's really amazing, perhaps invoking the 25th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.
How would that legislation work?
LAURA COATES, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, we believe it would work in the way that the 25th Amendment already contemplates, Wolf, the idea that there would be a congressional body or a committee that is comprised of medical experts who will be able to assess the condition of the president.
And the reason for that is because, right now, the way it operates is that you would have a majority rule, essentially, between the vice president and the majority of the Cabinet.
Of course, the Cabinet members serve at the whim of the president and at the pleasure of the president. So you kind of have the idea of the lion guarding the henhouse, and not being -- the fox guarding the henhouse, and not being able to truly assess objectively.
So, this would create the body that was already contemplated in the 25th Amendment to say, listen, are there are objective criteria for us to decide, within a limited amount of time, as members of Congress, to determine whether the president of the United States is indeed either incapacitated or unable to discharge his duties faithfully?
This would make the congressional members have a much larger role than they do right now, because it's only the vice president and the Cabinet who can ask those same questions.
BLITZER: Yes, the speaker suggesting the president's in an altered state right now.
Ryan Lizza, what do you make of this latest move by Speaker Pelosi?
RYAN LIZZA, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, one, she's -- there's no doubt she's raising this because we're on the eve of an election.
But that doesn't mean that it's not a legitimate issue. I don't mean -- she's usually -- but -- she's saying the president is acting irrationally. I think it's rather difficult to tell whether the way he's been acting the last few days has anything to do with the steroids or other treatments he has coursing through him, or if this is just the way Trump always acts.
The baseline here is fairly erratic to begin with.
And then just one thing I wanted to add, Wolf, on what Sanjay was talking about, about the White House, with this absurd argument, citing President Trump's privacy. When I go to the White House -- they actually stopped doing this, but, earlier this year, they would give a temperature check to every journalist that went through those gates.
As we know, at the big events, everyone gets tested before the event. We realize that's not foolproof now, but everyone was testing. Nobody was concerned about the privacy rights of those people testing.
When I go out and cover the Biden campaign, they have a testing facility set up in Wilmington, Delaware, where the journalists gather. You get tested.
It is just ludicrous to argue that the most important piece of information, when did he get tested, so we can know who else he may have exposed, that they are citing that as the privacy issue. You could imagine some medical secrets that a president has that maybe the public doesn't have a right to know about.
I would argue there are none. But this is the most basic thing, considering we're dealing with a contagious disease.
BLITZER: Yes, a very important point, indeed.
Laura, let me get your reaction to something really disgusting that the president said on FOX Business earlier today about Senator Kamala Harris. Listen to this.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
TRUMP: She was terrible. She was -- I don't think you could get worse and totally unlikable. And she is. She's a communist, and this monster that was on stage with Mike Pence.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
[18:15:08]
BLITZER: He repeatedly called her a communist, not once or twice, but several times, called her a monster several times.
What's your reaction to that, Laura?
COATES: Well, not only is it, as you said, disgusting and wrong, it also is inaccurate, because, last I checked, the terms he used were not synonymous with what I saw on stage yesterday, which is somebody who was eloquently responding to questions that were asked of her, and trying to give the American people some semblance of a substantive platform that would placate people, that would allow people to understand what their bid for the campaign was going to be.
I find it very shocking that the president of United States would continue to use these sorts of disparaging comments and remarks, and have this knee-jerk elementary school reaction, where he tries to degrade members of the Senate, not just a candidate on the other side of the ticket.
But perhaps the monster he was looking at was the fly that landed for two minutes, and he just got confused for a second of what he's actually speaking about.
And the idea of talking about communism, remember, we have heard over the course of several months now, as the Democratic Party tried to determine who their nominee would be, all sorts of hyperbolic terms to try to define what the platform was, whether it's going to be ultra- liberal or other terms they used about socialism.
Now we're hearing yet another word that is intended to try to elicit a response and a visceral reaction, when I think what the people want, generally speaking, politics aside, they have a visceral reaction to any time something is told them that's a lie, that's untruthful, and that misconstrues what they want to know about, which is the platform and what somebody who's asking to be the president for four more years actually intends to do.
BLITZER: All right, everybody, stand by. Guys, thank you very much.
Coming up, I will speak with the co-chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates, Frank Fahrenkopf. There you see him. We got a lot of questions for him. He's standing by.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:21:25]
BLITZER: Next week's second presidential debate is derailed, after President Trump rejected the nonpartisan commission's plan to hold the debate virtually because the president has coronavirus.
Let's discuss with Frank Fahrenkopf. He's the co-chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates.
Frank, thanks so much for joining us. Thanks for everything you're doing.
Are you still trying at all to salvage that October 15 presidential debate, the town hall-type debate in Miami, or is the event officially now canceled?
FRANK FAHRENKOPF, CO-CHAIRMAN, PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE COMMISSION: Well, we haven't officially canceled it yet.
But, as you know, today, when the president rejected doing the debate next week, the Biden campaign immediately said that they were going to withdraw from it. And they have arranged on another network a town hall meeting.
We haven't heard back yet from the Trump campaign as to exactly what they're going to do, although I did talk to someone from the Biden campaign today. And they said they definitely will be in Nashville on the 22nd, which is the date already set for the final debate. And they are willing to do the normal debate, which would replicate -- be replication of pretty much what happened in Cleveland a couple of weeks ago, or could convert it to a town hall meeting.
I haven't heard yet from the White House or the campaign as to what the view of that is. But, hopefully, we will hear it in the next few hours or certainly in the next couple of days. Then a decision will have to be made concerning Miami, and also a decision be made as to how we proceed in Nashville.
BLITZER: Well, let's talk about Miami for one quick second, because let's say, between now and next week, October 15, when the Miami town hall debate is supposed to take place virtually in different studios, the president and the former vice president, if the president were to change his mind and say, yes, he's now ready to go ahead and participate in this virtual debate, would the commission agreed to move forward with it now?
Or is it too late because Biden has already agreed to a separate town hall on ABC?
FAHRENKOPF: Well, as you know, the old saying, it takes two to tango. Well, it takes two to debate.
And so it would depend. If the president took that position, it would depend on whether or not the Biden campaign would be willing to backtrack and say, all right, we will do it. In that case, we would entertain it and, of course, hopefully put it on.
But, again, everything is subject to what we're doing with regard to medical safety. As you know, we have the Cleveland Clinic advising us as to how to proceed.
I'm not a doctor and members of our commission are not doctors. So, we're being guided by medical advice. And everyone has to be cleared in order to go forward.
And it's not just the safety of the two candidates, but, as you know, in a town hall meeting, we have a bunch of people from the community who are asking the questions. We have a crew of people who build the sets, who work the microphones, and so forth.
And they're in danger, if we're not sure that both of them are safe, and that we can hold it in a safe manner.
BLITZER: Would the third -- what is supposed to be the third and final debate, the one in Nashville October 22, would that be virtual, or will they be in-person?
FAHRENKOPF: Well, right now, the intent is, it would be in-person.
But that, again, will depend on the medical advice we receive, as to whether or not it would be safe to do so. And it really wouldn't make much difference whether or not it's a town hall meeting or it's the regular one-on-one with podiums.
It's going to depend on the health issue. And that what's going to guide us. If there's a health problem, then we will probably suggest that we go virtual.
[18:25:05]
But we will just have to see. It's too early to tell how that's going to work out.
BLITZER: Well, we will see what happens. I know you guys are doing really important work. We're grateful to you and the entire commission.
Frank Fahrenkopf, thanks so much for joining us.
FAHRENKOPF: Great. Thank you so much, Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, good luck.
Just ahead, authorities now charge militia members in an alleged anti- government plot involving plans to actually kidnap the governor of Michigan, Gretchen Whitmer. There you see her. We have new information.
We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:30:00]
BLITZER: More breaking news we're following. The White House now responding to Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer's remarks, calling out President Trump for his refusal to condemn white supremacists and hate groups. The White House press secretary, Kayleigh McEnany, is saying, Governor Whitmer is sowing division. This comes after authority say they thwarted an alleged militia plot to kidnap Governor Whitmer.
CNN Justice Correspondent, Jessica Schneider reports on the dramatic details of the investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GOV. GRETCHEN WHITMER (D-MI): I knew this job would be hard. But I'll be honest, I never could have imagined anything like this.
JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer speaking out against the alleged plot to kidnap her.
WHITMER: You don't have to agree with me, but I do ask one thing, never forget that we are all in this together.
SCHNEIDER: Today, the FBI charging six men in the conspiracy saying the group plotted to kidnap the governor from her vacation home before the election. Authorities became aware of the scheme as they monitored social media and discovered a group of men based in Michigan mapping out how to vitally overthrow government officials and target law enforcement.
ANDREW BIRGE, U.S. ATTORNEY FOR THE WESTERN DISTRICT OF MICHIGAN: They alleged conspirators used operational security measures, including communicating by encrypted messaging platforms and used code words and phrases and an attempting to avoid detection by law enforcement.
SCHNEIDER: Law enforcement was able to track the group by using informants and undercover agents who recorded the men when they visited the governor's vacation home two times.
BIRGE: Fox and Croft, in particular, according to the complaint, discussed detonating exploding devices to divert police from the area of the home. And Fox even inspected the underside of a Michigan highway bridge for places to seat an explosive.
The complaint further alleges that Fox purchased a taser for use in the kidnapping and that the group successfully detonated an improvised explosive device wrapped with shrapnel to test its anti-personnel capabilities. SCHNEIDER: State officials announcing separate terrorism charges against seven other men linked to a militia group, saying they planned to instigate civil war, target police officers and storm the capitol building in Lansing, taking hostages, including Governor Whitmer.
MATTHEW SCHNEIDER, U.S. ATTORNEY FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF MICHIGAN: All of us in Michigan can disagree about politics, but those disagreements should never, ever amount to violence.
SCHNEIDER: Whitmer has been a frequent target of President Trump over her coronavirus response, Trump saying this at a rally in her state last month.
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: You'd be doing even better if you had a governor that knew what the hell she was doing. You have got to open up the state.
SCHNEIDER: And tweeting, liberate Michigan, in April.
Protesters and militia, some armed, have even gathered at the state capitol calling for an end to Whitmer's stay-at-home order. The governor today blaming Trump for escalating the rhetoric.
WHITMER: Stand back and stand by. Hate groups heard the president's words not as a rebuke but as a rallying cry, as a call to action. When our leaders speak, their words matter.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: And Republicans around Michigan have rallied around and in support of Governor Whitmer. Of course, she's a Democrat. But White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany saying that Whitmer's comments are divisive, her allegations outlandish. Kayleigh McEnany putting it this way today, saying, President Trump has continually condemned white supremacists and all forms of hate. But, Wolf, Kayleigh McEnany leaving out that it did take President Trump two days after that last debate to come out and actually condemn white supremacists. Wolf?
BLITZER: All right. Jessica, thank you, Jessica Schneider reporting. A quick programming note, Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer will be one of the guests later today on Erin Burnett Outfront. That's right at the top of the hour right after The Situation Room.
Joining us now, the mayor of Atlanta, Kesha Lance Bottoms. Mayor Bottoms, thank you so much for joining us.
You just heard Governor Whitmer say, hate groups hear President Trump's words as a call to action. How alarming is this news out of Michigan about this foiled plot to you?
MAYOR KEISHA LANCE BOTTOMS (D-ATLANTA, GA): It's very alarming, Wolf, and the governor very eloquently summed up where we are. This is a president who is feeding into the hatred. And this is a democracy. We often disagree on our politics and our policy, but this is not how we deal with those who we disagree with. The most powerful vote -- the most powerful weapon that we have is our right to vote. And the thought that someone would threaten the governor's life and based upon really what's being inflamed by this president really speaks to where we are in this country and the danger of this president.
[18:35:02]
BLITZER: Let's get to the pandemic right now, which seems to be escalating in so many parts of the country. We're learning at the end of May, the White House chief of staff, Mark Meadows, actually hosted an indoor wedding in Atlanta, your city, with around 70 guests flouting local coronavirus guidelines. What's your response to a member of the Trump administration traveling to your city and apparently, at least according to these reports, ignoring the public health guidelines?
BOTTOMS: Just really making a mockery of this pandemic and the people who are getting sick and the people who are dying. And it's as simple as wearing a mask. It's a complete disregard for where we are with COVID-19, no respect or regard for the people who work in the hotel, the people who are serving them their food that evening. These are people who can take this home to their families and die.
And it's unfortunate, and it is the reason that so many people across this country aren't taking this virus seriously. I understand that people have weddings and they want to have celebrations, but as far as I know, there were no masks worn. It was a complete disregard of what we've asked people to do in our city and in our state at that time.
BLITZER: Amidst all of this, Mayor, President Trump has now launched a series of brutal attacks against the vice presidential nominee, Kamala Harris, following last night's debate. I want you to listen to what he said on Fox Business earlier today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: She was terrible. She was -- I don't think you could get worse and totally unlikable, and she is. She's a communist. And this monster that was on stage with Mike Pence --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: He repeatedly called her a communist. He repeatedly called her a monster. What do you make of that?
BOTTOMS: He's a silly man with silly words. And it is unfortunate that he would resort to name-calling. That's something that I can't even say my kids would do. It is -- he's made a mockery of the presidency. He is disrespecting her as a sitting senator. He is disrespecting her as a woman. And if this is the best that he has to offer just not one week removed from being on his death bed, then God help us all.
BLITZER: Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms of Atlanta, thank you so much for joining us.
BOTTOMS: Thank you. BLITZER: Just ahead, we're learning that another member of the White House press corps, yet another member, has tested positive for the coronavirus. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:40:00]
BLITZER: We're back with breaking news on the growing coronavirus outbreak over at the Trump White House. Get this, a fourth journalist who covers the president now has tested positive for COVID-19.
We're joined by Dr. Richard Besser right now, the former acting Director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Dr. Besser, thanks so much for joining us.
Another infection. Were those first few positive test just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to this outbreak over at the White House? I'll put up on the screen a whole bunch of White House associates, officials who have now tested positive.
DR. RICHARD BESSER, PRESIDENT AND CEO, ROBERT WOOD JOHNSON FOUNDATION: You know, Wolf, this is one of those situations where you really want to have very thorough contact tracing. I mean, it's a complex event. You have a location where people come from all over the country and then disperse. And if you're not able to identify everyone who's potentially at risk, then you're not able to ensure that those people don't continue to spread COVID back when they return home.
So this is the kind of thing that detectives at CDC are trained to do. I trained as a disease detective there many years ago. You want it to be thorough. You want it to be complete. And you want it to be done by public health professionals.
BLITZER: The Senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, actually said today that he hasn't visited the White House since early August, more than two months ago, because he said they don't wear masks over there, they don't practice the social distancing that he is mandating in the U.S. Senate. So are we seeing the results of what clearly was a lax policy at the White House?
BESSER: You know, what I -- my reaction to that was that it's the kind of behavior that everyone should follow. If there's a setting that you know that isn't safe, you want to try and avoid that, to reduce the risks to yourself and to others. What we would like to see is our political leaders modeling the behavior that everyone else should be following.
And we know so much more now than we knew early on. We know that indoor settings are much riskier than outdoor settings. And if you are in an indoor setting and you're not six feet away from everybody, it's one of those environments in which you should be wearing a mask, practicing social distancing and keeping your hands clean.
BLITZER: And we all remember, you know, Dr. Besser that a Rose Garden event when they announced the new Supreme Court nominee, they were all sitting outside, most of them were not wearing masks. Look at all of those individuals who came down now with COVID-19, including the president and the first lady was there, and so many others. And that was outside.
But what's also very worrisome that so many of those VIPs were in an event earlier just before the outdoor Rose Garden event indoors at the White House, and, clearly, it can spread like that.
[18:45:04]
BESSER: Well, one of the things that it's important people recognize is that while being outdoors is safer, it is not totally safe. Even if you're outdoors, if you're going to be within six feet of somebody for an extended period of time, you know, for more than 15 minutes, you should be wearing a mask. It -- your risk is reduced outdoors, but it's not eliminated.
And, clearly indoors, that's a setting where you should be wearing masks. You should also be practicing the same kind of rules that we're laying out for restaurants and other indoor gatherings where you want to minimize the number of people, limit the number of people in the space. Whenever you have people packed into a closed environment, that is a risky situation.
BLITZER: Especially indoors, but even outdoors is potentially very dangerous as well.
Dr. Besser, thanks so much for joining us.
BESSER: Thank you, Wolf.
BLITZER: We have an important note. Dr. Besser will join four other former CDC directors who will be taking part in a brand-new CNN town hall on coronavirus, entitled "Facts and Fears". That's this Saturday, 9:00 p.m. Eastern, right after a special edition of THE SITUATION ROOM.
And just ahead, a disturbing new forecast as coronavirus cases rise across so much of the United States. The CDC now says the U.S. death toll could reach 233,000 by the end of this month.
We'll be right back.
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[18:51:13]
BLITZER: As President Trump keeps trying to minimize the coronavirus that's infected his own body, more Americans are dying tonight. The U.S. death toll now rising above 212,000. And the CDC now projecting up to 21,000 more Americans could die by the end of this month.
Let's get some more from CNN's Brian Todd.
Brian, the numbers, the trends keep moving in the wrong direction. BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: They really do, Wolf. And new concerns
tonight about previous hot spots that the virus heating up again. New Jersey has just reported its highest daily numbers of cases since May. And officials in New York are desperately trying to head off another outbreak like the one they saw in the spring.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TODD (voice-over): On the streets of Brooklyn, violent resistance to new coronavirus crackdowns. Fires set, melees in the street, a journalist severely beaten. Members of orthodox Jewish communities, many not wearing masks, protesting the decision by New York officials to close certain non-essential businesses and limit indoor gatherings at religious institutions to ten people.
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D-NY), NEW YORK CITY: We have state-mandated restrictions in particular areas to stop a resurgence, and that resurgence, if it is stopped, will overtake the city and lead to an across the board set of restrictions on all of New York City.
TODD: The tougher measures are only in so-called cluster areas in Brooklyn, Queens and outlying New York City suburbs, where there have been alarming upticks in coronavirus cases. Do officials have a handle on it or is New York City on the verge of another widespread outbreak like the one that crippled the city in the spring?
DR. DARA KASS, YAHOO NEWS MEDICAL CONTRIBUTOR: The New York City officials and the governor know what to do. The question is, will the people of New York, specifically in these communities let them do it?
The protests that are happening in Brooklyn are really an affront to everybody in New York who is doing the work to keep these cases down.
TODD: The news across the country, no less alarming. Half of the states continue to see increased cases. Only two states are trending down. At least half a dozen states have seen record hospitalizations in the past few days. The surge is so bad in Wisconsin, that Governor Evers announced the state has to open a field hospital.
GOV. TONY EVERS (D-WI): We obviously hoped this day wouldn't come. But unfortunately, Wisconsin is in a much different and more dire place today and our health care systems are being overwhelmed.
TODD: This comes as President Trump is promising FDA authorization of an experimental drug he's praising after taking it to combat his case of coronavirus, an antibody cocktail made by Regeneron which may reduce symptoms and can speed up recovery.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I view it as a cure, not just a therapeutic, I view it as a cure because I took it. It's great. And what I'm doing is I'm going to supply this drug.
TODD: But experts say the Regeneron cocktail is a treatment, not a cure. And Trump's praise muddies the waters.
DR. MEGAN RANNEY, EMERGENCY PHYSICIAN, BROWN UNIVERSITY: Regeneron monoclonal antibodies may actually work really well, but it's tough to take that seriously now, and it's certainly not up to the president to decide what gets approved by the FDA.
TODD: The FDA isn't commenting, but Regeneron and Eli Lilly are seeking emergency authorization from the FDA for antibody treatments, and the U.S. is already putting up money for the companies to start producing therapeutics.
ALEX AZAR, HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY: We could have tens or hundreds of thousands of doses this fall, pending FDA authorization.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: Now, what President Trump and his aides have not mentioned is that the Regeneron antibody treatment was developed using technology that his administration has been trying to ban. The Regeneron therapy indirectly relied on tissue taken from an aborted fetus. Trump, who's bases, of course, staunchly against abortion rights has worked to reverse health policies from the Obama era, including those that scientific research involving human fetal tissue -- Wolf.
BLITZER: All right. Brian, thank you. Brian Todd reporting.
Much more news right after this.
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[18:59:30]
BLITZER: Finally, a nightly tribute of the corona pandemic.
Meryl Sabat of New Jersey was 92 years old. She was a retired editor at a publishing company and a proud mother, grandmother and great grandmother. Her daughter, Barbara, says she loved the Philadelphia Eagles, casinos, shopping and doing "The New York Times" crossword puzzle in pen.
Priscilla Kight of Florida was 69. She was an administrator at her church for 30 years and married for 50 years. Her daughter, Victoria, says she was a good singer and cook, who was into politics and close to her three children and five grandchildren.
May they rest in peace, and may their memories be a blessing.
"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now.
