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CNN Sunday Morning
Interview With Jacob Sullum, Arianna Huffington
Aired January 12, 2003 - 11:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Now let's drive a bit further down the road on this topic.
Arianna Huffington is one of the co-founders of the Detroit Project. She's in Los Angeles.
And Jacob Sullum is a senior editor of "Reason" magazine. He comes to us from Washington.
Good to see both of you.
ARIANNA HUFFINGTON, DETROIT PROJECT: Thank you.
JACOB SULLUM, SENIOR EDITOR, "REASON" MAGAZINE: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: All right, Arianna, let me begin with you.
What inspired this ad campaign? You certainly wanted to get the attention of folks, and you certainly have, but what inspired it specifically?
HUFFINGTON: Well, it was actually inspired by an incredible response to a column I wrote a few months ago, asking the public that if the administration really believes in the logic of the drug war ads it's running, linking people doing drugs to terrorists, what about a people's ad campaign, I asked in my column, to jar our leaders into reality about the need for greater fuel efficiency and oil independence at a time of war?
And I was overwhelmed with the response, over 5,000 e-mails from people asking where do I send the check? Where do I send my money?
So I got together with Lawrence Bender and Laurie David and Ariel Emanuel and we created the Detroit Project. And all the money that came from the public went into producing these two 30-second ads. Everybody donated their services, and the response from the media has been overwhelming.
WHITFIELD: Well, let's talk about the responsibility. I mean, because your critics are saying that what you're espousing in these ads is not necessarily accurate, and you're using these scare tactics to make people believe that when they pile up, you know, the vehicle, whether they put their kids in the car or whether they're hauling large equipment, that they are linked to terrorist activity.
HUFFINGTON: We're not using any scare tactics. The ads are a parody of the drug war ads.
And what we are asking people, and what we're asking Detroit, what we're asking politicians in Washington, is to connect the dots between the choices we make, especially when you consider that at the moment we have insane tax loopholes and subsidies that support Detroit in putting on the road these huge cars.
WHITFIELD: OK. Let me stop you right there and bring Jacob into the equation.
SULLUM: She says these ads are designed to help connect the dots. Where do you disagree here?
Well, I think the ads are clever as satires of the original anti- drug ads, which Arianna rightly condemned as ridiculous and inflammatory. I completely agree with that.
I think, if you take these new ads at face value, which she appears to want us to do, they're equally ridiculous and inflammatory. Because the decisions that she's talking about, whether it's buying one car versus another or buying an SUV versus another kind of car, are really morally trivial when you try to trace them down to their impact on terrorism.
WHITFIELD: So, Arianna...
SULLUM: Only about 10 percent of the oil that we consume in this country comes from Persian Gulf countries to begin with.
WHITFIELD: All right. Now Arianna, let me ask you this real quick.
Are you also saying, then, if you drive a smaller vehicle, then you are less responsible, you are less linked to such terrorist activity that you claim is really depending on the size of your vehicle? And is that really fair, and is it right?
HUFFINGTON: Listen, Fredricka -- Fredricka, you just showed a news story about our dependence on oil. You just talked about OPEC and Vienna deigning to agree to increase oil production by 2 million barrels.
We are so dependent on them that our foreign policy is determined by our oil addiction.
And therefore, at a time of war when oil prices are going to be going up, as you said a few minutes ago, it is absurd for us to continue to subsidize vehicles like the Hummer, which consumes nine...
WHITFIELD: Let's get Jacob in here, because we're running out of time. Let's give Jacob the last word.
The question is, why the focus on SUVs?
HUFFINGTON: Because there are 20 million of them.
SULLUM: Every consumer in America uses oil in one form or another.
If you fly on an airplane, which I assume you do from time to time, rather than taking an electric train, you're subsidizing terrorism.
If you take a cab, if you take a limousine anywhere, you're subsidizing terrorism.
If you buy groceries from a store that has the groceries shipped in by trucks, then you are...
HUFFINGTON: OK, but...
WHITFIELD: Jacob Sullum, I'm going to have to have that be the last word...
SULLUM: All right.
WHITFIELD: ... because we're out of time right now. And Arianna Huffington, thanks very much to both of you for joining us this hour.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired January 12, 2003 - 11:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Now let's drive a bit further down the road on this topic.
Arianna Huffington is one of the co-founders of the Detroit Project. She's in Los Angeles.
And Jacob Sullum is a senior editor of "Reason" magazine. He comes to us from Washington.
Good to see both of you.
ARIANNA HUFFINGTON, DETROIT PROJECT: Thank you.
JACOB SULLUM, SENIOR EDITOR, "REASON" MAGAZINE: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: All right, Arianna, let me begin with you.
What inspired this ad campaign? You certainly wanted to get the attention of folks, and you certainly have, but what inspired it specifically?
HUFFINGTON: Well, it was actually inspired by an incredible response to a column I wrote a few months ago, asking the public that if the administration really believes in the logic of the drug war ads it's running, linking people doing drugs to terrorists, what about a people's ad campaign, I asked in my column, to jar our leaders into reality about the need for greater fuel efficiency and oil independence at a time of war?
And I was overwhelmed with the response, over 5,000 e-mails from people asking where do I send the check? Where do I send my money?
So I got together with Lawrence Bender and Laurie David and Ariel Emanuel and we created the Detroit Project. And all the money that came from the public went into producing these two 30-second ads. Everybody donated their services, and the response from the media has been overwhelming.
WHITFIELD: Well, let's talk about the responsibility. I mean, because your critics are saying that what you're espousing in these ads is not necessarily accurate, and you're using these scare tactics to make people believe that when they pile up, you know, the vehicle, whether they put their kids in the car or whether they're hauling large equipment, that they are linked to terrorist activity.
HUFFINGTON: We're not using any scare tactics. The ads are a parody of the drug war ads.
And what we are asking people, and what we're asking Detroit, what we're asking politicians in Washington, is to connect the dots between the choices we make, especially when you consider that at the moment we have insane tax loopholes and subsidies that support Detroit in putting on the road these huge cars.
WHITFIELD: OK. Let me stop you right there and bring Jacob into the equation.
SULLUM: She says these ads are designed to help connect the dots. Where do you disagree here?
Well, I think the ads are clever as satires of the original anti- drug ads, which Arianna rightly condemned as ridiculous and inflammatory. I completely agree with that.
I think, if you take these new ads at face value, which she appears to want us to do, they're equally ridiculous and inflammatory. Because the decisions that she's talking about, whether it's buying one car versus another or buying an SUV versus another kind of car, are really morally trivial when you try to trace them down to their impact on terrorism.
WHITFIELD: So, Arianna...
SULLUM: Only about 10 percent of the oil that we consume in this country comes from Persian Gulf countries to begin with.
WHITFIELD: All right. Now Arianna, let me ask you this real quick.
Are you also saying, then, if you drive a smaller vehicle, then you are less responsible, you are less linked to such terrorist activity that you claim is really depending on the size of your vehicle? And is that really fair, and is it right?
HUFFINGTON: Listen, Fredricka -- Fredricka, you just showed a news story about our dependence on oil. You just talked about OPEC and Vienna deigning to agree to increase oil production by 2 million barrels.
We are so dependent on them that our foreign policy is determined by our oil addiction.
And therefore, at a time of war when oil prices are going to be going up, as you said a few minutes ago, it is absurd for us to continue to subsidize vehicles like the Hummer, which consumes nine...
WHITFIELD: Let's get Jacob in here, because we're running out of time. Let's give Jacob the last word.
The question is, why the focus on SUVs?
HUFFINGTON: Because there are 20 million of them.
SULLUM: Every consumer in America uses oil in one form or another.
If you fly on an airplane, which I assume you do from time to time, rather than taking an electric train, you're subsidizing terrorism.
If you take a cab, if you take a limousine anywhere, you're subsidizing terrorism.
If you buy groceries from a store that has the groceries shipped in by trucks, then you are...
HUFFINGTON: OK, but...
WHITFIELD: Jacob Sullum, I'm going to have to have that be the last word...
SULLUM: All right.
WHITFIELD: ... because we're out of time right now. And Arianna Huffington, thanks very much to both of you for joining us this hour.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
