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Campaign Says, No Harris V.P. Decision Yet Just Hours Before First Joint Rally; Biden, Harris Wrap Urgent Meeting as Iran Revenge Attack May Be Imminent; Stock Prices Plunge Amid Renewed Fears of Recession; U.S. Markets Hit With Some Of Worst Losses In Nearly Two Years; Fifth Death Attributed To Tropical Storm Debby. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired August 05, 2024 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, breaking news. We're told Kamala Harris has yet to make a final decision on a running mate less than 24 hours before she's scheduled to appear alongside her V.P. pick. We'll have the newest information on Harris' selection process and the timing of her high stakes announcement.

Also breaking, President Biden and Vice President Harris just wrapped up an urgent national security meeting in the White House Situation Room. U.S. officials warning that an Iranian revenge attack on Israel could be imminent.

And stock prices plunge with the Dow Jones Industrials closing down more than 1,000 points as recession fears send shockwaves through the U.S. and global markets. Are those fears backed by the numbers?

Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. Wolf Blitzer is on assignment. I'm Jim Sciutto and you're in The Situation Room.

We begin with breaking news on the final critical hours before Kamala Harris reveals her running mate to Democrats and to the world.

Let's go right to CNN Chief National Affairs Correspondent Jeff Zeleny. Jeff, what's the latest?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Jim, Vice President Kamala Harris is on the verge of making the biggest decision yet of her presidential candidacy. It's a remarkable turn of events. Just 15 days ago, she was the running mate, of course, to Joe Biden. Now, she's on the cusp of finding a running mate of her own. We know she's been meeting with top contenders over the weekend, meeting with her advisers as well, and narrowing in on that decision.

We believe two of the leading contenders tonight are Minnesota Governor Tim Walz and Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro. She met with both of those candidates on Sunday at the Naval Observatory in addition to Arizona Senator Mark Kelly. She's looking, I'm told, for a governing partner. She's looking for someone she has a chemistry with and someone who shares her core values. The Harris campaign is making clear tonight that she has not made her decision or at least announced her decision. In a tweet just a short time ago, a campaign spokesman said this. We understand the excitement and the interest here, but Vice President Harris has made no decision on a running mate yet. That was in response to a local news report out of Detroit that she, in fact, had made a decision.

Now, of course, we do not know if she has made one. We know she has not contacted any of the contenders. In fact, some of those contenders tonight are out working for her campaign. In Minnesota tonight, Governor Tim Walz is headlining a fundraiser for the Harris campaign. The governor of Kentucky, Andy Beshear, who was on a longer list of potential finalists, he's headlining a fundraiser for the Harris campaign in Chicago tonight.

One thing we do know is that she will make this announcement tomorrow evening around this time in Philadelphia at a rally. She will appear for the first time with her running mate, but we're expecting to hear her decision hours earlier. The campaign would like to make this announcement in the morning in a message with their to their social media supporters, trying to give supporters a look at this first in a fundraising campaign message as well.

They're trying to create excitement about this and keep this momentum alive that has really fueled the first two weeks of her candidacy. Of course, once that decision is known, it's off to the races. Republicans will certainly fly spec everything about their record and Democrats will size up this new partnership.

But, Jim, this moved remarkably quickly, the vetting most accelerated in modern American history. But, of course, again, this is her decision to make. I'm told chemistry is at the center of all of it.

SCIUTTO: Accelerated like so much in this campaign at this point. Jeff Zeleny, thanks so much.

So, let's bring in our panel now with more on the presidential race. So, David Chalian, listen, a lot goes into this decision, no question, home state, whether there could be any influence there, messaging, relationship, et cetera. What would you say the driving factor would be for Kamala Harris with this decision?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: I mean, I think you heard Jeff say it there, and it's what the campaign says over and over again. I don't think they're being coy about it. I mean, I do think picking a governing partner, you have to remember, we haven't seen a sitting vice president pick a vice presidential running mate since Al Gore did so with Joe Lieberman back in 2000.

So, seeing a -- you know, she knows the job better than anyone right now. She's occupying it. And so understanding the role that it can have that you are going to be sort of attached at the hip here with somebody for, you know, four or eight years, that vibe check is certainly important.

[18:05:05] Yes, the political calculus that plays into it. Yes, the -- you know, where the attack lines are going to come from, how it fits in your overall message, all of that is being looked at. But I think like she's got to have a sense of a governing partnership with this person.

SCIUTTO: Megan Hays, I mean, listen if you wanted a cautionary tale about how to choose a vice presidential pick, you might look to the other side of the aisle with Trump's pick of Vance and all that has followed since then. Well, what can Kamala Harris learn from the Vance pick?

MEGHAN HAYS, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT BIDEN: I think pick someone who does no harm, but I don't think any of these people that are in the waiting right now will do harm for her. I think it is a lot of on a vibe check. I think it's a lot about who's going to execute her vision moving forward for the next four years.

I mean, she now needs to reintroduce herself as well as this new running mate together, and they need to do this together for the American people. So, I think a lot of what their vibes and how they're going to govern together means a lot.

SCIUTTO: Kristen Holmes, Trump amazingly, shockingly, has taken to attacking Harris' ethnic background, questioning her racial identity based on nothing and this is despite the fact that many fellow Republicans are telling him to do quite the opposite. Let's listen to Republican Senator Lindsey Graham.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): Every day we're talking about her heritage and not her terrible, dangerous, liberal record throughout her entire political life. It's a good day for her and a bad day for us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: I mean, now what he didn't say there is, this shall not stand, this is bad, he just said that, politically, it's not a good idea. Any sign that Trump is listening to that sort of advice?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we saw him double down the day after he made those initial remarks at NABJ during the panel. He posted about it. He -- even that night, actually, I was at a rally, and they had a giant sign on the jumbotron that said, Kamala Harris elected first Indian-American senator, clearly doubling down on it. Since then, he actually has not brought up the racial issues, which is an issue for the campaign, and by that, I mean they have told him not to.

Just a reminder leading up to the moments of that he sat down on that NABJ panel, his campaign was telling me that's not a part of their campaign, that this was all about focusing on policy. This was actually going to be just as easy as defeating President Joe Biden because they could link her to his policies, and instead, he went rogue, unsurprisingly. But that isn't helpful, as Lindsey Graham said, and that's what his entire campaign feels. And it's not just, for example, attacking Kamala Harris. It's also not helpful when he attacks Governor Brian Kemp, the Republican in Georgia. They don't like that. That's a state that is incredibly important, a state that, up until Kamala Harris was on the ticket, they felt very confident in, but now really feels like a wild card to go in and attack the very popular Republican governor. That is also a risky move on behalf of Donald Trump, and not one that they were prepping him to do.

SCIUTTO: Not the first time he's done it, right, going back to 2020, in addition to those Senate races. By the way, he paid a political price for that, arguably, in the state of Georgia.

Alyssa Farrah Griffin, it has struck me that today, the campaign saw the need to have J.D. Vance's wife try to explain what was behind the childless cat lady comments. And I'll get to a moment whether you think that worked, but why do they feel the need to correct that comment, but leave the questioning of Kamala Harris' racial identity out there?

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: This cat lady comment has just really stuck in a way that I haven't seen with many things in politics. In the Trump news cycle, things tend to move rapidly, quickly. But with J.D. Vance, this has become like a three-week-long story. And it's genuinely hurting him with a demo that he needs the most, suburban women. It's just radioactive.

So, the fact that they're still playing cleanup and not particularly effectively is remarkable, I did think it was interesting, though, that Usha Vance gave probably the only answer you could give to it and the best one I've seen to date, whereas her husband just fully doubled down when he was on cleanup mission there. But she gave a much more nuanced answer on it.

This isn't going away. There'll be more comments like this because there just fundamentally was no vetting of J.D. Vance before he was added to the ticket. And this will not be the last comment that we see that is very radioactive with independents needed to win this election.

SCIUTTO: Now listen, we looked at the Democratic side, at a minimum, a compacted vetting process for the vice presidential candidates on that side.

David, debates, so Donald Trump is backed out of the ABC debate now, officially. He's floating this idea of a Fox debate in front of an audience, which is not even clear, by the way, that Fox News has signed on to this plan. Where does this stand? I mean, is there going to be a debate? Are they going to come to an agreement?

CHALIAN: Listen, debates happen when both candidates see a need for debates and some potential advantage in doing it. I don't know that in this new configuration right now that there necessarily will be a debate. I don't rule it out as a possibility, but you say where we are. Where we are is, you know, Donald Trump is not doing the ABC debate and Kamala Harris says, that's the only one I'm willing to talk about, engage on, or do anything with, because that's the one that we agreed to here.

And our reporting indicates that ABC is likely to give airtime to Kamala Harris whether or not Donald Trump shows up. And so, you know, she's not going to move off that dime of ABC September 10th right now and is going to try to use it as like you're scared to debate me and have that be a message that they drive.

[18:10:10]

Donald Trump, clearly, I don't think a Fox September 4th debate is something that Harris is going to agree to. So, he's locked himself into something, so at least he has a place to say, no, I'm willing to debate and push back on the sort of scaredy cat notion of it.

But if both of these candidates want a debate, if they think that is in their political interest here, then a debate will happen.

SCIUTTO: Are you saying that it's possible that both Trump and Harris calculate they don't need the debate?

CHALIAN: I'm not sure that either think that is a must have for them for their electoral prospects.

SCIUTTO: Megan, do you agree with that? I mean, well, first of all, do you think that Kamala Harris should debate Donald Trump and stand on the stage with him?

HAYS: So, I do. I actually do. I think that it's important for the American people to see people talking about their issues and talking about what their visions are face to face, whether that's Donald Trump is capable of having that conversation is a different thing.

Also, we have to remember that half of the country and half the population watches Fox News. That is not an untapped audience for Democrats, and they should reach out to that and they should play to that and they should be -- you know, those suburban women also watch Fox News.

So, whether or not they will do it is, to be seen, but it's not unreasonable.

SCIUTTO: So, you're saying Harris should not eliminate the possibility going on Fox for the debate, perhaps say, maybe not with an audience, I'll do it with the moderators?

HAYS: Absolutely. There's just no reason why you would turn down doing any sort of getting your message out to people who -- they have a tremendous audience.

HOLMES: I do want to add one thing about the Trump aspect of this debate, which is that part of him denying the ABC debate and accepting the Fox debate was not just because Fox is friendly, but, of course, that's part of it. But the other part of this is that they felt that the debate narrative had been taken away from them by Joe Biden. He had been out there, Donald Trump saying, I will debate anywhere, anytime. And then he completely lost control of the narrative because Biden came out and said, okay, I'll do this. These are the guidelines that I've set out. I've agreed to a CNN debate. Here you go. Donald Trump then was forced into a corner to do a debate really under terms that he didn't want to do and both agreed to CNN and ABC.

Then, with the switch at the top of the ticket, they felt that they could reclaim that narrative in control of the debate. So, yes, they wanted to do a friendly debate, but also part of this was not being cornered into restrictions and regulations around a debate that they had agreed to, but now they saw an opportunity to take back.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this, you've covered the campaign for a long time, the Trump campaign, and you know these folks well. Is it your sense at all that Donald Trump worries he might lose a debate to Kamala Harris?

HOLMES: I don't think Donald Trump worries about much in terms of his performance when he goes out there against anyone. He is pretty confident in himself. I don't think that's the same for everybody around Donald Trump. I can tell you that even going into the debate against President Joe Biden at a time where that race was looking very much more optimistic for Donald Trump, they were very concerned about his performance. His allies were concerned that he might go too far, that he might push too hard.

And I will say that was one thing that Donald Trump paid attention to about Joe Biden was that he looked back on his 2020 debate against him and said, I was too aggressive in that first debate. I needed to tone it down. But whether or not he worries about it, I'm not sure. Whether or not his team worries about it, I'm sure they're both looking at the risk and the reward of a debate.

CHALIAN: The country deserves a debate. That --

SCIUTTO: To be fair, these are two people running to run the country in arguably the most powerful position in the world. They deserve to be challenged on stage and to respond to each other's arguments.

Megan, Christian, David, Alyssa as well, thanks so much to all of you.

Just ahead, how the U.S. and Israel and the region are bracing for Iran to retaliate for the killing of a Hamas leader. CNN is live in the Middle East as the region. Is very much on high alert.

And a new warning is out about major flooding in the southeast after the storm named Debby hit land as a hurricane and turned deadly.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:20:00]

SCIUTTO: There's more breaking news this hour, President Biden and Vice President Harris wrapping up an urgent national security meeting in the White House Situation Room just a short while ago. This is U.S. officials warning that an Iranian retaliatory attack against Israel is expected to continue within days, possibly within the next 24 hours.

CNN's Jeremy Diamond joins us now live from Haifa in Northern Israel. Jeremy, I wonder what the level of concern is there and alerts about just how big this attack might be.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jim, this is certainly an incredible moment of tension and uncertainty. We are certainly within the window for a potential Iranian attack on Israel. But as you said, there are major questions about how large scale that attack would actually be and when exactly it may come.

The Israeli government has been projecting over the last few days that they are prepared for any scenario. The Israeli prime minister himself saying that Iran will face a very heavy price should it carry out an attack on Israeli soil. And we know that the military here has been preparing for days now for a potential Iranian attack, preparing not only for that enormous air defense effort that they may need to put on, but also already planning for various retaliatory strikes that they may carry out should Iran move forward. Of course, there are also threats in the north from Hezbollah, which also lost one of its top military commanders in an Israeli strike last week, and they have also vowed to retaliate.

For now, though, civilians here are carrying on with life as usual, and that's partly because the Israeli military's home front command has yet to issue any new guidance to citizens here to tell them to prepare for a major attack. And so most folks have been carrying on with their lives as usual, though they are very aware, of course, of this potential threat. And in cities like here in Haifa, as well as in Jerusalem, those municipalities have told residents to begin making preparations.

There are also enormous amounts of efforts underway to try and assemble, reassemble that international coalition that helped defend Israel from that barrage of 300 missiles and drones back in April.

[18:20:04]

That's part of why General Kurilla, the top U.S. commander in the region, is here now meeting with top Israeli officials and others in the region, preparing for worst case scenarios. Jim?

SCIUTTO: And all those U.S. naval assets in the region, part of that missile defense and early warning as well. Jeremy Diamond, thanks so much.

Joining me now, the ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, Congressman Jim Himes of Connecticut. Congressman, thanks so much for taking the time.

REP. JIM HIMES (D-CT): Thanks for having me, Jim.

SCIUTTO: So, as you know, the conditions in the region are already dicey, and we learned a short time before broadcast that several U.S. personnel were injured in a rocket attack on the Al-Asad Airbase in Iraq. These attacks often, as you know, carried out by Iran-backed proxies in Iraq. How much does this risk a broader escalation, and what's the right U.S. response to such an attack?

HIMES: Yes. Jim, it's a little hard to know. You know, the chess game that's underway right now in the Middle East, which is horrifying in and of itself, is one between Iran and Israel. I suspect, but I don't know, because obviously it's a developing story, that this militia attack on a U.S. base was probably not part of the retaliation that we're bracing for, that the Iranians have said that they will undertake. You know, I think the Iranians are smart enough to know that, A, the United States has been working very hard for a ceasefire deal, Israel, Gaza, and, B, I don't think the Iranians want a direct and open fight with the Israelis and they sure don't want a direct open fight with the United States.

So, developing situation, but my guess is that this is tangential to the larger issue of how the Iranians will retaliate.

SCIUTTO: Okay. So, let's talk about the outlines, as we might expect, of an Iranian attack. Their last attack in April, when they launched dozens of missiles and drones, largely failed. That network of the U.S. and its allies shot down the vast majority of them. So, I wonder, how does Iran make itself look stronger this time around? You know, that's part of the dynamic here. And are you concerned that it might target civilians with such an attack, civilian targets in Israel?

HIMES: Well, concerningly, Jim, this is a very different situation than what we saw back in April. If you remember back in April, the Iranians were retaliating for an Israeli strike on some of their military people in Damascus, right? So, here you had Iranian people in Damascus. They were quite clearly combatants.

The strike and, of course, the Israelis have not made a comment on whether it was them, but the killing of Ismail Haniyeh, a guest in Iran, in a secure guest house, supposedly protected by the Republican Guard. That is that is a whole different order of sort of embarrassment to the Iranian regime.

And so if you'll recall back in April, you know, they signaled that they were going to do this for days and they used drones, which took hours to fly, you know, towards Israel and stuff, but I suspect that this is going to be a different thing. And what could that look like? It could look like missiles fired from Southern Lebanon and Hezbollah, where there's almost no time to intercept. You know, it could look much different and more lethal.

Whether the Iranians target civilians, you know, in some ways, that's almost a moot point. You know, the reality is that they don't -- I'm not sure that they can say with 100 percent certainty that their munitions are going to just land on military targets. So, I think the risk that civilians in Israel are hurt is very substantial.

SCIUTTO: No question, then you worry about the degree of the Israeli response.

I want to talk for a moment about the relationship between Benjamin Netanyahu and President Biden because there has been over the course of months going back to really quite soon in the wake after October 7th, U.S. messages delivered to Israel to hem in some of its military response, particularly as civilian casualties mounted, but also now with this concern about a broader escalation in the region on. And it's not clear that the Israeli prime minister is listening to those messages.

I wonder what is the state of U.S. influence over the Israeli government this point? And can you say that Netanyahu is largely ignoring the U.S. president?

HIMES: Well, it sure feels that way. And, again, I think it's important to draw a distinction between Israel, the Israeli government and the prime minister. You know, the prime minister is obviously aware of the fact that the United States has invested thousands of hours, untold hours, in trying to get to that ceasefire deal that would release the hostages. And the prime minister, nonetheless, shortly after visiting the United States to give that speech to the combined session of Congress, undertook this unbelievably aggressive attack.

And, by the way, we shed no tears for Haniyeh and we shed no tears for the leaders of Hezbollah in Lebanon, but it very clearly, at least in the near term, takes a hostage ceasefire deal off the table, something that the United States has invested an immense amount of energy and time in.

[18:25:05]

So, you know, right now, and this has been true for a long time, I don't think the prime minister is really much listening to the president of the United States or to the advice that he's getting inside Israel about the best way to get the hostages released.

SCIUTTO: Congressman Jim Himes, let's hope as best we can for no further escalation. Thanks so much for taking the time.

Coming up, more on the Republican vice presidential nominee, J.D. Vance, being defended now by his wife, Usha, amid the backlash over his comments about childless cat ladies.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:30:00]

SCIUTTO: J.D. Vance's wife, Usha, is in the spotlight tonight as she tries to defend her husband amid the ongoing backlash over his now infamous comments about childless cat ladies.

CNN's Brian Todd joins us now with details. And, Brian, I know you're taking a closer look at Usha Vance and exactly what she's saying in her first solo interview.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, Jim. The Trump campaign is clearly trying to change the narrative over the childless cat ladies comments, and the campaign seems to think that Usha Vance is the right person to put it in context.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TODD (voice over): Tonight, Usha Vance speaking out in a new Fox interview about her husband's now infamous childless cat lady remarks.

USHA VANCE, WIFE OF J.D. VANCE: I mean, he made a quip. And he made a quip in service of making a point that he wanted to make that was substantive. I just wish sometimes that people would talk about those things and that we would spend a lot less time just sort of going through this three-word phrase or that three-word phrase.

TODD: J.D. Vance's controversial comments from a July 2021 interview on Fox, insulting adults without children, drew scorn from Hollywood as well as from conservative outlets.

SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We're effectively run in this country via the Democrats, via our corporate oligarchs, by a bunch of childless cat ladies who are miserable at their own lives and the choices that they've made.

TODD: Usha Vance's first solo interview comes as the Trump campaign is trying to deflect attention from her husband's remarks and change the narrative.

U. VANCE: J.D. absolutely, at the time and today, would never ever want to say something to hurt someone who was trying to have a family who really, you know, was struggling with that. And I also understand there are a lot of other reasons why people may choose not to have families, and many of those reasons are very good.

TODD: It's not the first time Usha Vance has confidently stood by her husband politically. During his 2022 run for Senate in Ohio, she took the lead in a campaign ad.

U. VANCE: Our family's story is an Ohio story. My husband, J.D., grew up in Middletown and things weren't easy. He's an incredible father, and he's my best friend.

TODD: That proclivity to be able to comfortably appear with her husband in public contrasts with Melania Trump, who's rarely seen with the former president at public events.

KATE ANDERSEN BROWER, AUTHOR, FIRST WOMEN, THE GRACE AND POWER OF AMERICA'S MODERN FIRST LADIES: We don't see Melania Trump humanizing her husband. That's really not the role that she's ever played. And so, perhaps Usha could be a really big advantage to this campaign. She's young. She's well spoken. She's successful.

TODD: Born Usha Chilukuri in 1986, she was raised in a San Diego suburb by Indian immigrant parents and met J.D. Vance when they both attended Yale Law School.

They married in 2014 and have three young children, which Usha Vance has balanced with some impressive professional accomplishments. She clerked for two Supreme Court justices, Chief Justice John Roberts, and Brett Kavanaugh when he served on the U.S. Court of Appeals. She recently resigned from a high-powered law firm. In a 2020 podcast, J.D. Vance joked about how tough it is to argue with her at home.

J.D. VANCE: Oh my God, it's terrible. It's just terrible. And she uses, you know, so much facts and logic.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TODD (on camera): During that Fox interview, Usha Vance also seemed to want to clarify reports that she and her husband had privately condemned Donald Trump before Trump selected J.D. Vance as his running mate, and more specifically, a report in the Washington Post that said Usha Vance was upset with Trump over the January 6th attack on the Capitol. Usha Vance told Fox that she has grown to understand Trump since then. Jim?

SCIUTTO: Brian Todd, thanks so much. Joining us now for more, former Trump White House Communications Director Anthony Scaramucci, good to have you on, thanks for taking the time.

ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: It's good to be here. There are word salads and then there are word pretzels, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes, I mean --

SCARAMUCCI: She's going to really -- you know, she could probably win a gold medal in gymnastics at the Olympics with the word pretzeling. But --

SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, I imagine you're talking there, not just about trying to explain away her criticism of January 6th but also childless cat ladies, which, let's be frank, it's got a deplorables vibe to it in terms of its durability in this race. Has she successfully defended those comments by the vice presidential nominee?

SCARAMUCCI: No, she hasn't successfully defended it. And, obviously, she's over at Fox giving the interview to the base, where it more or less doesn't matter. And so, no, she hasn't successfully defended it. But I think we're the real trouble for them is there are conservative women that don't like the commentary and there are conservative women that like reproductive freedom. And so, you know, they're in trouble. They know they're in trouble and that interview didn't get them out of trouble.

SCIUTTO: I mean, Trump's strategy was in part to win over some suburban women to make a difference, but also to win over black voters, Hispanic voters. And it just strikes me that his wife is trying to explain the cats comment but no one's trying to explain Trump's questioning Harris' racial identity. I mean, the only commentary you get is focus on the record, but there's no one saying, either trying to walk that back or explain what he really meant.

[18:35:06]

I mean, if there's been anything, there's been doubling down. Can you explain that?

SCARAMUCCI: Well, he won't allow for that. So, he doesn't like ever apologizing or ever recalibrating any statement that he's ever made. I've only seen him do it once and that was after the Access Hollywood tape. He waited until midnight and then he taped an apology to his wife in the campaign.

So, if you went to Donald Trump after that and said, hey, you probably shouldn't talk like that about Brian Kemp, he would steamroll and bully you. If you went to him and said, wow, you really shouldn't talk like that at the National Association for Black Journalists Conference, he would steamroll you.

So, there's never any walk back on Trump. I guess they're just, what they're trying to do, and this is -- you know, Trump is also a strategist. He's saying to his team, let's just neutralize J.D. Vance. It doesn't matter anyway. People are voting for me. One way or the other, he's got to get back to a neutral rating, meaning he's right now a net negative. Find a few ways to get him back to neutral and let's move on.

SCIUTTO: I mean, yes, he's well in the red when it comes to negative ratings, almost historically negative in favorability ratings for a vice presidential nominee.

You mentioned the comments about Jeff -- sorry, Kemp over the weekend. I just want to play those again in case folks didn't hear him. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT, 2024 PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: But Kemp doesn't want to end it because he's a bad guy, he's a disloyal guy, and he's a very average governor, Little Brian, Little Brian Kemp, bad guy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: So, Brian Kemp, he's attacked before, by the way, and paid a political price for those attacks, did he not, I mean, even when you look at the Senate races there, which Republicans lost. Does this put him in danger of losing Georgia again?

SCARAMUCCI: Well, listen, it doesn't help him in Georgia. You know, I've got a lot of friends in Georgia, a lot of emails and texts over the weekend basically saying, I'm starting -- and they're Trump supporters, I'm starting to get your point about Donald Trump.

I think the governor really has to ask himself something. He's got to look in the mirror and say, okay, we have this very dishonorable, lying, very bad for our party human being at the top of the party. Am I going to just be a sycophant of his and tweet out things like I did on Saturday night saying, hey, I support you and stop picking on my family? Or does he pick up the phone and go hard at Donald Trump and then issue a very hard statement, like back up? And so I think he has to do that if he wants to lead in the future. And so he may think that he doesn't have to do that. And lots of our politicians are equivocators and I get all that. But Trump is burning down the house, Jim. And so what I mean by the house, it's the GOP, the party of Lincoln, the Reagan party. He is an arsonist that is burnt down the house. And if Brian Kemp's going to stand there and say here's more gasoline, I'm here to support you in Georgia after you've ripped me and my family, I don't know how emasculating you can ask someone to -- how emasculating it could be for somebody than that. So, I hope he reconsiders his view of Donald Trump after this week's activities.

SCIUTTO: We'll see. There have been others who've made that same compromise, as you well know. Anthony Scaramucci, great to have you on, thanks so much.

SCARAMUCCI: Good to be here.

SCIUTTO: Just ahead, the recession fears that sent stock prices plunging, but here's a question. Is that anxiety justified? We'll take a look.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:40:00]

SCIUTTO: We are following breaking news on the economy. U.S. markets in a tailspin today with the Dow Jones Industrials closing down more than 1,000 points, fueled by recession fears.

CNN's Business Editor-at-Large Richard Quest, is here along with CNN Economics and Political Commentator Catherine Rampell. Good to have you here.

Richard, as you know, the market can be a jittery thing, clearly made more jittery by that jobs report on Friday. There were already some concerns about froth in the market. I just wonder, as you look at the collections of things here, is it overstating the risks, or is this a real warning sign?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: It's both. Split it in half. Let's do this. You've got the tech and the whole thing of the question of A.I., froth, overvalued profits nowhere near, therefore, time to take a bath on that. But the other one, more importantly arguably, is the market saying, hang on, the Fed is late to cut interest rates.

11 increases in rates in two years has finally had the full effect of medicine and that is not only crushing inflation, it has also slowed down growth to where unemployment and jobs protections are now at risk. We're seeing it in the data.

The good news, in a sense, is that if the Fed is late, so what? If the Fed is late, there is 500 basis points of interest rate cuts that they can now deploy that they didn't have two years ago, and so they can move. Yes, there could be a slowdown, yes, there could be a technical recession, but it is by no means the catastrophe, calamity, disaster that anybody would see.

SCIUTTO: Okay. Catherine Rampell, you and I were speaking about this on Friday before the market dropped. When you look at other factors in the economy, GDP growth for instance, the job market is still strong after, at least on the trend line, a slower report on Friday. Is the economy, when you look at the fundamentals, on the precipice of recession?

[18:45:01]

CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN ECONOMICS AND POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It doesn't really look like it right now. As you point out, a lot of other data that have come in recent weeks have been relatively strong or at least okay. I mean, some of them have even bested expectations, GDP growth was way better than expected in the most recent report, a couple of weeks ago.

SCIUTTO: Yeah.

RAMPELL: So a lot of the numbers look pretty the good. The worry is that their trending in the wrong direction, like unemployment, the number that we got on Friday, 4.3 percent, 4.3 percent is a pretty services really low number. I mean, in the grand sweep of history, it's a pretty low unemployment rate, but it has been rising, each of the last four consecutive months.

So the worry is if it keeps heading in that direction, then yeah, that would be bad. We want it to stay where it is. Go no higher. That's what markets are worried about, and that's what regular consumers are presumably worried about.

SCIUTTO: Invariably as you both know, and the market suffers, they look to the Fed for rescue. Austan Goolsbee, who is president of the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago. He said the following to push back against this idea, some are floating of an emergency Federal -- Federal Reserve cut prior to their meeting in September.

He said, we've got to be monitoring the real side of the economy. There's nothing in the feds mandate that's about making sure the stock market is comfortable.

I look at that Richard Quest and I think -- I see them saying let the market go through its stuff, we'll focus on the economy.

QUEST: He's talking about what used to be called the Greenspan put, the Fed put where basically Greenspan, Bernanke, even Yellen to an extent, bailed out the market.

But here is where it differs. Goolsbee saying, look on its own, were not going to bail out investors, where he will change his mind very quickly is if it starts to become a downward spiral, feeding into the economy.

SCIUTTO: Okay. We'll be watching for it.

Richard, Catherine, great to have you on. Thanks so much. Well, coming up, parts of the Southeast in a state of emergency now as

Debby unleashes record rains and life-threatening flooding.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:51:17]

SCIUTTO: Tropical storm Debby is hammering the Southeast with heavy rain and life-threatening storm surges.

CNN's Isabel Rosales is on the scene in Savannah, Georgia.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ISABEL ROSALES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Pounding rain, whipping winds, powerful current -- Tropical Storm Debby, no longer a hurricane after making landfall this morning as a category one storm.

The Big Bend of Florida seeing first impact.

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R), FLORIDA: We have seen significant storm surge. We have seen inundation. We have seen and will continue to see flooding in very parts of the state of Florida.

ROSALES: But Debby is still bring life-threatening storm surges and rain as it crawls inland, more than a months worth of rain has already fallen in Florida, triggering at least ten flash flood warnings.

DESANTIS: There's going to be a lot of water that's going to be dumped throughout the state and were going to see effects of that, not just today, but in the ensuing days.

ROSALES: The rain will likely be Debby's biggest danger, strong winds and potential tornadoes will continue to be a threat.

Four-storm related deaths now confirmed, a Florida teen crushed by a tree that fell on his mobile home. And multiple driving fatalities, including a tractor trailer driver who lost control on a wet roadway near Tampa, plunging off a bridge and into a canal. The second death blamed on Debby severe weather conditions.

JAY MELDER, SAVANNAH CITY MANAGER: This is a once in a thousand-year potential rainfall event.

ROSALES: Debby is slowing down in speed and officials expressing concern over the amount of rain forecasts as it continues into Georgia and South Carolina.

LORESSA GREEN DUNCAN, HOMEOWNER: We flood so easily here.

ROSALES: Residents in Savannah bracing for unprecedented flooding.

DUNCAN: I was listening to the news and I knew that it was going to be really high water we have some properties, low lying. So I was interested in saving it really from being flooded out. ROSALES: Multiple sandbag stations ran out of supplies Sunday night

and resupplied by the county. The area could see 20 inches of rain in two to three days.

ADRIAN HILL, HOMEOWNER: The storm staying on top of us for 24 to 48 hours and I know that's just going to be a lot of precipitation, a lot of rain coming down. It's just going to be -- it's going to be unheard of really.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROSALES (on camera): And, Jim, just in to CNN, we have the fifth confirmed death connected to this storm, a 19-year-old dying after a tree fell onto the side of their home. This happened in Moultrie, which is in South Georgia, that means that this is the first confirmed death in the state of Georgia.

SCIUTTO: Yeah. Let's hope all those people stay safe.

Isabel Rosales, thanks so much.

And we'll be right back.

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[18:58:32]

SCIUTTO: Tonight, just a bizarre confession by independent presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr. He says he left a dead bear cub in Central Park in 2014. A story CNN actually covered in real time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: New York's Central Park, a bear cub, I know, dead underneath some bushes there. Not sure whether it wandered in the park or someone put it there.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: There had been no bears in the park for a long, long time. It seems as if somewhat brought the thing there, which is really sad.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Well, John Berman was prescient, his comments there 10 years ago. I mean, how did he get his hands on a bear cub?

BERMAN: Look, I mean, little did I know at the time that it was Robert Kennedy Jr. And he confessed to all of this to Roseanne Barr as one does in a video that he posted last night to get out ahead of a story that was going to appear in the New Yorker.

Let's play some of the video as he explains it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR. (I), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE; So I pulled over and I picked up the bear and put him in the back of my van because I was going to skin the bear and it was very good condition and I was just going to put the beef in my refrigerator. I said let's go put the bear in Central Park and we'll make it look like he got hit by a bike. Fun -- funny for people.

(LAUGHTER)

KENNEDY: So, everybody thought, that's a great idea. So, we went and did that and it would be amusing for whoever found it or something.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: He says he thought it would be fun. He found the bear after it was hit on the road. He didn't have time to bring it to his house, so he left it in the park, he says.

Turns out that he could have been fined $250 had they discovered it was him. You can't dispose dead bears like that, but the statute of limitations ran out after one year, Jim.

SCIUTTO: He thought it would be amusing if someone were to find it. It's remarkable,

John Berman, thanks so much for explaining

I'm Jim Sciutto in THE SITUATION ROOM. Thanks so much for watching tonight.

"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts now.