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Clancy Jury Back in Court After Tensions Flare Over Holdout; Drivers Face Highest Labor Day Gas Prices on Record; Two Men Rescued from Nepal Tunnels Nine Days After Deadly Flood. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired September 04, 2026 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[10:00:00]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, breaking news tensions flare, the Lindsey Clancy courtroom, a deadlock jury, the defense claiming there is one juror who refuses to listen to the law. The move the judge is making this morning.

Incredible breaking overnight, miracle on the mountain. Two men rescued alive in Nepal after being trapped for nine days in a tunnel. What one of the men is saying this morning.

Also, all-time high, diesel has never been this expensive. It is the priciest Labor Day ever. The hidden fuel crisis that could hit your wallet next.

And dramatic reversal, the Pentagon pulling back a controversial testosterone screening program. What happened? My new reporting, straight ahead.

Welcome to our viewers of the United States and around the world. I'm Pamela Brown. Wolf Blitzer is off and you're in The Situation Room.

And we begin this hour with the breaking news. Court is back in session for the Lindsay Clancy murder trial, but the morning started with a tense exchange between Clancy's defense attorney and the judge. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KEVIN REDDINGTON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I would ask that you specifically direct their attention to proof beyond a reasonable doubt and reinstruct them on that forcefully.

JUDGE WILLIAM SULLIVAN, PLYMOUT COUNTY SUPERIOR COURT: I think I did that yesterday, didn't I?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

REDDINGTON: You did it yesterday, you did it soft, you didn't do it forcefully and I'm asking you to do it forcefully.

SULLIVAN: What do you want -- what do you want me to do?

REDDINGTON: I want you to tell the --

SULLIVAN: Get a brass band? I read the instruction as written by the SJC. The fact that I perhaps didn't give it my full inflection, I'm sorry about that. I'm not an actor. I've just given the instructions.

REDDINGTON: Well, my point, Judge, simply is that you're kind of glossing over the issue. The issue is this juror will not, according to that note, apply the law of reasonable doubt. And that's why I've requested -- you know, what I've requested.

SULLIVAN: Right.

REDDINGTON: So, I note my objection.

SULLIVAN: But just in case the record's clear, I am specifically not glossing over this issue. I have thought about this issue long and hard. I know the defendant objects, but the characterization that I'm glossing over it, trust me, that's not the situation.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: The deadlock jury is back for the seventh day of deliberations and a series of dramatic developments over the past day has offered more questions and answers in a case that has already gripped the nation.

Also this morning, Clancy's defense team filing an emergency motion asking the court to end all sidebar discussions. Those are the private conversations between the judge and the attorneys. The motion asks for all discussions to be held in open court. And this comes after a note from the jury's foreperson offering the biggest glimpse yet into the panel's nearly 40 hours of discussion.

According to Clancy's attorney, Kevin Reddington, the jury is split 11-1. Reddington went on to accuse the lone holdout of refusing to listen to the law. Clancy is on trial for the murder of her three young children, and it's up to this jury to decide whether she is criminally liable. Clancy's defense argues she was experiencing postpartum psychosis at the time of the killings.

Joining us now is CNN Correspondent Jean Casares from the courthouse in Plymouth, Massachusetts, Attorney Alan Tuerkheimer, he's also a jury consultant, and Defense Attorney Elyse Hershon.

A lot to talk about this morning. Jean, let's start with you. A lot of developments in that courtroom this morning bring us up to speed on this very unusual series of events.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think the first thing, most importantly, the jury is deliberating right now. So, any minute, something could happen. We're just waiting. This is, as you said, almost 40 hours of deliberation right now.

And when the jurors filed in, the judge did repeat his order to follow the law. And our producer in the courtroom, the camera didn't catch it obviously because it's the jurors, but noted that female jurors were shaking their head yes, just quite enthusiastically, as the judge was saying, you have to follow the instructions, follow the law. The male jurors were focused and listening, but not with that enthusiasm of shaking their head at all.

[10:05:06]

But the main issue here comes from the note, the note. And now we know on the record there were actually two notes that were sent to the judge. And the notes had to do with just one lone juror that the foreperson at least was saying that they couldn't follow, wouldn't follow the law.

And so the defense, first of all, wanted the juror out, but today, the issue was really he wanted inquiry in open court of that one juror. And the judge said, I'm not going to do it, because he swore, and it was a he because Reddington said he many times this morning, swore to tell the truth and he said that he would follow the law.

And so the prosecutor came up and actually cited case law saying the only reason that you can excuse a juror while they're deliberating is personal reasons, personal reasons. And an inquiry is if there is actual bias or actual issues in regard to how they are focused on things. But she said, we have none of that.

We just have disagreement. We have disagreement in the jury room. And so the judge listened to that and ordered the jury to continue.

BROWN: So, on that note, Alan, I mean, how unusual is it for a jury foreperson to send two notes to the judge singling out a single juror saying essentially that person, in this case, he, according to Reddington, isn't following the law?

ALAN TUERKHEIMER, JURY CONSULTANT: It's unusual, but certainly not unprecedented. This happens and if you think about it, they've been deliberating for so long. They've rehashed arguments. They've tried to persuade others. They've tried to get to unanimity. And at this point, they're frustrated. They're clearly frustrated.

And if you think about it also, what is reasonable doubt? Yes, there's a definition, it's read, but this is why we have 12 people assembled because it means different things to different jurors.

So, I wouldn't necessarily think that this juror is deliberating in bad faith or not even following the law. I understand why some jurors might think that's the case, but we just -- we don't know that. This juror might have a different definition of reasonable doubt and might be arguing about it from a perspective that is irking the majority of jurors in this case.

BROWN: And it's really notable to me, Elyse, that Reddington gave us a glimpse of what was in this letter, which is super unusual to learn about the deliberations as they're ongoing. Tell us more about the significance of that, of Reddington saying, according to this foreperson, that this lone juror has expressed doubt but isn't following the law. What does that tell you?

ELYSE HERSHON, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: So it tells me that we don't know what's in that note, but Attorney Reddington does. So, going off of his representations to the court on the record is that note contained a split, a jury split, what the numbers were, that usually is not disclosed to the public. That's usually -- that can never be asked into the jury room. The judge and the lawyers are supposed to stay out of that. They reported to the judge, from what we can gather, it's an 11-1 split.

And this is not just about a holdout juror, and this is not about the defense counsel wanting this to be over in his favor. This is about a juror that in that note has raised enough of an issue that the foreperson wrote a note to the judge saying someone is holding out because they recognize there is doubt, but won't apply it to the law.

Attorney Reddington said this in court. He said this in a press conference. And they've recognized that with the, basically the judge read the instruction of reasonable doubt and he said, the person will follow the law. I'm going to reinstruct them. That's what the prosecutor asked for.

But a reasonable doubt instruction is always 99.9 percent of the time favors the defense. The prosecution never wants that reinstructed because it reiterates how high their burden is. They know in this case that they are losing the jury or they -- the jury is likely 11-1 against them and they want that instruction and they probably want a mistrial because they don't want to lose this trial.

BROWN: Yes. So, just to drill down on that, what does all of this tell you, Elyse, about how the jury might currently be voting, who they're favoring right now?

HERSHON: 11-1 for what I would anticipate would be an acquittal under criminal responsibility. So, remember, there were five options there, first and second-degree murder, manslaughter, not guilty for lack of criminal responsibility, and then a full acquittal. I would imagine based on the evidence, based on the case and based on the strength of the defense experts and the weakness of the prosecution to prove beyond a reasonable doubt criminal intent, I think they're landing on that. There's no way for me to know, but something favorable to the defense outside of first or second-degree murder.

And, of course, that motion to have all the sidebars heard in open court, that's a totally valid motion.

[10:10:01]

We do have a public trial system as long as the jury is out of the room and not privy to what is being argued over and discussed. I think that's -- that motion was valid and the judge did the right thing with allowing it.

BROWN: And it was interesting, Alan, and I'll get you in a second, Jean, just on like next steps, but it was interesting because the judge met with the jurors and he indicated in court today that despite the majority of the jury believing that this lone juror wasn't following the law, that he said he didn't see evidence that the, this lone juror wasn't following the law.

Can you just help us understand this and make sense of it?

TUERKHEIMER: Sure. The judge has to do what he has to do, and that's talk to each juror and just say, can you follow the law or are you following the law in your deliberations? He wants to make sure they're deliberating in good faith. And it's hard to imagine a juror saying, no, Judge, I'm not going to listen to you or I'm going to flout the law that you give me. So, he just had to follow the process and he was convinced that every juror is doing it.

And, look, if you think about it in the deliberation, it's hard to imagine a juror saying, you know, I kind of think that the prosecution didn't meet their burden. However, I'm not going to let her go. She killed her three kids. It's just unlikely that somebody is going to be that blatant with her rejecting the law. But, certainly, the jurors think that this juror is not following the law and brought it to their attention and the judge had to do what he had to do and ask about it and felt confident that the jurors are all following the law the way he gave it on the burden of proof.

BROWN: And it was interesting to me, the judge emphasized even if you don't like the law, if you have personal feelings, you have to disregard that and follow this law despite what you think about it. Jean, remind us what happens if this ends up being a mistrial.

CASAREZ: If this is a mistrial, the trial is over. And, conceivably, Lindsay Clancy is a free woman because there was not a verdict at all. However, the prosecution more likely than not will stand up in court and ask that she remain in custody because you don't think about that she's in custody, but she is. This is a triple murder case and it's a no bail situation. They will reiterate that. And we may hear in the courtroom if it comes to this that their intent is to retry the case, conceivably.

BROWN: All right. And just really quickly, Elyse, back to you, how unusual is it for the defense attorney to kind of push back at the judge in this way? Presumably, you would think that the defense would want to be in the judge's good favor. I just wonder what your take is on how the defense has approached this.

HERSHON: I think, you know, certainly, Attorney Reddington can get away with certain things that I couldn't at this point in my career. He's been doing this a long time, has tried cases in front of this judge. So, there's a level of professional respect. The judge understands Attorney Reddington. This is a triple first-degree murder trial. Her life is on the line and the judge understands that zealous advocacy is required.

Attorney Reddington certainly has his own style that works for him. He is very straight to the point, he's very blunt, and he's a strong advocate for his client. So, everything that he said and did had a valid legal basis for it for asking it anyways, but it was in the judge's discretion to deny swapping out that juror. Again, like we discussed and other people in the panel discussed, personal bias or a personal issue is really the only thing that would allow a judge to do that.

And the judge cannot further inquire into what that jury is deliberating on. They are sacrosanct. They're not allowed to invade the province of the jury. So, the judge had to stay far away from asking exactly what was going on in there.

BROWN: All right, Jean, Elyse, Alan, thank you all. We appreciate it. And we're going to continue to monitor this.

And still ahead, diesel hitting a record. What this means for the cost of everyday items for you and your family.

And then later, a Louisiana judge paves the way for two NFL rookies to return to LSU ahead of tomorrow's kickoff. The dramatic showdown brewing between the Tigers and the SEC.

You're in The Situation Room and we'll be right back.

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[10:15:00]

BROWN: Well, drivers are expected to pay record Labor Day gas prices this holiday weekend, but it's not just the cost of filling your tank that's going up. Diesel, the workhorse fuel that powers the economy, has also hit an all-time high, adding pressure to the trucking industry. At $5.85 a gallon, that means a typical 18-wheeler with a 300 gallon tank can cost more than $1,700 to fill up.

CNN Senior Reporter Matt Egan is in New York. We're talking sticker shock all around here, Matt. Break down the numbers for us.

MATT EGAN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Well, Pamela, diesel has never been more expensive than it is right now. Before the war started, this was not a problem, right? Diesel was selling for well below less than $4 a gallon, but look at that, $5.85 a gallon, blowing away the prior record that was set four years ago under President Biden after Russia invaded Ukraine.

Now, I know it's tempting to kind of dismiss this because most of our viewers, they're not using diesel to fill up their cars. However, yes, diesel is the MVP of the fuels. It is the silent workhorse that's really powering the modern economy. It's powering the trucks and trains that are hauling the stuff that we buy online. It's hauling the -- it's powering the boats that allow goods to get shipped overseas, the tractors that farmers use to produce fuel, the construction vehicles making homes and data centers.

That's why this is a very big deal because all of those activities have just gotten more expensive and businesses, they are likely to pass along at least some of those costs to all of us as consumers.

[10:20:06] So, why is this happening? Well, one, it's the fact that oil prices have gone up because of the war with Iran, but, two, there's this global shortage of refining capacity. Refineries, there's just not enough of them that are operating right now to produce enough fuel.

And it's not just the level of prices that are a record, it's the increase. This is -- we're looking at a north of a 60 percent increase so far this year that would easily be the most on record. And then there's gasoline, as you mentioned for the first time ever, Gas Buddy's projecting that Labor Day gas prices will be above $4 a gallon. So, whether it's gas or diesel, either way, we're looking at an energy shock that is making the cost of living get even worse. Pamela?

BROWN: We're getting in some different economic markers. The most anticipated August jobs report was just released a little over 90 minutes ago. I want to go to National Economic Council Director Kevin Hassett and what he said about the report earlier this hour.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN HASSETT, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: It's really one of the biggest blowout skyrocketing job numbers that we've seen in a long time. And I think that if you think, you put it, you know, in perspective, what it means now after this report, that President Trump's economy, his policies have created now over a million jobs. So, we went over the million job mark because of this report.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: What more can you tell us about this report?

EGAN: Well, Pamela this report, it didn't just beat expectations. It did crush expectations, right? The forecast was for a gain of 65,000 jobs. The reality was 162,000, right, so more than doubling the forecast. In fact, this was stronger than even the most optimistic forecaster. And there were positive revisions. Both June and July were revised higher.

Another positive is the fact that job growth in August, it was more widespread than it has been in the past, right? This wasn't all healthcare, government added a lot of jobs. That was mostly local schools, public schools, leisure and hospitality. That was bars and restaurants.

But one thing that we do have to note here, Pamela, is wages. What we saw is that wage growth slowed again to a five-year low. Notably, wages are going up much slower than inflation. So, that means that if you adjust your paycheck for inflation, your paycheck is actually getting smaller right now.

So, Pamela, I do think that really speaks to how people are experiencing this economy and why a lot of consumers right now, they feel like they just can't keep up with higher prices because the data shows they literally can't.

BROWN: All right. Matt Egan, thank you so much. We appreciate it.

And coming up, miracle in the mud, two men found alive in Nepal. More on how they were rescued and the hope to find others alive.

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[10:25:00]

BROWN: Amazing euphoria and just disbelief. Exhausted rescue crews erupt in cheers, as you heard there, as two men are pulled out alive, nine days after Nepal's catastrophic flood trapped them inside a hydropower tunnel. Here, rescuers carry one of them to medical care. We're told one of the hydropower workers is in stable condition at this hour, the other critical. Both men are now hospitalized in Nepal's capital Kathmandu. And in a moment, you're going to hear from one of them speaking from his hospital bed. The body of a third person has been found in the tunnel.

Even so, the rescues give new hope after nine days of unimaginable heartbreak. Nearly 1,300 people are confirmed dead in Nepal. About 5,500 are missing there and across the border in China.

CNN's Hanako Montgomery has the latest from the rescue scene in Nepal.

HANAKO MONTGOMERY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I mean, there were cries of joy. There was jubilation after these men were pulled out almost miraculously after spending nine days stuck in the tunnel. You can imagine how difficult it must have been for these men to hang on to the walls as the floodwater was coming in, sweeping some of their colleagues away, yet somehow they were able to hang on and stay alive.

And you've seen some of those incredible videos of them getting pulled out of the tunnel using the rescue workers to hang on and to lean on, and, of course, them getting carried into helicopters with stretchers. And we now know that these two men are receiving medical treatment at a military hospital in Kathmandu in the capital.

And we actually heard from one of the survivors, Sanjay Sah, about his time inside the tunnel. Listen to this amazing account of what he experienced.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANJAY SAH, RESCUED FROM HYDROPOWER TUNNEL: My responsibility was to save everyone's life. After the accident happened, I could not run by myself. I had to save everyone. In the process of saving everyone, I told them that there was an accident in the big dam.

I asked everyone to escape outside. Doing so, I wasted time and I could not get out. I got trapped.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MONTGOMER: I mean, truly an act of heroism if he was sacrificing his time to escape by helping his co-workers. Now, we know that these rescue operations are ongoing. We saw some of them when we were up by the Trishuli-3A tunnel and we saw those rescue workers pulling at a piece of rope, hoping that the person on the other end of that rope was indeed alive.

I also heard from a commander on the ground there that they believed around 40 individuals might still be stuck inside that tunnel.

[10:30:05]

But, again, these are just some of the conditions that rescuers have been experiencing.