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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Winds Strengthen In L.A.; GOP Rep. Nunn Backs Johnson's Proposal To Condition Wildfire Aid; Senate Dems: FBI May Not Have Interviewed Pete Hegseth's Accuser Or Ex-Wives Ahead Of Hearing. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired January 13, 2025 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
CAPT. SHEILA KELLIHER, LOS ANGELES COUNTY FIRE DEPARTMENT: --I honor them with this hat, because they are relentless, and they haven't stopped.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: Well, I watched it, Thursday and Friday, up around Topanga. Just unbelievable.
KELLIHER: Yes.
COOPER: The air assets just coming in one after the other after the other.
KELLIHER: They're the best at what they do. And it's amazing to watch. But boy, that sure has helped us. And then, like the--
COOPER: But if the winds pick up big, tomorrow, that's, I mean, that's going to be a real--
KELLIHER: That's a concern.
COOPER: --that's a real problem.
KELLIHER: And so, they do that by looking at the ridge that they're on, and they've really taken care of that. But they look a couple of ridges ahead, and they start pre-painting those with the fire retardant.
COOPER: Yes.
KELLIHER: So they're, in case those assets can't get up for a while, they've kind of preset themselves up.
COOPER: Yes. Captain Sheila Kelliher, as always, thank you so much.
KELLIHER: Oh, it's a pleasure to be here.
COOPER: Appreciate it.
KELLIHER: Thank you for having us.
COOPER: If you want to know how you can help, you can check out CNN.com/impact, for a number of information on organizations that are doing good work, here in the Los Angeles area. That's CNN.com/impact.
That's it for us. Kaitlan Collins and "THE SOURCE" starts now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Breaking news from THE SOURCE tonight.
The National Weather Service issuing the most extreme fire warning that it can. Hurricane-force winds, powerful enough to trigger explosive fire growth, as Los Angeles is bracing for the next 32 hours ahead.
And a new fight is erupting, late this evening, here in Washington, just hours before Donald Trump's Pentagon pick is going under oath before Congress. Democrats are up in arms over what's in, or, should I say, not in. Pete Hegseth's FBI file.
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
As we come on the air tonight, fire-ravaged Southern California is getting another dire warning from officials tonight, with the National Weather Service, calling it a, quote, Particularly Dangerous Situation. That's a warning level that is rarely used. It starts overnight tonight. It goes until Wednesday evening.
And what that means is hurricane-force winds, in combination with dry conditions and no rain in sight, which forecasters are warning, that combination has the potential to trigger explosive wildfire growth. We are talking winds that could exceed 70 miles per hour.
That makes authorities concerned that new fires could start, while they are still battling the old ones, stretching already-strained manpower, not just on the ground, but also in the air, across Los Angeles and Ventura Counties. It is a tinderbox, and it is bracing for a couple of white-knuckle days ahead for many people on the ground there.
CNN's Erin Burnett, is on the ground in hard-hit Malibu.
And Erin, obviously, as you've been reporting there, these most dangerous winds, that officials are watching for, are expected to start hitting within hours. Do officials feel that the fire crews that they are ready to go for this?
ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: They do. But they know everything is at stake, Kaitlan.
And we are starting to feel those winds pick up here. Even just over the past couple of hours, we're starting to really notice it here in Malibu.
And you talk about that Particularly Dangerous Situation, what they call the PDS. That's only happened three times this fire season. And in those three times, you got the Eaton fire, you got the Palisades fire. So, those days have led to the massive fires that they're battling right now. And as we're feeling the winds pick up here, you've got -- we are within the Palisades fire zone where we are, in Malibu. They are trying to protect areas that haven't burned. Where we are, you can see behind me, complete devastation.
But there is other parts of Malibu here that have not burned down. And they're worried about the wind fanning the flames. Obviously, that's the biggest concern with fires that have not been contained. This Palisades fire, right now, is only as of right now, Kaitlan, about 14 percent contained. And a lot of that is because of what's behind the house behind me, which is the Pacific Ocean.
So, they're worried about the wind, and then they're also worried about the wind bringing those embers to far-flung places, some of the most populated areas--
COLLINS: Yes.
BURNETT: --in Los Angeles. So, that's the real concern.
They've had a bit of a reprieve, right? They've used that to fly more aircraft. They've done as much as they can. But now it's really going to be a matter of seeing what these winds do.
COLLINS: Yes, and of course, that's the authorities what they're worried about, people whose homes have not burned down. We're still just hearing so much, though, from people who have lost their entire livelihoods, as a result of the fires that are already -- that already exist.
What have you been hearing, from people as they're just processing all of that?
BURNETT: I mean, it is incredible, Kaitlan, because you've got this, this ongoing crisis, right? This marathon that is a sprint every day. And that is what's happening next, and battling these fires, even as people are already feeling and suffering from complete devastation.
Today, I was in Altadena, and seeing people who, you know, their livelihoods are completely gone. I mean, you've got people displaced, staying in hotels. Some of them do have jobs. They can go to them. Others, though, are losing their jobs because the small businesses that are at the heart of a community now don't have customers, so that means they can't make payroll.
[21:05:00]
And I was talking to one woman who has had a bakery for 17 years. She said during COVID, there was a year she had to not send her kids to college. She had to pull them out because she couldn't afford it, because of what was happening. But now, this is worse. And this is the first time in 17 years she said, she woke up and realized she couldn't make payroll, because she didn't have any enough customers.
Here's what she said just a little bit ago when we met her at her bakery. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRISTINE MOORE, LITTLE FLOWER BAKERY OWNER, HOUSE IS ONE OF FEW STILL STANDING IN NEIGHBORHOOD: We're not making payroll, today, the first time in 17 years. And I've spoken to a lot of friends that are also struggling with the fact that we've lost our beautiful town. Our customers are suffering. And now, our businesses are suffering.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: I mean, it's suffering, Kaitlan. It's just such a profound sense of grief. As one person said, Just this weight, and the weight just does not go away. And that is even as they are starting to feel these winds.
And really, everybody here is on sort of, I would say, pins and needles, a bit of a precipice, waiting for these winds. We do anticipate they'll pick up with some of those hurricane-force gusts that you were talking about, up 70 miles an hour at times, over these hours of the night, and then it's just going to be touch and go for the next couple of days.
President Biden, as I know you know, has been briefed on the status of the winds.
But right now, it is the second largest city in America, at the mercy, complete mercy, of Mother Nature.
COLLINS: Yes. And I know there's been so many questions still about, not just how these next fires could start. Obviously, we've seen the conditions here. But there are active investigations, underway, into the past fires, different ones into different fires that started last week.
What is the latest that our officials are saying about how those are developing, and how quickly they could see answers here?
BURNETT: Yes. So, they're worried about, obviously, new fires starting. And they're also looking at what caused the fires.
The ATF, Kaitlan, is here on the ground now, from Washington. And they're looking into this Palisades fire. Whether it was started by accident, whether it was arson, there are real questions about that. They don't yet have answers. They don't have answers with the Eaton fire either, at this point. They do believe that they say that they're going to actually get answers, just as to what caused it.
But I will also say, in an area, like where we are now, there's also real concern. And we've been seeing this. There have been all these lines that we've been showing you, Kaitlan, people who line up for 12 hours, to try to get up to see their homes. And that stopped today. That stopped. They said they weren't even able to bring people into their homes. So still, most people haven't been able to see if their homes have been destroyed, even in the fire-hit areas. And they're also dealing with -- they have had looting. And some of the National Guard, we've seen a lot more presence of National Guard on the ground. And they've been telling us that people are trying to get into these areas, they're posing, whether they're posing as reporters, like us, or firefighters, to try to get into loot.
So, the situation is really on edge. And it is a -- it is a dicey moment, when you look at what law enforcement is dealing with. And as I said, you are seeing a (inaudible) by the National Guard.
COLLINS: Yes. I mean, it's obviously just the lowest of humanity, people who would go in there and loot at a time like this.
BURNETT: Yes.
COLLINS: But on the escorts that they were providing for people, to be able to go in, whether it's to see if anything's left of their homes, maybe they saw it on social media, but to see if anything's there, any mementos or anything, or even just for insurance purposes, what is the reasoning that they stopped that?
BURNETT: I think they just basically were saying that they were overstretched, and that the lines themselves were becoming a bit, they thought, of a concern and a problem, because people were parking, and you were essentially not able to get anywhere near any of these areas, because they would just line up for 12 hours. And I mean, sort of a sense of resignation and desperation, in those lines.
At one point, Kaitlan, when the yesterday in a line, someone came up to me and said, What's it like up there? And there was just sort of look of hope and sadness in their face. And I mean, you know, and it was bad, it was bad, where they were trying to go. But it is great frustration and a tragedy in this situation that people haven't been able to get up into their homes.
They're also, of course, worried now with the winds and their need to use resources, all resources on deck, over these next 24, 48 hours, as these winds come through, to try to control the perimeters of these situations as best as they can.
But you have, right now, more than 100,000 people still under mandatory evacuation orders.
COLLINS: Yes.
BURNETT: You've got a lot of hotels full. It is really an entire metro area that is not just on edge, but also completely disrupted. It is not operating the way that it would normally operate.
And it is also very incongruous, on a day like today, even here in Malibu, when you're in the Palisades fire zone, you look up, it's a beautiful day, you don't necessarily see the flames in the fire. That depends on which way the wind is blowing.
So, there is this palpable feeling of nervousness and fear, even though it almost looks like things should be normal. And I think that's one of the strangest things about it, at this time.
COLLINS: Yes, Erin, it's just it's remarkable to see this, and of course, thinking for all those people so much.
Erin Burnett, on the ground in Malibu, thank you for that.
Our source, also on the ground tonight, Captain Erik Scott. He is the Public Information Officer for the Los Angeles Fire Department.
[21:10:00]
And Captain, it's great to have you back. Obviously, you've been joining us in these touch-and-go situations. I know you all are very busy, as you're joining us on the phone tonight.
We've been talking about these red flag warnings that are now in place, through Wednesday evening. What is your biggest concern about that tonight?
CAPT. ERIK SCOTT, PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICER, LOS ANGELES FIRE DEPARTMENT, FIRE CAPTAIN II & PARAMEDIC (On Telephone): The wind is king, it always has been, and we saw it be so devastating last week, Tuesday and Wednesday. So we've been getting breaks, and then she comes back, and it's been very difficult.
So, the area of major concern for the Palisades burn perimeter remains the North East area and Mandeville Canyon. It's a lot of homes, very narrow hairpin turns that we had to proactively enact parking restrictions, to keep vehicles out of areas that turn to choke points, in case there's additional evacuations.
But right now, we got a lot of firefighters lined up there, and our air assets are continuing to do a wonderful job.
COLLINS: Yes, I mean, we are looking at live pictures right now in L.A. This is from KCAL AND KCBS. You're showing firefighters trying to contain a fire. I mean, you can see how close it is to a neighborhood on this map, as we're looking at this.
SCOTT (On Telephone): Yes.
COLLINS: The biggest concern we've heard is new fires starting as a result of this warning, this Particularly Dangerous Situation warning that is -- that is so rare. If they do, are you prepared for that?
SCOTT (On Telephone): Yes, we have battled these PDS incidents in the past, those Particularly Dangerous Situations. But they are significant. We take them very seriously.
So, we have a ton of resources here, over 5,000 firefighters that remain on scene.
And we have over 40 helicopters that are assigned. We have a very large contingency of fixed-wing, including C-130s from National Guard that's here, very large DC-10s. So, some of these will drop water on the target hazards, to protect property. Others will be more defensive, and drop retardant, to stop the flames at what we call the three yards, the roads, rivers and ridges.
So, they're doing a wonderful job. And we continue to expect night operations to continue.
COLLINS: Are you worried that the winds could get so bad, though, that those aerial flights have to stop again, which was, of course, the issue at the beginning--
SCOTT (On Telephone): Yes.
COLLINS: --of these fires?
SCOTT (On Telephone): Yes, that's more of a worst-case scenario. If that happens, it makes the -- so much more difficult to stop the flame front. So, I was talking to our chief pilots today. And some of the (inaudible) around 40 miles per hour, but at the ridges, it could be cut even in half.
It's really up to the discretion of the chief pilot. The main thing on their mind is safety, of course, safety for their members. If that aircraft goes down, now you have loss of life, and they can't do anything. Plus, if the wind is so significant, the water dropping out of the bottom is vaporized, the target's not hit. So we have to consider that.
But right now, again, we're really proud to say that boots are on the ground, and the birds are in the air.
COLLINS: Yes. I mean, it's just remarkable what we're looking at now, to see how close these firefighters are to this fire. This is in Riverside, California that we're watching right now, I mean. And obviously, dealing with a lot of the brush there and vegetation.
SCOTT (On Telephone): Yes.
COLLINS: I mean, one, this is just amazing to watch. I know we've expressed -- I mean, they have chainsaws in their hands, as they are cutting down these trees, as we're watching this.
SCOTT (On Telephone): Yes.
COLLINS: As we look at this? And I was just talking to Erin about the investigations underway into the origins of this. The ATF is actually taking the lead in figuring out what caused the Palisades fire.
From your experience, do you think it was caused by humans? Or what is your -- do you have any hunch -- a hunch as you're looking at this?
SCOTT (On Telephone): If I were betting, yes. Many people are surprised to learn that over 90 percent of wildfires are caused by us, humans. And I think that's really important to sit and think about for a minute, because one less sparks, one less wildfire, we need to be cognizant of that.
This is right near Mandeville Canyon, right now. A few years past, we had a well-intentioned individual performing proper brush clearance. They used a Weed Wacker, hot exhaust, put down on light flashy fuel, like grass, and it took off. They couldn't catch it.
So people need to think, if you're going to do that, not be doing that during windy time periods. And when it calms down, of course, have an extinguishing agent. 911, cell phone, to call, if needed.
COLLINS: And as we look at this, I mean, it is -- it's really just remarkable to watch this effort, and what this looks like, and just how much they are putting their lives in harm's way, trying to contain this, trying to put it out.
We reported, on Friday, that the L.A. Fire Chief, Kristin Crowley, had met with the Mayor, Karen Bass. They have been kind of publicly contradicting. Not kind of. They're publicly contradicting each other, on budget cuts, and if they affected the response here.
[21:15:00]
Do you -- when -- from what you've heard from with your colleagues are -- is the Mayor and the Fire Chief, are they on the same page now, from your understanding?
SCOTT (On Telephone): I think they're going to continue to talk about that, behind closed doors.
It's safe to say that the LAFD is facing significant challenges due to previous budget cuts. Chief Crowley has been on statement, to say three things, repeatedly. We're underfunded. We're understaffed. We're under resourced.
And it makes it a real strain on our resources. It limits the ability to expand operations, to modernize. Los Angeles is, you got 4 million people that live, work and play here. So, there's a lot going on.
Us, firefighters, we're not asking for a raise in money. We just want to be fully-funded, to do the best job we can for those we serve. We live in this city. The Incident Commander of this lived and works in Pacific Palisades. We're holding the hands of the people, who are shedding the tears who say, Hey, that's where I got married, That's where my kids go to school.
We just want the team, the tools, the training, to do our job. No politics. Firefighters just want to do a good job.
COLLINS: Yes. We're watching them do a great job, right now, and just amazing, heroic work.
Captain Erik Scott, as you know, please pass along our gratitude. Thank you for taking the time to join us tonight as well.
SCOTT (On Telephone): Our pleasure, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: And you can see how desperately needed help is. I should note, tonight, here in Washington, the House Speaker is signaling there could be a fight in Congress, about getting aid to those who need it the most right now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): I think there should probably be conditions on that aid. That's my personal view. We'll see what the consensus is.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: We're going to speak to a member of the Republican Conference next.
Plus, hours away from what could be an explosive confirmation hearing, for the President-elect's Defense secretary pick, Pete Hegseth. What Democrats are doing tonight? We're going to speak to a Democratic U.S. Senator tonight.
[21:20:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: President Biden was briefed today on the California wildfires, a briefing that included details from the head of FEMA, on how displaced residents are going to get money for hotel stays, or essentials like gas and baby formula.
That comes as some Republicans say that they do now believe any new aid to Californians should come with conditions attached, including the Speaker of the House.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: There has been water resource mismanagement, forest mismanagement, mistakes, all sorts of problems.
It appears to us that state and local leaders were derelict in their duty in many respects. So, that's something that has to be factored in. I think there should probably be conditions on that aid. That's my personal view. We'll see what the consensus is.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My Republican source tonight is the Iowa congressman, Zach Nunn.
Do you agree with Speaker Johnson that conditions should be attached to the new aid to California?
REP. ZACH NUNN (R-IA): Well I think, first of all, we need to recognize that there are dozens of people dead. There are going to be more who are found here. There are thousands of homes that have been utterly destroyed, and we have a state that is reeling right now.
And I think it's a fair question to also say, how can we get the best aid there? I'm from a small farm state. When we get decimated by tornadoes, we expect that the rest of the country is going to come to our assistance. I believe firmly, in talking with the Speaker tonight, that this is where we want to be as a nation. I also recognize that there are challenges. We have a California situation, where state and local leaders, as was highlighted, have been derelict in their responsibility. I think we can do two things, first and foremost.
Look, I'm a military guy. We need to have a plan to be able to help the immediate challenge going on, right now. And that means getting the immediate resources, both at the local, state and federal level, to help these families who are hurting.
But we also need to be asking, we don't want to continue to pay hundreds of billions of dollars to a situation that finds itself consistently in a challenge, to be able to do forest management, water management.
I mean, we just heard right now, the leadership in L.A. is looking at making L.A. into a sanctuary city, in violation of federal law. But they expect the federal government is going to come and help bail them out, when they're openly flaunting their responsibilities? So, there needs to be a clear conversation on this.
We also need to recognize, this has got to be a bipartisan solution. If it's going to move forward, and we're going to be able to get this aid, it means Republicans and Democrats are going to have to work together. We've got 15 Democrats in Trump-won districts. I mean, they need to come to the conversation as well for solutions.
COLLINS: Yes, but you're not saying that single-handedly, it was the Democratic-elected leaders' responsibility for this fire. I mean, we've heard from--
NUNN: Yes.
COLLINS: We're going to speak to the Fire Chief in Orange County, in a minute, who said, this was unstoppable. I mean, they are in the middle of a drought.
NUNN: This is the force of nature, yes. Kaitlan, you're absolutely right.
COLLINS: These were fires that were just--
NUNN: But I also want to say--
COLLINS: --nothing like they've ever seen.
NUNN: Yes, I also want to highlight here, as we heard from our own Fire Chief, here in L.A., there's a situation, right now, where they felt like they were chronically underfunded. They didn't get the training and the resources they needed. And they don't want to be political about this. But they felt like they were left in the lurch.
I think this is tragic, when we have a situation, where we're pulling in 900 conscripted prisoners, to help fight a fire, in a situation, which is truly historically massive in magnitude. But we also have a state, which has just fallen flat, in its responsibility, because this is not the first time this has happened.
And we've seen in other states, Iowa is a keen example of this, where we know we're going to have tornadoes, we put a billion dollars into a rainy-day fund, so when these emergencies strike, we're ready to respond.
COLLINS: Yes, but I think what the concern that we've heard, from Democrats, who say is--
NUNN: Yes.
COLLINS: --You're creating a really bad precedent here, because aid typically doesn't have conditions on it.
NUNN: Yes.
COLLINS: I mean, North Carolina didn't have conditions, when we saw how devastating that was for people who live there, who say--
NUNN: Right.
COLLINS: --This is a slippery slope Republicans are going down, where, I mean, you could be in a disaster-prone state, like Louisiana, where Mike Johnson is from--
NUNN: Yes.
[21:25:00]
COLLINS: --or like Florida, or even Iowa, and something happens, and then, how would you feel if Democrats were saying, Well, actually, we don't like how your Republican governor is handling that, so we're going to put conditions on that?
NUNN: And Kaitlan, I'd gently push back on that, and say that there have been conditions placed on aid before, particularly when it comes to emergency aid.
Look, we've got a $36 trillion national debt. And the inability for the insurance commissioners, in California, to be able to keep insurance companies in country -- or in the state, are a real management issue. It's a challenge.
Equally important, if we're going to put hundreds of millions or billions of dollars into helping families recover, I want to make sure they're not going to face the exact same crisis, two years from now, because California has failed to take action, on things they should have been taking action on, decades ago.
COLLINS: OK. But so, for example, if Mike Johnson moves ahead with this idea that's been floating around, of tying the debt ceiling to wildfire aid, I mean is that -- could you argue that's anything but political?
NUNN: Well, we haven't even gotten to this point yet. So, I won't even speculate on what the future of the debt ceiling is going to look like.
COLLINS: Or would you support that?
NUNN: I think I want to support getting assistance on the ground, right now. Look, again, curtailing the -- I were in National Guard, and the military beforehand, there's needs that can be met, right now. We should be prioritizing focus on that.
What we don't need is more tragically, like what Governor Newsom has already done, is to say, Hey, send me your aid, but make sure it goes through my ActBlue account, so that I can collect your information and use it in my upcoming election. That's the real politicalization that's going on, right now, in California. We've seen the same come out of Elizabeth Warren.
COLLINS: But is it helpful--
NUNN: I want to see an end for that.
COLLINS: Is it helpful when Trump attacks a sitting governor, as these fires are still raging, in California?
NUNN: I think he's talked about already going out there and seeing this.
What I want to see is that both sides depoliticize, and it starts with the governor. He's the commander on the ground. He needs to take responsibility for this. I'd ask him, Take this ActBlue money, and give it directly to the people who are in need. Don't take 4 percent off the top.
COLLINS: Congressman, thank you for your time tonight. Thank you for joining us, here on set.
NUNN: Appreciate it, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: My political sources are also here.
Kate Bedingfield, former Biden White House Communications Director.
And Sarah Matthews, the former deputy press secretary for President Trump, when he was in the White House last time.
Sarah, this is not a position that is only held by some Republicans who are also in the House. We're seeing with Senate Republicans, like Tommy Tuberville, from my home state, also expressing support for this.
You worked in the White House when Trump was in office last time and disasters like this hit. What is your view of this demand that is percolating?
SARAH MATTHEWS, FORMER DEPUTY PRESS SECRETARY FOR PRES. TRUMP: I think although you're going to see some Republicans, who agree with this sentiment, we've also seen some come out of the Senate who have pushed back on this, particularly from states who understand the importance of disaster relief, and it being non-partisan.
Rick Scott from Florida has already said he doesn't agree with this. Senator Tillis from North Carolina, as you mentioned, they faced flooding there this year -- or last year. They -- he pushed back on that. They understand that this needs to stay non-partisan. It's a slippery slope. Sets a really dangerous precedent.
And during my time at the White House, we were struggling with COVID relief. And I think that it's easy to see how these things get politicized.
But I think that what would be best is that we don't punish the Californians, who just lost everything, and instead focus our attacks on the poor management that I think we've seen from the Mayor of L.A., Karen Bass, and Governor Newsom.
COLLINS: Well, Kate, on that front. I mean, there has been criticism of Mayor Bass. She was overseas, on an international trip, when this happened. Even though, of course, we knew the winds were expected to be bad, no one knew it was going to be this bad. She had vowed, as people are bringing up today, not to go on these trips, when she was elected.
And then, there was that moment, when Governor Newsom was confronted by a woman, who was asking about the water and the fire hydrants. I just want to show that, to people to remind them of this Californian, going up to her governor, and what she had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RACHEL DARVISH, DISTRAUGHT RESIDENT: Please tell me what you're going to do.
I'm not going to hurt him. I promise.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. OK.
GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D-CA): I'm literally talking to the President right now to specifically answer the question of what we can do for you and your daughter.
DARVISH: Can I hear -- can I hear your call?
NEWSOM: It doesn't--
DARVISH: Because I don't believe it.
NEWSOM: Getting the resources to help rebuild.
DARVISH: Why was there no water in the hydrants, Governor?
NEWSOM: It's all being -- it's all literally--
DARVISH: Is it going to be different next time?
NEWSOM: It has to be. (END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: What's your view of how Democrats are handling this?
KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER BIDEN WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Well, I think these moments of natural disaster can be really illuminating. And I would not disagree that there have been some optical stumbles.
And I think, obviously Mayor Bass being out of the country was problematic.
I think that was not a great clip for Governor Newsom, although he does say he's hearing her directly. He does say it has to be better next time, and he's acknowledging that.
But I think we also have to be fair that this has been a dramatic event that has been impacted by weather currents that nobody can control, no Democrat, no Republican, can control.
But I do think, I agree with Sarah, I think this idea of conditioning aid, or even, perhaps even more dangerously, tying aid to something as politically challenging as the debt ceiling, not only sets a dangerous precedent.
It's also it's just putting politics ahead of humanity and empathy, in a moment, where our leaders should be making sure that the citizens in California, who are hurting, get what they need, just as they do for every other citizen in this country who suffers from a natural disaster.
So, I think the idea that Republicans are starting to walk down this path is incredibly dangerous.
[21:30:00]
MATTHEWS: I will add too. Yes, we do need to strike that balance between humanity. But then also, I think that it's OK for these citizens to have rage toward their elected officials right now. I mean, there's a lot of questions that need to be answered, about what went wrong in this response.
It seems like there wasn't much proactive measures taken, and this is all reactive in response. I mean, why wasn't vegetation -- or why was it overgrown? Why wasn't brush cleared? Why were fire hydrants empty and reservoirs empty? I mean, these are questions that need to be asked. And it seems like poor governance on the part of--
COLLINS: Yes.
MATTHEWS: --these California elected officials.
COLLINS: And the voters are, of course, their bosses. So, we'll see what happens.
Kate Bedingfield, and Sarah Matthews, thank you both for being here. Up next. The first confirmation hearing for Donald Trump's Defense pick is only hours away from now. Pete Hegseth will be on Capitol Hill tomorrow, where he's expected to be grilled over allegations that have loomed over his nomination. We're going to speak to a Senator, who will vote whether to confirm him, next.
[21:35:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Here in Washington, on the eve of what could be a dramatic showdown, Democratic senators are questioning the thoroughness of Pete Hegseth's FBI background check. That's Trump's pick to run the Pentagon, who is, among other things, accused of sexual assault, which he has vehemently denied.
But Democrats, who will get the chance to question him tomorrow, are raising the possibility tonight, of gaps in that report.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. RICHARD BLUMENTHAL (D-CT): I'm told that they may well not have interviewed his ex-spouses or the accuser. I think that is a gap in the FBI report. If true, that is very unfortunate.
SEN. TAMMY DUCKWORTH (D-IL): My understanding is that several of the witnesses were not interviewed by the FBI, even though they wanted to be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: And my source tonight is Democratic senator, Chris Murphy.
Senator, thank you for being here.
If they did not -- if the FBI did not interview the woman who did accuse Pete Hegseth of sexual assault, and that was at the center of that agreement that they came to, which I should note he's denied, does that bother you?
SEN. CHRIS MURPHY (D-CT): Well, it certainly bothers me. These FBI reports are important. But it feels to me like there is enough information already, on the record, much of it admitted by the nominee, that is disqualifying in and of itself. So yes, we should have a complete FBI report.
There are so many disturbing allegations about sexual abuse, heavy drinking that we should get the interviews from the people who witnessed, or were subject to that behavior, firsthand.
But we have enough accounts already, in the credible media, that should make it pretty easy, for my colleagues, to ask the Trump administration to find somebody else. Somebody that doesn't have a history of heavy drinking, of organizational mismanagement, of sexual misconduct. Somebody that hasn't thumbed their nose at women's participation in the military. Somebody that has respect for the rule of law in international agreements like the Geneva Conventions.
There just seems to be plenty of evidence that this is a uniquely unqualified, dangerous nominee. And there are loads of other very conservative defense Republicans, loyal to Donald Trump, who would make a better head of the Defense Department.
COLLINS: But on this report that so many were saying they wanted to have this report done, and that that would inform their opinion on how they vote, certainly on the Senate Armed Services Committee.
The current practice is only the Chairman and the Ranking Member get to be briefed on that FBI report. So, it's up to the Trump transition team to decide if it should be shared more widely. Last I heard was they do not plan to break that precedent.
Does that mean you don't expect to see what's in that report, or your colleagues on the committee don't?
MURPHY: Well, there certainly have been exceptions. I remember when Brett Kavanaugh was coming before the Judiciary Committee, I got to be briefed on the FBI report, even though I wasn't Chairman of the Judiciary Committee, or a member of the Judiciary Committee. Why? Because that nomination was so important to the future of the country.
What's more important than the man who is going to lead our troops into battle, especially at a moment of great peril to American security and the security of our allies?
Yes, of course, we should all be able to see that FBI report, and it should be done in a thorough manner. All I'm saying is that I don't know that the FBI report should be determinative.
There is already enough really serious and credible allegations, and reports of misconduct, that I would hope that Republicans would be asking the Trump administration to send another name, send somebody else that will be in a better moral position, to lead our brave men and women.
COLLINS: Well, right now, it doesn't seem like they are, based on what we've heard. Even the biggest critics of him have seemed to soften on him a bit. And so, on that -- and the Kavanaugh comparison, I mean, that is what the Trump team has said in their favor, to say that he was unfairly scrutinized, in the way that he was, over old allegations against him.
But when this all comes down, and he gets a vote a week from his hearing, or when that's expected to -- believe -- I believe, the day the inauguration, do you expect that Pete Hegseth will get a single Democratic vote? Will you vote for him?
[21:40:00]
MURPHY: Oh, no. I think he is a very dangerous nominee. I will not be voting for him. I don't know about the votes of all the rest of my colleagues. But it wasn't so long ago, when Republicans would have the courage to occasionally stand up to a president of their own party, when somebody was sent to them that was uniquely disqualified.
And it only takes three or four Republicans, for us to have another name to consider. So, I certainly haven't given up on a handful of Republicans, saying, Listen, send us a different nominee, someone that is conservative, someone that is loyal to you as president, but somebody that doesn't have this history of widespread misconduct.
COLLINS: Well, when four years ago, when Biden took office, you warned about delaying the confirmation of the Defense Secretary. You talked about how important it was. The threat of our country requires DOD to have leadership in place without delay. You said, We need one on the job immediately.
Do you still feel that way tonight?
MURPHY: Well, I felt that way because we had a very qualified nominee before us. Of course, all things being equal, you want to have a national security team in place, as soon as possible, but not at the expense of putting someone so dangerous, in charge of the Department of Defense.
I know all the attention has been on these allegations of financial misconduct, his drinking habits. But he also is someone that has said, he doesn't believe in the Geneva Accords. He has defended soldiers, who have been found guilty, by their own fellow soldiers, of gross misconduct. He essentially endorses war crimes as just a cost of doing business in the military.
So that, to me, makes this country weaker, if we don't have a leader of the Defense Department, who believes in the international rule of law. So yes, I think you want a team put in place as fast as you can. But not any team. You want that team to be qualified.
COLLINS: Senator Chris Murphy, thank you for your time tonight.
MURPHY: Thank you.
COLLINS: We're also tracking new developments, this evening, on what may have started the deadly wildfires in L.A. Why investigators are now looking at a very specific street, in the Pacific Palisades. We'll show you ahead.
[21:45:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Tonight, Los Angeles is bracing for near-hurricane-level winds that are threatening to fan the flames, as we're already now getting new video of investigators looking into a specific street in the Palisades, where one of the biggest fires happened, to see where it may have originated.
My source tonight is the Orange County Fire Chief, Brian Fennessy. And Chief, it's great to have you here.
Because we're looking at this investigation that's underway, looking at this specific street. And, I guess, a question that people have is how critical it is to know how this started, in order to be able to stop future fires from starting.
CHIEF BRIAN FENNESSY, FIRE CHIEF, ORANGE COUNTY FIRE AUTHORITY: Well, yes, after every fire start, whether it's big or small, the Fire Service does an investigation, the agency having jurisdiction.
And quite frankly, if it does turn into arson, it's pretty tough for us to prevent. I mean, that is a crime. Whether it's utility started or accidental lightning, which, of course, isn't the case down here, all cases are investigated.
And I imagine, it'll probably be a while before we find out. There are -- you know, the investigators are going to be very sure, before they go public with the cause of these fires.
COLLINS: OK. So, you think it will take some time.
And I know, you described the level of these wildfires as unstoppable.
We've heard from a lot of critics. We just had a Republican congressman on here, who talked about how, and including the President-elect himself, more forest management needs to be done, brush clearing. They could have, maybe not stopped this, but would have helped mitigate it.
From your experience, is that the case? What is -- what is your assessment of, you know, could factors and steps have been taken to help here?
FENNESSY: So, there's no question that the wildlands throughout the West, are unhealthy, and we need to do what we can to restore the landscape, be it through beneficial fire and fuel removal, a variety of different things. That's unquestionable. We need to do that.
However, when we're talking about the fires that we experienced down here, in Southern California, quite frankly, when we're talking 70-, 80-mile-an-hour consistent winds with gusts in 90 to 100, we've seen fires like this blow by 12-, 15-lane freeways. I literally mean that is unstoppable.
But you got to understand that for quote-unquote, normal fires, even hot, extraordinary, days during the summer, absolutely defensible space. Fuel treatments on the landscape, fuel breaks, all the things we talk about are incredibly (inaudible) about, and I don't know the exact percentage, but I'm betting what we experience with these Santa Ana winds, and these kind of fires is 1 percent or less of the overall fires, the tens of thousands that we have in the West, and throughout the United States, that turn into fires like this.
But because of wind-driven, and because the humidities are so low, and because we've built into areas that we now call the Wildland-Urban Interface, we've developed in these places, when we have a weather phenomenon like we experienced, and there is an ignition? Unfortunately, we are going to lose homes. And our job becomes rescue, and keeping and moving people out of the path of these fires, and secondarily, then becomes the property protection.
[21:50:00]
COLLINS: Yes. Yes, I mean, to hear you say, even if it was a 15-mile highway, it wouldn't -- it would have been able to jump that. That is just remarkable.
Fire Chief Brian Fennessy, I really do appreciate you taking your time to come on, to share your expertise, to let everyone hear that. Thank you.
FENNESSY: You're very welcome.
COLLINS: And we've had a lot of people reach out, who want to know, how can they help. You're watching these images. They want to be able to help. If you want to be able to help wildfire victims in L.A., you can go to CNN.com/impact, for a list of vetted organizations.
Up next here for us. The President-elect threatened to fire a government official, one week from today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND CURRENT PRESIDENTIAL- ELECT: On day one, I will fire.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: But he is going to be resigning instead. His warnings, on his way out, that's ahead.
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[21:55:00]
COLLINS: Donald Trump used to say that he was not a fan of crypto, arguing that cryptocurrencies are, quote, "Not money," and "Based on thin air," in his view. But that was years before he and his family launched their own crypto business, and he became much more supportive.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I do believe in it. I also know a lot of friends that are really into it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: On the campaign trail, Trump said this, about Wall Street's top cop, who has been leading the crackdown on cryptocurrencies.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: On day one, I will fire Gary Gensler and appoint a new SEC chairman.
(CHEERING)
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: I didn't know he was that unpopular.
(CHEERING)
(APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I should note, Trump will not have the opportunity to do so. That's because Gary Gensler is going to resign his post as the Chair of the Securities and Exchange Commission when Trump takes office.
And the SEC Chief is my inside source tonight.
Trump has launched his own crypto venture with his family. So he's coming into office with that. His Commerce secretary, his pick if he's confirmed, Howard Lutnick, is a very big crypto enthusiast.
I wonder what your expert -- expectation is, for what that looks like with an administration that is embracing it so much, as you just heard from Trump there.
GARY GENSLER, CHAIR, U.S. SECURITIES AND EXCHANGE COMMISSION: Well, right now, the public isn't getting the disclosures they need and are required under the law. And then the so-called crypto exchanges, crypto intermediaries, many of them are co-mingling functions we would never allow in the rest of our markets.
And those conflicts are rife. And we know what happens. We know that that's when the public gets harmed.
COLLINS: Well, and on that front, with Truth Social, a majority of Trump's wealth now coming from that. Have we ever seen a president before who, his personal wealth will determine on the direction the SEC takes before? Have we ever seen that?
GENSLER: Well, we've been in place for 90 years, and most chief executives of our nation, commanders-in-chief, don't have that level of personal wealth.
But what's really important, and what we do, is we think about everyday Americans, at the Securities and Exchange Commission. It's why we did things.
Look, I came into office, four years ago. Do you remember that, the GameStop events, and the markets were?
COLLINS: Yes. GENSLER: And a lot of everyday investors were being harmed. And so, we came in, and we said, How can we help bring commonsense reforms to our stock markets? That's a $60 trillion market, that crypto is much smaller than that. That's where we focused a lot of attention.
We've shortened our settlement cycle, so that if you sell your stock on a Monday, you get your cash on a Tuesday. We've focused on the U.S. Treasury market, $28 trillion market, again, way bigger than crypto, and tried to reform the U.S. Treasury market, which, because of the deficits, are growing so rapidly.
COLLINS: But if you were staying on as the Chair, in that world? Because technically, your term isn't up for another -- until 2026. Would you be worried? Do you see obvious conflicts of interest here, for the incoming administration, starting with the President-elect himself?
GENSLER: Look, all of us who have the great privilege to serve, work with the lawyers, work with the Office of Government Ethics, and we really have to instill trust in our government, that the public has trust, that those of us that are entrusted in these jobs don't have conflicts.
COLLINS: Yes, and on that front, you talk about how much smaller the crypto world is. But for young men, it does disproportionately take up, they are much more invested in it than young women are. When you look at the numbers of ages, the numbers we looked at 18 to 29, 42 percent of men have used, of young men have used crypto. That's compared to 17 percent of women.
Trump did really well with young men. He was coming in, promising looser regulations on crypto, and just a more relaxed attitude.
Do you think how tough you were on it, and the fact that he named you at rallies, played any kind of role, in how those young men voted?
GENSLER: Look, I'll leave it to political consultants to do that. I know that many of your audience are interested in that.
But this is a field that if it's going to survive, and it's going to persist, it has to do a couple things.
One, what are its fundamentals? And there are many great investors out there that say, Look, there's a lot of sentiment, there's a lot of emotion, but what are the fundamentals? Meaning, what's the return for these 10 or 15,000 tokens?
Number two, it's got to comply with the law. It's got to be within something that investors trust. That's what's critical.
But no, I don't think that it ultimately was a top issue for voters, in these various states.
COLLINS: Gary Gensler, thank you so much for your time tonight.
GENSLER: Thank you. COLLINS: Really appreciate you.
And thank you so much for joining us. We'll see you back here, tomorrow night.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" is up next.
[22:00:00]
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST, CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP: Tonight. As liberal leaders face backlash over the fires, will their handling of the crisis convert some Democratic voters--
