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Trump Meets With Netanyahu; U.S. Strikes Iran-Backed Militias; Republicans Blast Anthony Fauci in Hearing. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired July 29, 2026 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:00]

SEN. ASHLEY MOODY (R-FL): And after everything we have just walked through, can you sit here today and tell the American people, our bosses, that you bear no responsibility for their collapse in trust of their government?

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, FORMER CHIEF MEDICAL ADVISER TO PRESIDENT BIDEN: On the advice of counsel, I respectfully decline to answer based upon my rights under the Fifth Amendment to the Constitution.

SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY): Time has expired.

We're going to do another quick round for those who remain, about five minutes, any questions that haven't come up that are pressing. Let's try not to re -- go over territory that's already been done.

I will begin by asking unanimous consent to insert into the record documents show -- that show that the CIA transferred funds to NIAID through interagency agreement. Hearing no objection, so ordered.

We had hoped to hear testimony from Anthony Fauci today. We haven't. But I think it's important that we do hear from him. So we will have a video we will play in a moment.

For years, Anthony Fauci has been the public face of saying this in all likelihood came from nature. He kept saying it's the marketplace, it's the marketplace, it's the marketplace. He's been saying that on television up until recently.

But what we find is that what he was saying in public is different than what he was saying in private. In January, in private, he wrote that: "Looks like the wet market was a super-spreader event. It didn't originate there. We know that some of the earliest deaths and sickness came from somewhere else."

But then, for years and years, we got dishonesty. So let's play the video so we can see a little juxtaposition of the problem we were dealing with.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(OFF-MIKE)

FAUCI: ... wild have been brought into wet markets. You have animals that come out of the wild that are sold at these open what -- they call them wet markets, where you bring animals in from the wild who have these viruses, the wet markets in Asia, where people bring animals from the forests into the market.

There wet markets in Wuhan that are ample opportunity for a virus to jump from an animal. The origin was from a bat to an intermediate host to a human very likely in a wet market.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: We will continue to monitor this hearing. We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer with Pamela Brown, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

We begin with the breaking news this hour. Dr. Anthony Fauci, he's invoking the Fifth Amendment in a very contentious Capitol Hill hearing amid questions related to the COVID pandemic response. The Republican chair of the Senate Homeland Security Committee, Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky, issued a subpoena for Fauci, the former head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, to appear before his panel.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Fauci and Paul, a trained ophthalmologist, have an acrimonious history, to say the least, with Paul even calling for Fauci to face criminal consequences.

Before today's hearing, the committee released more than 1,000 pages of the doctor's personal diary from 2019 to 2022. The entries document Fauci's growing fame at the time, shining a light on his interactions with celebrities and members of the media, including some CNN journalists.

The diary also narrates Fauci's escalating concerns about COVID-19 and conflicting relationships with both Trump and Biden administration officials.

So let's go live now to CNN congressional correspondent Lauren Fox on Capitol Hill and CNN's Kevin Liptak at the White House. We also have CNN senior legal analyst Elie Honig with us as well.

Lauren, you caught up with Dr. Fauci's attorney after he was forced to leave this hearing room amid this dispute with the Republican chair of the committee. What did he tell you?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, essentially, he was just trying in the room to explain why Dr. Fauci was pleading the Fifth.

And while he kept talking, it was clear that Rand Paul repeatedly told him that he was not authorized to speak in the committee room, that he could not speak on behalf of his client, and that he wasn't even supposed to be sitting next to him during that committee hearing.

When he continued to try to speak, he then was kicked out of the room. And that's when I caught up with him. And we were pressing him on what exactly he was trying to say, because we couldn't hear given the fact the microphone wasn't on.

And he essentially said that he was just trying to explain why he was pleading the Fifth. Here he was with us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FOX: Have you ever seen this happen in a congressional hearing?

DAVID SCHERTLER, ATTORNEY FOR DR. ANTHONY FAUCI: Dr. Fauci has a valid Fifth Amendment privilege and he has the right to assert it.

QUESTION: And that's what you were trying to say in the hearing?

SCHERTLER: That's what I was trying to tell the committee.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[11:05:00]

FOX: And, obviously, I have covered a lot of these hearings on Capitol Hill, very, very tense moment there.

And despite the fact that I have covered a number of these hearings, I have even covered a number of really fiery hearings where Senator Rand Paul was the chairman, I have never seen a lawyer of someone kicked out of the room. Obviously, that was an extremely, extremely fiery moment that you saw there.

Repeatedly, throughout the last hour-and-a-half, Dr. Fauci has just continued to plead the Fifth, whether that was a question about his time leading the coronavirus response in this country, or whether it was a question that was as simple as what the color of the room was, he continued to argue he was pleading the Fifth on the advice of counsel.

It was an extremely, extremely tense hearing.

BROWN: Yes, more than 70 times pleading the Fifth.

BLITZER: More than 70 times, he invoked his right under the Fifth Amendment to the Constitution.

Laura, stand by. I want to bring Kevin in.

How is the White House viewing all of this, specifically the politics of this very dramatic hearing?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, and it's clear that President Trump and people around President Trump view this as a vindication of sorts.

They have long viewed Dr. Fauci as a foil for them politically, and certainly for President Trump, who looks back to the year 2020 with a degree of regret in a lot of ways. That was obviously the year he lost a presidential election, and he has blamed it in part on the COVID pandemic. Now, he blames it on the effects that it has had on the economy and on

the shutdowns and on just general voter resentment about being locked inside. I think you could also argue that the -- COVID had the effect of people souring on the president's handling of what was a major crisis for the country.

But, either way you look at it, COVID it in a lot of ways cost the president that election, and he has always sort of looked for someone to blame, and, clearly, Dr. Fauci was that person. Obviously, they had made that intent known in his years out of office. That was part of why President Biden offered him this pardon.

And I think it was evident just listening to the questions from the Republican senators in this hearing that they continue to view this as a political cudgel. You heard the senator Bernie Moreno say that he hoped that voters would see clips from this hearing and that it would sway their own votes in future elections, just I think underscoring how COVID continues to affect the politics of the current day.

Now, President Trump earlier this morning did write about Dr. Fauci on TRUTH Social. He says, one, that more people died of COVID under the Biden administration than the Trump administration, and it is true that the pandemic continued to rage even after he was out of office.

He talks about Operation Warp Speed, which was his initiative to get a vaccine developed. It was actually one of the major highlights of his COVID response, but it's not something that he talks about that much anymore.

And then he goes on to say -- quote -- "I inherited Fauci, who was there since the 1980s, but with each passing day relied less and less on him. He made too many bad calls, like on masks."

And that's true. At the very beginning of the COVID pandemic, the president and Dr. Fauci had a fairly good relationship. He talked about him as a major television celebrity. But, as time went on, it really did start to sour, so much that by the end of the president's terms, they were barely on speaking terms.

And you saw that reflected in Fauci's diaries as well, when he called the president out of control, a true embarrassment, an idiot and all those sorts of things.

And so, as the president is watching this today, I think there is a degree of vindication to see Dr. Fauci now pulled before this congressional committee, to have to invoke the Fifth Amendment repeatedly, which I think in the president's eyes is an admission something of guilt.

Of course, it is not, but it is, I think, in their view, something of an embarrassment for this figure, who they have long blamed for the president's downfall in some ways.

BROWN: And let's talk a little bit more about that, the fact that Dr. Fauci pleaded the Fifth Amendment more than 70 times this morning.

I want to bring in Elie Honig on that point.

Elie, you heard Senator Hawley try to make the case that he doesn't have the right to invoke the Fifth, given his preemptive pardon from President Biden. What did you make of that?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: So, Senator Hawley's actually making the opposite argument there. He cited that Supreme Court case from 1896, and here is why.

So if there was no pardon, for sure, Dr. Fauci would have the right to take the Fifth. The complicating factor is, he does have this pardon. And so he cannot take the Fifth for anything that might be covered by the pardon. That's what the case that Josh Hawley cites says.

But the reason Fauci can take the Fifth here is because he's concerned about potential charges that fall outside the scope of that pardon, two things in particular. One, the pardon from President Biden would only cover Dr. Fauci for potential federal crimes, but Dr. Fauci could still be charged for state crimes.

[11:10:10]

In fact, a few minutes ago, we just heard Senator Moody from Florida say that there is a state level grand jury looking at Dr. Fauci. So he can invoke the Fifth on that basis.

The other thing is, the pardon was issued by President Biden on his last full day in office, January 19 of 2025, and only covers conduct up to that date. So Dr. Fauci can still be charged with federal crimes or state crimes that happened after that date, up to and including today.

So the case Senator Hawley cites really makes my point, which is he cannot take the Fifth for things that are within the pardon, but he certainly can take the Fifth if he has exposure outside of the pardon, which he certainly does.

BLITZER: Good point.

And, Lauren, let me go back to you. Do you have any sense at all of how Republicans on the committee may now move forward with possibly trying to punish Dr. Fauci for invoking his Fifth Amendment rights?

FOX: Yes, I actually asked Senator Rand -- excuse me -- Senator Ron Johnson about that when he came out of the hearing room. He said ultimately it's going to be up to the chairman, Rand Paul.

But you heard there in the early part of this hearing that Paul made clear there would be -- quote -- "repercussions" for declaring that he was pleading the Fifth today. And so I do think that Republicans are going to be looking really closely about whether or not they can try and bring some kind of case that he is impeding a congressional investigation.

I do think that Elie's point is a good one, which is essentially he was concerned today, Dr. Fauci was, that coming before this committee hearing, given what Senator Paul has said about wanting him imprisoned in the past, could potentially put him in a situation where every single thing that he said, every question he answered would be pored over, and perhaps there would be some kind of gray area that he worried about that Senator Paul would try to use to argue that he had lied to a congressional committee, which, of course, also is a crime.

So that is sort of the context that all of this is transpiring. And I will note that Fauci was very clear he has come before Congress more than 200 times during his career, and that he's always been happy to answer questions. He said it was with deep regret that he wasn't answering them today.

But he did point out that he was extremely concerned that, given some of the statements that Senator Paul, Chairman Paul, has made in the past, it was just legally very precarious to move forward with answering congressional questions today.

BROWN: Yes.

And just for context, Fauci has gone before Congress dating back decades, 250 times, more than that, actually. This is the first time he has pleaded the Fifth, but he has gone before Congress about his handling of the pandemic previously, and he is saying now that he's pleading the Fifth because of what he considers threats from Senator Rand Paul about prosecution.

And, actually, Elie Honig, we heard from Senator Paul today in response to him pleading the Fifth, saying that he will face consequences for obstruction. What could that look like?

HONIG: Well, there are two things that I can think of that Senator Paul might do if he wants to challenge this. The first thing is the senator can go to a federal court and argue to a district judge that Dr. Fauci had an invalid invocation of the Fifth Amendment.

Those arguments do get made from time to time to federal judges, but it's important to know that federal judges are going to give any witness very broad latitude when it comes to an invocation of the Fifth Amendment. If you look at the cases, courts all over the country have said basically we are going to defer very strongly, not entirely, but very strongly to a witness if that person takes the Fifth.

I'd also note, by the way, that a Republican on the committee, Senator Lankford, did acknowledge that Dr. Fauci had a right to take the Fifth here. So that's option A. You can go into a federal court and ask for an order saying, invalid invocation of the Fifth, you can't take the Fifth, Dr. Fauci, you must testify.

The other thing that I can think of that Senator Paul might try is to try to hold Dr. Fauci in contempt of the Senate. That would require a vote of the Senate. And he would need, of course, a majority to hold Dr. Fauci in contempt.

And if there are senators who think Dr. Fauci was within his rights to take the Fifth, I presume all the Democrats, maybe some Republicans, then that contempt motion would not go forward. So those are the two ways that I could see Senator Paul trying to proceed here.

BROWN: All right, Elie Honig, Lauren Fox, and Kevin Liptak, thank you all so much.

And coming up here in THE SITUATION ROOM: a new threat to Iran. President Trump is now promising retribution in a warning loaded with expletives.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:19:19]

BLITZER: We're, of course, continuing to monitor Dr. Anthony Fauci's hearing up on Capitol Hill, but also happening now, escalating dramatic tensions once again in the Middle East.

After a very brief pause in attacks, the U.S. military Central Command now says U.S. and Saudi forces conducted joint strikes against Iran- backed militias inside Iraq. And it comes as the U.S. military now says it intercepted several missiles fired by Iran in what's being described as a -- quote -- "surprise attack" on U.S. forces.

CNN senior White House correspondent Kristen Holmes is joining us right now.

Kristen, what is the president saying about this latest attack by the Iranians?

[11:20:01]

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, he's clearly unhappy.

And this is somewhat of an embarrassment for him, Wolf. I mean, just a reminder that he had stopped the strikes on Iran, citing that Tehran had asked the United States to do so, saying that they wanted to have room for negotiations, for those talks to breathe. It was only just a few days before the Iranians then launched their attacks.

Now President Trump is telling FOX News this: "We are going to beat the effing shit out of them." He went on to say: "We will be hitting them hard. They're going to get a beating."

Now, this came after President Trump had said that he wanted to go down the pathway of diplomacy. He wanted to let these kind of negotiations stand. He wanted to give them a break, them being Iran after 14 consecutive nights of strikes in Iran.

And, instead, now there was this surprise attack on U.S. forces. So he had also said that they were prepared to be -- quote, unquote -- "locked and loaded" and attacked back if the Iranians did not, in fact, come to the negotiating table. Obviously, now we have seen this strike.

It is unclear exactly what the United States is going to do, if they're going to continue this retaliation, what it will look like. But the other part of this is, it's also coming at a time in which we know there have been warnings internally about that munitions stockpile and it running low. So, how that factors in, that's also another question here we're asking at the White House.

BLITZER: All right, Kristen Holmes at the White House for us, thank you very much. We will stay in close touch with you.

Israel, meanwhile, and the United States say they are in lockstep about preventing Iran from obtaining nuclear weapons, that after the Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, visited President Trump at the White House yesterday.

It was their first in-person meeting since both leaders launched their joint war against Iran.

Joining us now here in THE SITUATION ROOM is Doron Spielman. He's the international spokesperson for the Israeli prime minister's office.

Doron, thanks very much for joining us.

How are Israelis responding now to yesterday's pretty important meeting that Prime Minister Netanyahu had with President Trump?

DORON SPIELMAN, INTERNATIONAL SPOKESPERSON, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER'S OFFICE: You know, Israelis from the very beginning, Wolf, see the United States as really the cornerstone that is joining us together in this threat, defeating a major threat throughout the world, which is Iran.

I think the United States sees the same thing from Israel. I know, from speaking to the prime minister, he and the president completely saw eye to eye. In fact, when he came out of the meeting, I asked him: "How was the meeting?"

He said: "This was one of the greatest meetings I have had with the president."

BLITZER: This is what Netanyahu said.

SPIELMAN: That's correct. That's when Netanyahu said -- he said: "This is one of the greatest meetings I have had with the president."

And they have known each other for 40 years. And so I think at this time, when, by the way, those missiles that were fired could be seen over the skies of Jerusalem, when the Israeli people see that and they see that we are in lockstep with the United States, it gives us a sigh of relief that both Prime Minister Netanyahu, President Trump, the American people and the Israeli people are united in defeating this enemy.

BLITZER: But you know right now there seems to be a real serious strain in U.S. Israeli relations, including relations between the Israeli government and the Trump administration.

SPIELMAN: I don't think so, Wolf. As a matter of fact, in getting briefed from this meeting, on all of

the subjects that came across in this meeting, in the meeting focused on Iran, the U.S. and Israel are completely on lockstep. Even before these meetings, there's always reports, the two men, there's some type of fissure.

As the prime minister said yesterday -- and I was in the room -- it's as strong as granite. The two militaries are in touch daily, if not hourly. The president and the prime minister speak daily. As a matter of fact, Wolf, I don't think we have probably ever seen two governments, certainly not Israel and the United States, more in lockstep since maybe even World War II.

BLITZER: But, as you know, Americans seem to be growing increasingly sour in their view of the Israeli government right now. A recent survey from the Pew Research Center found that nearly two-thirds of Americans, 62 percent, hold an unfavorable view right now of the Israeli government.

How concerning are these latest numbers to the prime minister and to you, for that matter?

SPIELMAN: You know, I think that, for Israelis, when we see any type of waning support towards Israel, of course, this is a great concern.

What we have seen is, in many of the factions in which there's waning support towards Israel, there's actually waning support towards the United States. It's a very similar group of people who are associating both an anti-Israel sentiment with an anti-U.S. sentiment. There is a true parallel here, and it's very concerning.

Where does it come from? Today, when a nation exerts, let's say, some type of power against evil, it is automatically being labeled as an oppressor, and therefore the evil, as soon as you beat the evil, they say that we're the oppressed, like the Iranian regime, like Hamas.

All of a sudden, when they begin to lose, we're oppressed. And therefore the focus is on the U.S. and Israel is an aggressor. It's the exact opposite. What we're seeing, Wolf, is that we are standing up with courage.

And I think this is the time that Senator Lindsey Graham left the world, and he said that he would send every person in his home state to fight against Iran. And he went to his grave seeing the combined actions of the U.S. and Israel standing alone with courage, the president of the United States, Prime Minister Netanyahu, our troops, standing against evil.

BLITZER: What can the Israeli government do right now -- you're a spokesman for the prime minister's office -- if anything, to regain support from what used to be this crucial base of moral support for Israel and its security among the American people?

[11:25:10]

SPIELMAN: I think, Wolf, when the Americans understand that Israeli security -- Israel is the model ally. The Pentagon phrased Israel in their most recent report in 2025. There was one state that was called the model ally, and that was Israel.

We see, when the United States, President Trump makes a call to nations throughout the world to help him, whether it's in the straits, whether it's in Iran, one nation showed up, and it was Israel. We sent our own planes, our own pilots to help the United States.

Our arms -- the U.S. arms, these deals that are being made, U.S. arms are tried and tested in Israel, and Israel shares critical intelligence with the U.S. There's intelligence being shared daily. If you look at the facts, if you unveil the actual relationship here, you cannot but help that say that Israel is the number one ally of the United States.

BLITZER: But you know that, before the Netanyahu-Trump meeting got under way yesterday, the president, President Trump, seemed to throw cold water on needing Israeli intelligence when it comes to nuclear sites, potential nuclear sites in Iran.

He told FOX News that Netanyahu was offering intelligence because he wanted Trump to -- quote -- "stay involved." Is there a growing rift right now between these two leaders? It seemed that was developing before the meeting yesterday.

SPIELMAN: In fact, that report that the president was responding to were news reports that were presented by many outlets, and it was fake news. That was never an intention of Israel.

Israel did not even discuss any intelligence regarding that site during the entire meeting, and that's what the president was responding to. We can say these two men have known each other, Wolf, for 40 years. They can have a disagreement in the morning and make history in the evening.

And that's in fact what has been carried through this entire time. The president has also referred to Prime Minister Netanyahu as the bravest leader of our time, and, of course, Prime Minister Netanyahu has said the same thing about the president.

We are looking at two men, Wolf. In answer to your previous question, how will we see this relationship? I believe that this time will go down in history in the future and say that these two men and our countries stood together against an evil that, had they not done it, it wouldn't be ballistic missile fire threatening ships in the straits. It would be an atomic bomb.

These actions today are protecting the world for tomorrow.

BLITZER: President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu may agree on Iran never getting some sort of nuclear weapon, but that doesn't necessarily mean they are on the same page about how to get there.

Would Prime Minister Netanyahu be open to a diplomatic resolution right now and a strong cease-fire?

SPIELMAN: Absolutely.

He has said from the very beginning that whatever path President Trump takes to achieve this -- in fact, it's preferred by the prime minister. If the president is able to negotiate this -- and we all know what it is to negotiate with the Iranians. They say one thing tomorrow, they lie, and then they do the opposite the following day.

If the president of the United States manages, and he's trying, to negotiate with these people and end their nuclear program, it is preferred by the prime minister of Israel and the Israeli people. If not, and we resort to force, we will send our people if we're asked to in order to make sure they do not get a weapon that threatens Israel and threatens the rest of the world.

BLITZER: I ask the question because, when the U.S. and Iran negotiated that memorandum of understanding, it was clear Prime Minister Netanyahu and many in the Israeli government didn't like it.

SPIELMAN: Well, he was skeptical, and he related this directly to the president.

To make a deal with the Iranians, you're making a deal with scoundrels that can turn their back. And the president was very clear, and the prime minister goes along with him, we have to try, because no one -- the U.S. and Israel are not looking to send our troops in the Middle East. We're not looking for this war.

What we are looking for is for that threat to be allayed. And the president, God bless him. If he manages to actually do this, it would be incredible. And if not, we see, we just came off 12 days where the president showed Iranians, if you're not going to stand by this deal and you're going to lie, we're going to use force. Therefore, you have both options on the table.

And I think that's the best chance we have to actually make sure that they do not have nuclear weapons.

BLITZER: Right now, Iran is no longer launching missiles or drones, rockets against Israel, right?

SPIELMAN: Yes, that's correct.

I think you know why, because Israel has already said to them, if you -- and the prime minister said when I was in the room, if you launch a weapon towards Israel, it will be a very, very sorry day for you. They know if they launch a weapon against Israel, we will respond, and we will respond seriously.

And so, therefore, they're shooting weapons all over the Middle East, assuming that these countries are not going to use force to stop them, because force at the end of the day is a language that this IRGC regime, which has hung two of its protesters, any challenge, only force, the threat of force is the only thing that they're listening to.

BLITZER: Is Prime Minister Netanyahu now leaving Washington, heading to New York City?

I ask the question because, as you know, the New York City mayor, Zohran Mamdani, said that although the city lacks the independent authority to enforce the International Criminal Court's warrant for Prime Minister Netanyahu's arrest, he still encouraged New Yorkers to get on the streets to protest the visit.

Here's the question. How concerned are you about Prime Minister Netanyahu's security going into -- going back to New York and eventually attending the United Nations General Assembly?

SPIELMAN: We are not concerned about the prime minister's security. What we are concerned about is the fact that Mamdani is the mayor of New York. And, in fact, this came up in the meeting between the president and the prime minister.

[11:30:00]