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Trump Endorses Rally Crowd Chants Of 'Lock Her Up' Nine Days After Kidnapping Plot Against Michigan Governor Stopped; CNN Reports, Former White House Chief Of Staff Tells Friends Trump Is The Most Flawed Person He's Ever Met; More Than 22 Million Votes Cast In 45 States And D.C.; GOP Sen. Sasse Blasts Trump, Refuses To Campaign For Him; Trump Visits Michigan, Wisconsin As Biden Leads Polls In Those States. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired October 17, 2020 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[20:00:00]

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. This is a special edition of THE SITUATION ROOM.

Our breaking news this Saturday night, the most powerful man in the free world seemingly calling for the jailing of the democratically elected Governor of the state of Michigan less than two weeks after the world learned of a highly rehearsed alleged kidnapping and murder plot against her. Listen to President Trump tonight in Michigan along with the crowd at his campaign rally using Governor Gretchen Whitmer's policies to stop coronavirus as an excuse to support her imprisonment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Get your schools open. The schools have to be open, right? Lock them all up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: The president also this week called Governor Whitmer a dictator. 14 people face federal charges in the domestic terror plot against Whitmer and her family, one of which prosecutor say the suspect is considered blowing up a bridge to delay help from coming.

The president's word comes one day after he also called for the Biden family, as well as Hillary Clinton, to actually be jailed. None of them, not Whitmer, not the Biden's, not Secretary Clinton have been criminally charged with any wrongdoing for any reason.

Meanwhile, Michigan and the state he's in right now, were talking about Wisconsin, face new record high coronavirus cases as the spread of COVID in the United States has now reach over 8 million victims.

Let's go to Wisconsin right now where the president is speaking to a large crowd of supporters. Jeremy Diamond is on the scene for us. Jeremy, what's the president's closing message to the voters in this crucial battle ground state, a state he narrowly won in 2016?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf. This is a state that the president won by fewer than 23,000 votes last time around but now the polls show the president down on average about seven points, trailing the former vice president, Joe Biden. And in large part, Wolf, that's being driven by the president's handling of this pandemic.

And yet despite that, Wolf, the president is not changing his tune, continuing to insist, despite all evidence to the contemporary, that we are turning the corner on coronavirus. And, Wolf, this event here in Wisconsin comes as the state experienced a record number of cases yesterday, more than 4,000 cases across the state. Cases are surging across the state in general.

And the president's own coronavirus task force, Wolf, has warned that the situation could continue to worsen in the state.

And here is the evidence -- here is the advice that they offer, Wolf, to residents in the state of Wisconsin. I want to read you this. This is from the White House coronavirus task force's weekly report on the state of Wisconsin. They say, Wisconsin's ability to further limit and avoid increases in hospitalizations and deaths will depend on increased observation of social distancing mitigation measures by the community until cases decline. Lack of compliance with these measures will lead to preventable deaths.

And so what the White House coronavirus task force is essentially saying is that events like this one that the president of the United States is hosting with thousands of people packed closely together, very few people actually wearing masks, this event, like -- and others like it will lead to preventable deaths. That is from the president's own coronavirus task force. And yet the president here, Wolf, forging ahead.

BLITZER: This is so, so dangerous indeed. All right, Jeremy, be careful yourself over there. We'll stay in close touch.

Joining us now, Secretary David Shulkin of the former Veterans Affairs Secretary under President Trump, and CNN Medical Analyst, Dr. Rochelle Walensky, she is the Chief of Infectious Disease at Massachusetts General.

Dr. Walensky, the president is continuing to hold these huge rallies across the country after getting the virus himself. And we're hearing that his Minnesota rallies last month are now being blamed for more than a dozen COVID infections. What do you think of him not taking all of this as seriously as he clearly should and possibly exposing so many people to what is potentially at least a very deadly disease?

DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Good evening, Wolf. You know, there is now a long track record of rallies that have led to infections. So we know after the Tulsa rally in Oklahoma, cases went up six-fold in Oklahoma. We know after the South Dakota motorcycle rally, there were 400 cases attributed to that rally.

[20:05:01]

We know after the Rose Garden, 34 cases attributed to that event, and, of course what you just mentioned with Minnesota.

What concerns me most about a Wisconsin rally is that there's a swarm of COVID there right now. The case rates in Wisconsin, the positivity rates are an astounding 24 percent. So we know that people, and in that rally, are unknowingly carrying COVID and they are just going to leave a massive wake of COVID after that rally. And I would just say if you're sitting in an emergency department physician in Wisconsin, you can just anticipate an oncoming train.

BLITZER: Yes. It means for every hundred people tested, 24of them tested positive. That's so scary indeed.

Dr. Shulkin, the president rallying today in Michigan and Wisconsin, the two states -- these are two of ten states that are now seeing surges in new infections. We're clearly not where Dr. Fauci had hoped we would all be going into the fall and winter. So what are your greatest concerns right now when you see what's going on?

DR. DAVID SHULKIN, FORMER SECRETARY, VETERANS AFFAIRS: Well, Wolf, I don't think any of us are where we believe that we should be, and all of us are very concerned about what the projections are showing. In just three weeks, the CDC says that we could be having up to 6,700 new hospitalizations each and every day. And, of course, that has the real possibility of overwhelming our health care system. And it's not just the beds that may not be available, our health care professionals, for doctors and nurses are working overtime and certainly their shortages are going to be severe.

So these projections and the number of new cases that we're seeing, in my career, I don't think that we've seen a health crisis like this before.

BLITZER: And it's getting worse by the day, Dr. Walensky, despite what the president says, when he says it's disappearing or we're rounding the curve or whatever he says. If you take to look at this, maybe we've got a graphic I can put up on the screen.

But look at this last week alone. On Monday, 41,000 confirmed coronavirus cases, Tuesday, 52,000. Wednesday, 59,000, Thursday, 63,000, Friday, 69,000 new cases. It's going in the wrong direction big time, Dr. Walensky, as you can see from this graphic.

WALENSKY: And it's escalating fast. I mean, we've gone tens of thousands of cases in just a week. You know, Dr. Fauci warned us that we may very well get to a hundred thousand new cases and I suspect that we will, because we're not doing anything to mitigate this, right?

I also worry that, you know, what we see today is increasing cases and they continue to increase, what we see two weeks from now is escalating deaths.

BLITZER: Yes, that's so scary indeed. You know Dr. Shulkin, Dr. Fauci has called gatherings, potential gatherings, let's say, for Thanksgiving a risk right now coming at the end of November. Says he's not getting together even with his own children for Thanksgiving, so sad to hear that. Is that what we all should be considering as the holidays approach, given what you've observed so far? Do you think people will actually pay attention to that advice?

SHULKIN: Well, I sure hope so, Wolf. What we've seen is we've seen a lot of the spread that's been going on, has been happening within families and within small groupings. And as it gets colder, particularly in parts of the country like the northeast and the Midwest, we are going to see much more indoor activity.

And If we don't pay attention to the fact that we know that this virus does spread easily indoors and is spread through an aerosolized mechanism, we're just going to see continued spread. And I think the projections that Dr. Walensky is talking about, that Dr. Fauci is talking about unfortunately really are realistic. And if we don't get ahead of this by inauguration day, we could see 350,000 deaths in this country, just a mind boggling number. So we better take this real seriously.

BLITZER: Yes, and almost 70,000 new cases just yesterday.

Dr. Walensky, Europe is also seeing a similar spike in new cases. In many areas in Europe are putting curfews. They're targeting lock downs. They're putting all that in place. Do you think it will come to that again here in the United States?

WALENSKY: Well, I think that we need national leadership in order to come up with a cohesive plan as to move forward. I'm very worried about the current plan that the administration seems to be endorsing that looks at herd immunity through infection as a plan. I don't think that's the plan that we should move forward. Herd immunity is a plan that we should get to from vaccination, certainly not from infection or we can anticipate an extraordinary number of deaths.

So I think we need national leadership. I think we need mask wearing. I think we need distancing. And I think we need a cohesive plan.

[20:10:00]

It may be that lockdown would be necessary again. I hope it wouldn't come to that and a cohesive plan that people adhere to would sort of hope that we wouldn't need to get to there.

BLITZER: When people hear the phrase, herd immunity, Dr. Shulkin, what goes through your mind right now, because it's been so widely discredited? But I'm anxious to hear your thoughts.

SHULKIN: Yes. Listen, this is a term and concept that just being misused in all the experts in public health understand that. As Dr. Walensky said, this is a term that really is appropriately used for vaccinations. And when you get above a certain percentage of the population that are vaccinated, often 70, 80 percent of the population, others can receive some type of protection.

But this herd immunity was never meant to be used for this type of pandemic with the type of spread that we're seeing where approximately only 10 percent of the American population so far has been infected.

So I completely agree. This is not a plan. This is actually a plan for disaster and a plan to continue this pandemic. And so we have to go back to what the science tells us, what we know works. And it's about time that we test that and we can avoid a national lockdown if people would start adhering to wearing masks, social distancing, proper hygiene and respecting this virus.

BLITZER: Dr. Shulkin, thanks so much. Dr. Walensky, thanks to you as well. We're grateful for all your expertise. I appreciate it very much.

Meanwhile, general -- retired U.S. General John Kelly is telling friends that the president is the most flawed person he's ever known. The president's former White House chief of staff is not the only one from the president's inner circle to now speak out against him.

My interview with the president's former National Security Advisor John Bolton. He's standing by live. There you see him. We have lots to discuss, and we will when we come back. We'll be right back.

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[20:15:00]

BLITZER: President Trump's former White House chief of staff, retired General John Kelly, has been tight-lipped since leaving the Trump administration. But he recently slammed the president, calling him, and I'm quoting now, the most flawed person he's ever known, telling friends, once again quoting, the depths of his dishonesty is just astounding to me. Those comments were uncovered, thanks to some excellent reporting by CNN's Jake Tapper.

I'm joined now by President Trump's former national security adviser, John Bolton. His explosive best-selling new book is entitled The Room Where It Happened, A White House Memoir, there's the cover. Ambassador Bolton, thanks so much for joining us.

So you worked closely with General Kelly. What's your reaction to his comments?

JOHN BOLTON, FORMER TRUMP NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: Well, they sound very much like things that we said to each other in conversations at the White House when we were both there and I think reflect accurately on what John Kelly thinks of President Trump. I mean, he faces, as do others, the very hard question whether he should say those things publicly, especially with just a few weeks left until the election, Jim Mattis, H.R. McMaster, to name a few others, all former military. It's very hard for people brought up in that tradition to speak out publicly.

And, look, basically it's a good tradition. I think the military, when they're in uniform and when they're not in uniform, basically, should try to stay out of politics. But I think when the commander in chief that they were serving, whether in uniform or not, is really betraying the institutions themselves. It puts it in a different light, I think.

And so I hope they're all considering very carefully, and I understand it's a hard decision, but I hope they're considering where they conclude their duty will lie in terms of speaking out publicly.

BLITZER: Because they're no longer in uniform, they're retired U.S. military officers. Why do you think he said this to people knowing almost certainly it would leak? Why not just come out on the record, speak to the American public and tell them how scared they are of this president?

BOLTON: Yes. Well, look, as someone who wrote 500 pages on what I thought, I can tell you, I understand and sympathize with the difficulty of the decision that John Kelly and many others are going through. And it really raises a fundamental question I think we ought to tackle, and that's the issue of loyalty.

Certainly, I have been criticized for writing a book during the tenure of the president that I served, not that others haven't done it as well. Former Secretary of Defense Bob Gates book came out during the Obama administration. George Tenet, former Director of the CIA, his book came out during the Bush administration.

But let's ask the question, where does the loyalty lie from former senior officials like Kelly, Mattis and Bolton? I would argue that it lies with the Constitution and with the institutions that the Constitution creates. This is not 12th century Europe. We do not live in a feudal system where it's a network of personal loyalties. There's a higher loyalty involved here to the Constitution itself.

Look, if Donald Trump had been an honorable man, I probably would have written a different kind of book. But I hope that the loyalty to the constitution will finally come to the top in their considerations. I just want to say, again, it is hard for people to come out and say this publicly and anybody who says to the contrary is just wrong.

But I hope John Kelly and the others would think about this. I think they would find a lot of support. They will be criticized by people who will call them traitor, there's no doubt about it.

[20:20:00]

But we've got less than three weeks until the election. If we're going to hear it, let's hear it now.

BLITZER: We've got 17 days, to be precise. Ambassador Bolton, let's talk about Russia for a moment. The U.S. intelligence community has known for months that Russia is actively trying to hurt the Biden campaign. And now, Rudy Giuliani has gone public with what may be misinformation tied to that effort. What do you make of this?

BOLTON: Well, I want to be clear that I'm not going to talk about anything that that I learned that was classified while I was in the White House. But this Ukraine situation really -- it just -- it was a tragedy that the people who wanted to impeach Trump were so determined to get it done quickly that they didn't look at the larger picture.

I don't want to say Kiev is the -- you know, the Vienna of this century, the location of the iconic film, The Third Man. There a lot of Russian agents working Ukraine, not because of the United States, because they're trying to influence Ukraine. And when people go there and supposedly get information about all these different conspiracy theories, if there aren't Russian agents working them, then the FSB is asleep on the job.

So I think it's a dangerous situation. Some of these things we've seen report in the press, if they had come to normal U.S. intelligence operations, it would have been given a very, very hard counterintelligence scrub. We haven't seen that here obviously. This is really, potentially very damaging, very destabilizing to the United States, which is what Russia fundamentally wants. They're not really in this for one candidate or the other. They're in it fighting asymmetric warfare against the Constitution in our institutions.

BLITZER: Yes. The U.S. intelligence community has long has said that the Russians are trying to sow political dissent in the United States to weaken the U.S. as much as possible, to embarrass the U.S. around the world as much as possible.

You saw them report in The Washington Post that U.S. intelligence officials actually warned President Trump that Rudy Giuliani was being used to give him Russian misinformation. When you were part of the administration, the president's national security adviser in the White House, what did you think of Rudy Giuliani? Did you have any reservations at all about him coming and going into the west wing?

BOLTON: Look, Rudy was a friend of mine for a long time before the Trump administration. And like a lot of friendships, the Trump administration has gotten in the way of it. I didn't know a lot of what Rudy was doing and I was just as happy not to because it was political.

And my feeling was the president and his advisors outside the government are entitled to conduct their own political strategies and campaigns. They have a First Amendment right too. But none of that had anything to do with the work of the National Security Council. So, I was trying to keep the lines sharp and the less I had to do with it, frankly, the better.

BLITZER: But did you think that Rudy Giuliani is being used by Russian intelligence?

BOLTON: Well, I can't say one way or the other, but I will say this. If you're a foreign adversary looking for vulnerabilities, you're going to try and find people close to the president. You're going to ask what is it that they want and what can we give them that they will, they will think is helping their efforts, but what, in fact, will help us. So if I were going to look for a target, I'd look for political operatives close to the president, and those would be the people I would try to corrupt. BLITZER: President Trump last night, once again, today, in this political campaign rallies, talked about locking up his opponents. I want you to watch and listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I'll tell you something though, and it's -- to locked them up, you should lock them up. Lock up the Biden's, lock up Hillary.

You got to get your governor to open up your state, okay? And get your schools open. Get your schools open. The schools have to be open, right? Lock them all up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Lock them all up, he says. As someone who has called out authoritarian voices around the world for so many years, Ambassador Bolton, does this kind of talk from the president of the United States worry you? He tweeted today that Joe Biden, in his words, is a national security threat and he's basically charging all of them with being corrupt and criminal.

BOLTON: Yes. Well, it's decidedly unpresidential and I think it is destructive of civic life in this country when the president himself engages in it. And I think it's corrosive.

[20:25:00]

It produces the same kind of reaction on the other side. And frankly, this is one of the reasons -- I'm just speaking out as a conservative Republican -- why I think Donald Trump is so destructive to the conservative cause. This is not behavior that conservatives should support because it does fundamentally compromise the ties that bind the country as a whole. America is very vulnerable when it's disunited. And Donald Trump's campaign here is based on exacerbating the divisions.

So this is -- I think this is completely contrary to conservative values and it's something that, honestly, gives the opposition a stick that they'll use to beat conservatives with if we don't disassociate ourselves from it sooner rather than later. November 3rd would be an excellent time to begin.

BLITZER: Yes. If the Russians have been trying to sow political dissent in the U.S., as U.S. intelligence has concluded from their perspective, mission accomplished. Look at the political dissent, the debate that's unfolding here in the United States, embarrassing the U.S. and potentially weakening the U.S. globally. Do you see that happening?

BOLTON: Well, I think the damage conclude repaired after one term. I'm far more worried about the extent of the damage that Trump will produce after two terms. So let me just come back to him calling Joe Biden a national security threat.

Look, I disagree with Vice President Biden on probably every significant national security issue. Bob Gates, again, to come back to his book, said, he thought Biden was wrong on every major national security question for the last 20 years. But being wrong is not the same as being a national security threat. And when Trump makes those kinds of accusations, that gets billed as the Republican position and the conservative position, both of which are inaccurate but terribly difficult to overcome.

So this is a real burden on the country as a whole but on conservative Republicans in particular to have him purportedly carrying that standard.

BLITZER: You think any of this is going to sway disillusioned Republicans, and you're a long-time Republican, very conservative Republican, to break ranks at the polls in these final days?

BOLTON: Well, I think there are a lot of quiet conversations going on among Republicans. The critical election, in my view, right now in my view is for control of the Senate. I personally would much rather have Republicans keep control of the Senate under a Biden presidency than to see Trump re-elected. So that's why I think much of the effort is and should be concentrated on getting Republicans who are in jeopardy now re-elected and holding on to the Senate. I'd like to get the House too, but the highest priority should be majority control on the Senate.

BLITZER: Well, you clearly don't want Donald Trump to be re-elected for a second term, but it's interesting. You're not yet ready to support Biden and tell your supporters out there, go vote for Biden, right?

BOLTON: Well, I don't agree with Joe Biden philosophically. I've actually already voted in Maryland and I voted for a living conservative Republican who I won't say publicly, so I don't get him in trouble. But I think that's a perfectly legitimate way to go. It's the way many people have voted in past elections when they can't support their party's candidate and don't want to support the candidate of the other party.

BLITZER: Yes. The Republican governor of Maryland, the Republican governor of Massachusetts, I don't think they're going to vote for Biden but they're not going to vote for Trump either, so they're following in your footsteps.

Ambassador John Bolton, thanks so much for joining us. Good luck out there.

And I have an important note for our viewers. Tomorrow night, Ambassador Bolton will be alongside other former Trump administration officials, including Olivia Troye and Miles Taylor for a CNN Special Report, Jake Tapper hosts The Insiders, a Warning from Former Trump Officials. That's tomorrow night, Sunday, 9:00 P.M. Eastern right here on CNN.

Meanwhile, the Biden campaign is warning it's supporters today, that President Trump could still very much win this contest. So is this a clever way to avoid complacency or is the race truly this close? Stay with us. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

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[20:30:55]

BLITZER: Barely 17 days left until Election Day here in the United States, November 3rd, early voting is surging in several states. More than 22 million votes have now been cast in 45 states as well as here in Washington D.C. We're seeing a dramatic jump in the numbers in places like Illinois and North Carolina compared to the 2016 race.

Our senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein, is with us. He's also the senior editor at The Atlantic. Also, with us, our national political reporter, Maeve Reston. Guys, thanks very much for joining us on a Saturday night.

Ron, we have some breaking news and I want both of you to get your analysis. Governor Gretchen Whitmer of Michigan is now responding to President Trump's call to have her jailed for her coronavirus response. She just tweeted this, and let me put it up on the screen. "This is exactly the rhetoric that has put me, my family, and other government officials' lives in danger while we try to save the lives of our fellow Americans. It needs to stop, "close quote. Of course, she was the target of an alleged kidnapping plot. Stopped just days ago. Let me play some sound from the president earlier today. Listen to this.

[20:35:10]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Get your schools open. The schools have to be open, right? Lock them. Lock them all up.

(CROWD CHEERING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: All right. Let me get both of you have to respond. Ron first and then Maeve. Go ahead, Ron.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, look it's easy to get numb to what we are seeing and hearing. But as you and Ambassador Bolton talked about, this is extraordinarily dangerous and an extraordinary departure from the American tradition. I mean, not only today with calling for locking up and inciting, you know, antagonism toward Governor Whitmer immediately after the FBI uncovers a plot to kidnap and possibly kill her and also downplaying that.

But I mean, just yesterday, he called for locking up his opponent in 2016, his current opponent, his current opponents' family. And, you know, within the last couple of weeks complained that his attorney general had not indicted his predecessor. And where, Wolf, is the Republican Party? Remember Susan Collins said that President Trump had learned a lesson from impeachment. Yes, the lesson he learned was that he can shred and barrel through the rule of law in any way conceivable, and Republican senators will excuse and enable.

The one I'm really looking forward to hearing from the most, John James, the Republican Senate candidate in Michigan. Is he okay with the president whipping up antagonism toward the governor immediately after a plot was uncovered to kidnap and possibly killer?

BLITZER: The President called the governor of Michigan, Maeve, a dictator the other day, what's your reaction to what he's now saying, and her clearly, understandably, very angry response?

MAEVE RESTON, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, you know, I think that this proves her point exactly, which is that, you know, he sounds like an authoritarian in these rallies, and it's so dangerous to use that kind of rhetoric when some people will take it literally. You know, obviously, some people around her have said, you know, that his tweet earlier this year about liberate Michigan was part of what led to this whole mindset of the folks who wanted to kidnap her and overthrow her government.

So, this is really dangerous rhetoric, and it's also the kind of thing that really turns off the voters that Donald Trump needs to win back. Certainly, she is a polarizing figure in Michigan, Governor Whitmer is, but people don't like to hear those kinds of attacks that start to sound really scary when there are kidnapping plots involved.

And it just makes Trump sound like this overpowering sexist figure that a lot of suburban women who he keeps referring to are not going to like those kinds of tactics, Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, they certainly, aren't they? She's the democratically elected governor of Michigan, and he's smiling as -- that he gets that crowd to say, lock her up, lock her up. We've heard that before.

Ron, let's talk about these final days of this campaign, the President is facing or fight in states that would normally be a lock for Republican incumbent president. We see, for example, Arizona, and Georgia among the battlegrounds emerging. Texas might even be in play. How much of this is about changing demographics? How much is simply desire for a change, no matter who makes up the electorate?

BROWNSTEIN: Yes, it's really -- it's really -- you know, in the Sunbelt, it's really the intersection of long-term demographic change and the immediate provocations created by President Trump. I mean, whether you're talking about North Carolina or Georgia or Texas and Arizona, Nevada, Florida, and all of these states, you're seeing an increase in the non-white share of the vote, substantial over the last two decades, reaching 40 percent of the total voters in many cases.

But the more immediate trigger here is that the recoil from President Trump in the suburbs is extending now into these big Sunbelt metro areas, whether it's Atlanta, Houston, where turnout is extraordinary, over 500,000 people have voted in Houston already. Dallas, as well as Phoenix, Maricopa County, no Democrat has won since 1948. Harry Truman, all polls show Joe Biden leading there now.

And, you know, the tipping point in this election probably are those three big Rust Belt states of Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania and whether Biden can win enough back enough white-collar blue-collar white voters to recement them in the democratic blue wall. But I think the most lasting marker from this election will be if we see the big metros of the Sunbelt begin to move in the way that the suburbs of New Jersey, and California, Illinois during the 90s, that Colorado and Virginia did earlier in the century. If that happens, it is a fundamental change in America's electoral landscape.

BLITZER: You're absolutely right. Maeve, how worried are Republicans in the states with a President clearly struggling in almost all of the polls? Let me rephrase that, in all of the polls, right now.

[20:40:07]

RESTON: Wolf, very worried. And that's why we saw Nebraska Senator, Ben Sasse, come out and talk to his some 17,000 constituents on that phone call about how dangerous he sees President Trump's rhetoric being to the future of the Republican Party, as Ron was just talking about, how it alienates women, how it alienates people in the suburbs.

And I think, you know, you aren't -- you aren't see -- you're starting to see cracks in the wall, not just because, you know, Donald Trump's numbers are so bad in the polls, but you're having this huge cascading ripple effect, not just in polls, but in money, where Democrats are just blowing away their democratic opponents -- I'm sorry, their Republican opponents, certainly in a lot of those really contested Senate races.

And, you know, folks like Sasse have talked about the potential for a blue tsunami in a couple of weeks that could just have a very lasting, devastating effects on the Republican Party, and in his view, in part because he doesn't see Trump as speaking for traditional Republicans.

So, it'll be really fascinating to see whether all of this huge turnout that we're seeing and all of that energy, whether there's enough there on the Democratic side to also shift the landscape for years to come, Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes. So many of these Republicans. They're not saying it publicly, Ben Sasse, is they're worried that the Republicans are going to lose -- they're obviously going to lose the House, but also the Senate as well, so they're very, very nervous about all that's going on.

All right. Maeve Reston, Ron Brownstein, as usual, guys, thank you very much.

President Trump today hitting two key battleground states he narrowly won in 2016 and needs to win again this year. But the polls show serious trouble for the incumbent president. We'll discuss. Harry Enten, he will break down the latest polling numbers for us when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:45:07] BLITZER: President Trump has been holding another campaign rally in Wisconsin, it's the second rally of the day was, it was in Michigan earlier today, the President is hoping to turn around polls which show his rival, Joe Biden, with a clear lead in both of those Midwestern battleground states.

Our senior political writer and analyst, Harry Enten is joining us right now. Harry, it's not just the presidency that is at stake on November 3rd, the U.S. Senate, the Senate Majority is also on the line. Layout what Democrats need to do to retake the majority in the Senate? And what are the polls telling you right now?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL WRITER: Right. So, Wolf, look, the Democrats need a net gain of three seats if Joe Biden captures the presidency, right? And right now, if you look at the polls, they look like they're in a position to do that, because take a look at here, look, on the left side of your screen, the democratic pickup opportunities, they need probably at least four of those given Alabama on the right side, where Doug Jones is, is probably going to shift to the Republicans. They need for those on the left side, and they lead in five of those democratic pickup opportunities.

You'll also notice on the right side that their second-best chance for Republicans to pick-up is in Michigan, where the Republican candidate, James, is actually losing by six points. And this just sort of gives you an understanding that Democrats have a very wide playing field to play from, because it's not just those five seats on the left side that they have an opportunity, and they also have an opportunity to a bunch of other states, these sort of rich states, and these are states, Georgia, the Georgia special Senate election, there's probably going to be a runoff come November -- come January, the Georgia regular, they're only down by a point.

And just look at all these different states, these sort of reach opportunities. So, even if they lose in maybe one or two of the states they're currently leading in, the playing field is just really, really wide for them, Wolf.

BLITZER: So, it's really amazing what's going on. The presidency, Harry, will ultimately come down to the key battleground states, a few battleground states, how are the candidates doing there?

ENTEN: Yes. So, look, Joe Biden's ahead. There's no other way to put it, right. Look at the six closest states that Trump won in 2016. And look, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Biden holds leads of at least seven points in all three of those. If he wins those three, plus the states that Hillary Clinton won in 2016, he's going to get over 270 electoral votes. But he's also, in fact, has slight advantages in Florida, Arizona, and North Carolina sort of backups, but it even goes beyond that, right?

Take a look at these sort of reach states, as I somewhat called them, right? They're the Trump reaches, the states Clinton won by three points are less than 2016. Biden holds clear advantages, and all of them, at least seven points up to 15 points in May. But look at the Biden reaches states, that Trump won by five to -- five to 10 points in 2016. Look how competitive Joe Biden is in those states. He's actually up by two in Georgia very, very tight, very tine eye up by a point. And even in Texas, which you mentioned in your last segment, look at that, a state that has not gone Democrats since 1900 and '76. Joe Biden's down by just two points there.

blitzer: Give us two reasons, Harry, why Biden seems to be leading in these polls right now.

ENTEN: Yes. Look, look at these two groups, white women and non- college white voters. These are two groups that went for Donald Trump in the final polls in 2016. He won non-college whites by 30 points. He won white women by five points. Look at white women now favoring Joe Biden by 12 percentage points, that's a 17-point swing.

And even among non-college whites, sort of the core group of the Trump base, look at that. Even though he's still ahead, that lead has been slashed nearly in half that lead is 13 points less than it was four years ago. Truth be told, Wolf, Donald Trump, if those are the current polls hold on election day, he simply cannot win given those numbers.

BLITZER: Seventy days to go. We'll see what happens. Harry Enten, as usual, thank you so much for joining us.

We'll take a quick break. Much more news right after this.

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BLITZER: Thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. We're back tomorrow night starting at 6:00 p.m. Eastern for another special edition of THE SITUATION ROOM.

Up next, join Fareed Zakaria for an in-depth look at President Trump's impact on the relationships between the U.S. and its allies, "How the World Sees America," a Fareed Zakaria special airs next on CNN.

Before we go tonight, we want to pay tribute to some of the victims of the coronavirus pandemic. Brenda Meadows of Virginia was 78 years old, a beloved mother and grandmother who relish spending time with her grandchildren. Brenda worked as a nurse for over 50 years, including 25 years with the State Department. Her daughter Lisa says she was a true Southern belle with a very strong will.

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Mary Tuck of Georgia was 79. She was an active member of her church helping to organize its popular cookbook. We're told Mary had a zest for life. She loved to travel, ride horses, and meet new people. Her daughter, Lucy, says she was a wonderful mother and grandmother who would do anything for her family. May they rest in peace, and may their memories be a blessing.

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