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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump Recounts Apparent Assassination Attempt For First Time; Acting Secret Service Director Says More Support Is Needed; Musk Deletes Post: No One Is Trying To Assassinate Biden, Harris. Aired 9- 10p ET
Aired September 16, 2024 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
MAYOR ROB RUE, SPRINGFIELD, OHIO: -- no, I'm sorry, but it was the state that stepped up with $2.5 million, over the next two years, to help fund our health care system, and that will primarily, I'm sure, be going towards translation services.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: Yes. Well Mayor Rue, I appreciate your time, tonight. And again, sorry we're talking under these circumstances. But I wish you the best.
RUE: Thank you so much for having me on.
COOPER: Mayor Rob Rue from Springfield.
That's it for us. The news continues. I'll be back tomorrow. Hope you tune in then. "THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Straight from THE SOURCE tonight.
Donald Trump describing for the first time the moment that he heard shots ring out, while he was playing a round of golf. As the Secret Service says its plan to protect him worked. So, how did an armed man, with a lengthy criminal record, lie in wait for 12 hours, before getting within shooting distance of the former President of the United States?
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
As we come on the air tonight, at 09:00 p.m., we are hearing for the first time, from Donald Trump, about that moment on the golf course yesterday, when a Secret Service agent who was walking ahead of him spotted an apparent assassin, hiding in the bushes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: All of a sudden, we heard shots being fired in the air, and I guess probably four or five, and it sounded like bullets. But what do I know about that? But Secret Service knew immediately it was bullets.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. TRUMP: And, uh, they grabbed me and, uh, I think probably the other one, Steve is one of the people. Steve Witkoff, a great friend of mine.
A Secret Service agent had seen a barrel of a AK-47 which is a very powerful gun, rifle. And, uh, he started shooting at the barrel and started shooting in the bushes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wow.
TRUMP: Could only see the barrel. How good is that? Right? But could only see the barrel. Based on that, he started shooting and, uh, ran toward the target, and was shooting a lot of, I mean, those were the shots we heard. The other one never got a shot off.
And he ran across the street and grabbed his car, hopped into his truck or car, and amazingly, a civilian in that area saw something, and it looked very suspicious, and in the car, drove their car to the back of his truck of some kind, and took pictures of the license plate --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wow.
TRUMP: -- gave them to the sheriff's office.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I just want to note, as we are hearing from Trump on this, what we did hear from authorities today is his rifle was actually not an AK-47, as they initially thought. Today, it was a different kind of rifle.
And this also comes as late, this evening, we're hearing from Trump. We're also hearing from his running mate, Senator J.D. Vance, who is speaking for the first time, in public, about the phone call that he had with Trump, just minutes after all this happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), 2024 VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: So I answer it, and he says, J.D., you're not going to believe this, but they tried to do it again.
I said -- I said that, No, they didn't. You're joshing me. What's going on here, sir?
And he says, No, you know, I was playing golf, and the Secret Service found somebody who was trying to shoot me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: A lot more on what we are hearing from them tonight, what details they're revealing, as we're also learning more about the multiple investigations, now underway, to determine whether this latest apparent attempt, on Trump's life, could have been prevented, and if enough is being done to protect the Republican nominee. The FBI tells us that the suspect appears to have moved under the cover of darkness, in the middle of the night, around 02:00 a.m., when cell phone data shows Ryan Routh, in the area of the golf course at Trump International. He may have remained there for nearly 12 hours, armed with that powerful gun.
The Acting Director of the Secret Service, who is now indefinitely in Florida, as they investigate this, says he spoke to Trump and that he has the highest level of protection right now.
Few people know all things Donald Trump, in South Florida, more than my lead source, tonight, the State Attorney for Palm Beach County, Florida, Dave Aronberg.
And Dave, it's great to have you here. Because we were talking yesterday, just as all of this was happening, and this was getting underway, and we were, you know, a lot of details were just coming out.
But given this is all happening, in your backyard, what's your assessment of what we've heard, from officials today, about where all of this stands right now.
DAVE ARONBERG, STATE ATTORNEY FOR PALM BEACH COUNTY, FL: Good to be with you, Kaitlan.
Well, the Feds are on top of this. They're doing a full, thorough investigation. And they have charged this suspect with two charges that will stick.
These are the easy charges punishable by up to 10 years in prison for an ex-felon possessing a firearm. Well, all you need is an ex-felon. Check. And that he was possessing a firearm. Check. You don't need any more intent or anything. So, we're going to keep him behind bars for that.
And you've got the other charge of obliterating a serial number on a firearm. They got that too. Punishable by up to five years in prison.
[21:05:00]
There still may be a chance, and I think a probability, that more charges could come, like aggravated assault with a firearm against a federal law enforcement officer. That's when the suspect pointed his rifle, allegedly, at a Secret Service agent. So, that can get you up to 20 years in prison.
So, I think the Feds are going to keep investigating, and ultimately they could add on some new charges.
COLLINS: Well, what about -- as given, clearly, there was premeditation here. There was the GoPro. This person was lying there in wait for about 12 hours based on the cell phone data.
What other charges could we potentially see here? Because that was a big question today, when it was just those first two pertaining to this gun itself.
ARONBERG: Well, that aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, that's a possibility. There's also a federal statute on threatening an ex- President. That can get you up to five years in prison.
They're going to look to see what his social media sites say, what was in the bag, what writings he's had, what kind of threats he's given. And that could be an additional charge.
Generally, when it comes to like attempted murder, that's more a state charge than a federal charge. But also, I think you need more than you have right now. You really have to get into his state of mind. He's got to take a substantial step into taking action. I mean, it's always a possibility. But generally, those kinds of charges are really at the state level rather than the federal level.
But make no mistake, I think this guy is in a whole world of hurt. He's going to be facing many years in prison, and he's not going to get out of jail, pending trial. They're going to show that he's a danger to the community, so he's not going to get pretrial release.
COLLINS: We heard from the Sheriff, in Palm Beach County, earlier today, talking about how Mar-a-Lago is about as safe as it can be, at this point, talking about the level of protection at that place.
But obviously, the golf course is separate than that. It's about a 15- minute drive. As you well know, it's across the bridge, in West Palm Beach.
How much harder is it to secure something like the Trump International golf course than it is the Mar-a-Lago Club, which has that one entrance in, one entrance out, with obviously a guard shack at the front of it, and a much harder perimeter, it seems.
ARONBERG: Yes. In fact, Mar-a-Lago is bordered on one side by water, and they can easily shut down the roads. In fact, they've shut down the road, one major road, outside of Mar-a-Lago, even when the former President is not there. And that's the consternation of the Palm Beach residents.
Now, in West Palm Beach, it's much harder to shut down the roads. You've got major roads, right outside of the golf club, which you're correct, about 10 to 15 minutes away.
There's also those large shrubbery, the trees, that are right in front of the fence, and so someone could hide in that. And it's a very large perimeter. It's very difficult to monitor that entire area. Especially if you've got someone willing to wait for 12 hours to go there in the cover of darkness.
This is not the first time you've seen someone breach the trees into the fence. There have been paparazzi, been media members. Now, a lot of times, the media will alert Secret Service. Sometimes, they don't. And they take pictures of the former President while he's golfing.
This is just the first time someone has pointed a rifle, at the former President, at least in his direction. And so, I do anticipate there'll be more security. But it's just really hard to monitor that property that closely.
COLLINS: Yes. And, yesterday, when there was that first briefing by officials, you were there, and you spoke to reporters. This was before we had actually seen charges that now we've seen that brief body cam footage that they've released, of them actually arresting Ryan Routh.
You can see officials have their guns drawn. They're directing him to back up with his hands in the air. He lifts his shirt, seemingly to show he doesn't have any weapons or anything on him, and he walks backwards, and then they arrest him.
What are you hearing, from other colleagues, law enforcement people, tonight, about just the aftermath. And I mean, are they shocked that this was able to happen?
ARONBERG: They're grateful at the Good Samaritan. Think about it. He had a passer-by, who saw something suspicious, took a photo of the car's license plate. So law enforcement was armed with that knowledge, not just of the make and model of the car, but the license plate.
And he still was able to get out 45 minutes of a head start, driving north, apparently, perhaps driving back to North Carolina. But he only got as far as the county north of Palm Beach, Martin County, where the deputies did a great stop.
And I think this shows also that the suspect is used to this. Maybe not this type of crime. But he's got a long felony rap sheet, back in North Carolina. So, he knows enough not to try to do anything weird, on that traffic stop, or else he could get shot. He knows enough not to talk. Apparently, he didn't. He clammed up, didn't say anything, when he was stopped.
And now, he was joking with his lawyer today in court. And so, yes, this guy has been through the process time and time again. But I have a feeling he won't be getting out anytime soon.
COLLINS: He was joking with his attorney?
ARONBERG: Well, yes, the word was that he was all smiles in his initial appearance, joking with his attorney. I don't know if he was trying to show that he's insane, or he just is that kind of person.
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By the way, it's going to be very hard for him to establish an insanity defense. Because although he's clearly got a screw loose, when he fled, it showed that he knew the difference between right and wrong. To establish an insanity defense, you have to not know the difference between right and wrong. Why do you flee? Because he knew what you did was wrong and against the law.
COLLINS: That's really interesting.
Dave Aronberg, thank you for that. As you hear more, please keep us updated, and come back to us, here on THE SOURCE.
ARONBERG: Thank you, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: And as you heard Mr. Aronberg mention there, Ryan Routh did make that first court appearance, today, where he was apparently joking with his attorney. Didn't seem like much of a joke. He had his hands and his feet shackled together, as he was facing those two federal gun charges that we mentioned.
A short time after that, we learned that Routh had actually popped up on the FBI's radar, back in 2019, after there was a tip about a felon in possession of a gun.
Even as law enforcement tried to run down that, what led up to this, we should note, tonight, the Secret Service is still facing a pretty immense challenge, which is what comes and what happens with Trump's golf course, and just how accessible it is.
We know this firsthand here at CNN, because take a look at these images. As Mr. Aronberg just mentioned, when Trump was in office, our photojournalist could often capture video of him golfing at Trump International.
Now, this would come, if the White House didn't say whether or not the President was golfing or who he was with. Journalists often relied on images like the ones that you're seeing here, to get a sense of the President's schedule.
But to capture these images, CNN photographers were not on the property itself. Instead, we were positioned across the street, on public property. Oftentimes, officials knew we were there. Sheriffs would ride by. But Trump was often still very visible, through our cameras, through the tree line of the property itself.
Our top law enforcement sources tonight are:
CNN National Security Analyst, and the former Assistant Secretary at the Department of Homeland Security, Juliette Kayyem.
And also, former FBI senior Intel officer, Phil Mudd.
It's great to have you back, Phil. Because what we heard from the FBI today, and this ties back to what Dave was just talking about there, a potential, maybe, insanity plea, if that's what the suspect goes for here.
They're talking to witnesses who were at the scene. They're talking to members of his family. What are those interviews? What kind of questions are they asking?
PHIL MUDD, FORMER CIA COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICIAL, FORMER FBI SR. INTELLIGENCE OFFICER: Boy, there's a lot of them.
The first questions are going to be about whether there's -- there are other people who are involved in this. You got to ensure. Even if you're 99 percent certain there was no conspiracy, you got to ensure that nobody was helping him. Nobody told him that Trump would be there. You also have questions, obviously, about who provided the weapon.
But then the investigation gets more complicated. As you add in things like, what's on his cell phone, what's his email, what's his Google search history, you might be going back to re-interview people with what happened a year ago? What happened two years ago? How did he get motivated to do this? Was he inspired by somebody?
So, the initial questions are about threat. But then the investigation starts to get more complex, as you get a timeline going back, maybe two, three, four, five years, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Yes. And obviously, the gun is a big question here, Phil.
And Juliette, that's why I'm wondering about this 2019 investigation, that an FBI tip that they got that he was in possession of a firearm, that he was a felon. He's obviously not allowed to have one.
But the case, we were told, was closed, because the Bureau said they didn't get any more information. I mean, when I heard that, it kind of raised my eyebrows in a sense of, why would that be the case here? Why would they -- they wouldn't look into this any further, if that is something that they were worried about?
JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST, FORMER ASST. SECRETARY, DEPT. OF HOMELAND SECURITY, PROFESSOR, HARVARD KENNEDY SCHOOL: Right. And the question is, who tipped them off? Was it a family member? We know it was his daughter's car. We know the son spoke, yesterday, of concerns of what his possession -- of how he came into possession of the gun. As well as why the FBI did not pursue it. Could they not find him? Well, all of those questions that will be asked.
Because you go back in any of these cases, there's always these moments, right? If only someone had stepped in, or they had gone and investigated this, if only, then this could have been stopped.
So, those are going to be the main questions for, how did he possess this? Why wasn't he stopped before? How did he stay at the golf area for so long with a car? I mean, that's the other thing. It's not just him hiding. There was a car right there. And how did, you know, sort of why is he doing this?
For me, as someone, who studies radicalization, and talks often with you about political violence, there is a definite disconnect between what we're seeing before, and all of a sudden, this political violence.
And so, what has -- what happened in the last couple weeks, months or years that would have turned him from some guy who's like very into Ukraine, to now being a potential assassin against Trump, and that's what you're going to want to look for.
Were there other people egging him on? Was he online? Did he get radicalized by the Butler, Pennsylvania assassination attempt, and he's a copycat, and therefore we should worry about others?
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COLLINS: Yes. And he obviously has a pretty massive online presence, if you look through his social media feeds.
KAYYEM: Right.
COLLINS: There's a lot for officials to pore over here.
But Phil, on the golf course. The other thing we heard from the acting Secret Service Director, today, was there was no full sweep of the golf course. He kind of seemed to imply it was a last-minute trip to the golf course that it wasn't really on the schedule. It certainly wasn't on any public schedule.
But instead of securing and sweeping the whole course, an agent was just moving one to two holes before him, gratefully, because that's how they saw this guy.
But given its public knowledge, Trump regularly plays golf. It was a Sunday afternoon. He's got a big motorcade. It's not hard to know where he is at a given time.
I mean, what was your reaction to that today?
MUDD: My reaction is that the American population will overreact to this.
Look, there will be legitimate questions about resourcing for the Secret Service. There will be a question about whether you have to shut off every street, every time the President of the United States decides to go golfing.
But when you ask for that level of security and assurance that the President will never be touched, what you're going to get is a president, who is not accessible to the American people. That's not been the American way.
Think about when President Obama won, 20 years ago. I remember that. Fewer than 20 years ago. I remember that. There were thousands of people in Chicago, watching him. Should he have not done that?
Think about when President Bush, that was 20 years ago, President Bush went to Ground Zero in New York. Should that have not happened, because he was accessible to people?
If you want assurance of perfect security, you're going to have presidents who aren't accessible. So, that's going to be a tough question to ask at, Kaitlan. What's the balance?
COLLINS: Yes, it's a good question that's now going to be raised by two of these incidents happening within two months.
Phil Mudd. Juliette Kayyem. Thank you both tonight.
MUDD: Thank you.
COLLINS: And after that first attempt on his life, we remember Donald Trump reacted by calling for unity. After this one, he said he knows who's to blame. It's not the suspected gunman, who was lurking in the bushes. More on that tonight.
Also, the richest man in the world put his tweet in his mouth again. Kara Swisher is here on the fallout we're seeing from a statement that was so out there, the normally pretty shameless billionaire actually ended up deleting it.
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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Tonight, Donald Trump's running mate, Senator J.D. Vance, says the apparent assassination attempt is a sign, in his eyes, that Democrats need to tone down their language.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VANCE: You know the big difference between conservatives and liberals is that we have -- no one has tried to kill Kamala Harris in the last couple of months, and two people now have tried to kill Donald Trump in the last couple of months. I'd say that's pretty strong evidence that the left needs to tone down the rhetoric, and needs to cut this crap out.
All of us, and I promise I will do my part to tone down the rhetoric, but in particular, the people telling you that Donald Trump needs to be eliminated, you guys need to cut it out, or you're going to get somebody hurt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My political sources tonight are:
Trump's former White House communications director, Alyssa Farah Griffin.
And Vice President Harris' former communications director, Jamal Simmons.
And Alyssa, Vance said that tonight. He also said, quote, I'm not going to say we're always perfect. I'm not going to say that conservatives are always getting things exactly right.
But I want you to listen to what Trump had to say about who he believes is responsible for what's happening.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: There's a lot of rhetoric going on.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. TRUMP: A lot of people think that the Democrats, when they talk about threat to democracy and all of this. And it seems that both of these people were radical lefts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I mean, just, I'm viewing this through how we're talking about this now, how he's talking about this now, compared to what we were -- people were saying two months ago, after what happened in Butler.
ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, FORMER TRUMP WH COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Right. Obviously, what happened was horrible. There's going to be a lot that comes out in the course of the investigation. Never should have happened. It'd be terrible for the country, obviously, if anything were to happen to the former President.
But the conversation, today, does need to be about political rhetoric. But one of the biggest offenders of escalatory rhetoric is Donald Trump and J.D. Vance. And the very clip where J.D. Vance says that he's going to work on himself, he's basically accusing Democrats of their rhetoric leading to this.
And I think that it is a -- this moment is a moment for sobriety that calls for serious leadership. And unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be a self-reflective moment, even though it was the candidate, Donald Trump, that himself was a victim.
And I just want to say this, because Donald Trump put out this screed afterward, basically saying Democrats are responsible for the rhetoric, but then also saying they're the enemy from within. That's the kind of language our adversaries love to hear us throwing around. It tears us apart from within. And, by the way, it does put people at risk.
And I want to note, Kamala Harris has also faced threats. Thankfully, she's not actually become a target as directly as Donald Trump has. Over the weekend, a right-wing handle called essentially for harm to be done to her.
This is something that happens every day, online. But the step that it takes to then go further and somebody act, it's actually a very small step, and we're all responsible for taking it down.
COLLINS: Yes, that was the National Libertarian Party of New Hampshire, I believe, that had posted that just hours before all this happened.
And in this environment, we heard from Hillary Clinton tonight. She said, what happened to Trump yesterday is a horror. She said, this idea that political violence -- that violence is being used in the wake of a political campaign is frightening.
And she was also asked about what Trump has been saying about Democrats' rhetoric. This is what she had to say. [21:25:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER UNITED STATES SECRETARY OF STATE: Well, you know, it is so regrettable that the former President would take what is a genuinely terrible event of someone stalking a former President and current candidate, and turn it into, as he did with that tweet that you just read, a political attack on his opposition and literally everybody else who does not support him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JAMAL SIMMONS, FMR. COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR TO VP HARRIS, FMR. DEPUTY ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT BIDEN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Listen, the idea that a national candidate for the White House, for the Presidency of the United States, would use the kind of rhetoric that Donald Trump does, and always raise the temperature in moments, when we should be bringing it down so that everybody can catch their breath and move in a different direction? That is something that should be disturbing for everybody.
And here's the thing. These people, whether it's the President, the Vice President, and the candidates, they've got Secret Service protection. They've got people who are looking out for them. There are a lot of people who are their supporters who don't have Secret Service protection. What about those folks that are out there? And we know that rhetoric gets people amped up about this.
So, we've got polling places we're going to have to protect, come Election Day, And there are people who often show up at polling places not looking to do the best -- not looking to be the -- be their best selves, right?
So we've got to make sure, I think, all of us are bringing it down, so there is a -- there is enough calmness that we can get this election done, without having anything serious happen.
COLLINS: Well, and initially, after what happened in Butler, people were saying, everyone needs to calm down their language. That's what you were hearing from Republicans, from Democrats.
They were saying that Trump was going to be a unifying force. Obviously, we heard his convention speech that even some of his own aides thought kind of missed the mark.
But Alyssa, on this, when the Trump campaign today is pulling every quote of anyone who said Donald Trump, including Harris, is a threat to democracy? Hours before this happened, Trump tweeted in all-caps that The New York Times -- "THE FAILING NEW YORK TIMES IS A TRUE THREAT TO DEMOCRACY." I mean, he himself is also using this language.
FARAH GRIFFIN: I also think we have to be honest in our discourse. We're in a political season. We make our voices heard at the ballot box. Talking about someone being a threat to democracy, who tried to overturn an election, is a legitimate criticism of the former President.
Language that goes further than that is not. Language that mischaracterizes him or calls him an enemy from within, I would never call him that. I would never call him America's Hitler, as his now running mate did, or possibly America's Hitler. That kind of escalatory language doesn't have a place in our politics.
But if your actions show you were a threat to democracy, that's a very legitimate thing to point out.
COLLINS: Yes, it's a good point.
Alyssa Farah Griffin. Jamal Simmons. Thank you both for being here.
Up next. We're going to take a closer look at the Secret Service. Tonight, Donald Trump is saying he believes he needs more members, more agents in his protection, as President Biden is also weighing in with his new comments, tonight.
We're going to speak to two members of Congress about this, here on set, right after the break.
[21:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Moments ago, former President Trump said that he does believe he needs more agents, on his protective detail. That comes after we heard from the acting Secret Service Director today, who said his agency needs more support.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RONALD ROWE JR., ACTING DIRECTOR, U.S. SECRET SERVICE: You can't just give me money and say, Hey, we're going to make sure that everybody gets overtime. Because the men and women of the Secret Service, right now, we are redlining them.
We don't have an alternative. Success, we have to have it every day. We cannot have failures. And in order to do that, we're going to have some hard conversations with Congress, and we're going to achieve that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My sources, tonight, are on the other end of those conversations.
Congressman Jim Himes is the Ranking Member on the House Intelligence Committee.
And Congressman Jared Moskowitz is a member of the congressional task force, investigating the assassination attempts, now plural, on Donald Trump.
Great to have you both here. We even heard from President Biden, on this, today, who said, what's going on is not sustainable. He said the Secret Service needs more help, and I think Congress should respond to their needs, if they, in fact, need more Service people.
Are we going to see a congressional response to this?
REP. JIM HIMES (D-CT): I think we will. I think that Jared's committee is going to do some good work, and really get to the bottom of what happened the first time. The first time, the attempt on the ex- President's life, in Pennsylvania, was obviously an egregious failure, operationally.
The question of whether more resources are needed. I mean, I heard the same quote you did, from the acting Director. Obviously, the mission is so critical that if more resources are the answer to the question, they're going to get more resources.
COLLINS: Well, and what does that look like? Because, I mean, you kind of have an indication of this, since for two months, Congress has been investigating what happened the first time. I think it's hard to believe that now you're tasked with dealing with a second assassination attempt.
What is the need of the Secret Service when it comes to what we saw happen yesterday?
REP. JARED MOSKOWITZ (D-FL): Yes, well, look, I appreciate the new Director coming forward, and saying he needs more resources, right? We had a first assassination attempt. He wasn't jumping up and down, for more resources at the time. Now, we have a second one, and now, all of a sudden, we need more resources. Look --
COLLINS: Well, to be fair, he wasn't the Director at the time.
MOSKOWITZ: Well --
COLLINS: He became acting Director because the first one was booted because of what happened.
MOSKOWITZ: No, of course. But today, he's asking for more resources. He's been the acting Director now for several weeks. And so, look, I think if he needs the resources, he will get those resources from Congress. But I also think we have a process and protocol problem, not just a resources and manpower issue.
They're saying Donald Trump is getting the highest level of protection. Well, if this is the highest level, we need to see several higher levels that they need to create for level of protection, because it's inadequate. It's clear by. I mean, there's not a single American, right now, in my opinion, that has faith in in the Secret Service.
COLLINS: Do you have faith in the Secret Service?
[21:35:00] MOSKOWITZ: Not at this moment. How can you have faith? It's 60 days, we've had two assassination attempts. That doesn't mean there's not great men and women working there. It just means, at this moment, they've had two fails in 60 days.
COLLINS: Do we need to change how we classify what detail someone gets? I mean, Trump does not have the same level as President Biden. I was told, yesterday, it's closer to what Vice President Harris has now, to a degree. But does it need to be based not just on your position as a former President, or major party nominee, but on the threat level against somebody?
HIMES: Sure. But threat level matters, but so does the fact the President is in a unique position, right? The President holds nuclear command authority. No one else does. No ex-President does. So, of course, you're going to double down on protection, around the one individual in the United States, who has nuclear command authority.
That said, the notion that there should be risk. There's an awful lot of conversation, on my committee, around how serious the Iranians are of, in their stated goal to assassinate a U.S. official. That is not acceptable. So, even though there may be different levels of protection, as the Secret Service Director just said, failure is never an option.
COLLINS: Well, and just quickly on that. I mean, if Congress does need to move here, can they move before the election? I mean, we've got two months left.
HIMES: Of course they can.
COLLINS: Seven weeks left.
HIMES: I mean, we've got a must-pass piece of legislation that we'll be voting on, in the next two weeks.
COLLINS: Yes.
HIMES: I am confident that we're actually not going to shut the government down. Whatever continuing resolution, whatever bill keeps the government open, can carry along a rider, which I suspect would have bipartisan support, that we're going to provide the resources that the Secret Service needs.
COLLINS: And of course, by continuing resolution, what Congress is looking at is only funding the government, through December, and then revisiting this fight again in just a few months.
I want to ask you. You're from Florida. Governor DeSantis has said that, essentially, he's opening his own investigation into what's happening, not just leaving it up to the FBI and the Secret Service. Is that a move that -- and his reasoning for it, we were looking at today, was essentially, and we were hearing from others who said they don't trust the Feds. That includes Senator Mike Lee, a Republican.
Do you agree with DeSantis' move to conduct his own investigation? MOSKOWITZ: Look, I actually don't have a problem, if the folks at the Florida Department of Law Enforcement want to conduct their own investigation. I think the folks, obviously, at the Sheriff's office in Palm Beach, are going to be helping with the investigation. So that, I don't have a problem with that. Obviously, no one should be playing politics with this. I think we want to get answers.
Right now, I think the federal government's one of the largest failures in this moment, and it's a failure from the Butler moment, as well, is the American people want information, and they haven't still gotten information from Butler. We're still not -- we still don't know the motive of the first shooter.
COLLINS: Yes.
MOSKOWITZ: And so, if you look for -- people on the left, think the first -- the first assassination attempt was staged. People on the right think it was the Deep State. And that's because they're filling the void with misinformation and disinformation, because these agencies are not sharing information.
I get it that it's protocol as usual, let's complete the investigation, and then we'll share with the American people. But we have to think outside of the box. These are extraordinary circumstances. We need these agencies, weekly, to be sharing information with the American public. Otherwise, more of this is going to go on.
COLLINS: Yes. And you're both Democrats. Given the conversation we were just having, of the Trump campaign pulling out any time a Democrat has said Trump is a threat to democracy, as a point of Democrats needing to tone down their rhetoric, I just wonder what your take on that is.
HIMES: Yes, I mean, two things about this conversation are really bothersome and actually deeply dangerous.
Number one is making that statement. Now, the last thing I want to do is get into a tit for tat here. But the American people know who has advised the police to not be too nice in their apprehension of suspects. They saw what happened on January 6th.
It's absurd that the vice presidential candidate and Donald Trump are pointing the fingers at Democrats. And, by the way, it's precisely what they shouldn't be doing, at a moment, when they should be taking down the political temperature.
The other thing that has just made me bristle, when you said it is, Senator Mike Lee and others who are saying they don't trust the Feds. The misinformation and the notion that the federal government -- and look, we do oversight of the federal government, so we'll be the first to tell you that there are challenges inside the federal government.
But when you constantly beat the drum that you can't trust the FBI, that the intelligence community is in the tank for Democrats, or for whoever it may be, what you do is every time you say that, a few more Americans get angry, at their own country, for no good reason.
There is no evidence, backing any of this stuff. And if you work hard enough, to delegitimize the government, in the eyes of Americans, you're going to create a very dangerous environment.
COLLINS: Congressman Jim Himes, Jared Moskowitz, it's great to have you both here on set tonight. Thank you.
MOSKOWITZ: Yes.
HIMES: Yes.
COLLINS: Up next, and speaking of the political temperature, Elon Musk now says he was just joking when he posted quote, No one is even trying to assassinate Joe Biden or Kamala Harris. He later deleted it. And now, the Secret Service is looking into it.
[21:40:00]
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COLLINS: The Secret Service tells CNN, tonight, it's aware of this now-deleted post, by Elon Musk, asking why no one is even trying to assassinate Joe Biden or Kamala Harris.
Musk posted this, just hours after what happened at Trump International, yesterday, initially refusing calls to take it down. But then, after one X user suggested that he was being misinterpreted, Musk responded, quote, "Fair enough. I don't want to do what they have done, even in jest." He has since claimed several times that it was just a joke.
My source, tonight, on this is Kara Swisher, the host of "On with Kara Swisher" and "Pivot" podcasts.
And Kara, just as someone who has studied Elon Musk, why do you think he ultimately actually deleted this post?
KARA SWISHER, HOST, "ON WITH KARA SWISHER" & "PIVOT" PODCASTS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, because I'm sure his legal team said, You need to delete this post.
[21:45:00]
It's a very serious thing to do, especially when he has a 193 million people following him, or being force-followed, in some cases, with him has been widely reported.
So, I think it was a -- it was a step too far, although he takes steps too far all the time. He was actively retweeting and commenting on the pet -- the Haitian pet-eating situation, which was all false. And he does it regularly. But this one was a little too far, I think, even for him.
COLLINS: Yes. And when we say the Secret Service is aware of it that they're looking into it. I mean, they have to investigate all perceived threats, even if the person --
SWISHER: Yes.
COLLINS: -- does say that they're joking.
I was thinking today about John Mulaney, when he was on SNL, he made a joke comparing Trump to Julius Caesar, who was assassinated, and he was investigated for that.
SWISHER: Sure was, yes.
COLLINS: But, for Elon Musk, he has major defense contracts with the U.S. He has access to highly-sensitive information.
SWISHER: Yes.
COLLINS: As we were just talking about with the Congressmen. They are sending SpaceX, his company, to go and retrieve the astronauts that are stuck in outer space. I mean, this is not just your uncle -- your crazy uncle tweeting this, you know?
SWISHER: No, it's not. And let me tell you. If the CEO of Lockheed did this, there would be hell to pay, essentially. So, I think it's, you know, he obviously is being treated differently from the average citizen, and definitely from any other CEO.
And he can say, it's a joke. And of course, that reminds you of someone else. But he can't, you know, he uses this thing as a rich toddler's playground, I guess. And so, he can say, you know, essentially, he's trying to say dirty words all the time, a version of that.
And in this case, he probably said it in front of some of his employees, and they laughed, because that's what you do when your boss says, Isn't this funny? And then posted it.
Last time, he did something like this, the person who said he shouldn't put it up, was fired. So, nobody's going to tell him, it's not funny. And he's in a group of people, who enable him, almost constantly. But it's his own fault. It's not their fault.
COLLINS: Well, that's a good question, because I do think people ask, Why doesn't anyone tell him not to do this? Which is often something people say also about Trump, as they have this growing alliance. But really, it's just the individual themselves who makes the decision.
SWISHER: That's absolutely true. But he actually -- Elon Musk fires people, who disagree with him regularly. So, I think that's one of the issues.
And a lot of people are sort of in this, and they think it's one giant joke about everything, including the Haitian pets, or it's trans people or whatever. He constantly -- and of course, he retweeted Tucker Carlson's interview with a Hitler apologist. And he just does this just to cause problems. And very much like Trump, if attention is away from him, for five seconds, it's like he can't breathe. And so, he does these things to create drama around himself, so he stays in our daily lives, constantly.
So eventually, he and Trump will start to fight over attention, if they -- you know, if President Trump wins again, and that'll probably be a problem. But eventually, they'll come to blows, because both of them seek attention. They're heat-seeking missiles to attention.
COLLINS: Kara, while I have you, I want to ask you about something else tonight, because Meta said just now that they're banning --
SWISHER: Yes.
COLLINS: -- the Russian state propaganda broadcaster, RT, as it's known, and other Kremlin-controlled networks, saying that they've engaged in deceptive influence operation --
SWISHER: Yes.
COLLINS: -- and attempted to evade detection.
How big of a deal do you think this decision is?
SWISHER: It's a big one for Mark Zuckerberg. Trump has threatened to put him in prison, if you recall. And so, it's a big deal to make this call.
Obviously, these are, as you said, propaganda machines that are sort of trying to create discord in our world and in our society. And so, it's the right thing to do. It'll be interesting to see if YouTube will do the same.
Obviously, X and Twitter will not. It will welcome that propaganda, because it does it on a daily basis.
But it'll be interesting to see if the other companies that are run by adults will think very hard about cutting off RT, which is a propaganda organization, plain and simple.
COLLINS: Yes. It's a great point. Kara Swisher, as always, great to have you.
SWISHER: Thanks a lot.
COLLINS: Thank you so much.
And I should note tonight. There are not many people, who really have their own Secret Service detail. Of course, it's a lot for the Secret Service. But when you look at the larger population, not that many know what it's like to have that, or to be the target of an assassination plot.
My next source, though, knows both. Former Trump National Security Adviser, Ambassador John Bolton, is here. [21:50:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Some new reporting that I broke, after the second apparent assassination attempt, on former President Trump, as sources confirm to me, and to my colleagues, Zach Cohen and Sean Lyngaas, that senior intelligence officials recently briefed Trump's campaign, about new Intel that Iran is planning to escalate attacks on Trump, and those around him.
Now, I want to be clear, there is no evidence that what happened yesterday, or at that rally in Butler, Pennsylvania, is connected to this new reporting. But it does speak to the threat environment, overall, that is facing a candidate for a major party in the United States, and a former President.
It's one that's known well by my next guest, Trump's former National Security Adviser, John Bolton, who in 2021, when officials uncovered an Iranian plot to kill him.
Ambassador Bolton joins me live.
And Ambassador, just looking at this, I mean, you yourself still have protection to this day, because of the threats against you. For people who do not know what that is like, could you just describe it for us?
AMB. JOHN BOLTON, FORMER TRUMP NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER, FORMER U.N. AMBASSADOR, FORMER ASST. ATTORNEY GENERAL, CIVIL DIVISION FOR DOJ: Well, I don't want to describe it in full detail, for obvious reasons.
[21:55:00]
But my home is under protection, 24/7, very much like the way it was when I was National Security Adviser. And I have the Secret Service with me when I travel. So that, again, is very much like when I served in the government.
And I think that's typical of some of the others, Mark Esper and others who are under the same general threat from Iran. Obviously, Trump is at the top of the list. But it's a very robust protection.
COLLINS: Well, and obviously a lot of people, who work in Washington, know a lot of the rank-and-file Secret Service agents. They work very hard. And the one, who was certainly with Trump, yesterday, did an amazing job, in spotting this person.
But overall, when you look at the Secret Service, and just the questions that are being raised, does what happened to Trump yesterday make you question your own safety?
BOLTON: Not at all.
I have listened, including just now on your show, to hear yesterday being described as a Secret Service failure. It wasn't a failure. The guy was never able to take a shot at Trump. The Secret Service system is based on layered protection. You can't stop every would-be assassin before he gets out the front door of his home. You have to ask what intelligence was there out there, on this particular shooter. There are a lot of theories. A lot of them have to do with politics.
I'm not at all sure that this -- the Pennsylvania episode, and this episode at Mar-a-Lago is two nut cases, is the only way I can think of to describe them. The second one in particular, triggered by having seen the first one, in a copycat action. It's a mistake, I think, on insufficient evidence, to jump automatically to the conclusion that these people are politically motivated. I don't think we know.
But I would distinguish that from the threat against Trump and others from the Iranians, which is deadly serious, and it's not internet chatter. It's not nut cases. It's the Revolutionary Guard Corps, and the Quds Force, actively seeking to hire hitmen.
So that for Trump, I think, would justify an increase in security, even if these two attempts had nothing to do with it. And because of the risk of a copycat additional attempt, I think that's justification for more security --
COLLINS: Yes.
BOLTON: -- for Trump too.
COLLINS: Well, I think, the question when it comes to the Iran Intel, which I should note again, not -- we don't know that it's related at all to yesterday.
But if the Trump campaign is briefed on that, in recent weeks, by senior Intel officials, about these -- that Iran's trying to ramp up its attacks, on Trump, directed at him. Why would that Secret Service level not change, in the interim period, between what happened yesterday and when they got that intelligence, knowing to be on high alert that that threat was out there?
BOLTON: Well, it depends on what they're hearing about -- specifically about Trump, what to do. And I am not briefed on that, or on the intelligence on anybody else. I think I have a handle on what -- what affects me. But it's for good and sufficient reason, not briefed to everybody else who's part of this.
I'd like to go on the Iran threat, though, to an antecedent question. This is really threats against former American officials, and some who are still serving, for carrying out their responsibilities as government employees. And that is -- that is a threat, really, by a foreign power, against not just the individuals, but the government of the United States.
And it's a good point to ask, why are we waiting for one of these targets to get hit? We've been so solicitous of Iran, for the past three and a half years. Our troops and our civilian employees in Iraq have been subject to attack by Iraqi armed, equipped, trained and financed Shia militia in Iraq and Syria. Why are we waiting to be attacked before we -- before we impose costs on Iran, and hopefully deter them from this kind of activity?
COLLINS: Ambassador John Bolton, thank you so much.
BOLTON: Thank you.
COLLINS: I do want to note, we have some breaking news tonight, as we can now report here, at CNN, that the embattled musician and producer, Sean "Diddy" Combs has now been arrested. That's according to the mogul's attorney, and what they are telling CNN tonight.
According to a source, Combs was arrested in a Manhattan hotel, this evening. He is right now being processed. The charges are unclear, at this time. And an attorney for Combs tells CNN, quote, "We are disappointed with the decision to pursue what we believe is an unjust prosecution of Mr. Combs."
CNN's Elizabeth Wagmeister is with us right now.
Elizabeth, what can you tell us about this arrest tonight?
[22:00:00]
VOICE OF: ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We don't have many details at this moment, but just hearing from his attorney directly that he has been arrested.
I am hearing that even his attorneys are not clear on what these charges are at the moment. But he was arrested, tonight, in a Manhattan hotel. He is currently being processed.
And of course, we know that this comes after months and months of this mogul having an immense fall from grace. He has 10 civil suits against him, many of which include very disturbing allegations of sexual assault, of drugging.
It's important to note that Combs has denied most of these allegations. But you'll remember, a few months ago, when we broke that video of Combs violently beating his ex-girlfriend, Cassie, in the hallway of a Los Angeles hotel room. And that came after he had denied many allegations that were in her lawsuit.
I want to remind our viewers that that lawsuit came out in November of 2023. And ever since then, it has been a constant domino effect. We heard at the time that Diddy was the target of an investigation. We learned that that investigation was tied to sex trafficking. And months later, we exclusively broke, at CNN, that a grand jury -- that this was presented to a grand jury, and that they were pressing --
COLLINS: Yes.
VOICE OF: WAGMEISTER: -- accusers to speak with that grand jury.
COLLINS: Yes. And we've seen what that grand jury has decided tonight.
Elizabeth Wagmeister, stand by.
I want to hand over the breaking news to Abby Phillip.
