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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump's New Anti-Immigrant Rhetoric: U.S. Is "Garbage Can" For The World To "Dump" The Unwanted; Source: Israel Carries Out Second Wave Of Strikes On Iran; Any Minute: Harris Rallies With Beyonce. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired October 25, 2024 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: Gary Tuchman. Gary, thank you.
One programming note. CNN will be live, all night, with the latest in our breaking news. Israel's military has confirmed strikes on Iran, retaliation for Iranian strikes in Israel more than three weeks ago.
That's it for us. The news continues. I'll see you on Monday. "THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts now. Have a good weekend.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Straight from THE SOURCE tonight.
You're moments away from Vice President Harris rallying with Beyonce, live in Houston. With 11 days to go, why that they are in Texas, with a message that Harris is hoping will propel her to victory, in just a few days from now.
Plus, one of her biggest backers is here with me in New York. Mark Cuban is going to weigh in on Donald Trump, Elon Musk, and how he thinks Harris should close this deal.
Meanwhile, tonight, we're also tracking major news out of the Middle East, as Israel is retaliating right now, striking inside Iran, as details are coming in on what they're hitting, and where. We'll take you live to the Middle East.
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): This is CNN Breaking News.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: And we start with breaking news, as we come on the air, tonight, because Israel is striking back on Iran, this evening, following an attack from Tehran, earlier this month. They had vowed to respond and retaliate. We are now seeing that happen. As the IDF says that they are hitting military targets in Iran, as there are reports, tonight, of explosions happening and being heard inside the capital city.
I want to go straight to CNN's Jeremy Diamond, who is live for CNN in Israel.
Jeremy, obviously, just a few days ago, we had both been in Israel. We were waiting to see how Israel was going to respond, as officials had been meeting. What is the latest that you're hearing on what the IDF is carrying out tonight?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kaitlan, the Israeli military is indeed carrying -- confirming that they are carrying out what they describe as precise strikes on military targets, inside of Iran, as we are getting these reports of explosions being heard in the Iranian capital of Tehran, and also seeing some quite dramatic images of plumes of smoke over the Iranian capital.
Now, we don't know the exact nature of these targets or how many military bases, the Israeli military has been striking, inside of Iran, tonight.
But Israeli officials are taking pains to emphasize that these are only military targets, that they are not striking at any energy targets, nuclear or oil facilities, which we know had been considered by the Israeli government, earlier in this process.
I do expect that we will get a fuller accounting from the Israeli military of the targets that they struck, and the number of aircraft potentially that appear to have been involved in this strike.
What I can tell you, from speaking with Israeli officials, is that this decision to carry out these strikes on military targets was the process of weeks of deliberations, within the Israeli security cabinet, as well as weeks of consultations, between Israeli and U.S. officials.
One Israeli official describing this to me, tonight, as a, quote, very diligent decision-making process. Another Israeli official telling me that they went after targets that, quote, posed the threat or could pose a threat to the State of Israel.
Admiral Daniel Hagari, the Israeli military spokesman, in a video statement, tonight, saying that Israel has the right to defend itself, and that it is now prepared for all offensive and defensive scenarios. But for the time being, Israel's Home Front Command has yet to make any changes in its guidelines. And for now, the situation in Israel is effectively normal.
Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Yes. And Jeremy, I should note, we have heard that President Biden has been briefed. He's in Delaware. On this. Of course, the U.S. had been advising Israel on how to respond, trying to kind of restrain what that response would look like, whether they were striking military targets, nuclear sites, oil facilities.
Do we know how much that factored into the weeks of planning that you were just talking about for this response that we're seeing right now?
DIAMOND: There's no question that it was a significant factor, in the Israeli decision, to ultimately focus this attack solely on military targets.
Because we know that it was early on that the Israeli prime minister and some of his top advisers were indeed looking at something that would have been much more significant, much more escalatory, like those energy infrastructure targets.
Ultimately, it was clear that those consultations played a major role, as well, potentially as the deployment of a major and very advanced U.S. air defense system, the THAAD air defense system, which arrived in Israel, last week, and has now been deployed, and is indeed fully operational, in Israel, with a contingent of some 100 U.S. troops, which could defend Israel from any future Iranian retaliation.
And indeed, we do expect that there will be some kind of a response, from Iran. Israeli officials, who I've spoken to, in recent weeks, have emphasized that this Israeli retaliation, which we are now watching, play out, right now, as we speak, they did not expect that to be the end of the story.
[21:05:00]
The question now is how significant will that Iranian retaliation actually be? Will the fact that Israel only struck military targets factor into their decision-making, as far as whether or not to respond with something more significant, something that is kind of proportional here, or perhaps even something that takes the temperature much lower in this region.
COLLINS: Yes, it's not an overstatement to say the whole world is watching to see what that's going to look like.
Jeremy Diamond, as you get updates from the IDF, on what they're hitting, please bring those to us. We'll check in with you throughout the hour.
I also want to bring in CNN's Chief National Security Correspondent, Alex Marquardt, who is here with me.
Alex, we're looking at a live image, right now, of Tehran, watching where Israel is responding inside of Iran, the certain targets.
Jeremy just mentioned, the 100 U.S. troops who are in Israel, deployed, because they're required to work that sophisticated defense missile system that has been deployed to Israel.
When it comes to that and how U.S. officials are waiting to see what this response is going to look like. What are you hearing from sources in Washington?
ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think the overarching hope, Kaitlan, is that whatever we see, tonight, could be absorbed by the Iranians, and that they would not instigate another turn, if you will, and launch another salvo of rockets, missiles and drones, like we've seen over the course of the past few months. That may be wishful thinking.
So, I think very -- a lot of this depends on what we actually see, in terms of the targeting, the damage that is done, tonight, by the Israelis.
And we should caution everyone that it might not just be one evening. This is something that could drag out, over the course of several days. That remains very much to be seen.
But Kaitlan, I want to pick up on something that Jeremy was saying. Because I do think that over the course of the past 24 days, since that October 1st strike by Iran, with those 180 ballistic missiles, there has been not just these consultations, but essentially a negotiation that was underway, with fairly significant pressure, from the Biden administration, on the Israelis, to not go after some of those bigger targets that would lead to more escalatory action by the Iranians, getting them to essentially commit to these military targets.
And they have done that tonight. We understand from both the IDF and the White House, saying explicitly that only military targets are being struck.
And in return for that, they essentially got that THAAD air defense system that you've been talking about. Very sophisticated. It is something that can take down, with extremely high precision, short, medium and intermediate -- and intermediate range missiles.
But they also got more oil sanctions against the Iranians. We saw more F-16s arriving in the Middle East, just today. And you'll recall, Kaitlan, there was that strike by B-2 stealth bombers against Houthi targets just a few days ago.
So, there are quite a few actions that the Americans have taken, against enemies of Israel, in recent days, and in defense of Israel, essentially, in a way to make them feel comfortable that they could -- that they don't have to go into Iran, in a much bigger way. So, there is certainly a hope, in Washington, tonight, that what we're seeing now is kind of the extent of the target set.
Kaitlan.
COLLINS: And Alex, we're looking at this. Here it is, October 25th. This response that they are retaliating against is, obviously, there's been a lot going on, with the back-and-forth. But it's for Iran's attack on Israel on October 1st, which we all watched play out.
And it was kind of every single day, what was this response going to look like? And we heard a lot of warnings from the Defense Minister, in Israel, saying it's going to make your jaws drop, what this is going to look like.
I mean, I think it's a real question of whether or not, since it's 4:30 in the morning, if we have a good picture of what this looks like, right now.
MARQUARDT: I don't think we do. We first started getting word, just over two hours ago, that there had been explosions west of Tehran. We don't know if that's it. We could certainly see more in the coming hours. We could certainly see more in the coming days.
And I think one of the scarier scenarios, Kaitlan, is if the Israelis do inflict a good amount of pain, on the Iranians, tonight, not only will they feel -- could they feel a need to respond soon, say, in the coming days? Could they respond tonight? I think that is certainly a real concern.
But you're absolutely right. Over the course of the past three days -- three weeks, rather, there has been anticipation building towards this moment.
And we heard, very quickly, from President Biden himself, that there was a hope and expectation that the Israelis would not go after Iranian nuclear facilities, that they would not go after Iranian oil facilities, in a way that would drive up oil all around the world.
[21:10:00]
But we did know, for a fact, and I think we're seeing it now, that whatever this Israeli retaliation was going to be, it would be bigger than what we saw back in April, when Israel essentially went after a symbolic target. They just hit an air defense system in Isfahan, essentially telling the Iranians, Hey, we can get through your air defense systems.
I would imagine that when the dust settles, after tonight's strikes, that there will be a pretty decent amount of damage, on these military targets. But that is really going to determine what happens next, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Yes, and of course, we're looking at this, a 11 days out from the election. I mean, I was just in Israel a few days ago. This is certainly something that people are talking about.
Because when Netanyahu is having these conversations with the White House, which have not been pleasant, when, you know -- the diplomatic speak, you can always tell when people say it was a very candid conversation, what they -- what they mean it looks like.
But Netanyahu has been on the phone with Donald Trump, who is not urging restraint. He's actually been saying, Israel should do what it -- whatever it feels it needs to do in this situation.
MARQUARDT: Well, absolutely. And not too many details from former President Trump. He's basically been telling them to get the job done.
I think there was a level of confidence, in the White House, that what is happening, tonight, was what they expected to happen. We've been told for the past few days, we know what the Israelis are going to do, and we feel pretty confident. But as you -- as you point out, Kaitlan, there has been -- there have been repeated examples of defiance, of the Biden administration, by Prime Minister Netanyahu. So, there's simply never 100 percent confidence that the Israelis are going to do what the U.S. expects them to do.
Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Yes, I think Biden -- President Biden, would certainly agree with that, as they're watching this play out.
Alex Marquardt, please keep us updated on what we're hearing, watching this all very closely in the Middle East.
There's also major developments happening here, on the campaign trail at home, I should note.
Right now, Donald Trump is flying to Michigan after he taped a three- hour interview with Joe Rogan. He's just apologized to the crowd that you see waiting on him, in Michigan, asking them to stay up late, because he's running several hours late to that event. He hasn't even landed yet.
Meanwhile, on the left side of your screen, you are looking at Houston. That is where Vice President Harris is about to bring two very famous Texans, Willie Nelson and Beyonce, to help her deliver a message to voters that she's hoping will go far beyond the Lone Star State. We're going to bring that event to you live when they get on stage.
Now, you might be thinking to yourself, Why are they in Texas? It's not a battleground, certainly not in the presidential race. They've got a Senate race happening. But this is not why Harris is rallying there with just a 11 days left in this race.
What her campaign is saying, tonight, is that Texas is ground zero, when it comes to this fight over reproductive rights. They've got one of the strictest abortion bans in the country, in Texas, of course, as you know. We've heard stories from women there. And Harris is hoping that issue is going to propel her to victory in a race that right now could not be closer.
CNN's last national poll, the final one that we'll do of this presidential race, finds this contest is completely tied up.
Meanwhile, Donald Trump was also on his own, in Texas, today, hammering away on immigration, and also repeating a line that he rolled out yesterday that pretty much sums up his closing message.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We're like a garbage can.
We're like a garbage can for the rest of the world to dump the people that they don't want. (END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Here's what Vice President Harris had to say about that comment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S., (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Just another example of how he really belittles our country. This is someone who is a former President of the United States who has a bully pulpit. And this is how he uses it to tell the rest of the world that somehow the United States of America is trash?
The President of the United States should be someone who elevates discourse, and talks about the best of who we are, and invest in the best of who we are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Speaking of investors, my lead source tonight is a billionaire businessman and investor. He has spent two years, focusing on drug prices with his company, Cost Plus Drugs. In addition, he, of course, stars on ABC's Shark Tank, and is a vocal Harris supporter.
Mark Cuban, welcome to the show.
MARK CUBAN, ENTREPRENEUR, CAMPAIGNING FOR VP KAMALA HARRIS, PART OWNER, DALLAS MAVERICKS, HOST, "SHARK TANK": Thanks for having me, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: When you hear Donald Trump say that the United States has become the garbage can for the world, as a dumping ground, I mean, just as someone, who, you have such an amazing success story, what do you make of that comment?
CUBAN: I get mad. I get pissed off. I mean, this is -- this is our country. It's beautiful. We love it. I'm still part of the older generation. Love it or leave it. And to say that we've become the garbage can, is insulting to every single American.
COLLINS: When you look at your surrogacy for Harris, you've been out there, stumping for her, making the argument for her. The New York Times called you the most surprising surrogate for her.
You're someone, who has known Donald Trump for a long time. You used to actually give him political advice. And I wonder, when you described your relationship, I was looking at this today, in 2016, you said that you and Trump had a love-hate relationship.
How would you describe that relationship now?
[21:15:00]
CUBAN: I mean, he -- truth about me on Truth Social, we don't have a relationship. That's as close as we come. I haven't spoken to him since right before he left the White House. COLLINS: What do you make of how he was when you knew him, 15 years ago, 20 years ago, and the candidate that you do see out on the campaign trail today?
CUBAN: Yes, I mean, the weave is on his head and in his mouth, and it's not working. He just he's slowed down. There's no question about it.
Having known him for 25 years, early on, in the early 2000s, you can have a legitimate conversation with him. It's just now, it's talking point, talking point, talking point. And I just don't see -- you can see he's declined. It's just reality, Father Time is undefeated. You can't be 78-years-old and not expect some decline.
COLLINS: Do you think voters see it that way?
CUBAN: No.
COLLINS: I mean, obviously it was a major issue for Biden.
CUBAN: Yes.
COLLINS: He's not in this race anymore because of it. They don't see Trump the same way?
CUBAN: No, not at all, because Trump never is intellectual about anything.
You don't ever think of Donald Trump and think, Wow, that was really an in-depth conversation he had with somebody. You don't think of Donald Trump and say, That was really nuanced in what he had to say about this position or his policy. You don't hear him talk in-depth about policies at all.
And so, you can get by with just sound bites. You can get by with being loud and boisterous and salesy. And to some people, that comes across as being the right thing to do.
COLLINS: I mean, it comes across like that to a lot of people.
We're looking at how close this race is. And we, at the town hall with Harris, this week, we heard from voters saying, I want specifics from her. I want to know what my taxes are going to look like when I'm filing them in April, if she's in the Oval Office.
And just when you compare that, as it's now become this thing, people are focusing on the double standard that both of them face.
CUBAN: Right.
COLLINS: Trump's plan is tariffs, which, you know?
CUBAN: Right, don't work.
COLLINS: He likens to -- or Harris likens to it, a Trump sales tax.
CUBAN: Right.
COLLINS: And Drill, baby, drill--
CUBAN: Right.
COLLINS: --is what he told me at the town hall.
CUBAN: Which isn't going to work.
COLLINS: Well, also the U.S. is producing more oil right now than we ever have.
CUBAN: We ever have.
COLLINS: Ever.
CUBAN: Well neither side, really.
COLLINS: Which we don't really talk about.
CUBAN: That's just the nature of the candidacy. Neither side gets into details.
Because Kamala Harris came into this race 13 weeks ago with -- and a deficit in awareness. Even Donald Trump said, Who is Kamala Harris, nobody knows who she is. So, she spent the last 13 weeks letting people get to know her. It's tough to do that and to get into detail on policy.
Donald Trump has been doing this for nine years, and he still hasn't gotten into depth in policy, so.
COLLINS: But why do you think he's not punished for not having policy, but she is?
CUBAN: Well, it's like anything else. If you never do something--
COLLINS: Not having details, I should say.
CUBAN: Yes, it's like anything else. If you never do something, you're not expected to do it. If you hear policy, and you hear analysis, and you have somebody who's pragmatic and open-minded, like Kamala Harris, then you expect more, and you expect different things.
We all have friends, who aren't going to talk in-depth about anything. Donald Trump is one of those people.
COLLINS: But listen to this one voter. Because this isn't just a media conversation that we're having or within the campaign. This voter, Pam Thistle, the other night, I was so struck by her, listening to her. She's a widow. And she was talking about putting her kids through school, paying her bills.
This is what she said about how she's making this decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) PAM THISTLE, UNDECIDED PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: Stop trashing each other. We don't care.
Stop trashing Trump.
Trump, stop trashing the Vice President.
We don't care. The voters don't care. We don't even know the people they're talking about, that this person said this and that. How does that impact the voters? That's who you're talking to, that's who you're serving. This feels like high school gossip. We don't care. We don't want to hear it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CUBAN: Yes, she's not wrong. People just want to live their lives. They want to get through their lives. They're so stressed by all this, they don't -- they don't get it -- they're not saying to themselves, OK, let me take an in-depth look at different policies. Just communicate to me in a way that lets me know that I can do something with confidence. It's about trust.
And I think Kamala Harris that -- in those 13 weeks just to be tied, all things considered, she's been building trust. Again, it makes it hard to go out there and talk in detail, about taxes and business, which is why she has surrogates like me. I can go into the weeds, and talk about any of these subjects.
COLLINS: Are you worried she hasn't had enough time?
CUBAN: Yes. I mean--
COLLINS: You think that could hurt her, in the 11 days?
CUBAN: Well, it's -- I mean, if she had 26 weeks or 52 weeks, it would be completely different. People would know her better. She would have had more time to talk about details. But she doesn't.
And like a good CEO, like a good leader, she's put together a team, including myself and others, to go out and communicate things she doesn't have time to communicate. And I think I've been effective. I know others have as well. And I think that's going to make a big difference. And it's under-appreciated.
COLLINS: When you look at the Trump campaign, right now, he is selling tennis shoes, crypto, Bibles, watches, coins, Christmas ornaments, NFTs, pieces of his suit from when he was nearly assassinated. Truth Social stocks.
CUBAN: Really? I didn't see that one.
COLLINS: Yes. Shreds of his suit, his--
CUBAN: Don't forget cologne.
COLLINS: His cologne. If he was on an episode of "Shark Tank," would you invest in any of those?
CUBAN: No, because he's desperate. You only sell those things because you have to, because you need the money.
[21:20:00]
And it's obvious, look, people think he's this great businessman. If the job of presidency was investing in real estate, picking curtains and fixtures, he'd probably be the most qualified. But it's not.
He's not a business-person. He's failed early and often. And the worst part about his business career is how many times he rips off hard- working Americans. Trump University, Trump SoHo, Trump Foundation. When he was tested -- when Michael Cohen was testifying, in the New York trials, Michael Cohen took pride in the fact that he underpaid vendors.
Just a couple -- just last week, when he was in Detroit or in Michigan somewhere, and the audio went out, he started trashing the engineer, and saying, You shouldn't pay him, and you might sue them.
COLLINS: Yes, you were really bothered by that.
CUBAN: Yes. I mean, we've all been in that situation, right? And you should show some empathy, because whoever's running that audio is freaking out, right there and then. He showed no empathy at all. He doesn't care for hard-working Americans.
Tariffs, the same thing. That's, you know, we talk about it being a tax, but we need to get into the details of it. Think about what you're going to buy for next Christmas, if he wins.
You're looking at your Christmas presents. 60 percent or more of the things you buy were made in China. Now, all of a sudden they cost 60 percent more. When they cost 60 percent more, you have to make decisions, What am I not going to get my kids? What am I not going to get my family? What am I not going to get my friends?
And on top of that, you had the comp -- the retailers that you buy them from? They're not getting that business either. Their sales fall as well, particularly in the fourth quarter, which is everything.
So now, all of a sudden, you're not having the Christmas you want. The retailers are going out of business or struggling, and there's 50 other reasons why, across the board, tariffs don't work.
COLLINS: So why do voters trust him more on the economy?
CUBAN: Well, that's changing over time. Again, she just hasn't had enough time. I've been doing this for just a couple weeks. And that's what I do. I go out and I talk to small businesses. I'll be in Pittsburgh, tomorrow.
And one of the things I talk about now that's a new topic, that's impacting them, is deportation. Now you know--
COLLINS: Because if he carries out mass deportations, it's going to hurt the business community, potentially.
CUBAN: It's going to kill somebody (ph). Imagine, like there's a thing called an I-9, we all have to fill it out, which talks about your immigration status, and work status and everything.
Walking into a restaurant, and going up to the manager and say, I want a list of all your non-citizen employees, and all their I-9 statuses, all their Social Security numbers, all their address and phone numbers, so I can go to their house and knock on their door, see if there's anybody there that's illegal, undocumented, and drag them out?
Or maybe he'll just do it more easily. He'll just have checkpoints on the street, where they know -- where he knows there's communities where there may be undocumented immigrants.
That's not the United States of America. That's not who we are. And that's just wrong. And it's going to impact communities. It's going to impact business, big, small, medium-small and large. People just don't realize the negative impact.
He is not a business-person. He is an investor. He's had some great success on some things, other failures. But he is not a good business- person. There's no situation that you can present that says he is.
COLLINS: Mark Cuban, will you stick around?
CUBAN: Yes, for sure.
COLLINS: Because we want to have more of a conversation. I also want to ask you about Elon Musk.
CUBAN: Uh-huh.
COLLINS: Since it's Battle of the Billionaires that's playing out on the campaign trail.
And as I noted, Vice President Harris is about to get on stage with Beyonce. We're going to bring you that campaign moment here live.
We're also tracking the major news out of the Middle East, as Israel is responding to Iran's attack on Israel with retaliatory strikes, right now. We'll have the very latest from the Middle East.
[21:25:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Any moment, we expect to see Vice President Harris come out on that stage, on your left, where Colin Allred is speaking right now. Beyonce also expected to appear there.
Meanwhile, Donald Trump is on his way to Michigan. He is very late. We are hearing from reporters, who were at that rally that a lot of people are leaving, given just how tardy the former President is.
All of this comes, as we are a 11 days away from the election, and the final CNN national poll of this race shows that it is a dead heat. 47 percent of people supporting Harris. And 47 percent supporting Donald Trump.
If anyone tells you they know for sure what's going to happen? Block their number, until November 6th. They have no idea what they're talking about.
Two people who do know what they're talking about. Mark Cuban is back with me. As well as a former senior adviser to Mitch McConnell, Scott Jennings.
I want to ask you each a question. Mark, I'll start with you.
If Donald Trump wins this race, what do you think is the one thing that worked in his favor, for why he won?
CUBAN: He's a relentless salesperson that doesn't care about the facts. He's that sales guy on the car lot that will tell you that the 1992 Corolla is a Rolls-Royce. And if you say it enough time, people will start to believe it.
COLLINS: Scott. I know you don't like to say a lot of nice things about Harris. But if she wins, what do you think is the one reason that you would attribute that to, if you had to guess, right now?
SCOTT JENNINGS, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER TO MITCH MCCONNELL: Well, if I had a guess, it would probably be mobilization of women voters around the issue of abortion. I mean, if you look at all the polling, it's the one issue that works for her. She's got a wide lead on it.
COLLINS: That's what she's talking about tonight, in Texas.
JENNINGS: That's what she's talking about tonight. It seemed to mobilize Democrats in the midterms, although it's a different electorate this time. But if that is the result, it will likely be attributable to that.
COLLINS: I mean, when you look at this race, and you're watching this as a huge surrogate for hers. You've been out there. And what's interesting about you is you kind of take the arguments against Harris, some of the ones we've heard from Scott, on the economy and whatnot.
She has cut Trump's lead on the economy by a significant amount from where it was, when it was Biden and Trump in this race. Is it enough though, I think, is going to be the major question, when you look at how voters are seeing this.
CUBAN: Well, she just has to reduce it on the margins. She's better for business. There's 33 million companies in this country. 99 percent of them are small business. 99 percent of those are passthrough. And 99 percent of the CEOs and entrepreneurs that run them make $400,000 or less. So effectively, for every country in this -- every company in this country, your taxes are going to be the same or lower. You just -- we just have to get that word out. And I think that's why she's closing the delta.
JENNINGS: Yes, I disagree. I think the reason Trump is winning and will win, ultimately, on the issue of the economy, is the comparative. I mean, look at the polling. His job approval retrospectively is far higher than the Biden-Harris job approval today.
There's one reason for that. Because people feel economic anxiety today that they did not feel under Donald Trump. They didn't feel the inflation under Trump. And they don't really believe that Biden and Harris either have a handle on it at best, or they've made it worse. And I think it's a change election.
[21:30:00]
And honestly, Trump's best argument on the economy is, You can't leave the same people in charge, if you're feeling economic anxiety, you got to go back to what you know works.
And honestly, he's more popular now than he's ever been. His administration is more popular than it's ever been. Look where he came from when he left office to right now. There's one reason why he's more popular today than he's ever been. Because people are comparing it to what they've got now, and they're saying--
CUBAN: And yet it's a dead heat.
JENNINGS: --I want to go back.
CUBAN: And yet it's a dead heat against somebody who's only been in the race 13 weeks.
JENNINGS: Well, you act as though she just landed here, on a spacecraft, 13 weeks ago. She's been the Vice President for an entire term.
CUBAN: But there's a difference between--
JENNINGS: She was in the United States Senate. She did not show up here, 13 weeks ago. She has a record as Vice President.
And I think what's hurting your campaign is that she also has a record, when she ran for president, and she said a lot of things that have come back to haunt her.
CUBAN: Yes, but that's a different world. I mean, I can go back 10 years, when Donald Trump said he wanted to tax oil companies out of existence. You can talk about Section 230. You can talk about Bitcoin. You can talk about abortion. There's a long list of things that Donald Trump has flip-flopped on.
JENNINGS: But he was the President, and he has a record. And she was the Vice President, and she has a record. CUBAN: Yes, but what kind of record?
JENNINGS: And people are comparing them.
CUBAN: But you know that whole comparison isn't legit, because the Vice President doesn't do anything. What did Mike Pence do?
JENNINGS: Well, I'd disagree. I actually think she has been the most consequential vice president, when you consider the responsibilities that she was given, when you consider that Donald -- that Joe Biden has said, she was there every step of the way.
CUBAN: Yes, but that position -- that position--
(CROSSTALK)
JENNINGS: And finally -- and finally -- and finally--
CUBAN: --and you know it.
JENNINGS: --she cast more tie-breaking votes than any other Vice President. She cast the votes--
CUBAN: Well that's because of the Senate -- because of the nature of the Senate. Had nothing to do with her being special. That's just the job.
JENNINGS: She cast the most consequential economic votes of any Vice President in our history. You know--
CUBAN: But what we have to talk about is what her plan is for now, right?
JENNINGS: Right.
CUBAN: Look at health care.
JENNINGS: Great question.
CUBAN: Her plan for health care. She's talked about going after the final pharmacy middlemen, in particular, the PBMs, who set the prices for medications. She's talked about adding transparency. That alone, I know from my experiences, will cut the cost of medications, and then eventually health care, for every household by 20 to 30 percent.
JENNINGS: I agree with you on--
CUBAN: That's a -- that's--
JENNINGS: I agree with you on PBMs, by the way, one.
Two, I will say, when she had her town hall, this week, she got asked a simple question by a voter. What's the first bill you would pass? And had absolutely no answer for it. It wasn't an economic bill. It wasn't immigration. It wasn't health care.
CUBAN: Well--
JENNINGS: It was, I don't really know.
CUBAN: But let's go back to what--
JENNINGS: What kind of confidence does that give you that she's ready to lead?
CUBAN: Yes, because she puts together a team. She's a team leader, as opposed to Donald Trump.
JENNINGS: We don't vote for team. We vote for presidents.
CUBAN: Yes, we do vote for teams.
JENNINGS: We vote for presidents.
CUBAN: No, we vote for -- if you're smart--
JENNINGS: Who's on the ballot?
CUBAN: Who's on the ballot obviously leads the way. But who's on your team makes a big difference.
On one hand, you have Donald Trump, where 40 out of 44 of his staff just turned against them. I've never seen that happen to anybody in any circumstances, ever. I've never seen a company like that ever.
COLLINS: Not just turned against him. Called him a fascist, I mean.
CUBAN: Yes, I mean, his Cabinet just went, You don't belong in government at all that. What does that say?
Whereas with Kamala Harris, you don't see that. In fact, you see her putting together a good team.
JENNINGS: Well--
CUBAN: One time with her office, yes, she had a bad experience.
JENNINGS: I disagree. She had a 92 percent turnover rate.
CUBAN: Yes, one time--
(CROSSTALK)
JENNINGS: She's had a rough ride with staff.
CUBAN: Yes, but you haven't seen that in the last four years. You have--
JENNINGS: But you've seen it her entire career. It happened when she was Attorney General. It's happened when she's Vice President. I think she actually has a pretty rough track record of leadership when you consider--
CUBAN: So--
JENNINGS: --the people who've washed through there.
CUBAN: So, 90-plus--
JENNINGS: Now, expand that out to the entire federal government.
CUBAN: Yes, 90 percent of people in her cabinet, you think will turn on her?
JENNINGS: I'm saying that she has not had a good record of staff management in small groups.
CUBAN: I'm saying what she's doing right--
JENNINGS: Now she's managing the whole federal government?
CUBAN: Small groups are harder. As someone who's managed, small groups are harder because it's more personal.
COLLINS: But if the argument is, Turnover is bad? I mean, Donald Trump is the king of turnover.
CUBAN: And on top of--
COLLINS: So that is a bad bar--
CUBAN: And on top of that, he's using loyalty--
COLLINS: --for comparison, really.
CUBAN: --as a mechanism to determine who he's going to hire. That's Tony Soprano.
JENNINGS: Every president -- every president, uses loyalty to their agenda to decide.
CUBAN: No, you work hard--
JENNINGS: I worked for George W. Bush. You had to be loyal to the President's agenda. I'm sure Joe Biden did the same thing. They're politically elected.
CUBAN: Yes but--
JENNINGS: It's their prerogative to have loyal people.
CUBAN: It's their prerogative. But that doesn't make it the best people to solve the problems. She's already said--
JENNINGS: You think she's going to hire people who'd disagree with her?
CUBAN: I think she -- yes, I've seen it. I've seen it. She hasn't disagreed with everything I've said to her, by a long shot. But she listens. She's open-minded. She's not dogmatic. That's critical. Being dogmatic is the difference between being good as a president.
JENNINGS: I think -- I think -- I think she has displayed, this week, and throughout October, in her interviews, an extreme amount of indecisiveness. And in Kentucky, they say the only thing in the middle of the road is yellow lines and dead squirrels. I'm afraid she's going to find herself one or the other--
COLLINS: Speaking--
JENNINGS: --come Election Day.
COLLINS: Speaking of what staffing would look like, if she does win, would you take a job? And what job would you want?
CUBAN: No. No, I don't want -- I don't want a job. Costplusdrugs.com is changing health care. I can do more on the outside than the inside. I can still be an adviser.
JENNINGS: How are you going to feed yourself, if you don't take one of these jobs?
CUBAN: Yes, I'll find a way, Scott. I'll find a way.
COLLINS: Scott, if Donald Trump wins, would you take a job in his administration?
JENNINGS: I have a terrific job here at CNN.
CUBAN: Right, won't be sad (ph).
JENNINGS: It is my -- it is my -- it is my sincerest desire to continue to be here with you on, Friday nights.
COLLINS: So, everyone's keeping their jobs.
CUBAN: You only--
(CROSSTALK)
COLLINS: Scott Jennings.
JENNINGS: Well I don't -- I don't know that. He's more secure. That I'm the poorest guy at the table. I don't know what's going to happen to me.
COLLINS: Yes, there's only one billionaire among us.
Mark Cuban, great to have you. Thank you for being here--
CUBAN: Thanks for having, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: --as always. Have fun in Pittsburgh, tomorrow.
[21:35:00]
Up next, as I noted, Vice President Harris is about to be on stage, with Beyonce, momentarily, in Houston. Donald Trump is on his way to a rally in Michigan. We're going to be monitoring both of those events.
Also, we are keeping a close eye on the Middle East. Israel is striking Iran, right now. More details to come on just how far they've gone, and if they heeded President Biden's advice.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Breaking news, as Israel is now launching a second wave of retaliatory strikes against Iran tonight.
I want to bring in CNN's Alex Marquardt, who is in Washington.
Alex, we were just talking about how, you know, we're -- been monitoring this first wave of strikes from Israel carried out inside Iran tonight. Now a second wave has been carried out. What more are you learning?
[21:40:00]
MARQUARDT: Yes, Kaitlan, we are now well into the third hour of this Israeli retaliation against Iran. As you can see there, it's just past 05:00 a.m. in Tehran. The sun will come up soon.
So, we are being told, my colleague, Kayla Tausche, and I, by an official who is familiar with this Israeli operation, that a second wave is underway. And I think that was to be expected.
The first wave, from what we heard from Iranian reports, targeted primarily the west of Tehran. We're trying to figure out now where the second wave of strikes may be targeting.
And I think throughout the course of the evening, we could expect to see more. In fact, Kaitlan, as you and I were talking about earlier, we could not only see more tonight, but we could see more in the coming days. And this could be a multi-level attack, not just air strikes, which we appear to be seeing now. But you could also see cyber strikes, among other kinds of attacks, from the Israelis.
Now, the U.S. has been coordinating closely. There is no U.S. role, we should emphasize, in this operation tonight. But the U.S., we are told by American officials, has been well-aware of what Israel is planning. And both American officials and Israeli officials making clear tonight that the targets are military targets.
We are told that President Biden has been briefed on this Israeli operation. He is in Wilmington, Delaware.
And perhaps indicating the level of concern, or at least comfort with what they know about the Israeli plan, we are told that there are no plans to convene a meeting in the White House Situation Room.
Kaitlan.
COLLINS: OK. Well keep us updated on what White House officials, as they're kind of just watching this like we are. It is a big question of how much of a heads-up they had on all this. Alex Marquardt, in Washington, we'll continue to check in with you.
We're also following a lot on politics on this very busy news night, right now. Any moment, Vice President Harris will come out on stage, there in Houston. She's going to be joined, for the first time on the campaign trail, by Beyonce, tonight.
Meanwhile, on the right side of your screen, Donald Trump is over three hours late, right now, for his rally, in battleground Michigan, a very important state when it comes to holding on to the blue wall.
We have new video from our reporters on the ground that shows some people in the restless crowd are beginning to head for the exits, despite a video message from Donald Trump, asking them to stay up late for him.
My political sources are here with me at the table tonight.
I mean, obviously things happen, Scott. But you never want to leave a crowd waiting, especially in a state that Trump lost in 2020, won by 10,000 votes in 2016. These are probably Trump supporters, who are there, I think it's safe to say. But you know?
JENNINGS: Yes, it--
COLLINS: What does it say?
JENNINGS: It's not ideal. Having been in a number of presidential campaigns, candidates are often late. You do have delays. Things do happen. I find it hard to believe that someone would switch their vote from Trump to Harris, because a candidate was late for a rally. But it's not ideal.
And, I guess, ultimately, when you're running campaigns, as you know, Mayor and Maria, you got to make scheduling decisions. And they made a decision today, to do this Joe Rogan podcast, and it's going to drop, and it's going to reach millions of people. So that's, you know, heavy is the -- is the head of the campaign manager that has to make these calls.
COLLINS: Yes, that's a three-hour podcast, apparently, according to Trump's aides.
JENNINGS: Yes.
COLLINS: Obviously, the Joe Rogan interviews are quite lengthy. So, we'll be watching to see what happened in those three hours.
JENNINGS: Yes.
COLLINS: But Harris is in Texas tonight. If you're at home and you're wondering, Why is she in Texas? We have a 11 days to go. When Democrats are not going to win Texas for the presidential race.
MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Yes. COLLINS: But they're trying to draw attention to reproductive rights. She is hoping that that is going to be, as Scott was saying earlier, may be decisive in this election.
CARDONA: That's exactly right.
And let's remember that Texas is kind of ground zero for the huge, really repressive Trump abortion bans. It was the state that really focused on the fact that those kinds of abortion bans put women's lives in danger. They're going to tell the stories of women, who went through this, who almost died, some of those women can't have children anymore. So, they are going to really focus and do a deep dive on this narrative. I do believe it will be decisive.
And it's one of those issues, Kaitlan, that when we talk about how the issues in this election are going to be, the economy, immigration, crime, which is what the Republicans love to talk about.
But reproductive rights is one of those issues that for women, and not just women, for families, you go into a ballot box, and I've heard a lot of women say, You know what, Maria? I don't care what the price of eggs is. The economy is coming back.
And in fact, I heard you guys talking earlier, Kamala Harris has really closed the gap on the economy, and in a lot of polls, in the majority of polls these days.
These women are really concerned about what's going on with their reproductive freedom. They don't want to live in a country, where they're going to have to raise their daughter--
COLLINS: Yes.
CARDONA: --with less rights than they did.
COLLINS: Well, and on this, some people say, Well, why are celebrities there? Why is this included? But having Beyonce there obviously helps get eyeballs. Talking about the millions of voters that Joe Rogan's podcast could reach.
BILL DE BLASIO, (D) FORMER NEW YORK CITY MAYOR: Sure.
COLLINS: Having Beyonce there could help draw a lot of attention to what she's hoping will be more decisive.
[21:45:00]
DE BLASIO: Yes, and I think we should recognize there is just one truly dominant issue, in this election. And it is reproductive rights.
I obviously understand how much people are hurting, economically. I understand the emotions and the realities around immigration.
But I can tell you this from going door to door, in Michigan, quite a bit, in the last few weeks, Central Michigan, Northern Michigan. Women are talking about the fact that their right was taken away. That's never happened in American history. That's literally -- I mean, we fought to expand rights. Only once has a right been taken away, in broad daylight, and it affects over half the population.
And I'm telling you, a lot of moderate Republican women, a lot of independent women, are going to break for Kamala Harris, for themselves, for their daughters, for their granddaughters. There is no other issue that compares, in terms of how personal, visceral--
CARDONA: Right.
DE BLASIO: --human-intense it is. And this is why I think Kamala Harris wins this election.
JENNINGS: I just have to respectfully rebut that.
I think that to minimize people's economic concerns, to minimize the concerns of people over illegal immigration, particularly people and families, who have perhaps suffered a violent attack from an illegal immigrant, to minimize the concerns about the anxiety that people feel in their day-to-day lives that they did not feel under the previous administration, which was headed by Donald Trump, is a huge mistake by Democrats.
DE BLASIO: Just real quick, Scott.
JENNINGS: I would not -- I think you minimize those things that you're -- I know why you do it, because it's the only issue you have.
DE BLASIO: No, no, but--
CARDONA: Yes, but we're not doing that.
DE BLASIO: No. No.
JENNINGS: But you both--
DE BLASIO: Simply put--
CARDONA: No.
JENNINGS: --minimize that, I think it's wrong.
CARDONA: No.
DE BLASIO: I think it's -- they're extremely important issues. I think they're deeply felt by the American people. I think they pale in comparison--
CARDONA: Right.
DE BLASIO: --to a right being taken away from over half the people of this country.
CARDONA: Exactly.
COLLINS: I want to finish this conversation. Everyone stick around. We've got to squeeze in a quick commercial break. As we are keeping an eye on the stage in Houston, where Beyonce is set to appear shortly.
[21:50:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: We're still waiting for Vice President Harris. She is about to come out on stage, in Houston, tonight, alongside a name you might recognize, Beyonce.
On the right side of the screen, that crowd is in Traverse City, Michigan, waiting on a delayed Donald Trump. I should note, our reporters who were there, say that there are some of the crowd, you can clearly still see some of them are there, some of the crowd is leaving as it is getting late into the night.
I should note this is all coming as an alarming story came out today, as U.S. intelligence agencies revealed Russian operatives are making fake videos, apparently showing someone tearing up mail-in ballots, in Pennsylvania, before posting and amplifying that video online.
Now, of course, the story is coming, as there is a huge concern from U.S. officials about increasing threats and interference in the election, not just from Russia, but from Iran and China as well, with this election just a 11 days away.
My political panel is here with us. But also, CNN Chief Law Enforcement and Intelligence Analyst, John Miller.
When I saw this headline, John, and the statement from the FBI confirming that basically they're making these videos, which is what we saw in 2020, when there were all these reports, Bill Barr likened it to Whac-a-Mole, about fake ballots, stolen ballots, mail-in ballots showing up in a sewage drain.
What are we learning about this tonight?
JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT & INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, the FBI, the Director of National Intelligence, where I once served, the CISA people, all believe that this is created and amplified by the Russians. And what they're not saying is the people probably behind it.
And you brought up tangentially, the IRA or the Internet Research office that worked, in the first Trump campaign, to promote disinformation, and you--
COLLINS: In 2016, in that election.
MILLER: That's right. And you remember, the Mueller report said that they were working in that campaign, trying to sway votes. But there was no collusion between -- that they could identify, between the Trump team and the Russians.
That was run by Yevgeny Prigozhin, who fell out in the Ukraine war with Putin, and died in a mysterious plane crash. And then emerged Storm-1516, which is the group that has been pretty prolific at putting out disinformation, usually starts with a whistleblower story, and putting that on fake news sites, hoping that it will bleed over into real news sites and the rumor mill.
All of this is meant to stoke doubt about American democracy, about the election process. And that's why authorities have been so immediate to try and get ahead of these, once they're identified.
COLLINS: I mean, Mayor, as an official, how do you deal with this? Because people see that and think this is real, when it's actually a Russian -- a fake Russian operative doing this.
DE BLASIO: Yes, I think it's important to confront it immediately. I mean, this is rapid response of the highest order to protect democracy. People need to be told, Look, you're being shown things that just are not happening, and here's the evidence of why it's not happening. But if you let it sit out there and don't answer it? Watch out.
COLLINS: Yes.
JENNINGS: I think this foreign interference issue is a real thing, especially when you consider what Iran is doing. They have active threats against Trump. China hacking the Trump campaign, apparently, we learned today.
COLLINS: And going after the Harris campaign.
JENNINGS: Lots -- lots of our adversaries would love to scramble us against ourselves. We should not allow them.
MILLER: And, I mean, just to close this out, one thing they're saying is we can expect to see this running up to Election Day, and they predict, in the intelligence community, keep going after it.
COLLINS: Well, and that's what's scary, if it's a disputed election--
MILLER: Exactly.
COLLINS: --and it's close, and we're seeing disinformation?
CARDONA: And especially, Trump supporters, who believe that there was -- that the election was stolen? This is going to light the fire.
COLLINS: Yes, obviously sounding the alarm on that.
Everyone stay with us.
The Harris rally with Beyonce is set to begin, any minute now. As we're also hearing Donald Trump is closing in, on Michigan, about to take the stage there, after a bit of a delay. We're monitoring both of these events, in a late-night campaign trail moment, for you, here on CNN.
[21:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: In moments, Donald Trump is set to arrive in Michigan.
But right now, you are looking at Houston. You can see that massive crowd there, waiting for Vice President Harris, as she is set to take the stage.
A bit of an important guest we are expecting to come out, truly any moment now. Beyonce is going to be introducing the Vice President, who often walks out to her song, "Freedom," when she's out on the trail.
My political sources are back here with me.
Favorite Beyonce song?
CARDONA: I think she should sing All the Single Ladies, to talk about underscore the childless cat ladies.
COLLINS: All the single childless cat ladies?
CARDONA: All the single ladies. Exactly. To talk about in honor of them.
DE BLASIO: I think--
COLLINS: Scott, what's your favorite Beyonce song?
JENNINGS: My favorite? Oh, I don't know. If I were her, I would sing, "Run the World." I mean, they're running for President. I know it's back in the catalog a little bit.
COLLINS: What about "Bills"?
DE BLASIO: I would go with "Freedom" for a very simple reason. Now, the Democratic Party talks about freedom, and Republicans can't.
CARDONA: And we represent it.
DE BLASIO: Because Republicans took away a woman's right to choose.
COLLINS: You know what else also, Kaitlan? You know the reason why they're there? Also because of Colin Allred.
COLLINS: Yes.
CARDONA: There is a possibility.
DE BLASIO: Right.
CARDONA: He is so close.
COLLINS: He is close with Ted Cruz.
CARDONA: There are -- there are--
JENNINGS: I love watching you guys get your hopes up.
CARDONA: They are -- they are tied.
COLLINS: Don't say, you guys.
CARDONA: And Ted Cruz is one of the least-liked people on earth.
JENNINGS: Keep hope alive.
[22:00:00]
COLLINS: All right. Speaking of keeping hope alive, we will be watching this rally very closely. Stay tuned, if you're a Beyonce fan. If not -- she's about to come out on stage.
Thank you all so much for joining us, this busy hour.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" starts right now.
