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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump-Musk Relationship Publicly Implodes; Speaker Johnson: Elon Musk's Attacks Are "Not Helpful"; Tesla Shares Tumble As Musk- Trump Feud Goes Nuclear. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired June 05, 2025 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
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That's it for us. The news continues. "THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: Good evening. I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
And tonight, what happens when the most powerful person on the planet, and the wealthiest person in the world, have a very public falling out? While we're finding out, in real time, this evening, as the partnership between President Trump and Elon Musk is imploding, while we are all just sitting here and watching.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Look, Elon and I had a great relationship. I don't know if we will anymore. I was surprised. Because you were here, everybody in this room practically was here, as we had a wonderful send-off. He said wonderful things about me. You couldn't have nicer, said the best thing.
And I'll be honest, I think he misses the place.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: And with that, after days of dodging Musk's attacks, Donald Trump opened the floodgates.
For starters, the President's biggest campaign donor, who was so close that Trump invited him to sleep at the White House, is now calling for him to be impeached and replaced by Vice President, JD Vance.
The man who was handed nearly unfettered access to the federal government, is openly musing about forming his own political party. And the same guy, the billionaire, backing the U.S. space program, he's now threatening to take his rockets and go home.
What at this time, yesterday, was a one-sided attack on the President's signature spending bill, is no longer just a policy disagreement, not even close. It has now become quite personal, as the President says, he thinks he knows why.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well, look, you know, I've always liked Elon, and so I was very surprised. You saw the words he had for me, the words -- and he hasn't said anything about me that's bad. I'd rather have him criticize me than the bill, because the bill is incredible. It's the biggest cut in the history of our country we've never cut. It's about $1.6 trillion in cuts.
Elon is upset because we took the EV mandate, and you know, which was a lot of money for electric vehicles. And you know, they're having a hard time, the electric vehicles, and they want us to pay billions of dollars in subsidy. And you know, I -- Elon knew this from the beginning.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: As Trump was speaking from the Oval Office, Elon Musk responded, in real-time, writing this. Quote. "False, this bill was never shown to me even once and was passed in the dead of night so fast that almost no one in Congress could even read it." And, quote, "Whatever. Keep the EV/solar incentive cuts in the bill, even though no oil & gas subsidies are touched (very unfair), but ditch the MOUNTAIN of DISGUSTING PORK in the bill."
And with the German Chancellor sitting by his side today, with the President there in the Oval, he said what he had been bottling up, really, for days now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: You saw a man who was very happy when he stood behind the Oval desk. And even with a black eye. I said, do you want a little makeup? We'll get you a little makeup. But he said, No, I don't think so. Which is interesting.
He's worn the hat, Trump Was Right About Everything. And I am right about the great big, beautiful bill. We call it a great big, beautiful bill, because that's what it is.
I don't know what it is. It's sort of Trump derangement syndrome, I guess they call it. But we have it with others too. They leave, and they wake up in the morning, and the glamor is gone, the whole world is different, and they become hostile. I don't know what it is. Someday you'll write a book about it, and you'll let us know.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Not to be outdone. Musk posted in response to that, quote, "Without me, Trump would have lost the election, Dems would control the House and the Republicans" in the Senate "would be 51-49." "Such ingratitude," he added.
As the White House was scrambling to react to all of this, as it was playing out, in real-time today, with aides now forced to attack the person they have been defending for months in front of the cameras. Look at this. You could still see the imprint of Musk on the White House, that red Tesla that the President bought from him. Our Jay McMichael shot this. It was still sitting right outside the West Wing, parked on West Exec.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: He's a great patriot. And he's also done an incredible job with Tesla. And I mean, nobody else has a car company started up in the last 30 years, that's been successful. I don't think so.
I love Tesla.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: It's not clear if he still feels the same way, tonight.
[21:05:00]
Today, the President declared that, Elon was 'wearing thin,' I asked him to leave, I took away his EV Mandate that forced everyone to buy Electric Cars that nobody else wanted (that he knew for months I was going to do), and he just went CRAZY.
Then came the threat that could really hurt. The President said, The easiest way to save money in our Budget, Billions and Billions of Dollars, is to terminate Elon's Governmental Subsidies and Contracts. I was always surprised that Biden didn't do it.
Tesla's stock price took a massive hit after that, a $150 billion in market value gone, as the two were trading attacks today. According to Bloomberg, Elon Musk lost $34 billion today. That financial hit, though, does not seem to be enough for his critics in MAGA world.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE BANNON, FORMER TRUMP AIDE: This guy is all over the map, he's right -- but he's emblematic of these oligarchs. All of them have the maturity of a 9-year-old, and they're dangerous. They're dangerous not just to the President of the United States. More importantly, they're dangerous to this republic, and the citizens of this constitutional republic. (END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: At one point, the President seemed to may be trying to cool things off. He said, quote, "I don't mind Elon turning against me, but he should have done so months ago."
And I'm told that allies of both the President and Musk were kind of caught in the middle of all of this today. They were quietly and delicately trying to broker peace between the two men, behind-the- scenes.
But those efforts were upended when Elon Musk wrote this. This was really kind of the end of that. He said, Time to drop the really big bomb: Donald Trump is in the Epstein files. That is the real reason they have not been made public. Have a nice day, DJT.
Now, I should note tonight, there's no evidence when it comes to what this looks like in terms of the Epstein files, beyond that. The White House says his bomb is an unfortunate episode. And several people, familiar with what was happening behind-the-scenes, described the Epstein tweet to me as the tipping point, though, in this relationship, now fearing that there is no going back.
We have a full house of deeply-sourced insiders to start us off on what is a remarkable day at the White House.
CNN's Donie O'Sullivan and Brian Stelter.
And also Politico's Dasha Burns.
And the Associated Press' Seung Min Kim.
Dasha, I mean, I just want to know what you're hearing from people at the White House tonight. Because what we were hearing is, yes, this was a breakup that was predictable. But even people inside the White House did not see it going down like this, and as fast as it happened today. I mean, the group chats inside the White House were just on fire today. People comparing it to a divorce--
DASHA BURNS, WHITE HOUSE BUREAU CHIEF, POLITICO: Yes.
COLLINS: --saying, Yes, we thought it was going to happen, but maybe, maybe not until the fall, or in a few months.
What have you been hearing from people tonight?
BURNS: Yes, my phone has been just absolutely blowing up. People inside the White House, people on the Hill. I mean, yes, the divorce analogies are rampant right now. Look, it was the ferocity, the how quickly this happened.
And once he started going down the rabbit hole of the Epstein files, that's when the conversation with the White House allies and people inside of the White House really changed. As I was communicating with folks all day. They were saying, This is now going into crazy-town. They were -- people were telling me that the President is concerned about Elon Musk's wellbeing that -- you saw the reporting, as we all did, from The Times, around the drug use. They didn't expect it to go quite in this direction.
And at this point, earlier on, people were saying, Look, they fight. These are two titans. They're clashing, but they'll come back together. Now, it seems like the hope for any sort of reconciliation is gone, and the goal is just to try to turn the temperature down here.
COLLINS: I mean, Seung Min, that's really the question here is, how you turn the temperature down, when you have got these two major personalities, two alphas, who are trying to essentially outdo one another in terms of inflicting harm, now that this relationship is, we're watching it totally implode.
SEUNG MIN KIM, WHITE HOUSE REPORTER, ASSOCIATED PRESS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I mean, Elon Musk and Donald Trump hit each other where it hurts the most. They hit each other's egos. And for Elon Musk, Donald Trump really hit at his wallet. So, it's really difficult to see what the two sides can do to at least even turn the temperature down a little.
But this fight could have really serious -- actual consequences for President Trump's agenda. I was really fascinated by some of the early comments we were getting, from Republican lawmakers, on Capitol Hill, about the impact on that so-called one big, beautiful bill.
I mean, there's Ryan Zinke, Republican from Montana. He was Interior Secretary for President Trump in his first term, and he said that it's, you know, you have the richest man in the world, and you have the most powerful man in the world, going up against each other. It really does put -- it can put the bill in serious jeopardy.
[21:10:00]
And while I'm a little bit skeptical about how much -- I'm just a little skeptical, at this point, about how much power Elon Musk will have at this point. I think a lot of his power, within the Republican Party, comes from his proximity to Donald Trump. But it certainly doesn't help when the fate of the bill is already very much teetering on the edge.
COLLINS: Yes.
And Donie, when it comes -- it started out just, you know, this policy fight, on what was happening on Capitol Hill. Obviously, anyone who crosses Trump should expect to face his wrath. It was actually surprising how long he took to respond to Elon Musk.
But on the Epstein files, I think just, I just -- to properly convey to people, who may not be on Twitter as much as you and I are, it is the lowest of the low insults, to say to someone, in right-wing media or the right-wing atmosphere, Oh, you're in the Epstein files. DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Yes. That really is, you know, that is the kryptonite here, and maybe why Trump finally responded, right? I mean, when it comes to -- when it comes to the Epstein files, Epstein list, whatever folks want to call it, it doesn't actually matter what it is, in reality.
I mean, there have been names that have been associated with Jeffrey Epstein that have been released through court. Trump's name came out in documents, last year, but there was absolutely no accusation of wrongdoing on Trump's part whatsoever, but his name was, as somebody who knew Epstein.
What is most important, though, is what people and the MAGAverse imagine what this list is to be, right? And this, they imagine is a list of all the bad people, all the bad people who went to Epstein's Island, and who abused young women, and did other criminal things. And what people also believe is that that list is made up of Trump's enemies, normally, right? We see, there's been many versions of this list that have circulated online.
COLLINS: That's the thing though too. They did this to themselves.
O'SULLIVAN: Yes.
COLLINS: Because it's the Trump orbit that amplified the conspiracy theories about Jeffrey Epstein's list, and who was on it, and what it meant about those people. And so, for Elon Musk to say that? That is why that kind of takes this to this other level. It doesn't mean anything. It doesn't mean that there was wrongdoing. We don't know that.
O'SULLIVAN: No.
COLLINS: But there's already pictures of Trump and Jeffrey Epstein together. We knew he was a member at Mar-a-Lago, and then was removed from the club. But it was kind of the right turning on the right here.
BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA ANALYST: A 100 percent. And there is going to be a situation now, where people have to choose sides, right? GOP lawmakers are already asking themselves, Am I choosing Trump or Musk? I'm sure most of them will choose Trump.
But that is a serious choice to have to make, given how much money Musk funneled in to the election, last year. Musk recently said, he doesn't want to invest in the next election, in the midterms. Does anybody believe that? Does anybody believe Musk is going to sit on the sidelines, with the midterms coming up?
I see this as a lose-lose scenario. Trump has a lot to lose. Musk has even more to lose. Trump could turn the levers of the government against Musk companies. There's, what, 20 investigations into Musk's various companies going on right now. There are so many ways that Trump could take advantage of the government's power, to hurt Musk.
So, in some ways, I think Trump is outmatched here. Musk is a lot more powerful on the internet. He has a much bigger megaphone on Twitter or X, than Trump does on Truth Social. Musk is playing dirtier, but that's because Musk has more to lose.
O'SULLIVAN: I will just say this is -- this is where Musk could--
STELTER: Yes.
O'SULLIVAN: --has the strength, right? When I opened X, a few minutes ago--
STELTER: Yes.
O'SULLIVAN: --the first image I saw was a fake, or potentially deepfake image that purported to show Trump with Epstein and young women, a totally fake image.
We know -- we don't have answers about how much Musk changed the algorithms, played around with the algorithms to help Trump in the last election. Is X going to become a place now, which was once the right's favorite platform, where you open it up, and every day what you're being fed algorithm -- algorithmically, is anti-Trump content?
COLLINS: Yes.
STELTER: Wow.
COLLINS: Yes.
STELTER: Interesting.
COLLINS: And in terms of what they could do to each other, Dasha, you know?
STELTER: Yes.
COLLINS: I mean, Trump could theoretically revoke his security clearance that he has. He could terminate the federal contracts. But also, on the reverse side of that, I mean, Elon Musk's rockets are the only -- it's the only reliable ride that astronauts have, to space right now, in the United States, essentially. And the effort to try to get people back on the moon, that would be threatened by this.
And also, we've got Steve Bannon tonight, saying that the President should initiate an investigation of his immigration status, and saying that he should be deported, right now.
BURNS: Yes. One Hill aide told me tonight that there are about 10,000 different ways that each one of these could hurt the other.
And right now, it is also Trump's agenda on the line here, and it's vulnerable. Like, Trump might not be himself that vulnerable, but his agenda is, and that's where I'm hearing some alarm bells, from folks on the Hill, saying, like, Look, you do not want the world's richest guy with the world's biggest megaphone, like, dumping on this bill in the final hours. And there are all of these practical levers, right, that each one of them can pull against each other.
[21:15:00] But the most important thing for both of these men is their image, is their brand, is their ability to deliver the message. So that's, I think, really where the biggest gloves are going to come off. How are -- is each one going to go after the other, in terms of the branding, the imaging, the messaging, the media, which both of them are very good at wielding to their own ends.
COLLINS: Yes.
And Seung Min, I was thinking, the Cabinet itself, there are several people who are in Trump's Cabinet. One, I mean, he nearly got in a fistfight with Scott Bessent, the Treasury Secretary. But people like Howard Lutnick, the Commerce Secretary, who have these very close relationships with Elon Musk.
And that now -- you know, we talk about Republicans not knowing what to do. People in the White House are looking at this dynamic, and wondering what to do.
MIN KIM: I mean, I think Scott Bessent might be smiling a little bit tonight. But you're right. I mean, this is, on the one hand, maybe perhaps you saw this implosion coming. I mean, what could you expect from these two very loud, brash personalities? Could they really have a functioning relationship, for months and years at a time?
But it also does, you know, it also just really gives a lack of clarity as to where the -- you know, as to where Cabinet officials and Republican lawmakers should be signing with at this point. Opinion host, Laura Ingraham, on Fox, said tonight, which was actually a little defensive of Musk, and said, the President shouldn't be threatening his federal contract.
So, to see the broader where -- the broader conservative ecosphere, and where they land, after -- as this fight continues to percolate, in the coming days, will be a really interesting factor to watch.
COLLINS: I mean, it is the only thing that anyone in the White House was talking about today, like even--
STELTER: Or -- or across the country.
COLLINS: Or anywhere.
STELTER: Around the world.
COLLINS: I mean, just watching this blow-up. I think everyone saying, Of course, this is going to happen. But, I mean, there are incredibly serious stakes at play here, between these two, in terms of their power. But also, seemingly having no stopping point, when it comes to hurting the other.
O'SULLIVAN: I was listening to -- so, just in terms of how this is playing out in the MAGAverse, and on right-wing media, it's--
COLLINS: It's like a funeral. O'SULLIVAN: It is. I mean, what's really fascinating to watch is, normally, there's a bad guy, every day, there's a villain, every day, in the MAGAverse.
STELTER: Right.
O'SULLIVAN: And normally, it's a Democrat, or it's some -- a journalist. It's normally very clear, because Trump and Musk and everybody's aligned.
Today, they were really scrambling and trying to figure out what the hell was happening. I will say, Charlie Kirk who's influential young activist on the likes--
COLLINS: Who Elon Musk unfollowed today.
O'SULLIVAN: Look, that's the other thing.
COLLINS: And Stephen Miller.
O'SULLIVAN: I'm wondering, is Musk going to unfollow Trump on X, given that Musk brought Trump back to X.
But Kirk was pointing out that, look, people did predict that this was going to happen. Frankly, they predicted that these two guys would have a falling-out in the first week of January, or like that that this would not last long past the inauguration. So, he was saying that, look, it did last five months, longer than expected. And I think there is a hopefulness that maybe these guys can come back together, once they get all this.
STELTER: Yes.
O'SULLIVAN: They're saying -- the point that I heard being made was that they're happy that this is happening now, rather than in the summer of 2026.
COLLINS: Can you like--
O'SULLIVAN: But that would be too optimistic.
COLLINS: Can you come back from likening someone to -- or linking someone to a notorious sex trafficker--
STELTER: I actually think you can.
O'SULLIVAN: Well--
STELTER: I actually think you can.
COLLINS: --child sex trafficker?
STELTER: JD Vance likened Trump to Hitler.
O'SULLIVAN: Trump--
STELTER: JD Vance is now the Vice President.
O'SULLIVAN: Trump said that Ted Cruz's dad was involved with the JFK assassination. Marco--
STELTER: We'll we're going down memory lane here. It's possible.
O'SULLIVAN: Marco Rubio, of course, is now this -- but.
STELTER: Less than a year ago, Trump was not even endorsed by Musk at, right? It was the day of the Butler assassination attempt.
O'SULLIVAN: I need to mention that--
STELTER: So, anything can happen.
But voters have real concerns here. What about DOGE? What about DOGE? There are actually real questions here, I think the voters have on their minds, about what happens with the government now.
O'SULLIVAN: Right.
COLLINS: We might not see any more rescissions packages being sent--
O'SULLIVAN: I need to mention that--
(CROSSTALK)
STELTER: What I mean that's--
O'SULLIVAN: --was a false claim about Ted Cruz's dad, just for the record.
STELTER: Oh.
O'SULLIVAN: Just for the record.
COLLINS: Yes.
O'SULLIVAN: Just for the record.
COLLINS: Yes. And no, but that's important.
O'SULLIVAN: Yes, yes.
COLLINS: Because this is how it gets into the lexicon.
STELTER: That's true.
COLLINS: Everyone. Thank you. Stand by.
Don't worry. There is a lot more to talk about here tonight. Because, Elon Musk was not only directing his fire at the West Wing tonight. He was also directing it at Capitol Hill, including House Speaker, Mike Johnson, who said that Musk was his good friend, just a few days ago. We're going to get reaction from a Republican and a Democrat, on Capitol Hill, next. [21:20:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: The White House press secretary commenting, for the first time tonight, on the now open, exposed for everybody to see rift between President Trump and Elon Musk.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The only difference between Friday and today is Elon went back to his companies, and as a businessman, he has a right to speak for his companies. But as president, President Trump has a responsibility to fight for this country. And the one big, beautiful bill is the most historic piece of legislation that has moved through Capitol Hill, in modern-day history.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: It's probably safe to say, that is not the only difference that has now happened, as President Trump's signature policy bill, on Capitol Hill, is where this fight started.
And tonight, Republican leaders are on the receiving end of Elon Musk's fire as well. He called House Speaker -- House Speaker, Mike Johnson, called Elon Musk his good friend, just about 24 hours ago. And then Elon Musk tweeted, quote, "Where is the Mike Johnson of 2023," while linking to a post from that time of Speaker Johnson, calling the federal debt, unsustainable.
House Speaker, Mike Johnson, is responding to that tonight.
[21:25:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): I don't know what motivated this, this disturbance, to begin. But obviously, it's not helpful.
My way is that policy disputes are not personal. And I, I have, I've tried very hard to speak with Elon over and over, you know, and talk with him about what I believe are misconceptions he has about this bill and what it is.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I'm joined by a pair of congressional sources tonight.
Tennessee Republican, Congressman Tim Burchett.
And Texas Democrat, Congressman Vicente Gonzalez.
And it's great to have you both here.
Congressman Burchett, I'll start with you, since you're the Republican here with us tonight. When you look at this battle happening, between Elon Musk and President Trump, whose side are you on?
REP. TIM BURCHETT (R-TN): I'm on President Trump's side. He's our President. He's our Commander-in-Chief. Elon Musk is a private citizen. He's allowed to say anything he wants to say, and that's within his First Amendment rights.
COLLINS: What goes through your mind when you hear Elon Musk saying, Trump should be impeached and replaced by JD Vance?
BURCHETT: Well, he doesn't have -- necessarily have a vote in that. The Democrats, that's what they want, of course. They want to impeach. That's -- they want to tie things up.
He also said -- made reference to President Trump on the Epstein Island. And could you imagine Joe Biden having that information, which he did, he would not get that out? That is -- that is so bogus. I mean you, as a legitimate member of the media, you should shake your head at that whole thing, that whole scenario.
I just think it's, he's upset, he's mad at the President, and he's firing off at him on his -- on his social media.
COLLINS: So you think he went basically too low?
BURCHETT: Oh, I mean, you don't lie about somebody in this, especially something about that, and especially since Elon -- I mean, how many pictures did you all put on the screen, of Elon and X running out to the helicopter together, and X running around the Oval Office with President Trump in there?
COLLINS: His son.
BURCHETT: You know, I just don't -- the whole thing's bogus. Two weeks from now, nobody will be talking about it. They'll be back. Y'all will be finding something else to run the country down about.
And it's just, it's a shame that the media seized upon this, because America is more worried about paying more taxes right now, if we don't pass the big, beautiful bill, because the people in my district, a family of four making $70,000 a year, they're going to pay about $1,400 more dollars a year, if we don't get this thing passed.
COLLINS: Well, I don't think this is the media's fault that the President and the richest man in the world are in an open war, happening right now.
But Congressman Gonzalez, you have a stake in this in terms of what are the results of this feud between Trump and Musk. The headquarters of SpaceX are in your district. So, what happens if the President follows through on his threat to terminate Elon's federal contracts?
REP. VICENTE GONZALEZ (D-TX): Well, obviously that would be devastating for SpaceX, and obviously many other programs that Musk is running.
I don't think you needed to be a genius, though, to foresee that this eruptive and public display of divorce was going to happen at some point. I mean, we had wagers going on, on the floor, Is this relationship going to last three months? Is it going to last six months? I don't think anyone thought it was going to last a year.
But one thing I think Elon Musk got right is that this is a big, ugly bill for the American people. This is a bill that cuts $500 billion of Medicare for our senior citizens, our most vulnerable people in America. $400 billion in Medicaid cuts that are people -- poor people living in my district, that live around SpaceX, we have 100,000 people that rely on Medicaid. More than a quarter of folks who live in our congressional district, where SpaceX lives and works are going to be impacted.
We have SNAP that's going to take food from people's -- from kids' bellies. People -- kids that have, sometimes, the only breakfast and lunch that they have in a day comes from this program. Meals on Wheels for senior citizens.
I think those are really impactful issues that are going to be -- people are going to be hurt by this big, ugly bill, as Elon Musk just called it. He's the richest man in the world. He also benefits from some of these subsidies. I think what he's told the administration, and members of the House and the Senate is right on, and I think they need to go back.
Also, this all happens -- all these cuts happen while giving us $3 trillion of more national debt over the next decade. Exactly what Musk has been fighting to try to prevent, up here with DOGE, and up here--
COLLINS: Yes.
GONZALEZ: --working with the administration.
BURCHETT: Kaitlan, let's be honest. The last four years, Joe Biden's administration, and the Democrats, ran up our debt, a trillion dollars every 100 days, every 100 days. This definitely slows the rate of growth down to an incredibly slow amount.
And also, the fact that Medicaid and Medicare, that's been disproven so many times. The Democrats have fought us--
GONZALEZ: No--
COLLINS: Yes, but--
BURCHETT: --have fought us every time we want to cut out waste, abuse and fraud. You have a healthy man who's drawing Medicaid check. That's wrong. That is--
GONZALEZ: Yes, that's definitely not the case.
COLLINS: OK.
BURCHETT: --very wrong. They need to be working.
COLLINS: But Congressman-- BURCHETT: And they need to work. And you all need to quit -- quit allowing that lie to be facilitated.
COLLINS: Congressman Burchett, on this--
GONZALEZ: The Congressional Budget Office--
COLLINS: --on this one--
GONZALEZ: --has made clear--
(CROSSTALK)
BURCHETT: The Congressional--
COLLINS: We talked about this. Yes, yes.
BURCHETT: Yes, let's talk about the Congressional Budget Office.
COLLINS: No, no. Congressman Burchett, I got a different question for you.
BURCHETT: 84 percent of the people in the health care department of the CBO--
COLLINS: Congressman Burchett--
BURCHETT: --are registered Democrats.
COLLINS: Yes, yes.
GONZALEZ: No.
COLLINS: We even talked about this almost every single night--
BURCHETT: 84 percent.
COLLINS: --as this bill has been debated.
BURCHETT: No, you don't.
COLLINS: Yes, we -- we truly just talked about--
(CROSSTALK)
BURCHETT: You know, you always -- it's not a debate when-- go ahead.
COLLINS: Congressman Burchett, can I ask you on this--
BURCHETT: Go ahead.
[21:30:00]
COLLINS: Can I ask you on this front? Thank you. The President said today that he thinks the reason Musk is so opposed to this bill, which he claimed that he had time to look at it, to review it, he could have spoken up sooner, basically, that it's because of the EV mandates. And that's also what we heard from House Speaker, Mike Johnson, that he's upset that the subsidies and the mandates are being taken away that benefit his companies.
But we have been hearing from Republicans, and the White House, for months now, that Elon Musk didn't have any conflicts of interest, that he was self-policing those, he wouldn't get involved in matters he shouldn't get involved in. And now we're being told, basically, he has a huge conflict of interest, by Republicans and White House officials.
BURCHETT: Well, that's up to the lawyers to decide. I'm not a fan of electric vehicles. I'm an oil-and-gas kind of guy. I mean, I like internal combustion engines. And right now -- right--
COLLINS: And you're on the Oversight Committee, sir.
BURCHETT: That is correct. But right now, around 3 to 4 percent of vehicles on the road are electric vehicles. So, it's a very small percentage. I'm more concerned about some other things. But yes, if there's a conflict of interest there, it needs to be addressed.
I still find it ironic, though, that the Democrats, up to this point, have gone the opposite side. And now, they're for Elon. But last week, they were against him. So, you can't have it both ways.
GONZALEZ: Yes.
BURCHETT: Are you with him? Are you against him? And that should have been the issue all along.
GONZALEZ: Yes, I don't know that Elon has made a lot of friends on our side of the aisle. But I could tell you that when he makes pointed comments, about this budget and this bill, and he's been doing it for a while, he's right on point. And it we -- he and I be may be agreeing on this ugly bill, for being ugly, for different reasons. It also shows that even the wealthiest man in the world benefits from government help.
And unfortunately, this bill hurts the poorest, hard-working people in America, and we need to be honest about it. And we should stop the lies about what this bill actually does.
It cuts $500 billion of Medicare from senior citizens. It cuts $400 billion of Medicaid. By the way, 92 percent of those people on Medicaid that are under 65 are employed. So, it's a bunch of malarkey, when they say, Oh, we have a bunch of unemployed people taking advantage of the system.
COLLINS: Yes.
GONZALEZ: That's just totally not true.
COLLINS: Well--
GONZALEZ: $300 billion of SNAP. We're going to take money -- we're going to take food from kids' lunch programs. We're going to take food from senior citizens that rely on Meals on Wheels. I mean, for God's sake, this is America.
COLLINS: Yes, we're waiting to see, of course, what the Senate does with the bill that the House passed, and it's now to them.
GONZALEZ: That's right.
COLLINS: Congressman Gonzalez and Burchett, thank you both for being here tonight.
GONZALEZ: Thank you.
BURCHETT: Thank you, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: When Elon Musk left the federal government, that was last Friday, he said it was going -- it was so he could go focus on his companies, including Tesla. But the Oval Office remarks today, and the tweet spree that followed from Elon Musk after, are now costing Musk billions. What's at stake for both of them, and for the United States, as these personal attacks are becoming very public.
[21:35:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Heartbreak may be one thing, but the financial cost of Elon Musk and President Trump's feud may be another.
According to Bloomberg, Musk's personal net worth plummeted $34 billion, just today. And take a look at Tesla's stock. By the time the markets closed on Wall Street, it tumbled more than 14 percent, erasing around a $150 billion off the company's market value. You can see the drop, right after Trump started speaking in the Oval, this morning.
Today's plunge ranks as the 11th worst day in Tesla's trading history. And with one of the most powerful alliances in tatters tonight, President Trump is now threatening to terminate billions of dollars in government subsidies and contracts with Elon's companies.
My sources tonight are:
CNN's chief data guru, Harry Enten.
And CNN's Senior Legal Analyst, Elie Honig.
Harry, I think the question is, if Trump does try to pull these contracts, what does that mean for Elon Musk? We don't know that he's going to follow through. But what does it mean if he does?
HARRY ENTEN, CNN CHIEF DATA ANALYST: I mean, all I know is that this is the greatest story that's hit the front pages, at least in the last few months. It just blows my mind. It's so unbelievable.
But in terms of money, in terms of contracts, let's talk about it, and we'll say, it's billions. We know it could be billions. What are we talking about? Well, we can talk about SpaceX, right? What do we know from 2024 in SpaceX? We know that in 2024, $3.8 billion, $3.8 billion government contracts with SpaceX. We're talking what is 344 government contracts.
Let's talk about, right now, the ongoing contracts with the government. And this, I think, is actually an underestimation. But we're talking about, get this, a $11.8 billion. So this is, yes, it's a love story that has broken apart, but it's also a fiscal story as well, and this breakup could cost Elon Musk and his companies a lot of dough-re-mi.
COLLINS: The question that someone asked me today, Elie, and that I'm curious for your take on, is legally, if Trump wanted to, can he just terminate these contracts?
ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST, FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NY: It's--
COLLINS: Does he have the power to do that?
HONIG: It's much harder than you would think. It's not just like flipping on or off the light switch.
So, most federal contracts, like these, with Elon Musk's companies, do give the federal government pretty broad discretion to cut them off, even midstream. However, the reason for terminating the contract cannot be a bad-faith reason, cannot be, what lawyers call, arbitrary and capricious. Meaning, it cannot be based on politics. It cannot be based on personal beefs like this. It cannot be just something sort of out of the blue.
[21:40:00]
So if Donald Trump was to terminate these contracts, Elon Musk could absolutely take him to court. And here's why Donald Trump's hurting his own case today. Because Elon Musk would have to show there's bad faith. What do you do? Just go to Donald Trump's social media feeds, tonight. I mean, he's saying what the bad faith is. He's saying, I'm going to do this to get retribution at you, because you've irritated me, personally and politically. So--
COLLINS: Well, is there no clause if they accuse you of being in Jeffrey Epstein's files--
HONIG: Right.
COLLINS: --you know, in light of that.
HONIG: That would be an interesting counter-defense, for sure. But I mean, if there ever is such a lawsuit, all these tweets, social media posts that are going out today, these are all going to end up in evidence.
COLLINS: I mean, if you're a Tesla shareholder, you have been watching -- if you're a shareholder of any of the companies, you've been watching the last few months, and you're like, OK, come back to work, Elon Musk. ENTEN: Yes.
COLLINS: And now they're seeing, a few days outside of the federal government, what's happening here.
ENTEN: Yes. I mean, look, this is just insanity, is what it is, right? It seems you're looking Elon Musk, Tesla stock up and down and all the way around. But I think this is also something that we should talk about, just in terms of the political -- possible political ramifications, right?
What are we saying? If Elon Musk all of a sudden decides to turn his fire on the Republican Party, what does that mean? I mean, you go back to the 2023-2024 cycle. Elon Musk was the number one spender. He was the number one spender. What are we talking about? We're talking about what, $291 million freaking dollars? I mean, nobody else was even close. Tim Mellon was number two, and he didn't even make $200 million.
COLLINS: And what did -- Musk tweeted today, Trump has three and a half years left in office, I have 40 more years alive on this planet. Basically saying, Choose carefully, to Republicans.
ENTEN: Choose carefully. Because look, Donald Trump is one thing. But Mike Johnson, John Thune, all those senators, all those House members, if Elon Musk decides to turn his fire on them, all I can say is, Good luck this primary season.
HONIG: There's actually financial risk for Elon Musk as well, though. Because he said, at some point, today, Well, I'm going to just order all the work stopped on all these contracts. Right? If he does that, that's a risk to him. That's no different than if the federal government contracted with an engineer to build a bridge, and they stopped halfway through. You could be sued for damages.
And the other thing that could happen here, and this does happen sometimes, there could be a shareholder lawsuit within Elon Musk's companies. Basically, shareholders can argue that one of the people in management has basically turned his back on the company, is not doing, what we call, his fiduciary duty, to take care of the company and its shareholders.
So, this isn't all just fun and games from Elon -- I know he's got plenty of money, but it could cost him as well on the bottom line.
COLLINS: Elie Honig. Harry Enten.
HONIG: Yes.
COLLINS: Legal advice. Data advice. What we all need tonight.
ENTEN: We need love advice as well, based upon this relationship, right now.
COLLINS: OK. We'll get back to that in the commercial break. There is a big question tonight about how Democrats are feeling about what's happening with Elon Musk. They've spent months, attacking him. Now what? My next source tonight is Democratic senator, Andy Kim. We'll find out.
[21:45:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: The enemy of my enemy is my friend, as the old saying goes. But while Democrats spent the day celebrating Elon Musk's dramatic turn against President Trump, tweeting popcorn emojis, the ultimate breakup playlist on Spotify, and AI-generated SummerSlam posters, Democratic senator, John Fetterman, had this to say about his fellow Democrats taking a victory lap.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN FETTERMAN (D-PA): The Dems, we've been dumping all over Musk, and vandalizing Teslas, or whatever. And now, suddenly, now we might -- might be more back into him and thing. It's just like, you know, he's right about the big, beautiful bill.
We have to decide, you know, where are we thinking about him?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My source tonight is Democratic senator, Andy Kim of New Jersey.
And it's great to have you here, sir.
When you hear what Senator Fetterman said there, where do Democrats stand on Elon Musk tonight?
SEN. ANDY KIM (D-NJ): Well, first, we have to take stock of what's actually happened on the Republican side. And what we saw at the last election, the Republican Party became a big-tent party. And now, they're seeing the challenges of that coalition unraveling, which is what we're seeing right before.
And it's not just Trump and Musk. You're seeing that with Trump and Amy Coney Barrett, with the Federalist Society, on so many different fronts. So, what I see happening today, yes, you know, there's an entertainment value in the same way that I see this unfolding, like I see my 7-year-old and my 9-year-old boys fighting with one another. But this shows a deeper unraveling that's happening on the Republican side.
Then the question of what happens on the Democrats' side? I mean, look, the first and foremost is we can take stock of what's happening, look at the feud that is unfolding. But we have to pivot back to the real damage that is being done.
We cannot get distracted by this sideshow of two billionaires duking it out, when this legislation is going to do real damage. I mean, 16 million Americans can lose their health care. That's where we need to focus on. That's where we need to get on board with.
And while Musk certainly is going to draw attention to this, and put pressure on the Republican Party, we cannot lose our message of the damage that will be done to the American people with this legislation.
COLLINS: So, when someone like Ro Khanna says to Politico, We should ultimately be trying to convince Musk that the Democratic Party has more of the values that he agrees with. Do you think that is an effort that is worth Democrats' time?
KIM: I mean, look, I don't know Elon Musk. I've never had a chance to meet him. If Ro Khanna and others have a relationship, I don't mind them talking to him. But what I would say is that's not going to be the magic key, the silver bullet on what's going forward.
What we need to do is reach out to working-class families, to the families that we know are the ones, the communities we know are the ones, that we need to earn the vote back from. I think that that's really the key.
[21:50:00]
And I'm a Democrat that won a congressional seat, that Trump won twice. We've seen just exactly what we need to do. And what we need to do is to mobilize the people, in this country, to recognize that not only is this bill bad for the American people, in gutting Medicaid and SNAP benefits, for food assistance, but it's also something that is giving the wealthiest Americans a massive tax cut, a tax break.
That's the kind of connection we need to make, and that's the kind of effort we're going to have to build, for us to be able to win the midterms, and ultimately White House back. It's not going to be through Elon Musk.
COLLINS: Yes. Well, it seems like -- we'll see how it impacts the bill, and whether or not it stops the Senate Republicans from allowing it to pass.
But on what's happening also at the Senate. We've been talking about whether or not the Senate is going to sanction Russia over what's happening. Last night, we heard from a Republican senator, who seemed to say they were waiting on the White House to make any moves there.
But we are seeing Russia tonight, just in the last few hours, launch an aerial assault on Kyiv. We're still waiting to see what the results of that are, what that looks like. The Air Force says that Russian bombers are believed to have launched cruise missiles.
You mentioned your sons fighting earlier, likening that to what Musk and Trump are doing. But Trump today, in the Oval Office, likened Russia and Ukraine to two kids fighting, saying, Sometimes it's better to let them continue fighting than to pull them off of one another immediately. What do you make of where this stands tonight?
KIM: Well, those comments are disgusting, honestly, to try to compare an invasion of a sovereign nation, as if it's just two toddlers bickering and arguing. That's absolutely wrong.
I mean, the Ukrainian people are fighting for their lives. Just -- I was always so hit by, you know, that older Ukrainian men were joining up early on to be able to take up arms, to try to prevent the younger men from having to risk their lives, just because they know how much generational harm is being done.
I just met with Zelenskyy's office, and some of his top advisers, the other day, at the Capitol. They were talking about hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian children kidnapped and taken by the Russians. I mean, this is an absolute travesty. And for Trump to constantly just downplay this, and just continuing to give in to Putin. I really hope that he changes course on this and really shows what is at stake here.
And the problem is, is that, as we saw with everything today, on your show, you know, Trump is distracted. Trump is just focused in on these political battles, and we knew that that's what it's going to be about. His whole campaign was about the enemy from within, losing focus on the threat from Russia, losing focus on the competition with China.
And I think that that's ultimately what I hope the American people see, is we have a child in the Oval Office that is distracted, getting caught up in personal feuds, and it's allowing these dictators, and these authoritarian leaders to run the tables. I talked with a foreign minister--
COLLINS: Yes, Senator--
KIM: --of another country today, and he just said that we're a laughing stock, that the United States is a laughing stock, and I just find that stuff -- to be just absolutely ridiculous.
COLLINS: Senator Andy Kim, thank you for joining us tonight.
KIM: Thank you.
COLLINS: Remember this moment?
(VIDEO - AI-GENERATED VIDEO FEATURING ELON MUSK AND PRESIDENT TRUMP DANCING)
COLLINS: It's a strange but AI-generated video. It was posted on X during maybe the better days for Trump and Musk's relationship, just one of the many moments that now seems so far away.
[21:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: It took Elon Musk just over 300 days, to go from endorsing Donald Trump, to calling for his impeachment, a remarkable turnaround in their relationship, especially when you look back at a few key moments along the way.
Like, on January 20th, when the billionaire was given a prime spot at Trump's inauguration, seated closest to the President, among the other tech giants who were in attendance. The two then shared a moment, as Trump gave a nod to Musk in his inaugural speech, promising to send Americans to Mars, a top priority for him.
The President and his Special Government Employee also later sat for a joint interview, something you don't often see, rarely even see it with someone like the Vice President, that people described as a love fest.
And in what would be Musk's last Cabinet meeting, he joked about the many hats that he wore within the Trump administration, and even appeared emotional when the President bid him farewell. Little did we realize, that was the beginning of the end, just a few days ago.
Also tonight, here at CNN, in this week's new episode of "Searching for Spain," Eva Longoria breaks bread with her ancestors in the town of Longoria. Here's a preview.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
EVA LONGORIA, AMERICAN ACTRESS AND FILM PRODUCER (on camera): So today, I am visiting my town, literally my town, the town of Longoria.
LONGORIA (voice-over): And the crazy thing is, I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for my ancestor, Lorenzo, who was just 11-years-old, when he left his family behind to travel to the Americas.
The Longoria lands stretch three miles along the Narcea River Valley, and I'm headed to Casa de Longoria, just outside the town of Longoria. Incredibly, some of the Longoria families still live here, a 11 generations later.
[22:00:00]
LONGORIA (on camera): I get to visit long-lost family, share stories, share history, and, of course, share food.
Hola, familia.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hola.
LONGORIA (on camera): Hola.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hola.
LONGORIA (on camera): (FOREIGN LANGUAGE).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (FOREIGN LANGUAGE).
LONGORIA (voice-over): Luis (ph) and his mother, Marife (ph) are descendants of the family Lorenzo left behind.
LONGORIA (on camera): Wow. (FOREIGN LANGUAGE).
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COLLINS: That new episode of "Eva Longoria: Searching for Spain" airs, this Sunday, 09:00 p.m. Eastern and Pacific, only here on CNN.
Thanks so much for joining us.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" is up next.
