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ICE Transfer Flights Now Becoming Harder To Track; Maxwell Prison Transfer Raises Witness Tampering Concerns; Taylor Swift Talks Love and New Album in Podcast Debut; Alaska Preps for Trump-Putin Summit. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired August 14, 2025 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

RENE MARSH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: -- handcuffed, walk up those steps and get on board. One, two, three, four more detainees. You can tell that their hands are restrained.

MARSH (voiceover): This is one of about 6,000 ICE flights since President Donald Trump took office. We were able to find this plane here in Richmond, Virginia, but most of them are hidden from the public and operating with little transparency. Virtually every ICE flight carrying detainees blocks their tail numbers from flight tracking websites, making it nearly impossible for families and advocates to find their loved ones once they're in ICE custody.

MARSH: This is one of the tail numbers that we think could possibly come here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Uh-huh.

MARSH: And right now, it's in Youngstown. Oh, loOK. I think it's taking off because the altitude is increasing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is it rising?

MARSH: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.

MARSH (voiceover): We studied months of flight paths, got a tail number, and made an education guess about which flight would arrive in Richmond. Then using a crowdsource database that monitors aircraft radio signals we tracked the suspected flight revealing every city and state it stopped in within 24 hours.

This is the plane we're tracking, a Boeing 737 operated by Eastern Air Express with a tail number N668CP. It has up to 148 economy seats, a bathroom in the front and the back, but it's unclear how many people are on board this flight or any other ICE flight.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tyson 51, continue on.

MARSH: OK. Tyson 51 is this one right now. That's the call sign that they're using for this flight. MARSH (voiceover): Many ICE flights go by Tyson, the same call sign used to identify Trump's personal plane after he was elected in 2016.

Here's the flight path it took on August 6. Ohio, New York, Pennsylvania, to Louisiana. Back to Ohio, then New York, pick up and dropping off detainees at every stop.

MARSH: If it's actually coming to Virginia, it should be here very soon. It's on approach. It's on approach right now. Its altitude is like literally 50 feet. So --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. I think over there -- over there. Go, go, go.

MARSH: All right. I think that might be it. This is the plane. This is the plane that we've been tracking all morning. This is it. And we just saw, like, more than 30 detainees handcuffed walk up those steps and get on board. There's one, two, three, four more detainees. You can tell that their hands are restrained. Another one, another -- OK. So they're unloading another vehicle here. Multiple detainees walking up to get on board this Eastern Air Express flight.

MARSH (voiceover): The Trump administration has used more than 70 airports across the country for domestic shuffle flights so far, moving ICE detainees between detention centers before deportation.

In the past three months, the number of these flights spiked 90 percent compared to the same time period last year, according to an immigrant rights group, and that trend is expected to continue after the Department of Homeland Security recently earmarked $14.4 billion for ICE flights.

MARSH: We know that the tail number of a flight that we've been tracking today is N668CP, and we want to see if this public tracking site that gets its data and information from the FAA has any record of a flight. Nothing comes up.

MARSH (voiceover): But we were able to track the flight as it made its way back to Alexandria, Louisiana -- the busiest hub for ICE deportation flights. At this point in the journey some of the first detainees on board were possibly on this plane handcuffed for nearly 10 hours. As this ICE flight completes its 24-hour trip, Louisiana is likely the last stop in the U.S. before the people on board are deported.

MARSH: Well, the reality is it was not very simple to track this ice flight. We weren't even sure we had successfully done it until it was coming in for a landing at Richmond's airport. And the point is these flights really have virtually no eyes on them. Families and advocates have no idea where their loved ones are going once they are in ICE custody.

Now, one of the airlines flying the flights for ICE, Avelo Airlines, told CNN in an e-mail, quote, "Flights operated on behalf of the United States government are often unidentified at the government's request." So, we reached out to the Department of Homeland Security. That's the agency that oversees ICE to get a better understanding as to why these flights are blocking their tail numbers. But the agency did not comment.

Rene Marsh, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Rene, very much. I want to bring in CNN Senior Legal Analyst Elie Honig. Elie, thanks very much for being here. We saw how these companies operating these deportation flights are removing the tail numbers from the public flight records, the tracking sites, as they're called. Is all of this legal?

[10:35:00]

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST AND FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK: Well, Wolf, this is a really good illustration of the fact that immigration enforcement authorities tend to operate with less visibility and less transparency than we're used to, for example, in the criminal field.

Now, as to the legality, there's nothing necessarily illegal about removing a tail number. However, what that does is it really undermines the due process rights of the potential deportees. The Supreme Court earlier this year found that while people who might be deported don't have the same due process rights as a criminal defendant, they do have some basic due process rights. So, if we think about it, if the family members of a deportee don't know where he is, can't track him, have no idea where he's being held, they can't realistically go and hire a lawyer. The lawyer can't realistically go meet with this person. So, this practice, I think, is really damaging to the basic due process rights here.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, that's a really important point. I also want to ask you about another subject that we've been covering. Of course, that's the Jeffrey Epstein case. Democrats on the House Judiciary Committee say that Ghislaine s Maxwell's controversial prison transfer raises, quote, "substantial concern." They're arguing here, Elie, that the administration maybe trying to tamper with a witness. What do you make of that argument?

HONIG: Well, it's not witness tampering. I think that's an overstatement. I do think there are valid questions about how a convicted sex offender got moved down to a lower security prison. What happens all the time is that prosecutors will deliver benefits to people who they deemed to be credible, useful cooperating witnesses. It can be at times a benefit in terms of where they're held. It can be a sentencing benefit. That's the most common way to do this.

And to me, that raises the question of, has DOJ actually concluded that Ghislaine Maxwell is reliable and trustworthy? Are they going to bank on her word? Are they going to ask us in the public to believe the word of a convicted child sex trafficker of a person who has lied under oath about her involvement? So, I think those are the relevant questions. I wouldn't call it -- it's not witness tampering, but I think it does raise valid questions about credibility.

BLITZER: Elie Honig, thank you very much for that update. Appreciate it very much.

BROWN: Thank you, Elie. And just ahead right here in the Situation Room, skipping the sunscreen. This is a viral trend that has doctors raising red flags. A dermatologist separates fact from fiction, coming up.

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[10:40:00]

BROWN: And new this morning, we are taking a look at a growing trend on social media. Viral claims questioning sunscreen. Here are just a few of them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't wear sunscreen. And anytime I do an interview, I get a lot of -- when I admit that I don't.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not saying just go from zero to a hundred and spend five hours in the sun.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Like every spring I start with like five minutes in the sun, work up to 10 minutes, 15, and then I build that. And by the end of summer, I'm in the sun for like the whole day without any sunscreen or anything like that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Amazing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obviously don't get sunburned, but there's something called a solar callous. What this is the more sun exposure you have, the less likely you are going to get hurt. Your grandparents didn't wear sunscreen and they were half as likely to get skin and colon cancer as we are.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It turns out that your diet can protect you from the sun. Eat your sunscreen, stop wearing it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So, this growing anti-sunscreen movement has taken hold on sites like TikTok. And doctors are sounding the alarm. Dr. Jennifer Choi is a dermatology professor at Northwestern University Med School and specializes in skin cancer. Hi, Dr. Choi. So, off the bat here, can you fact-check what we just heard?

DR. JENNIFER N. CHOI, DERMATOLOGY PROFESSOR, NORTHWESTERN UNIVERSITY MED SCHOOL: You know, there is a lot of misinformation online and everything that we heard unfortunately is misinformation. There's no evidence that we can eat our sunscreen. There's no evidence that enough food is enough to protect us from the damage from UV rays. And then, also, anytime you spend enough time in the sun, even tanning is a sign of UV damage to your skin that can lead to skin cancer. So, even if you build yourself up to the point where you won't sunburn, you're still damaging your skin, unfortunately, from UV radiation.

BROWN: So, this idea of building yourself up so you don't get sunburned, is there some -- even though it's bad for you, is there some truth to that if you -- like we just heard the guest on Kristin Cavallari saying, well, I spend five minutes and I build up to 10, and you know, what about that?

DR. CHOI: I mean, yes, there is a little bit of truth to that in the sense that if you spend time slowly increasing that you might be able to decrease your risk of sunburn right away. But the -- I think the most important point is that that's actually still not healthy for your skin. So, both sunburns and tanning actually are a sign of UV damage that both can lead to sun skin cancer. So, even if someone thinks that they're safe because they can sit in the sun for five hours or all day without sunburning, that is still constant damage to your skin.

BROWN: Is a sunburn more dam more dangerous than a tan?

DR. CHOI: A sunburn is more dangerous to a tan. They've actually found that a single blistering sunburn during childhood more than doubles your risk of melanoma in adulthood. So, when you think about UV damage to the skin, there's DNA damage happening at the skin level. So, sunburns, there's an intense amount of damage that then your body needs to try to correct. And with tanning, there is still damage, but it's not as bad as sunburns.

BROWN: Some people have gone so far as to claim that sunscreen itself causes cancer. What do you say to that? What's the truth?

DR. CHOI: Yes. So, there -- that is not true at all. There's a lot, again, misinformation online. There's a fear of chemicals, but I always like to remind people that water's a chemical. But there is no evidence that sunscreen is harmful to our bodies.

[10:45:00]

A lot of this was based on some studies that had come out. So, for example, a couple years ago, there was a scare that benzene was found in sunscreens, especially sprays. And benzene is a carcinogen, but we actually also breathe in benzene in the city air from gas exhaust. So, we don't necessarily obviously want it, but it was found to be a contaminant, not an ingredient in sunscreen. And so, that -- and then even the little amounts that we may have been exposed to is not enough to cause cancer.

And then, there was also some evidence that if you feed these ingredients to mice a thousand times more than we would ever get through absorption through our skin, that it can maybe have endocrine disrupting effects on the mice, but it does not at all translate to human use. So, to this day, there's no evidence that sunscreen is harmful, it does not cause cancer and is not harmful to humans.

BROWN: Tell us more about the difference between chemical and mineral sunscreens and whether there are any chemicals in some sunscreens that could be dangerous to kids.

DR. CHOI: So, that's a great question. So, chemical sunscreens are the type that contain ingredients like avobenzone, oxybenzone, octocrylene. They work by basically absorbing the UV rays and then it dispersing them into heat before it reaches the skin, and that's the way they're going to protect the skin from UV damage. These tend to be more elegant. They go on nicely. They don't leave a white cast.

And then, the mineral sunscreens are titanium dioxide and zinc oxide. And the way they work is they do also absorb some of the UV rays and translate it into heat and disperse it, but they also block the sun from your skin. So, they're a physical blocker. Now, these are considered better for sensitive skin. They can sometimes be a little more white and thick.

And so, for kids and for, you know, people with sensitive skin, we usually do say we recommend mineral sunscreens. But even chemical sunscreens actually have not been found to be dangerous even to kids.

BROWN: Just really quickly, I want -- this is a selfish question because I've always been curious about this. I keep hearing about, you know, the importance of vitamin D and you get that from the sun. So, how do you strike the balance of getting vitamin D from the sun, which is super important, but also protecting your skin with sunscreen?

DR. CHOI: That's also a great question. So, there have actually been studies that people who use sunscreen regularly still make enough vitamin D. And part of that reason is because most people are actually underplaying the amount that they need for sun protection. So, they're still getting vitamin D production.

Having said that though, if you are using sunscreen in an adequate way, that you could become vitamin D insufficient or places like Chicago where we don't get sun all year round. And in those cases, we usually say just stick to food and supplements to make sure that you're not vitamin D deficient. And if you just stick to those ways, then we don't have to rely on the sun because then you can't separate that from sun damage that can cause things like skin cancer.

BROWN: All right. Dr. Jennifer Choi, thank you so much.

DR. CHOI: Yes, thank you.

BLITZER: And coming up, laughter, tears, sarcasm, romance. The epic two-hour podcast announcement of Taylor Swift's new album had it all.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TAYLOR SWIFT, SINGER: Yes.

JASON KELCE, HOST, NEW HEIGHTS PODCAST: Are you ready for it? Thank you. Your podcast gave you the most impressive guest in the history of shows, Taylor Swift.

SWIFT: That intro. Jason, he's, oh, my god.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[10:50:00]

BROWN: October 3rd, it's the date I know Wolf Blitzer has circled on his calendar as a Swifty, right?

BLITZER: Of course.

BROWN: And me too, by the way. Taylor Swift has officially announced when her 12th album is dropping. And the way she did it sure beat just sending out a, you know, press release. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SWIFT: This is my brand-new album. It's called "The Life of a Show Girl."

J. KELCE: Love it. Love it.

SWIFT: It was something that I was working on while I was in Europe on the Eras Tour. And --

J. KELCE: So, while you were on tour. OK.

SWIFT: I was working. I would be on tour.

TRAVIS KELCE, HOST, NEW HEIGHTS PODCAST: How on earth did she do this on the tour is still blowing my mind.

SWIFT: I just love it. I just love it a lot. I love music.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So, Swift made the announcement on her first ever podcast interview, speaking on New Heights with co-host boyfriend guy on the Chiefs, you know, Travis Kelce, and his brother Jason Kelce.

BLITZER: CNN Entertainment Reporter Lisa France is joining us right now. Lisa, you've been watching all of this unfold. This was part of a rather raw, very personal, and emotional two-hour interview with the Kelce brothers. Taylor was more open about her personal life than ever before. I think that's fair to say, right?

LISA RESPERS FRANCE, CNN ENTERTAINMENT REPORTER: It's so fair to say, Wolf, because to quote Taylor Swift, it's a love story. And the Swifties are still trying to process all the joy that we got last night and all the information.

Now, we came full circle with this one because if you'll remember two years ago, Travis Kelce, he shot his shot on New Heights by letting Taylor Swift know that he was trying to get in contact with her to give her a friendship bracelet with his phone number on it. So, we found out last night from Taylor how she's grateful for that and grateful for the podcast. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J. KELCE: So, we're going to ask a question everybody watching the show is currently asking, why are you coming on the show? What are you doing? You have so many better things to do with your time.

SWIFT: This podcast has done a lot for me. I owe a lot to this podcast. This podcast got me a boyfriend. Ever since Travis decided to use it as his personal dating app about two years ago. So --

J. KELCE: Worked pretty good?

SWIFT: Yes. Hey.

[10:55:00]

FRANCE: Oh, so cute. We just love it. And there's also a moment where she like frames his face and he kisses her palm. I mean this -- they're just the most adorable couple. And they're baking bread together, Wolf and Pamela.

BROWN: I know. Sourdough bread.

FRANCE: Sourdough bread. Very important. Thank you.

BLITZER: She was paying attention. You were paying --

BROWN: I was watching with my five-year-old daughter and it was really cute because my five-year-old was like so into it and kept wanting to watch. So, I had to -- I watched most of it.

BLITZER: And as you know, Lisa, Taylor swift also spoke rather passionately about regaining ownership of what are called her master recordings, all of her songs. What did we learn about that?

FRANCE: Those masters were so important to her, Wolf. And what we learned is when she was fighting to get them back, she didn't send an attorney, she sent her mom and her brother. And Taylor got extremely emotional discussing it. Let's hear what she had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SWIFT: I get a call from my mom and she's like, they we did. You got your music.

J. KELCE: Yes.

SWIFT: And so, sorry that this is -- it's literally been so long since this happened. Like, it's, every time I talk about it. She was like, you got your music. And I just like very dramatically hit the floor for real. Like honestly, just started --

T. KELCE: It's been a long time coming.

SWIFT: -- bawling my eyes out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Very emotional indeed, Lisa.

FRANCE: Yes. Yes. You could tell that that meant a great deal to her, and her sharing that with the world meant so much to the Swifties and the fans. So, we love to see it.

BROWN: Yes. And she mentioned that he cried too.

BLITZER: Yes.

BROWN: During that moment.

BLITZER: It was an emotional moment. She regains ownership of all of her work. That's so nice. All right. Lisa France, thank you very, very much.

FRANCE: Thank you.

BLITZER: Pamela.

BLITZER: All right. Coming up right after the break, we are taking you to Alaska where there's a mad dash to get ready for the Trump- Putin Summit. You're in the Situation Room.

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