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Crews Search for More Attack Victims in Fire-Ravaged Church; Trump Moves to Federalize Oregon National Guard in Portland; Congressional Leaders Negotiate as Government Shutdown Looms. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired September 29, 2025 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, deadly church attack, what investigators are now learning about the gunman as authorities are searching through the burned out building for yet more victims. New video into The Situation Room showing the attacker's truck.

Plus, shutdown showdown, last-minute negotiations to try to fund the federal government, an urgent meeting over at the White House amid an ugly messaging war with tens of thousands of federal employees all caught in the middle right now. Why this brewing shutdown is different.

And later escalating crackdown, President Trump is ramping up federal law enforcement presence in more American cities. Officials in those areas are now responding.

Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer. Pamela Brown is off today, and you're in The Situation Room.

Happening now, crews in Grand Blanc, Michigan, a township in Michigan, are sifting through the charred ruins of a church. They're looking for possibly more victims of yesterday's truly horrific attack. Hundreds of people were worshiping inside the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints when a man slammed his truck into the building. He then opened fire and intentionally set the church ablaze. At least four people are dead and eight others wounded.

This is brand new video just coming into The Situation Room showing the burned out church just 24 hours after the attack. This morning, the White House press secretary had this to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: And I spoke with our FBI director, Kash Patel, bright and early this morning. He assured me and the American public that the FBI is currently executing multiple search warrants at the residences and the family homes of this perpetrator to try to get to the bottom of why he would commit such an act of evil. And the FBI is working with both state and local law enforcement providing the full support of the federal government.

From what I understand based on my conversations with the FBI director, all they know right now is this was an individual who hated people of the Mormon faith. And they are trying to understand more about this, how premeditated it was, how much planning went into it, whether he left a note. All of those questions have yet to be answered but certainly will be answered by the FBI.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Investigators identify the gunman as Thomas Jacob Sanford, a 40-year-old former Marine from a nearby town. He died in a gunfight with police. Witnesses describe the horror of the attack. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I didn't know what was going on. I didn't know what was going on and I didn't know if we were going to have to get down because we couldn't see anybody.

To worship my savior, Jesus Christ, and I didn't expect this to happen, of course.

And I've lost friends in there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm completely distraught.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This was a quiet neighborhood, you know? We've never seen anything like this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: All right. Let's go live right now to CNN Correspondent Leigh Waldman. She's in Grand Blanc Township in Michigan. Leigh, what are you learning this morning?

LEIGH WALDMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, if the investigation into the motive behind this attack is still ongoing. We're expecting a press conference from law enforcement officials at some point this morning, but we were able to move now closer to where the scene is. There's a car over here that has bullet holes.

But what we can now see is the church itself. I'll move out of the way so you have a better picture. You can see the charred remains of that church itself. You can smell it from where we are. But we've seen FBI agents, ATF agents, people who appear to be in hazmat gear with shovels digging through those ruins. We know there was ongoing search efforts overnight that had to be suspended when things got dark, but this is a part of the efforts happening to search for seven possibly unaccounted for people inside of that church. We know hundreds of people were inside as the church was set on fire after that gunman crashed the front doors and started shooting at people.

We spoke to a neighbor, Wolf, who's just down the street about this tragedy. Take a listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEFF CARYL, GRAND BLANC TOWNSHIP RESIDENT: We kept talking about why do shooters pick on schools, why do they pick on churches?

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And, you know, it was like because they're soft targets. But it just doesn't make sense. You know, if you're a good human being, you don't pick on churches and schools. And it's just disturbing to tie all that together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALDMAN: The neighbors we see here keep talking about how utterly disturbing this is, and it's why it's so important to get a motive behind this attack, why the FBI is leading this investigation and what they're calling an act of targeted violence here. Wolf?

BLITZER: The White House press secretary saying the FBI believes the gunman hated people of the Mormon faith. Talk a little bit about what you're hearing on that issue.

WALDMAN: Wolf. I'm glad you brought that up because we spoke to a man named Chris. He's running for city council in the community of Burton. That's where this alleged shooter lived. And when my conversation with him, he actually spoke with that shooter just a week ago, and he said it was a cordial conversation, nothing political, but then the gunman himself brought up his thoughts on guns and asked about his views on the Latter Day Saints community itself.

We're speaking with him more later on today, but he said it was the gunman who changed the conversation almost immediately. But none of the conversation raised a red flag for this potential city councilman. He said he didn't feel like he needed to report anything but now looking back what happened less than a week after that conversation, he said he's truly shocked and heartbroken for what happened here.

BLITZER: It is truly shocking. There's no doubt about that.

Leigh Waldman, thank you very much. We'll stay in close touch with you.

The Trump administration, meanwhile, is gearing up to send U.S. National Guard troops into more cities this week. President Trump says he's directing the U.S. Defense Department to, quote, war-ravaged Portland to protect ICE facilities there. The city joined the state of Oregon to sue the Trump administration claiming it overreached its mandate in response to protests.

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GOV. TINA KOTEK (D-OR): Portland's doing just fine. And I made that very clear to the president.

He thinks there are elements here that create an insurrection. I told him there is no insurrection here and that we have this under control. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Plus, a new federal task force is expected in Memphis, which has seen high numbers of violent crimes in recent years. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. BILL LEE (R-TN): There will be members of these 13 law enforcement agencies beginning Monday. I can't tell you who's coming Monday, who's coming Tuesday, how many they're coming.

And we'll see a ramp up of those resources over the next weeks.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: This comes also as law enforcement officials in Chicago repeatedly used chemical agents against the crowd of protesters outside an ICE building there on Friday. President Trump has repeatedly threatened descend U.S. National Guard troops to Chicago but is yet to follow through on that commitment.

Happening now, a dual threat in the Atlantic. Right now, hurricane Humberto and Tropical Storm Imelda are spinning off the southeastern coast of the United States. You can see them at the top of your screen. And this is new video just coming in from hurricane hunters as they flew into Imelda to gather critical data for the National Hurricane Center.

Let's go live right now to CNN Meteorologist Derek Van Dam over at the Weather Center for us. Derek, these storms aren't expected to make landfall in the U.S. but they could still pose a very, very serious threat to people all along the East Coast.

DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes, you're right. So, even though we do have a riptide threat, large swells, and even some gusty winds and showers across the coastline of Florida, Georgia, and the Carolinas, this is about as best of a forecast as we can imagine considering that the strength of Humberto well to the east of Imelda has actually caused a pathway for Imelda to exit stage right in bringing the direct impacts to the Southeastern United States. So, this is about as best case scenario as we can imagine with the system exiting very quickly to the north and east.

There will be gusty winds and notice the direction, a northeasterly direction. So, that is kind of a cross shore flow. So, the potential for some coastal erosion or coastal flooding is certainly a possibility, especially in some of those exposed areas. But we're not anticipating the winds to even get to tropical storm force across the Southeast U.S. coastline, certainly some rainfall locally one to two inches. But we have averted the direct impacts from Imelda, so good news. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right. Derek Van Dam, our meteorologist, thank you very much. We'll stand on top of this story.

Also happening now, last-minute negotiations as a government shutdown looms. Congress has until midnight tomorrow to agree on a funding deal. Today, top Congressional leaders will head over to the White House to meet with President Trump.

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Both parties are blaming each other as they dig in on their demands.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): Chuck Schumer came back with a long laundry list of partisan demands that don't fit into this process, and he's going to try to shut the government down. The president wants to talk with him about that and say, please don't do that.

KRISTEN WELKER, NBC NEWS HOST: Is the government going to shut down this week, Leader Thune?

SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD): Totally up to the Democrats. This is -- the ball is in their court.

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): We've made clear that we are ready, willing, and able to sit down with anyone at any time and at any place in order to make sure that we can actually fund the government, avoid a painful Republican-caused shutdown and address the healthcare crisis that Republicans have caused that's impacting everyday Americans.

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BLITZER: All right. Let's go live right now to CNN's Chief Congressional Correspondent up on Capitol Hill Manu Raju. What do -- the negotiations, where do they stand right now, Manu?

MANU RAJU, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, there actually are no negotiations, which is why there's so much concern about a potential government shutdown, a potentially prolonged government shutdown, because the two sides have completely opposite positions as they head into this critical meeting this afternoon at the White House, which potentially could lead to some sort of resolution or could only deepen the standoff.

And the standoff is because Republicans are calling for a straight extension of government funding for the next seven weeks up until November 21st. They don't want to add on any additional provisions. Democrats do. They are demanding changes signature domestic policy achievement of President Trump, the One Big, Beautiful Bill Act that included cuts to the Medicaid program. They want those cuts reversed.

They also want to extend expiring subsidies under Obamacare. Those are set to expire at year's end. They want to get that included as part of it. And they also want to have language in their dealing with how Trump has moved ahead and cut federal spending without the consent of Congress. All of those are nonstarters for Republicans who say, let's keep the government open now and negotiate later.

Democrats have significant leverage in this process. It requires 60 votes in the United States Senate to pass anything, meaning, Wolf, seven Democrats at least would be needed to pass something, giving Chuck Schumer significant leverage here. And, Wolf, there is a shutdown, it could be painful. Just in the Department of Education alone, there could be up to 1,500 employees furloughed out of the 1,700 employees in that department. That's just one agency. And the White House is warning of mass firings as well to federal agencies. So, a lot of concerns about this moment in Washington, Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, there are so many federal employees here in the Washington, D.C., area, suburban Virginia, suburban Maryland, and you can just feel it speaking to people as you walk around going to a supermarket and people come up to you and start talking about their concerns, they're going to be losing their jobs.

The GOP margin, as you know, in a related matter, Manu, is narrowing in Congress after a special election in Arizona just last week. But she hasn't been sworn in yet, the new elected official. What can you tell us?

RAJU: Yes. That's Adelita Grijalva who have won that special election to fill her late father's seat in the House of Representatives. When she is sworn in, there would be -- Speaker Mike Johnson can only afford to lose two Republican votes on any straight party line vote. But she has not been sworn in yet in large part because the House is not in session and they won't be in session until -- it's unclear when because of this government shutdown standoff that is happening right now.

But the speaker's office did put out a statement giving us a statement earlier this morning about what is going on here. A spokesperson said, as a standard practice with the House now having received the appropriate paperwork from the state, the speaker's office intends to schedule a swearing in for the representative-elect when the House returns to session. And when that happens, Wolf, she will be the 218th signature on an effort to force a vote on the full House to call for the release of all of the Epstein files, which means that that could pass the House potentially by mid-October, but that would head over to the Senate where it has an uphill climb for that bill to pass.

BLITZER: All right. Manu Raju watching all of this up on Capitol Hill, thank you very much.

Other news, a new twist in the New York City mayoral race, as Eric Adams, the mayor, ends his reelection bid. His exit stems from bad polling numbers and a spate of corruption scandals, which his campaign says made it very difficult to raise funding.

Here's part of his announcement.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR ERIC ADAMS (D-NEW YORK CITY, NY): I cannot continue my reelection campaign. The constant media speculation about my future and the campaign finance board's decision to withhold millions of dollars have undermined my ability to raise the funds needed for a serious campaign.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Big story, indeed.

Let's go live right now to CNN correspondent Gloria Pazmino. She's in New York for us. Gloria, what are you hearing from the candidates still in the race?

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GLORIA PAZMINO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Oh, well, Wolf, the big question now is how this is going to affect the field. Andrew Cuomo's senior aides have told me in the last few hours that they are hoping this is going to breathe much needed life into their struggling campaign. They are hoping that some of Eric Adams' support will shift to the Cuomo campaign.

But the reason polling does not necessarily suggest that that is likely to happen, you see there, Andrew Cuomo is polling behind Democratic Mayoral Nominee Zohran Mamdani, but there's still a Republican candidate, Curtis Sliwa, who is in this race. So, we'll see whether or not Cuomo can actually make up any ground.

In the meantime, Zohran Mamdani saying that this just confirms what he has been saying for months, that Cuomo is Trump's chosen candidate. And so we are seeing him now kind of shift his messaging to focus on Trump and his alleged involvement in this race. We are expecting to hear from Mamdani later today as well as from the former governor. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right. Gloria Pazmino watching the mayoral race in New York, thank you.

Also happening now, President Trump is preparing to meet with the Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, at the White House during the next hour. This meeting is critical because the president says a deal to end the war in Gaza to free the hostages is close. That's what he says. But he needs Prime Minister Netanya clearly to sign on.

Let's go live right now to CNN White House Reporter Alayna Treene. Alayna, what's the president's message to Netanyahu?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Look, Wolf, it's clear from my conversations with people here at the White House that they are really hoping that he gets on board with this 21-point peace plan that the president laid out to various Arab leaders last week at the U.N. General Assembly.

Netanyahu is expected to arrive shortly for a bilateral meeting with the president, but I think what is the most striking is going to be that press conference where the two are going to stand side by side this afternoon.

I pressed the White House press secretary, Karoline Leavitt, on whether the expectation is that they will announce that this deal has been struck during that press conference. Listen to what she told me.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: The fact that there is a press conference today with the Israeli prime minister, it signals, I think, that he's expecting there to be a deal announced, or at least that Netanyahu's going to accept the proposed plan. Is that the hope that the president has today?

LEAVITT: Look, the president knows and believes that this is as good of a plan as these sides are going to see. And that's why it's 21 points. It's very detailed. It's comprehensive.

TREENE: Is the expectation though that the Israeli prime minister is going to sign it today or, or agree to it?

LEAVITT: The president believes strongly in this plan, and he wants this to be the plan, and he wants this war to come to an end.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: So, clearly, the White House kind of raising expectations now for what we are going to see today. But, really, I think the key thing is what are they going to hash out behind closed doors, because we have heard, Wolf, from Israeli officials that Netanyahu still has reservations and wants to push for some changes. So, stay tuned for all of that.

BLITZER: We will certainly stay tuned.

Alayna Treene at the White House for us, Alayna, thank you.

Still ahead, Dolly Parton is postponing concerts until next year. What the star is now saying about the fate of her residency in Las Vegas.

And Democratic Congressman Steve Cohen, who represents Memphis, standing by to join us in The Situation Room, as the city anticipates the arrival of U.S. National Guard troops,

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BLITZER: As President Trump prepares to send U.S. National Guard troops into more American cities, Tennessee's governor says he expects to see arrivals as early as today.

I'm joined now by Democratic Congressman Steve Cohen from Tennessee. He's a key member of the Judiciary Committee.

The Tennessee governor, Bill Lee, says crime in Memphis will be quote, a story of the past. How do you respond to this claim that the National Guard is needed to combat crime in your beautiful city of Memphis?

REP. STEVE COHEN (D-TN): Well, first of all, we'll thank you for saying how our city's beautiful. It is beautiful and it's a great cultural city that's historic in America. The police department has done a great job and the city mayor of bringing crime down. It's down to just low levels and come down tremendously in the last year. It doesn't hurt to have some extra law enforcement help, like the FBI, having some more forces here. They used to have a main station here, a post, they took it to national. We kind of have a splinter station, but they'll have a few more men here, men and women, and maybe even the DEA and the Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms.

But we don't need the National Guard that gives an image of a city that is as Trump called it I don't want to say what he called it. The city's not hurting and it's not big, bad problem because we do have a high crime, but it's coming down. Anything that could help come down is encouraged and it'll be helpful. But the National Guard's not going to make the difference, and it might even hurt the city's image, which is strong for tourism and for economic growth. We are concerned about that.

And the National Guard has not done -- didn't really make that much difference in D.C. 40 percent of the arrest in D.C. were for immigration. ICE followed the FBI into Washington. I hope ICE doesn't follow the FBI into Memphis because we don't need people that are working here helping us in our tourist industry and construction jobs and hospitality jobs and, and agriculture even taken out of our community who are not causing problems.

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And that's what's happened.

I've written to Kristi Noem several times saying you're the worst of the worst and you pick up some of the finest citizens and most productive citizens in our communities and deport them. We don't need that. So, we're concerned about ICE coming in following the Guard. We just hope the guard does kind of what they did in D.C., which is some work with light and some things that can help clean up the city and maybe, and support the police, and they seem to be working well, the governor and the mayor working together.

BLITZER: Congressman, according to the most recent review of FBI data, Memphis had the highest violent crime rate last year among U.S. cities where the population over 250,000. Given that, why shouldn't the city welcome help in reducing violent crime, and what kind of help does the city need?

COHEN: Well, I think the city and the mayor have said they welcome anything that can help them. That was last year's rates. The last year's rates were awful, and we've done a lot since then. And part of it has been a project where more FBI and other federal law enforcement people came into town during the summer.

But what we need is long-term solutions. We need more mental health areas and centers in the city. Mental health's a large problem. Crime is related to poverty, and we need jobs and we need economic activity. The administration just closed a minority business center that helped people get loans and go into business. That was a mistake. Their education needs to be improved and we need help with our education system of needs more money there. The long-term solutions in both D.C. and Memphis and other cities is in healthcare, it's in mental health, it's in education, it's in business opportunities and economic development, and we're not seeing those at all. And they're just going for the kind of like the hard hand that might do some good in a few weeks or a month, I don't know, and I'm not sure what they'll be doing.

Washington is certainly not that much change from what it was three months ago or six months ago. The endemic problems are still there and have not been dealt with. And, in fact, a billion dollars that the federal government, OTC has not been allowed to go to D.C, which would help them hire more policemen, which we need more policemen also, more people on patrol who help them with their education problems, that'll help them with other situations.

BLITZER: Democratic Congressman Steve Cohen, thanks so much for joining us. Good luck to you. Good luck to all the folks in Memphis.

COHEN: Thank you Wolf. We appreciate it and we're a great city.

BLITZER: It is indeed a great city.

Coming up, hundreds of thousands of government employees are watching and waiting as the clock ticks closer and closer to a federal government shutdown. I'll speak to the head of a union for some of these employees as the White House Budget Office threatens mass layoffs if Congress can't make a deal.

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