Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Sunday Morning
Interview With Michael Smerconish, Lida Rodriguez-Taseff
Aired March 16, 2003 - 08:11 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ARTHEL NEVILLE, CNN ANCHOR: Federal and state prosecutors met in Salt Lake City yesterday to discuss their strategies for the prosecution of Michael David Mitchell -- Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee. With the latest on the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping, CNN's Ed Lavandera is in Salt Lake City very early on Sunday morning.
Good morning, Ed.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN DALLAS BUREAU CHIEF: Good morning, Arthel. Well, authorities here, as you mentioned, were meeting yesterday. We anticipate that those meetings will continue today.
We've been told by a law enforcement source that they're working out on the timing and the strategy as to how they will move forward in this case. There are different charges that are being looked at not only on the state level, but also on a federal level as well. So we're told that authorities here are meeting to figure out how exactly they're going to handle those charges in the next coming days.
Also, more indications of just what Brian David Mitchell and his wife were doing with Elizabeth Smart over the course of the last nine months. And from indications we've gotten, there are several situations where they came very close, having (UNINTELLIGIBLE), if you will, with authorities in several areas. In fact, perhaps a week ago, just outside of Las Vegas, they were pulled over by a north Las Vegas police officer, questioned because they were said to be looking suspicious, but they were released. No charges were filed. So they continued that as well.
And, also, there's a video from our affiliate -- CNN affiliate in San Diego, KUSI, showing Brian David Mitchell and presumably his wife and Elizabeth Smart at a homeless shelter eating Christmas dinner. Also, CNN has spoken with Brian David Mitchell's father and he described Brian David Mitchell as a tormented young man, isolated, an odd black sheep, if you will, of the family.
Said there was no justification for what Brian David Mitchell has done, but he also said that people should keep it in perspective. That most people who abduct children usually kill them and do other evil things with them, as they will. So he asked people to keep that in perspective, that Brian David Mitchell did not harm Elizabeth Smart. But he did go out and laid out a very troubling picture of a scenario of how he grew up and what drove him to this point in his life -- Arthel.
NEVILLE: OK. Ed Lavandera, thank you very much for that report this morning.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: The police phase of the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping case is finished. The legal phase is just beginning. To discuss what issues face prosecutors and defense attorneys, we turn to legal experts of our own. From Miami, Lida Rodriguez-Taseff, president of the ACLU of Miami. And from Philadelphia, trial attorney and CNN contributor, Michael Smerconish.
Lida, I'm sorry. Thanks very much for joining us, both of you.
Michael, let me start off with you. On the Elizabeth Smart case, did the police blow it?
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, TRIAL ATTORNEY: You know, in retrospect, you'd have to say, Anderson, that they did not take seriously the report of the 10-year-old sister who comes forward only in October and says, I think I know who it was or I think I know what this man resembles. It's Emmanuel, that homeless guy who we allowed to come in and work in the house. And the Smart family, on their nickel, ends up having this sketch created, it goes to "America's Most Wanted," and then family members of this guy see it. They say, we know who it is. Here are some legitimate pictures.
And the distressing things here is that he was in prison in San Diego for five days. Had law enforcement connected the dots, had law enforcement taken seriously the report of the 10-year-old sister, probably they would have apprehended him sooner.
COOPER: Lida, do you agree? Do you think this thing could have been over a long time ago?
LIDA RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF, PRESIDENT, ACLU MIAMI: You know, it's amazing. It could have been over even before that. And I completely agree with Michael, which is exciting, because we very seldom agree. But the other really troubling example of this case is the fact that the stepdaughter, Mitchell's stepdaughter had come forward many years and said that he had sexually molested her. And the prosecutors decided to not prosecute at that time because they decided they didn't believe her, even though this man already had a history of sexual deviancy, even though as a juvenile he was arrested for exposing himself to a girl.
So we're not talking about police botching it now. We're talking about the failing system over and over again.
COOPER: Well, as this thing goes to trial, I mean what do you think we're going to see? Michael, let me start off with you. Do you think -- is this guy going to be pleading insanity?
SMERCONISH: Well, what a remarkable interview we just saw on CNN a few moments ago with the father, who, by the way, doesn't look like he's playing with a full deck to me. And already you see the seeds of this thing. You now, accidental conception? What? What's that?
Abused in day care as a child? Rough upbringing, divorces? Here we go. You know it's going to be the "he was a victim." And then I hear the guy say, "And after all, he didn't dismember her." Give me a break. But that's where it's headed.
But one other point on this. Notice that when he was pulled over in Las Vegas he knows enough to say, oh, this is my daughter. So don't go buying into this business that he didn't understand reality. Because when the cops were around he knew what he was doing was wrong.
COOPER: Lida?
RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF: Well, you know insanity has nothing to do with understanding reality. It has to do with being unable to control oneself. And having this background, that Michael just described so eloquently, indicates that this was a man who was damaged. This was a man who didn't know right from wrong, and this was a man who, while conniving at times, was also very, very, very troubled.
So let's not just assail the insanity defense. Let's also remember that the prosecutors and the police in this case failed Elizabeth Smart and they failed the Mitchells.
COOPER: Well you can already hear the lawyers circling on this case. It is, no doubt, going to be in the public eye for quite some time to come.
Let's move on to the other big case this week: Robert Blake out on bail. He got out on Friday. I think the first thing he asked for was a cigarette. Michael, should he have gotten bail? And what's going to happen next?
SMERCONISH: It strikes me as odd that a guy who is facing murder charges would get bail. It's going to be an interesting case. You know his defense lawyers say, well, there is no gun and there are no eyewitnesses. I mean I watched Blake in that one network interview that he did. He didn't come across to me as being all there.
It will be a very interesting trial to watch it unfold. This is a guy who will never take the stand. That's one prediction that I'll make.
COOPER: Lida, I suppose you probably agree, not much of a chance of him fleeing.
RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF: Well, certainly not. But you know this is a perfect case of prosecutors overcharging in order to gain an unfair advantage. The only reason he didn't get bail is because they charged him with lying in wait. And what's that? That's the classic old west concept of an ambush.
And lying in wait is a special circumstance that allows prosecutors to seek the death penalty and to deny somebody bail. But they immediately said they didn't want to seek the death penalty, so why did they do it? Well, they did it so that he couldn't get bail. And the reason they did that is because they know that defendants who are in jail waiting trial have a greater chance of losing that trial.
And this is a prosecutor's office that has been embarrassed. It was embarrassed and out-lawyered with O.J. Simpson. And they were trying to find a way to keep this guy in jail so that he couldn't assist in his own defense so that he could gain an unfair advantage.
And I have to tell you, it took a long time to have that bail hearing. And you've got to wonder how that came to be that the judge twice refused to hold a bail hearing and it didn't happen until the California Supreme Court ordered it.
COOPER: All right. We're going to have to leave it right there. Michael Smerconish, Lida Rodriguez-Taseff, thanks very much for joining us. It's always interesting to talk to both of you. Thanks very much.
SMERCONISH: Thank you.
RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired March 16, 2003 - 08:11 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ARTHEL NEVILLE, CNN ANCHOR: Federal and state prosecutors met in Salt Lake City yesterday to discuss their strategies for the prosecution of Michael David Mitchell -- Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee. With the latest on the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping, CNN's Ed Lavandera is in Salt Lake City very early on Sunday morning.
Good morning, Ed.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN DALLAS BUREAU CHIEF: Good morning, Arthel. Well, authorities here, as you mentioned, were meeting yesterday. We anticipate that those meetings will continue today.
We've been told by a law enforcement source that they're working out on the timing and the strategy as to how they will move forward in this case. There are different charges that are being looked at not only on the state level, but also on a federal level as well. So we're told that authorities here are meeting to figure out how exactly they're going to handle those charges in the next coming days.
Also, more indications of just what Brian David Mitchell and his wife were doing with Elizabeth Smart over the course of the last nine months. And from indications we've gotten, there are several situations where they came very close, having (UNINTELLIGIBLE), if you will, with authorities in several areas. In fact, perhaps a week ago, just outside of Las Vegas, they were pulled over by a north Las Vegas police officer, questioned because they were said to be looking suspicious, but they were released. No charges were filed. So they continued that as well.
And, also, there's a video from our affiliate -- CNN affiliate in San Diego, KUSI, showing Brian David Mitchell and presumably his wife and Elizabeth Smart at a homeless shelter eating Christmas dinner. Also, CNN has spoken with Brian David Mitchell's father and he described Brian David Mitchell as a tormented young man, isolated, an odd black sheep, if you will, of the family.
Said there was no justification for what Brian David Mitchell has done, but he also said that people should keep it in perspective. That most people who abduct children usually kill them and do other evil things with them, as they will. So he asked people to keep that in perspective, that Brian David Mitchell did not harm Elizabeth Smart. But he did go out and laid out a very troubling picture of a scenario of how he grew up and what drove him to this point in his life -- Arthel.
NEVILLE: OK. Ed Lavandera, thank you very much for that report this morning.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: The police phase of the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping case is finished. The legal phase is just beginning. To discuss what issues face prosecutors and defense attorneys, we turn to legal experts of our own. From Miami, Lida Rodriguez-Taseff, president of the ACLU of Miami. And from Philadelphia, trial attorney and CNN contributor, Michael Smerconish.
Lida, I'm sorry. Thanks very much for joining us, both of you.
Michael, let me start off with you. On the Elizabeth Smart case, did the police blow it?
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, TRIAL ATTORNEY: You know, in retrospect, you'd have to say, Anderson, that they did not take seriously the report of the 10-year-old sister who comes forward only in October and says, I think I know who it was or I think I know what this man resembles. It's Emmanuel, that homeless guy who we allowed to come in and work in the house. And the Smart family, on their nickel, ends up having this sketch created, it goes to "America's Most Wanted," and then family members of this guy see it. They say, we know who it is. Here are some legitimate pictures.
And the distressing things here is that he was in prison in San Diego for five days. Had law enforcement connected the dots, had law enforcement taken seriously the report of the 10-year-old sister, probably they would have apprehended him sooner.
COOPER: Lida, do you agree? Do you think this thing could have been over a long time ago?
LIDA RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF, PRESIDENT, ACLU MIAMI: You know, it's amazing. It could have been over even before that. And I completely agree with Michael, which is exciting, because we very seldom agree. But the other really troubling example of this case is the fact that the stepdaughter, Mitchell's stepdaughter had come forward many years and said that he had sexually molested her. And the prosecutors decided to not prosecute at that time because they decided they didn't believe her, even though this man already had a history of sexual deviancy, even though as a juvenile he was arrested for exposing himself to a girl.
So we're not talking about police botching it now. We're talking about the failing system over and over again.
COOPER: Well, as this thing goes to trial, I mean what do you think we're going to see? Michael, let me start off with you. Do you think -- is this guy going to be pleading insanity?
SMERCONISH: Well, what a remarkable interview we just saw on CNN a few moments ago with the father, who, by the way, doesn't look like he's playing with a full deck to me. And already you see the seeds of this thing. You now, accidental conception? What? What's that?
Abused in day care as a child? Rough upbringing, divorces? Here we go. You know it's going to be the "he was a victim." And then I hear the guy say, "And after all, he didn't dismember her." Give me a break. But that's where it's headed.
But one other point on this. Notice that when he was pulled over in Las Vegas he knows enough to say, oh, this is my daughter. So don't go buying into this business that he didn't understand reality. Because when the cops were around he knew what he was doing was wrong.
COOPER: Lida?
RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF: Well, you know insanity has nothing to do with understanding reality. It has to do with being unable to control oneself. And having this background, that Michael just described so eloquently, indicates that this was a man who was damaged. This was a man who didn't know right from wrong, and this was a man who, while conniving at times, was also very, very, very troubled.
So let's not just assail the insanity defense. Let's also remember that the prosecutors and the police in this case failed Elizabeth Smart and they failed the Mitchells.
COOPER: Well you can already hear the lawyers circling on this case. It is, no doubt, going to be in the public eye for quite some time to come.
Let's move on to the other big case this week: Robert Blake out on bail. He got out on Friday. I think the first thing he asked for was a cigarette. Michael, should he have gotten bail? And what's going to happen next?
SMERCONISH: It strikes me as odd that a guy who is facing murder charges would get bail. It's going to be an interesting case. You know his defense lawyers say, well, there is no gun and there are no eyewitnesses. I mean I watched Blake in that one network interview that he did. He didn't come across to me as being all there.
It will be a very interesting trial to watch it unfold. This is a guy who will never take the stand. That's one prediction that I'll make.
COOPER: Lida, I suppose you probably agree, not much of a chance of him fleeing.
RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF: Well, certainly not. But you know this is a perfect case of prosecutors overcharging in order to gain an unfair advantage. The only reason he didn't get bail is because they charged him with lying in wait. And what's that? That's the classic old west concept of an ambush.
And lying in wait is a special circumstance that allows prosecutors to seek the death penalty and to deny somebody bail. But they immediately said they didn't want to seek the death penalty, so why did they do it? Well, they did it so that he couldn't get bail. And the reason they did that is because they know that defendants who are in jail waiting trial have a greater chance of losing that trial.
And this is a prosecutor's office that has been embarrassed. It was embarrassed and out-lawyered with O.J. Simpson. And they were trying to find a way to keep this guy in jail so that he couldn't assist in his own defense so that he could gain an unfair advantage.
And I have to tell you, it took a long time to have that bail hearing. And you've got to wonder how that came to be that the judge twice refused to hold a bail hearing and it didn't happen until the California Supreme Court ordered it.
COOPER: All right. We're going to have to leave it right there. Michael Smerconish, Lida Rodriguez-Taseff, thanks very much for joining us. It's always interesting to talk to both of you. Thanks very much.
SMERCONISH: Thank you.
RODRIGUEZ-TASEFF: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
