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CNN Sunday Morning
Talk to CNN
Aired June 15, 2003 - 09:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: The reality is, we must end terror and violence; we must move forward. We must take this chance for peace. And the United States will not get weary. We will not waiver. We will not stop. We will not step aside. The president is committed. I am committed. His administration is committed. We will succeed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RENAY SAN MIGUEL, CNN ANCHOR: Can the U.S. live up to that commitment? Time now for "Talk to CNN," where we'll answer the questions and comments you've e-mailed us on the push for peace in the Middle East.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Here to take your questions are CNN's Chris Burns, who is traveling with the president in Kennebunkport, Maine, this morning. Hello to you, Chris.
CHRIS BURNS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi there.
COLLINS: CNN's Matthew Chance, who joins us from Gaza this morning. Hi, Matthew.
And Wolf Blitzer, joining us live from Jerusalem. Hello to you as well.
Wolf, I'd like to start with you if that's possible, Wolf. Charmaine from Houston writes to us this morning and says, "The United States is not an honest broker in this situation. We need to step aside and let the U.N. send in help instead of blocking their efforts." Is this an opportunity, Wolf, for the U.N. they have yet to take?
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I don't think that the U.N. is going to manage to deal with this crisis, primarily because the Israeli government doesn't have a whole lot of confidence in the U.N. Historically over the years, the Israelis have seen the U.N. as being one-sided, and if not anti-Israel, certainly sympathetic towards the Arab side, the Palestinian side, in particular, given the nature of the U.N., so I don't think that's going to go very far as far as the Israelis are concerned. I think the Palestinians would be receptive to it.
Historically, if you take a look at any of the progress that's been achieved over the past 30 years in this Israeli-Palestinian conflict, or between the Israelis and the Egyptians or the Jordanians, it's been the United States, successive U.S. administrations, that have gotten the job done. That's why both sides, the Palestinians and the Israelis, look to Washington right now for that kind of outside help that could potentially move these parties forward.
SAN MIGUEL: This next question is for Chris Burns, who's traveling with the president in Kennebunkport, as we said. Burt writes in, which side should end the violence? The most powerful, or the least? If we, the U.S., immediately cut off all American taxpayer aid to Israel, how fast do you think they would stop killing Palestinians and sue for peace?
Chris, we had talked about the pressure that the Arab Street is putting on the Bush administration to really put pressure on Ariel Sharon to see what can be done.
BURNS: Well, there have been calls for that. But obviously, that is not going to happen. The Bush administration, as well as previous administrations, have committed to supporting Israel, come hell or high water. So it's very important for that finance to continue.
However, of course, it is important for the Bush administration to show that it is -- try to show that it is an honest broker between the two sides, that both are looking to President Bush to offer that leadership, to try to pull them out of that situation. And that is why President Bush is stepping in.
Now, President Bush is also backed by Russia, the United Nations, the European Union. It is part of a quartet that is pushing for this. And President Bush is playing his role in that.
COLLINS: All right. Thanks, Chris.
This next question goes out to Matthew Chance now, if we could. Allan in Ontario, Canada, says, they have to exile Arafat to Jordan or Egypt, so he can't interfere. He is the problem as I see it.
And you know, there have been questions, Matthew. You and I, in fact, have talked about before Mahmoud Abbas and what sort of power he really has as long as Arafat is around.
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's a question a lot of people ask, to be honest, about why don't the Israelis do more to isolate Yasser Arafat. Why didn't they exile him.
Or even worse, the fact is that my understanding of the situation is that it's a bit of a fantasy to think that the whole problem of the Middle East of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is focused on just one man. I mean, certainly, depriving Palestinians of a figure like Yasser Arafat may deprive them of a national symbol. But the real issues on the ground would remain. How to best achieve security for Israel by giving Palestinians an independent, viable state of their own. And, you know, to achieve that, it's going to take a lot more than sort of relatively simple moves of exiling of whatever Palestinian leader is in power at whatever moment. It's going to take very real and painful concessions, both on the sides of the Palestinians and on the side of the Israelis as well.
SAN MIGUEL: Wolf, a question for you from Marguerite in Seattle, Washington. Do we know the nature of the financial backing for the militant groups such as Hamas? Is there any chance that if we could stop their funding and the U.S. ceased the $2.7 billion, $2.1 in defense and $0.6 in humanitarian, annual foreign aid grant that it provides to Israel each year, that we could employ some financial sanctions to create more of an incentive for these people to start the peace process?
Now, that kind of plays into the question that was asked to Chris. But also, some of the pressure that the Bush administration's been trying to put on governments like Saudi Arabia, to cut off the funding for these groups.
BLITZER: Well, you heard that directly coming from the president earlier in the week. And the secretary of state repeatedly calling on everyone, including the Saudis and others throughout the Arab and Muslim world to stop the funding, the money that's flowing to Hamas, some of the other groups, Islamic jihad, the Palestinian-Islamic jihad.
There's another group that's been active over the years, the al Aqsa martyrs brigade, which is an offshoot of the Fatah movement that's directly controlled by Yasser Arafat. Hezbollah, which is in Lebanon, is funded at least to a great deal by the Iranians and Syrians. That money certainly provides a lot of wherewithal.
But I think what the Bush administration is trying to do is to get the money stopped, going to Hamas in particular. The State Department calls Hamas a terrorist organization. They've been squeezing the Saudis and others in the Arab world to stop. And we'll see what happens on that front. But it's a goal of the Bush administration. There's no doubt about that.
COLLINS: Matthew Chance, now, this one goes to you from Jerry in Naperville, Illinois.
It would appear that most of the Middle East really does not want U.S. or Western influence in their neighborhood. Why doesn't the Arab League or some other recognized Muslim organization put together a peace keeping force to go into Palestine and other hot spots and eliminate those terrorist groups? This would be far more politically correct than Western involvement -- Matthew.
CHANCE: Well, I think on the issue, first of all, on the United States, a lot of countries in the region do want greater U.S. involvement; that they welcome the involvement of President Bush over the past few weeks in the Middle East peace process to try and get some form of peace back on track. But what they are looking for from the United States is for that country to be, you know, not biased on one side or the other. The opinion in the Arab world generally is that, you know, the United States just backs Israel, as Chris Burns said earlier, come whatever else happens.
As for a peacekeeping force, well, you know, this is something the Palestinian people, the Palestinian leadership, has been calling for for a long time. But, you know, the big reason standing in the way of no Arab-led peace keeping force, or indeed a U.N. peace keeping force, which has been suggested in various arenas, is the Israelis. They say they don't want any kind of third force being involved in this region because it would, you know, impose on what they do themselves here. They say it's their region, it's their country, and they should be responsible for their security.
SAN MIGUEL: Chris, a question for you from Don. This kind of plays off the question that was given to Wolf earlier about funding of terrorism from some of these governments in the Middle East.
Extreme pressure, economic and otherwise, has to be brought upon Syria, Saudi Arabia, and Iran to stop funding and rewarding terrorism. Only then can the violence be stopped.
In terms from the Bush administration perspective, is that the role that they see themselves doing, is to really putting pressure on these particular countries? And is there a point where they can push too hard?
BURNS: Well, Renay, absolutely. The Bush administration has been working on this. This has been a main focus, really, even in the last few days. Secretary of State Colin Powell speaking with Farouk al-Sharaa, the Syrian foreign minister, about this, because of some of the base for Hamas there, trying to cut off that support to Hamas and other militant groups. And they're trying to do that also with other Arab countries.
In fact, a senior administration official just told me a couple days ago, said, look to see -- try to see whether the Arab states will be doing something in the near future about trying to cut off that support.
Now, it is not only financial support. It is also words of support. It is also a sort of symbolic support for these groups. There have been expressions of support in terms of resisting the Israeli occupation in the many decades' occupation of the Palestinian areas there. It is a very, very big issue to try to prevent the militants from acting, and getting that moral support and other support from other Arab countries. So that is a main focus of the Bush administration.
Of course, you can go overboard there, too. There could be backlash. And that is why this is being done very discreetly. This is not being done overtly. It's being done behind the scenes. A lot of behind the scenes telephone calls and contact with the Arab states. Secretary Powell will be going to Jordan to meet with other officials there, with the quartet and other leaders, and part of that effort will probably be focused at that. The effort right now, as the administration has said in the last few days, the issue is not the Palestinian authority, not Israel, it is the militant groups that have to be quelled.
COLLINS: All right. Chris Burns joining us this morning from Kennebunkport, Maine, traveling with the president. Matthew Chance joining us from Gaza, and of course, Wolf Blitzer live in Jerusalem. Thank you so much. Excellent panel this morning. We appreciate all of your insight, guys.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired June 15, 2003 - 09:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: The reality is, we must end terror and violence; we must move forward. We must take this chance for peace. And the United States will not get weary. We will not waiver. We will not stop. We will not step aside. The president is committed. I am committed. His administration is committed. We will succeed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RENAY SAN MIGUEL, CNN ANCHOR: Can the U.S. live up to that commitment? Time now for "Talk to CNN," where we'll answer the questions and comments you've e-mailed us on the push for peace in the Middle East.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Here to take your questions are CNN's Chris Burns, who is traveling with the president in Kennebunkport, Maine, this morning. Hello to you, Chris.
CHRIS BURNS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi there.
COLLINS: CNN's Matthew Chance, who joins us from Gaza this morning. Hi, Matthew.
And Wolf Blitzer, joining us live from Jerusalem. Hello to you as well.
Wolf, I'd like to start with you if that's possible, Wolf. Charmaine from Houston writes to us this morning and says, "The United States is not an honest broker in this situation. We need to step aside and let the U.N. send in help instead of blocking their efforts." Is this an opportunity, Wolf, for the U.N. they have yet to take?
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I don't think that the U.N. is going to manage to deal with this crisis, primarily because the Israeli government doesn't have a whole lot of confidence in the U.N. Historically over the years, the Israelis have seen the U.N. as being one-sided, and if not anti-Israel, certainly sympathetic towards the Arab side, the Palestinian side, in particular, given the nature of the U.N., so I don't think that's going to go very far as far as the Israelis are concerned. I think the Palestinians would be receptive to it.
Historically, if you take a look at any of the progress that's been achieved over the past 30 years in this Israeli-Palestinian conflict, or between the Israelis and the Egyptians or the Jordanians, it's been the United States, successive U.S. administrations, that have gotten the job done. That's why both sides, the Palestinians and the Israelis, look to Washington right now for that kind of outside help that could potentially move these parties forward.
SAN MIGUEL: This next question is for Chris Burns, who's traveling with the president in Kennebunkport, as we said. Burt writes in, which side should end the violence? The most powerful, or the least? If we, the U.S., immediately cut off all American taxpayer aid to Israel, how fast do you think they would stop killing Palestinians and sue for peace?
Chris, we had talked about the pressure that the Arab Street is putting on the Bush administration to really put pressure on Ariel Sharon to see what can be done.
BURNS: Well, there have been calls for that. But obviously, that is not going to happen. The Bush administration, as well as previous administrations, have committed to supporting Israel, come hell or high water. So it's very important for that finance to continue.
However, of course, it is important for the Bush administration to show that it is -- try to show that it is an honest broker between the two sides, that both are looking to President Bush to offer that leadership, to try to pull them out of that situation. And that is why President Bush is stepping in.
Now, President Bush is also backed by Russia, the United Nations, the European Union. It is part of a quartet that is pushing for this. And President Bush is playing his role in that.
COLLINS: All right. Thanks, Chris.
This next question goes out to Matthew Chance now, if we could. Allan in Ontario, Canada, says, they have to exile Arafat to Jordan or Egypt, so he can't interfere. He is the problem as I see it.
And you know, there have been questions, Matthew. You and I, in fact, have talked about before Mahmoud Abbas and what sort of power he really has as long as Arafat is around.
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's a question a lot of people ask, to be honest, about why don't the Israelis do more to isolate Yasser Arafat. Why didn't they exile him.
Or even worse, the fact is that my understanding of the situation is that it's a bit of a fantasy to think that the whole problem of the Middle East of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is focused on just one man. I mean, certainly, depriving Palestinians of a figure like Yasser Arafat may deprive them of a national symbol. But the real issues on the ground would remain. How to best achieve security for Israel by giving Palestinians an independent, viable state of their own. And, you know, to achieve that, it's going to take a lot more than sort of relatively simple moves of exiling of whatever Palestinian leader is in power at whatever moment. It's going to take very real and painful concessions, both on the sides of the Palestinians and on the side of the Israelis as well.
SAN MIGUEL: Wolf, a question for you from Marguerite in Seattle, Washington. Do we know the nature of the financial backing for the militant groups such as Hamas? Is there any chance that if we could stop their funding and the U.S. ceased the $2.7 billion, $2.1 in defense and $0.6 in humanitarian, annual foreign aid grant that it provides to Israel each year, that we could employ some financial sanctions to create more of an incentive for these people to start the peace process?
Now, that kind of plays into the question that was asked to Chris. But also, some of the pressure that the Bush administration's been trying to put on governments like Saudi Arabia, to cut off the funding for these groups.
BLITZER: Well, you heard that directly coming from the president earlier in the week. And the secretary of state repeatedly calling on everyone, including the Saudis and others throughout the Arab and Muslim world to stop the funding, the money that's flowing to Hamas, some of the other groups, Islamic jihad, the Palestinian-Islamic jihad.
There's another group that's been active over the years, the al Aqsa martyrs brigade, which is an offshoot of the Fatah movement that's directly controlled by Yasser Arafat. Hezbollah, which is in Lebanon, is funded at least to a great deal by the Iranians and Syrians. That money certainly provides a lot of wherewithal.
But I think what the Bush administration is trying to do is to get the money stopped, going to Hamas in particular. The State Department calls Hamas a terrorist organization. They've been squeezing the Saudis and others in the Arab world to stop. And we'll see what happens on that front. But it's a goal of the Bush administration. There's no doubt about that.
COLLINS: Matthew Chance, now, this one goes to you from Jerry in Naperville, Illinois.
It would appear that most of the Middle East really does not want U.S. or Western influence in their neighborhood. Why doesn't the Arab League or some other recognized Muslim organization put together a peace keeping force to go into Palestine and other hot spots and eliminate those terrorist groups? This would be far more politically correct than Western involvement -- Matthew.
CHANCE: Well, I think on the issue, first of all, on the United States, a lot of countries in the region do want greater U.S. involvement; that they welcome the involvement of President Bush over the past few weeks in the Middle East peace process to try and get some form of peace back on track. But what they are looking for from the United States is for that country to be, you know, not biased on one side or the other. The opinion in the Arab world generally is that, you know, the United States just backs Israel, as Chris Burns said earlier, come whatever else happens.
As for a peacekeeping force, well, you know, this is something the Palestinian people, the Palestinian leadership, has been calling for for a long time. But, you know, the big reason standing in the way of no Arab-led peace keeping force, or indeed a U.N. peace keeping force, which has been suggested in various arenas, is the Israelis. They say they don't want any kind of third force being involved in this region because it would, you know, impose on what they do themselves here. They say it's their region, it's their country, and they should be responsible for their security.
SAN MIGUEL: Chris, a question for you from Don. This kind of plays off the question that was given to Wolf earlier about funding of terrorism from some of these governments in the Middle East.
Extreme pressure, economic and otherwise, has to be brought upon Syria, Saudi Arabia, and Iran to stop funding and rewarding terrorism. Only then can the violence be stopped.
In terms from the Bush administration perspective, is that the role that they see themselves doing, is to really putting pressure on these particular countries? And is there a point where they can push too hard?
BURNS: Well, Renay, absolutely. The Bush administration has been working on this. This has been a main focus, really, even in the last few days. Secretary of State Colin Powell speaking with Farouk al-Sharaa, the Syrian foreign minister, about this, because of some of the base for Hamas there, trying to cut off that support to Hamas and other militant groups. And they're trying to do that also with other Arab countries.
In fact, a senior administration official just told me a couple days ago, said, look to see -- try to see whether the Arab states will be doing something in the near future about trying to cut off that support.
Now, it is not only financial support. It is also words of support. It is also a sort of symbolic support for these groups. There have been expressions of support in terms of resisting the Israeli occupation in the many decades' occupation of the Palestinian areas there. It is a very, very big issue to try to prevent the militants from acting, and getting that moral support and other support from other Arab countries. So that is a main focus of the Bush administration.
Of course, you can go overboard there, too. There could be backlash. And that is why this is being done very discreetly. This is not being done overtly. It's being done behind the scenes. A lot of behind the scenes telephone calls and contact with the Arab states. Secretary Powell will be going to Jordan to meet with other officials there, with the quartet and other leaders, and part of that effort will probably be focused at that. The effort right now, as the administration has said in the last few days, the issue is not the Palestinian authority, not Israel, it is the militant groups that have to be quelled.
COLLINS: All right. Chris Burns joining us this morning from Kennebunkport, Maine, traveling with the president. Matthew Chance joining us from Gaza, and of course, Wolf Blitzer live in Jerusalem. Thank you so much. Excellent panel this morning. We appreciate all of your insight, guys.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
