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Health Officials: New COVID Variant Could Be 70 Percent More Transmissible; CDC: Frontline Workers, People Over 75 Should Get Vaccine Next; Barr Contradicts Trump, Says No Widespread Election Fraud, No Basis To Seize Voting Machines, No Need For Special Counsel; Senior White House Advisers Fear Trump's Final Days; Congress Set To Pass Stimulus Bill; Interview With Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT). Aired 5-6p ET

Aired December 21, 2020 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:00]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Give you chills. We send our love and condolences to Billy's family.

Follow me at twitter, @PamelaBrownCNN or tweet the show, @TheLeadCNN. Our coverage continues right now.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I am Wolf Blitzer in THE SITUATION ROOM. We are following breaking news.

This hour, Congress is on the brink of finally passing a desperately needed COVID relief package. We are awaiting a House vote on the $900 billion deal that includes direct payments up to $600 for many, many Americans.

This as first shots of Moderna's vaccine are now being given here in the United States amid new alarm about a COVID-19 variant that may be more contagious. Tonight, more than a half million Americans have received the other authorized vaccine from Pfizer, including President-elect Joe Biden.

Also breaking, CNN has learned that some of President Trump's own advisers are now privately worried about how far he will go to try to hold on to power in his final 30 days in office warning, and I'm quoting now, "no one is sure where this is headed."

Lots of news today. First, let's go to CNN's Sara Murray. Sara, we're seeing more Americans vaccinated, a very, very promising development as we are closely watching this new COVID variant in the U.K. What's the latest?

SARA MURRAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): That's right, Wolf. Even with some of this concerning news coming out of the U.K., obviously, its good news in the U.S. to have two different coronavirus vaccines circulating, and this new Moderna vaccine will make it much easier to get across the country.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNKNOWN: It didn't hurt. It didn't hurt.

MURRAY (voice-over): The first shots of the Moderna vaccine going into Americans' arms today.

UNKNOWN: This vaccine is hope. Its hope that we will cease this pandemic. It's hope that we live a better life.

MURRAY (voice-over): As Moderna's easier storage requirements allow more corners of the U.S. to begin accessing lifesaving coronavirus vaccines.

GUSTAVE PERNA, CHIEF OPERATING OFFICER, OPERATION WARP SPEED: Over 4,000 locations will be receiving vaccines between today and tomorrow.

MURRAY (voice-over): But concerns are growing about a new variant of COVID-19 in the U.K. that reportedly spreads faster than others.

MARIA VAN KERKHOVE, WHO HEALTH EMERGENCIES PROGRAMME: It does mean that we have to work a little bit harder about preventing the spread. But again, these viruses mutate all the time.

MURRAY (voice-over): U.S. officials say it's not yet proven whether it spreads more quickly.

MONCEF SLAOUI, SCIENTIFIC HEAD, OPERATION WARP SPEED: I had conversations with my U.K. counterpart. I think scientifically to date there's no hard evidence that this virus is actually more transmissible.

MURRAY (voice-over): As researchers across the globe scramble to study the variant, a growing number of countries have halted travel from the U.K.

UNKNOWN: San Francisco and Santa Clara County now requires a 10-day quarantine upon arrival.

MURRAY (voice-over): U.S. officials still debating similar restrictions.

BRETT GIROIR, ASSISTANT SECRETARY, U.S. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES: I think everything needs to be on the table.

MURRAY (voice-over): Dr. Anthony Fauci advising against travel restrictions, telling CNN, "The U.S. must keep an eye on it, but don't overreact to it." Some governors are urging the federal government to be more aggressive.

ANDREW CUOMO, GOVERNOR OF NEW YORK (via telephone): And today that variant is getting on a plane and landing in JFK. How many times in life do you have to make the same mistake before you learn?

MURRAY (voice-over): But officials warn the new variant may already be here.

GIROIR: It could be in the United States and we might not have yet have detected it.

MURRAY (voice-over): Still, experts say the coronavirus vaccines should fend off the latest variant of the deadly disease.

GIROIR: There is also no evidence to suggest nor reason to believe that it would evade our vaccines that we have right now. Remember, our vaccines develop antibodies against multiple parts of that spike protein, not just one that's -- the mutated one.

MURRAY (voice-over): Those vaccines coming a bit more slowly than officials promised. Operation Warp Speed aimed to have 20 million shots in Americans' arms by end of the year. Now they are saying it may take until the first week of January to get those 20 million doses out to states.

ALEX AZAR, HHS SECRETARY: It's not as if there's a moment in time where all of a sudden there are 330 million doses available of vaccine. It just progressively rolls off the production lines each week.

MURRAY (voice-over): It will still be months before many Americans receive the vaccine as CDC advisers voted over the weekend that the next group to get the vaccine should be adults over age 75 and front line essential workers.

The hope for a more widely available vaccine coming as hospitals across the country warn they're already stretched, and fear the numbers could look even worse after Christmas.

CHRISTINA GHALY, DIRECTOR, LOS ANGELES COUNTY DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH SERVICES: It's heartbreaking really to see where we're at, at this point in the pandemic. We're seeing those numbers continue to go up and every day that puts more and more stress on the hospital system, on the nurses, respiratory therapists, physicians.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[17:05:02]

MURRAY (on camera): Now, we are learning that tomorrow, Dr. Anthony Fauci, is going to get vaccinated along with the head of the NIH, Francis Collins, as well as Health ans Humans Services Secretary Alex Azar. Of course, they all want to do this in public to send a message that the vaccine is safe, is effective. People should get it when it is their turn, Wolf.

BLITZER: Well, that's obviously very, very important. Sara Murray reporting for us. Thank you very much. Let's go to the White House right now where some of President Trump's own advisers are growing increasingly worried as he clings to conspiracy theories and spreads false claims about the election. Our White House correspondent Jeremy Diamond is joining us. So, Jeremy, tell our viewers what you're learning.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (on camera): Well, Wolf, with 30 days on the clock until Inauguration Day, President Trump is increasingly relying -- weighing desperate ways to overturn the results of the 2020 election, and he's doing so by relying on a group of fringe advisers, including the attorney and conspiracy theorist Sidney Powell who was spotted at the White House today for the third time in just four days.

All of this, Wolf, is leading to a growing sense of alarm among many of the president's top advisers who are concerned about how he will handle the end of his presidency.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DIAMOND (voice-over): President Trump's brazen and delusional push to overturn the 2020 election is alarming some senior officials and people close to the president who say they're concerned about how he is handling his final weeks in office.

One official telling CNN, "No one is sure where this is heading. He's still the president for another month." Now, as Trump considers an executive order to seize voting machines, naming a special counsel to investigate voter fraud, and even imposing martial law in key battleground states, even his most loyal allies are pushing back.

WILLIAM BARR, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I see no basis now for seizing machines by the federal government. You know, wholesale seizure of machines by the federal government.

UNKNOWN: Do you believe there is enough evidence toward appointing a special counsel?

BARR: If I thought a special counsel at this stage was the right tool and was appropriate, I would do -- I would name one, but I haven't.

DIAMOND (voice-over): The attorney general isn't alone. Sources telling CNN that White House counsel Pat Cippolone and Chief of Staff Mark Meadows also pushed back on the outlandish ideas raised during a heated Oval Office meeting on Friday.

Trump denied considering martial law but he is increasingly turning to the fringes of his political orbit, chief among them, former national security adviser Michael Flynn and conspiracy theorist Sidney Powell, who was removed from her position on Trump's legal team after baselessly accusing the CIA and the late Venezuelan leader Hugo Chavez of rigging the 2020 election.

The pair were at the center of a heated Oval Office meeting on Friday which sources said turned into a shouting match. Powell, whom Trump is considering naming as a special counsel was spotted again leaving the White House residence late Sunday night. Also now back in the president's ear, former White House chief strategist, Steve Bannon.

STEVE BANNON, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF STRATEGIST (via telephone): As I strongly recommended to the president, we need a special counsel named immediately, a special prosecutor just on election fraud and voter fraud. They're two different things. Election fraud and voter fraud. You need to do that immediately. DIAMOND (voice-over): Bannon who was charged with counts of wire fraud

and money laundering conspiracy last summer may also be seeking a presidential pardon.

Meanwhile, the president is missing in action on the coronavirus pandemic and downplaying one of the worst cyber-attacks on U.S. government systems, calling it, "far greater in the fake news media than in actuality." And suggesting China was the culprit even though top U.S. officials say all signs point to Russia.

MIKE POMPEO, SECRETARY OF STATE: This was a very significant effort and I think it's the case that now we can say pretty clearly that it was the Russians that engaged in this activity.

BARR: From the information I have, you know, I agree with Secretary Pompeo's assessment. It certainly appears to be the Russians.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DIAMOND (on camera): And Wolf, over on Capitol Hill, Congress appears to be on the verge of passing this $900 billion coronavirus relief bill but they are working against a midnight deadline to avoid another government shutdown. But House and Senate leaders both say they hope to pass this bill by tonight, and then of course it goes over to the president for signature. The White House has indicated that the president will, indeed, sign this bill, Wolf.

BLITZER: Jeremy, I'd like you to stay with us. I want to bring in also our senior political analyst, Ryan Lizza, the chief Washington correspondent at "Politico." Also with us, our political commentator Bakari Sellers. He is the author of the new book "My Vanishing Country."

Ryan, let's begin with this new reporting, very disturbing that some White House advisers, senior advisers are fearing for President Trump's final 30 days in office, 30 days until inauguration of Joe Biden. What do you anticipate this next month will hold?

[17:09:55]

RYAN LIZZA, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, if it's anything like the last month, I think it will be increasingly desperate attempts by Trump to manufacture more baroque details about a false election rigging scheme, more worrying is putting perhaps pressure on the incoming acting attorney general when Barr steps down.

There are all sorts of pardons in the pipeline and all sorts of hangers on in the Trump orbit who have gotten into some trouble with the law who are in line for pardons and telling Trump what he likes to hear as a way to influence him.

So, I think those are the two big worrying things, is pressuring anyone at the Justice Department with some of these open investigations and frankly abusing his pardon power to hand out favors to former associates in trouble with the law. And perhaps ultimately pardoning himself or his family members. And

that's sort of untested constitutional proposition, whether the president can pardon himself. And we may be -- that may be litigated in our future.

BLITZER: Yes. And that is certainly a possibility right now given what's going. You know, Bakari, we are learning the president is actually choosing to turn to a fringe group of advisers including conspiracist lawyer Sidney Powell, disgraced former national security adviser Michael Flynn. What does that tell you in these final few days of this transition?

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, he's turning to what we can only call the bad news bears of presidential advisers. I mean, the fact that he only has Michael Flynn and Sidney Powell and Steve Bannon to turn to.

Even Attorney General Barr has left his side. Mike Pompeo has left his side. You don't hear the names Jared Kushner in the room any more as much. It is this fringe group who as Ryan so eloquently put, they are putting their own self-interest above anything else, except for Sidney Powell who I think to be a really bad lawyer.

They all need something from this president or have received something from this president. And so this president we know to be very, very transactional and we also know him to be very self-serving, and that's what you're seeing.

And the unfortunate part is that there still are thousands upon thousands of individuals who are dying from this pandemic every single day. There are still people starving in the streets every single day because of the economic toll of this pandemic and this president is nowhere to be found.

All because he is out here trying to save himself or position himself for whatever his post presidency may be. And so, I have always told people the most dangerous time for this president was going to be between November 4th and January 20th at 12:00 p.m.

From the day after the election to the day where we have a new president being sworn in because there will be no reins on this president and reins on the abuses of power and nothing he won't attempt to do.

BLITZER: And some of his most senior advisers are so worried about what potentially he might do listening to these fringe elements out there. Jeremy, you've been doing excellent reporting.

All of this is unfolding as the outgoing Attorney General Bill Barr today totally discounted several of the president's claims on election fraud, insists that it's not necessary to appoint a special counsel. Agreed with Pompeo that, yes, Russia was engaged in that cyber-attack against the United States.

Do you think Barr's words at this late stage and Wednesday will be his final day in office, will have any impact at all on the president's thinking?

DIAMOND: I think it's hard to see them having an impact on the president's thinking, in particular because there are a lot of other people who have been talking to the president and trying to essentially walk him off of this ledge that he is on as it relates to trying to overturn the results of the 2020 election.

There's a lot of folks who have tried to tell the president let's start thinking about your post presidency, let's begin to make those plans, but the president is completely uninterested in that. And of course, we know that he had long soured on Bill Barr over the last several weeks, in particular after Bill Barr acknowledged that there was no evidence of widespread voter fraud in the 2020 election in an interview with the Associated Press.

So, ultimately, folks like Bill Barr, you know, as loyal as they can be to President Trump, they ultimately have to make a decision about whether or not they want to live in reality or whether they want to live in Donald Trump's reality.

And right now, we are seeing that schism really happening in Trump world where many of the people who were so loyal to the president, they are recognizing that they need to live in reality, and so the president is increasingly turning to these fringe figures to continue to live out his own reality.

BLITZER: Yes. Let's not forget that the Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell has even congratulated Joe Biden. He said he is the president-elect of the United States. So, of all of these supporters of the president, they're beginning to face reality at this stage.

[17:15:01]

Everybody stand by. We're awaiting Congress to vote on a new COVID-19 relief bill. I'll speak to Senator Bernie Sanders about his deep concerns that the current legislation doesn't go far enough.

And we'll have a live report from the United Kingdom on the urgent concerns right now about a new COVID variant and drastic measures to contain it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: We are following breaking news up on Capitol Hill where both the House and the Senate are expected to pass a $900 billion coronavirus relief bill that includes a $600 direct payment to people below a certain income level and extends the $300 a week jobless benefit.

There are $284 billion in forgivable loans for small businesses under the Paycheck Protection Program. The package also contains $82 billion for schools and colleges, as well as $25 billion for rental assistance.

We are joined now by independent Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont. Senator, thank you so much for joining us. You've said the relief bill is not adequate. I know you pushed for more money for direct payments to Americans who are in desperate need right now. In your view, why does this deal fall short?

[17:20:01]

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT): It falls short, Wolf, because this country today is facing the worst set of crises that we have faced in the modern history of this country. I mean, as we speak, you're looking at tens of millions of families that face eviction from their homes because they lost their jobs. They have no income.

You're looking at a record level of hunger in the United States of America. We got over 90 million people who are uninsured or underinsured in the midst of the worst pandemic in the modern history of our country. And you see poverty rising very, very significantly.

So with all of those crises out there, what we needed was a major, major response to tell the working families of this country who are struggling to keep their families in place, we hear their pain and we are responding.

Now, this bill to be honest has a lot of very important stuff in it. I mean, we work very hard. I worked with Senator Hawley to make sure there would be direct payments. I wanted $1,200 bucks. We ended up with $600, which for a family of four, the average family of four will be $2,400. Will that help? Yes, it will. Is it enough? No, it is not.

We manage to extend unemployment for another 11 weeks at a supplement of $300 on top of normal unemployment. Is that enough? No, it should have been for four months and that number should have been higher.

We provided zero financial aid to states and localities all over this country who are suffering devastating financial problems which will mean they'll have to layoff firemen, police officers, and teachers and so forth and so on.

So, this is a step forward. It is better than nothing. But it is nowhere near in my view where it should be going. And I should say, I very much look forward to when President Biden is in office that immediately, first thing he has got to do is to address this crisis and figure out a way as to how we can provide help to so many families facing economic devastation.

BLITZER: A lot will depend of course on who wins those two senate runoff seats whether the Democrats are the majority in the Senate or the Republicans as you know a lot better than I do. Bottom line, are you voting for this bill tonight?

SANDERS: Yes. Yes, I will.

BLITZER: You will vote for it. It's not perfect by any means, but it's got a lot of good things in there as you correctly point out. If the legislation is passed tonight or tomorrow, senator, when can Americans expect to finally receive those much needed stimulus checks that you fought to secure? SANDERS: According to Secretary Mnuchin, if people have the direct

deposit capabilities, those -- that money could be in their accounts within a week or two. Depending on the state in which you are living, unemployment help will get out sooner or later.

I think this time around the states should do better than they did the first time we were dealing with unemployment. So, in terms of the direct payments of $600, that money should be going out quite soon. And I can tell you that families in Vermont and all over this country desperately need that help.

BLITZER: Yes. There are so many millions of Americans who are now in poverty because of the pandemic, simply or having trouble feeding their kids, simply having trouble paying the rent. They desperately need this assistance and that's an important statement indeed.

Let me quickly turn to hack of the U.S. government agencies while I have you, senator. The president says China may be to blame but his Secretary of State, his attorney general, almost everyone in the U.S. intelligence community believes it was Russia. Why do you think the president once again is willing to contradict his own officials rather than hold Russia accountable?

SANDERS: Wolf, your guess is as good as mine. I think the American people are catching on to the fact that we have a president who is pretty far removed from reality. I think the intelligence agencies, his own Secretary of State suggest that the culprit here is Russia.

But he is on -- Trump is on an anti-Biden -- an anti-China kick and that's what he is, you know, that's what he keeps saying. But, you know, I think many of us know that the president lies all of the time and take anything that he says with a grain of salt.

BLITZER: Yes. It reminds me when I was in Helsinki covering his summit with Putin and he agreed with Putin and disagreed with the U.S. intelligence community that Russia was engaged and trying to interfere in the 2016 election. Senator Sanders, thanks for everything you're doing. Thanks very much for joining us.

SANDERS: Thanks you very much. Happy holidays to everybody.

BLITZER: Thank you very much and have a happy New Year. Stay safe out there.

[17:25:00]

Coming up, we're going to have details on a troubling new variant of the coronavirus that's been identified in Britain. We'll also get more reaction to the Attorney General William Barr's eyebrow raising news conference today.

Two of his predecessors, former attorneys general, Loretta Lynch and Alberto Gonzales, they are standing by. They'll join us. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BLITZER: Tonight, the U.S. is investigating whether new COVID-19 vaccines are effective against a new variant of the virus that may be more contagious.

[17:29:55]

The variant is of urgent concern in United Kingdom right now, prompting lockdowns and bans on travel and shipments. CNN's Salma Abdelaziz is joining us from Dover, England, one of the country's most critical ports right now. So Salma, how tight a blockade is the U.K. in right now?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN REPORTER: Wolf, it almost feels like this country is being sealed off from the outside world. The trains have stopped because the Euro tunnel is closed. Some of the planes are being stopped because so many countries are putting in restrictions in here at the port of Dover. The ships have stopped as well. But that's not all the vehicles, the trucks, they're stopping too.

I'm going to step out of my shot for a minute because I really want to show you something. If you look all down the street behind me here you're going to see tractor trailer after tractor trailer after tractor trailer. These are vehicles that are carrying goods that were supposed to make it into Europe, but they've been caught up in these restrictions. They have nowhere else to go.

These drivers are parked along what should be a public road and they'll be sleeping in these cars tonight. I actually just saw a little while ago some of these drivers literally cooking in the back of their vans. They had a little cooker. That's how they could get dinner tonight. That was the only way.

Now, the U.K. government says that they are working on this. Prime Minister Boris Johnson spoke a short time ago and said he is in touch with the French President Emmanuel Macron and that they're working on a solution in a matter of hours. The French government for their part say that they want to see a safety protocol, a health protocol in place so that trade can resume but in a safe way to not allow this variant to spread further.

It's important to remember here, Wolf, it was just this weekend that this government said that this virus is out of control. This variant is out of control. And I think critics of Prime Minister Boris Johnson might say well, he doesn't seem in control of the response, either. Wolf?

BLITZER: Salma Abdelaziz on the scene for us at Dover, England. Thank you very, very much, really an awful situation unfolding over there.

Joining us now is Dr. Tom Frieden, the former director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Dr. Frieden, thank you so much for joining us. So what about this new variant in the United Kingdom? Can you explain what this development means? And just how concerned should we be here in the United States?

DR. TOM FRIEDEN, FORMER CDC DIRECTOR: Well, first off, there's a lot we still don't know about the new variant. And we're learning more literally day by day, but it may be weeks before we know as much as we wish we knew. Right now it does appear that it spreads more readily. There's nothing that suggests that it's more deadly. And it does look like our tests will work OK on it. We don't yet know if we'll have any impact on the effectiveness of the vaccine. But certain treatments such as steroids are likely to be equally as effective with this variant as with others.

BLITZER: We're still learning about it. Admiral Brett Giroir says there is no reason to believe this new variant would evade the vaccines we now have, two have been authorized for emergency use here in the United States. Do you agree with him?

FRIEDEN: I think that's the weight of evidence now. But I'd like to be cautious and say, let's get the studies done. And see we're just finding out more about this. Now, one thing that is quite striking is that this isn't just a little change. This is a number of different mutations. So that's surprising. And one theory is that this may have emerged in someone who has a weakened immune system, such as someone who was born with a weak immune system, and that virus may have kind of evolved in that person's body for weeks or months to have this many mutations.

So it is a surprising change. But there's nothing we've seen so far that would suggest that the vaccine will not be effective for it. We're just beginning to roll the vaccine out, as you know, very important that we get this right because it's our best tool to curb this pandemic.

BLITZER: And speaking of vaccines, the first Moderna coronavirus shots were given here in the United States today. Is there any substantial difference, Dr. Frieden, between these two vaccines from Pfizer and Moderna, which have both been granted, as we say emergency use authorization in the U.S.?

FRIEDEN: They're both very similar. There's no difference as far as we know in how effective they are, on how well tolerated they are. The big difference is that Pfizer's needs to be kept much colder, so it's much harder to ship it and store it. And therefore the Moderna vaccine may be more suitable for small medical practices in places that don't have 1,000 or 5,000 people to be vaccinated at once.

BLITZER: The CDC now says people over the age of 75 and frontline essential workers should be the next group to get vaccinated here in the U.S. as the former director of the CDC, what do you make of that decision?

FRIEDEN: It's a sensible and thoughtful approach. You can always criticize. But the key is they're making these decisions transparently. We're being very clear. We have various different things we're trying to make sure happen. Reduce deaths as quickly as possible. That means vaccinating everyone in nursing home staff and residents ASAP.

[17:35:02] But protect those who are protecting us and that means not just doctors and nurses but everyone who works in healthcare facilities from the people who clean the floors and register the patients to everyone else.

And the essential workers who have to face the public every day, I think of a 54-year-old bus driver who has diabetes, that person has both a higher risk of being exposed and a higher risk of dying if they do get infected.

BLITZER: So who else you believe should be next in line as far as getting these two vaccines?

FRIEDEN: Well, one of the important distinctions made with the new recommendations from over the weekend is that not all elderly are the same. The risk of death from COVID goes back -- goes up very rapidly, the older people get. So the most recent recommendations specified people over 75 or 75 and over. That's a group that's at extremely high risk.

The 65 to 74-year-olds are at much lower risk. Now there's no cut and dry point between 74 and 75. But the fact is, there's a very rapid increase in risk with age. So that's a sensible distinction. It's a balancing act. And ultimately, states are going to need to do this. And the ACIP, everything is open. The meetings are open. It's all transparent.

And because these are tough decisions that do have values involved, it's important to be open about them. And those values have to include reducing death as quickly as possible, being fair about who gets it and disproportionately providing services including vaccine to communities that are disproportionately affected.

BLITZER: We have millions and millions of Americans, they're anxious to get these vaccines and totally understandable. Dr. Frieden, thank you so much for joining us, really appreciate it.

Coming up, I'll speak with two former U.S. attorneys general about William Barr breaking further today with President Trump totally contradicting his false claims about the election. When Barr leaves his job two days from now, will his replacement be willing to aid the President's attempts to try to undo the election? We have lots to discuss. We will when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:40:46]

BLITZER: The outgoing U.S. Attorney General Bill Barr today have knocked down several of President Trump's false claims about election fraud, the need for special counsels, among other things.

Joining us now, two former U.S. Attorneys General Loretta Lynch served during the Obama administration and Alberto Gonzales served under President George W. Bush. Both of them now are members of the National Coalition on COVID-19 and Criminal Justice, a very important commission. They're the two co-chairs of this new commission.

And Attorneys General we're going to discuss that in a moment. But I want to get to your reaction to what we heard today. Some really stunning comments from the outgoing Attorney General Bill Barr, listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAM BARR, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I agree with Secretary Pompeo's assessment. It's certainly appears to be the Russians.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The President has continued to, to make the case that there was fraud in the election. Do you believe there is enough evidence to warrant appointing a special counsel to look into it?

BARR: If I thought a special counsel at this stage was the right tool and was appropriate. I would do, I would name one, but I haven't and I'm not going to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: He also said he opposes going out there and collecting voting machines around the country in battleground states. Attorney General Lynch, were you surprised to hear the outgoing Attorney General split from the President so forcefully in this final news conference, Wednesday is his last day in office?

LORETTA LYNCH, FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL: Well, thank you, Wolf. You know, you, at the top of the session, refer to these comments as stunning, but I'm not sure that for anyone who follows the facts that they are. Certainly there's been nothing expressed that would set forth the need for a special counsel. And we've all seen the allegations of voter fraud evaporate much like mist before the sun, certainly in the intelligence community's assessment of Russia's role has been well documented as also.

So I think that the current Attorney General was simply stating the facts as he knew them. And hopefully people will be able to hear that through the noise of this current election cycle and focus on these larger issues and the larger threat that Russian interference poses in our systems.

BLITZER: When I said stunning I only meant stunning because Bill Barr has been such a loyal supporter of the President, such a loyal advocate for what the President has been doing over these past few years to see him point by point by point totally publicly disparage disagree with what the President has been saying, trying to overturn this election, that was stunning to me.

But Attorney General Gonzales, the Attorney General and the outgoing Attorney General was definitive saying, if he thought there should be a special counsel election investigating alleged election fraud, he says he would have named a special counsel, as President Trump continues to claim this election was rigged. How important is it to hear from the current Attorney General totally, totally disagree with the President and say there's no evidence of widespread fraud? ALBERTO GONZALES, FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL: Well, the Attorney General follows a set of regulations and in terms of when a special counsel is supposed to be appointed, there has to be a termination, that is criminal investigations warning against an individual, a determination that there's a conflict of interest either personal, financial, or political.

And finally, that's in the public interest to appoint a special counsel. And so I'm sure that Bill Barr took all of these factors into consideration. Now, obviously, there's a lot of discretion here. And so the next Attorney General or the person responsible for making this such a decision is not necessarily bound, but I think it carries a great deal of weight, certainly with respect to the public with respect to members of Congress, and it will be something that I think the next Attorney General, it's a fact that will be considered as well.

BLITZER: Yes, that's important. Do you know, Attorney General Lynch, let me get your thoughts on this impressive initiative. The two of you have teamed up with the National Coalition on COVID-19 and Criminal Justice. Tell us what you've learned through this effort, what you're recommending.

LYNCH: Well, thank you for that. And I want to thank my co-chair Judge Gonzales in this effort. We brought together 14 commissioners from all walks of the criminal justice system, we call it cops, corrections, courts and community and study the impact of COVID-19 on the criminal justice system.

[17:45:08]

And not only are we from all parts of the criminal justice system, we're from both sides of the aisle. This was a truly nonpartisan effort to look at how this pandemic has really brought our criminal justice system, literally to its knees.

Some of the most important things that we have found, frankly, we were not prepared, we as a criminal justice system, were not prepared to deal with all the issues that this pandemic brought forth. Secondly, it illustrated and exacerbated already existing inequalities that highlighted there the over representation of African Americans, Hispanics, and poor people in the system.

It also showed us the challenges that over incarceration has brought to us not just in terms of the collateral consequences, we've all noted over the years, but specifically with this pandemic, and its cost to human safety and human life, over incarceration has been a tremendous problem.

So it really highlighted a number of things that we've been grappling with for some time, and brought them to the fore. We have to deal with over incarceration. We have to deal with the issues of the over incarceration of people who are mentally ill and bring that trauma to the system, as well as people who are suffering from addiction. Both groups can often be treated better in different locations. This would alleviate some of the strain on the system. We can also --

BLITZER: Yes. I just want to be aware of limited amount of time, I want the Attorney General Gonzales to weigh in as well. What do you want Americans, Attorney General, to understand about how the criminal justice system in our country should respond to this public health crisis? What do you want?

GONZALES: Well, first of all, we need to get guidance. I mean, one of the complaints we heard repeatedly is that lack of guidance. And obviously, people are going to be turning to the White House. They're going to be differences in how we approach this problem in various jurisdictions. There's no question about that.

But what we learned here is that people didn't know what to do. There wasn't sufficient guidance. And so we're hopeful that this study, this report, will provide some recommendations and best practices. Again, every juror is going to be different and have their own set of problems. But we're hoping that this provides guidance, and that will save some lives, and certainly prevent people from getting infected going forward in our criminal justice system.

BLITZER: Well, this so important, and we're grateful to both of you, Loretta Lynch, Alberto Gonzales for cooperating and working on this project. It is so important. Thank you so much for joining us. Stay safe out there. Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, and we will of course, stay in touch with both of you.

GONZALES: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: We have more breaking news coming into the Situation Room. President-elect Joe Biden received his initial Coronavirus vaccination earlier this afternoon. Will that and other high-profile officials getting vaccinated on camera to convince more people to get the shot?

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[17:52:26]

BLITZER: We're following multiple breaking news stories, including President-elect Joe Biden receiving his first dose of the coronavirus vaccine this afternoon, CNN's Jeff Zeleny has the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT-ELECT: Yes, I'm ready.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tonight President-elect Joe Biden receiving the vaccination for COVID-19. The first of two shots that will ensure he's fully inoculated before taking office in just 30 days.

BIDEN: What I want to say is we owe these folks an awful lot. The scientists and people who put this together, the frontline workers and the people who were the ones who actually did the clinical work, it's just amazing. ZELENY (voice-over): Biden praising the Trump administration for its work overseeing the swift authorization and rollout of the vaccine and reassuring the nation of its safety.

BIDEN: The administration deserves some credit getting this off the ground of Operation Warp Speed. I also think that it's worth saying that this is great hope. I'm doing this to demonstrate that people should be prepared when it's available to take the vaccine. There's nothing to worry about.

ZELENY (voice-over): With the holiday looming Biden urging Americans to take the deadly virus seriously to protect one another.

BIDEN: If you don't have to travel, don't travel. Don't travel. It's really important because we're still in the thick of this.

ZELENY (voice-over): Meanwhile, prospects for Biden reaching a self- imposed goal of fully filling his Cabinet by Christmas are dimming tonight.

BIDEN: The Biden-Harris Cabinet, it will be historic.

ZELENY (voice-over): A half dozen spots remain open, chief among them, Attorney General. CNN has learned the top contenders are Judge Merrick Garland and Alabama Senator Doug Jones. He has also yet to formally announce secretaries of Commerce, Education, Labor, along with the CIA director, and head of the Small Business Administration.

One month from tonight the Biden administration will be in power. The transition team is working to have the confirmation process well underway or even completed by then with nominees holding scores of virtual meetings with members of Congress and outside groups, new biographical videos from Lloyd Austin, the Secretary of Defense nominee talking about military families.

GEN. LLOYD AUSTIN (RET.), DEFENSE SECRETARY NOMINEE: You can begin to think how much our spouses and our families sacrifice.

ZELENY (voice-over): And Xavier Becerra, the Health and Human Services Secretary nominee.

XAVIER BECERRA, HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY NOMINEE: If I do this job right as Secretary of Health and Human Services, will make sure a lot of doors open for folks who are looking to make sure their kids have access to great healthcare.

ZELENY (voice-over): Tonight, Senate confirmation of all nominees and the scope of the Biden administration's agenda will be dramatically influenced by the outcome of the two Georgia runoff raises. Vice President-elect Kamala Harris making a campaign stop in the state today, a week after Biden visited.

[17:55:10]

SEN. KAMALA HARRIS (D-CA), VICE PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let us use these days leading up to January 5th, in the spirit of all that is good and right to make sure everyone we know, understands their power, that they understand what is at stake.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ZELENY: Now the President-elect has been very deliberative picking his cabinet, Wolf, but we are told that that is likely going to mean a delay as well. Attorney General we are likely hearing from a variety of sources is not expected before Christmas, it could be pushed back after the holidays, perhaps just one more Cabinet announcement this week. Wolf?

BLITZER: We'll watch and see. All right, thanks very much, Jeff Zeleny.

And stay with us for more in today's breaking news across the United States. Right now, people are receiving the first shots of the newly authorized Moderna coronavirus vaccine.

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