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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Two Students, Two Teachers Killed In Georgia School Shooting; Liz Cheney: "I Will Be Voting For Kamala Harris"; DOJ: Kremlin Used Right-Wing Influencers To Push Propaganda. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired September 04, 2024 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST, FORMER NYPD DEPUTY COMMISSIONER OF INTELLIGENCE & COUNTERTERRORISM: Well, it is as the investigators believe the gun came from the home, which would fit in with the information we just went over.
And then, of course we want to know, was there any other threat information today. And that will come up again.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: All right. Now we do know, though, there's a timeline that goes back well over a year. We know that there was a rifle used, questions about where in the house, if it did come from the house, it came from, when it was purchased.
John Miller, we'll let you get back to working the phones.
A lot more information coming in over the next few minutes as well.
MILLER: Thanks, John.
BERMAN: Again, the news conference from Georgia starts very shortly.
"THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts right now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Straight from THE SOURCE tonight.
Any moment, a new update from the authorities, in Georgia, after two high school students and two teachers were murdered today. At least nine others were hospitalized in what is now the 45th school shooting in America, just this year alone.
Chilling accounts are emerging from what happened inside that school today, as we're also learning new details, tonight, about the 14-year- old suspect, who is now in custody, including how he was questioned by law enforcement, about school shooting threats just last year.
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
As I noted, we're awaiting a live update, from the authorities. Right there, in Georgia, they are gathering at the microphones on what is now the deadliest school shooting in America this year. The law enforcement officials are expected to brief us at any moment. We're going to bring that to you live, when it happens.
But as we wait, tonight, we are getting new details about the weapon that was used, in today's mass shooting, at Apalachee High School, in Winder, Georgia, that's just northeast of Atlanta.
A law enforcement official tells CNN, the gunman used an AR-15-style rifle, when he killed two students and two teachers, and injured at least nine others this morning.
I want to take a listen to the officials now.
SHERIFF JUD SMITH, BARROW COUNTY, GEORGIA: All right. Good evening. As you can tell, we know that it's been a long day. I want to thank you for being patient with us today. I want to thank you for understanding that this is still an active crime scene.
But from the minute that this tragic incident happened today, Governor Kemp has been with me, and been talking to me and several times, and has been on our side and law enforcement's side. And I wanted to introduce him to make a few statements.
Again, thank you for your patience.
And at this time, I'm going to introduce the Governor.
And then, Director Hosey will take answers and questions after that.
GOV. BRIAN KEMP (R-GA): Well, thank you, Sheriff. Just want to thank you, and your team, for the incredible work that they've done.
The response of our first responders today has been unreal. Superintendent LeDuff, Principal Leroy (ph), who just did incredible job with these kids.
This hits home for us. Being from Athens, just down the road, Marty and I having a daughter that taught first grade, just a few years ago, this is everybody's worst nightmare.
And I just want to offer my sincere condolences, and our thoughts and prayers to the families of -- that have lost loved ones, for those that are injuring and injured and continuing to fight through just a tragic time for, really, this whole community that's been affected by today's actions.
And I just cannot thank the first responders enough. I cannot thank Director Hosey, Colonel Hitchens, Director Stallings at GEMA, the whole state response. I want to thank Special Agent Farley, and her team, from the FBI, that are embedded with us, in the school, as we speak, running down every single lead and other things that Director Hosey will mention tonight.
I represented Barrow County, when I was in the state senate, 20 years ago. These are our neighbors. These are our friends. And this community is hurting today. And I would just ask all Georgians, and all Americans, to continue to keep these families, these educators, and these students, in your thoughts and prayers. And we will provide every state resource that is needed from here until they're not, to support this community and support this team behind me.
And with that, I'll turn it over to Director Hosey.
CHRIS HOSEY, DIRECTOR, GEORGIA BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION: Thank you, Governor.
Real quick. We wanted to provide some additional updates from today's events. And I will mention too that this will be our last update for the evening. So, I please hope you'll understand that.
Let me start by saying that there's no evidence to report that any additional shooter was involved in this incident, today. Investigators are actively pursuing, however, any leads of any potential associates of the shooter that was involved in this incident.
[21:05:00]
So, I say that to say we're following up any potential leads, through the investigation, to ensure, if there are any associates involved in this, that we find them, we identify them. So that's part of, again, the ongoing investigation.
There is no evidence of a list of schools being targeted. However, there is a lot of evidence that is being recovered and evaluated. We're going through everything, to determine if there is any active threats to any schools in this area, this county and the State of Georgia. And we will continue to monitor that throughout this investigation, throughout the evening, as we as we carry on.
There was a call, as we're aware of, to a local high school, as well this morning, with a reported threat. Police responded and investigated and determined that there was no threat, after all.
There's been reports that a Colton Gray (ph), who is another student here at the school, was involved, or a Colton Gray (ph), was involved in this.
If you recall from a previous press conference, early this afternoon, the individual that we have arrested and will be charged with this, his name is Colt Gray. But there is another student here at the school with a very similar name.
We want to ensure everyone that Colton Gray (ph) is not involved in this incident. That is the name that I provided you, earlier this afternoon. So, those reports were inaccurate, if that was passed on to you.
I do, however, want to identify the victims of this -- of this incident today, those that lost their life in this tragic event.
Mason Schermerhorn, age 14, who was a student here at the school.
Christian Angulo, who was 14, also a student here at the school. Richard Aspinwall, not sure of his age, but he was a teacher here at the school.
And Christina Irimie, I'm sorry for my pronunciation, who was also a teacher here at the school.
We will post a list of these victims, for the correct spellings, for everyone, later this evening, after we complete the press conference here.
Also, as has been released, the FBI's National Threat Operations Center has received anonymous tips, in the past, of online threats to commit school violence or school shootings, at an undetermined location and time.
The FBI referred this information to the Jackson County Sheriff Office for action. The Jackson County Sheriff's Office identified and located Gray, who is our suspect in this case. They conducted an investigation, at that time, and there was no probable cause for arrest, or to take any additional law enforcement action.
This is not recent. This is in the past. But we wanted to bring that to your attention. Because we are pursuing that, working with the FBI on that. And any connection to that, that incident, that could be connected to today's incident as well.
Also, we're also aware of some previous contacts that the Department of Family & Children Services, in the area, had had with the suspect and his family. And we are pursuing that avenue as well too, to see if that has any connection with today's incident.
Let me stress again, as we have many times, that this is still a very fluid investigation. It is still very active. We will have agents. And there will be law enforcement personnel that will be pursuing investigative leads, and collecting evidence, throughout the night, and then to much of tomorrow, I would anticipate as well.
We again ask for your patience in that. This is a criminal investigation, and we're going to treat it like that. So, I apologize ahead of time if we don't answer some of the questions that you may ask. So please understand.
I also want to -- want to bring note to one very special thing that we do not need to forget about here, is we have heroes in our midst. We've talked about our law enforcement personnel, our Fire, our EMS.
Those that are deceased are heroes, in my book. Those that are in the hospital recovering right now, are heroes in my book.
But also the heroes that we need to remember is our faculty and staff here at this school. They acted admirably. They were heroes in the actions that they took.
The protocols at this school and this system activated today prevented this from being a much larger tragedy than what we had here today. So, I want to recognize them as heroes, because they are. [21:10:00]
And continue with our thoughts and prayers as has been mentioned for the families that were lost here today, those that were lost here today, those that are recovering in the hospital, and obviously those that were affected directly by this tragedy, here at the school, and all of the community of Barrow County, we need to continue to have them in our thoughts and prayers.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Director, thank you for doing another one of these again. Can you tell us, by chance, since he's being charged as an adult, will he be in court, tomorrow? Will there be a first court appearance? Will he be booked, tonight, if that happened?
HOSEY: He will be booked tonight. I'm not sure of the court appearance, but it will be within a reasonable amount of time.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How did law enforcement learn about the--
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there anything that you can share to us about the weapon that was used, by chance?
HOSEY: The weapon that was used in this was an AR-platform style weapon.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, how did Mr. Gray get the gun into the school?
HOSEY: We're still investigating that aspect of it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did he go out of the classroom and get the gun and come back? We've heard some of that from some students.
HOSEY: We're still trying to clarify a lot of the timeline in from the time that he got here to school today, until the incident took place.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And last one from me. I mean, so often, I know people at home, we always hear something that the FBI has heard something about someone, who goes and does one of these tragic events.
How can we stop this from happening? Because it feels like this happens every single time there's a school shooting that we heard that there was a prior threat, or there's prior knowledge. What -- when lives are at stake, how can we stop this from happening?
HOSEY: Well, there's a variety of ways, in my personal opinion, community involvement, what our school system is doing here, to ensure that.
Whether we'd be able to stop it completely one day or not? I don't know. That's -- those are decisions that each individual is making on their own to do this.
But again, I go back to what I said earlier, about the heroes here, that prevented things from being a lot worse today. But we've got to take action within our own communities. Take care of each other, be aware of our surroundings, and what's going on in our community. (CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Director Hosey, do you believe--
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: --the family last year, they found hunting rifles in the family home. Was an AR-platform weapon among those weapons that were in the home during that interview?
HOSEY: Again, that's part of a lot of the things that we're trying to clarify within the investigation. Again, we're very, very early.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As a parent--
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: --active-shooter situation, was it from a 911 call from a faculty or a staff member or from a student? Can you just expand on that, how they (ph) got here--
HOSEY: Yes, I'm not sure of that. Can you answer that, Sheriff?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: --within minutes.
RABECCA SAYARATH, MOTHER OF STUDENT AT APALACHEE HIGH SCHOOL: Could you also expand on why it was a female faculty member walking around, looking for the student, minutes before he shot up the school?
HOSEY: Yes.
SAYARATH: Can you all clarify that?
HOSEY: I'll answer that one.
SMITH: I'll let Director Hosey answer that question.
(CROSSTALK)
SAYARATH: --resource officer didn't approach him?
KEMP: Look -- look, Ma'am, let's get this question, right here, and then we'll come back to you.
SMITH: You asked, how was I notified?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've discussed today, heard earlier, law enforcement here within several minutes. So, we're just curious how the notification went through. Did 911 hear about it from a student, or was it a faculty that made that call, alerting law enforcement?
SMITH: All of our teachers are armed with a form of an ID called CENTEGIX. And CENTEGIX alarms us and alerts the law enforcement office. After buttons are pressed on an ID, and it alerts us that there is an active situation at the school, for whatever reason. And that was pressed. And we've had that about a week now. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've heard stories of students actually pulling other students, while they were in the hallway, while all this chaos is happening, while shooting was going on. We've heard stories about students pulling their classmates, into the classrooms, to get them to secure -- to get them to safety.
What do you think that says about these young folks, who are barely 13-, 14-, 15-years-old, that they're looking out for one another like that?
SMITH: That's admirable. Just like Director Hosey said, we have heroes among us, and those students and teachers that did that today saved a lot of lives.
This could have been a way worse than what we -- and again, the investigation is still trying to file through those -- that information. But those kids are heroes and brave as well to do that, when they hear an active shooter around them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sheriff, you talked about the--
KEMP: Let me -- let me get this one question right here. Did you have something else, Ma'am?
SAYARATH: No, it was me.
KEMP: OK.
SAYARATH: I was asking, why did the school resource officer not go looking for this kid and approach him, and why they sent a female faculty member to the room, to the algebra room he was in, with my daughter, looking for him, instead of the school resource officer? Or why the school allowed this boy to come and go from the class, all the time? He will go and sign up for the restroom pass--
SMITH: That's--
SAYARATH: --leave the class, and come back sometimes, and sometimes never come back.
SMITH: With--
SAYARATH: He has been wandering the school.
SMITH: With -- with all due respect, Ma'am, I think your information is incorrect. And our investigation is going to lead to what we have. And we will be glad to answer your questions once that's done.
SAYARATH: I guess victims are lying to you then (ph).
SMITH: Possibly.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sheriff, what can you tell us about the SROs? You talk about a lot of heroes. You talk about how one of the SROs encountered the shooter. What can you tell us about them, who they are, how long they've been working here, and what they did today. [21:15:00]
SMITH: Both of the SROs that are here at these high schools, at both of my high schools, I have two there, both of the SROs, to include a third one, was here today, not for any other reason, other than to help and assist, today.
They're the true heroes as well. They were actively looking. They had an alert, I guess, if you will. And when they interjected, or when this shooting began, they interacted with the shooter, Mr. Gray. And as soon as they made contact with him, he gave up immediately.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you share these officers' names?
SMITH: Not at this time. I'd rather not.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sure.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is the shooter, right now? You said, in custody.
SMITH: The shooter is in custody at the Barrow County Detention Center, because he is a juvenile. He's being booked in, and he will be transported to RYDC.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were officials or school administrators tipped off by a threat here before this shooting happened?
SMITH: I'm not aware of that at this time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sheriff, or Director, can say the condition on those injured that were taken to hospital. Have you got any updates on how they're doing?
HOSEY: You may have that.
SMITH: All of our victims that are at the hospital are going to make it and going to recover well, as we've been told. And we don't expect any more fatalities, at this time.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Last question.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has there been any shooting or tragedy to this scale inside a Georgia school that you're aware of? Could you speak to that?
SMITH: I can't speak to that, no.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you put this in perspective for us--
KEMP: Hey, Jeff, I'm sorry (ph).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: --what today has meant for law enforcement, for students, all those affected?
SMITH: Tragic. When someone preys on kids, it's tragic. Like I said earlier, hate is not going to prevail in our county, and hate is not going to prevail in our state. And pure evil did what happened today. That's all I can tell you. I want to continue to say that.
I'm proud of the men and women behind me. I'm proud of the women that stood beside me. I'm proud of the men and women who protected these kids. I'm proud of this staff. I'm proud of this community. And I just ask for prayers. Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Governor, is there any more your office can do to prevent shootings like this?
KEMP: Well, look, we've done a tremendous amount on school safety. But today is not the day for politics or policy.
Today is the day for an investigation, to mourn these precious Georgians that we have lost. To thank the first responders that went into the line of fire, the school staff, Superintendent, the Principal and others that are just trying to hold this community together. That's what we need to be focused on right now.
We also had a tragic loss of a firefighter, in Greene County, earlier today, before this event happened, with an explosion that killed the life of a first responder that, again, was running in to danger, when many people were trying to run out.
And that's what the focus needs to be on, tonight. I would ask everybody to continue to keep this community, these victims, and these educators, and these men and women in law enforcement, in your thoughts and prayers. Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, Governor.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just want to thank everyone for their patience, and taking the time to cover this. We ask that you continue to follow the GBI for updates. As we said earlier, we're going to continue to provide updates. It's very important that we get this information out. But, right now, we really want to focus on our victims, and--
COLLINS: You have been listening to an update, tonight, from officials in Georgia.
That was the Director of the Georgia Bureau of Investigation.
You also heard from Georgia's governor.
And the Sheriff, there, an update on that school shooting that happened today, killing two students and two teachers, who were murdered.
We just got the names of the victims. What officials told us there that two of those victims were 14-year-old students. Two were teachers. Their names are Mason Schermerhorn, who was 14-years-old. Christian Angulo, also 14. Richard Aspinwall and Christina Irimie. Those are the four victims of today's shooting, the 45th school shooting that has happened in the United States just this year alone. We also got an update from officials about the suspect who, as we know, is a 14-year-old student at that school. Still questions, tonight, that remain unanswered about how he got that gun into the school, and where it came from, and how he got access to it.
But what we do know is he is going to be booked, tonight, according to the GBI Director there, as an adult, and that will be a transfer, as we're still waiting to hear when his court appearance is going to happen.
A lot that we're learning, tonight, including from that press conference.
Joining me here tonight.
CNN's Chief Law Enforcement and Intelligence Analyst, John Miller.
And CNN Contributor, Jennifer Mascia.
Thank you both for being here.
John, obviously, a lot of questions about the shooter and how he got the gun into the school. What stood out to you from what you heard from officials there?
MILLER: Well, I think we learned a lot, particularly about that earlier threat.
[21:20:00]
So, in May of 2023 -- that we're in Barrow County now. But in May of 2023, a ninth grader who's 14 today, was an eighth grader, who was 13 at the time, and there was a gaming platform that is used by young kids a lot, where posts were made about an individual threatening to do a school shooting.
Those reports went into the FBI's West Virginia-based Threat Operations Center. They went through the processes of getting subpoenas, disclosure orders, preservation orders. They got those postings. They traced it to an IP address, and then a physical address. And the FBI passed that information to the Jackson County Sheriff, different county from this, right?
They go to the house. They interview the parents. The father tells them, according to the FBI, tells the Jackson County Sheriff, yes, there are guns in the house. Yes, we have a son, but he doesn't have access to those. Those are locked away.
They interview the 13-year-old, who says, I didn't make that threat. I know that, that threat is there, but that wasn't me.
And then, it was shared, I am told, with the school authorities there.
But then they move. They move to Barrow County. And it appears that information didn't have a way to follow them, because it was in -- it was captured by the FBI Threat Center, referred to the locals who did the investigation, turned out to be unsubstantiated, shared with the school. And now, we see this today. So, I think that was--
COLLINS: Well, and the other question they had was--
MILLER: --very revelatory.
COLLINS: And they seem to suggest that they're looking into other contacts that they had with Child Services, as the official said, there.
What kind of questions are they going to be looking into for something like that matter?
MILLER: Well, we start off with the big ones that are in front of us, which are, if there were weapons in the old house, it's presumable that those weapons traveled when the family moved there.
What was the situation with access? How did this individual get access to a rifle that was used today? The investigation's operating theory, right now, is that it came from the home, because they have no indication that it would have come from anywhere else.
And with the tipping and cueing involved here, between Child Services, the FBI tip, the Jackson County investigation, before Barrow County had this incident today. We have to ask ourself, what were the signs? Who were they shared with?
We know in 83 percent of these cases, there are indicators before a shooting, what they call leakage, and things that are noticed by teachers, students and counselors. And only half those times they're shared.
COLLINS: Yes, and the other thing that they confirmed, Jennifer, is that it was an AR--
JENNIFER MASCIA, CNN CONTRIBUTOR, WRITER, THE TRACE: Yes.
COLLINS: --they said an AR-platform style weapon. CNN confirmed, Mark Morales, earlier, that it's an AR-15 that was the gun that was used here.
MASCIA: Yes, and that doesn't surprise me. Most mass shootings are committed with handguns. But AR-15 rifles, they have this, this cache, this mystique. And we've seen a lot of mass shooters go for those.
In Georgia, there is no minimum age to possess a rifle. Now, you can't go to a gun store and buy a rifle. But people go hunting with rifles with their parents, they have access to these guns.
What's surprising to me is that after an FBI tip, and a Child Protective Services call, that this child still had access to those weapons.
Now, Georgia doesn't have any kind of a red flag law. But even if Georgia did, the red flag would be on the parents, not the minor living in the home. There's really no mechanism, within a family household, to shield a child from guns, if there's not any kind of criminal or civil liabilities or penalties in place.
COLLINS: I mean, and the fact that the shooter, though, is still alive.
So often, we are in this situation, in these other mass shootings, or shootings that happen at schools, where the shooter is deceased, and they cannot therefore interview that person.
Not only did they say earlier, they were interviewing him, they also talked about his family members as well.
They said, tonight, there's a lot of evidence that's still being evaluated.
What kind of evidence are they looking into? They mentioned a threat that happened at another school in the area. They said they went there. There was no threat to be acted upon. But there was a threat made, at a nearby school, in the same area, this morning.
MILLER: So, as a former FBI person, NYPD person, the questions I'd be asking, tonight, is that threat that came in this morning, was it designed to draw resources away, from one location, in terms of police, and did it come from someone, either the shooter or known to the shooter?
That threat, as we were told, was that there were going to be shootings at five schools, which would have divided police resources evenly between multiple locations.
[21:25:00]
One of the things that Mr. Hosey from GBI told us, at the press conference, was, we are looking hard to see if there were any compatriots involved, or any associates that might have been involved, including, you know, that would include the universe of possibly that caller.
And then, there has to be what's going on, right now, which is all right, so what guns are registered to the father? This gun is recovered now. What guns are in the house? What was the access system there?
We have all seen in cases like the Oxford, Michigan, Crumbley case, where the attention after the shooter shifts to the parents, in terms of criminal liability for was the gun too available, whether that was in this case, or a small child in Virginia, which we've seen.
COLLINS: Yes.
MILLER: So, that is kind of a new focus here.
COLLINS: The other thing that stood out was when there was -- there was clearly a parent, who maybe is also a reporter, that was there asking questions. But right before she was asking questions, they asked who notified the police? Was it a student? Was it a faculty member? And the officer said, he referred to as CENTEGIX. He said it's a badge alarm that these teachers have had. He said they've only been using it for a week. But essentially, they can push a button on it and notify authorities, when there is danger in the school.
MASCIA: That is remarkable.
And we've seen a whole industry pop up, since Sandy Hook, really, of school security, where they have silent alarm buttons. And there's a movement to get these things installed in school.
It sounds like, it worked out the best possible way it could work out, to a point, because four people still died.
So, we have school security measures. And in this day and age, let's be realistic, we need them.
COLLINS: Yes.
MASCIA: But unfortunately, lives will still be lost, possibly even when all the scenarios line up.
COLLINS: Jennifer Mascia. John Miller. Great to have you both, to break down those headlines.
I just want to read the names of the four victims, one more time, as we have them, from Georgia officials.
Mason Schermerhorn, who was 14-years-old.
Christian Angulo, 14-years-old.
And two teachers, Richard Aspinwall and Christina Irimie.
Obviously, our thoughts are with their families, and their loved ones, and everyone who knew them, tonight.
We'll continue to follow this.
Up next. We have more with a former police officer, who responded to the massacre that happened at another school, at Sandy Hook.
And also, a student who survived the Parkland shooting. David Hogg will join me, in just a moment.
We'll be right back.
[21:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: We're back, tonight, with our breaking news out of Winder, Georgia, where two students and two teachers were murdered today at school.
I want to get to CNN's Senior National Correspondent, Ryan Young, who was on the ground, and was just listening to that press conference from officials.
Ryan. And I know, obviously we've been hearing from officials, on what was happening. There was one voice that was asking questions, to those authorities, about how this happened, how this shooter was found at the school today. And I believe that you have her with you now.
RYAN YOUNG, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. So, as we were doing the news conference, and we were getting that new information, Rabecca's voice could be heard sort of over the reporters, for a clear reason, that's because she's a parent at this school. She has some concerns, about what's actually being said.
You said that you believe there was a call that came in, earlier today, that gave them an alert, and they might have actually already been looking for the student, when the shooting happened?
SAYARATH: From what everybody is saying, there was a call at 09:30 this morning, but I don't know how true that is.
All I know is that a school female worker came looking for the kid, about 10 to 15 minutes before he came back and started shooting. They got the wrong kid. They had the names mixed up. And she left.
And about 10 to 15 minutes after she left the class, that's when he came back, and approached the door that my daughter was in. And a girl went up to let him in, but saw that he had a gun, and she backed away. And I guess that's when he just started shooting everybody else.
YOUNG: I saw the Sheriff walk over to you. What was that conversation afterwards? Because obviously, I know you're a little angry, because your daughter was in that class.
SAYARATH: I basically just feel like he was calling me a liar, saying that the staff member wasn't looking for the shooter, that she was looking for the kid whose names they mixed up.
But you can't tell me it's a coincidence that you're looking for somebody, with that name, and 15 minutes later, he shoots up the school. The school should have been put in lockdown, the moment they went looking for him.
YOUNG: You said there was a pattern, though, with this particular student that even your daughter noticed. So, can you tell us, and the viewers, about that pattern?
SAYARATH: From what my daughter told me, he comes to class, and he'll sign out to use the bathroom, but not take the pass, and he'll leave class. And sometimes he'll come back. And sometimes, he won't. And today, that's what he did.
He was there when she got in class. And then, he went and signed out, and said he was going to the bathroom, but didn't take the pass, and left the classroom. And a little bit later, that's when he started shooting.
YOUNG: You took this so seriously that when your daughter called you, you got on the road immediately. Tell me about driving here. What was running through your mind? How fast you got here?
SAYARATH: I live probably about seven minutes from school. I got here in about, like, I think, about two minutes. I don't know. Everything was just flying. I pretty much, I sped the whole way here. When I got here, there was only two cop cars here, and that's the cops that worked here, so.
YOUNG: Well, I'm glad your daughter's OK. Thank you.
[21:35:00]
Kaitlan, obviously there are some mixed emotions.
And police officers are trying to figure out exactly what the steps are. We know they're reviewing surveillance video. So, as this goes on, parents do have some serious questions about how today played out.
COLLINS: Yes.
YOUNG: Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Understandably, Ryan. Thank you for being there. And please tell Rabecca, we said thank you--
YOUNG: Sure.
COLLINS: --for also joining us tonight.
YOUNG: Thank you so much. Appreciate it. Thank you.
COLLINS: I also, I want to speak to someone, tonight, who knows all too well what people like Rabecca and her daughter are feeling.
And that is David Hogg, who co-founded March for Our Lives, after the 2018 mass shooting at his school in Parkland, Florida. And most recently, he co-founded a PAC called Leaders We Deserve, to help elect young progressives.
And David, just to be in this moment, again, as we were saying, the 45th school shooting, just this year alone in the United States.
And the Sheriff that we heard from, tonight. Earlier, I was listening to him, and he said he was shocked that this happened in his community. And I get what he's saying. It's jarring to have this happen in your hometown, in your home.
But you, of all people, know that it's unfortunately not that surprising.
DAVID HOGG, PARKLAND SHOOTING SURVIVOR, CO-FOUNDER, MARCH FOR OUR LIVES: Yes. Unfortunately, it's happening in every community. And, at this point, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when, until we come together and do something about this.
And I'm just really sick and tired of the hatred and the division and the debate over and over about all this stuff, and us not focusing on what we can agree on.
After Uvalde, many people said that it wasn't going to be possible for us to change any gun laws. But for once, Congress actually did something. We expanded background checks for people under the age of 21, attempting to buy a gun. And we put billions of dollars into school safety programs and community safety programs.
And obviously, that was nowhere near enough, given that I'm talking to you, right now. But we have made progress on this. Over 800 high-risk individuals have been stopped from buying guns like the AR-15, since Uvalde, because of the passage of that law. We have so, so much more work to do.
But the point I really want to come back to is we know this is very divisive issue. We know, as a country, that we have very strong opinions on both sides of this issue. But ultimately, we all agree that nobody wants to see these school shootings continue. Nobody wants to see gun violence continue.
And I think it's time that our leaders have a real conversation, about what can we agree on, moving forward, so that these stories, these school shootings, can be left in our history books, and not in our headlines.
COLLINS: Well, and everyone remembers how you and your classmates, after several of your classmates were murdered in 2018, went to lawmakers in Florida, went to the Governor, Rick Scott, pushing them on this very issue.
I wonder, given that -- you know, we saw Governor Kemp there, Brian Kemp there, also speaking to reporters tonight. What would you -- what would your message be, to lawmakers, in Georgia, this evening?
HOGG: I mean, look, there's obviously a lot of Republicans in Georgia. There's a lot of Democrats too. My message would be to put politics aside.
We heard the Sheriff talking earlier about the importance of not politicizing this moment.
I think what it looks like to politicize this moment is frankly, doing the same thing that we've always done, which is nothing, right? Nobody wants these shootings to continue.
And what I would urge those lawmakers to do is do something potentially like a special session, in Georgia, and have some real conversations, not out in public, between the lawmakers, where they're in the public sphere, and then, they need to have their guards up a lot of the time, especially the Republicans, because they don't want to be seen talking to Democrats about this. But have a real conversation, behind closed doors, and figure out what you can agree on to move forward.
In Florida, we raised the age to buy a gun to 21, and we passed red flag law. Obviously, there's work that needs to be done as we find out more details about this incident, to make sure that we're passing things like child access prevention laws, to make sure that parents, whose child is able to access a gun, that is owned by that parent, and go and do something like this, that they're held accountable. This is child endangerment for, like, period. There's nothing more than that.
And that's what I would encourage those lawmakers to do, is have a real conversation.
And more than that, though, I would encourage the voters of Georgia, I would encourage young people, across this country, and people of all ages, to make sure that we aren't just sending our thoughts and prayers, but remembering that, it's about action.
We need to do more to address this issue, and come together, as Americans, to address this, and acknowledge the fact that we're always going to have disagreements. Why don't we come together, and focus on what we can agree on, and move forward on that? Because none of us want to see this violence continue.
COLLINS: Yes. David Hogg, thank you, for joining me, tonight.
HOGG: Absolutely.
COLLINS: We're also following some breaking news, in the political world, tonight, after Liz Cheney, who went from being one of the most -- from one of the most conservative families in America, who served in House Republican leadership, before she was abruptly removed from that post, has now said that she is voting -- who she is voting for in this election. And it is not a Republican.
[21:40:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: The politics of guns, and gun control, are likely to play out on the campaign trail, perhaps as well at the debate that is now going to happen just six days from now.
Tonight, Vice President Harris picked up a new voter, a notable one, given it is a lifelong Republican, who was once a member of House leadership.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LIZ CHENEY, FORMER UNITED STATES REPRESENTATIVE: Don't believe that we have the luxury of writing in candidates' names, particularly in swing states.
And as a conservative, as someone who believes in and cares about the Constitution. I have thought deeply about this. And because of the danger that Donald Trump poses, not only am I not voting for Donald Trump, but I will be voting for Kamala Harris, in this election.
(CHEERING) (APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:45:00]
COLLINS: The room erupting into cheers after you heard the former Wyoming congresswoman, Liz Cheney, making that announcement, at Duke University, in the swing state of North Carolina, tonight.
And with that, in the last 24 hours, Harris has picked up support from not just a Cheney, but also a McCain, two of the biggest family names in Republican politics, over the last several decades.
The one and only Dana Bash is here with me, who is also the author of her new book, "America's Deadliest Election."
And I want to talk about the book in a moment.
But what is it like for you, someone who has covered politics, been on the Hill--
DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR & CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, AUTHOR, "AMERICA'S DEADLIEST ELECTION": Yes.
COLLINS: --to see Liz Cheney, coming out and saying, I'm voting for a Democrat?
BASH: And I covered the Bush-Cheney White House. If you would have told me that anybody related to Vice President Cheney would be voting for a Democrat? I would have told you to have your head examined.
But it's just the latest data point in the fact that this is not the same Republican Party that Dick Cheney grew up in and that he served in. Obviously, we know that it's not the same Republican Party that Liz Cheney served in, because she had to leave, and she was effectively kicked out of the leadership. And same goes for John McCain. It is just a completely different world.
And with each of these big decisions that people like Liz Cheney -- and you heard her say, I am a conservative. It's not like she has changed her politics. She still believes in many, many things that are very different, and at odds with what Kamala Harris agrees, supports. But they agree on one thing. And that is they believe Donald Trump is a threat to democracy.
COLLINS: Well, and I think so many people are watching something like that, at Duke, tonight, and saying, What a remarkable election that we're living through, nothing's ever happened like this. Which I think is true.
But in your new book, which is fascinating, on "America's Deadliest Election," it follows this contentious election in 1872, in Louisiana. I think a lot of people, I certainly hadn't--
BASH: Nor had I. COLLINS: Had never -- had no idea what happened.
BASH: This -- and people sort of say, Oh, America's deadliest election. Are we talking about 2020? Oh, no.
COLLINS: Yes.
BASH: What happened in 2020, and into 2021, was horrific and tragic.
What happened in 1872 was a series of riots, of absolute chaos, total corruption, real corruption, fraud and violence against -- specifically against Black Americans, who were now, this is during the Reconstruction Era, finally able to vote.
And the segregationists in the south realized that the way to keep Blacks from gaining power and gaining more status in society was to keep them from voting. And it really started there.
And there was a massacre called the Colfax massacre that happened during this election. After the -- there was absolutely no way to tell who won the governor's race, who won the legislature, because everything was so compromised.
And a 150 Black men were murdered in cold blood. And all they were trying to do was trying to find a way to get their votes counted, after this crazy election.
The way that they tried to find justice for these people, who were murdered, was to go through the federal judicial system. It went all the way up to the Supreme Court.
The Supreme Court decided a really important decision called Cruikshank. And what they decided was it would be the state government that would be determining civil rights, including election rights, and not the federal government. And that ushered in the Jim Crow laws, for 100 years, in this country. And it started with this election in 1872.
COLLINS: Yes, and obviously -- I'm from neighboring Alabama. Just, I mean, learning about that, growing up, and the impact that that had on, on so many people still alive, and seeing how voting changed.
BASH: Yes.
COLLINS: But when you -- when you were researching this, and writing this book, what parallels did you see, between what was happening in the 1870s with what we are witnessing right now?
BASH: Well, there are so many.
And this really kind of blew my mind that if you fast forward to 1876, where there was the same corruption, and fraud issues, and disenfranchise -- disenfranchisement of Black voters. It was so bad that four states had to -- Congress had to throw out four states' electoral slates, because it was such a mess, you couldn't tell who really won. And there was a debate then, Kaitlan, you'll appreciate this, about whether the Vice President had a role in actually deciding which electoral slate would be admitted, or whether it was ceremonial. And they decided it was ceremonial.
COLLINS: Wow.
BASH: And so, that had already been determined 100 years, more than 100 years earlier.
[21:50:00]
Also, the main character in this book, who was the Governor of Louisiana, who was very charismatic, has a lot of traits that you will find quite familiar. He was somebody, who had people who loved to love him and loved to hate him. He was very open about changing the rules, if it suited him, and about doing whatever it took to stay in power. And there are lots of similarities between those two characters.
COLLINS: Have you sent a signed copy to Mar-a-Lago, yet?
BASH: It's on its way.
COLLINS: Dana Bash. Great to have you.
BASH: Thanks, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: The book is "America's Deadliest Election." It's great. Everyone should read it.
And a reminder that CNN will have complete coverage, and exclusive analysis before and after that debate that I was mentioning. ABC News Presidential Debate Simulcast, right here, Tuesday, 09:00 p.m. Eastern on CNN.
Up next. The U.S. government today has now accused Russia of trying to interfere with the upcoming election, again, but with a new twist this time.
Former National Security Adviser, John Bolton, is here to weigh in.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Tonight, the Justice Department is pointing the finger directly at Vladimir Putin for, again, attempting to interfere in U.S. elections.
According to a new indictment, this time, the Kremlin's influence operation allegedly included funneling money and propaganda directly into the hands of some of the most prominent voices in right-wing media.
CNN has confirmed tonight that the nearly $10 million went to Tenet Media. And among the commentators, there are podcasters you might be familiar with, Benny Johnson and Tim Pool. Both of them have millions of subscribers, on YouTube, and other social media platforms. And in fact, some of the same narratives that the Kremlin was pushing came up, when Pool interviewed Donald Trump, just in May.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TIM POOL, AMERICAN COMMENTATOR AND JOURNALIST: It's kind of scary to think about, but you take a look at the weakness we have now with Ukraine, and the money that we are wasting.
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: When you look at Ukraine, we're giving all of this money. Europe, which is much more affected by that war than us, is spending just a tiny fraction of what we're spending. And you say, Does anybody at least get involved in this?
But more importantly, I will end that war. I'll get it ended. Putin respects me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I should note. Johnson and Pool, both say tonight that they maintained control of their content, and say that they were victims of the alleged scheme.
My next guest met face-to-face with Putin, on this very issue, back in 2018, where he delivered this message.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN BOLTON, FORMER TRUMP NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE U.N.: It's a lesson, I think, don't mess with American elections.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:55:00]
COLLINS: At the end time -- at the time, Ambassador John Bolton was Donald Trump's National Security Adviser.
Ambassador Bolton, it's great to have you.
Because when you look at this indictment and the part about this and the money that they were allegedly funneling, to this Nashville -- this Tennessee-based media group. In 2016, it was a troll farm posing as Americans and grassroots activists.
What do you make of the allegations in this indictment that the Kremlin is now trying to use actual American influences, whether -- influencers, whether it's to their knowledge or not?
BOLTON: Well, it's not at all surprising. If anything surprising is that they weren't doing it earlier.
If you go back just a little bit in history, the 1940s, and the 1950s, the communist Soviet Union realized that Hollywood had a big influence on American opinion. So, taking control of the studios, getting their kinds of actors and scriptwriters in, was a major communist effort to infiltrate Hollywood. And a few people stood up to it, like Ronald Reagan, the union man, head of the Screen Actors Guild, to push that back.
So, this idea of influencing influencers from Russia, it's in their playbook. And I'm not at all surprised they're doing it in this election, and probably others that we haven't uncovered yet.
COLLINS: Well, and maybe some people watching are not familiar with people like Benny Johnson and Tim Pool. But they do have millions of subscribers, on YouTube, on social media platforms. Obviously, you just saw that one of them interviewed Donald Trump, in May. Republicans, lawmakers go and speak to them or quote them on Twitter and whatnot.
I just want -- it made us think about what the Republican Intelligence chair, Mike Turner -- Republican House Intel chair, Mike Turner, had to say back in April about this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE TURNER (R-OH): We see directly coming from Russia, attempts to mask communications that are anti-Ukraine and pro-Russia messages, some of which we even hear being uttered on the House floor.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I mean, how successful do you believe Russia has been, in influencing Republicans, on issues like Ukraine?
BOLTON: Well, again, to go back into Russian history. Vladimir Lenin used to call people like that useful idiots.
And there are a few useful idiots, in Congress, today, on the Republican side, and I'm sure, the Russians are trying to take advantage of. It's really a twofer for Russians, or others trying this kind of influencing.
One, I think they do want Donald Trump to be president. Because unlike Trump's opinion of his relationship with Putin, Putin thinks Trump is an easy mark, so he'd be happy to deal with him.
But it has a secondary and perhaps even more significant effect, because this kind of propaganda undercuts Americans' faith in their own institutions, and it turns Americans against each other.
People who hate Donald Trump will now say more Russian interference, we knew it was true all along.
And die-hard Trump supporters will say, They've politicized the Justice Department again. Here's another prosecution of poor people just trying to help Donald Trump out.
COLLINS: Yes.
BOLTON: So, this sowing of discontent, distrust is very significant.
COLLINS: Yes. I mean, you see people, who now doubt what we read in an indictment, like today.
I got to ask you about something else. Because back in April, you were sitting here with me on this show. You told me that you were writing in Dick Cheney for the election. You're not voting for your former boss, Donald Trump.
You heard Liz Cheney say today that she's voting for Harris, despite being conservative. And she said it is important for people to recognize not only is what I've said about the danger that Trump poses, something that should prevent people from voting for him, but I don't believe we have the luxury of writing in candidates' names.
Does that change your opinion at all?
BOLTON: Certainly not.
I was coming under pressure not to vote for Dick Cheney, to vote for Liz. But, I guess, with her comments today, maybe I'll just stick with Dick Cheney.
It's not a luxury to be able to write in somebody other than the two major party candidates. It's important. It's a protest vote. I understand my vote will not elect a president that has no chance to. But in Maryland, where I live, I have no chance to affect the Electoral College outcome there anyway.
And I am not going to vote for anybody with whom I have a principled disagreement, or think they're not fit to be president. It's a sad commentary, on our political process, that we've got two such inadequate candidates now.
[22:00:00]
And I don't agree with the idea that somehow the Constitution is such a piece of weak paper that Donald Trump is a threat to it. Donald Trump will cause a lot of damage, if he is elected in a second term. He is not an existential threat to American democracy. If you really think that, you must think this country isn't worth much.
Because, we've gone 235 years with this Constitution. We've survived a lot worse than Donald Trump. And this kind of comment undercuts those who are trying to see Trump put in this place.
COLLINS: And, of course, there are certainly people who feel that way.
Ambassador John Bolton, thank you for joining us, tonight.
BOLTON: Thank you.
COLLINS: And thank you all so much for joining us, in this busy hour.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" starts now.
