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CNN Sunday Morning
Interview With Greg Gutfeld
Aired January 12, 2003 - 08:46 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Mix beautiful people, competition, fear, deceit, sex and greed, and you have the ingredients of TV's reality show craze. But are the shows going too far? Is the market saturated? Perhaps rhetorical questions.
For some insight, we're joined by Greg Gutfeld, who is the editor-in-chief of "Stuff" magazine. Greg, good to see you.
GREG GUTFELD, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, "STUFF" MAGAZINE: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: All right. My theory in all of this is it's just cheap TV, and that's really at the root of all of this. Do you go along with that?
GUTFELD: I'd go along with that, but I'd also say it's cheap psychotherapy. I think that reality television is fundamental for the self-esteem of our nation. Think about it. If you're...
O'BRIEN: How so? Wait, it makes us feel like we're better than they are?
GUTFELD: Absolutely. I mean, think about it. Let's say you're a 25-year-old kid living at home, you've got no job, you've got no girlfriend, you've got no pants. You turn on "The real World." Suddenly, you're life isn't so bad because at least your problems aren't being paraded around the country. Stupidity and people who are less fortunate than us in certain ways is somewhat amusing and makes us feel better.
O'BRIEN: So really it's the same reason we slow down for accidents on the highway?
GUTFELD: Exactly. It's like a six-month accident, if you watch like "The Real World" and "Survivor" all in a row.
O'BRIEN: All right. Let's trace the origins of this. I mean, I guess it can go back to that PBS series years and years ago, "American Family," right?
GUTFELD: Actually, you can even go beyond that back to circuses. We don't go to circuses anymore. Circuses generally were reality- based television with unattractive people. They were called sideshows. Then we had game shows, again, with unattractive people.
Suddenly, we figured out that we can have reality-based people entertainment, but with really good-looking people. Hence, you have, you know, "Temptation Island," and, you know, "Fear Factor," except they're eating cow testicles, which -- or bull testicles.
O'BRIEN: I had the misfortune of flipping through the channel to see that particular -- what's this one here? This is "The Bachelor" or whatever -- "The Bachelorette" or whatever.
GUTFELD: Yeah. I find those people particularly creepy. I don't know why. I guess I find like, it's just so contrived. And...
O'BRIEN: Oh, you think so? Contrived?
GUTFELD: Yes. I know I'm going out on a limb on that. But it also illustrates another important part of our culture, and that is more and more people feel it's better to be famous than useful. And the fact is that...
O'BRIEN: We are in a bad way in this country.
GUTFELD: ... we should thank the networks for getting these people off the streets and having them do something valuable, which is entertain us.
O'BRIEN: There you go. They have their use. They have their "special purpose," to quote Steve Martin in "The Jerk."
GUTFELD: Exactly. It's like the old way we used to look at performers was that they were performing for us.
O'BRIEN: There you go. All right. Let's look at the -- what is this, this mole -- "Celebrity Mole." That's -- the thing now is that the winners of the previous reality contests become their own, you know, celebrities. And they get involved and it just becomes a house of mirrors.
GUTFELD: Exactly. You become famous for simply being famous.
O'BRIEN: It's kind of like the Zsa Zsa Gabor effect, you know?
GUTFELD: Exactly. It's a sick cycle that will never end. Pretty soon all of us will have reality shows, Miles. You and I will be living in a house together.
O'BRIEN: If Andy Warhol were alive, he might have modified that whole thing.
GUTFELD: They might even bring him back for a show.
O'BRIEN: All right. What about "American Idol"? That's more of a talent show than anything.
GUTFELD: Yeah. It's kind of like "Star Search" with a little hint of cruelty. Because we all -- you know you always used to watch "Star Search" and really kind of yelled at these contestants. But now you have judges doing it for you.
O'BRIEN: Yeah. And you had this -- who is that nasty judge that was already being mean... GUTFELD: Simon Cowell (ph).
O'BRIEN: Simon (ph) the evil judge.
GUTFELD: He just remains me of every guy who works at, like, I done know, a very expensive clothing store. A very snotty -- but it works.
O'BRIEN: Tell me, when was the moment -- if you can define it -- when it just went from bad to really bad?
GUTFELD: Well, I would have to say -- there are times when I watch "Fear Factor" and I cringe. But actually, I find the worst kind of reality television, "Donahue" on MSNBC, because I just can't -- I mean, the fact that he's still around is just more surreal than real for me. And to be watching his shows, I think that's the worst kind of reality television.
At least these things, these shows, are entertaining. I find them amusing. And you're right, they cheap. And they're the ultimate public television, because they feature the public and they're for the public.
O'BRIEN: Well, I suppose when you consider -- what are they paying those "Friends" guys? About $1 million an episode.
GUTFELD: $1 million an episode.
O'BRIEN: And you don't have to be a rocket scientist to do a little mathematics there to realize you don't need even need those big numbers really to sustain these kinds of things, right?
GUTFELD: Yeah, I think that one -- you know that's the -- one of those stars is the budget probably for the entire cast of "Surreal World" with Emmanuel Lewis and M.C. Hammer, two of my favorites.
O'BRIEN: All right. So where is it headed? Is it going to finally wane or do we have to see more of it?
GUTFELD: I think they're just going to continue to combine them. They create these recipes, where they're going to take -- let's take celebrities, let's take dangerous stunts. Let's put them together, which I think would be a great idea, to see Corey Feldman jump out of a plan without a parachute.
O'BRIEN: Oh my goodness.
GUTFELD: You know, the ultimate.
O'BRIEN: And we didn't even mention "Battle of the Network Stars." But we're out of time.
GUTFELD: Well, next time.
O'BRIEN: Next time. All right. Excellent. We appreciate it, Greg Gutfeld, editor-in-chief of "Stuff" magazine from New York City. We appreciate you being with us.
GUTFELD: My pleasure. Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired January 12, 2003 - 08:46 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Mix beautiful people, competition, fear, deceit, sex and greed, and you have the ingredients of TV's reality show craze. But are the shows going too far? Is the market saturated? Perhaps rhetorical questions.
For some insight, we're joined by Greg Gutfeld, who is the editor-in-chief of "Stuff" magazine. Greg, good to see you.
GREG GUTFELD, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, "STUFF" MAGAZINE: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: All right. My theory in all of this is it's just cheap TV, and that's really at the root of all of this. Do you go along with that?
GUTFELD: I'd go along with that, but I'd also say it's cheap psychotherapy. I think that reality television is fundamental for the self-esteem of our nation. Think about it. If you're...
O'BRIEN: How so? Wait, it makes us feel like we're better than they are?
GUTFELD: Absolutely. I mean, think about it. Let's say you're a 25-year-old kid living at home, you've got no job, you've got no girlfriend, you've got no pants. You turn on "The real World." Suddenly, you're life isn't so bad because at least your problems aren't being paraded around the country. Stupidity and people who are less fortunate than us in certain ways is somewhat amusing and makes us feel better.
O'BRIEN: So really it's the same reason we slow down for accidents on the highway?
GUTFELD: Exactly. It's like a six-month accident, if you watch like "The Real World" and "Survivor" all in a row.
O'BRIEN: All right. Let's trace the origins of this. I mean, I guess it can go back to that PBS series years and years ago, "American Family," right?
GUTFELD: Actually, you can even go beyond that back to circuses. We don't go to circuses anymore. Circuses generally were reality- based television with unattractive people. They were called sideshows. Then we had game shows, again, with unattractive people.
Suddenly, we figured out that we can have reality-based people entertainment, but with really good-looking people. Hence, you have, you know, "Temptation Island," and, you know, "Fear Factor," except they're eating cow testicles, which -- or bull testicles.
O'BRIEN: I had the misfortune of flipping through the channel to see that particular -- what's this one here? This is "The Bachelor" or whatever -- "The Bachelorette" or whatever.
GUTFELD: Yeah. I find those people particularly creepy. I don't know why. I guess I find like, it's just so contrived. And...
O'BRIEN: Oh, you think so? Contrived?
GUTFELD: Yes. I know I'm going out on a limb on that. But it also illustrates another important part of our culture, and that is more and more people feel it's better to be famous than useful. And the fact is that...
O'BRIEN: We are in a bad way in this country.
GUTFELD: ... we should thank the networks for getting these people off the streets and having them do something valuable, which is entertain us.
O'BRIEN: There you go. They have their use. They have their "special purpose," to quote Steve Martin in "The Jerk."
GUTFELD: Exactly. It's like the old way we used to look at performers was that they were performing for us.
O'BRIEN: There you go. All right. Let's look at the -- what is this, this mole -- "Celebrity Mole." That's -- the thing now is that the winners of the previous reality contests become their own, you know, celebrities. And they get involved and it just becomes a house of mirrors.
GUTFELD: Exactly. You become famous for simply being famous.
O'BRIEN: It's kind of like the Zsa Zsa Gabor effect, you know?
GUTFELD: Exactly. It's a sick cycle that will never end. Pretty soon all of us will have reality shows, Miles. You and I will be living in a house together.
O'BRIEN: If Andy Warhol were alive, he might have modified that whole thing.
GUTFELD: They might even bring him back for a show.
O'BRIEN: All right. What about "American Idol"? That's more of a talent show than anything.
GUTFELD: Yeah. It's kind of like "Star Search" with a little hint of cruelty. Because we all -- you know you always used to watch "Star Search" and really kind of yelled at these contestants. But now you have judges doing it for you.
O'BRIEN: Yeah. And you had this -- who is that nasty judge that was already being mean... GUTFELD: Simon Cowell (ph).
O'BRIEN: Simon (ph) the evil judge.
GUTFELD: He just remains me of every guy who works at, like, I done know, a very expensive clothing store. A very snotty -- but it works.
O'BRIEN: Tell me, when was the moment -- if you can define it -- when it just went from bad to really bad?
GUTFELD: Well, I would have to say -- there are times when I watch "Fear Factor" and I cringe. But actually, I find the worst kind of reality television, "Donahue" on MSNBC, because I just can't -- I mean, the fact that he's still around is just more surreal than real for me. And to be watching his shows, I think that's the worst kind of reality television.
At least these things, these shows, are entertaining. I find them amusing. And you're right, they cheap. And they're the ultimate public television, because they feature the public and they're for the public.
O'BRIEN: Well, I suppose when you consider -- what are they paying those "Friends" guys? About $1 million an episode.
GUTFELD: $1 million an episode.
O'BRIEN: And you don't have to be a rocket scientist to do a little mathematics there to realize you don't need even need those big numbers really to sustain these kinds of things, right?
GUTFELD: Yeah, I think that one -- you know that's the -- one of those stars is the budget probably for the entire cast of "Surreal World" with Emmanuel Lewis and M.C. Hammer, two of my favorites.
O'BRIEN: All right. So where is it headed? Is it going to finally wane or do we have to see more of it?
GUTFELD: I think they're just going to continue to combine them. They create these recipes, where they're going to take -- let's take celebrities, let's take dangerous stunts. Let's put them together, which I think would be a great idea, to see Corey Feldman jump out of a plan without a parachute.
O'BRIEN: Oh my goodness.
GUTFELD: You know, the ultimate.
O'BRIEN: And we didn't even mention "Battle of the Network Stars." But we're out of time.
GUTFELD: Well, next time.
O'BRIEN: Next time. All right. Excellent. We appreciate it, Greg Gutfeld, editor-in-chief of "Stuff" magazine from New York City. We appreciate you being with us.
GUTFELD: My pleasure. Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
