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The Situation Room

Interview With Rep. Jason Crow (D-CO); Interview With West Virginia Attorney General J.B. McCuskey; Trump Talks With Putin; Republicans Set to Pass Budget Bill. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired July 03, 2025 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:00]

AMOS HOCHSTEIN, FORMER MIDDLE EAST NEGOTIATOR: When I left, we were very close to delineating a land boundary between Israel and Lebanon for the first time since the existence of the two countries.

If you do that, I think we can get -- with stepping-stones. I think that future is very, very possible.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Syria too?

HOCHSTEIN: Absolutely.

BLITZER: All right, Amos Hochstein, thanks very much for coming in. And we will be right.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Happening now, breaking news: six hours and still talking. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries delivers a mega- speech, as he delays the vote on President Trump's megabill.

BLITZER: And we want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world.

I'm Wolf Blitzer with Pamela Brown, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLITZER: And we begin this hour with the breaking news. President Trump inches closer and closer to the biggest legislative victory of his second term.

House Republicans appear to have enough votes to pass the spending and tax bill that will flesh out his agenda.

BROWN: Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries has held up the vote with his lungs. He's been speaking for more than six hours. Republicans say they're ready to put the bill on the president's desk by tomorrow's deadline.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): We're excited to get this done. If Hakeem will stop talking, we will get the job done for the American people.

It takes a lot longer to build a lie than to tell the truth. So he's really spinning a long tale in there. But we're excited that people will see the effect of this bill. The sooner we can get to it, the sooner the Democrats will stop talking, we will get this bill done for the people. And we're really excited about it. So I'm ready to roll.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: CNN congressional correspondent Lauren Fox is on Capitol Hill.

Lauren, Speaker Johnson just stopped to speak with you. What did he say?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, he told us that he is ready to pass this bill as soon as Hakeem Jeffries, the Democratic leader, finishes up with what is known here as the magic minute, which has been so magical that it has stretched on now for about six hours.

The record for this is 8 5 hours. That was held by Kevin McCarthy, a previous speaker of the House, when Democrats were trying to pass Build Back Better, and they were in the majority. So we are really waiting to see whether or not Jeffries tries to break that record. That would put this final vote some time in the 1:00 hour, toward the end of that hour.

But, again, it's just hard to predict right now when this final vote will take place. When it does, Speaker Johnson is very confident that he has lined up the support that he needs to get this across the finish line. He warned that he might have one or two defections. He said he's still having conversations with Representative Brian Fitzpatrick, who voted against advancing the rule in the middle of the night.

But he said that Fitzpatrick has a series of concerns and convictions that he respects, but he is still continuing to try to figure out if he can win that support. Obviously, if you're Speaker Johnson, you want as many votes in the yes column for the president as you can get.

But this is just a really huge, momentous moment for Speaker Johnson, for the Republican leadership in both the House and the Senate, in part because repeatedly they had set deadlines for themselves that seemed almost impossible. They may be on the cusp of getting there, assuming that at some point Jeffries yields the floor.

BROWN: All right, Lauren Fox, thank you -- Wolf.

[11:05:02]

BLITZER: All right, Pamela, millions of low-income Americans could lose their benefits if President Trump's bill makes historic cuts to both Medicaid and other safety net programs.

The American Hospital Association is warning that the cuts could cause what it describes as permanent damage to the nation's health care system. CNN senior reporter Matt Egan is joining us right now.

Matt, what more can you tell us about these cuts and who could suffer the most?

MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: Well, Wolf, this legislation calls for deep and historic cuts to social safety net programs, and that is why many low-income Americans could end up being worse off here.

Now, in particular, this package calls for new and expanded work requirements for both Medicaid and for food stamps and also cuts the funding there. As far as hospitals go, they're not pleased with this legislation because it also calls for reduced Medicaid funding from states.

And there's estimates out there from the Congressional Budget Office that the number of people who are uninsured could spike by almost 12 million by 2034. And when we look at the business impact, we know that a lot of business groups are happy with this package, but some are not, in particular, clean energy.

We're talking about reduced incentives for renewable energy projects. That's wind, solar, and other clean energy projects, also stricter requirements for them to get some of their tax credits. And when you think about some of the harsh criticism from Elon Musk, this package would end tax credits in September for E.V.s, tax credits that previously were not scheduled to expire until 2032.

So, look, we know the president has said that this is going to be one of the most successful pieces of legislation in U.S. history, but I think it's very clear that the ultimate beauty of this bill really is in the eye of the beholder. And while some groups are going to come out ahead, others are not.

BLITZER: How much will this raise the national debt, Matt? And how much will it affect people who want to simply buy a home?

EGAN: Well, I think it's hard to look at what has happened in the last few weeks and say that deficit hawks and those who are concerned about the national debt did not come out as losers here, because the Congressional Budget Office, they estimate this megabill will increase the deficit by $3.4 trillion.

And we know America already has a mountain of debt. This shows the national debt as a percentage of GDP. It is well ahead of where it was around World War II. You see, it started to spike around the Great Recession, went even higher during COVID, and it continues to rise and is projected to continue to rise above 150 percent.

Again, this is because the government continues to spend more money than it takes in. And when you think about the implications here, there are many. First of all, a lot of economists say, when you have too much debt, it can slow down the economy because it crowds out private investment. It also leads to higher borrowing costs for businesses, also for consumers, when you think about people who are trying to get a mortgage or a car loan. Ultimately, there are concerns that in the long run. Some investors could really become concerned about the health of the U.S. budget, and that could cause a financial crisis to itself. And every billion dollars that the government spends on interest is a billion less that it can spend on other priorities like Social Security and Medicare.

So I think the bottom line here, Wolf, is there are a lot of estimates out there that this package is going to make America's fiscal mess even worse.

BLITZER: All right, Matt Egan, reporting for us.

Matt, excellent. Thanks very, very much.

BROWN: All right, so Matt there just walked us through all the numbers in this bill.

BLITZER: Let's turn now into the political impact of this legislation.

CNN senior political analyst Mark Preston is here with us in the situation to break this down for us.

How big of a win potentially is this for President Trump?

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: This is a gigantic win. I mean, there's no question about it. This was his signature issue. He wanted an incredible amount of money that was going to be earmarked, focused strictly on border security. He has got an incredible amount of money going that way.

The budget hawks aren't necessarily very happy with what they got. They seem to be that they're going to go along. But the fact of the matter is, this is a Republican bill, no question about that. The tax cuts that are going through right now are going to be welcomed certainly by his supporters -- or certainly by his supporters who are more on the wealthy spectrum.

Otherwise, they would have seen an incredible tax hike.

BROWN: Right, but a lot of it's a continuation of what happened in 2017.

PRESTON: A hundred percent.

BROWN: So it's not like people are going to just suddenly see all this extra money.

PRESTON: A hundred percent, nor will we see this bill become -- will we see the debt get reduced, right? There will be no deficit reduction. As Matt said, we're going to see, what is it, close to $4 billion more, $3 billion to $4 billion more added on.

BROWN: Trillion.

PRESTON: Trillion. There we go. BROWN: Trillion, yes.

[11:10:00]

PRESTON: Gazillion.

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: Billion, trillion.

PRESTON: We're going to make up letters here.

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: So on that note, I think it's $3.3 trillion, if I'm not mistaken. That's what the CBO is projecting. Of course, Republicans argue, well, the CBO is wrong. And we're going to have all this growth.

PRESTON: That's over the next decade.

BROWN: Right, over the next decade. We're going to have all this growth. I just asked Congresswoman McClain about that. That was her argument.

But the CBO is also estimating that nearly 12 million people could be uninsured by, I think, its 2034. So you have to wonder what the potential blowback for Republicans could become next year's midterms. I know some of these dates are very strategically placed, it seems, in terms of when some of this is going to go into effect.

PRESTON: Right.

BROWN: But this could really impact a lot of Americans who are the most vulnerable.

PRESTON: Yes, and this doesn't come in the terms of it being in a vacuum.

Just a couple of months ago, where there was so much talk about the DOGE cuts, right, and all the cuts, and how that was going to affect the midterm elections, and how we saw the federal government that was going to start pulling back all these resources all across the country, now you couple that with 12 million people being thrown off the rolls, necessarily, you head into the midterm elections.

Potentially, what you have is the perfect storm politically for Democrats. You have the fact that they finally have a message. They actually have folks who are inspired to go out. And, three, they have enough people, which is really two, to go out and to try to win back the House and the Senate. It's going to be hard, but that's what certainly they're hoping for.

BROWN: All right, Mark Preston, as always, thanks so much. And happy Fourth.

PRESTON: Happy Fourth.

BLITZER: Good to have you here in THE SITUATION ROOM. Thank you very much.

BROWN: And we have some breaking news coming in.

For the second time in weeks, President Trump says that he is holding a phone call with Russia's Vladimir Putin. Their talk comes on the heels of the Pentagon's decision to pause some weapon shipments to Ukraine.

CNN senior White House reporter Kevin Liptak joins us.

What do we know about this call, Kevin?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, and Trump said that this was scheduled to begin at 10:00 a.m. Eastern time. So that's about an hour and 10 minutes ago.

And it comes at a critical moment for the U.S. role in Ukraine after the Trump administration said it would halt delivery of certain weapons to Ukraine over concerns of dwindling U.S. stockpiles. That's certainly a point of conversation between these two men.

The president last spoke to Putin in mid-June. That was a conversation that, in part, centered around the situation in Iran. The president told his Russian counterpart during that conversation that he wanted him focused squarely on the situation in Ukraine. And we did hear from President Trump last week at the NATO summit, saying that he thought Putin was misguided, even though he thought that the Russian leader did want to settle this conflict somehow.

And so you do see how all of these things are coming together into President Trump really trying to apply pressure on Putin to bring this war to an end. It does come amid a diplomatic flurry for the Russian leader. He spoke earlier this week with the French president, Emmanuel Macron, for the first time in three years. And so you do see the gears moving somewhat on this particular situation.

One question that we don't have an answer to is whether or when President Trump plans to speak to Volodymyr Zelenskyy, the president of Ukraine, about that halt in weapons. No scheduled call is on the books as of this moment, but certainly I think Zelenskyy very eager to speak with Trump about that particular situation.

BROWN: All right, Kevin Liptak, thanks so much -- Wolf.

BLITZER: And still ahead, the aggressive deportation push versus the country's reliance on migrant labor. CNN has new reporting on the Trump administration's tough balancing act.

BROWN: And the Supreme Court has agreed to review if states can control which team a transgender athlete plays on. We will talk with a state attorney general involved in this legal fight in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [11:18:36]

BROWN: This morning, the U.S. Supreme Court announced it will take up multiple cases on the transgender rights, including one on West Virginia's Save Women's Sports Act.

At the heart of this case is 13-year-old Becky Pepper-Jackson, a transgender girl who was initially blocked from running on her middle school track team. A preliminary court injunction has allowed her to compete while the case makes its way up to the highest court. West Virginia's law has drawn criticism for banning trans athletes from competing in girls and women's sports.

And the ACLU is arguing trans athletes like Becky should be able to play under the equal protection law, the equal protection of the Constitution and Title IX.

Let's discuss with West Virginia's Attorney General J.B. McCuskey.

Thank you so much for being here.

First of all, what is your reaction to the High Court taking up your state's case here?

J.B. MCCUSKEY (R), WEST VIRGINIA ATTORNEY GENERAL: So we're excited to make our argument as to why the Save Women's Sports Act here in West Virginia is constitutional under -- in the highest court in the country.

What we see here is a common standard law passed by our state legislature. Women and girls have a fair playing field to showcase their talents and all the hard work that they put into these sports. And we're very excited and very bullish on our chances of winning at the High Court.

BROWN: You say it's unfair to let transgender athletes compete against women and girls. And, to be clear, polls have consistently shown that a strong majority of Americans oppose allowing transgender women and girls to compete in female sports.

[11:20:07]

Can you explain why you think that is?

MCCUSKEY: And this isn't about polling for us. This is about fairness.

And the reason is so intensely commonsense that it's sort of -- it's easy to make this argument, right? Everybody can see the difference between what a man and a woman can do on an athletic field. And the other point that I think is really important to make is that we're not trying to keep anyone from playing sports.

We're trying to ensure that, when people are playing sports, they're playing against people that have the same physical characteristics that they do and that an (AUDIO GAP) the sport. BROWN: Uh-oh.

MCCUSKEY: And we think that this is a fairly common (AUDIO GAP) and we're really excited about getting to the court and making our (AUDIO GAP).

BROWN: I say uh-oh because your connection is not so strong right now. Hopefully, that resolves itself.

But just to follow up with you, for Becky's part, according to the ACLU, she has described her teammates as her second family and that participating in her schools cross-country and track team is deeply meaningful to her. And doctors say the evidence is incomplete. In the case of children, most experts say that before the age of puberty for boys and girls, there's not a significant advantage between the two sexes.

What evidence do you have that letting transgender kids participate in sports harms girls?

MCCUSKEY: Well, I mean, I think the evidence is with my eyes.

I mean, I have two girls that play a very competitive sport. And I have seen just from my own personal experience that even as early ages as 8 and 9 that the boys have a very distinct athletic advantage over the girls.

And what (AUDIO GAP) saying here is, is that there is a biology-based distinction. And biology-based distinction does not change over time, right? And so it is -- we believe the fairest way to do this is that we have people playing on fields against people that have (AUDIO GAP) athletic ability based on their (AUDIO GAP) and -- as other people.

And you can make the argument that at age 6 or (AUDIO GAP) but, to us, that matters less than the idea that this is a sex-based classification that is based on biology.

BROWN: The NCAA president, Charlie Baker, in December said that he was aware of fewer than 10 transgender athletes among more than 510,000 who competed at the collegiate level. And advocacy groups say the number is even smaller in K-12 sports.

So what do you say to critics who believe your fight is for a minuscule number of athletes just trying to express their identities?

MCCUSKEY: Well, I think, from a philosophical standpoint, an unfairness against anybody is an unfairness period.

But I think what you're seeing like places at the University of Pennsylvania is that everyone is (AUDIO GAP) to understand that Title (AUDIO GAP) lift, raise women and girls to an equal playing field with men and that there's an enormous (AUDIO GAP) that's been done in their (AUDIO GAP) NCAA sport, NIL. You see like (AUDIO GAP) Clark (AUDIO GAP) Reese in the NBA just..

(CROSSTALK) BROWN: Unfortunately -- yes, unfortunately, we're having a hard time hearing you. So I just want to note that, that your connection isn't very strong, but I do want to read the ACLU.

MCCUSKEY: I'm sorry.

BROWN: That's OK. It's the tech gods. They're not liking us today.

But let me just read this ACLU statement, make sure we get this out there. They say -- quote -- "Trans kids play sports for the same reasons their peers do, to learn perseverance, dedication, teamwork, and to simply have fun with their friends. Categorically excluding kids from school sports just because they are transgender will only make our schools less safe and more harmful places for all youth."

So that is what the ACLU is saying there.

West Virginia Attorney General J.B. McCuskey, thank you so much.

BLITZER: And thanks, Attorney General, from me as well. Appreciate it. We will fix those technical issues the next time we all talk.

Up next, Congressman Jason Crow will weigh in on what Democrats can do about President Trump's megabill, as his colleagues -- as his colleague the House minority leader, Hakeem Jeffries, goes to great lengths to try to delay the vote.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:29:06]

BROWN: Right now, House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, is more than six hours into a marathon speech opposing President Trump's Big Beautiful Bill, as it's called.

Jeffries says that he's going to take his sweet time as he tries to delay a final House vote.

I want to discuss it with Democratic Congressman Jason Crow of Colorado.

Congressman, thank you for being here with us.

Republicans appear to have the votes to pass this. What is the mood inside the Democratic Caucus now that you're on the verge of losing this fight?

REP. JASON CROW (D-CO): Pam, we're doing everything, everything in our power to stop it and to slow it down.

And the reason why slowing it down is really important is because House Republicans, congressional Republicans really, you include the Senate in that, haven't given Americans the opportunity to weigh in. They have stopped holding town halls largely. They're not responding to people's calls. They're jamming this through in the middle of the night literally. They're bypassing committee process. [11:30:00]

They have short-circuited all the things that are built into a process like this to hear from people, to hear from constituents.