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The Situation Room

Interview With Rep. Josh Gottheimer (D-NJ); Trump Delays Decision on Iran; Americans' Opinions on Trump Administration?. Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired June 20, 2025 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:30:02]

KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: They're going to say, look, we cannot hold the Trump administration back from bombing your nuclear sites, and we don't know diplomatically a way out of this unless you say yes to giving up enrichment now.

The other thing with the military option, estimates are that this would only set back the Iranian nuclear program two to four years. The intellectual capacity still remains, despite the scientists who've been killed. They could rebuild and they would have more of a will to rebuild if they go ahead with strikes.

Also, if you go ahead with strikes, then how do you get back to the negotiating table? So this is an opportunity. And German, Britain and France all have embassies in Tehran. They have diplomatic negotiations. They have a measure of trust. And they can say, look, we will be able to support your peaceful nuclear program, but anything that goes towards enrichment, which brings it towards a weapon, that will never last again.

RAHM EMANUEL, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL AND GLOBAL AFFAIRS COMMENTATOR: There is also a way from here, United States, Israel and Iran -- Russia got thrown out of Syria and didn't see it.

They're not being very responsive to Iran in their time in need, when Iran was responsive to Russia's need. China's looking totally incapable of responding. There is something to dealing with the axis of resistance of Russia, China, North Korea and Iran. If you hit it or you deal with it and set it back, you will have basically adversely degraded that axis of resistance.

So that shouldn't be lost. I do agree on the kind of maybe four years. But there is an assessment right now in Iran. They spent billions and billions of dollars in Syria, billions and billions of dollars with Hezbollah, hundreds of billions of dollars in developing a nuclear weapon.

All of that has gone up in smoke. So there will be a consequence. Yes, it could be two to four years. They're not going to have the resources to both address the country's economic needs and social needs and totally rebuild the nuclear power plan back.

The delivery piece is a crux of what Israel can do to set this back on a more permanent basis such as two to four years. We're talking about a generation.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Do you agree, Kim?

DOZIER: Well, the wild card is, what does Israel hit in the interim, how much damage this does.

EMANUEL: Right.

DOZIER: Talking to Arab officials, they're very concerned about potential nuclear stockpiles getting hit and a nuclear cloud drifting across the Strait of Hormuz.

They're also concerned that, if Tehran's back is really against the wall, that it could close the Strait of Hormuz and stop energy supplies from getting out. And, third, they are worried about a strike on Khamenei, the ayatollah, they do not want to see a decapitation, because then it says what if the U.S. government or Israel wants to take out any one of us in the Gulf? This is a bad precedent.

EMANUEL: But you would agree -- I mean, I have a slightly -- the leaders of the Gulf nations say all that, but what they also want is Israel to finish this up very quickly, and because they also don't want Iran -- they too have a self-interest Iran does not have a nuclear capacity in that area, in that capacity.

(CROSSTALK)

EMANUEL: And so there's slightly what they publicly say and privately hope for and wish.

BLITZER: How do you think, Rahm, the Trump administration has handled this crisis so far?

EMANUEL: Well, it depends on which part of which day, which hour.

BLITZER: Overall.

EMANUEL: Yes, look, I think here is -- as an assessment again, advising two presidents, et cetera, I would probably say the move recently about giving it two weeks was right after kind of rushing ahead.

Richard J. Daley used to say, when you see a parade, get your baton and get in front of it. I thought President Trump being too cavalier about military use was absolutely wrong. Giving this two weeks is right, but I would fill in the blanks. This is what I want to see. We're going to be at the negotiating table. You choose not to show up, that's on you, not on us. We're going to be there.

Two, here are the planes, C-130s. This is what they're going to take to Israel. They're going to be able to keep doing this offensively and defensively, because that's our commitment. We're good to our word. Third is, over here, you're going to see us practicing what we have to do. Your choice, but we're going to be at the table.

And I do think, I mean, this shouldn't get lost, I mean, the United States has that capacity, but it shouldn't get lost in all this conversation Israel has this capacity. And I would be honest also about a president. You have 45,000 American men and women in uniform in the Gulf. You have to protect them.

You cannot be cavalier, because once you make this kinetic decision, their lives are at risk. And no -- now, our military leadership has done a tremendous amount of protection, et cetera. But this will be different because Iran's back is against the wall.

[11:35:05]

Beyond the warships that are there, beyond the resources that are there, 45,000 American men and women who have dedicated themselves and their lives to the protection and advocacy of the American interests need to be protected before you make a decision.

And this is where I would say, Israel's IDF for 80 years has had one principle. Nobody fights our wars. We fight our wars. That should not be violated. It has served Israel well and it has served us well.

BLITZER: All right, we have got to go, but, Rahm Emanuel, thank you very much. Kim Dozier, thanks to you as well.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: All right, and just ahead right here in THE SITUATION ROOM, our weekly segment "Your Voice."

We're going to talk with a pair of radio hosts, one liberal, one conservative, for what their listeners are saying about President Trump's pending decision on striking Iran and the divide it's causing among his base.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:40:10]

BROWN: And now to our weekly series "Your Voice."

Every Friday, we check in with talk and podcast hosts across the country to find out what their listeners are thinking and saying about what's going on here in Washington.

And, today, we have got conservative radio host Jason Rantz out of Seattle, Washington, and progressive radio host Michelangelo Signorile from SiriusXM out of New York.

Gentlemen, great to have you on. Looking forward to hearing from both of you.

Jason, let's get off with you.

Tell us a bit more about your listeners and how they're responding to potential American involvement in Iran and what they think President Trump should do.

JASON RANTZ, CONSERVATIVE RADIO HOST: And they have been largely positive on what the president has been doing. This two-week pause has obviously given some folks a little bit of time to really contemplate what the next steps really should be.

I have seen the coverage of sort of a MAGA civil war, but based on what I'm hearing from folks who are actually within the movement, they're not really all that disinterested in what the president is hoping to pursue, which is ultimately, if you're not going to give up capabilities to create nuclear weapons, then we might have to get more involved.

There's no support for boots on the ground, but as far as airstrikes, and this is beared out in the polling, there's general support amongst conservatives.

BROWN: So, I want to pick up on that in just a minute, but first I want to go to you, Michelangelo, about your listeners, how they're responding to what's happening in the Middle East right now and President Trump.

MICHELANGELO SIGNORILE, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Well, as you said, I'm a progressive host and our listeners are all across the country, cities and small towns, rural America, mostly liberal, Democratic, independents. But I do get a fair number of conservatives and Trump supporters who call in to discuss and debate.

We have only heard from people who are very concerned, very worried, very much opposed to any military action or any strikes. And what is really odd too is that we usually get some people who -- if those are the people who are not supportive of Donald Trump, we get some people who are opposed to Trump who call in to debate it and say, no, we agree.

I haven't heard from anyone who has said that they support any military action. People point to the Iraq quagmire. People point that there was an Iran deal before Trump the first time with President Obama. So they're pointing to a lot of hypocrisy and their worries about the future.

BROWN: So, Jason, I want to go back to you on that and what you were saying. You basically said that, based on what you're hearing from your listeners, there's not this big rift in the MAGA base.

If you would, tell us a little bit more about that, because, as you know, as we have been reporting, President Trump, a big part of his campaign was about, look, we're going to take the U.S. and out of overseas interventions and so forth. And there's this isolationist view within the party.

And so it's interesting to me that that's not really reflected necessarily in what you're hearing, Jason.

RANTZ: Yes, I mean, remember, this is not anything new that folks who support Donald Trump support Donald Trump. And when he's willing to pivot perhaps on some of these issues, they're willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and go along with it. I think a lot of what you're seeing from conservatives right now is

really -- this is pushback from what we have seen over the course of the last year-and-a-half from some of the antisemitic positions that some have taken with Israel going after Hamas in Gaza. And I think there is just a natural inclination to want to support Israel even more.

I think over the last year-and-a-half, people have really understood the Middle East in ways that I don't think they may be thought of before. And they recognize the threat of Iran having nuclear weapons. This is -- at the end of the day, there is a debate, there's no doubt, about what the next step should be.

There is not a debate, however, that folks generally accept they cannot be armed with nuclear weapons. And so I think there's a lot of trust for Donald Trump to move forward in the next two weeks to come up with a plan.

BROWN: So, Michelangelo, I'm going to get to you in a second.

But just, Jason, to follow up, tell us a little bit more about what is driving the support for Israel among your listeners. You said you're seeing more and more of that on the last few months. What's behind that?

RANTZ: Yes, I think mostly it's been there this entire time, but I certainly think that there are more interest in vocally supporting Israel as a way to push back at some of what they have seen on the ground, both here in Seattle and, frankly, around the country.

There's been a lot of antisemitism. I say that not just as a talk to host, but as a Jew myself. Like, I feel it, I see it, I experience it. And I think naturally people want to support Israel as a democratic state in an area that is not too friendly to the West, generally speaking, certainly when it comes to Israel and Hamas, a terrorist organization.

[11:45:06]

So, Donald Trump has been really strong on this. I think that's obviously rankled some feathers, but also there are some Democrats who clearly are on the side of Donald Trump on this particular issue, even if they may not want to vocalize it all that much.

BROWN: So what do you say to that, Michelangelo, based on what you're hearing from your listeners? And tell us more about what they are thinking and feeling about supporting Israel in this moment and walking that fine line?

SIGNORILE: Well, we have listeners who run the gamut of Israeli policy and whether or not they're opposed to Israeli policy, certainly in Gaza and what we have seen, as well as those who support it, including many Jews, who we know, of course, also run the spectrum in terms of supporting the policies of the Israeli government.

But most of my listeners have seen no interest in the United States getting involved in this. This is between Israel and Iran. People are more concerned about Ukraine, which was attacked by Russia and the lack of any engagement in making sure we protect Ukraine. A lot of people have brought that up and how that's just fallen off the map and that there isn't an interest here in military action that can't be solved without diplomacy.

And I think that's the key thing. People feel there hasn't been the kind of (AUDIO GAP). Donald Trump was engaged in it just a few weeks ago and really talking about the same kind of nuclear deal that he had killed in his first term. People are pointing to that hypocrisy and saying, why all of a sudden this shift? Why all of a sudden this backing?

And is it that he just wants to once again be on the winning team? I have had several people say, Netanyahu moved out ahead of him, and now he wants to be the leader ahead of Netanyahu.

BROWN: All right, Michelangelo, Jason, great to have you both on. Thank you so much.

More when we come back.

SIGNORILE: Thank you.

RANTZ: Thank you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:51:09]

BLITZER: We're, of course, monitoring all the late-breaking developments out of Israel and Iran, new Iranian strikes hitting Israel just a couple of hours ago.

You see the damage in Haifa. At least 23 people were injured throughout Israel and a woman died of a heart attack inside a bomb shelter, this as talks are under way right now between Iran and top European diplomats in Geneva.

BROWN: Joining us now is New Jersey Democratic Congressman Josh Gottheimer, a member of the House Intelligence Committee.

Congressman, thanks for coming on.

REP. JOSH GOTTHEIMER (D-NJ): Thanks for having me.

BROWN: Let's first start off by getting your reaction to the president's decision to decide within two weeks whether to strike Iran. Is that the right call, in your view?

GOTTHEIMER: So, I think anything that in the end ensures that Iran has no nuclear program, with zero enrichment, as long as that remains the objective, I don't care how we get there.

I think what is critically important and must be the number one objective here is ensuring that Iran has no nuclear program, that we obviously continue to take action against Iran, against their terror program. As you know, Iran and their proxies have killed hundreds of Americans, service members, targeted not just our military bases, but our allies.

So we have to never forget the kind of government that Iran has been running, which is one that sees the United States as its enemy.

BROWN: So, just to be clear, though, do you support U.S. military involvement in Iran?

GOTTHEIMER: I believe, at the end of the day, we have to do everything we can to stop a nuclear program. If that means, after -- in this current effort, that the United States can help ensure that there is no nuclear program, whether that's through bunker-busters or other delivery systems, I think that the end goal there is the number one priority, which is no nuclear program.

We cannot allow Iran to have a nuclear weapon.

BLITZER: Congressman, I want to pivot while I have you and discuss the freed Israeli-American hostage Edan Alexander, who just got a hero's welcome as he returned home to New Jersey, your state, after 584 days in Hamas custody.

He was released last month. The streets of Tenafly, New Jersey, were filled with thousands of friends and supporters, and I want you and our viewers to watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're all really excited to have him back. It's a big deal. Part of our town's missing, and now he's finally home, so it's really nice for all of us to have him back.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's the best. We have been waiting for him, and we're really happy to have him home. And all of Tenafly, Bergen County, all of us came out, and he's back.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: So, Congressman, what does this mean to your community and in your state of New Jersey?

GOTTHEIMER: Well, he's my constituent. He's just a regular Jersey guy, an all-American kid, went to Tenafly High School, as you heard, 21 years old, and, obviously, Wolf, as we have talked about many times, in captivity for 584 days at the hands of Hamas terrorists.

And to see him come home, it's a dream come true for the community, and so much excitement. I was there last month, when the whole community came together to celebrate his release. And to see him finally come home, it's just incredibly exciting.

And we still, as you know, Wolf have two more Americans who are not alive anymore to bring home, and we can't rest until that happens. But yesterday was a day for great celebration across New Jersey. BLITZER: Yes, I know it was -- Pam.

BROWN: Yes. And we had his parents on our show a while back before he was released, and we're so happy for him and his family.

You mentioned the two Americans.

GOTTHEIMER: And they never gave up, those parents.

BROWN: They didn't.

GOTTHEIMER: I just want to say, like, his parents, unbelievable people, right? They never for one minute -- I will tell you, I spoke to them nearly every day for those 584 days, and they never gave up hope or faith, his entire family, courage, and the whole community stood behind them, and it showed. It was amazing.

BROWN: We just love watching this video too of the first hug and the excitement, because they weren't sure if they were going to see their son again.

[11:55:02]

GOTTHEIMER: Incredible.

BROWN: It's amazing, but at the same time...

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: Oh, go ahead.

GOTTHEIMER: No, I was just saying, the odds were long, and the fact that he got out, right, that hug -- the whole family coming together.

I have spoken to them many times since. And the -- not just the -- like -- and they never -- I will tell you, I will be honest, like, they never gave up faith for one day. And that's -- I'm -- they willed him home. And he's just an incredibly strong person. I can't wait to spend time with him.

BROWN: Yes, a parent's love, what it will do, right?

BLITZER: Certainly, and very touching indeed, very emotional, very moving.

BROWN: All right, Congressman Josh Gottheimer, thank you so much.

GOTTHEIMER: Thanks for having me.

BLITZER: And thanks from me as well.

And, to our viewers, thanks very much for joining us this morning. You can always keep up with us on social media @WolfBlitzer and @PamelaBrownCNN.

We will see you back here Monday, every weekday morning at 10:00 a.m. Eastern.

"INSIDE POLITICS" with Manu Raju today is coming up next right after a short break.

BROWN: Have a great weekend, everyone.