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The Situation Room

Robert Redford Dies at 89; Kash Patel Testifies on Capitol Hill; U.S. Kills Three in New Strike Against Alleged "Narco- Terrorists". Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired September 16, 2025 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

ROBERT REDFORD, ACTOR AND DIRECTOR: These are kind of like tears that formed outside of what we were doing. That's fine, that's their business, but it's not who we are.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR (voice over): And his love for the environment continued.

REDFORD: As years went on, I became more and more convinced that nature had played a great role in our lives, but wasn't being treated fairly. And so, I got committed to preserving that.

SIDNEY (voice-over): But he didn't stop acting and directing, and was awarded an honorary Oscar in 2002 for his contributions to filmmaking.

REDFORD: I want to make the most of what I've been given. And you keep pushing yourself forward, you try new things, and that's invigorating. I guess I found out that rather than retiring, that just feels better. Just keep moving as long as you can keep moving.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Robert Redford was 89 years old. I loved his films, loved all of them. May he rest in peace, and may his memory be a blessing. And our special thanks to Sara Sidner for that report. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:35:00]

BLITZER: Happening now, the FBI director, Kash Patel, is testifying up on Capitol Hill as his agency works to uncover more details about the killing of conservative activist Charlie Kirk.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: The suspect, 22-year-old Tyler Robinson, is set to appear in court for the first time today. He is currently held without bail at the Utah County Jail on charges, including aggravated murder, according to officials.

Joining us now to discuss is former FBI Deputy Director and CNN Senior Law Enforcement Analyst Andrew McCabe. Hi, Andrew. So, I want to play what Patel said about the suspect in this case late last night. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KASH PATEL, FBI DIRECTOR: I will say what was found in terms of information, a text message exchange where he, the suspect, specifically stated that he had the opportunity to take out Charlie Kirk and he was going to do that. And when he was asked why, he said some hatred cannot be negotiated with.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So, by Patel's characterization of it, someone else was allegedly engaging with Robinson over text about Robinson's alleged plans to kill Kirk. What could that person's role be in this investigation?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST AND FORMER FBI DEPUTY DIRECTOR: Well, you know, there's a lot of possibilities there, Pam. So, the text itself, and there may be additional texts that we don't know about, but going off of just that text itself that was referred to by Director Patel, isn't specific enough to make the recipient of that message likely, you know, fully knowledgeable enough to be considered a co-conspirator in the attack. Of course, to be a co-conspirator, you have had to have indicated agreement to the attack and taken some sort of overt step. So, we're well short of that at this point. But again, we don't know what other information investigators have.

I should say it's really remarkable that the director actually said that on national television. This is not something I've ever seen any other FBI director do. We know the attorney general has been very clear about not sharing information from the case, from the investigation, because it is classically sensitive investigative information and an ongoing investigation. I'm sure prosecutors aren't happy about the fact that that information was shared. We typically only express information about the case in the form of court filings. So, it's a remarkable departure from a pretty strong policy.

BLITZER: Remarkable indeed. And I want you to take a look at what the attorney general, Pam Bondi, said when asked for details about the suspect. Listen and watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY GENERAL: Yes, I can't talk about details at all. What I can talk about that's public is that the FBI worked long and hard from day one.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: So, Andrew, how do you explain the disparity between what we're hearing from Pam Bondi and Kash Patel? And I should note, the president just expressed his confidence in both of them before boarding Marine One.

MCCABE: Wolf, if it's inexplicable. Pam -- what you saw from Pam Bondi, there is the traditional appropriate course that a senior executive in either the Department of Justice or the FBI would take under such circumstances. The fact that the director keeps going out on social media or on selected news outlets and revealing details from the case, it's inappropriate. It makes the FBI look bad. It's not appreciated by our investigative partners on the ground who should be making those releases themselves. And it possibly puts the prosecution in danger.

So, to be clear, what Kash Patel is doing here is not something you've ever seen from another FBI director. And it's clearly inconsistent with what his attorney general is doing.

BROWN: Yes, just along what you're saying, Andrew, Kash Patel has also been all over the media touting the FBI's role in the manhunt for Charlie Kirk's assassin. Listen to what he said last night about the decision to release the photos and videos of the suspect that did lead to his eventual capture.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATEL: We made -- I made an executive decision on an investigative and operational need, and it turned out to be the right move. So, I made the tough calls.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: It also initially said that there had been some resistance to release that. Governor Cox said that there hadn't been. From your experience as the former acting FBI director, what do you make of the way he's describing this move to release the photos and video?

MCCABE: You know, the language he uses, Pam, is really unfortunate. If you listen to even longer clips of his comments about the case, you hear a lot of the use of the term I.

[10:40:00]

So, it comes off as if he's taking personal responsibility for all these important developments in the case. Even if that's true, and we don't know that it is, but assume for the sake of argument it is true, it's not something that an FBI director, a senior law enforcement, the nation's most senior law enforcement officer, should really ever do. You always defer the accomplishments and the investigation to those men and women who are working it on the ground, to your partners who you're working with.

It's divisive inside the organization. It's bad for morale. It undermines, I think, his credibility and people's confidence in the organization. It's just not a good idea. It's a bad look for him, and it's a bad look for the FBI.

BLITZER: Andrew, President Trump also revealed yesterday that he was considering naming the far-left anti-fascism group, Antifa, as domestic terrorists. Based on the threat landscape, as you understand it, how widespread and dangerous is Antifa? MCCABE: Well, at this point, Wolf, I'm not aware of any direct evidence that ties the acts of this shooter, Tyler Robinson, or any of the mass shooters, school shooters we've seen in the recent past, to any particular national group or organization. What we've seen is a profusion of individuals who have been radicalized for their own personal reasons, who've decided to strike out on their own. We are in the midst of a period of elevated political violence. We've seen this coming.

We saw this coming on January 6th, the largest expression of political violence we've seen in this country in the last 100 years. We've seen it targeted at Republicans. We've seen it targeted at Democrats. So, we definitely have a problem here that needs to be addressed. But kind of dreaming up straw men or false enemies and cloaking them with the -- you know, the label of your political opposition, I don't think it gets us any closer to actually solving this problem.

BLITZER: Andrew McCabe, thank you very, very much. And we have a lot more coming up. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:45:00]

BROWN: Happening now, the U.S. military struck another vessel allegedly transporting illegal narcotics from Venezuela. Right here, you're looking at footage of the strike, which killed three people. This video posted by President Trump on social media shows the boat was traveling in international waters near South America. President Trump added in a post that, quote, "These extremely violent drug trafficking cartels pose a threat to U.S. national security, foreign policy, and vital U.S. interests."

The announcement comes just under two weeks after the U.S. military killed 11 people in a strike allegedly tied to a Venezuelan gang. So, for the latest, we're joined by CNN Senior National Security Reporter Zachary Cohen. Just put it into context why this is significant and what more we're learning about this strike.

ZACHARY COHEN, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, this is the second time in two weeks the U.S. military has conducted a lethal strike against an alleged drug boat in the Caribbean. This -- the first strike was unprecedented by all accounts. You mentioned that it killed 11 suspected traffickers who the administration is painting as narco-terrorists. And that's really key to understanding kind of what the administration is using to justify these strikes. They're tying them to these cartel groups in Venezuela.

But the rub here is that so far, Congress has been demanding to see the evidence, see the proof that links these individuals who have been targeted on these boats to these cartels. And we're told that so far, the Department of Defense has not presented anything that explicitly proves that point.

Now, Donald Trump saying that there was proof in the second strike, especially that these individuals were cartel members, they were trafficking drugs. He pointed, though, to the ship's cargo, claiming that you could see cocaine and fentanyl in the ocean after the blast took place. The video released by the White House does not seem to show anything -- any debris around the boat. So, we'll have to see if there's additional evidence there. But so far, answers are hard to come by.

Now, this is obviously stoking new tensions with Venezuela. And Nicolas Maduro, the president of Venezuela, has really warned his people of a potential looming U.S. invasion. Donald Trump was asked this morning what his message to Maduro is. Take a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: Stop sending Tren de Aragua into the United States. Stop sending drugs into the United States. We knocked off actually three boats, not two, but you saw two.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: So, it's interesting, Donald Trump mentioning that there's a third boat that was also targeted by the U.S. military. We're asking the White House what he meant by that, because so far, only two strikes have been disclosed publicly so far.

BROWN: All right. Zachary Cohen, thanks so much. And coming up right here in the Situation Room, we're going to take you back to Capitol Hill, where FBI Director Kash Patel is testifying after a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:50:00]

BLITZER: Happening now, the FBI Director Kash Patel is still testifying up on Capitol Hill. It's expected to go on for quite a while. Republican Senator Josh Hawley of Missouri is asking him some specific questions on other issues involving the FBI. I want to listen in.

PATEL: We're going to work with our partners to get that shut down permanently.

SEN. CHARLES GRASSLEY (R-IA): Senator Coons.

SEN. CHRIS COONS (D-DE): Thank you, Chairman Grassley. Thank you, Chairman, for calling this hearing. I'm grateful we're continuing, this committee's long tradition of oversight, and in particularly today, oversight of the FBI.

Director Patel, thank you for being here. There's a number of issues I hope that we can speak to. I want to start by reading something you said to me during your confirmation hearing under oath. I have no interest, no desire, and will not, if confirmed, go backwards. There will be no politicization of the FBI. Then you looked me in the eyes and said there will be no retribution actions taken by the FBI should I be confirmed as director. I told you that in your office. I tell you that again today.

I'm concerned that that's not what's happened. That since you took over as director, you've cleaned house or forced out senior leaders across the Bureau, in particular targeting those that worked on investigations of President Trump. The former acting director has just sued you for firing him for political reasons, so did a leader in the D.C. field office. And the well-respected leader of the Salt Lake City office was pushed out last month, leaving that office shorthanded at a particularly difficult time.

[10:55:00]

I'm worried that these actions compromised the Bureau's ability to keep Americans safe. Hundreds of agents have resigned. You are lowering application standards to fill vacancies. You've reassigned large numbers of agents to work on immigration and street crime issues other law enforcement agencies can handle, perhaps more effectively with the FBI. But I'm concerned that this compromises the Bureau's ability to address national security risks, uniquely its capability.

In fact, you've shut down the Office of Integrity and Compliance, which makes sure that agents act in a lawful and ethical way, and reassigned staff away from domestic terrorism investigations exactly at a moment I think we are all concerned about it. I also have to ask, you came before the Appropriations Committee in May and told us you wanted a half-a-billion-dollar budget cut for the FBI, literally an effort to defund the police.

I am grateful for the work of the men and women of the FBI. They've done great work this year in Delaware, partnering with the Dover Police Department to support human trafficking victims, partnering with the Middletown Police Department on armed robbery and carjacking. And it's urgent, I think, that we fix the direction and the prioritization within the FBI. And I wish we could focus on those efforts today. But I'm seeing an FBI leadership more focused on social media clout and on political revenge than on fighting crime.

Director, have you ever ordered that an FBI employee be terminated because he or she worked on an investigation into President Trump?

PATEL: Senator, thank you. One quick correction for the record. There's 280 NV investigations. I gave the incorrect number to Senator Hawley. Thank you.

COONS: Understood.

PATEL: As far as a lot of your statement, I disagree with it, and I'm happy to address it. But the only way, generally speaking, an individual is terminated at the FBI is if they have violated their oath of office, violated the law, or failed to uphold the standards that we need them to have at the FBI.

COONS: So, those who say that they've been fired because of working on investigations into President Trump are lying or misrepresenting?

PATEL: Well, those matters are alleged in litigation, which is ongoing. So, I can't comment on those specifically.

COONS: Could you comment on why you fired former acting FBI Director Driscoll?

PATEL: I can't because it's ongoing litigation.

COONS: Could you say now definitively under oath that the rank-and- file agents who were assigned to work January 6 cases will not be terminated because that's what they were assigned to do?

PATEL: I've said it before and I've said it again, your case assignment, as I was given case assignments when I was a young prosecutor, does not dictate your career or your termination.

COONS: Thank you. Then let me go to the appropriations question in May --

BROWN: We're hearing this exchange between Senator Coons, Democratic Senator, and FBI Director Kash Patel. You heard there Senator Coons pressing him on whether he has fired anyone from the FBI for political reasons for formally investigating President Trump. He denied that but also noted the ongoing litigation, this lawsuit that was brought by three former FBI senior agents who claimed that they were fired for political reasons.

This testimony is ongoing on Capitol Hill and we'll continue to monitor. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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