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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump, Harris To Meet For First Time In Debate Face-Off; Project 2025 Architect Speaks For First Time Since Resigning; NFL Star Tyreek Hill On Detainment: I'm Still "Shell-Shocked." Aired 9-10p ET
Aired September 09, 2024 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RANDI KAYE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): --but after a teacher helped him write and read poetry.
JAMES EARL JONES, AWARD-WINNING ACTOR: And he discovered I wrote poetry, and he got me to read my poetry in front of the class. And when I did, I didn't stutter.
KAYE (voice-over): Jones eventually found his distinctive, thundering voice. And those vocal cords of his launched a career he'd never imagined. Not just Hollywood, but Broadway too. He won three Tony Awards, including one in 1969, for his role in "The Great White Hope."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your wish coming true, huh?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Never this. Never this, Jack.
KAYE (voice-over): He may not have done it all, but for James Earl Jones, he'd done enough.
EARL JONES: Death is OK. It is something that happens to all of us.
KAYE (voice-over): James Earl Jones was 93.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: An extraordinary life.
The news continues. "THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts now. I'll see you, tomorrow.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Straight from THE SOURCE tonight.
Vice President Harris wheels down in Philadelphia, as Donald Trump is wrapping up his prep from Mar-a-Lago, ahead of their first and perhaps only debate.
Plus, a SOURCE-exclusive for you tonight. A mastermind behind Project 2025 is here, for his first TV interview, since resigning. Donald Trump is trying to disavow the roadmap for his second term, as Democrats use it against him.
And Miami Dolphins star, Tyreek Hill, is here to join me tonight, after police just released body cam footage of the traffic accident -- incident, where he was dragged out of his car, and placed in handcuffs, just hours before the Dolphins season opener. Actions that his legal team calls excessive.
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
As they say, the stage is set, and this is what you'll see, tomorrow night, when Donald Trump and Kamala Harris come face-to-face, for the first time ever, I should note, at these two podiums, in Philadelphia. Vice President Harris will be at the lectern on the right side of your screen. Donald Trump on the left. And it will all take place in just 24 hours from right now.
Harris has arrived, tonight, in Philadelphia, after spending several days prepping across the state, in Pittsburgh.
Trump, we are told, remains at his Mar-a-Lago club, and he'll arrive there, tomorrow, after a weekend out on the campaign trail, where he was pushing election conspiracies, and threatening to jail election officials.
Harris, for her part, has had this prediction, about how she thinks tomorrow will go, in a new interview, out today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S., (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: He plays from this really old and tired playbook, right? Where he -- there's no floor for him in terms of how low he will go and, um, and we should be prepared for that.
And he tends to fight for himself, not for the American people. And I think that's going to come out during the course of the debate.
I think he's going to lie, and um, you know, he has a playbook that he has used in the past, um be it, you know, his attacks on President Obama or Hillary Clinton. So we should expect that some of that might come out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: Our sources tell us that, given what she's expecting might come out, tomorrow, Harris is bracing for a barrage of attacks. And not only has she been studying Trump's past policy positions, but also his past insults about her.
Meanwhile, the Trump campaign is telling us that he'll make the case that Harris, quote, owns everything, when it comes to the policies of the Biden administration.
Officials say that Trump will be himself, something that even his own allies are privately wondering whether it will help or hurt him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS (R-AR): He'll go in, game-time ready, just as he does for every interview, every rally that he does. This is not something that is a heavy lift for him.
GOV. DOUG BURGUM (R-ND): Well, I think that when he stays on the issues, policies, absolutely, those are -- those are the winning issues.
SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD): Well, I think just, you know, stay focused on the issues, and you know, don't make -- don't make things personal.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: The throughline is clear. They would like for Trump to stay focused on the issues.
The Trump team is also teasing to expect some surprises, tomorrow night.
I should note that what we are going to watch, tomorrow night, all of us, could be the first and only debate that we see between Harris and Trump.
I want to get straight to my panel of political experts, tonight, to start us off.
And David Axelrod, you know what this feeling is like. I mean, this is incredibly--
DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER TO PRES. OBAMA: I'm having PTSD. Yes.
K. COLLINS: I mean, the pressure, after looking at the polls that came out yesterday, from The New York Times and Siena College, showing this race could not be tighter, voters still have questions about at least one of these candidates.
What are the 24 hours before a debate like?
AXELROD: They're incredibly anxious, you know?
But the thing is that if you've prepared well, then you should have some confidence that you know the questions that are going to be asked, and you also know how you're going to answer them, and how Trump is likely going to answer them. And you prepare for something that you can't predict, because Trump is an asymmetrical fighter, so he can say or do anything.
I think the goal for her is to stay focused on her mission, which is to deliver her message, to the American people.
[21:05:00]
But one thing I want to point out. Normally, like when we -- we had a bad debate in 2012, famously with President Obama, the first debate, we had two more debates after that. We had a vice presidential debate in between. So, the stakes of that debate were not nearly as great.
This is probably the last debate. It's the last big event, between now and the election, where they will have an audience, like this, to try and influence voters.
K. COLLINS: Yes, and I've heard from sources, on both sides, that they think there will be another debate. I think it depends on how tomorrow goes.
But can you over-prep for a debate? I mean, Trump always invokes the Mitt Romney debate, saying that he was--
AXELROD: Well.
K. COLLINS: --too prepared for--
(CROSSTALK)
AXELROD: Actually, Mitt Romney did pretty damn well in that first debate. I wish he had prepared a little less, for that debate.
But -- so, I mean, Trump is Trump, OK? And people who say, Gee, I hope he'll stick to the issues and so on? This is his seventh presidential debate. There's not a whole lot of evidence. No one's ever had more, by the way, which is an advantage for him. But he's not going to change.
He's almost 80-years-old. He's not going to change. He's going to be more like he's ever been. And especially if she is composed and confident, I think it's going to be hard for him, if she doesn't engage on the terms that he likes to set for these debates.
K. COLLINS: Yes, and he's such a known quantity to everyone, who will be watching, all the millions. She is not as known. I mean, we know her well. You worked with her. I covered her.
But for those, who don't know her, who are going to be tuning in. One, I just think the image of the contrast, the two of them will be striking, for people watching.
But what does she need to do, on that stage, tomorrow night, do you think?
ASHLEY ALLISON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, NATIONAL COALITIONS DIRECTOR, BIDEN-HARRIS 2020 CAMPAIGN: I really hope she is herself.
I agree with David. She has prepared. She knows where she wants to stand on issues.
And for those who do not know her yet, allow her to reintroduce -- introduce herself, and reintroduce herself to voters, and do a couple of things. One, I'm the adult in the room, and I can do this job. Two, things are not great, but they can get better under my leadership. And three, look at this guy. Do you want to do that again? No. That's all she needs to do. And I think, all -- there's a whole bunch of pontification going on about this. I think if she can land those three things, and then B, do it in her own way? Don't do it in a robotic way that people think like this is how a woman candidate has to present herself.
When she's out there on the campaign trail, people love her. She's personable. She's an engaging human being. Don't talk to him. Respectfully. Don't talk to the moderator. Talk to the American people.
AXELROD: For the record, I like Harry.
HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL DATA REPORTER: Thank you.
ALLISON: I'm sorry. But--
ENTEN: I was wondering what was going on.
ALLISON: You were a -- you were a Trump stand-in. I'm sorry, Harry. I like you too.
ENTEN: I'd like to think I have better hair than he does. But whatever.
ALLISON: I'm sorry, no, that wasn't -- that wasn't personal.
K. COLLINS: OK. But Harry, really, I mean, you looked at these numbers too. And I know the Harris campaign is saying a lot of don't -- ignore the polls. Don't focus on that. Focus on what we want to get done.
ENTEN: Yes, sure, OK, whatever. Everyone's looking at the polls every five seconds, even if they say they're not.
I mean, look, if you look at the polling data, what we know is that Kamala Harris came out, when she became the presumptive Democratic nominee, and skyrocketed up, right, took that mantle, took that momentum.
And ever since then, she's kind of flatlined a little bit, maybe dropped a little bit, in some of those key battleground states, like Pennsylvania. Tonight -- tomorrow night is a chance to sort of turn the tide, say, Wait a minute. I'm going to take hold of this campaign.
We know from those New York Times, Siena College polls, what is it? 28 percent of percent of voters say they want to hear they need to hear more about Kamala Harris. If you look at those who are undecided, that number is actually nearly double that. It's near 50 percent of undecided voters who say that.
So, the bottom line is, tomorrow night's a real opportunity, because Donald Trump has consistently been disliked by more voters than he has been liked. And she has to say, You know what? I'm going to take this. If you don't like Donald Trump, vote for me. I can be an adequate stand-in.
The real question's going to be is, can she actually deliver those lines in a way that matches up with how popular she is now, versus, let's say, those second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth, however number of debates there were back in the 2020 Democratic primary season, where her debate performances kind of fell off.
She has to be the person who showed up in that first debate, against Joe Biden, who delivered that great line, and not be the person who show up in those latter debates that honestly seemed a little bit canned.
K. COLLINS: Yes. And Erin, you worked for Donald Trump, the last time he was running for president. And I think one thing that he has been kind of scarred by was how that first debate with Biden went. He himself has recognized that he was too aggressive in that.
I want you to just listen how the two candidates are setting the expectations, for tomorrow night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: You know, if I destroy her in the debate, they will say, Trump suffered a humiliating defeat tonight, no matter what.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What's the one thing you want to really get -- get across to him?
HARRIS: Well, there's a lot. But look, it's time to turn the page on the divisiveness. It's time to bring our country together, chart a new way forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:10:00]
K. COLLINS: What's happening inside the Trump campaign, if you had to guess, tonight? What does this scene at Mar-a-Lago look like?
ERIN PERRINE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST, DIRECTOR OF PRESS COMMUNICATIONS, TRUMP'S 2020 CAMPAIGN: This evening, they're probably just going through the last set of questions, like it's probably much more casual.
It's not a very formal setup. Especially not the way they did it in 2016, which was very formal debate prep. 2020, it was a little less formal. They felt that being president, every day, and doing the press conferences and everything that he was doing at the time, that was good practice.
Here, he's brought in Tulsi Gabbard. But honestly, he's probably not doing a ton, necessarily, in the traditional debate prep. Also, it's the night before, right? You don't necessarily want to overdo it, the night before the big game, and get too much into your head. So if you're him, right now, you just got to hang out, and make sure that when it comes to tomorrow.
Because if you're Kamala Harris, part of this is, you know, you can knock Trump off his mark. But what is it, and how are you going to do it? And he just needs to know that she's going to be trying to do that tomorrow. And just stay on your mark. That muted mic will be the most helpful thing for him, tomorrow night, to stay on his mark.
K. COLLINS: Well, and the muted mic thing, the Harris campaign is very upset with. They had fought it basically, tooth and nail, trying to -- because they believed it would be more effective for her to be able to cut in and interject when Trump is speaking.
Is it harder for her if she can't do that tomorrow night?
AXELROD: Well, I think one thing that will be hard is if he's speaking, but his mic is muted, and she's hearing it, but the audience isn't hearing it, that's a distraction. And I think that's more difficult.
But I think it's interesting that his campaign was so emphatic that that the mic remained muted, because I think it does reflect a realization that he can go overboard. So, he's got seat belts, for tomorrow night.
ENTEN: I would just add. Until the debate between Joe Biden and Donald Trump, this year, Donald Trump had basically lost every single general election debate. So, they want to stick to the format that they had against Joe Biden, because it's the only time he's actually won a gosh darn debate.
AXELROD: Yes, but the question is, was it because of the muted mic.
ALLISON: Right.
ENTEN: Ah.
AXELROD: Or the muted opponent?
ALLISON: Yes.
ENTEN: We will find out, tomorrow night.
ALLISON: I think--
K. COLLINS: Well, and that's a great -- great point. We saw this contrast, last time, with Trump and Biden, obviously, on Biden's age. It is what ultimately drove him from this race.
Tomorrow night, by a lot, Donald Trump will be the oldest candidate on that stage.
ALLISON: Yes, if we can go back, I don't know, two months ago? The American public will say--
K. COLLINS: Perfect (ph).
ALLISON: --you know, it's like, feels like a lifetime, at this point. But the American public was saying they didn't want a rematch of Joe Biden and Donald Trump. Well, guess what? They don't have it anymore. And so, they get to choose, if they do want to turn the page, to the next generation. One party made that choice. One party didn't. And so, I think that that contrast will come out on the debate stage.
PERRINE: But--
K. COLLINS: Is there a risk of Trump rambling, like he did with his child care answer, the other day, which he and Biden could not -- neither could answer at the first debate. He still has not developed an answer to it, clearly.
PERRINE: I mean, is there a possibility that Donald Trump is going to ramble in an answer? Yes. Will it be on child care, specifically? That I don't know. And who knows if he'll even get the question about it.
Honestly, debates don't pick winners of campaigns. But they definitely can decide the losers of campaigns. It is not -- when you win a debate, it's generally because your opponent did so poorly, and you were able to capitalize on those moments.
Remember the Terry McAuliffe-Glenn Youngkin race, right? That debate, Terry McAuliffe said, during it, he talked about parents and not being able -- and that the state should have more access to their children's education than he -- should. That's a paraphrase. But -- parents -- it was more about state being able to control things. The Youngkin team immediately clipped that and put that out.
And this was at the time when, especially in Northern Virginia, when you were looking at like Fairfax County and Loudoun County, where parents were getting super-upset about school boards and the way their children were being treated--
K. COLLINS: Yes.
PERRINE: --coming out of COVID.
It didn't pick the winner of the debate, but it certainly made the moment for McAuliffe, to have a huge mess up. That's what Kamala wants to avoid, tomorrow.
K. COLLINS: Yes. We'll see if there's any of those moments, tomorrow night.
Thank you all. We'll all be watching it together, tomorrow night. And one subject that is likely to come up is Project 2025.
Up next. I have an exclusive first TV interview with the former Director of Project 2025, who resigned after backlash from the Trump campaign.
Plus, Miami Dolphins wide receiver star, Tyreek Hill, is here to join me, live, after he was detained by police, yesterday. And now, we are seeing the body cam video, for the first time, in was -- his attorneys say was excessive behavior, by the police.
[21:15:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
K. COLLINS: Vice President Harris, and Democrats, have continued to attack Donald Trump, over his connections to Project 2025, the conservative blueprint for a potential second Trump term.
And it's a message that seems to be resonating with voters. New numbers from The New York Times and Siena College polls show that three quarters of likely voters say they've not only heard about it. But for most of those, who know about it, they oppose it. 63 percent of that number oppose to Project 2025.
Those numbers might explain Trump's multiple attempts, to distance himself from Project 2025, overall.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We have nothing to do with Project 25.
I don't even know what the hell it is.
I don't know anything about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: Listen to what the former Trump staffer, turned Project 2025 Director, himself has said about it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL DANS, FORMER DIRECTOR, PROJECT 2025: We're going to make this happen under President Trump.
It's going to be a D-Day invasion plan.
I'm a forever Trumper.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: And now, for his first television interview, since he stepped down, as the Director of Project 2025, in July, I am joined by Paul Dans.
It's great to have you here.
I mean, as you know, given what we've seen, from the conventions, it's almost inevitable that this will be brought up, on the debate stage, tomorrow night. Are you worried that your work could be a liability, for Trump, when he's on stage up there tomorrow?
DANS: No, not at all.
And thank you for having me, Kaitlan.
[21:20:00] Look, President Trump's the greatest debater, bar none, of our time. And the breaking news is Trump has nothing to do with Project 2025. Sure, a lot of us have worked in the admin and came together. But this started long before he even announced for president. It was really a coming together of the conservative movement. And I think that's what's been so threatening to the left.
Our side's always been prone to infighting. And what we were able to do here was bring together 110 groups, and really lay out a commonsense plan. Not everyone agrees in what's in that book. But the book's only actually part of the plan. And what we did was really invite people, from all over the country, to get back into their government.
K. COLLINS: Well, I think that's why -- you know, I was reading through it again, in recent days. When people say Trump has nothing to do with it.
I mean, you worked as the Deputy Chief of Staff at the Office of Personnel Management, a pretty significant office. Six of his former cabinet secretaries helped collaborate or write on it. I mean, you look at it, and it's full of names that people would recognize. Chris Miller. Peter Navarro. Johnny McEntee.
And so, some people see, OK, well, 140 of his staffers worked on it, how can you say that he has nothing to do with it?
DANS: Well, he personally didn't have anything to do with it. Certainly, a lot of folks worked on it, came out of the Trump administration. But that's natural, for any Republican administration, you're going to have to carry over for the next one. And in this case, it's conservative.
But look, those ideas were open to Joe Biden, and to implement, if he wants to. And they actually are.
K. COLLINS: It's very--
DANS: That's the funny thing.
K. COLLINS: It is very conservative.
Does it bother you, when Trump calls it abysmal and ridiculous? I mean, something that you worked on, for two years?
DANS: Well, I mean, I don't know what he's referring to, in particular, with that.
Certainly, there were some remarks by people at Heritage that I would fully renounce. Any kind of talking about the Second American Revolution, or bloodlessness. We have to lower the temperature in this country.
But as far as the ideas within Project 2025, I think, they're pretty solid. The reality is that most of what people think is in Project 2025 is, in fact, not in it. It's mainly misinformation. K. COLLINS: There's a few things that Democrats have said that's not true, like on Social Security.
But a lot of it, revoking access to Mifepristone, which is the abortion medication that the FDA approved 24 years ago. I mean, that is part of it, when it comes to that. You want to get rid of the Inflation Reduction Act, which helped lower the cost of prescription drugs. Those are all part of it.
And when you say Trump has nothing to do with it? If he's reelected, do you think that parts of Project 2025 would ultimately come to fruition, in a Trump second term?
DANS: Well, I hope so. To be fair, 400 people worked on that book. And not everyone, who wrote for the book agrees with everything in the book. It's a coming together of our movement that only a plotting of points, to basically direct the next conservative president, This is a way what the conservatives would like to see.
Certainly, I think even under a Harris administration, you see a number of ideas. They're commonsense. These are the things Americans want.
And in fact, there's some polling that when people actually look at the issues discussed, restoring the family, and really helping us provide for kids, and shoring up our borders?
K. COLLINS: Yes.
DANS: There's great public standing in favor of it.
K. COLLINS: How many times have you been to Mar-a-Lago?
DANS: Several, several, sure.
K. COLLINS: And you meet with Trump campaign people? Or who do you talk to when you're there?
DANS: Well, I've met -- well, they're not at the Mar-a-Lago, per se. But yes, I've met with Susie. And from time to time, we have a little bit of interchange. But it's very limited with respect to Project 2025, sure.
K. COLLINS: Have you met with Trump himself?
DANS: I've only met him, shaken hands with him.
K. COLLINS: And when was -- was that recently?
DANS: Well, I spoke at the National Religious Broadcasters Convention, in Tennessee. So, I met him in the -- in the snaps (ph) line, and I met him a couple years prior. But no, I really haven't met President Trump.
K. COLLINS: So, when you say Trump has nothing to do with it, you're saying he wasn't personally, he didn't write it, he didn't collaborate on it.
But I looked at some past things you said, and you said that this is ultimately his direction and his team's direction. I think people might doubt that he has nothing to do with it, given comments like that, that you've met him, that you've been to Mar-a-Lago?
DANS: Well, he hasn't been personally briefed by myself. Or, I don't know what the nature of his campaign briefings on it have been.
But certainly, we're picking up where he left off, in the first term. A lot of us have worked there, and we're frustrated. I mean, what Project 2025, really is, it's not a threat to democracy. It's a threat to bureaucracy. It's putting the American, We, the People, back into our government.
[21:25:00]
Right now, we have a permanent government in Washington. And this is the essence of a call to people to come serve in Washington. It's Kennedy-esque. It's really. And that's what's so exciting to see, like RFK Jr. and the rest, joining the Heritage -- joining the Trump fold, is that that this is a coming together for our country.
K. COLLINS: Are the people joining the Trump campaign? RFK Jr.? Corey Lewandowski has returned. Are they more open to Project 2025, and its ideas?
DANS: I think that the ideas in Project 2025, we talk about making America healthy again. We are definitely going after HHS. And we can't remember -- we can't forget what happened here, three years ago, with COVID and the jabs.
K. COLLINS: Well, let me explain why I asked that. Because you stepped down. It seemed kind of abrupt, given this was a blueprint for a second term. You left in July.
And when you did, Susie, who you just mentioned, that's Susie Wiles and Chris LaCivita, they're running the Trump campaign.
They put out a statement, after your departure, that said Trump's "Campaign has been very clear for over a year that Project 2025 had nothing to do with the campaign, did not speak for the campaign, and should not be associated with the campaign or... in any way. Reports of Project 2025's demise would be greatly welcomed and should serve as notice to anyone or any group trying to misrepresent their influence with President Trump and his campaign -- it will not end well for you."
What was your response to that very forceful denunciation of your work?
DANS: Well, with apologies to Mark Twain, I'd say, the reports of my demise have been greatly exaggerated.
The reality is that, look, we haven't had interchange with the campaign. A lot of this was done, way before President Trump even announced for office. A lot of the Heritage folks worked with the DeSantis campaign. So, you can -- you might actually say it's more of a DeSantis Project 2025.
K. COLLINS: Well Trump's name is in the document, 300 times.
DANS: Well he's the--
K. COLLINS: DeSantis' is not.
DANS: Yes, he's the former President, you know? But like, when it came time to debut the book, at the Heritage 50th anniversary, President Trump wasn't invited by Heritage management. They instead gave the seat of honor to Governor DeSantis. So, I think, it's very ironic that it's now getting mapped to him. It's -- that's fake news.
But to be fair, it's natural that a lot of these ideas, because there were great -- there were great things that he was on the verge of accomplishing.
K. COLLINS: Do you think Trump's campaign managers are doing a good job?
DANS: I'm excited about the change, with Corey coming in, with the RFK Jr. edition. That's -- this really exciting. Dr. Carson is a godsend. And, yes, I really think that this is an opportunity, for our country, to really heal, come together.
The President's had an extraordinary year. The gentleman almost died, but for the grace of God. And I think it's, you know, we sit here in New York, on the eve of September 11th here. I was here for 20 years. And I still remember after that how--
K. COLLINS: Yes.
DANS: --people came together. And I think we have that movement, now.
K. COLLINS: You worked in the last Trump administration. Would you work in a second Trump term?
DANS: Well, I'd obviously be honored to be asked by the President. But it's so important we get that second term. And I think that that's really what we need to be concentrating on now.
I think the President has had -- we had great peace and prosperity, four years of Trump. You know what Trump's going to offer. It's not what's in the book of Project 2025. It's what he's telling you, what he did. He brought us peace. He brought us rising an economy, rising wages. And we know that for certain.
With Kamala Harris, Kamala Harris, rather, she's an unknown. But we know she's the most radical. She makes Biden look like a moderate.
K. COLLINS: I think she would obviously push back on that.
Paul Dans, thank you for joining us, for your first TV interview.
DANS: Thank you.
K. COLLINS: Up next. Miami Dolphins wide receiver, Tyreek Hill, was detained by police, after a traffic stop. And we now have the body cam footage of that moment, as police pulled him out of his car, and pushed him to the ground.
We're going to speak to Tyreek Hill, right after a quick break.
[21:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
K. COLLINS: Some breaking news for you tonight, is that Miami-Dade County Police have just released this dramatic new body cam footage of the NFL star, Tyreek Hill, as he was pulled from his car, and placed in handcuffs, yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get out. Get out. Get out.
TYREEK HILL, MIAMI DOLPHINS PLAYER DETAINED BY POLICE: I'm getting out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get out. Get out.
HILL: Damn.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What (inaudible) this time.
HILL: Hey, Drew. Hey, Drew, I'm getting arrested, Drew. I'm getting arrested.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we got all day (ph).
HILL: I'm getting arrested, Drew.
I'm getting out. Dear God (inaudible).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When we tell you to do something, you do it.
HILL: I'm doing that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You understand?
HILL: I'm doing that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You understand? Now will you--
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: And just a few moments later, this happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: Hold on, bro. I just had surgery on my knee. I just had surgery on my knee, bro.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You got ear surgery--
HILL: I just had surgery on my knee, bro.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Really? What a coincidence?
HILL: I just--
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You had surgery in your ears when we told you to put your window down?
HILL: Oh, chill, bro. Chill, bro. I don't know (ph), bro.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back off. Back off. Back off.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (inaudible).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back off.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (inaudible).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: I want to get straight to THE SOURCE, tonight, with a man in that video, NFL star, Tyreek Hill.
And also, his attorney, Julius Collins, join me tonight.
Thank you both so much for being here.
I mean, Tyreek, obviously watching that video, just when you watched it back, for the first time, tell me what was -- what was going through your mind, in those moments.
[21:35:00]
HILL: Man, for real, I was -- I was like, I was shocked, man, like, it's crazy, because it all happened so fast, man. But like for me, man, like, it just all happened so fast. And I really couldn't, like, gather everything that was happening. So, it was crazy, you know?
And me being a father, me being a husband, and all that, man, I was just putting myself in that situation, like, Hey, I got to be smart. You know what I'm saying? That's where I really I wasn't on that kind of energy, like I was chilling, like I was following rules. You know what I'm saying?
I wasn't moving fast because, you know, I got injuries. You feel me? I got things that I go through. I play a physical sport. I've been doing this, for a moment now, man. So, I'm dealing with some stuff. So, I guess, the officers, they felt like I wasn't doing it on their timing.
But I will -- I was doing it. But, you know, man, I'm still kind of shell-shocked from it, man.
K. COLLINS: Yes.
HILL: Like, I'm embarrassed, you know? But--
K. COLLINS: Well, and when you watch it--
HILL: --here we are.
K. COLLINS: --can you just, can you tell us what happened with the moment with - you didn't see it there in the video. But you're in the car. They're yelling at you to roll your window down. What was happening there?
HILL: You know what? When the officer came up, and knocked on my window, I let my window down, cooperated. Gave him my ID. And then, I immediately let up my window. And then, after that, I let -- I let back up my window.
And then he came back to the window, and was like, let your window down now, let your window down now. And then, I let it down. That's when he said, If you don't let your window down, I'm going to snatch you out of the car. I was like, sir, my window is down, like, what do you want?
I'm not trying to cause a scene. Because A, if I let my window down, like people walking by, driving by, they're going to notice is that it's me, and they going to start taking pictures. And I -- like I -- like I didn't want to create a scene at all, like, I just really wanted to get the ticket, and then just go on about my way, and then just, you know, just have a great Sunday. You know what I'm saying?
Because really, like, I really could have just kept going to the stadium, but I really just pulled to the side, just chilling, because I was -- I was that close to the stadium, like I was that close to, like, our entry level on, like I was that close to the players entry level.
And then, from that moment, the guy came from the back, he was like, Hey, get out. He was like, Hey, I'm about to snatch you out the car, or whatever. You know what I'm saying? And then it just all unfolded from there.
Because I was going to get out my car. You know what I'm saying? Because they told me to get out. Because I was getting out my car. By the way, that my car is made, there's like a dip inside my McLaren some 20 years (ph).
K. COLLINS: Yes.
HILL: So.
K. COLLINS: Well it--
HILL: It's-- K. COLLINS: --it happened so quickly. I mean, it's like, right after they direct you to open the door, it's like seconds later when the -- when you open it, and then you're pulled from the car.
And I saw that you said, if you weren't Tyreek Hill that you feared--
HILL: Yes.
K. COLLINS: --this could have ended a lot differently. What do you think could have happened?
HILL: Yes, like, so the crazy part about it is, I hate talking like this, man, but because I have a kid (ph) fan base. But the reality of it is, it's the truth.
If I wasn't Tyreek Hill, worst-case scenario, we would have had a different article, you know? Tyreek Hill got shot in front of Hard Rock Stadium, you know? Or that's worst-case scenario. Or Tyreek Hill put in handcuffs and taken in and booked, you know?
But it's crazy that I, you know, me and my family had to go through this, you know? So.
K. COLLINS: Yes.
Julius, we heard from the President of the South Florida Police Benevolent Association, basically the union that represents them.
And they said, and I'm quoting him, they claim that your client was not immediately cooperative with the officers on the scene who, pursuant to policy and for their immediate safety, placed him in handcuffs. They said he was uncooperative, refused to sit on the ground, and was redirected to the ground. And that once it was sorted out, within a few minutes, he was issued two traffic citations and was free to leave.
I mean, when you look at the video, is that how you would describe what happened?
JULIUS COLLINS, TYREEK HILL'S ATTORNEY: Absolutely not. From what we know, and they sent us a ZIP file, where there's about five or six body cam videos. The officer who we believe is now possibly on leave, that's the officer that you saw snatching Tyreek, out of the vehicle, right? That was the most aggressive person.
The person that Tyreek spoke with, who originally came to the car, he wasn't aggressive by any means. It was the other guy that came in, that got super-aggressive with Tyreek about the window. I think he even said, we'll break this freaking glass if we need to. And then he just snatches him out of the car. I want to say it looked like he opened up the door for Tyreek.
And another portion is Tyreek actually put on his seatbelt. There's another body cam showing Tyreek putting on his seatbelt. So, along with that, he's calling Miami Dolphins security, to let him know what's going on. So, that's the delay, that immediate portion that they're talking about? He's taking off his seat belt, and he's getting Drew Brooks on the phone, from the Miami Dolphins.
[21:40:00]
And then, you see him getting snatched out of a car. Like he said, he's driving a McLaren. There's a dip in it. And he just had some repairs done on his knee. He can't jump out immediately. If you saw also, he put up his hands, to show that he didn't have a firearm, he wasn't a threat, and that he was complying with officers.
I mean, as far as the statement goes though, from the police union, I think the video contradicts everything that they're saying, even down to the notion that he refused to sit down. He actually told the guy, hold on, I'm going to sit. I just had surgery.
And that's when that same officer, who snatched him out of the car that threw him down to the ground, that placed his knee in his back, then grabs him in like a, some kind of chokehold, and drags him down to the ground. The video even goes farther away. You see him put his hand on Tyreek's throat. So, that's what the police union didn't state in their statement, so.
K. COLLINS: Yes.
J. COLLINS: The video contradicts it.
K. COLLINS: And I should note that they said that they released the video, to keep the public informed that one of the officers involved, was placed on administrative duty, as all this is being investigated.
Tyreek, just before you go, you just tweeted a moment ago. You said, Let's make a change. What did you mean by that?
HILL: Right. So, I'm a good old country boy from South Georgia, man, like I'm not -- I'm not a big believer in dividing people. I don't believe in all that. Man, I believe in bringing people together, because that's my purpose in life.
I do football camps all across the world, man, trying to bring different people together, different kids, different parents. Because we are in this together, baby. Like we on this earth together, we got to live together. So, when I say, let's make a change, let's do it together.
So Miami PD, really, all officers, across the world, man. Because one officer doesn't, you know what I'm saying, like, make the whole group look bad. Like, every -- everybody has bad apples. You know what I'm saying? Every team has bad apples.
It's my job to use my platform and my resources, so that way I'm able to align, with these different stations. So, that's what I mean when I say, let's make a change, like, because we don't try it at all. You know what I'm saying? Like, we don't protest. We even took a knee. We done did (ph) walks. Like, so what's next?
So, right now, me and my wife, we right now brainstorming on how can we be a part of this change, you know? So, it's important to us, you know? Because we want to be able to change lives all, you know, all the way across the world.
K. COLLINS: Yes.
HILL: Not just Miami, you know? It's important to us.
K. COLLINS: Well, keep us updated, on what you all brainstorm. We'd love to talk about that more.
Tyreek Hill. Julius Collins. Thank you so much for both just hopping on, on this breaking news.
J. COLLINS: Thanks.
K. COLLINS: And to talk about it. We really do appreciate it tonight.
HILL: Om Shanti (ph).
J. COLLINS: Thank you.
K. COLLINS: My next guest tonight is front and center in a new ad that you're seeing from the Harris campaign. Why are they featuring former Trump National Security Adviser, John Bolton? We'll talk to him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN BOLTON, FORMER TRUMP NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED NATIONS: I voted for Dick Cheney.
K. COLLINS: Wow.
BOLTON: And I'll vote for Dick Cheney again this November.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:45:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
K. COLLINS: Vice President Harris' campaign is trying to get under former President Donald Trump's skin, before their first showdown, tomorrow night, using the words of Trump's own former top officials against him.
This is what is what is going to be broadcast, on Trump's favorite channel, Fox News, and is expected to air, where he is, right now, in West Palm Beach, starting tomorrow.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Donald Trump said he would choose only the best people to work in his White House.
Here's his Vice President.
MIKE PENCE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Anyone who puts themselves over the Constitution should never be President of the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His Defense Secretary.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Do you think Trump can be trusted with the nation's secrets ever again?
MARK ESPER, FORMER TRUMP DEFENSE SECRETARY: No.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His National Security Adviser.
BOLTON: Donald Trump will cause a lot of damage.
The only thing he cares about is Donald Trump.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: Of course, that last face you see there is Trump's former National Security Adviser, Ambassador John Bolton, who joins me now.
I imagine you never thought that you would be in a Democratic campaign ad, in a way that was against a Republican, and in favor of the Democratic nominee. What did you make of the ad?
BOLTON: Well, I was -- I was happy to be in very good company in the ad. I don't consider Trump much of a Republican. I think he is a Trumpist. He believes in Donald Trump, and he's not a conservative.
So, that's why I'm in the uncomfortable position, of not wanting to vote for either candidate, certainly because there's no conservative on the ballot, this November.
K. COLLINS: But you've served in a lot of administrations. I mean, what does it say that a campaign is using the Vice President, the former Defense Secretary, the former National Security Adviser, and their words against a candidate?
BOLTON: And there are many others they could have put in that ad. It could have been a much longer ad.
And I think it shows that people, who really try to have the country's best interest. You can agree or disagree with them. That's not the issue. But people like Mike Pence, who put the country first, are people that run up against Trump, and come away bruised from it. And that says that is convincing evidence why Trump is not fit to be president.
K. COLLINS: Nikki Haley is another person who served under Trump, and then challenged him for the nomination. She was the last one to drop out. Even after she dropped out, she was still getting a sizable portion of votes, in places like Pennsylvania.
She was asked the other day about whether she's been asked to help Trump campaign. This is what she said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) FMR. GOV. NIKKI HALEY (R-SC): I'm on standby. I'm happy to be helpful. I don't want to see Kamala Harris win. He's the candidate. He can decide whether he needs my support or not.
BRIAN KILMEADE, FOX NEWS HOST: But you would do it?
HALEY: Absolutely.
KILMEADE: You would go--
(END VIDEO CLIP)
K. COLLINS: What do you read into why Trump hasn't asked Nikki Haley to campaign for him?
BOLTON: Well, he doesn't think very much of her. I mean, that's clear. I know that from comments he made during the administration.
I would say, though, on her part, if she really wanted to help, she could be knocking on his door.
K. COLLINS: And you think she should do more. I mean, she's put herself out there.
BOLTON: She's--
K. COLLINS: She was at the convention. She spoke. She's--
BOLTON: She's--
K. COLLINS: --said she's voting for him.
[21:50:00]
BOLTON: She's running in 2028. And I think she's looking for the path that she doesn't have to completely kiss the ring, but she doesn't want to alienate the Trump voters.
I think leadership requires people saying Donald Trump is not acceptable as the Republican nominee. I think people shouldn't get into politics for the jobs they want. They get in it for philosophy. And Donald Trump doesn't have one.
K. COLLINS: Well, a lot of people get in it for jobs that they, as you know.
BOLTON: Well that's their problem.
But from a philosophical point of view, no Republican should assume that a second Trump term is going to be the flowering of conservatism in Washington. That isn't going to happen.
K. COLLINS: Yes. Well, and speaking of what's happening to conservatism, and conservatism in Washington, we talked last week after Liz Cheney had said she was voting for Harris, and your thoughts on that. She's now come out and said her father, Dick Cheney is also voting for Harris. He affirmed that in a statement.
It was not that long ago that you and I were talking and you said that you were going to be writing in her dad, Dick Cheney, in 2024. Does it make any difference on what you're going to do that he himself is voting for Harris?
BOLTON: Well, the fact that Liz and Dick are both voting for Harris has put a wrench into my plan to double or triple a nationwide Cheney vote.
But I think, as of now, I'm still going to vote for Dick Cheney, because, for the same reason I did in 2020. I want to vote for a conservative Republican. And notwithstanding his support for Harris, he is a conservative Republican. If Dick Cheney became president, Kamala Harris would not be in his cabinet.
I think it's important that we not allow the Republican Party to be turned into a cult of personality. After Trump wins or loses, there will be a fight, for the Republican Party, from what I would call the Reaganite wing of the party, against the Trump wing of the party. And a lot rides on it, particularly in the national security space.
Because the Democrats have no national security wing. And if the Republican Party turns isolationist, there won't be anybody advocating the right kind of foreign policy. So, there's a struggle ahead, one way or the other, after Election Day, whatever the outcome at the presidential level.
K. COLLINS: Ambassador John Bolton, thank you.
BOLTON: Thank you.
K. COLLINS: Up next. She says that she peered into Trump's ear and also his soul. I'm going to speak with a reporter, who just got close- up access to both, in a new interview.
[21:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
K. COLLINS: In a new interview, Donald Trump claims that after his assassination attempt, Mark Zuckerberg told him there is no way that he could vote for a Democrat.
Trump telling New York Magazine, in an interview, that the billionaire CEO of Meta, quote, called me "Up and said, 'I've never supported a Republican before, but there's no way I can vote for a Democrat in this election.'"
I should note, a Meta spokesperson denies that exchange, saying that Zuckerberg has not publicly endorsed anyone, and, quote, has not communicated to anybody how he intends to vote.
The reporter, who conducted that interview was Olivia Nuzzi, New York Magazine's Washington correspondent. And her latest cover story, "The Afterlife of Donald Trump," is out today, with a pretty amazing cover, where you talk to him a lot about this assassination attempt.
But the conversations with Mark Zuckerberg. And also he told you that Jeff Bezos called him after this.
OLIVIA NUZZI, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, NEW YORK MAGAZINE: Yes.
K. COLLINS: I mean, what did he have to say about those?
NUZZI: Well, we got an off-the-record no comment from Jeff Bezos' spokesperson. So, I don't think that was something that he wanted out there, whether or not it was true that they spoke on the phone.
I thought it was interesting. Donald Trump brought that up to me when I asked him about fear, and whether or not he had felt fear during the assassination attempt. And he said, I didn't think of fear, as if fear is something that you choose to think of or not think of.
And then, he immediately pivoted to sort of peacocking, and telling me about these impressive people, whom he alleges contacted him to tell them that he's going to support them -- that they're going to support him.
But it kind of spoke to Donald Trump's reluctance, or inability, to really look inward, and talk about what's going on in his interior life.
K. COLLINS: Well, you seem to try to kind of have an introspective moment, with him, during this, to talk about Corey Comperatore, the guy who was killed--
NUZZI: Yes.
K. COLLINS: --that day, the father who jumped on top of his daughter and his wife.
What was that moment like?
NUZZI: It was interesting. It was one of those moments, where I could tell that Trump was really trying, and he admitted that he did think of it. And then, he distracted me, for a little while, talking about how much money he had raised for the family. He clearly felt bad. And he was much more comfortable talking about what he had done for the family, financially.
And then, when I came back around, I asked him again, the question was, have you thought at all about why -- because he now believes that an interventionist God stepped in to essentially move his face and prevent him from being killed.
And I said, Well, what kind of God would intervene to save you, and not save somebody else? And he really didn't want to grapple with that. And then finally, he said, I haven't thought much about that, I should think about it. And gave me some spiel about how he's been distracted, running the campaign, he's got his business, and he's trying not to think too hard about those things. But it's interesting to see him in this moment, where something monumental has happened to him, where that would make anyone change or prompt anyone to look inward. And--
K. COLLINS: Yes, well, you said you felt that he was different. I mean--
NUZZI: He seems different.
K. COLLINS: --you covered him for a long time.
NUZZI: Yes.
K. COLLINS: What was it?
NUZZI: I mean, you know he's highly distractible. He is who he is. He's always been the same. He wasn't changed by the Office of the Presidency.
And it's very interesting to sit across from him at this moment, and he's much -- he's thinking more before he answers the question. I've been interviewing him for 10 years, he finally asked me where I'm from. Like, he is just more interested, in sort of being a part of the human race.
[22:00:00]
But will that yield different results? I think the answer is -- now, we were both at the press conference, on Friday, where Donald Trump stood up and talked for, it felt like three hours. I don't know how long it was. About all of the allegations against him, about sexual misconduct. And he sounded, just like any old Donald Trump that we have known, over the last decade.
K. COLLINS: Yes, it was very 2015--
NUZZI: It was.
K. COLLINS: --2016-esque.
Olivia Nuzzi, it's a great interview. Everyone should read the piece.
NUZZI: Thank you.
K. COLLINS: Thank you for joining us to talk about it.
NUZZI: Thank you for having me.
K. COLLINS: Out in New York Magazine tonight.
Thank you all so much, for joining us here, on THE SOURCE, this evening.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" starts right now.
