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CNN Sunday Morning
Interview With Bill Koffel
Aired February 23, 2003 - 07:39 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JONATHAN KARL, CNN ANCHOR: On the heels of last week's raging night club fire in Rhode Island and the club stampede in Chicago, many cities across the country are rethinking the way they make buildings safe. Joining me from Baltimore to talk about building safety is Bill Koffel of the Society of Fire Protection Engineers. And Bill joins us via telephone.
Bill, based on what you've seen so far and what you've looked at and studied in the situation in Rhode Island, who is to share the bulk of the blame for what happened?
BILL KOFFEL, FIRE PROTECTION ENGINEER: Well, I think it's a little early to determine who's to share the bulk of the blame. I'm sure the fire investigation and potential criminal investigation will be thorough and determine to what extent various parties may to be blame for the incident.
KARL: Yes, and obviously, we're going to have a question of whether or not the band had permission to use the pyrotechnics that set the blaze. But looking at what you've seen, and we've seen you know floor plans in the papers of the night club, was that a fire trap? I mean, was that place essentially a fire trap? And there you see, I mean there were several exits, but really only one exit that most of the people tried to use.
KOFFEL: Well, it's not uncommon in a place of assembly for most of the people to try to use the egress through the way that they came into the building. Certainly some people did use alternate egress facilities. And again, not knowing all of the details, it's premature to indicate that the club was or was not a fire trap.
KARL: I mean, what makes a building like that go off, and you know, I mean three minutes to just basically be burned to the ground? It sounds like a fire trap to me.
KOFFEL: Certainly the materials on the walls and ceiling appear to have contributed to significantly to the development and the spread of the fire. We will learn the details of that as the investigation proceeds and the properties of those materials.
KARL: OK, now let's get to the national issue here, the question of fire codes. Fire codes are something that are done state by state. And in some cases, locality by locality. Is that a problem? Do there need to be national standards for fire codes in the country?
KOFFEL: Most of the fire codes are developed at a national level. There are primarily today two organizations that develop fire codes. And then the state or local jurisdiction will adopt those codes with or without some amendments.
KARL: And do you think it -- will we see changes in those? I mean, what do you think we will learn? What will be the lesson of this tragedy?
KOFFEL: Well, again, certainly we will find out a lot about the materials. And we will find out whether the codes did or did not permit the materials and the pyrotechnics display that apparently occurred in the club on the evening of the event. Hopefully, we will also learn quite a bit about the behavior of the occupants in the building. And that may be one of the bigger lessons we may learn is how that people responded to the incident, and whether any changes are necessary in the code as a result of that.
KARL: OK. And then just -- we still have a few seconds left. What would you give by way of advice for, you know, for people who find themselves in crowded venues like night clubs, like concerts in terms of being prepared for, you know, perhaps a remote possibility, but a possibility that something like this could happen?
KOFFEL: Well, certainly, one of the first things you could do is make sure you are aware of where the exit facilities are located and what options may be available to you. And then to be aware of your surroundings. Apparently in this incident, initially the people did not recognize or perceive any threat. And then by the time they did perceive a threat, there was limited time for them to egress.
KARL: All right, Bill Koffel in Baltimore. Thank you for joining us.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired February 23, 2003 - 07:39 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JONATHAN KARL, CNN ANCHOR: On the heels of last week's raging night club fire in Rhode Island and the club stampede in Chicago, many cities across the country are rethinking the way they make buildings safe. Joining me from Baltimore to talk about building safety is Bill Koffel of the Society of Fire Protection Engineers. And Bill joins us via telephone.
Bill, based on what you've seen so far and what you've looked at and studied in the situation in Rhode Island, who is to share the bulk of the blame for what happened?
BILL KOFFEL, FIRE PROTECTION ENGINEER: Well, I think it's a little early to determine who's to share the bulk of the blame. I'm sure the fire investigation and potential criminal investigation will be thorough and determine to what extent various parties may to be blame for the incident.
KARL: Yes, and obviously, we're going to have a question of whether or not the band had permission to use the pyrotechnics that set the blaze. But looking at what you've seen, and we've seen you know floor plans in the papers of the night club, was that a fire trap? I mean, was that place essentially a fire trap? And there you see, I mean there were several exits, but really only one exit that most of the people tried to use.
KOFFEL: Well, it's not uncommon in a place of assembly for most of the people to try to use the egress through the way that they came into the building. Certainly some people did use alternate egress facilities. And again, not knowing all of the details, it's premature to indicate that the club was or was not a fire trap.
KARL: I mean, what makes a building like that go off, and you know, I mean three minutes to just basically be burned to the ground? It sounds like a fire trap to me.
KOFFEL: Certainly the materials on the walls and ceiling appear to have contributed to significantly to the development and the spread of the fire. We will learn the details of that as the investigation proceeds and the properties of those materials.
KARL: OK, now let's get to the national issue here, the question of fire codes. Fire codes are something that are done state by state. And in some cases, locality by locality. Is that a problem? Do there need to be national standards for fire codes in the country?
KOFFEL: Most of the fire codes are developed at a national level. There are primarily today two organizations that develop fire codes. And then the state or local jurisdiction will adopt those codes with or without some amendments.
KARL: And do you think it -- will we see changes in those? I mean, what do you think we will learn? What will be the lesson of this tragedy?
KOFFEL: Well, again, certainly we will find out a lot about the materials. And we will find out whether the codes did or did not permit the materials and the pyrotechnics display that apparently occurred in the club on the evening of the event. Hopefully, we will also learn quite a bit about the behavior of the occupants in the building. And that may be one of the bigger lessons we may learn is how that people responded to the incident, and whether any changes are necessary in the code as a result of that.
KARL: OK. And then just -- we still have a few seconds left. What would you give by way of advice for, you know, for people who find themselves in crowded venues like night clubs, like concerts in terms of being prepared for, you know, perhaps a remote possibility, but a possibility that something like this could happen?
KOFFEL: Well, certainly, one of the first things you could do is make sure you are aware of where the exit facilities are located and what options may be available to you. And then to be aware of your surroundings. Apparently in this incident, initially the people did not recognize or perceive any threat. And then by the time they did perceive a threat, there was limited time for them to egress.
KARL: All right, Bill Koffel in Baltimore. Thank you for joining us.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
