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Sources: FBI Foiled Potential "ISIS-Style" Terrorist Attack; Trump Urges Republicans To Go "Nuclear" And Kill Filibuster; "Hell On Earth": Hurricane Devastates Black River, Jamaica. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired October 31, 2025 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:08]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news. Terror attack thwarted. The FBI director announcing agents have stopped a potential Halloween weekend terror attack in Michigan. Multiple people allegedly connected to the plot are now in custody. We have the latest on the investigation.

Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Pamela Brown. Wolf Blitzer is on assignment. And you're in The Situation Room.

And we begin this hour with that breaking news. The FBI says it has stopped a possible violent terrorist attack that sources are describing as ISIS inspired. According to officials, the plot unfolded in chat rooms online with an undercover FBI agent being included in the conversation. Posting on Twitter earlier, Director Kash Patel wrote, this morning, the FBI thwarted a potential terrorist attack and arrested multiple subjects in Michigan who were allegedly plotting a violent attack over the Halloween weekend.

Two people have been arrested, three others are being questioned and their ages range from 16 to 20s. Agents became concerned that the plot might have been imminent around Halloween weekend when a reference to pumpkin day came up in the chat group.

I want to bring in Andrew McCabe, CNN senior law enforcement analyst and former deputy director of the FBI to better understand this. What is your reaction to this news? And what does ISIS inspired suggest to you, Andy?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, ISIS inspired is the, you know, that's the moniker that our counterterrorism professionals, the FBI and other agencies are most concerned about, right? We saw that very recently in the January 1st attack this year, the individual who attacked the crowds, excuse me, in New Orleans, Louisiana, same thing there, ISIS inspired.

So it's very serious. It indicates, you know, a desire to inflict mass casualties. My reaction to this, Pam, is I'm just thrilled that the FBI is still doing this kind of very delicate, very hard work, finding these individuals wherever they are congregating, whether that's online or in -- in the real world and doing what's necessary to make an assessment of whether or not this is just talk or if it's -- if it's been elevated to the level of an actual conspiracy to take action and hurt people. It's good -- it's great work.

BROWN: Yes. Help us better understand that, how the FBI makes that determination. If an FBI agent's in a chat room and they're talking about a plot and then use references like pumpkin day around the holiday weekend, how do you make the determination that they're -- they're close to being operational versus just chatting in a chat room and throwing stuff out there?

MCCABE: Sure. So I think it's important to -- to note that the FBI investigates individuals. They don't investigate locations, either online locations, chat rooms, or -- or other physical places. So when your -- your investigation of people takes you into one of these, you know, it -- it enables you to establish like a surveillance or intelligence collection opportunity in one of these chats, then the focus becomes on two points. It's intent and capability.

So you're listening to that chat. You -- you are trying to assess, do these people intend to actually harm others? And do they have the capability to do so? So you're looking for mentions of things like preparation, like the acquisition of weapons or of precursor chemicals. Now, I'm not -- we don't know what they had in this situation, but I'm just speaking hypothetically.

Those are the sorts of things that you look for. Using an online undercover, which apparently they did here, according to some of our sources, is one of the best ways to do that. You have to have someone in that conversation who can monitor it and to make those real-time assessments as to intent and capability.

BROWN: So you have an FBI agent in the chat room, according to our sources. Tell us what other FBI resources would be used in this case if you're really concerned that there could be an imminent terrorist attack. You would surveil and do other things to -- to try to find these people and track their movements, right?

MCCABE: Absolutely. Yes. So you first want to identify them. That can be very tough. If the people you're dealing with are using only monikers, not their real names, things like that. So there's a lot of behind the scenes work by some analysts and other investigators to peel back the actual identities and locations of these people. Then you want to do physical surveillance that can help you determine whether these people are actually capable of doing some of the things they're doing.

In many cases, if you have the time to work with, you want to try to take that online interaction that you have between the undercover and the subjects and turn it into a real physical interaction. Ideally, you want the undercover to kind of go with them as they prepare for this event because it's collecting evidence of that preparation. Those are the -- those are the -- the acts that you need to substantiate a conspiracy charge.

[11:04:59]

But in some cases, if it seems so imminent, as apparently was the case here, you don't have the luxury of that time and you have to step in and disrupt the plot before it can take place. That can put a lot of pressure on your prosecution because you may not have had the opportunity to collect the really exquisite evidence that will -- will seal the case.

But we'll have to see as they -- as these folks get presented and we see what the indictments allege and what sort of evidence is referred to there, we can make a better judgment as to how strong the cases are.

BROWN: Yes, we -- we are waiting for more information. That's for sure. Andrew McCabe, thank you so much.

MCCABE: Thanks.

BROWN: Happening now, President Trump wants to go nuclear to end the ongoing government shutdown. In a post on social media, Trump called on Senate Republicans to end the filibuster, allowing the GOP majority to bypass Democrats and reopen the federal government after a month- long standoff.

Let's go live now to CNN's Kevin Liptak at the White House. So, Kevin, the President had been overseas in Asia. Now he's back making this extraordinary demand. Does there seem to be much appetite for this among Republicans on Capitol Hill?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: There traditionally has not been. And they -- there's a reason they call this the nuclear option. It's viewed as a last resort, even by those in the majority, and it would have the effect of essentially incinerating precedent in the Senate.

But President Trump says he's thought a lot about this. He says he was thinking about it on that lengthy flight back from Asia, where he says people kept asking him why the U.S. government remains closed. And now he says it is time for Republicans to play their, quote, Trump card and go for what is called the nuclear option, get rid of the filibuster and get rid of it now.

The President goes on to say, now we are in power, and if we did what we should be doing, it would immediately end this ridiculous, country- destroying shutdown. Now, the timing of this, I think, is significant. There had been sort of glimmers of hope that these negotiations between Republicans and Democrats were progressing, although, to be sure, a deal now still seems relatively out of reach.

But it was just this month that the Senate Majority Leader John Thune, a close ally of President Trump's, was dismissing calls to get rid of the filibuster. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD), MAJORITY LEADER: There's -- there's always pressure on the filibuster, sure, yes. I mean, you know, you -- you -- there are folks out there who think that that is the way we ought to do things around here, simple majority. But I can tell you that the filibuster, through the years, has been something that's been a bulwark against a lot of really bad things happening to the country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LIPTAK: Now, at the time, Thune said that he was receiving no pressure from the White House or President Trump to get rid of that 60-vote threshold. Obviously, now that has changed. You know, President Trump isn't the first President to call for changes to the filibuster. Remember, President Biden called for a carve-out to pass legislation related to voting rights and abortion rights, but he was stymied by members of his own party.

Now, we are getting a better window into who Americans are blaming for this shutdown. A "Washington Post" poll out today found 45 percent of Americans blamed Trump and the Republicans versus 33 percent who blamed Democrats. That's sort of narrowing from a month ago. Now, the Senate will be back on Monday evening. They are now butting up against the longest shutdown in history. That lasted 35 days. Pamela?

BROWN: Right. And the reality is, tomorrow, tens of millions of Americans are set to lose their food stamps as a result of this shutdown. Is the White House saying anything on that front?

LIPTAK: Well, the White House says that there's nothing, essentially, that they can do to allow some of that nutrition assistance to go out the door. What they are focusing on is the problems that have now begun to plague the aviation system at airports, air traffic controllers, TSA agents, all of these issues that are causing delays on the ground for passengers. We saw yesterday J.D. Vance meeting with airline executives to try and put pressure on Democrats to end the shutdown by passing a clean funding extension.

When it comes to those food programs, they, too, are blaming Democrats for that, but insisting that there is nothing they can do to allow that money to go out the door.

BROWN: All right. Kevin Liptak, live for us at the White House, thank you so much.

[11:09:21]

Still ahead, critical health alert, an alarming new study linking COVID, pregnancy and autism. We're going to take a deep dive in this study with Dr. Natalie Crawford coming up later in the show. You're in The Situation Room.

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BROWN: Emergency crews are slowly making their way into areas of Jamaica devastated by Hurricane Melissa. The storm is blamed for at least 49 deaths across the Caribbean, including two in the coastal Jamaican town of Black River. Survivors call the situation there hell on earth. CNN's meteorologist Derek Van Dam takes a look at the damage.

DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: We are approaching the Black River area, a bridge that we were concerned that had too much damage to drive across, but it looks like cars are traveling at least in. We got to watch out for some of this damage that's just strewn about.

Look at people have their personal belongings on the back of mopeds trying to desperately get out of this area, carrying whatever they can, food, supplies, clothing. It's utter chaos here. And the heat is adding a new level of dimension to this -- this humanitarian disaster that is unfolding. It's very loud.

[11:15:15]

And I just want to show you the bridge here as this massive queue of cars, people carrying food, all the supplies they can to get out of Black River, because this area was hit extremely, extremely hard. Desperation, what once was paradise, has now turned into hell on earth. This is ground zero.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VAN DAM: What's happened to your home?

BRITNEY SAMMS, BLACK RIVER RESIDENT: The storm, everything gone, boarded it, so everything right down, right down.

VAN DAM: Was it the wind or was it the -- the -- the sea?

SAMMS: Everything, everything, sir. Everything. And we are surrounded by water.

VAN DAM: What do you need most at this time?

SAMMS: A roof over our heads, sir. Me and my mother and my grandmother, we don't know what we're going to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAN DAM: There's a supermarket in town that we were told that people are taking supplies off of the shelf. This is a matter of life and death for people. One individual saying that, hey, this isn't looting. This is a matter of survival. People carrying whatever they can to get out of this region.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's paradise, but it's hell on earth as well right now. Six hours. It's frightening. I've never seen anything like this in my life. It was devastating.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAN DAM: The bridge in Black River has become a makeshift shelter. You can see helicopter and the Jamaican Defense Forces flying and surveying the area. This area has become almost a makeshift refugee camp because the people behind me have nowhere to sleep. Their homes were completely decimated by the fury of Hurricane Melissa. They are desperate for water, food, any kind of medical provisions, and they need international aid desperately.

I am CNN meteorologist Derek Van Dam in Black River, Jamaica. Back to you.

BROWN: Such an important message there from Derek Van Dam. Thank you for your excellent reporting.

And up next here in The Situation Room, new battle lines are forming in the nationwide redistricting wars as Democrats and Republicans battle for control of Congress. We're going to break it down, next.

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[11:21:45]

BROWN: Happening now, nearly 42 million Americans are preparing for their food stamp benefits to run dry because of the government shutdown. Today marks the last day of SNAP assistance before this program is out of money, and the situation is getting more dire for the people who rely on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NAJEE KINARD, SNAP BENEFIT RECIPIENT: If we don't receive relief soon, it can put people in desperate situations to make mistakes that they cannot come back from, and that's not OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Joining us now is the woman you just heard there, Najee Kinard. She is a SNAP benefits recipient. So, Najee, how are you and your family doing since we spoke one week ago today and there's still no resolution to the shutdown?

KINARD: Once again, thank you for having me back. It's taking a toll on myself and other individuals. Our families are in the same situation. It's honestly feeling like our food and health care are being put on the line as bargaining chips in this political shutdown.

And me, as a hardworking American, that is totally unacceptable. The people who are in the powers to be or in Congress need to get it together because millions of Americans are being directly affected by this, and we shouldn't have to, especially during this holiday season. So I am totally upset for myself and other individuals and families.

BROWN: You say you're, you know, you're a hardworking American. You and all these other millions don't deserve this. Just so we have a better understanding of what you and so many others are going through, how much money is your regular SNAP benefit and how much are you living on right now?

KINARD: For my regular SNAP benefit allotment, it's about like $300 or $400 a month. And with that, that can go a long way. But however, with the increasing grocery prices due to the tariffs and inflation, it's pretty, well, stressfully thin. And my income varies due to the fact of the work that I do, because without the proper customers with the higher demand, it can affect how much money I tend to make. So for us to be without these benefits is a terrible detriment.

BROWN: What -- what kind of work do you do?

KINARD: Yes, I do freelancing work and also gig work. I do DoorDash and Instacart, anything just to make ends meet to provide for my daughter and myself.

BROWN: And how do you plan to support yourself and your child on -- on that money you just laid out? What are you doing to stretch it?

KINARD: Well, I may have to take some extra freelancing gigs. I may have to stay out in the field a little bit longer, but it does take away from quality time for my daughter. And I'm not the only one who has to make those sacrifices. Of course, as a parent or any other individual that takes care of anyone, if your child may go hungry, you would sacrifice yourself in order to make sure that it will not.

BROWN: And that is true as a parent myself.

KINARD: And also going to --

BROWN: No, you're -- you're absolutely right about that.

KINARD: Go ahead.

BROWN: So tell me more about kind of what you're doing to prepare. Are you seeking out food banks and pantries at this point? Last week that you said that was something you were considering.

KINARD: Yes, I definitely have reached out to quite a few food banks and different organizations to see how can I receive help. But I also want to volunteer with them as well, because I'm not the only person that's going through this. And I want to offer support. And we also need a sense of community as well.

[11:25:15]

BROWN: Just wondering, you know, what -- what is it like in those, you know, sometimes in the middle of night hours, we all wake up and we have anxiety, you know, or just like that feeling of doom. And I'm wondering what that is like for you being in this situation where you're wondering if your basic needs will be met for you and your daughter, what it's like in those overnight hours or waking up in the morning?

KINARD: It can be very heartbreaking, because as a parent, you're doing the best that you can. And a lot of times with this particular government shutdown, it's beyond our control. A lot of these decisions being made are not being considerate of people like myself and other individuals. And it can really keep you up at night, honestly.

BROWN: Najee Kinard, our hearts are with you and so many other Americans who are just feeling so vulnerable right now. Thank you for coming back on the show.

KINARD: Thank you for having me.

BROWN: Well, just ahead, early voting underway and critical races across the country. What they could reveal about how Americans feel about the Republican Party in power.

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