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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump Rewrites History: Jan. 6 Was "Love And Peace"; Harris Slams Trump's Black Outreach: "Ask Him" For His Plan; North Korea Blows Up Roads Near South Korean Border. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired October 15, 2024 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: --it's a way, I hope, you can feel a little less lonely, in your grief. You can connect with me, and others living with grief. You can leave comments and share your own experiences as well.
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That's it for us. The news continues. I'll see you tomorrow. "THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Straight from THE SOURCE tonight.
Fascism and fear. That's how Kamala Harris is boiling down Donald Trump's campaign, in the final three weeks of the 2024 election, as the former President is refusing to commit to a peaceful transfer of power, again.
Senator Bernie Sanders will join me live.
And Donald Trump is not denying Bob Woodward's new reporting that he has spoken with Russian President Putin, numerous times since he left office. But he says, if he did, this is what it means. We'll talk about it with The New York Times' Maggie Haberman.
And the election is happening right now, before our very eyes. CNN's tally shows that well over 5 million people have already cast their ballots. One of the most critical battlegrounds that we'll be watching, on Election Night, actually shattered records today.
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
Three weeks from tonight, polls will be closing, votes will be counted, states will be called, and we could know who will be the next President of the United States. Or we may not. A nail-biter is playing out as one of the candidates, tonight, is again refusing to commit to a peaceful transfer of power.
Donald Trump's opponent, tonight, is unloading on him about that, and his closing message in this campaign that has been full of bluster, falsehoods and a fondness for dictators.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S., (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Donald Trump through his -- his -- his way of trying to name-call and demean and divide, tries to project as though those things are a sign of strength, when in fact the man is really quite weak. He's weak.
It's a sign of weakness that you want to please dictators, and seek their flattery and favor. It's a sign of weakness that you would demean America's military and America's service members. It's a sign of weakness that you don't have the courage to stand up for the Constitution of the United States and the principles upon which it stands. This man is weak and he is unfit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: That was Vice President Harris, in an interview, tonight, with Charlamagne tha God, the radio host.
And those comments came after, today, we saw the only person who has presided over a non-peaceful transfer of power in U.S. history, try to argue otherwise.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN MICKLETHWAIT, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, BLOOMBERG: Will you commit now to respecting and encouraging a peaceful transfer of power?
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Well, you had a peaceful transfer of power.
MICKLETHWAIT: You had a peaceful transfer of power? You had a peaceful--
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: OK.
MICKLETHWAIT: Come on, President Trump. You had a peaceful--
TRUMP: You always have--
MICKLETHWAIT: You had a peace -- you had a peaceful transfer of power compared with Venezuela, but it was by far the most the worst transfer of power for a long time.
(BOOING)
TRUMP: It was love and peace.
I left the morning that I was supposed to leave. I went to Florida. And you had a very peaceful transfer.
Not one of those people had a gun. Nobody was killed, except for Ashli Babbitt. So -- so I think we should be allowed to disagree on that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Police officers died, of course. And I should note, the idea that no one had a gun, on January 6th, is just not true. We've seen multiple people convicted on very charges of bringing a gun, onto the Capitol ground, something that is illegal.
But in overall, that's just not the way most people remember what happened that day, including someone who was there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: January 6th, Donald Trump incited a violent mob to try and undo the will of the people and undo the results of a free and fair election. That violent mob attacked the United States Capitol. Over a 140 law enforcement officers were injured, some of them were killed. And he has said, since then, that there will be a bloodbath after this election.
CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD, CO-HOST, "THE BREAKFAST CLUB": So why is everybody sitting around acting like Donald Trump isn't going to plan to steal this election if he loses?
Why are people acting like this is going to be a free and fair election?
HARRIS: It will be a free and fair election if we, the American people, stand up for that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My first source tonight is the Independent senator from Vermont, Bernie Sanders.
Senator, it's great to have you here.
When you hear Donald Trump, as we all did today, sidestep another question about committing to a peaceful transfer of power, does it worry you about what Election Day, in just three weeks from tonight, could look like?
[21:05:00]
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT): Well, Kaitlan, it makes me wonder, why anyone, no matter what your political views may be, you're conservative, you're moderate, you're progressive, we cannot support somebody, who is working overtime, to undermine American democracy, who fomented an insurrection.
I was there. And trust me, it was a violent insurrection. People were hurt. People were killed.
So, to my mind, before we even talk about the issues of health care or the economy or education, I would think that it should be hard, for anybody, to support a candidate, who is not willing to accept free and fair elections. That is not what America is supposed to be about.
And I would also add, there is a reason why his own vice president, Mike Pence, who sat by his side for four years, is not supporting him. Why Dick Cheney, the most maybe conservative vice president in the modern history of this country, is not supporting him. Why Mitt Romney, a sitting U.S. senator, Republican, is not supporting him.
They understand that because of his lack of support for democracy, because of the fact that he's a pathological liar, this is a guy who is not fit to be President of the United States.
COLLINS: I mean, it does say something when Bernie Sanders and Liz Cheney are not only voting, but also campaigning for the same person for President. Her reason, obviously, is because of what happened on January 6th, that she says has driven her to do something she never thought she'd do, which is vote for a Democrat here.
I mean, but Senator, you've been out on the campaign trail, you've been in a bunch of states. What is your answer for -- I mean, it's a nail-biter. It's a very close election. There's a lot of people, who are still willing to support--
SANDERS: Well--
COLLINS: --Donald Trump.
SANDERS: Well absolutely, they're on. And it's going to be a very, very close election.
And I applaud the Vice President for raising and fighting for some very important issues for working people. And I think she has got to intensify that, bring more issues to the forefront, to make it clear that she is standing with the working class and the working families of this country, and is prepared, in fact, to take on corporate greed and the massive level of income and wealth inequality that we have right now.
Now, I go all over the country. I can tell you, in my own State of Vermont, and wherever I go, people are talking about the housing crisis. And it's not only 600,000 people who are homeless. It's that people are paying 40 percent, 50 percent, 60 percent of their limited incomes for housing. Kamala is talking about building 3 million units of affordable and lower-income housing, desperately needed.
And I will also tell you, I talked to working parents. It is expensive today to bring up a kid. And when she's talking about expanding and making permanent, the Child Tax Credit, man, that's going to make life easier for a whole lot of working families in this country.
And I was especially pleased that last week -- because this is something I've been working on for a long time. She is now talking and will implement an expansion of Medicare to cover home health care.
Kaitlan, I can't tell you how many people I talk to, who have elderly people in their homes, or disabled people in their homes, who want to stay in their homes. They don't want to go to a nursing home. But they can't afford the help that they need to take care of that individual.
So, expanding Medicare, to include home health care, is a huge step forward. And she is also, in that plan, talking about making hearing aids and eyeglasses--
COLLINS: Yes.
SANDERS: --a part of Medicare. That's a big deal as well.
COLLINS: Yes, and I know previously you wanted that. You also wanted Dental.
But just to follow up on what you were just getting at because--
SANDERS: I did.
COLLINS: Because your argument was saying, before we get to the issues, and I want to talk about the issues, but this line of one candidate not saying that, Yes, I'll commit to a peaceful transfer of power.
Harris tonight agreeing with the host, when Charlamagne said that Trump's agenda, he believes, is just about fascism.
I mean, when you're out talking to these voters, is that a more effective line for her to be pushing and highlighting to voters? Or is it what you're just talking about there, people who are taking care of their elderly parents, or who can't afford child care?
SANDERS: Well--
COLLINS: Or is it both?
SANDERS: I think you got to go -- I think you got to go in both directions.
I mean, I think you have to appeal to a number of moderates, some Republicans, who say, You know what? I don't agree with Kamala Harris. Don't like her views on the issue. But you know what, I do believe in democracy. My husband was a veteran. He fought, and -- he fought to preserve American democracy. And we can't elect somebody, who doesn't believe in the basic tenets of American democracy. So, that is a strong point.
[21:10:00]
And I think the fact that he lies all the time. Kaitlan, all over this country, there are people trying to raise their kids, to tell the truth, to not be a bully. And to have somebody as President of the United States, who lies all of the time? That is so bad on so many levels.
And I think a lot of conservatives understand that. I mean that is, again, the reason why people, like Mike Pence and Mitt Romney are not supporting Donald Trump. But I think, at the same time, when you have 60 percent of our people living paycheck to paycheck, more income and wealth inequality today than we've ever had before, with the rich becoming much richer, while working families are struggling, you've got to talk about economic issues.
And I would hope that the next three weeks, she will intensify how discussion about the needs of working-class people, by expanding Social Security, for example, very important. We could do that by lifting the cap on taxable income, by raising the minimum wage to a living wage.
There are millions of people in this country working for $9, $10, a 11 bucks an hour. Got to raise that minimum wage to a living wage. I think that's good policy. And I think that is good politics.
COLLINS: Yes.
SANDERS: I hope she will move aggressively in those areas.
COLLINS: OK. So, you very clearly want to see her ramp that up.
I wonder what you made, Senator, then last week, when we heard from Harris, when she was asked what she would have done differently than Biden had she been president. Initially, she said nothing came to mind. Then, she said putting a Republican in her cabinet, something she's pledged to do.
But from your vantage point, do you think that was enough of a course correction that she offered to voters?
SANDERS: Well, frankly, it's no great secret. I happen to believe that on domestic issues, President Biden has probably been the most progressive president, since Franklin Delano Roosevelt. And I think he's done a lot of good work, on a lot of areas, which I think he's not getting the kind of credit that he deserves. And Kamala Harris has been at his side throughout that whole process, and she deserves the credit.
I mean, I think it's no great secret that the area that I and a lot of folks do have disagreements with, in the Biden administration, is the war in Gaza. I happen to think that both Netanyahu, and Sinwar, who is the leader of Hamas, are war criminals.
And what started this war with a terrible terrorist attack against Israel. And now, Netanyahu has gone to war, all-out war against the Palestinian people, killing 42,000, two-thirds of whom are women, children and the elderly, injuring a 100,000, now stopping humanitarian aid so that people are starving there.
I think that is not where American money should be going. And I don't think another nickel should go to Netanyahu, so long as he continues those policies. That's my view.
But I would have hoped that Kamala might have diverted a little bit from the Biden administration on that. COLLINS: OK. So, you think that that should have been a course correction she could have offered there.
I got to ask you, though, because you have been out on the campaign trail so much, in the last several days.
When Vice President Harris has been talking about her middle-class background, which she said tonight, I'm repeating this a lot because people need to get to know me better.
One thing that she has mentioned is working at McDonald's, when she was in college in her early 20s. Trump has repeatedly accused her of lying about it, because, I guess she didn't talk about it enough, for him, before.
And CNN is being told tonight, we're reporting -- well, I just -- let me -- let me ask you this, because we're being told that Trump is going to visit a McDonald's in Pennsylvania, and work the fry cooker. That's according to a source to our Kristen Holmes.
What do you make of that, Senator?
SANDERS: Well, look, I smile and I laugh, whenever Donald Trump, of all people, accuses somebody of lying. What can you say? This guy lies every single day. And it's not just stretching the truth, making preposterous lies.
I remember, you recall, a few months ago, Kamala Harris did a rally, I believe it was in Michigan. She had 10,000 -- 15,000 people out. It was covered. It was live-streamed, covered by all the media. And Donald Trump alone perceived that there was nobody there, it was artificial intelligence. I mean, on and on it goes.
His lies are so preposterous that for Donald Trump to accuse anybody of lying is nothing less than laughable.
COLLINS: Senator Bernie Sanders, thank you for your time tonight.
SANDERS: Thank you very much.
COLLINS: Ahead. We're going to talk about what Trump is not denying or confirming, those secret calls with Vladimir Putin. We're getting new insight, from the legendary journalist, Bob Woodward.
Plus, new reporting on Trump's mindset in these final three weeks. Also a cash crunch that is whittling down his campaign payroll. That's ahead.
[21:15:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Tonight, the legendary reporter, Bob Woodward, offered this answer, for why his reporting that Donald Trump has spoken with Vladimir Putin, since he left office, really matters.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOB WOODWARD, AMERICAN INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST: CIA Director, Bill Burns, quote, says, Putin manipulates. He's professionally trained to do that. Putin's got a plan, just as he did when Trump was in office, at playing Trump.
Now that's not some political opponent saying that about Trump. That's the CIA Director.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Trump, for his part, played coy, when he was asked directly, has he spoken to Vladimir Putin since he left office?
[21:20:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICKLETHWAIT: Can you say yes or no, whether you have talked to Vladimir Putin since you stopped being President?
TRUMP: Well, I don't comment on that. But I will tell you that if I did, it's a smart thing. If I'm friendly with people, if I could have a relationship with people, that's a good thing, not a bad thing, in terms of a country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My inside source tonight is CNN Political Analyst, and Senior Political Correspondent for The New York Times, Maggie Haberman.
I mean, that was a dodge of whether or not he has spoken with him. How do you interpret that? Does that -- I mean, to me, it sounds like they definitely have spoken. But I wonder how you -- how you hear when he doesn't answer.
MAGGIE HABERMAN, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, THE NEW YORK TIMES, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: No, I don't take it as that at all. But I take it as the fact that he wants people to think it might have happened.
And I think he wants to not offend Vladimir Putin by saying openly, No, I wouldn't do that, or to look weak as if he wouldn't be in touch with an adversary who is fighting against Ukraine, while the U.S. is funding Ukraine's opposition.
But I don't think that it means that he has done it. We talked to -- to be clear, doesn't mean he didn't.
COLLINS: Yes.
HABERMAN: But we talked to roughly 20 people, who should have had some visibility into this, and none of them knew about it.
It's certainly possible that it's happening on some kind of covert channel, or has. It's certainly possible that Trump suggested to people that he had talked to Putin in the past, and didn't. All of these are within the realm of possibility.
But I don't take that as yes, he absolutely did, because he often leaves these things open, so that he's not ruling something out.
COLLINS: But that's interesting. Even, you spoke to 20 people, who, generally, you would think would know, if these calls had happened?
HABERMAN: Yes. And they didn't.
COLLINS: And they weren't sure?
HABERMAN: And they -- they were not aware of this. Yes, they did not say, definitively this couldn't have happened. But that they weren't aware of them. And it's a lot of people.
COLLINS: And it's pretty -- I mean, you couldn't imagine a situation, where another former President has, like, spoken to a world leader, and his close staff and aides doesn't know about it?
HABERMAN: No. Although Trump does things so unusually. He's not staffed at every minute of the day.
COLLINS: Yes.
HABERMAN: And at least back in the past -- in the past, when he left office, and he went to Mar-a-Lago, it was a really tiny staff around him. And so, all kinds of things could have happened.
I asked him in an interview in September of 2021 if he had spoken to Putin. And he said, No. But that doesn't mean that he hadn't either. I just, I don't know that I take that dodge as evidence that he did.
COLLINS: Yes. So he -- that was at the Economic Club of Chicago today that he did this interview, with the Bloomberg editor.
And there were these moments, where he would be asked about something, and he would kind of ramble. I mean, this is kind of classic Donald Trump, for people who've covered him for a long time.
He is now explaining it as the weave. I want -- just -- this was his description of that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: So, I said, No, I'm just telling you basic -- it's called the weave.
And I knocked out ISIS in a matter of weeks. It was supposed to take four to five years. I did it in a matter of weeks. We actually have a great military.
MICKLETHWAIT: I was asking about tariffs. You've gone off about that.
Should Google be broken up?
TRUMP: I just haven't gotten over something the Justice Department did yesterday, where Virginia cleaned up its voter rolls, and got rid of thousands and thousands of bad votes.
MICKLETHWAIT: The question is about Google, President Trump.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I mean, he's calling it the weave. But if his opponent was doing that, would he be so generous in his description?
HABERMAN: No, and I think that he has challenged his rivals', both of them, mental acuity, over and over again.
Look, we are used to seeing him have a discursive speaking style. But it has gotten more rambling. It has gotten more incoherent. And it's gotten longer.
That's the other thing, is that if you look back at the speech lengths, from a couple of years ago, they were much shorter. Now, they -- when he was in office. Now, they are 75 minutes, 90 minutes. His aides have been working to try to get them down for a while.
But no, I think calling it the weave is PR, to try to explain why he's talking this way.
COLLINS: I mean, what have you heard from sources about -- shortly before we came on the air, last night, and we showed part of this, which was this town hall, a friendly town hall that Trump was doing, last night, where he only took a handful of questions.
And then, most of it looks more like this, where he was with the South Dakota governor, Kristi Noem. I mean, it was over half an hour that they were up there. He was requesting songs on little pieces of paper. His aides were tweeting about it in defense.
But it was this weird moment, where, I mean, we are three weeks out from a very close election, and.
HABERMAN: It was weird. I mean, I don't know of another word to describe last night. It was weird. And he does weird things like this. And he usually does them in private, or he does them with aides, or he does them on the Mar-a-Lago patio, when he's DJing on an iPad. This was a rare time that people were seeing this in public.
I think what happened was he got anxious, because people were getting sick, and it was delaying the event.
At the second Butler rally, people got sick twice, and you could see him get a little anxious, when it was taking a very long time to make sure that they were OK.
He went over at one point to talk to the Secret Service to ask if they could open the doors. The answer was no. So I think that he said, Let's play the music. I know he said, Let's play the music. So that people would start leaving. But then nobody left. And then, they were all sort of swaying along with him, and then he was feeding off what they were doing.
And you know this very well. The music thing is a big thing for him. It was how people would basically reset him in the White House.
[21:25:00]
COLLINS: Yes. Well, it's also, he would blare music on his plane.
HABERMAN: Yes. Alone (ph).
COLLINS: And what you're saying with Mar-a-Lago, I mean, this is that kind of what the Mar-a-Lago dinner party, that's kind of what he does at the end of them, when people are there.
HABERMAN: Yes, it's pretty unusual to see it on the campaign trail, at an ostensible town hall. When you could just say to people, We're going to call it an early night because it's really hot, and I don't want people getting sick. Instead it turned into this.
And, I mean, Noem -- Kristi Noem's face, kind of said it all. She was the moderator for this panel, and she looked completely confused, standing there with him.
COLLINS: Yes. Well, and this comes as you had some really interesting reporting over the weekend about Trump.
One, he's not doing what he loves to do on the weekends, typically, which is go golfing, because of the security threats that are facing him. Now, two assassination attempts, all the threats from Iran.
But you also reported that the other thing that appears to be on his mind, in the closing days of this election, is money, and that he was quite frustrated that he is spending so much time, having to court donors and raise money instead of being out on the campaign trail at rallies.
HABERMAN: Yes, so my colleagues and I -- Jonathan Swan, and Shane Goldmacher, and I, had a story, about this money situation, where he is irritated.
And we've been told by people on the campaign that they do -- they will be fine, in the closing weeks of the campaign. But he's not at parity with Harris in terms of fundraising. She had a huge last three months, last, I think it was, 80 days.
And so he -- what was notable about it is that he's at this dinner, with these incredibly wealthy donors, or potential donors, who are members of a group called the American Opportunity Alliance. Some of them are huge pro-Israel backers. And he starts trashing Jews who don't back him. He uses a slur to describe Kamala Harris' mental state. It goes on and on and on like this.
And it's, he seemed to have, according to the seven people we talked to, who were briefed about this dinner, it was as if he had no sense of who he was in front of, or who he was talking to.
And so, I think, yes, there is anxiety about money, that's clear, and I've heard that from multiple people. Also just think that he is, and this kind of relates to last night, there's like a -- there's -- it's like he's devoid of context. It's like he's just sort of showing up and behaving in various places.
COLLINS: What do you read into that? I mean, with three weeks to go. Is he just a different candidate in this? I mean, is he just older? Is he just viewing this differently?
HABERMAN: I mean, he's older. I think that he is, you know, I think there's less of a filter than there used to be, which is what happens when people get older.
I also think that, this is based on a number of people, who have been around him or talked to him, that he has -- he has seemed somewhat different, since the attempt on his life, in Butler, Pennsylvania, and since Joe Biden stopped being a candidate.
COLLINS: And you also have reported just at that dinner, Betsy DeVos was there.
HABERMAN: Yes.
COLLINS: Trump's Education Secretary, which stood out to me, because she resigned on January 6th -- after January 6th.
HABERMAN: After January 6th, and blamed his rhetoric for escalating the violence that took place at the Capitol.
I think it speaks volumes about how durable his support is within the Republican Party, and how people, who have been oppositional to him, in various ways, at various times, realize that they are not going to be able to be against him and beat Harris, which they see as a crucial imperative.
COLLINS: Maggie Haberman, fascinating three weeks ahead of us.
HABERMAN: Thanks, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Thank you very much for the great reporting.
Up next tonight. We're following this very closely. There has been record turnout in the critical battleground State of Georgia. It is the first day of early voting. Of course, that's the same state where Donald Trump is criminally charged with trying to overturn the last election.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: As former President Donald Trump is rallying, in Georgia, tonight, the battleground state is reporting record turnout on the first day of in-person early voting. The Secretary of State's office says that more than 300,000 voters cast their ballots today. That nearly doubles the previous records set in 2020.
So far, across 39 states, CNN counts more than 5 million votes so far cast in this election. And with the election three weeks from right now, from tonight, a big question is, what does this data tell us?
I want to go inside the numbers with CNN's Senior Data Reporter, Harry Enten.
And Harry, Gabe Sterling is calling this spectacular turnout compared to what we've seen in previous election cycles. What does this mean that we're seeing such a higher number, but obviously not anywhere close to what we'll see three weeks from now?
HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL DATA REPORTER: I really appreciated his tweet, actually. I think it was a GIF, and I think it was spectacular that was throwing hands (ph).
I think it's spectacular, right? We got people voting. People are clearly very excited about this election.
But here's the thing, right? Four years ago was a pandemic. In-person early voting this year is going to look very different than it did four years ago. And, at the same time, voting by mail is going to look very different than it did four years ago. In Georgia, for example, I don't think anywhere near the number who voted by mail, four years ago, are going to vote by the same numbers this time.
So, when you see that number, 300,000-plus. I think it's a great number. It's obviously double the record. But we should note that the vote by mail is going to be considerably down there, as it's going to be considerably down everywhere.
COLLINS: OK. So, Donald Trump was talking about this today, when he was asked what state is he keeping his eye on the most, on Election Day. He cited basically the ones that we're all keeping--
ENTEN: Ah.
COLLINS: --keeping our eyes on.
But here's what he had to say about whether or not he thinks the early voting total so far are in his favor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: So when you look at polls, but you can also look at the votes that are being cast right now. People get a pretty good indication. And based, as we discussed backstage, you know, based on the votes that are coming in so far, we're doing very well. I mean, we're way up in Pennsylvania, we're way up in Michigan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:35:00] ENTEN: I have no idea how he's actually calculating that stuff. But I'll be honest with you, half the time Donald Trump talks I don't exactly know how he's calculating that stuff. But here's what--
COLLINS: But do we know who is doing better so far?
ENTEN: Here's what we know. We know from the numbers from Pennsylvania, they do have vote by party registration, in the State of Pennsylvania, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. God forgive me, Jake Tapper. And that's very much unlike Georgia, right where you don't have party registration.
What do we see in the party registration so far in the great Commonwealth of Pennsylvania? Look, Democrats make up the vast majority of those who have cast a ballot so far. Now, we obviously don't know who those folks, those Democrats, are actually voting for.
Now, here's the thing. Compare that to where we were four years ago. And this is where I think it gets a little bit more interesting. If you look at those votes, what we do see is, in fact, it does seem that fewer folks who are the percentage of Democrats that make up that chunk. You can see it. It's much lower than it was four years ago, when it was 76 percent. We're now talking below 70 percent for the percentage of Democrats. But again, we don't know who those folks are voting for.
But here's the other thing. We're comparing everything to four years ago. I said at the top of the segment, we were in the middle of a pandemic, for goodness sake.
COLLINS: Yes.
ENTEN: Those comparisons, they're interesting. We're making them. But there are some big caveats that surround them.
COLLINS: It's a really good thing to keep in mind.
And also, the first year Biden was in office was when the Georgia governor signed into new voting laws -- and signed those into law. He was heavily criticized by Democrats at the time. I mean, at one point, Joe Biden called it Jim Crow 2.0.
ENTEN: Yes.
COLLINS: And Governor Kemp, I interviewed him that fall. He strongly defended it, and said it wasn't going to hamper or suppress votes.
And he tweeted tonight, and said, "For years, Kamala Harris, Stacey Abrams, Joe Biden, and their allies in the media lied about Georgia election laws to raise campaign cash and scare people." He says "It was wrong then, and it's wrong now. Here's the truth: in Georgia, it's easy to vote and hard to cheat."
What does what we're seeing happening in Georgia, tonight, say, if anything, about the voting laws?
ENTEN: I mean, I think, obviously Brian Kemp thinks it says a lot that it is easy to vote, hard to cheat.
We know, historically speaking, in 2020, Georgia, in terms of voting eligible population, basically match the nationwide average. In 2022, obviously there was a hot Senate race, was actually above average.
If you were to look at non-partisan rankings that essentially say, how easy is it to register, how easy is it to vote? George is right in the middle of the pack. I'm not sure, you know, I don't think, if I was Brian Kemp, I wouldn't say, Oh, Georgia runs away. It's the easiest to register, easiest to vote. But the Stacey Abrams stuff. She's out to lunch, if I'm being perfectly honest with you.
COLLINS: Can we talk about the other thing quickly before we go tonight, that's happening right now. Colin Allred is in Texas, on debate stage, with Ted Cruz. He is challenging him there for that Senate seat. It's a little bit closer, actually, than people think.
And there was a moment, tonight, about IVF, or, excuse me, about abortion and exceptions for rape and incest. Here's how Ted Cruz answered that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): I agree with the United States Supreme Court that under our Constitution, the way we resolve questions like that, questions on which we have real and genuine disagreements, is at the ballot box.
JASON WHITELY, SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER, WFAA: Do you support or oppose exceptions for rape or for incest? Again, asking as a Texan and as a father tonight.
CRUZ: So, I want to be very clear. If you listen to Congressman Allred's answer, at no point did he make any reference to his own record.
WHITELY: Why is this an issue you won't address, about saying whether you support or oppose exceptions, like rape and incest?
CRUZ: Jason, I'm curious. Why do you keep asking me that?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Could that affect this race at all?
ENTEN: I'll keep it simple. Look, Ted Cruz is leading in that race, right now. But it's a race within the margin of error. Answers like that are the reason why Ted Cruz continuously runs behind the Republican baseline, in the great State of Texas.
COLLINS: Harry Enten, a lot of updates, and a lot of numbers for us tonight. Thank you for that.
ENTEN: A lot of numbers, I hope I made it interesting.
COLLINS: You always make it interesting, Harry. ENTEN: Thank you.
COLLINS: Don't worry about that.
Also tonight, Vice President Harris is stepping up her push to win over Black voters. We talked about those numbers last night. Tonight, she's going after Donald Trump, for selling Bibles and sneakers, and responding to criticism that she comes off as scripted.
[21:40:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Amid concerns about eroding support in the Democratic coalition, Vice President Harris, today, is highlighting her connection and her plans for Black voters.
In a one-hour town hall that she did, with the radio host, Charlamagne tha God, she talked about her proposals to fund Black small businesses, to kickstart homeownership, and also to improve access to health care. All while she argued that Donald Trump does not have a plan for Black voters.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: They are trying to scare people away because they know they otherwise have nothing to run on. Ask Donald Trump what his plan is for Black America. Ask him.
And then he's selling $60 Bibles or tennis shoes and as -- and trying to play people as though that makes him more understanding of the Black community. Come on.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My political sources tonight are:
The former communications director for Vice President Harris, the Co- host of the "TrailBlaze" podcast, Jamal Simmons.
Republican strategist, Shermichael Singleton.
And CNN's Media Analyst, Sara Fischer.
Great to have you all here.
Shermichael, when you hear what she's saying there, going after Trump, because he's actually seen a boost in his support--
SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Yes.
COLLINS: --from what we saw in 2020. What did you make though of her saying, this is someone who's trying to hawk you Bibles and tennis shoes. He doesn't actually have a plan for your wellbeing and whatnot. SINGLETON: I mean, look, the Vice President just came out with her plan, two days ago. But she does have a plan. So, I'm going to give her credit there. I wonder strategically, what difference that's going to make with 21 days remaining.
[21:45:00]
Obviously, African American men, 18- to 44-years-old, have some issues with the Democratic Party. I wouldn't necessarily say it's Vice President Harris.
You can go all the way back to Hillary Clinton, and you continue to see a drop off of Black men. You go to Barack Obama's second term, and you see men, writ large, leaving the Democratic Party for the Republican Party, or at least becoming more independent-minding in how they decide to whom they're going to vote for.
And so, I think this is a problem that the Democratic Party has to deal with. I'm not certain that it's so much so ideological, any more than it is that maybe a certain percent of men, in the country, don't believe the party represents a manliness or masculinity in the traditional sense. And so, I wouldn't necessarily put that at her doorstep. But she does have to figure out how to get over that hurdle.
COLLINS: Yes.
JAMAL SIMMONS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR FOR VP HARRIS, CO-HOST, "TRAILBLAZE" PODCAST: So, I was with Shermichael for a minute, right? There is clearly something going on with the Democratic Party and men, and Democrats have to really sort of speak to the aspirations of men, economically, start a business, have a job that pays well, take care of your family, those things.
The masculinity part, the manly part, is where we sort of differ, because I do think that nothing's really changed about masculinity. Men want to take care of their families, and protect them and do well. But we are starting to see that women also are doing really different things in their careers. And so, if you're going to be a good partner to a woman, then you're going to take care of some of those things.
The one thing about protecting your -- the women in your life you care about, and your daughters, and whoever, is about them having freedom to make their own reproductive choices. And that is something that the Republicans have been losing ground on, for a long time. Donald Trump superpowered it with the Dobbs decision.
But the stuff that Democrats have really latched on to, and a lot of men support them for this, they think abortion ought to be -- at least access to abortion--
SINGLETON: That hasn't -- that hasn't helped--
SIMMONS: --ought to be legal.
SINGLETON: But that hasn't helped the Vice President with her deficit with Black men, though. And now, I will say she's improved upon where Joe Biden was. But she's not where she needs to be mathematically, as a Democrat. Even former President Obama noted that.
SIMMONS: I see your point (ph).
COLLINS: But what about in the terms of the two interviews that we saw today?
Donald Trump with the Economic Club of Chicago.
Harris was sitting down with Charlamagne tha God, for this town hall.
Because at one point, Sara, with Charlamagne, she was asked by him. He said, People say you come off as scripted. They say, you stick to your talking points. And she goes, that would be called discipline. She was saying, essentially, These are talking points. I'm just repeating -- I'm being like a typical candidate, in the sense of repeating this.
While Donald Trump, as Maggie and I were just talking about, was defending what he calls the weave, as he like, waves, goes from tariffs to another answer, to Google and whatnot.
SARA FISCHER, CNN MEDIA ANALYST, SENIOR MEDIA REPORTER, AXIOS: I think she knows that anytime she's calling attention to Trump's attacks on her, she's elevating them. So, she tries not to respond directly.
But where she does do it is on social media. The Kamala HQ TikTok account will go after Trump all day, all night, in the most crass manner possible. But she doesn't like to do it in pointed interviews. She likes to stay on topic and to be more disciplined, to your point.
I was actually shocked that Charlamagne kind of called her out. He was sort of saying, Hey, you're filibustering me on the border question. It kind of comes to show that you might think that you're walking into an interview that's going to be all fun and games. Jamal, you know this from when you used to work with her. Not every interview that's pointed at a specific audience is a softball, if it's not a journalistic interview.
COLLINS: Yes, it was a very substantive, interesting interview that he conducted with great questions, I thought.
I do have to ask you, Shermichael, because Trump did a Fox News town hall that will air tomorrow -- we'll see it air tomorrow with women, focused on women's issues. During this, we have just learned that he called himself the father of IVF.
And I want to read you his full quote. Because he was being asked a question by a voter, and he said, I'm the father of IVF, so I want to hear this question. He said, We really are the party for IVF. We want fertilization, and it's all the way. And the Democrats tried to attack us on it. And we're out there on IVF, even more so than them. So we're totally in favor.
SINGLETON: Look, I think it's a good pivot. I mean, if the Republican--
COLLINS: Father of IVF?
SINGLETON: If the Republican Party is going to claim that we as conservatives, as people of faith, believe in families? Then we should support every aspect of what it takes to create a family.
And the reality is, there are millions, perhaps, of Americans who do struggle to conceive naturally. And so, to support those types of programs, I think that's in sync with conservatism. We're about the family.
I think the former President is on the right track here. He should have done it a long time ago. It's a bit inconsistent to say, Hey, we're pro-family, but we're going to restrict how people start families. I don't think that's a consistent belief.
SIMMONS: I know you got a--
SINGLETON: I'm a conservative here. So--
SIMMONS: I know you've got to self-brief here, Shermichael.
SINGLETON: So -- so I think that--
SIMMONS: And that's really kind of nutty.
SINGLETON: No, but I think that if you are conservative, and many Americans say, Well, these people are always talking about how they believe in families and the importance of the nuclear family. Yet they don't want to support people starting families? That's not a consistent ideological disposition. So him pivoting on this, I think, is smart.
FISCHER: Yes but it's really -- I wanted to just say, I don't think it's really a policy belief thing. I think at the end of the day, this is the closest -- sorry, the farthest gap for women in any recent election. He knows he's got to get that vote. I think this is just a political stunt, at the end of the day. I mean, if he really believed this? We would have heard it much earlier.
SINGLETON: Well I just think--
(CROSSTALK)
COLLINS: Well, we asked Tom Cotton--
SINGLETON: --of ideological purity though. As a conservative, we should believe it. I think sometimes we get too far away from the foundation of what these ideals actually meant, once upon a time ago.
COLLINS: OK. But -- well, hold--
SINGLETON: And that's important.
[21:50:00] COLLINS: But hold on. Because the reason this is an issue is because of what happened in Alabama, where the Alabama Supreme Court decided that embryos are people. And therefore, a lot of IVF clinics shut down because they don't want to be prosecuted or have the law come after them. And that's really what became the issue.
SINGLETON: Right, and there are -- there are some evangelicals--
COLLINS: So, when we hear from people arguing that there's no Republicans who believe that? There are Republicans who think embryos are people.
SINGLETON: No, that is true. There are some evangelicals who have that disposition. I wouldn't challenge them on that, because that is based upon their religious beliefs.
However, I am of the mindset, in a modern society, you're going to have to adapt somewhat. That doesn't mean you necessarily change the concreteness of your ideals.
SIMMONS: But--
SINGLETON: But it does mean you have to be nimble in terms of where society is going.
And again, if we're going to say we want to conserve family? That means being more open-minded to allowing people to start families in different ways. And so, again, I think Trump--
SIMMONS: Well--
SINGLETON: --politically or not, whether he believes it or not, as a conservative, I think it's a smart thing to do.
SIMMONS: And--
COLLINS: But Trump says he's going to pay for IVF. And I -- we asked Tom Cotton, Well, what is the plan? Tom Cotton's a huge surrogate for Trump. And how are they going to pay for it? And he had said that there were no -- they had not worked out the perimeters of that yet.
SIMMONS: Yes, they got concepts of a plan. That's like the thing of the Republican and the Trump -- in the Trump era. They really don't have plans for any of these things.
And here's the problem with it. They've got all the doctors and clinics and the hospitals so nervous about this that even the ones who aren't actually doing abortions or whatever, that -- you're seeing lower places for people, for women to get breast exams. You're seeing OB-GYNs decide to get out. You're seeing insurance costs go up. These are all things that are getting in the way. And so, women are having this problem.
We have not polled women well since the Dobbs decision. Women have overperformed against MAGA, every time they've had to choose in the election since Dobbs. I think it's one of the questions in this current election. Is that going to happen again, and benefit Kamala Harris?
COLLINS: I mean, father of IVF is going to be probably in an ad, I would assume.
Thank you all for being here.
I'm not sure on which side necessarily.
Up next. We're going to talk about an alarming alliance that we're seeing forming, right before our eyes, as Kim Jong Un is reportedly sending North Koreans to fight, in Russia's war in Ukraine, and why the secretive state just blew up roads near South Korea's border.
[21:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: In a display of anger, today, North Korea blew up two parts of two major roads that once linked the Hermit Kingdom to South Korea. Now, this was symbolic, more than anything, given those roads have not been used in years.
But this is all coming at a really important moment, and in the wake of escalating rhetoric between those two nations. As North Korea's dictator, Kim Jong Un, is threatening to use nuclear weapons to destroy South Korea, after South Korea's President Yoon, warned that the North will face the end of its regime, if it tries to do so.
My source tonight is The Washington Post columnist, Josh Rogin.
And Josh, this is really interesting, because North Korea has spent months, trying to fortify it's already heavily-armed border. Obviously, there are about 30,000 -- 28,000 U.S. troops are stationed in South Korea.
I just wonder what you read into this move by North Korea, on top of everything that we've been seeing lately.
JOSH ROGIN, COLUMNIST, THE WASHINGTON POST: Well, Kaitlan, it's pretty stunning. Kim Jong Un has completely changed North Korea's 80-year- long strategy of reunification. His father, his grandfather, all said the goal of North Korea was to reunify with the South, under their command, by their telling. And now, that's no longer the case.
And by blowing up the roads, he's literally blowing up the connections, the last remaining connections he has with the South. This means that North Korea is no longer trying to unify with the South.
They're looking towards other actors for their future. They're looking towards Russia. They're looking towards China. They're looking towards Iran. They're not looking towards Seoul anymore, and they're definitely not looking towards the United States.
COLLINS: Well, you mentioned Russia. I mean, President Zelenskyy of Ukraine said that North Korea's sending North Koreans, to fight with Ukrainians, to help Russia's military in Ukraine.
ROGIN: It's pretty shocking, if true.
We know that North Korea has been supplying Russia with tens of thousands of train cars worth of munitions, ballistic missiles. We know that North Korean officers have been killed on the Ukrainian battlefield. We know that they've sent engineers.
And now, what President Zelenskyy is saying is that thousands of North Korean troops are training in Russia, to be deployed on the Ukrainian battlefield, which, if true, would mean that thousands of new troops for Putin's war against Ukraine will be sent in, at the worst possible time for Ukraine, in the winter, when they're facing energy shortages, when they're facing manpower shortages, and they're facing a basic lack of enthusiasm from the West in helping them struggle against Putin's aggression.
We have to wait and see if they actually show up. But if thousands of North Korean troops show up on the battlefield in Ukraine, that's really bad news for Ukraine, and really a call to action, I think, for the West.
COLLINS: And what have you heard from U.S. officials about how they're viewing this, what North Korea is getting out of this, and just their assessment, right now?
ROGIN: Right. The assessment is that North Korea and Russia, let's say Putin and Kim Jong Un, two psychopathic mass murderers, who always had sort of a transactional relationship, because they're both psychopathic mass murderers, who kind of liked each other, are now elevating that relationship into a strategic one.
They have basically what's essentially a mutual defense pact. And this has implications not just for Ukraine, but all over the world. The transfer of high technology from Russia to North Korea. The transfer of munitions from North Korea to Russia. Both countries are ramping up production for what they think will be a long struggle, militarily, against the West, in conjunction with Iran and China, by the way.
The Axis of Chaos is mobilizing for a long struggle against us. And we're not mobilizing for the long struggle against them. So that assessment is a pretty bleak one, at least at this stage.
COLLINS: Yes. I mean, it's kind of amazing that if North Korea is sending forces to Ukraine, that you're not just hearing European leaders scream from the rooftops about this.
It's remarkable reporting.
ROGIN: Exactly.
COLLINS: Josh Rogin, thank you for helping us break it all down.
ROGIN: Anytime.
[22:00:00] COLLINS: And thank you all so much for joining us tonight.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" starts right now.
