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The Situation Room

Bondi Testifying Before Senate Judiciary Committee. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired October 07, 2025 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

ALYSE ADAMSON, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: -- attacking a lot of democratic narratives if, you know, that's how they would characterize it, but was unable, and as you said unwilling, to opine on that at all. And what I think what's important to note is that this was supposedly a department that was going to be more transparent. They kept saying they were not going to continue withholding information like the Biden-DOJ did, but here we are, we have a very simple question, what happened to the money?

And the questioner was correct, as the head of the Department of Justice, she would know. And so, I think we should start demanding more answers and asking ourselves, why is she able to answer, as Eliott said, some of those political-type questions with those pivots, but not the really easy, factual questions about important investigations?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST AND FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: No, I think that's right. Now, you know, she could make the argument that this matter has been investigated and it's not my job to talk about it, but there's a relatively straightforward question about, you know, what -- even if you're not addressing the question of Tom Homan's personal legality -- you know, personal culpability there, it's what happened to the money? Like, everybody's in agreement that there was an exchange of money, perhaps it was not unlawful.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: It was an undercover FBI agent gave him $50,000 of cash in a paper bag. That sounds a bit suspicious.

WILLIAMS: And there's -- as of right now, there is no allegation of wrongdoing against Tom Homan. Fine, it's a fair question, separate and distinct from whether he goes to jail or should be accused of anything, where's the money? And she just sort of punted and got away from that.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: And how unusual is it for an attorney general to say, well, you're going to have to ask the FBI director about that?

WILLIAMS: It's not that unusual, but he's -- Senator Whitehouse, who's a former U.S. attorney, is very mindful of the fact the FBI director reports to her. It is -- you know, she is the FBI director's boss. And so, the notion of, well, you can just talk to the FBI director, yes, the FBI director is closer to the facts of that matter, but she's his boss. The buck ought to stop with her, and if someone at the department is capable of answering the question, it is the attorney general.

BLITZER: Are you surprised the questions that Whitehouse was asking about the Jeffrey Epstein case, and if there are pictures of Trump with half-naked women involved with Epstein?

ADAMSON: I thought that was very surprising. That was the first time I had ever heard of that. Of course, we need more facts. If that is true, I think that would be a bombshell revelation, quite frankly. It would also explain why the Department of Justice has been hesitant to release the files, and I think Senator Whitehouse is asking exactly the right questions and, you know, demanding the transparency that the DOJ and Pam Bondi promised to the American people, so I was shocked, and I think that could be very significant.

BROWN: And just to be clear, CNN hasn't verified that.

ADAMSON: If this were actually corroborated.

WILLIAMS: You know, Wolf and Pam, if these hearings weren't so divisive and partisan and contentious right now, one of the most important issues senators could be asking about is this question of eight Republican senators being spied on. If you notice, there's a clear divide on the committee, and the Republicans are digging in on it about politicization at the department, the Democrats are staying away from it, this is actually a potential huge red flag, if in fact it is what is being alleged, and it's an important -- you know, I worked on this committee for two and a half years, it's an important area that they ought to be getting to the bottom of, and I hope that someone can get honest answers about it.

BLITZER: Ellie and Alyse are going to be with us, Pamela, all day as we watch this hearing. We're going to have special coverage throughout the morning. We'll see what else comes up. There's a lot of livelihood. Some of these Democratic senators and Republican senators have very serious questions coming up. We'll have a special coverage when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:35:00]

BROWN: And we are watching Attorney General Pam Bondi's testimony in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee. She's speaking to Republican Senator John Cornyn of Texas. Let's listen.

PAM BONDI, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: -- into this country without any ramification across the Mexican border until Donald Trump became president again. And that's when it stopped.

We are doing everything in our power to find and arrest these people who are exploiting these children and find these children throughout our country. One of those cases, we charged a Guatemalan national unlawfully residing in Cleveland with lying to government because he became the sponsor of a young girl. And of course, we found he was later sexually abusing her. That's one of many cases, Senator Cornyn, that I can talk about. And Donald Trump will not rest until all of these sponsors are found and these children are found and protected.

SEN. JOHN CORNYN (R-TX): Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Senator Klobuchar, you're recognized.

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D-MN): Thank you. Attorney General Bondi, good morning. I'm going to start on a different subject --

BONDI: Good morning.

KLOBUCHAR: -- on behalf of families in my state. And I wanted to thank the FBI and the local justice officials in Minnesota, the U.S. Attorney's Office, for the work that they did catching the murder and the horrific murder of my friend, Speaker Melissa Hortman, and her husband in the shooting of Senator John Hoffman.

Just last month, my state was again shaken to its core when a mass shooter attacked Annunciation Catholic Church in Minnesota, shooting through the stained-glass windows, injuring 21 people, including 18 kids, killing little Fletcher, little Harper, an eight- and a 10-year- old, murdering them when they're in mass, praying, 12-year-olds protecting eight-year-olds.

[10:40:00]

I know we've spoken about these tragedies, and we both agree that this kind of violence, whether in Minnesota or at a Mormon church in Michigan, or the assassination of Charlie Kirk, has no place in our politics or in our democracy.

In 2018, after the Parkland shooting, you were attorney general, and there was a bill called the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School Public Safety Act. And the bill banned bump stocks, enacted red flag laws, and raised the minimum age to purchase a firearm in Florida from 18 to 21. And you actually defended the law in court from a challenge from the NRA. And we know that I'm in favor of an assault weapon ban, period. I look at these bills and I think, does this hurt my Uncle Dick in the deer stand? We have a proud tradition of hunting in Minnesota. I don't think they do.

But as I talked to Director Patel, and he told me in the chair you are sitting in right now, that assault weapon bans could prevent future attacks. I talked to him about better background checks, about red flag laws, and then that perhaps we could find common ground on what actually happened in Florida, which would be to at least change the minimum age for purchasing assault weapons.

Because we've got 18 to 20-year-olds commit gun homicides at over triple the rate of adults 21 years and over, even though that wouldn't have helped in Annunciation Church, because he was a few years older, she was a few years older. But as you know, the shooter at Parkland was 19 years old. And the shooters in Buffalo and Uvalde were both 18 years old. So, given your efforts in Florida, do you agree that at least raising the age for purchasing assault weapons could reduce the number of these shootings?

BONDI: Senator, first, that's pending litigation, and I can't discuss that at all. The 21 is pending litigation. I cannot discuss that.

KLOBUCHAR: In Florida?

BONDI: But if I could go back to --

KLOBUCHAR: I just -- I really need to know this time.

BONDI: -- the 21 age is pending litigation. I can't discuss that. But, Senator, back to what you said about what happened in Minnesota, there is no place for that. And I believe I spoke to you after that horrific, horrific -- those murders. And I'm so sorry that that happened. And all of my federal agencies were partnering with state agencies working hand in hand in Minnesota.

What I can tell you about the Second Amendment is this is a very -- this is the most pro-Second Amendment DOJ in American history, as you know. But we want to keep guns, as you said, where they should be in the hands of law-abiding American citizens, while keeping them out of the hands of criminals and gangs.

Since January 20th, the ATF and FBI have seized more than 30,000 illegal guns.

KLOBUCHAR: I know. You gave the statistics. I really was -- I have 10 minutes.

BONDI: 30,000, Senator Klobuchar.

KLOBUCHAR: You have given these statistics, and I truly appreciate those statistics. But what I was just trying to get at was something where maybe we could find common ground on a bill that you actually defended in court in a state, which Director Patel seemed open to, and that was looking at could we at least raise the age to 21 of the purchase of an assault weapon federally while states look at banning these weapons overall, given these little babies that this gun is used to kill.

So, we can talk about it later, but that was my question, and you don't want to answer it.

BONDI: No, it's pending litigation, Senator.

KLOBUCHAR: OK. It's -- but your views on this is not pending litigation. So, I want to get to the independence of the Justice Department. At your nomination hearing, I specifically asked you to provide assurance to every member of this committee that the Justice Department will only follow the facts and the law, and the White House will play no role in the cases investigated or brought.

You stated in response, this was you, politics will not play a part in my decisions. And you also said, the Justice Department must be independent and must act independently. Do you believe that you have upheld that commitment?

BONDI: I absolutely have upheld that commitment, Senator. I pledged that I would end the weaponization, also, of the Justice Department, and that America would once again have a one-tier system of justice for all. And that is what we are doing in this country.

KLOBUCHAR: We saw this with the president directing an investigation prosecution of Chris Krebs, a former head of cybersecurity, Lisa CoOK. former -- who is a current governor of the Federal Reserve, Director Comey. And the president, and I know you have said that you will not discuss discussions you've had with the president about Comey. Is that correct, that you won't testify here about that?

[10:45:00]

Because I was going to ask you if you received advice, instruction, or requests from anyone at the White House to direct the department to engage in any investigations, prosecutorial actions, including decisions not to investigate or prosecute anyone. I'm not going to discuss any conversations.

KLOBUCHAR: OK. But then how about the Truth Social post on September 20, 2025, in which the president said, we can't delay any longer, Pam, using your name, not bringing criminal charges, or killing our reputation, his words, and credibility. And then, goes on to tell you to prosecute a member of this committee, to prosecute the attorney general of New York, and to prosecute James Comey. Do you consider that a directive to the Justice Department?

BONDI: Senator Klobuchar, President Trump is the most transparent president in American history. And I don't think he said anything that he hasn't said for years.

KLOBUCHAR: OK. It has been reported that you initially pushed back against requests by senior Trump administration officials to push out or fire the acting U.S. attorney in Virginia, Erik Siebert, who's a conservative Republican, who made the decision that Comey -- that the evidence was not there to prosecute Comey. What made you change your opinion?

BONDI: I am not going to discuss personnel decisions.

KLOBUCHAR: OK. Is it true that the career prosecutors in the Eastern District of Virginia found that there was insufficient evidence to bring criminal charges against former Director Comey?

BONDI: I am not going to discuss pending cases because Comey was indicted in the Eastern District of Virginia by, I may point out, one of the most liberal grand juries in the country.

KLOBUCHAR: OK. Let's go on to other firings or terminations. Last week, the Justice Department fired at least two senior attorneys in the Eastern District of Virginia, including the office's National Security Chief, Michael Ben'Ary. It is reported that his firing came following criticism from a right-wing social media commentator who wrote one can only assume he was part of the internal resistance in the Comey indictment. In fact, he did not work on the Comey case. Instead, he was working on pursuing justice for service members killed in Afghanistan. How does firing a 20-year national security prosecutor enhance public safety?

BONDI: Senator Klobuchar, I'm not going to discuss personnel decisions, but the personnel issue that I'm having right now is that all of my agents, all of my lawyers are working. My agents are on the street working without a paycheck because your party voted to shut down the federal government.

KLOBUCHAR: Unfortunately, the House isn't even back here. They're 18 days off the job to even meet with us to come up with a resolution that we would like to discuss with them about saving people's health care.

Let's move on to the Antitrust Division. Did you authorize your chief of staff to overrule top officials in the Antitrust Division to settle the challenge to the Hewlett Packard Enterprises Juniper Networks merger?

BONDI: Senator Gail Slater runs my Antitrust Unit, and she is doing an excellent job on many, many cases. As you know, that is a pending case.

KLOBUCHAR: OK.

BONDI: In any merger -- just to clarify, in any merger, Senator, there is a deal struck with our office and with the corporations involved, but then that also goes to a court to certify. In any merger, in any merger. It's a multi-step process. And that process --

KLOBUCHAR: OK. I will ask some further questions about Antitrust. I just had one other thing. DOJ --

BLITZER: All right. We're going to continue to monitor this important Senate Judiciary Committee hearing. I want to go to our senior justice correspondent, Evan Perez. He's been watching, he's been listening. So, far, what has jumped out at you, Evan?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, I think we -- you know, you can see the attorney general is really ready with any criticism that she gets from the Democrats. She's refusing to answer questions about some of the internal decision-making, for instance, the decision to pursue charges against James Comey, the former FBI director, despite the fact that prosecutors inside that office in Eastern District of Virginia said that there wasn't enough evidence. And then, she's also ready to push back at any Democratic criticism by pointing out that what she says is the blame for the current government shutdown, which she puts at the feet of the Democrats.

One of the things that I think you're going to see emerge from this hearing, we're still only nearly at the start, really, that we expect this to go several more hours.

[10:50:00]

But you're seeing the theme of weaponization, right, which is a tale of two different hearings. Republicans want to talk about the investigations into former -- into President Trump and the revelation that there were phone records taken of some of the members of this committee. Democrats want to talk about the prosecutions of Comey and other people who are enemies of President Trump. So, that's the theme that we'll see unfurl over the next few hours.

BLITZER: A quick question, Evan. What's the justification for her refusing to say whether she personally believes that assault weapons should be available only for people 21 and older and not 18 right now?

PEREZ: Yes, I think that's a very interesting one. Clearly, she believed that that was a legal move back when she was the attorney general in Florida, Wolf. And now, she is reluctant to say, it's clear, because they've gotten a lot of criticism from gun rights groups. And I think the politics of that issue have changed since she was in Florida and taking that role.

So, I think that's one of the reasons why you're seeing her stay away from that and she's reinforcing the idea that this administration is very pro-Second Amendment. You're not going to get her off of that one, I don't think, because obviously the politics have changed on that issue in the last few years. Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, good point. Evan, don't go too far away. We'll get back to you. Pamela, we're watching this very closely.

BROWN: That's right, we are watching this. We're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:55:00]

BROWN: All right. Attorney General Pam Bondi, is testifying before the Senate Judiciary Committee. Let's listen in.

BONDI: It's going to stop because he has secured our borders, Senator Lee.

SEN. MIKE LEE (R-UT): And we're very grateful for that effort. It's interesting to note, moreover, that under the leadership of your predecessor, the Department of Justice, the FBI, and others who routinely appear before this committee, when asked about the human smuggling operation going on across our southern border, routinely denied that fentanyl was coming in in significant quantities through the human trafficking operation. They stated, never with any evidence, never with any ability to back it up, to prove this was the case, that these things were coming across the ports -- points of entry through vehicles, through trucks, and otherwise. We know that not to be true, and we appreciate your work in exposing that.

Now, in recent months, going along with this law enforcement effort, there's been a disturbing trend. It's a disturbing trend that seems to be on the increase in recent days and weeks. That is a rise of violence directed at federal law enforcement officers engaged in immigration-related arrests, including direct physical threats, organized riots outside of detention facilities, and most tragically of late, a fatal shooting targeting an ICE facility in Dallas.

Then just yesterday, it was reported that a cartel member in Chicago put a bounty, that's right, a bounty, out there offering $2,000 on information about any ICE officer and $10,000 for those who kill an ICE officer. Now, keep in mind, this information is not for kicks and giggles. It is not for a game of trivial pursuit. That information, for which the cartel member would pay $2,000 is there so that others can kill an ICE officer and get $10,000. That's what that is.

Can you discuss what protections are essential to ensuring the safety of ICE officers and their families and why requirements to display personal information and prohibiting them from ever wearing any kind of covering would represent a totally unacceptable, indefensible risk to their public safety?

BONDI: Senator Lee, our federal agents have been doxxed, and many of you know what that means. It has happened to you on both sides of the aisle. Our federal agents' lives have been threatened. We fought -- well, we spoke with Apple and Google to get the ICE block app taken down. That was reckless and criminal in that people were posting where ICE officers lived. We worked with both Apple and Google to take that down. Threatening the lives --

LEE: It's stunning, I would add here, that it took as much work as it did by you to get them to take that down. Remember, in the days following January 6th, they took down all kinds of things, including a social media app called Parlor, based on a very thin evidence that was later (INAUDIBLE) rebutted, suggesting that people had been manipulating Parlor in order to plan the January 6th attack.

That wasn't true and they took it down. It's -- I'm glad they have taken this block ICE app, but it's a shame that it took as long as it did and as much on your part to get them to take it down.

BONDI: I will they you, they were cooperative. And to correct myself, it was where they were going, the jobs they were doing. And that's what's been happening because hundreds of organized rioters, Senator Lee, are showing up where our ICE officers are. And as you know, they have fireworks, they have gasmask, you know, they don't want our officers to be protected from -- with their identity, yet they're wearing gasmasks, they're wearing goggles. And they're ramming cars --

LEE: So, it's OK for them to be safe --

[11:00:00]