Return to Transcripts main page

The Situation Room

Severe Flu Season?; Francis Scott Key Bridge Collapse Investigation; Interview With Rep. James Clyburn (D-SC). Aired 11:30a- 12p ET

Aired November 18, 2025 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:30:02]

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: These are very dramatic developments unfolding on the -- at the White House right now. We will continue to watch it. We will continue to monitor it.

Sabrina Singh, thank you. Aaron David Miller, thanks to you as well.

We will take a quick break. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Happening now: The House of Representatives is preparing to vote on a bill that would compel the U.S. Justice Department to release all of the Epstein case files, some lawmakers even predicting unanimous support after President Trump's reversal, and dramatic reversal, to now support that legislation.

[11:35:01]

Joining us now, Democratic Congressman James Clyburn of South Carolina. He is also the author of a very important, excellent new book entitled "The First Eight: A Personal History of the Pioneering Black Congressmen Who Shaped a Nation."

Excellent title, excellent book. Congressman, thanks so much for joining us.

I want to get to the book in just a moment or so, but let's talk about the news. We're the cable news network, the news of the day first.

(LAUGHTER)

BLITZER: I want you to watch what Republican Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene said about President Trump at a news conference with Epstein survivors just a little while ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): And he called me a traitor for standing with these women and refusing to take my name off the discharge petition. Let me tell you what a traitor is. A traitor is an American that serves foreign countries and themselves. A patriot is an American that serves the United States of America and

Americans like the women standing behind me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: She really is going after President Trump. What's your reaction to that?

REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D-SC): I was very shocked when I heard it this morning.

But I understand how hurt she is because she was called a traitor. And that's a tough name to be called. And so I am not surprised. She's a very strong woman. I have three pretty strong daughters. I was married for 58 years to a pretty strong woman.

And I can tell you I can respect it.

BLITZER: What do you say to those Republicans who argue that your Democratic Party could have released the Epstein files years ago, when President Biden was in office and Democrats controlled Congress?

CLYBURN: Well, they were going through all kinds of investigations, pretty extensive investigations. We're all aware of that.

And I don't know there was any clamoring for anybody to release these files at that time. Most people thought we'd be going through an ordinary process, and things would go as we expect them to go in these kinds of investigations.

But then the Trump administration came in and closed it down. So nobody closed it down. They did. And so that's where the problem came, when it was closed down. And nobody did that but Trump.

BLITZER: So you blame Trump for the delay?

CLYBURN: Oh, this administration? Absolutely.

BLITZER: Right. All right.

Let's talk a little bit about "The First Eight," your excellent new book, "A Personal History of the Pioneering Black Congressmen Who

Shaped a Nation."

You're the ninth from your state.

CLYBURN: Yes.

BLITZER: Let's talk a little bit about that.

You obviously have had a long and distinguished career beginning with the civil rights movement. Why write this book now?

CLYBURN: Well, I started out doing it because people have been asking me about these pictures on my wall. But then, in the middle of the book, maybe a little beyond the middle,

the 2020 election came, the reaction to those elections, setting up, trying to set up these alternative slate of electors up in Michigan, Pennsylvania, down in Georgia. And I recognized what was happening.

And I said to people around me, look, I know what's going on here. They're trying to get these electors, put this whole Electoral College vote into dispute, get this election into the House of Representatives, which is exactly what they did in 1876.

And that's what led to the demise of Reconstruction, the beginning of Jim Crow. And then I decided to start all over with the book. I was about 75 percent through it. And I started all over because I thought it would be good for people to get a good understanding of the foundation, the history.

And they could see all the similarities. 1876, they were the Red Shirts, today, the red caps. And if you look at the most destructive, let's call it riot in South Carolina, or it was a massacre, really, took place down in Hamburg near Augusta, Georgia, across the line in South Carolina, Aiken.

And it was all about the National Guard. And so you look at all of these things that happened back then and what was beginning to happen here, somebody wrote a script using the 1876 elections and the aftermath in order to implement what has become Project 2025.

BLITZER: All right. So are you worried about the civil rights movement right now in the United States, what's going on?

CLYBURN: Yes, I am, because I'm wondering whether or not people have learned any lessons from this history, which is why I wrote the book the way I did it. If anybody really wants to know exactly what is taking place, this book gives you a script of what is happening.

[11:40:04]

And it also in the book offers up some suggestions and recommendations how to avoid it happening again.

BLITZER: Is there one specific black congressman from South Carolina that you write about that you try to model yourself on?

CLYBURN: No, I'm a combination of several of them.

George Washington Murray, who was number eight. Robert Smalls, everybody knows Robert Smalls. He was number six. The first president of South Carolina state, Thomas E. Miller, who was number seven. And, of course, everybody admires Joseph Rainey, who was number one.

I'm an AME -- Richard Cain, who was an AME pastor, he pastored Emanuel AME Church in Charleston. And there are some things he did with the faith community that I have modeled after.

BLITZER: People will learn a lot about what's happened in South Carolina, but around the country, reading this book. CLYBURN: Absolutely.

BLITZER: I know that your longtime friend and colleague the former Speaker Nancy Pelosi recently announced she plans to retire. You're 85 years old, right?

CLYBURN: Yes.

BLITZER: Are you planning on seeking reelection in 2026 or are you planning on moving on?

CLYBURN: Those plans will be made at Christmas. Since 1972, my family has been meeting on Hilton Head starting a week before Christmas. And we go up to New Year's Day.

During that time, we spend time reflecting on the year, projecting out into the future. And then we make decisions about how we will conduct ourselves. We will make that decision come December.

BLITZER: And when you do, you will come here into THE SITUATION ROOM and we will talk.

(LAUGHTER)

CLYBURN: If you invite me, I will come.

BLITZER: You have been a guest here many, many times.

CLYBURN: Absolutely.

BLITZER: We have worked together many times over the years. And we're always happy when you come into THE SITUATION ROOM.

CLYBURN: Wolf, thank you very much for having me.

BLITZER: And good luck, whatever you decide.

CLYBURN: Appreciate it.

BLITZER: And the book, once again, "The First Eight: A Personal History of the Pioneering Black Congressmen Who Shaped a Nation."

I recommended it highly.

And, as we go to break moments ago, we saw President Trump and the Saudi crown prince walking about just outside the Oval Office, right on the Colonnade. The two men are then headed to their bilateral meeting. We're going to keep our eyes on all of these important developments.

Meantime, more news coming up, including new answers into what caused last year's collapse of Baltimore's Francis Scott Key Bridge that killed six people. What the NTSB founded this investigation, we will update you on that when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [11:46:43]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Well, new this morning, the National Transportation Safety Board has released its findings in the Baltimore bridge disaster probe.

The Francis Scott Key Bridge collapsed in the overnight hours of March 26 of last year after a container ship slammed into a support pillar. Six construction workers on the bridge died.

Let's bring in CNN's Brian Todd at the NTSB headquarters.

What are officials there saying, Brian?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Pamela, they are focusing on a cascading series of events which led to this tragedy, two power blackouts, the failure of an emergency generator and a horrible loosely placed wire that I'm going to get to in just a second.

But, first, at the top of the hearing, the chairwoman of the NTSB, Jennifer Homendy, focused on the sheer and horrible avoidability of this tragedy. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JENNIFER HOMENDY, CHAIR, NATIONAL TRANSPORTATION SAFETY BOARD: The fact is, none of us should be here today. This tragedy should have never occurred. Lives should have never been lost. As with all accidents that we investigate, this was preventable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: Now, more specifically to what could have really specifically caused the power blackouts, one loosely placed, badly connected wire is one thing that they're focusing on in this hearing. This -- there was a label that was put in the wrong place on a signal wire that was connected to a circuit breaker.

We have a diagram that they showed of that wire and how it should have been placed. This label was poorly placed on the wire, kind of at the base of the wire, preventing the wire from being fully connected to the circuit breaker. And that was placed there loosely at the time of the ship was built about 10 years ago.

And they said that caused the first blackout. That loosely placed wire caused the first blackout, which, of course, triggered a series of events, a second blackout and then the failure of the emergency generator. Jennifer Homendy, the NTSB chairwoman, said that this vessel is about as long as the Eiffel Tower is tall and trying to find a loose wire on a ship like this is like trying to find a loose bolt on the Eiffel Tower.

In addition, they showed a harrowing picture of the last vehicles to exit the bridge before impact. And you can see it from the dashcam of one of the vehicles. This is on southbound on the Francis Scott Key Bridge just a few -- a couple of minutes really before the impact. And you can see the vehicles. There's a truck on the left. And you can see the ship as it careens toward the Key Bridge on the right-hand side.

One other thing quickly, Pamela. Officials here said that the six construction workers who were in the middle of the bridge in their cars who died when they fell into the water, they did not receive adequate warning that danger was imminent. They said, if they had been warned at the same time that the police were warned, they could have had about a minute-and-a-half possibly to get off that bridge -- Pamela.

BROWN: Just a cascade all stemming from apparently one loosely placed wire. Oh.

Brian Todd, thank you so much -- Wolf.

BLITZER: And coming up, information you need to know about new health warnings -- why experts now say this flu season could be worse than usual.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:54:46]

BROWN: Well, new this morning, a new strain of flu overseas could hit the U.S. next, and experts for in this flu season could be more severe than usual, at least partly because not enough people are getting vaccinated.

BLITZER: CNN health reporter Jacqueline Howard is joining us right now.

[11:55:01]

Jacqueline, update our viewers. What are you learning?

JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: Wolf and Pam, we know that there's a lot of concern about what this upcoming flu season holds. And scientists are keeping a close eye on a particular mutant strain of the flu called subclade K.

Now, this is a strain that's already been behind early surges of flu in the U.K., Canada, and Japan. And we are seeing some cases here in the United States. And what's adding to this concern is, we also know, here in the United States, fewer people have gotten their flu shot this season compared with last season.

So, we know that, so far, retail pharmacies have administered roughly 26.5 million flu shots between August and October of this year. That number indicates that there have been two million fewer shots administered compared with around this time last year. And that's adding to the concern, because we know that the flu vaccine can offer some protection.

What we're already seeing from the U.K. when you look at vaccination rates is that vaccination reduced the risk of having to go to the E.R. or the hospital for the flu by almost 75 percent in children. And among adults, even those older than 65, it was by 30 percent to 40 percent.

So we are seeing this effectiveness. We are seeing this protection. And that's why experts say that they are concerned about what the flu season holds and vaccination remains important, Wolf and Pam.

BLITZER: This new strain of the flu, is it going to be -- are we -- those of us who got the flu shot, is that going to help us with this new strain?

HOWARD: There is some protection, because those numbers that I just showed you, the 75 percent and the 30 to 40 percent, those numbers are from the U.K. this year. So it is showing some protection there.

BLITZER: Excellent. All right, Jacqueline Howard.

To our viewers, get the flu shot. Thank you very much for joining us this morning.

BROWN: PSA from Wolf.

Thank you all for joining us.

"INSIDE POLITICS" with Manu Raju starts after a quick break.