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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump, Facing Massive GOP Revolt, Reverses On Epstein Files; Sen. Warren Calls On Harvard To Sever Ties With Larry Summers; Glen Powell Brings His UPS Driver On SNL Stage After Waiting Four Years To Host Show. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired November 17, 2025 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I will say, the Department of Homeland Security has sent out a release, Anderson, this evening, that said, of the 130 undocumented people they arrested, over the weekend, they said 44 of them had criminal records, that included assault and driving under the influence. They also said that two of the members, people they arrested, were known gang members, Anderson.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: All right. Dianne Gallagher, thanks very much.
That's it for us. The news continues. I'll see you, tomorrow. "THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS" starts now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST: Tonight. Inside President Trump's reversal on the Epstein files, ahead of a vote tomorrow that looks like it could now end up being a Republican landslide.
I'm Kaitlan Collins. And this is THE SOURCE.
Tonight, on the eve of a vote that President Trump tried and failed to stop, he appears to have accepted the inevitable. The President is not only giving House Republicans his blessing to vote, yes, tomorrow, which would force the release of the Justice Department's Epstein files, ultimately. But the President also said he would sign it, if it reaches his desk.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: They could do whatever they want. We'll give them everything.
REPORTER: You would sign it, if it comes to your desk?
TRUMP: Sure I would. Let the -- let the Senate look at it. Let anybody look at it. But don't talk about it too much, because, honestly, I don't want to take it away from us.
It's really a Democrat problem. The Democrats were Epstein's friends, all of them. And it's a hoax. The whole thing is a hoax.
(END VIDEO CLIP) COLLINS: This is a full-180, from five days ago, when the White House went to extraordinary lengths to stop this vote from ever happening, even summoning a House Republican to the Situation Room, in a failed attempt, to convince her to take her name off this petition.
Republican leadership was then left with no choice but to schedule a vote, in the House, where Republicans, for the first time since Trump retook office, were prepared to defy him, in large numbers.
Now, backed into a corner and powerless to stop this from passing, the President is retreating in a rare moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Here's what I want. We have nothing to do with Epstein. The Democrats do. All of his friends were Democrats. You look at this Reid Hoffman, you look at Larry Summers, Bill Clinton, they went to his island all the time, and many others, all Democrats.
We've already given, I believe the number is, 50,000 pages. 50,000 pages. And it's just a Russia, Russia, Russia hoax, as it pertains to the Republicans.
Now, I believe that many of the people that we -- some of the people that we mentioned, are being looked at very seriously, for their relationship to Jeffrey Epstein. But they were with him all the time. I wasn't. I wasn't at all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: And none of the people there have been mentioned -- that the President mentioned have been accused of doing anything wrong. They've each put out their own statements, regarding Jeffrey Epstein. And neither has the President, for that matter. His own friendship with Epstein in the 90s and the early 2000s is well-documented.
Here they are, in 1992, together at a party, at his Mar-a-Lago Club in South Florida.
Then, in 1993, Epstein was a guest at the President's wedding to Marla Maples at The Plaza Hotel.
There's flight logs that show Trump traveled on Epstein's jet, four times, in 1993, twice in 1994, again in 1995, and then in 1997.
Here are the two of them, chatting in 1999, before that Victoria's Secret Fashion Show, in New York.
Then, in 2002, the President told New York Magazine, obviously, long before he took office, that he had known Epstein for 15 years, and he called him a terrific guy.
He also said that Epstein is, quote, "A lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side." Several years later, the President and Epstein had a falling out when Trump says he threw Epstein out of his club because he, quote, Stole young women who were working for him at his spa.
And during a legal deposition in 2010, Jeffrey Epstein confirmed, what the images that I just showed you reveal, that despite what the President is now claiming, before that falling out, he and Epstein had socialized for years.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you ever had a personal relationship with Donald Trump?
JEFFREY EPSTEIN, AMERICAN FINANCIER AND CHILD SEX OFFENDER: What do you mean by personal relationships?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you socialized with him?
EPSTEIN: Yes, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes?
EPSTEIN: Yes, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you ever socialized with Donald Trump in the presence of females under the age of 18?
EPSTEIN: Though I'd like to answer that question, at least today, I'm going to have to assert my 5th, 6th and 14th Amendment rights, sir.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:05:00]
COLLINS: None of this, of course, is evidence that Trump did anything wrong, nor does it suggest that he was involved in Jeffrey Epstein's crimes. It does, however, showcase their own association, as he is directing his Justice Department now, to investigate the Democrats who were named in those new Epstein emails.
Meanwhile, tonight, here in Washington, the House Republican who's been leading this push, to release all of these files, that's Congressman Thomas Massie of Kentucky, he's predicting that tomorrow's vote that is going to come to the House floor, is going to be overwhelming. That would put enormous pressure, on Senate Republicans, to then also bring it for a vote there, and ultimately send it to the White House for the President's signature.
As Massie has some thoughts about the President's sudden reversal.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. THOMAS MASSIE (R-KY): Well, he got tired of me winning, so he joined our side. I have no animosity toward him. I regret that it got personal for some folks, but it never has for me. It's always been about the survivors.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you optimistic this will pass tomorrow?
MASSIE: Yes, I think it's going to pass. I think it -- I think it's going to pass with a veto-proof majority.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: My lead source tonight is the top Democrat on the House Oversight Committee, which is leading the Jeffrey Epstein investigation on Capitol Hill. Congressman Robert Garcia of California is here.
And thank you for your time and for being here.
Do you agree with Thomas Massie that everyone in the House is going to vote for this tomorrow?
REP. ROBERT GARCIA (D-CA): I think it's going to be overwhelming. There's no question.
Look, we were going to actually win the vote, regardless of what Donald Trump's position was. He obviously flip-flopped from his position. It was already going to pass. I had heard from dozens of Republicans who were going to vote for it and defy Trump. But now, with this kind of reversal that he's done, I think it'll be -- it'll be a vast majority, if not all, Republicans will vote for it.
COLLINS: Why do you think he reversed his position after initially fighting this?
GARCIA: Well, it's clear. I mean, he was panicking. I mean, this is someone that spent the entire campaign, it's going to be -- release the files. Then he gets into office. Pam Bondi says they're on her desk. Then he completely changes position, and does everything he can from stopping their release, including what he did last week.
But he saw it was going to happen. He was going to have a major defection from his own party. His base has been in turmoil. He knows that he was going to be essentially called out by his own party. So, he chose to flip-flop.
COLLINS: You said you think it will be overwhelming. Do you think it will be unanimous, tomorrow?
GARCIA: I think it could be an unanimous. I think it absolutely could be unanimous.
COLLINS: Because we've seen some Republicans, including one who said he was a hell no on this. Today, after the President, of course, gave them his blessing, Troy Nehls was saying he's going to vote yes, on it.
GARCIA: And they all should vote yes. And the Senate should vote yes as well. But what people need to remember, at this moment, is that there's already a subpoena in place that compels the DOJ to release all the files to the Congress. That's been in place since August. The DOJ has done little to nothing to get those files out.
The President, right now, today, has the power to release the files. He doesn't even need a vote from Congress. We're having to take these votes, put in place the subpoenas, because the President is leading with Pam Bondi, a White House coverup of the files. He should release the files, right now, and bring justice to the survivors.
COLLINS: How many Republicans do you think need to vote for this, tomorrow, in the House, to pressure Republicans in the Senate to vote -- to actually bring it for a vote?
GARCIA: Our initial goal was to get 100 Republicans. That's something that we talked about early on. I thought we would--
COLLINS: You thought that would be enough?
GARCIA: I thought that would be enough then, before the President's position. And I think it would be enough now. We're going to get -- I think, almost all the caucus would vote for it.
COLLINS: So, if that happens, and if the Senate does take it up, which we're seeing more senators, people like Tommy Tuberville saying that they would -- that they believe it should come for a vote. The President said he'll sign it.
Then what? Do you think that the DOJ would release everything? Or do you think -- I mean, there seems to be parts of the language, like in the resolution, that says, The Attorney General may withhold or redact segregable portions of records that would jeopardize an active federal investigation.
I mean, if they're investigating the Democrats that the President directed Pam Bondi to investigate, do you think that would cause them to withhold some of the documents?
GARCIA: I think that's very concerning, and that's what something that we're actually monitoring.
So, two things. One is the President, right now, has the power to release the files without an act of Congress. So, he should do so. The second piece is, this investigation he just launched, which, quite frankly, is pretty -- is bogus, the person that appeared more times in the files, from the last batch, was actually Donald Trump. More than any of the other names that he's mentioned.
COLLINS: More than Bill Clinton or Larry Summers--
GARCIA: By--
COLLINS: --or any of them?
GARCIA: By far, his name in this last batch within -- they're over 1,600 times in the 23,000 pages. And so, he wants to investigate anyone, it should be himself, his own administration.
And so, right now, he's putting this investigation together, and we're very concerned he's going to use it as an excuse to not release the full files.
COLLINS: Do you think that you'll get more emails, your committee, from Jeffrey Epstein's estate to release, like your committee did last week?
GARCIA: Yes. So, two things. All the emails that we've been releasing have been from the Epstein estate, not the Department of Justice.
COLLINS: Because you subpoenaed the Jeffrey Epstein estate.
GARCIA: Because we subpoenaed those, and we're--
COLLINS: Bipartisan.
[21:10:00]
GARCIA: Yes. And we're working -- and we're working hard. We're fighting to ensure that those documents are released.
And by the way, Republicans have tried to stall every single time to get more documents. They've not wanted to release them. We have -- we're working with the Epstein estate. We expect even more documents to come out from the Epstein estate.
But we also know that what the DOJ has is enormous. It is dramatically more documents, photos, possibly videos, that the Epstein estate does not have. And so, that's what we need. And Pam Bondi should release those files now.
COLLINS: The President has been in a huge feud with someone who typically was a huge ally of his, Marjorie Taylor Greene. Part of what she's criticized him for, which there's other things, but is the handling of the Epstein files that she believed this should come for a vote. She was one of those Republicans who put her name on this, to get it to 218 in the first place.
When he calls her a traitor? I understand the two of you don't agree politically or maybe on anything. Do you see her as a traitor?
GARCIA: No, I think she's doing the right thing.
Look, I -- look, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Nancy Mace, these are folks that I rarely agree with. They're on my Oversight Committee, on our committee together. But I do admire the courage, at this moment, that they're showing for their party, and certainly, the respect that they're showing to the survivors. And it's important for them to have stood up to the President. I think they're a good example, at this moment, of how to actually stand for survivors versus what Mike Johnson and the vast majority of that party has done.
We have been saying from day one, and I think Marjorie understands this, we don't care who's in the files. The President keeps naming Democrats. We don't care if there's Democrats, if there're Republicans, how powerful they are, how much money they have. If you've caused harm to children, to girls, to women? You should be exposed, and there should be justice.
COLLINS: Congressman Robert Garcia, ranking Democrat on House Oversight, thank you for joining us tonight.
GARCIA: Thank you.
COLLINS: And speaking of House Speaker, Mike Johnson. He is signaling tonight that despite fighting this vote, and bringing it to the floor, and calling it a moot point, he says he now may vote yes, tomorrow, on this, if his concerns about the bill are addressed
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): He's never had anything to hide. He and I had the same concern that we wanted to ensure that victims of these heinous crimes are completely protected from disclosure, those who don't want their names to be out there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: That is the Speaker's new stance.
Many of the women, though, who survived Jeffrey Epstein's abuse, have been among the loudest voices calling for these files to be released. In a new video message, there's a group of them, and they are urging lawmakers, on Capitol Hill, ahead of that vote tomorrow, to vote, yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was 14-years-old.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was 16-years-old.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was 16.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 17.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 14-years-old.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This was me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When I met Jeffrey Epstein.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is me, when I met Jeffrey Epstein.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are about a 1,000 of us.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's time to bring the secrets out of the shadows. It's time to shine a light into the darkness. (END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: And one of those women joins me now. Annie Farmer was 16- years-old when, she says, Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell sexually abused her.
And Annie, we've had you on a few times. Thank you for being here, again tonight. It's great to have you.
When that message came out, why was that so important for you to release that, ahead of tomorrow's vote?
ANNIE FARMER, JEFFREY EPSTEIN ABUSE SURVIVOR: I think it just really centers, again, what this story is all about, which is the experience of girls and young women. And I think having those images of us, at the ages when these crimes occurred, really helps people remember that.
COLLINS: And do you think -- I mean, it feels like so often, that gets lost in this conversation, here in Washington, that we've had for the past few months, where it becomes about politics or grievances against one another. When really, what is at the heart of this, is what you and many other girls had to go through, at the time.
FARMER: Yes, exactly. And I think it is -- it's very frustrating for many of us, that it does so often get politicized. But I think, finally, the stories are breaking through, and people are recognizing that. And we're feeling such a groundswell of support because of that.
COLLINS: And what are you hoping for tomorrow? Are you hoping that every lawmaker votes yes, on this?
FARMER: I really am. I mean, again, it makes me think about our last conversation. We were talking about what's likely, and then what happens? Right? And so often--
COLLINS: Can I play that moment?
FARMER: Oh, sure.
COLLINS: Because, I agree. When you said that last week, I just, I couldn't stop thinking about it. And we were talking about, do you actually think this is going to go anywhere, is it going to get stuck and held up in the Senate, which, last week, seemed to be the case.
And to your point, this is what you said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FARMER: I feel like it's important to note that so many things that are unlikely have happened, when it comes to this case.
It was very unlikely that we -- that we would get the signatures we needed for this discharge petition. And here we are. We have them. Right?
[21:15:00]
It was very unlikely that Andrew would no longer be a prince. And that's happened.
And I think, for years, people said, it was unlikely that anyone would care or know about the crimes of Epstein and his co-conspirators. And people clearly do. So, I just, I really believe that we -- that there -- that people are going to demand that this move forward, and I think it's very likely it will happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I mean, to look back on that, I mean, you're even being proven right, just a few days later.
FARMER: It is actually surreal how quickly this has unfolded and changed.
But it makes me a little emotional to think about that, because of -- really, there are so many people, and I'm thinking specifically, right now, about my sister, Maria Farmer, who was a whistleblower, in 1996, and pushed, for so long, to try and get transparency in this case, and Virginia Giuffre, who so bravely spoke out when there were so many people speaking against her and so much backlash.
And so, I just -- I'm thinking about them a lot, right now, as we're on the precipice of something, I think, really powerful tomorrow.
COLLINS: Yes, how are you going to feel tomorrow, when this vote is open?
FARMER: I mean, I think there'll be a big sigh of relief. I think there will be a sense -- I mean, there's been so much momentum. And I just, I think, we are not naive to the political process. Those of us who have been involved in this, for some time, recognize there have been a lot of betrayals. So, I think what we really want to see is follow-through.
We know there is still a longer road ahead. As Congressman Garcia said, it doesn't have to be that way. These files could be released right now. But if we -- if the path continues, as we're expecting, we will have to bring this to the Senate. It will be moving there, next. And we're ready to push forward there. And I think we feel optimistic about our chances.
COLLINS: You think you'll lobby senators and say, Hey, we want you guys to pass this?
FARMER: Yes.
COLLINS: To vote on this?
FARMER: Yes. Those conversations are beginning.
COLLINS: The President framed it today, as saying, I told House Republicans they should just vote for it. I don't want it to distract from my other achievements, like I want this to get over with, basically.
If you could say something to the President tonight, about why you think he should sign this, what would you say?
FARMER: I'd say, It sounds like we're on the same page. We also want to move on and get past this. And the best way to do that, the best way to distinguish what you're calling a hoax, from the truth of this case, is the same as it's always been. To release the actual facts of the case. And I think you have everything to do that, right now. So, please move forward efficiently, and do so.
COLLINS: Annie Farmer, thank you for joining us tonight. And, as we've had you so many times, it's really great to have your voice, and your perspective, in this.
FARMER: I appreciate it. Thank you for having me.
COLLINS: So, thank you so much. And for your sister as well, of course.
And up next. As I mentioned, Marjorie Taylor Greene there, and what's going on. It was an alliance that went from good to bad. It has now turned to downright ugly. As the President is accusing one of his top supporters of being a traitor. She's responding that his attacks are a dog whistle that have led to death threats and put her family in danger.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I don't think her life is in danger. I don't think, frankly, I don't think anybody cares about her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: This also comes as the case against James Comey seems to be in huge trouble tonight, because the judge just tore into prosecutors, over potential misconduct, and making what the judge himself said is an extraordinary order.
Also, later tonight, there's an SNL surprise that has so many people talking as Mitch, the UPS guy is going to join me live tonight.
[21:20:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Tonight, Democratic senator, Elizabeth Warren, a former Harvard professor herself, is calling on the school to cut ties with the former University President, and current faculty member, Larry Summers. That's because Senator Warren says that Summers cannot be trusted, that's her quote, after new details emerged, regarding his close relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. All of this revealed in last week's release of Epstein's private emails.
Larry Summers served as Bill Clinton's Treasury Secretary and in Barack Obama's administration. He was the Director of the National Economic Council.
These new emails revealed comments that Summers made, as he also sought out dating advice from Jeffrey Epstein. That includes the morning of March 17th, 2019, see these emails here, where Summers and Epstein were exchanging multiple emails, debating Summers and whether or not he should send a note to a romantic interest.
Epstein argued to Summers that it would be, quote, "BAD FORM."
Summers wrote back, quote, "Why bad form. Supposed to be face to face?"
To which Epstein replied, "You care very much for this person. You might want to demonstrate that. a note does the very opposite."
Now, the reason that exchange is notable that we're pointing it out, is because of when it happened. It was just four months before that exchange that the Miami Herald had published an exhaustive investigation, detailing Jeffrey Epstein's abuse of underage girls.
They continued to communicate, though, for the next several months. That includes on July, 5th, 2019, when Larry Summers sent Jeffrey Epstein an update from his vacation on Cape Cod. The next day, July 6th, 2019, is when Jeffrey Epstein was arrested for sex trafficking crimes.
Now tonight, Larry Summers told CNN in a statement that he is going to continue to teach at Harvard, but he will be stepping back from his other public commitments, saying, in a statement that he takes full responsibility for the misguided decision to continue communicating with Mr. Epstein.
My political sources tonight are:
Democratic strategist, Alencia Johnson.
And Republican strategist, David Urban.
[21:25:00]
And obviously, it's worth noting, Alencia, that Senator Warren and Larry Summers have clashed, before in the past, over policy issues and whatnot. But her saying, this is someone who is very involved in Democratic politics, was reportedly going to be very involved in them doing a version of Project 2025, for Democrats. She's saying that the school needs to cut ties with him entirely. Do you agree with her?
ALENCIA JOHNSON, SENIOR ADVISER, BIDEN 2020 CAMPAIGN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I absolutely do agree with her. And not just because I worked for her in her presidential primary. But because, as you explain the timing of this. It's one thing if Larry Summers was communicating with Jeffrey Epstein, before the big investigation from the Miami Herald.
But it's another -- and he said he didn't know about it, because there have been instances of that, right? Someone is charged for an egregious crime, and people around him don't know anything about it.
But this was very public. It was all over our national news. People in politics were paying attention to it, and deep-diving because of his ties to a lot of political figures. And so, it is problematic that he remained in contact with him. And we don't see any evidence of him even acknowledging, how wrong Jeffrey Epstein was.
And so, I agree with Senator Warren, because if we think about his involvement, not only in Democratic policies -- politics, he is also a teacher at Harvard, and those are -- there are probably young women in his class. And I would be concerned about, whether or not he has the integrity to continue to be in those positions.
I'm not going to sit here and say he's -- anything is going to happen to his students. But it is concerning that you would be OK with someone who has these accusations, and you still continue to be involved in a teaching capacity.
COLLINS: So you think what he's doing tonight doesn't go far enough, because he says he is still going to be teaching?
A. JOHNSON: I don't think it goes far enough. I don't -- and I don't think we should continue to award -- reward bad behavior, or even when you're turning a -- trying to turn a blind eye to maintain a position of power.
COLLINS: Yes.
And David Urban, this all comes, as we're seeing the ramifications of these emails far and wide.
I mean, obviously, Stacey Plaskett, another Democrat, was also texting with Jeffrey Epstein, during the Michael Cohen hearing, apparently. Her spokesperson for her confirmed that she was getting text messages from him, that influenced her questioning, it appears.
But David, this is also coming, as for Republicans, for your party, there is a huge breakup underway, between Donald Trump and Marjorie Taylor Greene. In part, she's criticized how they've handled the Jeffrey Epstein saga, and this entire back-and-forth over the discharge petition. She was one of those four votes that came out, initially, and voted for this.
When the President's saying that she's a traitor, and Marjorie Traitor Greene, as he called her, what do you make of that? Do you think that's all right? Or do you think that's too far?
DAVID URBAN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST, FORMER TRUMP CAMPAIGN ADVISER: Yes -- yes, it's too far, I mean.
So, let me just say this. I don't think I've ever said these words before. I agree with Senator Warren, right? Like, I agree with Senator Warren, and Alencia.
I think that Larry Summers has to go. That not only was it his judgment very bad there, but it was a young woman who was a mentee, he was -- he was texting or emailing back and forth with Epstein about. And moreover, her father was a member of the Chinese Communist Party. So, most likely, he was getting played as an asset during this whole thing. So, it's only the tip of the iceberg with the Larry Summers issue.
But yes, look Marjorie Taylor Greene, like her, don't like her, love her, hate her? She campaigned for Donald Trump, when very few people were. She was out there burning -- you know, burning and churning when, you know, after January 6, when Donald Trump was a lonely soldier, she was a soldier, foot soldier, in the Trump war, fighting for him every step of -- every step in every way. So, I think it's a little harsh for him to say what he did about her.
Look, I don't necessarily agree with her all the time. On this vote, I think, bad news doesn't get better with age. If either White House had released it a long, long time ago, and moved on quickly to something different. It's a bad PR move, it seems to me. I'm not quite sure--
COLLINS: Yes, David--
URBAN: --who or what they're trying to protect. But it's never getting better.
COLLINS: Well, that's what -- I mean, I was talking to people, who are allies of Trump's and White House officials, who were saying, They kind of did this to themselves, because they could have just come out and supported this from the beginning, instead of -- I mean, they brought Lauren Boebert into this Situation Room, to try to get her to change her mind, last week.
So it's not like they really get a lot of credit for this passing. I mean, it passed despite their efforts. Not because of them.
URBAN: Yes, listen, I consider myself a huge supporter of the President's from, you know, I can tell you, in 2016, when I signed up to support Donald Trump, you could fit everybody in a room, in a tiny room, that was supporting Donald Trump.
And so, I just think this was -- this was mishandled from the get-go. I'm not quite sure why. Just get the information out. People campaigned on it. The President campaigned on it. Others did as well.
[21:30:00]
That, you know, the President and Republicans feel that they were, you know, that for too long, the mighty and powerful have been protected in this country. And this President campaigned on making sure there was equal and fair justice for everybody, the rich as well as the poor. And this feels a little counter to that. It feels like that someone's being protected that might not be worthy of that protection, as you see in these Larry Summers emails.
COLLINS: Yes.
And Alencia, I mean, just seeing this. Mike Johnson was asked about this, the calling her a traitor. It is something that was unfathomable. I mean, after January 6th, there were very few Republicans who still vocally supported the President, publicly. Marjorie Taylor Greene was one of them.
A. JOHNSON: Yes.
COLLINS: And so, to see this split has even shocked a lot of people inside their orbit.
A. JOHNSON: Listen, I am all about people redeeming themselves and changing their opinion. But I believe in, as the Good Book says, you judge a person by their fruit.
And so, we have to see how Marjorie Taylor Greene continues to move forward, and also if she atones for a lot of the egregious things that not only she said, but supported, like January 6, and some of the things that she didn't hold Donald Trump accountable for.
And so, we have to see where she continues to be on this path. Because she's talking a great game, right now. But who knows what's going to happen, when something else happens that comes out of this White House?
COLLINS: Yes. Dana Bash had a really good interview with her, on Sunday, and brought up some of her past statements--
URBAN: Yes.
COLLINS: --and whatnot, and she did ask for -- or said that she regretted some of those things.
Alencia, stand by. David, as well.
URBAN: She went on the -- she went on "The View." She went on "The View."
A. JOHNSON: She--
URBAN: How much better can she like -- pleading for forgiveness?
A. JOHNSON: Listen, we got to continue to see more of this from Marjorie Taylor Greene, because some of the things that she has done and said has, quite frankly, harmed a lot of people. And so, we'll see. Judge a person by their fruits.
COLLINS: All right, both of you stand by, because we're going to bring you back, because we love what you're saying so much.
But up next. We have to talk about what happened today inside a courtroom, because a federal judge said that they thought this was a disturbing pattern of profound investigative missteps. That is not something you ever want to hear from the bench.
As a judge is now raising the possibility that Trump's handpicked U.S. Attorney, Lindsey Halligan, might have botched that grand jury proceeding in the James Comey case, and it could be permanently tainted. [21:35:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Tonight, mistakes and possible misconduct by Trump's handpicked U.S. Attorney, Lindsey Halligan, could derail that case against James Comey.
That's according to a judge who went scorched-earth today, on the Justice Department's handling of the years-old evidence in its case, against the former FBI Director, with the judge writing in an opinion, quote, "The record points to a disturbing pattern of profound investigative missteps, missteps that led an FBI agent and a prosecutor to potentially undermine the integrity of the grand jury proceeding."
Now, let's remember how we got here. Halligan, of course, is someone who was a personal attorney to Donald Trump before he won the election. She had no previous prosecutorial experience. After working at the White House for a little bit in his second term, she was then put in this role, after President Trump fired her predecessor, Erik Siebert, for not charging James Comey, or the New York Attorney General, Letitia James.
My legal source tonight is Brendan Ballou, the former Special Counsel at the Justice Department's Antitrust Division.
And I mean, to hear a judge saying this. I mean, is this unheard of that now there's even this idea they might give grand jury materials to James Comey's team?
BRENDAN BALLOU, FORMER SPECIAL COUNSEL, DOJ ANTITRUST DIVISION: It's really rare.
And reading that opinion, for a practicing lawyer, it would be bone- chilling to be on the other side of that opinion, you know? What was really interesting about it was the scope of the judge's concerns. Because it's not just the alleged misconduct by Ms. Halligan, who, as you point out, is not an experienced prosecutor. This was really her first time acting as one.
It's really concerns going back to 2017, when you're talking about problems with the search warrants that were used to get Mr. Comey's emails. Then going to 2025, the decision to reopen the investigation without getting a new search warrant.
And then, with Ms. Halligan herself. Some of the materials are redacted, in this opinion. But it suggests that she potentially misrepresented Mr. Comey's constitutional rights under the Fifth Amendment, and potentially said something to the effect to the grand jury, that they didn't have to rely just on the information that she presented to get an indictment. They could actually just infer that there might be better evidence, further down the line at trial, which is a pretty extraordinary mistake to make.
COLLINS: So essentially, the concern was, she was saying, Even if this isn't enough for you now, there might be more evidence for you to look at later?
BALLOU: That's the suggestion. And I mean, that runs counter to the entire point of what a grand jury is about. You're supposed to make an indictment, based on the evidence that the government presents to you, and at least based on what this opinion suggests. That's not what she did.
COLLINS: Well, and the other issue, if I'm right, was that she was saying, basically, James Comey would have to testify in his defense at trial?
BALLOU: It's not entirely clear what she was saying, because, it's not -- you know, she might not have known what she was saying. But also, part of the opinion is redacted. But it's a really core tenet. Everybody -- you don't have to be a lawyer to know, you don't have to testify in your own defense. You don't have to incriminate yourself.
The fact that Ms. Halligan said something like that really just shows why she was so unprepared for this role, and shows why it's so important that U.S. attorneys actually be nominated by a President and confirmed by the Senate.
COLLINS: So, the federal judge here, overseeing all of this, has kind of put a pause on where this was going. What is going to happen? What are you looking for next here, if you're Lindsey Halligan, waiting to see how this plays out?
BALLOU: Yes, so Ms. Halligan and her team have made an emergency appeal to another judge, to try to stay the production of documents that this judge ordered be made to Mr. Comey.
[21:40:00]
It kind of seems like Ms. Halligan is playing for time here, and trying to extend this as long as possible, given that the problems that have been flagged here are extraordinary, and could really sink this case.
COLLINS: Brendan Ballou, thank you for being here.
And of course, we'll continue to follow that and see what does happen next with the federal judge weighing in tonight.
But tonight, for us here. President Trump is revealing when he wants to send Americans those $2,000 tariff checks that he has promised. He's been making his affordability pitch, at an event, for one of his favorite restaurants.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I'm also one of your all-time most loyal customers.
And I even got Bobby Kennedy to eat a Big Mac.
(LAUGHTER)
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: And he told me he loved it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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[21:45:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: You voice sounds a little rough. Are you feeling alright?
TRUMP: Yes, I feel great. I was shouting at people because they were stupid about something, having to do with trade in a country, and I straightened it out. But I blew my stack at these people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: President Trump today, blamed that raspy voice that he had in the Oval Office, on a shouting match with an unknown country over trade. The reporters tried to ask which country it was, but he declined to tell them. He said they were trying to renegotiate a trade deal.
And this comes, as the White House has been working to refocus attention, away from the Jeffrey Epstein controversy, and onto a renewed focus when it comes to affordability, especially following those huge Democratic wins, during the elections the other week.
It's a new strategy shift that we saw launch today. There was a nod to this moment from the 2024 campaign, where the President filled in on a shift at McDonald's.
This time, he was leaning on the Golden Arches for an Impact Summit with McDonald's owners, operators and suppliers, here in Washington tonight, where he delivered this message.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We have to do. The word is affordable. And affordable is -- should be our word, not theirs, because the Democrats got up and took, Affordability, affordability. And they don't say that, they had the worst inflation in history, the highest energy prices in history. Everything was the worst. What they're great at is lying. They say, Affordability.
This stuff was all much more expensive. We have a couple of items like coffee, which is a little high, we're going to get that down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: And my political sources are back here with me now.
And David Urban, you heard the President tonight saying this. But also, the White House put out this celebratory tweet, when it came to the President's Executive Order, modifying his own tariffs. It says, Thanks to President Trump's deal-making, we're making trade fair again, & winning BIG.
But obviously, these are them acknowledging that they are bringing down tariffs that they put in place, that were raising prices, which they had said all along, Americans were not paying the price of these tariffs. But now it seems to be a tacit acknowledgement that they indeed were.
URBAN: Yes, Kaitlan, look, the economy is a very complex thing we find out, huh? It's, you know -- and President Trump, just like President Biden before him, things are, you know, things are actually going not as terribly as people feel, right? People feel one thing and the numbers say something else.
So, inflation is down. Real wage increase is up. Consumer spending is up. Consumer confidence, not so -- not so bad. Pretty -- pretty steady. So things are moving in the right direction, but they're moving slowly, right?
Real wage growth is going about -- at about one and a half percent. And so, it's not keeping pace with inflation. So, people still feel, when they take that money out of their pocket, and go to check out or pump their gas, they still feel it at the pump or the cash register. And until those -- until those two lines cross, things aren't going to get better for real Americans. And I think it's wise for the President, and for the Congress, the Republican Congress, to talk about it.
But the President's right. Affordability is a Republican -- is the Republican talking point, is our -- is our strategy. It's how Trump won. It's how he won working-class, black and brown people and white people, by talking about it, by going to McDonald's, by diving -- by driving a dump truck, really connecting with people in places, all across America, bodegas, barber shops, everywhere. And we can't lose sight of that. And we really need to speak to it.
I think, the President's been in there 10 months. People aren't that patient. They want to see change very quickly.
COLLINS: Yes. Well, especially when he promised it very quickly. I mean, that was something, those were his own words on the campaign trail.
And so, that is the thing, obviously, to David's point there, about how the Biden White House handled this.
The President keeps saying, Well, inflation was so bad under Biden. And that is true, it was incredibly high. But what he is saying now is that it's virtually non-existent is also not true.
A. JOHNSON: Right. Well, I mean, Donald Trump is known to lie. And also, all of these things that David mentioned about the dump truck, the visiting the bodegas, the going and working at a McDonald's during the campaign trail, these are all stunts.
I will say this, though. Donald Trump and Republicans are great at messaging to working-class people, even though they have the policies that actually harm them more.
The thing that we're not talking about with the economy is also the amount of job losses under President Trump, the amount that people are going to pay even more for health care, which was the crux of the shutdown fight. All of those things paint a picture about the economy.
And he's talking to the McDonald's Impact Summit. Those are franchise owners. Franchise owners are millionaires. They don't understand the plight of the working-class people and poor people.
And so, it's really frustrating that Donald Trump can seem to get support around these stunts, while he's also making sure he's cutting deals with billionaires and millionaires, making sure that people in the tech industry, running these big corporations, they get tax breaks, but the American people are feeling all this.
[21:50:00]
And so, he can cut a check around the trade, I guess, the money that the government is receiving. But that's not from foreign governments. That's from the fact that American people are paying more money, because of these trades.
COLLINS: Well and David, obviously, to the point of the White House recognizing that Americans are still struggling, when it comes to the economy, or making ends meet.
The President has rolled out this idea of these $2,000 tariff checks that would go out to Americans.
I want you to listen to what he said today about this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We've taken in hundreds of millions of dollars in tariff money. We're going to be issuing dividends later on, somewhere prior to, you know, and probably in the middle of next year, a little bit later than that, of thousands of dollars for individuals of moderate income, middle income. We're going to pay down debt. You know, we have a lot of money from tariffs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: David, do you have concerns about whether or not that's a promise the President can deliver on?
URBAN: Listen, Kaitlan, I do think the President can deliver on that. They have taken in several hundred billion dollars in tariffs.
And it does -- it does matter, where you put that line, right? If you give people $2,000 or a $1,000, what income level, if they're at $50,000, if they're $40,000, what the numbers are? That it's a sliding scale, right? It's obviously, hundreds of billions of dollars for giving away $2,000 to 150 million people. It's a big number. But if it's -- if it's a lower -- you know, we can do it.
Listen, the best thing I heard from the President today is he's a fan of the Filet-O-Fish. At the McDonald's Summit.
COLLINS: That was the best thing you heard?
URBAN: It was just great. It's like, listen, Donald Trump -- listen, Alencia, you're right about the messaging. When Trump was at -- when Trump went to East Palestine, Ohio, after the train wreck, he was in a McDonald's, and he put his arm around the McDonald's, the franchisee, and he said, you know, he looked at the menu, and he said, You know what? I probably know this menu better than you do.
It connects with real people. He did that again today. It was -- it was a spectacular performance in front of those franchisees.
A. JOHNSON: Well, that's what it exactly is. It's just a performance. He cannot connect with the hurting people about what they're experiencing.
URBAN: I think he won the--
COLLINS: David Urban. Alencia Johnson.
URBAN: --I think he won the popular vote.
COLLINS: Thank you both for being here.
URBAN: Thank you.
COLLINS: And up next for us. You're going to want to see this, because if you're watching Saturday Night Live, this week, you saw a special guest on the stage, who nearly stole the show. He is going to join me, right after this.
[21:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: If you were watching Saturday Night Live, this weekend, you might have seen a familiar face in the Cold Open, or at least Chloe Fineman's amazing impression of me in a very well-dressed, and very nailed the look, I think, in terms of the press briefing.
But it was not the Cold Open that was the big surprise cameo. It was actually an unexpected place for the host and movie star, Glen Powell, talked about what happened, once, on his front porch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GLEN POWELL, ACTOR: I was actually supposed to host four years ago for "Top Gun: Maverick." And when I got the call, I was on a porch with my family, and we just all lost our minds.
And a UPS driver happened to be delivering a package at that exact same moment. And he was like, What is going on?
And I was like, I'm hosting SNL.
And he was like, Are you serious?
And I was like, Yep, Christmas episode. Tune in.
But then, my dream got taken away. "Top Gun" got delayed because of COVID, so SNL had to take their offer back.
So, I didn't end up hosting, which means, for four years, this UPS driver was just going around--
(LAUGHTER)
POWELL: --saying, Glen Powell is a liar.
(LAUGHTER)
POWELL: I flew him all the way to New York.
(CHEERING)
(APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: That former UPS driver, Mitch Berquist, not only made it into Studio 8H for Powell's turn as the host. He even brought him on stage during his opening monolog, and at the end of the show.
Mitch is not done with TV appearances just yet, because he is my source tonight.
And it is so great to have you here, Mitch.
Because, I was there Saturday night. We saw you. You were easily the star of the show, this weekend. And I think one of the big questions is, is how Glen Powell's family tracked you down and found you after four years.
MITCH BERQUIST, GLEN POWELL'S SPECIAL SNL GUEST: Well, they made a post online in some of the local Facebook communities, here in Maine, and a bunch of people reached out to me, saying, There's your photo floating around online, like people are looking for you.
And I linked up to the photo and saw that it was this -- this selfie that I knew only Glen and I had taken together, and I reached out to the person posting it, and it turned out being Lauren, who got me in touch with her brother, Glen. And that's sort of how that all got in motion, for me to come out on Saturday.
COLLINS: And do you remember that day, four years ago, when you were there delivering a package?
BERQUIST: Oh, yes, I joke around with my buddies and my family all the time, about how he was -- he's like my bro, and I got to go see his movie, because I took a -- took a photo with him. And then, all of a sudden he's reaching out to talk to me, in-person, and have me be a part of this huge experience with him too.
COLLINS: What was it like, inside 30 Rock, on Saturday night, for you? What was that experience like?
BERQUIST: Complete chaos. Like, the whole time, I couldn't believe how quick and fast everything was happening, and how everyone worked together, and how many people were involved.
But overall, like, the experience was like, so warm and welcoming for me. Everyone, cast members, crew members, Glen, his whole family, they're all so welcoming, and made it such a fun, exciting and nice experience for me, coming in from the outside, being just a random stranger, essentially.
[22:00:00]
COLLINS: Well, a random stranger, no more, because now all of America knows who you are. And it was such an amazing story, and what a cool ending to that. And it was great to meet you. And I'm so glad that you came and joined me tonight. So, thank you for being here, Mitch.
BERQUIST: It was so good to meet you. Thank you so much for having me on the show.
COLLINS: Absolutely.
A sign to always pay attention to your UPS drivers, especially if you're going to be hosting SNL.
Thank you, Mitch.
And thank you all so much for joining us.
"CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" starts now.
